# Windsor's "next episode"



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well here it is guys, my new journal.

Last one got a bit cluttered and I had no motivation to sort it out or get it going again.

So here i am starting a new one for a new episode in training.

Basically to cut a long story short I have decided to take the plunge and move to the dark side and I believe that it deserves a new beggining.

I shall include some new updated photo's of where I am at the moment, if anyone is interested in where i have been and where I have progressed from then please look here

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/members-pictures/41698-chriss-journal-94.html

So there are probably many reasons why i have decided to take the jump, basically and honestly, I want to get bigger and stronger. No point lying. I have some very good experienced people onboard who I trust so I am in good hands with this.

I shall be using Methyl mst. 50g capsules twice a day. The main reason for this is purely logistical. It would be very hard for me to use jabs where I am, they would be very hard for me to get here, to store and needle depositing would raise to many eyebrows. so tabs were the easier option. Plus this is a mild tab, so it should be a little easier on my system.

I will list my full diet below and training later when I get a chance. I basically train for strength, but i have decided that now is the time to get this flab gone. No matter what I seem to do I can't shift it, I have been up to 3 hours cardio a day and to no avail. To this end I shall be using 2ml of Clen/T3 in the morning to aid this.

If I am brutally honest cardio has been pretty much non existent recently due to work, so this and diet are something that needs to be addressed.

Anyway, enough bull, I may get sh1t form some people for starting this but the decision is made and I have some very good experienced people onboard helping me along the way so I am in good hands.

*Diet + supps:*

As it stands

03:30: Wake and shake, 50g Whey, Glas OJ with 2ml Clen/T3

06:00: Tuna and little balsamic Vinegar for taste, plus Banana

08:30: 6 hard boiled (whites only) eggs, 1/4 dinner plate scrammbled eggs, 1 slice brown toast. If the flavour is bad (as usually is) may add some beans. 5g Omega 3, 600mg Milk thistle, 50mg Methyl mst

10:00: 50g Whey, 50g Glucose, 3 BCAA, 2 Cranberry extract, 1 Multivit

Sleep

15:00: Wake and shake, 50g whey, 5g Omega 3, 3g Vit C

17:30: Can Tuna and balsamic.

20:00: Main meal, can be anything, but normally 3 chicken breast and a small amount of rice, 5g Omega 3, 50mg Methyl mst

22:00: Sleep, maybe ZMA, but I am unsure yet.

So, any advice on that would be fantastic, diet has always been my downfall. Please be aware that I know this is not ideal, but I am limited in what I have available so suggestions may have to be compromised. I would ideally like to get another meal in there around lunchtime before sleeping.

*Training wise, it looks like this*

Day 1:

Chest + Bi's: Flat Bench, Incline Bench, Dips, Hammer curls, BB curls

Day 2:

rest

Day 3:

Legs: Squats, Leg extensions

Day 4:

Rest

Day 5:

Delts: Military press, side raises, Lat raises

Day 6:

rest

Day 7:

Back and tri's: Deads, CGBP, Close grip plams in pulldowns, Wide grip rows, Tri pushdowns. (The reason the CGBP is after deads is due to the Oly bar being in one gym and everything else in the other.

Day 8:

rest

Day 9:

repeat or rest depending on how I feel.

Any suggestions?

My heavy lifts are, warm up, then say 8 x 60%, 2 x 80%, then 2 x 5 at a more comfortable weight. I do this for Flat bench, Squats, MP and deads.

all others are 2 x 8.

So anyway guys, hope the regulars are all onboard, and hopefully some new guys to watch the transformation take place!!!!!! :rockon:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So, here's the pics of where I am at.

I may have been guilty in the past of being selective over which photo's I post, so here I am, non edited as they were took.

Appreciate I am carrying alot of fat, but there is muscle under there and if I was any good at taking pics then you may have been able to see it lol

Be nice though people!!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Here's the rest of them, lets see what happens in 7 weeks!!


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Damn that's some quality muscle there! Looking good hun hopefully we'll both shift our evil flab x


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey babe, first post!!!! Glad to see you've returned to my journals. Missed ya x

Thanks, some good muscle, just that damn layer of fat covering it!!!

We finally going to have that beer when I get home?


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## Dezsx (Jul 12, 2009)

Just been reading your first journal mate and you have done exactly what I want to do! Good effort! I hope like you I can drop from 28% where I currently am to around 15% in a similar time frame to yourself!!

Good work!!


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Oh boy a new journal to spam.LOL

Looking good Chris, xxxooo.


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## genesis (Jul 4, 2006)

hey dude, hows tricks?

Are you going to have offdays from the diet?

Dont be afraid to stick some red meats in there, higher in cals but good protein for muscle growth


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## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

Good luck with this


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

windsor81 said:


> Hey babe, first post!!!! Glad to see you've returned to my journals. Missed ya x
> 
> *I never went away * :wub:
> 
> ...


Yes, on a cheat night cos then I can have sugar too!!! :thumb:

When are you back?

Forgot to add - when do you train hams?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah Dave, I did contemplate it, but it's not Dbol and it's quite mild so it should be ok.

I may order some anyway rather than get caught out.

Still in the consideration period for PCT. I have had some good advice and I do not believe that it is necessary, I should be fine. However this may change as the course progresses, I have plenty of time to decide and will be home by the time that happens.

Lifts wise, my bests so far are

Dead: 205kg

Bench: 140kg

Squats: I don't like to talk about but around 150kg

Military press: 86kg I think last time I went heavy

All for 1.

I am unsure of numbers to be honest, any ideas guys?

I would like to think at least 200kg squat, although I think that would have been achievable natty. Deads, unsure, maybe 200kg? Bench I hope at least 150kg as that is my strong point.

I would not be dissapointed if I do not reach those lifts though as this is a very mild drug and I am doing this time more for aesthetics AND strength.


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

Keep it tight


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## WRT (May 21, 2009)

Nice journal pal, will keep an eye on it!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Dezsx said:


> Just been reading your first journal mate and you have done exactly what I want to do! Good effort! I hope like you I can drop from 28% where I currently am to around 15% in a similar time frame to yourself!!
> 
> Good work!!





genesis said:


> hey dude, hows tricks?
> 
> Are you going to have offdays from the diet?
> 
> Dont be afraid to stick some red meats in there, higher in cals but good protein for muscle growth





RACK said:


> Good luck with this


Great to have you guys onboard! Always nice to see new faces and I was hoping this journal would bring a few new people in.

Dezsx, if there's anything I can help you with just post it up. I understand how hard it is to get where you need to be, as does everyone on here I guess. Anything I can help you with though, with my limited knowledge then I would be glad to help.

Cheers for the kind words Rack.

Genesis mate, thought you'd dissapeared. I would reccomend this guy for any supps you might need people. Very reliable, good prices and quick service!!!

:rockon:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tall said:


> Keep it tight


Wondering how long it would take mate 

Keep dropping in and any advice would be great!


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

First of all, you owe me a tenner as towards the end of last year I said you'd be on gear within a year.

Program looks good. Similar to one you've used before and I know you liked it. I expect to see some nice changes when you visit in August.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

WRT said:


> Nice journal pal, will keep an eye on it!


thanks for dropping in big guy. Going to try and keep this one a bit tidier and more focussed than the last one!!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> First of all, you owe me a tenner as towards the end of last year I said you'd be on gear within a year.
> 
> Program looks good. Similar to one you've used before and I know you liked it. I expect to see some nice changes when you visit in August.


Big gay bear!!!! Wouldn't be journal without you in here!!

I'm not really sure what to expect, but I know I will be looking better and lifting stronger, and thats all that matters.

Not sure about the tenner, but I'll take you out for a few WKD's


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

genesis said:


> hey dude, hows tricks?
> 
> Are you going to have offdays from the diet?
> 
> Dont be afraid to stick some red meats in there, higher in cals but good protein for muscle growth


Just re-read this.

I am not sure to be honest about days off. I will have a cheat meal once a week, but the diet will be hard enough to keep to under the circumstances as it is, so the chances are rather than a cheat day once a week I may end up missing a meal every once in a while due to work and filling in with an extra shake or a cheat of some kind to get by.

One big thing that I need to do is seriously UP my water intake. I am literally at about 0.5 litre a day just water Plus maybe 6 Green teas a day and maybe 3 OJ's. This has to be upped to at least 4 litres. I just find water hard to drink strangely, so I have Ribena just to give it a little flavour and make it easier to go down.

Plus the extra Vitamins in Bena won't hurt.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

mmmmm, if I can just get that Dead to 240kg I can outlift you gay boy 

I'll be able to better judge once everythign is in full swing and I can see how my lifts are going.

May get some calipers as well so I can measure the BF%. Might not be accurate, but it's the trend thats important.

I should be lifting with you and the Big daddy in August sometime if you're around for a spanking?


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I'm with Dave on this one. You should easily be able to pull 220, I mean I pulled 240 and squatted 200 natty.

As for the WKD, I'm gay but I'm not that gay.


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## Dezsx (Jul 12, 2009)

windsor81 said:


> Dezsx, if there's anything I can help you with just post it up. I understand how hard it is to get where you need to be, as does everyone on here I guess. Anything I can help you with though, with my limited knowledge then I would be glad to help.


Cheers mate, will see how the weigh in and BF measure goes on Sunday morning and will pick your brain if things have slowed down/stopped :thumb:


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## hertderg (Jun 15, 2007)

Hope the course goes well mate ,your lifts are already great, some nice strength there.

I've not come across MST that much , just wondering what sort of gains in size/strength you are hoping to get from it ?


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Wondering how long it would take mate
> 
> Keep dropping in and any advice would be great!


Will be the same as Joe's but said in a more complicated way


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

hertderg said:


> Hope the course goes well mate ,your lifts are already great, some nice strength there.
> 
> I've not come across MST that much , just wondering what sort of gains in size/strength you are hoping to get from it ?


To be honest, i have no idea. I have heard and read reports of some very good strength gains from it. As for numbers though I'm not to sure.

I like the sound of Bench: 155kg Squats: 200kg Deads: 230kg

I think this should be attainable, and I think these are the gioals I am going to stick to.

deadlifting wise, most of it is in my head. I have pulled 205kg for 2 before, and yet when i was in London with Darren and Dave I only managed 180kg. I just get the fear, if I can get over that I could have probably got to 220kg natty. Hopefull when I see thenumbers increasing with the gear it will give me some confidence to use my natural strength as well.

aesthetics wise I have no idea, completely uncharted terretory for me. I am running the clen and cleaing my diet right up so that i can hopefully get my BF down to around 10%. Visible abs would be great. It has been a long time goal of mine ever since I was a kid so to just get that would be fantasic.

If this course goes well though I will intend to move onto the bigger stuff. Strength at the moment is still my priority, but that may change depending on how this all pans out.

As I say, these are new and nervouse uncharted waters I'm heading in to.

Very excited, but still nervous and apprehensive!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tall said:


> Will be the same as Joe's but said in a more complicated way


Bless him, he can't help being slow!

I don't understand 90% of what you say anyway mate, but it looks good and the post count keeps going up :tongue:


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Uncharted waters? Bit worrying for a navigator....


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Uncharted waters? Bit worrying for a navigator....


Yes - will this thread founder..? 

Anyway I've subscribed...


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thanks Patrick. Great to have a guy with your experience onboard.

Do you have any thoghts towards the PCT question. I know we've discussed privately, but now I have told you what it is? Could be useful to someone.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Uncharted waters are where navigators make there money!

Just me and my sextant, a lead line and the wind at my back.

Or in this casse.......drugs


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I'd rather not think about your sextant, frankly.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Wow......you have changed!


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You have to show me  :devil2:


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## hertderg (Jun 15, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> I like the sound of Bench: 155kg Squats: 200kg Deads: 230kg
> 
> I think this should be attainable, and I think these are the gioals I am going to stick to.
> 
> ...


I'm subscribed mate and I'm sure we'll see you hitting the figures above.

:thumbup1:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

If you're a good boy :whistling:


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Everything looking good Chris:thumbup1:

3 chicken breasts, you greedy bastard


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers Tel, I do love my chicken!!!


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Hmmm by August I'll be pulling nearly 300.................


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

dmcc said:


> Hmmm by August I'll be pulling nearly 300.................


Is this secret code for saying you'll have the horn? ie, per day


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not sure Dave, maybe beggining September instead. Not embarrasing myself with deads again. Maybe bench?

Hope the calories will be right up!! Can't wait!!!!!!!!!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Hmmm by August I'll be pulling nearly 300.................


You have your goals, I have mine. We can't all be superman.


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

TBH you'd be better having a squat session as you need to a) get your confidence and B) get your numbers up. You'll love my new gym.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Is this secret code for saying you'll have the horn? ie, per day


I doubt even the test could get you through that


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> TBH you'd be better having a squat session as you need to a) get your confidence and B) get your numbers up. You'll love my new gym.


Maybe. to be honest I don't have a confidence problem with Squats, just the case of getting the weights up, then we'll see how that goes.

Maybe deads again, who knows!


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

windsor81 said:


> Thanks Patrick. Great to have a guy with your experience onboard.
> 
> Do you have any thoghts towards the PCT question. I know we've discussed privately, but now I have told you what it is? Could be useful to someone.


Thanks! :blush:

PCT isn't much dependent on the particular gear you were on, but on the fact of having been on AAS.

Anything which raises your test exogenously will suppress your endogenous axis, and even gear which is predominantly anabolic rather than androgenic will do this to some extent.

Some guys don't suffer heavy shut-down or depression even after a long and heavy cycle - very few did PCT years ago. Most just accepted post-cycle blues and relied on attitude and training to get through them and minimize losses.

And some think PCT is more harmful than cruising. Course, if you want kids a proper PCT at the right time is surely beneficial, though many produce enough jizz and are quite fertile even on-cycle. Perhaps extra horniness and more sex make up for fewer wigglies! 

Hope this answers your question - or am I missing the point..?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So tomorrow shoudl be Chets and Bi's.

shall be the first session after my first tab.

Not expecting miracles obviously, guess it will take a few weeks for any gains to be noticed, but hey, maybe the thought will give me some inspiration.

hoping for around 135 for 2 on my working sets. That would make me happy


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No Patrick that was perfect. obviously i did talk to you about it privately but it may help others to see it up here.

At the moment i am edging on the "Man-up" side of things. I do not intend to cruise, nor do I think that on this kind of "designer" steroid cruising would be possible, other than just keep taking it!

Like you say, i should be big and strong enough to handle coming off without.

thw bonus being that I will be at home so any moodyness or emotinal change will not have to be explained away at work in a confined environment.

Great help again Patrick


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

windsor81 said:


> No Patrick that was perfect. obviously i did talk to you about it privately but it may help others to see it up here.
> 
> At the moment i am edging on the "Man-up" side of things. I do not intend to cruise, nor do I think that on this kind of "designer" steroid cruising would be possible, other than just keep taking it!
> 
> ...


OK - thanks - but I think you should consider a few things:

All orals are harder on the liver than injectables, so you should limit your cycle's duration.

Any come-down after you stop taking even orals won't happen immediately, and could occur after your furloe.

Whatever may be said and hoped, though you invariably make great gains on a first cycle, the gains from AAS are largely proportional to the dose. (As are the side-effects - it's a trade-off.) So if your chosen first gear is mild, you could be disappointed at the results. Sorry, but there it is. :sad:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ha, it sounds so confident when you write it down.

Confidence has always been my downfall in all walks of life. Never had it and not sure I ever will. Although i have read alot of people saying that teh gains they made from gear helped with the confidence issues.

We'll see. I just want to ge tit in me and start lifting properly again. I have a new fire bruning again for this sport which I had lost recently!

So, any ideas how long before I start to see the effects from this?


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris I am probably one of the least-confident and secure people you know. I just put on a good front and can talk a good talk when it's needed. Just believe in yourself, I know you can píss those weights.


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## M_at (May 2, 2009)

dmcc said:


> Just believe in yourself, I know you can píss those weights.


Seconded - I may not be lifting anywhere near Darren's or your weights but today I told myself I was going to get everything up and I did


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> OK - thanks - but I think you should consider a few things:
> 
> All orals are harder on the liver than injectables, so you should limit your cycle's duration.
> 
> ...


I think you may have misunderstood. I won't be cruising, I will defo be coming off. This whole cycle is for me to experience, highs and Lows. Coming off is part of that.

I am the kind of person that needs to experience these things first hand to see what it's all about. I have read what seems like thousands of post from guys about the pros and cons and I have made an informed decision to try it myself. I am under no illusions that it may not work.

If that is the case then abck to the drawing board.

I do expect a lot from this course, BUT I am open minded as to what may or may not happen. I think I will make moderate gains though and to that end at this stage I would be happy with moderate gains.

I am aware that I am not jabbing 1g of test and will not get the gains as though I was. That was part of the reason for chosing a milder steroid, that the sides will be less harsh and I can see how my body re-acts particularly while I am away.

thanks for the "other side" though Patrick, it is important to consider all angles. although I think I am right for going into this with positive thinking.

am I??


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Chris I am probably one of the least-confident and secure people you know. I just put on a good front and can talk a good talk when it's needed. Just believe in yourself, I know you can píss those weights.


I know, but Patrick has made a good point, and maybe I need to be a little bit more level headed doing this and not get carried away as I normally do.

I DO know that those weights are attainable though without cycling, so i have every faith that I can reach them whilst cycling!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

M_at said:


> Seconded - I may not be lifting anywhere near Darren's or your weights but today I told myself I was going to get everything up and I did


You're bang on. It's just abd when you know you can do something, but you have to convince yourself of the fact.

Mind games are sh1t!


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

dmcc said:


> Chris I am probably one of the least-confident and secure people you know. I just put on a good front and can talk a good talk when it's needed. Just believe in yourself, I know you can píss those weights.


Stay focussed, you have the tools to do what you want :thumbup1:


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

windsor81 said:


> ...I am the kind of person that needs to experience these things first hand to see what it's all about. ... I think I am right for going into this with positive thinking.
> 
> am I??


Of course! But I'm not sure about only ever first-hand experience...

One of out great human achievements which has driven perticularly our modern civilization is the ability to communicate knowledge, so that we do not have to re-learn everything each generation but can build on accrued experience.

So you don't have to put your hand in the fire to know it will burn...

You're in a particular predicament in your job with regard to gear. But that does not negate the fact that, as Darren has found, a big strong healthy bloke like you will make amazing gains on reasonably high doses of gear quite safely and with few problematic side-effects.

So, being the devil's advocate, if you think you can bear any post-cycle blues without PCT while busy aboard ship, why not try a fairly heavy blast of quick-acting gear as soon as you get onshore?

And then maybe some long acting esters just before you embark again to tide you into your tour? You might even smuggle some Clomid and Nolva aboard just in case you crash a bit hard...


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## genesis (Jul 4, 2006)

windsor81 said:


> Genesis mate, thought you'd dissapeared. I would reccomend this guy for any supps you might need people. Very reliable, good prices and quick service!!!
> 
> :rockon:


I left the site for a while but i drift in and out now, thanks for the kind words mate, much appreciated

I'll have a look at the journal when i come on here and spout some bollocks at you :thumb:


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## Guest (Jul 18, 2009)

damn Chris.... New journal and already 5 pages in one day!!!! I am jealous of your popularity:tongue: :thumbup1:

good luck with the new journal


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Maybe it was the pics, damn he is shexy!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

winger said:


> Maybe it was the pics, damn he is shexy!


I can whore it with the best of them big guy 

Seriously though Winger, this flirting has to stop. I am but a man, and faced with you, your looks AND your charm, man, I think I'm in love.

And man love at 4 a.m. is never a good thing for a straight guy.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> ... why not try a fairly heavy blast of quick-acting gear as soon as you get onshore?
> 
> And then maybe some long acting esters just before you embark again to tide you into your tour? You might even smuggle some Clomid and Nolva aboard just in case you crash a bit hard...


You speak wise words as normal. I haven't counted this out yet Patrick, and is defo something I will look into more closely. I just wanted to do this as a trial run and see what happens.

I have not discounted the fact that I might not like it. I might not like the gains, I might not like the way I end up looking....

...although I think we all know I will.

Then it's a case of putting a more detailed plan together for when I am next home. Next time I am back for 2.5 months, so there is no need for blasting, I can put together a proper cycle and take my time over it, which I think would be more sensible.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

genesis said:


> I left the site for a while but i drift in and out now, thanks for the kind words mate, much appreciated
> 
> I'll have a look at the journal when i come on here and spout some bollocks at you :thumb:


You're welcome in here any time fella. Glad to se you back, I've been a bit of a drifter myself recently.

hope the business is going well mate :thumb:


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## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

worst journal ever


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

GAY!!!


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> GAY!!!


Gay? They're not that different from you, are they? Same haircuts. Full of hormones, just like you. Invincible, just like you feel. The world is their oyster. They believe they're destined for great things, just like many of you, their eyes are full of hope, just like you. Did they wait until it was too late to make from their lives even one iota of what they were capable? Because, you see gentlemen, these boys are now fertilizing daffodils. But if you listen real close, you can hear them whisper their legacy to you. Go on, lean in. Listen, you hear it? ....


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I think the lady protests too much.... I mean, styled hair, A&F t-shirts and underwear, drinking WKD... I'd say Chris is well-experienced in the man-love.

Anyway, as for not liking what you'll look like in a couple of months, absolute bull. I've never heard anyone say "god I wish I'd never taken that gear and trained so hard, I look disgusting now."


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tall said:


> Gay? They're not that different from you, are they? Same haircuts. Full of hormones, just like you. Invincible, just like you feel. The world is their oyster. They believe they're destined for great things, just like many of you, their eyes are full of hope, just like you. Did they wait until it was too late to make from their lives even one iota of what they were capable? Because, you see gentlemen, these boys are now fertilizing daffodils. But if you listen real close, you can hear them whisper their legacy to you. Go on, lean in. Listen, you hear it? ....


Carpe Diem boyus, seize the day, mak your lives extraordinary.....

...point taken :tongue:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> I think the lady protests too much.... I mean, styled hair, A&F t-shirts and underwear, drinking WKD... I'd say Chris is well-experienced in the man-love.
> 
> Anyway, as for not liking what you'll look like in a couple of months, absolute bull. I've never heard anyone say "god I wish I'd never taken that gear and trained so hard, I look disgusting now."


Apart from the odd synthol abuser no. but then that's a whole other discussion.

First one down. Feel no different, not really sure what I was expecting. Nervous as hell when I did it, which is pretty gay, although I'm sur you guys were when you did it.

Chest and Bi's

Actually not to strong today, but the weather is cr*p so I was all over the place again.

*Flat Bench*

warmup then

5 x 125kg

2 x 132.5kg

2 x 6 x 110kg

*Incline Bench*

2 x 8 x 80kg (good for me maybe a PB?)

*Hammer curls*

2 x 8 x 24kg

*DB curls*

2 x 8 x 22kg

No monster weights, but I am knackered, worked hard and fast, low recovery time, really got the sweat on. So all in all happy.

Didn't do dips as basically forgot, but they will be added normally.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Do you mean physically all over the place? All I'll say is that your core strength must be good to compensate for the waves.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No, the waves.

Mentally and physically I'm in the game right now. Just the bloody platform isn't.

I'd like to think my core is strong, I have to put my body through a lot of unusual strains that most guys wouldn't have to in order to shift these weights, and with no spotter.


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Helllloooooo.

Right, here I am. Who's making the tea.....? 

x


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

3 times I've written this, so here's the abbreviated version.

Zara - welcome anytime round mine for a cuppa.

Diet - Was great yesterday, sh1t today as have cold like symptoms. 99% sure due to Clen, had t first time I used. Will drop to 1 ml tomorrow to see if better.

Kidneys and liver great, unsure if due to higher fluid intake, cranberry/milk thistle, or no alcohol. Maybe combination.

Training - Massive Chest DOMS, no bicep DOMS. Maybe change Biceps to include 21's.

If this doesn't post this time I'm leaving the site!!!


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

windsor81 said:


> 3 times I've written this, so here's the abbreviated version.
> 
> Zara - welcome anytime round mine for a cuppa.


id make her bring her own milk as i do to people who come round here :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm a friendly Geordie though, not a tight Manc, so she is welcome to share my milk


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

windsor81 said:


> I'm a friendly Geordie though, not a tight Manc, so she is welcome to share my milk


aww arn't you sweet, a bit weird but sweet none the less

oh and im finding your journal boring at the moment, whats with all this training talk? i didnt know you trained :lol:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You like sharing your man-milk?

You're probably feeling better for dropping the booze - after what the last few weeks have been like :whistling: I mean, how often do you get "St Petersburg" drunk?

21's? Give me a break. Just up the weight on regular curls. Just because you don't have DOMS doesn't mean it was a bad workout.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I had to start Dave, I want to be like you. You're my inspiration!!!

That actually does sound wierd now I look back at it. Oh well


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

dmcc said:


> You like sharing your man-milk?
> 
> You're probably feeling better for dropping the booze - after what the last few weeks have been like :whistling: I mean, how often do you get "St Petersburg" drunk?
> 
> 21's? Give me a break. Just up the weight on regular curls. Just because you don't have DOMS doesn't mean it was a bad workout.


hahaha 21's are for stupid people, i think you should carry on doign them

curl them to the top then raise your arms vertically infront of your face


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No, it was bad, although I missed DIPS, so I will add them on Tricep and Back day.

Not sure if I am looking forward to Deads yet. Still have the fear.

So how long do people reckon before I start to feel the effects? 1 week, 2 weeks?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Get over the fear or I will bitch-slap you.

As for the effects, depends on the gear and the person but you should start to notice a few things in about a week.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Good good. Well it is mild gear and I am a big guy so we'll see. Hope I will feel a little different. If it's a week then a nice strength increase would be nice before deads and maybe give me a little confidence boost. Even if just a couple of KG's.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

I dunno, turn my back for a day or two and I have a load of reading to do...hurrah!!!!! :laugh: x


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thanks for the comments guys. Feeling alot better now.

Dropped the morning to 1.5ml and the sides have eased. I will consider UPPING when I feel a bit better. If I was at home then this wouldn't be an issue, but unfortunately I have to work. Headache was still there and concentration down as a result.

Wouldn't say I am feeling any different yet, although it's weird, I can almost feel a wave of healthyness washing over me. Strange eh.

All the supps are going in fine, I even added in lunch today, I am getting all the meals in just not necessarily at the right times.

Dave: I'm hoping it's going to be productive, but I am heading with caution as Patrick said. No point in ending up dissapointed.

Had a weird/gay moment last night. Fancy dress in the crew bar, figured it would be cool to go as superman one day, just with body paint instead of a costume.

Best UP the dose again I reckon.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Beklet said:


> I dunno, turn my back for a day or two and I have a load of reading to do...hurrah!!!!! :laugh: x


Not as much smut as the old one though eh!!!

Does anyone else suffer nightmares when on gear? I have been getting lots and I do not usually remember dreams at all.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well i just had a dream this afternoon that I had an extra pillow which was climbing into my bed, but was actually a mechanical spider.

Scared the sh1t out of me.

Don't even want to talk about the Russian invasion of Newcastle the other night!


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Strange ....erm this is the new and shiny heterosexual version of your journey ....with Russians in Newcastle - I'd give them 5 minutes with the toon army lads - any of their holiday attitude and they'd be well on their way out !

Hello !


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

This is the new shiney (allegedly) straight one.

Trying to get more training in then smut, but we'll see how that goes!!

Just these crazy a55ed dreams I'm having, really weird, at least it mkaes nighttimes more fun then they have been!!!


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Sorry mate, only just seen the new journal.

I will be following.... :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

pastanchicken said:


> Sorry mate, only just seen the new journal.
> 
> I will be following.... :thumb:


Cheers mate, the more the merrier


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

windsor81 said:


> Cheers mate, the more the merrier


Funny, that's what Darren said. :whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tell me about it!!! I was never enough :crying:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Had a weird/gay moment last night.


Just last night? :lol:



windsor81 said:


> Does anyone else suffer nightmares when on gear? I have been getting lots and I do not usually remember dreams at all.


Constantly. Very vivid, very surreal. The other night I dreamt I was singing a song full blast in an art museum or something, and I swear I woke up singing the song. That's a normal one at the moment...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, good, so it's not me.

Just starting to feel myself now which is good. I know this has had more to do with the Clen than anything else. Kinda out of of it a bit, headaches and then that killer cold like thing.

Jacked myself up on OJ and Vit C and it passed though. Will keep the Clen/T3 on 1.5ml for now. I'm sweating enough so its working.

Everything else though is great. Liver and kidneys great so still full steam ahead. Had a MASSIVE back pump today and calfs strangely, wasn't even working out, just lifting sun loungers. Somethings happening!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Lifting sun loungers? Poof.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Didn't have much choice mate. Turned into a head wind and had 70 knot relative winds across the decks. After 3 of them hit me in the face I though Sh1it, I'd better move these.

Just for the record though, I was lifting a pile of 10 of them.........in cowboy boots, so see, not gay at all :whistling:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I've seen those cowboy boots, don't forget.........

BTW you'll have to remind me of your new e-mail address, is it 1 or S2?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

1 mate.

There a killer for lifting in. Believe me, you never want to deadlift in 3 inch heels!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

.......................................and that's why your deadlift's pants :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Everyday I love you a little less!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Silly question but any training going on....................................

ie lifting weights


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey, it was all training and diet till last page!!!

I had to miss training today due to work, but I shall be doing legs tomorrow, and doing them hard. and then delts the next day.

Will that suffice grandad


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Hey, it was all training and diet till last page!!!
> 
> *I had to miss training* today due to work, but I shall be doing legs tomorrow, and doing them hard. and then delts the next day.
> 
> Will that suffice grandad


 :thumbdown:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

:crying:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

:crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: :crying:

If that's all it takes....


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

im glad to see it got to page 2 before it became a banter journal

maybe if you start a new journal every week you will be ok flower


----------



## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Well here it is guys, my new journal.
> 
> Last one got a bit cluttered and I had no motivation to sort it out or get it going again.
> 
> ...


People who use anabolic steroids usually either inject a cocktail of hormone growth substances into their body or take them orally as pills. :thumbup1:


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

winny, I'm trying to love your new journal BUT if I discover you are taking a pro hormone instead of proper gear........! A n=move to the gray side IS not the dark side....

I await your gentlemans assurances that this sh1t you are injesting is pukka....

Make the move properly in all seriousness mate, get injecting or you will be very dissapointed. You can stash a 20 mil vial somewhere each trip away and throw you fvcking used pins overboard....the chances of hitting a diver are miniscule and the salt water will dissolve them in a year or 2


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

ok so methyl mst is a pukka oral, just looked it up......good luck winie


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

For the record, some of those pro hormones are very good.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just decided to keep it simple for the first time thats all. Towards the end of this one I will have a better idea as to what is going on. I can get more advice nearer that time and then come up with a plan.

Basically at the moment it would probably entail an 8 week cycle in January as I have an extended leave then. What it would involve is another thing, but that is the plan at the moment.

Training wise Tel, I will be back in tomorrow. Sadly missing work aint an option, not unless I want to make the papers for all the wrong reasons as the guy that killed 3000 people ramming Gibraltar.

This stuff is supposed to be the Mutts nuts Uriel, but I'll have to finish it off to see how good it will be for me. Guess after 7 - 10 days I'll know if it is making any positive differences. Sorry it's not hardcore enough.......yet. 

Dave, you're a tw*t

Winger, I love you :wub:

DMCC / DC55: Let's just stop this flirting around and next time I come down we'll just get it on :thumb:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

If the stuff is good you will notice at day 9 to 10 for sure.

I like the idea you are taking it slowly, we/us all should. More is not better IMO.

Also, I have seen so many men do way too much gear and get way too strong and get hurt in the process.

Let me digress. Guy takes gear, guy gets strong, guy does singles to see how much he can do for a max, guy gets hurt from doing too much weight in too short of time.

That is the very reason why I just did more reps on my little Prohormone/steroid cycle. Just be smart, as I suspect you are!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Exactly Winger. This is something that I knew I wanted to do, but I have problems with my left kidney. A birth defect.

This means that I am always wary of things like this. I won't take Nurofen or Ibuprofen for the very same reason. Now the gear has nothing to do with my kidneys as such, but this is just another extension of ny caution of introducing new things to my body.

I am only 27 (28 in a week :crying: ), so I have all the time in the world. Darren only ran his first cycle at 30 something :whistling: and look how strong he is! Tel at 40! So why rush now when I can try this first, and then progress on from there depending on the results.

Plus I have no intention of getting injured any time soon...touch wood!!

Also, look at me now!! GOLDmember. Defo been round here to long now.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Basically at the moment it would probably entail an 8 week cycle in January as I have an extended leave then. What it would involve is another thing, but that is the plan at the moment.


500mg test, some quality oralage.



> Training wise Tel, I will be back in tomorrow. Sadly missing work aint an option, not unless I want to make the papers for all the wrong reasons as the guy that killed 3000 people ramming Gibraltar.


I imagine the people of Gibraltar would love a good ramming from you.

Oh and for the record, I started about 6 weeks before my 32nd birthday.


----------



## hertderg (Jun 15, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> I am only 27 (28 in a week :crying: ), so I have all the time in the world.


That's a great approach mate,many people want instant results. Just chip away and picture what you'll look like by the time you reach my age , big 40 in May.

I wish this site was around when I was your age, I wasted so many early years training and eating incorrectly and then lost interest and took a 6 year break LOL .


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers guys, always nice to hear the you are doing the right thing as you go.

D-bol was my original choice, but I was researching and had some great advice and decided to switch to this.

Slowly slowly is the way. I have seen a couple of guys on this board who have done the massive cycle, actually one not so massive, and all they seemed to be doing was raising BF. I want to lower BF if possible, I know that is difficult whilst building muscle, but i want to at least aim for that.

The other option is that i just get HUGE and maintain the same fat, then I will just look better anyway!

Legs today.

I like to keep my leg days simple, if for anything just due to a lack of equipment onboard! Ideally I would like to add a legpress in there as well. The Leg curl machine we have is a technogym work of the devil. Last time I used it it sh*gged my knee.

So nice and simple.

*Squats*

8 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

working sets

6 x 125kg

5 x 140kg

2 x 6 x 120kg

Funny, I did the 140kg (which was only supposed toi be 2 reps  ) and thought, pah, this is to easy, I'll stick to the programme though and do 120's but a bit of a waste of a session. Then I tried to lift them and my legs nearly buckled, and I then thought, oh that actually did the trick!

*Leg extensions*

12 x full stack

8 then 2 x fullstack

Great session, very happy. Especially the 4 at 140kg for the squats. In all sorts of pain now, which is even better 

Shoudl be Delts tomorrow, will be MPing properly again hopefully, see how much strength I've retained there.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Damn this is moving too fast!!!! :laugh: x


----------



## fozyspilgrims (Oct 22, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Cheers guys, always nice to hear the you are doing the right thing as you go.
> 
> D-bol was my original choice, but I was researching and had some great advice and decided to switch to this.
> 
> ...


Good squating there Chris thats more like it, i would be very happy with 140kg.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Nice squatting big guy:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It's nice to be squatting full stop. Took me long enough to get the rack!!

Hopefully htose numbers will continue to move upwards. To be honest, I expect them to fly up. It's the only lift I have not done consistantly and the only lift I haven't had massive gains on, so I am expecting them, and would be without the gear.

FOXY!!!! Welcome aboard 

Beklet girl, you gotta keep up


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

I wonder if she hears that much.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I think it would be the other way round Wing man, I aint ashamed to admit it!

Just as an add on to the above. In squats I am unsure as to how low I am getting! I don't have any way to Video them and no-one onboard knows anything about squatting, so I'm a biut screwed. I try an dlook when I am doing them but I would rather concentrate on looking straight ahead and putting everything into the lift.

I am the kind of person that follows there eyes, so when I lean forward I tend to fall forward lol

I think they're pretty much parallel though, will find out when I get home to a proper gym I guess.


----------



## fozyspilgrims (Oct 22, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> It's nice to be squatting full stop. Took me long enough to get the rack!!
> 
> Hopefully htose numbers will continue to move upwards. To be honest, I expect them to fly up. It's the only lift I have not done consistantly and the only lift I haven't had massive gains on, so I am expecting them, and would be without the gear.
> 
> ...


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

If you think you're parallel, you're almost certainly not. You need to either video it or get someone to honestly tell you.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

If you squat naked with a hard on, when your cok touches your chin you are parallel

Video it Chris


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> If you squat naked with a hard on, when your cok touches your chin you are parallel
> 
> Video it Chris


If any mans cock touches his own chin he doesn't even need to work out. Just my 2 cents worth.


----------



## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

dmcc said:


> If you think you're parallel, you're almost certainly not. You need to either video it or get someone to honestly tell you.


Squat to a Bench.

For most people that about 2-3" above para, but will be deeper than most folks squat to.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dc55 said:


> Nice squating big boy.
> 
> Try think about it as making your hip para with your knees. If that makes sense. Just go low as possible.....BUT not too low.
> 
> ...


150's in the bag mate!! Looking forward to getting a respectable squat!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tall said:


> Squat to a Bench.
> 
> For most people that about 2-3" above para, but will be deeper than most folks squat to.


Cheers for that Tall, great idea. Will give it a shot next time.

Thinking about it the bench might be slightly lower than parallel for me as I'm quite tall. Will measure up later on.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> If you squat naked with a hard on, when your cok touches your chin you are parallel
> 
> Video it Chris





winger said:


> If any mans cock touches his own chin he doesn't even need to work out. Just my 2 cents worth.


Vids on it's way Tel, just got to find a girl willing to Video a naked man squatting with a hard-on. As soon as I do I'll send you the directors cut


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

But will it be parallel? If it wasn't then I want to see. :lol:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

*ALPHA 6*

*DRIVE BY* :gun_bandana:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

:thumbup1: :rockon:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

I'll video it . .


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not a great day diet wise today.

Woke up as sick as a dog. Missed my morning shake and Clen. Couldn't face it.

Throat was dry and sore as hell. First meal was 4 hours later, but it was a good one!!

Managed to get the gear down though and the rest of the supps so not all is lost.

Delts.

Couldn't get to the crew gym today so had to use the other one with the shoulder press machine. Decided to do the workout the reverse way round in order to pre-fatigue.

*Lat Raises, seated DB*

8 x 16kg

3 x 8 x 18kg

*Front raises (alternate DB)*

3 x 8 x 16kg

*Shoulder press*

3 x 12 x 67.5kg

10 x 67.5kg

So still went to failure, still caused pain, so good workout.

Just have to drag my sorry ass into the gym to get over the fear of Deads again now.

Wish I could stop being a pussy about these things!!!


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Something going round lol i was rough as hell yesterday spent most of it alternately trying not to gip and sleeping . .


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know the feeling. I think mine is down to the CLen/T3 though, so I may be knocking that on the head. I can't afford to be feeling this sh1t at work.

Means I may have to do bloody cardio again though.....guitted.

Give the Clen another shot in the morning and see how it goes. If I still feel crappy then bye bye to that, and my bloody abs.....that I still haven't seen!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I felt a bit crappy when I started the clen/T3 but it passed after a day or two. Stick with.

And get over the fear of deads or I WILL come to Southampton next time you're in port and I WILL kick your ass.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Sort the diet and training out or...........................


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Kick??? :crying:

and I thought you loved me :crying:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

and thats not my leg:lol: :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Actually Tel, I don't think the training is going to badly.

I've made a good week of lifts so far. Smashed chest and legs.

Still have leg DOMS now in fact.

Delts was a good session, and despite the fact that Deads always give me the fear I know for a fact that I will still go in there and destroy them with ease.

So really, all is on course. Other than the diet on occasion, however, the diet is still 100% better than it was. When I am not ill I am eating on schedule and more importantly cleanly. Also no beer. Now thats dedication.

Had a quick peek in the mirror this 'alvo, and I have to say I look a little less flabby.

I am guessing that alot of what I thought was flab was me just being blaoted from eating sh1te and drinking heavily. Now I've had a week (ish) off that, I do not feel bloated, feel alot emptier if that makes sense and SO much better for it!!

So hopefully soon the gear should kick in a bit, in that I should start noticing differences. Let's hope so eh!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> and thats not my leg:lol: :lol:


That is one seriously crooked pen1s you have there Tel!!

Reaches the parts other pen1ses can't :beer:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

it was only a leg pull chris (way hay, another pun)

You'll get there mate, just think of all the work you've put in and what a waste

it would be to just blow it on a few parties, drinking, pasty smashing..........


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You are correct sir. I have been very disciplined this week.

No partying, no drinking and the Pasty is all out of date so binned 

I have been to bed early all nights and am sleeping like a baby. Although with shifts not ideal, I am still getting 8 - 9 hours a day total, which is VERY good for the work I'm in.

Can't wait to start seeing some changes though, even if they aint big ones, just a little more incentive would be nice!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

When you come to visit, we're going out. I'm taking you to a gay bar and you can be a mangina-tease and bask in all the attention.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

windsor81 said:


> You are correct sir. I have been very disciplined this week.
> 
> No partying, no drinking *and the Pasty is all out of date so binned *
> 
> ...


 :crying:

Hey, I know I'm old but still......... :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> When you come to visit, we're going out. I'm taking you to a gay bar and you can be a mangina-tease and bask in all the attention.


That actually sounds like fun, some times any attention is good attention. Not saying that being lusted over by some guys isn't good attention. :confused1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I had to re-read Mangina 3 times before I got it lol!

Wingman, you get all the attention in the world that you need from me!

Beklet, you are prime time real estate baby, no out of date pasty where you are concerned. Proper Ginsters


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

windsor81 said:


> Beklet, you are prime time real estate baby, no out of date pasty where you are concerned. Proper Ginsters


I do remember one of Beks posts were she was a bit bitter. :whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So, It's 4 a.m. and another glorious day. At least today we are in Dubrovnik which is one of my favourite towns. However I shall be spending the day lying round the pool in the sun getting tanned.

Day off from the gym and I shall be enjoying it, trying to get rid of these leg DOMS for tomorrows deads session or I will end up crying like a little biatch.

Took another 1-1.5ml Clen/T3 this morning with my orange and Cranberry, so lets see if things get any worse or better!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

windsor81 said:


> I shall be spending the day lying round the pool in the sun getting tanned.
> 
> !


I went to the tanning bed does that count? :cursing:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Surely it's hot out in Cal this time of year?

35° here at the moment. BOOOOOOOOTIFUL


----------



## ParaManiac (Mar 20, 2007)

Only just found noticed this journal Chris - very interesting,especially your decision to use drugs,i look forward to the results and your progress(impressive so far!).Best of luck mate :thumbup1:


----------



## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Looking good on the pics dude!! Keep at it! :thumbup1:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

windsor81 said:


> Surely it's hot out in Cal this time of year?
> 
> 35° here at the moment. BOOOOOOOOTIFUL


In the 90's and it's hot as hell over here. Thank God for Air Conditioning and beer. :beer:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

ParaManiac said:


> Only just found noticed this journal Chris - very interesting,especially your decision to use drugs,i look forward to the results and your progress(impressive so far!).Best of luck mate :thumbup1:





kieren1234 said:


> Looking good on the pics dude!! Keep at it! :thumbup1:


Cheers guys, really great to see you in here.

Glen mate, it wasn't a decision taken lightly, but I am excited to see the results!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

:cursing:

Turns out I am now the weakest man in the world!!!

Not sure if it is because of the diet, because I have a cold or not leaving it long enough between Legs and Deads but I lifted like a tart today.

*Deads*

10 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

4 x 140kg

2 x 160kg

2 x 180kg

2 x 0,5 x 200kg

In fairness, I could have managed 190kg if I'd done that first off, but I didn't so hey ho. At least I got back in the gym and was doing them though which is important. Just have to build up from scratch again next wek. At least I know where my limit is now so I can plan accordingly.

*CGBP*

3 x 8 x 95kg

*Close grip plams in pulldown*

2 x 8 x 85kg Lowered weight and slowed right down to improve form

*Wide grip palms out pulldown*

2 x 8 x 85kg

*Tri pushdowns*

2 x 8 x 55kg

*Wide grip rows*

2 x 8 x 75kg

All in all not a bad workout, but much to improve on. I also think my form must be out when doing delts as my lats had DOMS before I started today. May have something to do with it.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

When was the last time you did deads though?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I haven't done deads for weeks now, and when I did do them they were half ar5ed.

I think the last time was SLDL actually as well. Maybe just a case of getting them back in regularly and working back up to a decent number.

Feel a bit sore now, so somethign probably worked!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

In that case, not bad at all. You just need to get back on the horse.


----------



## fozyspilgrims (Oct 22, 2007)

Thats big numbers on the deads mate.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Damded, wish I could do DL's, I'd wup your ass:whistling: :whistling:

Good work out big un:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You're welcome to try any time Grandad 

Cracking session today, feel like the absolute Daddy at the moment.

Chest and Bi's today, no spotter, no lift-off.

*Flat Bench*

10 x 40kg

8 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 125kg

2 x 135kg

1 x 140kg This wasn't supposed to be done here, but i felt good and went for it.

5 x 120kg

4 x 120kg Sh*gged

*Incline bench*

8 x 80kg

8 x 85kg

*Machine Bi curls*

2 x 8 x 55kg

*Hammer curls*

2 x 8 x 24kg

For some reason I haven't been doing Dips, need to remember next week, very important.

So I feel like a million bucks now!

Just got to catch Dave's 170kg now, but he has an unfair advantage being gay, and we all know gays are naturally stronger as they have to wrestle men.

Haven't been feeling well at all the last few days either, and it's not the alcohol, so diet has been pants once again. Need to really pull my finger outg on this.

I'm feeling alot trimmer and there is no bloat anymore. Carbs are right down and protein is high soit is still a healthy diet, i am just struggling to get enough down my throat. Will be easier in a fortnight when I get home.

I think I am looking bigger as well which is helping to make my stomach look flatter and more lean. Maybe it is just the placebo effect. either way considering the downer I normally have on myself it's all welcome.

Going to be starting boxing training soon. A mate of mine onboard is an ex pro (only a couple of fights) and a bit of a pikey fighter, on the side of the good I might add. We had a bit of a roll arounf drunken scrap one the floor of the bar the other night and he decided I fight like a tart, now I'm convinced I kicked his a55, but either way he's training me and I'm helping him pack on some good size for his next Prizefight in Nov. Sounds like a fun way to get in shape!!!


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Just saw this on FB too, nice bench my man!! :bounce: :thumbup1:


----------



## Ollie B (Mar 14, 2007)

Awesome bench Chris. Strength is always on the up for you.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well chuffed. Squat is ever increasing, just bloody deads thats all!

Ollie mate, good to see you in here. I've stalled a bit recently to be honest, lost my way so this is me getting back to it. I hope to have those weights flying up again in no time.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, I don't have the guys around me to help out unfortunately. I like training on my own these days. Become a bit of a loner.

A partner would be good but they're all to weak or daft.


----------



## Ollie B (Mar 14, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Well chuffed. Squat is ever increasing, just bloody deads thats all!
> 
> Ollie mate, good to see you in here. I've stalled a bit recently to be honest, lost my way so this is me getting back to it. I hope to have those weights flying up again in no time.


You on any gear yet. If not still thinking about it?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yip Methyl MST 50 mg twice a day.

Hence the new journal 

Feeling good Ollie boy, but only been on maybe 1.5 weeks so it will only just be starting to take effect.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Yeah, I don't have the guys around me to help out unfortunately. I like training on my own these days. Become a bit of a loner.
> 
> A partner would be good but they're all to weak or daft.


I hear ya on that, they either let you down with lame excuses (normally legs day)

or just wanna fcking chat.

I like the feeling of my life hanging in the balance if I don't lift the weight:lol:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

dc55 said:


> Very good workout there mate, and i must say your a braver man than me for attempting 140 with no spotter.


Great minds think alike - I said exactly the same earlier on...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Go shorty, it's ma birthday!!

Celebrated way to hard last night. Only got to bed 7 a.m. woke up at 1 and decided to go squatting! Genious.

Actually, twas good fun.

*squats*

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 130kg

3 x 145kg (actually didn't think I was going to make it back up after the last rep, ATG)

2 x 5 x 120kg

*Leg extensions*

2 x 8 x 97.5kg

not bad, now I am off to be sick.

love you all xxx


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Happy Birthday big man!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers wingman, hope you're well!


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

*YOUR*

*
A*

*
GREAT*

*
BIG*

*
DIRTY*

*
KN0B*

*
ROBBING*

*
LADY*

*
BOY*

:bounce:

happy birthday and that though


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice squattage you big poof. Were you sweating alcohol?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

yip, managed to getdrunk all over again from the fumes!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Písshead.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Bloody alky lol Happy Birthday (again) from me :wub: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Happy Birthday big guy


----------



## fozyspilgrims (Oct 22, 2007)

windsor81 said:


> Go shorty, it's ma birthday!!
> 
> Celebrated way to hard last night. Only got to bed 7 a.m. woke up at 1 and decided to go squatting! Genious.
> 
> ...


Hope you had a good birthday big lad:beer: big squats there mate reps.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Pah. I can't possibly congratulate anyone squatting more than me 

but I can say happy birthday and tell you I'm jealous of the squat :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey guys, thanks alot for all the birthday messages.

Means alot.

Would have got on a lot sooner to thank you all, but you know, Vodka :beer:

Delts today, smashed myself to bits. Kept it to 2 exercises, to be honest I'm not convinced the front raises were doing much anyway.

Got the weight up quite high, maybe could have done more, but with the movement of the ship and the fact it was the first time going heavy overhead for a while I am very happy.

*Seated Military Press*

15 x bar

10 x 40kg

5 x 60kg

6 x 70kg

3 x 80kg

2 x 6 x 67.5kg

*Lat Raises, Seated*

2 x 8 x 18kg

So I'm a happy guy, gonna be a sore guy though.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Ooh name change?


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Good spot!

What's going on mate? :sneaky2:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Happy birthday mate

I see making some nice progress

As you were sailor


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, just seems that my name is Chris, so may as well make it Chris here!

Cheers for the birthday message Joe.

Yip, next week I feel confident for a good 85kg overhead for 2 or 3.

Lets keep the numbers UPPING


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Vodka, fcking lightweight:tongue:

Hope the Birthday celebs were good, I'll take it for granted they were:thumb:

at the risk of getting burnt down in flames by JW why are the workouts so short?

Is it because your a lazy bastard:lol: :lol:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

He has no stamina, as I discovered one night a few weeks ago...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'D HAD A LONG DRIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Mainly because I am training for strength Tel and I believe that if you're going heavy enough and doing it properly you shouldn't need loads of exercises.

Especially with delts, they are such a small area really and if you are Military Pressing properly it will hit most of your delts. The lat raises are just a little ancillary that I like to do for the burn.

I do the same for all my major muscle groups. Technically you shouldn't need anything more than deads for your back, squats for your legs and bench for your chest.

My leg days are Squats and extension, and the extensions are only 2 x 8.

Back is Deads, lat pulldowns and rows, the last 2 only 2 x 8 normally.

Chest is Flat, then incline and maybe dips 2 x 8.

arms I just throw in on the back and chest day as a finisher as they get hammered anyway if you're doing the rest correctly.

Plus if I am going heavy I need longer between sets to recover in order to maximise the amount lifted, so it all helps to keep the sessions shorter.

I am open to being proved wrong though???


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I wasn't referring to your performance in the gym.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I'D HAD A LONG DRIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


.......and this is why you drink Vodka:confused1:

:lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey, it's good enough for Pudjanowski, it's good enough for me!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

He's on something stronger than wódka, I expect....


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Surely not.............."Protein" !!!!


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Extwa Spwecial fingys?

They seem to be causing a typing impedement - you should give them up now :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So back today.

I made a decision early on that today I was juts going to try and conquer my fear of deads. So all I did was deads. If I feel up to it I will crack on and do some more back and Tri's tomorrow.

Very happy with todays session, although I have to say I am still not eating properly, all I can stomach at the moment is shakes and 1 meal a day.

Not sure whats wrong with me. My kidneys have been a bit sore so I don't know, anyways. Still getting stronger!!

*Deads*

5 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 140kg

5 x 175kg

1 x 195kg

2 x 5 x 150kg

So, the big number is creeping back up again. I was kicking myself for a bit but then thought, it's only 5kg off 200kg which is very good.

I'll be happy when the lift is back at 205kg. Then I will be bakc on making progress. It is all in the head though.

Today I was in the right frame of mind and that 195kg was easy. Probs could have shifted 200kg, but, baby steps.

Hopefully tomorrow I'll be ok to do some Tri work and finishe of rows and pulldowns.

Plus I MUST try and get food down me as I can't run on fumes forever!! I have heard reports though from this gear that it can supress appetite quite alot, I believe it was Nytol mentioned it (could be wrong).

Anyways, enough excuses, I'm happy enough with what was achieved. The fear is slowly dissapating :beer:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Nice DL mate 

Interested to see how you go on with this compound, never really heard much about it


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

I'm always hungry, might have to get some of this stuff Chris is on :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Normally I eat like a horse, but I don't know whats going on!!!

At least abs are starting to show again. So there is one bonus I guess!!!

Will be down the end of August Dave, Benching I think is the way forward!

I should be up around 150kg by then!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Good dealdlifting Chris.


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Soooo when do we get pics of the abs purlease ?....if there is no pics - it didnt happen ...so they say


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Abs or uniform.......make your mind up girl :tongue:

I am going to wait till the end of the course and put new pics up.

Hopefully there will be a difference.

I have started to notice what I believe to be stretch marks where my Delt and Bicep join, is it wrong of me to think of this as good progression???


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice deads, good to see you're back on the horse. But do try to get some food down you. If you think it's bad now, be glad you're not on tren................

Hopefully I'll be back benching again by the end of August but will be back following the blast programme as much as possible.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well I am easy, so I'll just follow whatever programme best falls into place with what you guys are doing!

I reckon with a lift off and good spot I gotta 145kg in me now for bench.

It is amazing how much the lift off takes out of you. Plus I am not using my legs at all, so that is somethign worth looking into as well as general technique.

I am well chuffed with my deads, I can feel the confidence coming back slowly but surely.

When I did the 195kg I didn't get the fear like I normally do, I new I would do it. I also knew not to attempt anymore for risk of destroying what I had managed to build.

It all sounds really gay this confidence thing, but it really does make all the difference, and I really think we're talking maybe 5 - 10kg difference in my case!

I'm off to attempt to ram more food down my throat. Hopefully pick my mood up a bit as well, been very down recently, I think it must be the no food and general tiredness as I reach the end of contract.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Quite, and looking forward to getting home for a bit.

Re the bench sesh, Dave and I are doing quite different things at the moment so I guess it will be each to his own.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Normally I eat like a horse, but I don't know whats going on!!!


Out of a nosebag:confused1:

I have something in common with a horse



Chris1 said:


> Well I am easy


We know you are mate:thumbup1:



Chris1 said:


> I have started to notice what I believe to be stretch marks where my Delt and Bicep join, is it wrong of me to think of this as good progression???


You can get cream for that

Anybody off to Wingers do on Sept 2nd, I maybe after a bed for the night??


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Well I will be in the UK on September 2nd and I am staying at the *

Crowne Plaza Hotel LONDON-THE CITY

19 NEW BRIDGE STREET

LONDON, EC4V 6DB ENGLAND

1- 877-227-6963


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> Well I will be in the UK on September 2nd and I am staying at the *
> 
> Crowne Plaza Hotel LONDON-THE CITY
> 
> ...


That, my friend, is way way way out of my league:cool2:

Mindst, I don't mind Heads and Tails:lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Is it expensive?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I someone after a lift Tel???

What is this "Do" you speak of?? Are we all having a dinner or something?


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

We can or have some drinks at a bar with JW007.

I will only be in town for one day and then off to Amsterdam for a smoke fest for two days.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I would certaintly be up for that. I am home from sea then and I think it would be nice for us all to meet up for a bit of food and drinks.

You in Tel? I'm sure Darren and Dave would pop across the smoke as well!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

winger said:


> Well I will be in the UK on September 2nd and I am staying at the *
> 
> Crowne Plaza Hotel LONDON-THE CITY
> 
> ...


That's just over the bridge from my office. Nice hotel though not particularly central for the nightlife, and the nearest Tube (subway/metro) station is currently closed. But it's not far from the West End.

Oh and the 877 number only works in the US/Canada...


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

winger said:


> We can or have some drinks at a bar with JW007.
> 
> I will only be in town for one day and then off to Amsterdam for a smoke fest for two days.


Ooh, can I come? For drinks in London, not the smoking, lol


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> That's just over the bridge from my office. Nice hotel though not particularly central for the nightlife, and the nearest Tube (subway/metro) station is currently closed. But it's not far from the West End.
> 
> Oh and the 877 number only works in the US/Canada...


Will the tube be open by September 2nd?



Beklet said:


> Ooh, can I come? For drinks in London, not the smoking, lol


Absolutely Bek and bring your corset. :beer:

We need to pick a bar in advance, anyone know a good bar that's close?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

The Buddah Bar isn't that far.

Directions below

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=19+New+Bridge+Street,+London,+EC4V+6DB,+United+Kingdom+(Crowne+Plaza+London+-+The+City)&daddr=8+Victoria+Embankment,+London,+Westminster,+WC2R+2,+United+Kingdom+(Buddha+Bar)&hl=en&geocode=FbwDEgMdM2f-_yHUkwOhnAljbw%3BFWD-EQMdrUP-_yH6Uf4jU7N-cA&mra=cc&dirflg=w&sll=51.512001,-0.111237&sspn=0.006584,0.015814&ie=UTF8&ll=51.51156,-0.10982&spn=0.006584,0.015814&z=16


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

M_at said:


> The Buddah Bar isn't that far.
> 
> Directions below
> 
> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=19+New+Bridge+Street,+London,+EC4V+6DB,+United+Kingdom+(Crowne+Plaza+London+-+The+City)&daddr=8+Victoria+Embankment,+London,+Westminster,+WC2R+2,+United+Kingdom+(Buddha+Bar)&hl=en&geocode=FbwDEgMdM2f-_yHUkwOhnAljbw%3BFWD-EQMdrUP-_yH6Uf4jU7N-cA&mra=cc&dirflg=w&sll=51.512001,-0.111237&sspn=0.006584,0.015814&ie=UTF8&ll=51.51156,-0.10982&spn=0.006584,0.015814&z=16


That sounds fun. Would this be the most fun of the bars around there?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Starting to sound a bit like a plan. Plus I reckon there would be some ok hotels not to expensive for the rest of us round there!!!

I could tie all this in with an end of August trip to show DC and DMCC how to bench


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Winger it doesn't open again till 2011 as the station is being rebuilt, as is the National Rail station above it.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> *Will the tube be open by September 2nd?*
> 
> Absolutely Bek and bring your corset. :beer:
> 
> We need to pick a bar in advance, anyone know a good bar that's close?


It would help if we knew who's tube you were talking about Wingman:lol: :lol:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Starting to sound a bit like a plan. Plus I reckon there would be some ok hotels not to expensive for the rest of us round there!!!
> 
> I could tie all this in with an end of August trip to show DC and DMCC how to bench


So you will be driving from Newcastle or Southampton? :whistling:

Winger, that hotel is well expensive mate

Still waiting for an offer of a bed for the night:rolleyes: :whistling: or failing that a cheap Hotel?


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Well maybe we should pic a bar first and then find a hotel next to it...lol

Bummed about the Tube being down, nobody even mentioned it.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tel, the Hiltons were cheap and well nice inside. If we shared it would be probably £50 each for the night but we would have separate beds unfortunately :crying:

I'll take the car big guy, pick you up en-route. Lets get this party started!!!

Tube may be down, but thats why God invented Indian taxi drivers. They are like the tube but faster and more direct and I don't have to have physical contact with dirty southern strangers.

Apart from the ones at the end of the night in the kebab shop


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

This should be fun. I can't wait.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Almost forgot, I did some training today.

I feel totally sh*gged now, MASSIVE pumps all round. Been a awhile since I felt that.

Unfortunately I think I f*cked my RC, however it isn't to bad now so I should be ok. Totally forgot how much weight to do on the Incline and went 10kg over by mistake, still trained after as well like a nob.

Nevermind, and excellent session though, very happy with the weights shifted although

I WANT MORE!!!!!!

*Flat Bench*

5 x 40kg

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

working sets

5 x 132.5kg

1.5 x 145kg (Second rep I got all the way up but form was all pver and had to lift my ar5e for the last few part so only counted 0.5)

2 x 5 x 125kg

*CGBP*

8 x 100kg

8 x 105kg Felt super strong!

*Incline*

2 x 95kg (completely miscalculated, wasn't expecting it, nearly dropped the lot)

6 x 85kg

8 x 85kg

*Tri pushdowns*

2 x 8 x 55kg Need to up this one.

stopped there as didn't want to aggrevate the shoulder. Only missed Dips though so not so bad!!

Feeling big and strong today, lovimg the gains atm.

Home in 1 week to 

Loving everything.......including this Magnum I'm munching on


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

winger said:


> Well maybe we should pic a bar first and then find a hotel next to it...lol
> 
> Bummed about the Tube being down, nobody even mentioned it.


It's not the entire system - there's a station next to that hotel and one within a few minutes walk which will be open

Is there anywhere in town you really want to see? That may help people suggest hotels.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris be very VERY careful with your shoulder. I wasn't and I am now paying the price. Especially as you rarely train with a spotter to lift the bar in.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Meh, I should have a spotter but I just crack on. WIth a spotter and lift off the 145 is in the bag.

Just happy the numbers are on the rise!!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Tel, the Hiltons were cheap and well nice inside. If we shared it would be probably £50 each for the night but we would have separate beds unfortunately :crying:
> 
> I'll take the car big guy, pick you up en-route. Lets get this party started!!!
> 
> ...


I know this may sound absolutely ridiculous, but Wednesday is my shoulders &

triceps day, are we cool for an early workout before the precedings, would be good:thumbup1:

Of course my Mum will have to be getting very much better but by then she

will hopefully be either back home with a home help or living with me or my sister:thumbup1:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

M_at said:


> It's not the entire system - there's a station next to that hotel and one within a few minutes walk which will be open
> 
> Is there anywhere in town you really want to see? That may help people suggest hotels.


Good. I just want to meet as many of the people on the board as possible.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sounds like a plan tel. We can figure it in in the morning.

Show you how to press properly


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

2 September is a school night, isn't it?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not for me


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> 2 September is a school night, isn't it?





Chris1 said:


> Not for me


If the street lights are on can Chris still come out and play? :beer:

I want to meet you guys really bad. Even tel, we can talk about the times when we actually had it..lol


----------



## Guest (Aug 8, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> Almost forgot, I did some training today.
> 
> I feel totally sh*gged now, MASSIVE pumps all round. Been a awhile since I felt that.
> 
> ...


Great flat benching Chris:thumbup1: Some nice strength there mate!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Damn 319lbs on bench is most impressive Chris!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers guys! Pretty happy with my benching these days.

Although more would be better 

Winger, it's much safer for all concerned if the street lights are on when I play


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Hey I never said that I wouldn't come out, just that I wouldn't be out long as it's a school night.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> Hey I never said that I wouldn't come out, just that I wouldn't be out long as it's a school night.


That's ok, I just want to meet ya and grope the sh1t out of ya and leave ya.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Use me, abuse me, then dump me? :crying:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> Use me, abuse me, then dump me? :crying:


I only have one day so I don't want to waste it. :beer:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You might at least buy me a coffee, leave cab fare and slap my ass on the way out.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> You might at least buy me a coffee, leave cab fare and slap my ass on the way out.


How about I slap the cab driver, take his coffee and give it to you and give you a courtesy reach-a-round?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Yeah, s'pose that'll do...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

What do I get then big guy??


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> What do I get then big guy??


You get the taxi driver. :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Result!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just a quick update.

Haven't trained since chest the other day, basically as I couldn't walk. My lower back has been crippled. The pain has been such that I can't move.

It is defo a good DOM type muscular pain, and MASSIVE pump, just meant that squats have been out. Should be ok tomorrow though I hope.

HUGE chest and Tri DOMS as well, must be doing something right.

Have had very limited movement in my shoulder recently as well though unfortunately after my incline miscalculation. but thats cleared. Upped the fish oils back to 15g for now to see if that helps.

So looking forward to posting some big numbers tomorrow


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Heat and ice too. If your shoulder has a limited ROM and is sore, you need to sort it out, and 15g of fish oils won't cut it.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

May up then. Try 30 and then drop back if ok.

My shoulder is ok now, just regular DOMS, Delts aren't for another 3 days so we'll see.

I am either going to skip Deads this week OR leave them till I get home.

I can't afford a 6 hour drive with my back the way it was yesterday.

I may leave them till I get back actually, as I am on a role and don't want to stop.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

But get some heat and ice on it irrespective!! The ice will reduce any swelling, and the heat will get it nicely mobile again.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Just a quick update.
> 
> Haven't trained since chest the other day,


Lazy Fvkcer:whistling:

Shall I PM my mobile to you, but don't be sending any ridiculous gay texts at

all hours


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> Lazy Fvkcer:whistling:
> 
> Shall I PM my mobile to you, but don't be sending any ridiculous gay texts at
> 
> all hours


LOL


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

PM it through Tel and we can have phone sex every night 

Legs today, unexpected bout of power.

Struggled for 3 at 140kg I think it was last time this time went like this.

*Squats*

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 130kg

5 x 150kg Woohoo, First 3 below parallel, last 2 1 inch above, felt my almost popping out. Well thats what it seemed like, so didn't go as deep.

2 x 5 x 125kg, robbed myself here, had more in the tank.

*Leg extensions*

2 x 12 x 97.5kg

Really happy with that session, and yet a bit dissapointed as I had more. So feel like I have done myself short.

Next week though I know I have more so I will give more, plus I will be back in a proper sweat filled hardcore gym 

So close to home I can taste it, 5 weeks of blissfully doing nothing.

Except taking Grandad to the big smoke to meet his other elderly friends :tongue:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice squating Chris.

Can't wait to see you and grandpappy.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It should be a good one


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> last 2 1 inch above


LMFAO, are you sure it wasn't 1 and a quarter inches:lol:

I'm catching you up big guy:whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know Tel, you're my inspiration 

Although I am having inclinations towards doing a 5 week blast at home!!!

To be honest I don't think this is an option as I am in the middle of an oral course, but we'll see.

Defo on the cards for the future.

Have to say I am looking forward to training with you Tel, we'll see who pushes who to the limit


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I know Tel, you're my inspiration
> 
> Although I am having inclinations towards doing a 5 week blast at home!!!
> 
> ...


Not sure where we're going to train, nobody is screaming out "train here",

typical safaners, all mouth


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I would ask around mate but I don't know London at all.

Only place I know of is Darrens Gym and he has moved since then so I am at a loss.

Might start a thread when we know where we are staying.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I would ask around mate but I don't know London at all.
> 
> Only place I know of is Darrens Gym and he has moved since then so I am at a loss.
> 
> Might start a thread when we know where we are staying.


Thats a hint to you lot from London


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Depends entirely what kind of gym you want, really.

Chris, IMO you should leave any blast (even a mild one) till you have some sustained time off work - don't you have a few months towards the end of the year?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I may have 2 months off in Jan.

You're probably right. I may do another oral only course later on in the year though.

Will see, this one has been going quite well I think


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

The main reason I suggest that is because then you'll have access to a much better gym and not much to do other than eat, train, sleep and shag.


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

glad to see a little bit of training still goes on


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

pfft, shag!!! Chance would be a fine thing, unless you're coming up??

Yeah Dave, it comes and goes


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> pfft, shag!!! Chance would be a fine thing, unless you're coming up??
> 
> Yeah Dave, it comes and goes


one day a month programmes are the future mate, one day they'll all be doing it that way


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Can't be overtraining mate


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

davetherave said:


> one day a month programmes are the future mate, one day they'll all be doing it that way


Only 20 min sessions though, don't want to overtrain


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Only 20 min sessions though, don't want to overtrain


including driving to the gym, getting changed, dump, buying a drink, some curls, shower, changed and drive home


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> Only 20 min sessions though, don't want to overtrain


Don't laugh my workouts are about 23 minutes long every other day. Get in and get out and train heavy.



davetherave said:


> including driving to the gym, getting changed, dump, buying a drink, some curls, shower, changed and drive home


I think your confusing it with sex.

When my wife and I have sex it takes about 20 minutes.

19 minutes of begging and 1 minute or the most intense sex, well kind of like a jack rabbit, or like a one rep max power lifter like Darren...ooopsie. :beer:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> Don't laugh my workouts are about 23 minutes long every other day. Get in and get out and train heavy. I think your confusing it with sex.
> 
> When my wife and I have sex it takes about 20 minutes.
> 
> 19 minutes of begging and 1 minute or the most intense sex, well kind of like a jack rabbit, or like a one rep max power lifter like Darren...ooopsie. :beer:


You have to beg the 5 black guys to get off her, they've just got no manners these

ppl have they:lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> You have to beg the 5 black guys to get off her, they've just got no manners these
> 
> ppl have they:lol:


Not really, I just roll a watermelon in the other direction and they scramble.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

That cracked me up Winger 

So no training again, but this is because tomorrow I am going HOME!!!!!!

Another contract down adn now I get to drive up home and do nothing but eat, sleep, train and try and sh*g Winger on the 2nd 

Wish me a safe journey back to the father land and I will be online in a couple of days with hopefully a training update


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

DRIVEBY........... :bounce:

See ya on the 2nd  :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You as well????

Ya dancer


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Woohoo back in Blighty and trying to avoid my advances!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I welcome them Darren.

Like a drunk welcomes a train


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You're just grateful for the attention, sweetcheeks.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

To right I am. I don't get enough to complain where it comes from


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> You as well????
> 
> Ya dancer


Ya me too 

.... god I need a new dress now :lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Ya me too
> 
> .... god I need a new dress now :lol:


I hope you buy a really short dress. My bad did I just hijack Chris's journal? :lol:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Ermmmm....


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

:lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Stalker who me? :whistling:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

winger said:


> Stalker who me? :whistling:


pmsl...

well since we are thread hijacking and chris aint here to stop us.... :whistling:

....I may go dress shopping in cambridge tomorrow.... which means I need some sleep now lol


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Zara-Leoni said:


> pmsl...
> 
> well since we are thread hijacking and chris aint here to stop us.... :whistling:
> 
> ....I may go dress shopping in cambridge tomorrow.... which means I need some sleep now lol


Sleep is so overrated sunshine.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> See ya on the 2nd  :thumb:


Thats my bed sorted for the 2nd then


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> Thats my bed sorted for the 2nd then


what? you having the empty one in cambridge while I'm away?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris, we could train at my gym and set off from there? Its half decent and a proper "mans"

gym, not one of those tarts gyms:whistling:


----------



## Guest (Aug 14, 2009)

:lol: :lol: :lol: ..Couldn't help myself


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Sailor Poof is back in Blighty!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I am indeed home. Knackered, took nearly 9 hours with terrible traffic.

Still no kitchen and something is wrong with my Sky +, bloody listings are broken.

Every time I come home this stupid box has knackered itself somehow.

Thanks for the hijacks. Nice to see people still come in here 

Tel mate, sounds like a plan!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

So when are you visiting me and the wife?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not sure, just got in, need a bath and a sleep before I start thinking normally again.

5 weeks, so much time and no idea what to do!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Get your kitchen sorted maybe!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

True, Should be starting Monday and finished Tuesday.

I hope!!!

Got sh1t all food or drink till then. Not great for a diet!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Step up and be a man, OK sorry, I just wanted to be macho for a second.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

winger said:


> Step up and be a man, OK sorry, I just wanted to be macho for a second.


LOL!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

rs007 said:


> LOL!


Reps for that..lol


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

boring journal, infact could be a contender for worst journal ever


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Ever thought that your Sky+ box could be buggered because you leave it on and tuned to the same channel for months at a time?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Answer your texts gay boy!!

So, weighed myself today for the first time in 3 months.

I think I'm looking leaner, abs maybe comig back through, felt great but tired and out of breath all the time.

Probably due to the fact that I'm up to 119kg again. I'm sure it must be muscle as I feel alot leaner.

I'm starting back on the Clen today after 3 weeks off so should lean up even more now.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

rs007 said:


> LOL!





winger said:


> Reps for that..lol


ROFLMFAOPMSLLOL :thumb: :beer: :lol:  :tongue: :cool2: :bounce: :thumbup1:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I was out shopping so shut your yap.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So Clen/T3 is started. Boiling up already 

Love it 

So, training is up for a change. Deads are out for now due to the lower back.

I thought it was just massive back pumps but now I am worried it is somethimg else. When I woke up this morning I went in the shower and then couldn't walk.

So I need to come up with a new back workout, maybe only temporary, but something to tide me over till the back gets better.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Just in to show some natty love :wub:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey ladies, remember me 

Well after a week form hell trying to get everything sorted in my sh1t tip of a house I finally managed to get back in the gym.

Kitchen fitters I was told were only supposed to be in 2 days and it took 4 so I have had to sit indoors basically since I got back waiting for them to finish.

So I was pleasantly surprised to see that I am still on track.

*Flat bench*

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 134kg

2 x 144kg

5 x 130kg

4 x 130kg

*Incline bench*

2 x 8 x 90kg

*Dips*

2 x 8 x BW

*CGBP*

2 x 8 x 100kg

*Tri Pushdowns*

2 x 8 x 55kg

Well pleased with that.

Bring on the 150kg next week 

How we looking for the gathering??


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not bad for a natty 

oh wait, I forgot :whistling:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Wooo for 144! Were you sensible this time and got a spotter, or do I have to spank you?


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Damn Chris, that is awesome. What is your weight at the moment?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

So it'll be arms today and shoulders tomorrow eh, then chest again:whistling:

Whats with the random numbers 134 and 144, and yes, I'm jealous

Whats your weight atm?

Btw, good workout


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

They only have the 2kg small weights as opposed to the 2.5kg you get in normal gyms.

I think you're supposed to use them with the 1kg collars but I don't like collars.

I'm actually back down to around 117 ish now, down from 118.5 after a week of not eating properly as I don't have a kitchen.

Darren, no spotter or lift off, I shall assume the position xxx


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris you are asking for trouble not getting a lift in with that weight, especially if the uprights on your bench rack are angled away from you.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

They're straight up and down mate.

The only hassle I have with the bench is the stupid uprights are to close together, which makes it a pain for loading and unloading as the bar keeps flipping up and when I do CGBP the uprights are right where I normally have my hands.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Even so Chris, having someone lift the bar in for you will save you a lot of shoulder problems later on. There was a guy in the gym I was training in yesterday who was considerably bigger than you but still got a lift in on a lower weight than you.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I totally agree with you Darren, I just don't like bothering people and more than that I can't find anyone who can spot me properly.

When I bench I quite often look like I'm struggling, and I am, but people always come in to early trying to help which is pointless. Unless the bar starts lowering again don't step in!!!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I totally agree with you Darren, I just don't like bothering people and more than that I can't find anyone who can spot me properly.
> 
> When I bench I quite often look like I'm struggling, and I am, but people always come in to early trying to help which is pointless. Unless the bar starts lowering again don't step in!!!


"

I'm exactly the same, hate them bastards who's hands "hovver" over the bar

saying "its all yours mate":cursing:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Exactly, even if you do it all on your own, you're never quite sure.

If I spot I have my hands an inch under the bar so there is no doubt, if I see the guy struggling then I use finger tips only.

Most times when people are struggling it only takes the tiniest of little pushes to get the bar going in the right direction.

I hate spotters that just take over, it defeats the object to me.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Then teach them how to do it properly, hangover boy.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Dirty natty fly by, spreading the love :wub:

Looking good, keep it tight, maybe I should come and check your form...... :devil2:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Beklet said:


> Dirty natty fly by, spreading the love :wub:
> 
> Looking good, keep it tight, maybe I should come and check your form...... :devil2:


You should and report back to us.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You're all welcome anytime the pair of you


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> You're all welcome anytime the pair of you


How about the 2nd? We can make it a threesome if my wife will let me. :confused1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sounds good to me Wingman!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Legs today. Awesome workout.

Can't walk now, very happy with how these numbers are progressing.

May even try deads this week to see what happens.

Not sure how to work it as next Tuesday I have to do gay shoulders with Tel :whistling:

Sure I'll work round it.

*Squats*

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 140kg

1 x 1/4 rep x 160kg

1 x 1/2 rep x 160kg

1 x 3/4 rep x 160kg

1 x 1 x 160kg

2 x 5 x 130kg

*Standing calf raise*

2 x 15 x full stack yawn

*Seated calf raise*

2 x 20 x forgotten, did really slowly and really hurt 

*Leg extensions*

2 x 12 x full stack

Happy with the 160kg, all that 1/4 rep nonsense was just because I was worried I wouldn't get up. The last 140 I nearly failed on, although I was atg on it which didn't help. So I went down a 1/4 pause, half pause and so on. No re-racking.

Sure you get the idea.

So, delts tomorrow maybe, or next day. Gonna see if I can crack the big 90!! I will get someone in to lift off though as I hate the set-up in this gym for seated MP's.

Wish me luck :bounce: :thumb:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Legs today. Awesome workout.
> 
> Can't walk now, very happy with how these numbers are progressing.
> 
> ...


Nice numbers on the squats, you'll be glad that next *Wednesday* is squats day now, can't afford 2 nights at London prices.

Do we have any clue on where we are staying??


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I meant Wednesday, lol.

Squats is cool beans, although I would have been happy with anything really. Your gym, your choice.

I was going to PM you, Mak and Tom and see if you had come up with any plans yet??


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I meant Wednesday, lol.
> 
> Squats is cool beans, although I would have been happy with anything really. Your gym, your choice.
> 
> I was going to PM you, Mak and Tom and see if you had come up with any plans yet??


Shall we hire a caravan, 2 berth of course:lol:

I don't even know where we are meeting winger and joe, we'll have to stay outside

the center (so I'm told) as it will be way expensive, for my pocket anyway


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, Hilton was 100 quid for a double room.

50 each aint to bad really. We could get all 4 in and just kip down on the floor if the other 2 are still going?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Well, Hilton was 100 quid for a double room.
> 
> 50 each aint to bad really. We could get all 4 in and just kip down on the floor if the other 2 are still going?


Do you get an all you can eat breakfast

Sounds good to me, 2 rooms I think best, could turn ugly with only 2 beds:whistling:

I mean, where are you 3 gonna sleep:confused1:

:laugh:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey old man, you might be bigger and older but last time I checked I'm still stronger!!!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Very good workout, and very sensible approach to the 160 - nothing wrong with a couple of partials to get used to the weight, though personally I wouldn't have re-racked it. It's no different to what I did last week, partial then a full rep.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Hey old man, you might be bigger and older but last time I checked I'm still stronger!!!!!


Hmm, I believe your 3+ stone heavier, severaly inches taller and *maybe* a *couple*

of KG's stronger:tongue:

Ahh Fvck it, I'll share


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I didn't re-rack it.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Hmm, I believe your 3+ stone heavier, severaly inches taller and *maybe* a *couple*
> 
> of KG's stronger:tongue:
> 
> Ahh Fvck it, I'll share


I knew you'd see sense sweetheart xxx


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I didn't re-rack it.


Good. The way it was presented sort of suggested you did. But it's the way forward for squatting a new number.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You mean apart from the bit where I said No-re racking :tongue:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Pfff I just read the numbers. For all I know you could have been declaring your undying love for me and offering my your man-tackle for wild nights of passion.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I used to but you dumped me for Dave :tounge:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

And he's dumped me for MrsDC.... :crying: So I'm back on the market.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Oh I see, so now you want me back eh???


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Always, sweetcheeks xxxx


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I feel used!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You wish you did. You'll feel more than used the next time you stay over. I'll make sure you get a proper stuffing, just like last time.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, it better be painted this time!!!

Actually, I don't believe I have ever bitten a softer, nicer pillow.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

The whole flat has been painted, including the Guest Suite.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Woohoo, got my PB.

Easily have a 95 in there for one. If I play this cool, I could have a BW over head press in me by the time I go back, that would smash all expectations.

So, Delts!

*Military press seated*

10 x bar

5 x 30kg

5 x 40kg

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

3 x 90kg (last one was spotted though, couldn't have done it alone)

2 x 5 x 74kg

*Seated lat raises*

2 x 8 x 18kg

Awesome workout, well chuffed!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> S
> 
> I don't even know where we are meeting winger and joe, we'll have to stay outside
> 
> the center (so I'm told) as it will be way expensive, for my pocket anyway


We will be here at 4:00, Click here.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sheesh, not even a single comment about my awesome poundage!!!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

90kg for seated military is very very strong. So strong in fact we might need to change your name too Chris007


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Oh you're so strong, and so lovely, and I'm so in awe of your poundage.

Now rep me bitch :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

winger said:


> 90kg for seated military is very very strong. So strong in fact we might need to change your name too Chris007


Wow, the greatest of honours.

Thats why I love you man :thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

M_at said:


> Oh you're so strong, and so lovely, and I'm so in awe of your poundage.
> 
> Now rep me bitch :lol:


Cheers Matt you big hunk of love.

If you're around in London then I shall reward you in spanks.....

...till then you can have a rep


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Just popped in to say FCK YOU

All sh1t here as normal, nice to see some PBs mate

I hope you been getting some practice in for wednesday, cant have that FAT head showing you up

xxx


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Getting there fella.

Session tomorrow to see how I fair. Still no beer for me though, Vodka all night!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Nice MP that, lot more than me although I'm not doing them atm as my shoulder is giving me

gyp:whistling:

Talk about women changing there minds, biatch wants to come to London now:laugh:

Still need to book hol first though, looking good for it I'd say:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Coolio, well I am still waiting for Tom to decide, I think Maks out. I'll rent a car, I'll have to get a hotel on my own then if your missus is on her way down.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Coolio, well I am still waiting for Tom to decide, I think Maks out. I'll rent a car,* I'll have to get a hotel on my own then if your missus is on her way down.*


Sorry mate, we ain't the Weemans:lol:

Still early days Chris, just give it the weekend before you do anything, I've got

loads of hotels lined up and a lot have singles for £50, there all no more than 10 mins from the cheesy pub:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok mate, keep me informed then. I'll sort out the car as I am going whatever.

Picking you guys up on the way.

I'll hold out for the hotel till you get back to me.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Poof

:wub:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Heavy lifting poof though


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

jw007 said:


> I hope you been getting some practice in for wednesday, cant have that FAT head showing you up
> 
> xxx


Or my hero either. :beer:

winger's in training as I speak. I am so looking forward to seeing you blokes you have no idea.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Looks like I can make it now fella.

We have a gang, Tel and his missus probably.

Lets get this done!!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Looks like I can make it now fella.

We have a gang, Tel and his missus probably.

Lets get this done!!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

I just called the place and he hung up on me twice. 020 7353 6170

Either I have the wrong number or I don't have any idea how to use skype..lol

My wife is going and so is a buddy of mine. His wife is smokin hot.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Bastardo.

Back and bi's today. Feeling super strong, and smashed another milestone!

Happy to have finally got over my mental block on deads, could possibly have gone heavier but I aggrevated my back so had a half ar5ed attempt at a 210 and walked away still happy.

*Deads*

5 x 100kg

3 x 140kg

1 x 180kg

1 x 200kg

0 x 210kg Deffo there, just got the fear back after I twinged my back on the 200kg. Seeing as I wasn't even going to do deads today as I have had a bad back for ages I am pretty chuffed.

*Close grip palms in Pull up*

6 x BW then 2 x BW

6 x BW then 2 x BW Couldn't do the straight 8 lol

*Wide grip pulldown*

2 x 8 x 85kg Fried by this point

*Wide Grip Row*

2 x 8 x 75kg twinge in back was quite painful by now so stopped there

*Hammer Curls*

2 x 8 x 24kg

*EZ bar curls*

2 x 8 x 30kg (I think) Super slow and perfect form, hurt like a b*stard

*DB Curls*

2 x 8 x 20kg

Great work out, well chuffed with the weight on deads. I have been past 205kg before but then the fear got me, so to do 200kg, and it was a comfortable 200, has smashed that mental block I had. I should have stopped there with the pain I had in y back because if I had moved that 210kg I would have crippled myself. The guy next to said I would have demolished 210kg easy if I had given it a better shot.

Started to suffer towards the end of the back bit and the form was off, but still very happy. Did more on bi's then normal, but screw it, gotta have some sort of gunnage for next week 

Aim for next back session is to comfortabely get over that 200kg barrier, either a 205kg or a 210kg so then I know 200kg is gone.

Really loving the gym again now, getting right back into it!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sure is fella, next week I have plans for a 150kg bench, a 170kg squat and a 210kg dead.

I think maybe my course will run out by then though, so it's nearly picture time me thinks, gulp!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

What did you up the dose? Man you are getting strong. I mean stronger..he he.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No, same dose.

Just eating more as I am home now so that may be the reason???


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Well I've had this out with you so you know what I think. If you do less than 210 next week I will be not impressed.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Completely agree Dave. My first 240 was ropey as was yours but look at us now. The boy needs to be surrounded by the right people.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dmcc said:


> Completely agree Dave. My first 240 was ropey as was yours but look at us now. The boy needs to be surrounded by the right people.


He will be on the 2nd. :beer:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Great, I'll pull my first 225kg in a pub in London, fvcked off my tits.

In fact, I'm ****ed as a [email protected] now, I'm off for a 4 plate bench


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey guys, time to update my overly neglected journal!!

*Bench*

15 x bar

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 135kg

2 x 150kg

4 x 130kg

5 x 125kg

*Incline bench*

2 x 8 x 86kg

*CGBP*

2 x 8 x 95kg

*Rope pulldowns*

2 x 8 x 35kg

Home!!!

Shattered.

Few points, well chuffed with the 150kg. Had a list in and a spot, now the spotter commited the cardinal sin, his hands were to close to the bar, now he said the he didn't use anything on the first one and very very little on the second.

However you know how this affects you mentally, did he or didn't he. It plays havoc with your mind.

I am 100% sure though that I would have p1ssed it for 1 on my own though and I think he is right that he didn't touch it, as normally when they take the weight you feel a slight jump if you know what I mean and there was none.

Decided against Dips as my chest was crippled after the inclines and the CGBP, wanted to try ropes for a change, may continue with mixing up the last tri exercise.

Pushdowns if I'm honest do nothing for me other than hurt my RC, I should have stopped them ages ago but they just became habit.

Looks like I am becoming a strong, really feeling it again now and getting right back into the swing of it. There were bigger guys than me there today who were saying they couldn't press that much, so either they're weak as hell or I need to start realising that I am a strong boy


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Wooooooooo at the PB!

I'm not surprised that you're shattered, that's a LOT of warm-up in a lot of ways. Last week I didn't even do half that before my working sets, and I'm the one getting over an injury.

Now work on your squat.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice bench big man!


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

you are a cnut, 150 is very impressive


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers guys.

I know it's a lot Darren. Normally nowadays I miss out the 80kg, not sure why I did it.

I also got mega confused at what my first working set should be. I had the bar rigged up for 140kg for the first 5, then I thought hold on, that can't be right I only do 145 for 1.

So I spent a good 5 minutes trying to figure out what I was supposed to be doing and plumped for the 135kg.

Also didn't have my wraps. 1 has gone missing and the gym had none, so my girl wrists were in agony which didn't help. So with all those negatoves added on I think I did really well!


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Cheers guys.
> 
> I know it's a lot Darren. Normally nowadays I miss out the 80kg, not sure why I did it.
> 
> ...


i take it you use chalk though pal?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

NO chalk, I have ordered liquid chalk but that will only be for deads.

Do you use chalk for benching? Does it help?


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> NO chalk, I have ordered liquid chalk but that will only be for deads.
> 
> Do you use chalk for benching? Does it help?


nah mate id jumped onto the deadlift weight but didnt tell anyone :lol:

i use chalk for deads and sometimes overhead press but thats it, i do keep it on after deads so you could argue i use it for all back and bicep exercises


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Also didn't have my wraps. 1 has gone missing and the gym had none, so my girl wrists were in agony which didn't help. So with all those negatoves added on I think I did really well!


Buy some now. www.bpsports.co.uk does good Inzer wraps, get the 36" ones - same as mine. They'll hold your hand straight as if it's in a splint.



Chris1 said:


> NO chalk, I have ordered liquid chalk but that will only be for deads.
> 
> Do you use chalk for benching? Does it help?


Yes and yes. It's not nice feeling your hand slide along the bar when there's well over 100kg on it.



dc55 said:


> Oh and I use liquid chalk for everything....just got into a habbit now. Makes me look like a proper lifter, with loads of chalk everywhere....pmsl


Same here.


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Nice benching chris

Impressed mate


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers guys for the comments again.

Chalk ordered.

Unsure what to go for next week really. I guess logically 155?

Tomorrow I will settle for nothing less than a 170kg squat. End of story.

I may consider strapping up, unsure yet. Ooooo the decisions.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

And you complain about me progressing on the deadlift!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not complaining!!! Simply offering up a spanking for you because you're getting to strong?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Then tomorrow you'll get to the gym and do sweet FA until my bench and squat have caught up. Can have you getting stronger while I'm trying to out do you


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

M_at said:


> And you complain about me progressing on the deadlift!


The King of lifts, the true test of strength.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

When I first saw that I thought you said trying to out me not out do me lol 

Tomorrow like I said will be a 170kg end of story!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You don't need help being outed :whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheeky mare....

....I'm still in denial


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Can your ship get down de nile?

:lol: L:lol:L :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

God Matt, that was terrible!!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Denial is a river in Egypt, honey


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris, stick to reps on the bench, you are progressing rather fast and you don't want to get hurt. Use the same weight and just do more reps. After you do 8-10 reps up the weight. JMO.

Gear gives a false sense of security in a way, not that I know anything about that.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Would be interested to hear Joes thoughts on that?

He advised me on this programme and it has been working well but I am always open to suggestions if they will help me in the long run.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> Would be interested to hear Joes thoughts on that?
> 
> He advised me on this programme and it has been working well but I am always open to suggestions if they will help me in the long run.


If you are adding weight to the bar then you are on the right track.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thats the big thing.

Just got to keep conquering this dead fear and I'll be alright!


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> *Would be interested to hear Joes thoughts on that?*
> 
> He advised me on this programme and it has been working well but I am always open to suggestions if they will help me in the long run.


Continue as you are mate, great progress

Dont change as working well

As for Gear, your not really on much at all in scheme of things, doubtfull you wil "over progress" PMSL


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Lol, I know.

I'm still pretty naive as to the gear side and the progress to be made.

I'll crack on as normal.

170kg today!!! Should **** it, although it is another 10kg jump on last week.

I still think my legs have way more to offer in terms of lifting, not even close to potential, at least the numbers are a bit more respectable now though.

Looking forward to seeing you guys tomorrow as well!!

Shaping up to be a top night!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, blasted my legs today for fun, had to wait for the rack though :cursing:

I hate waiting.

Did a gay little warm-up while waiting.

12 extensions @ 50kg

12 extensions at 70kg

Standing leg curl @ 30kg

GAY!!!

*Squats*

5 x 80kg

5 x 120kg

3 x 140kg

4 x 160kg (to think I was worried about 1 last week!!!)

3 x 170kg (first one just above, other 2 either parallel or slightly below)

0.5 x 180kg wrist gave out and had to re-rack

5 x 150kg

5 x 140kg

*Seated Calf raises*

2 x 15 x 55kg

No extensions this week as sh*gged after squats and short on time!

Good workout, achieved more than I set out to, just p1ssed at the 180 as I had it there. Maybe not to parallel, but defo there.

As I unrack I then push my hands to where I like them ready for the squat, must have got it wrong this time and hurt myself. No biggy.

One for next week!!!

The only issue I have (other than I forgot my belt :whistling: ) is my hips.

When I squat my hips really hurt. Do I need to just keep changing my stance till I find a position that they don't hurt in, or is there something else I could be doing?

Or should I just man up and let them get used to it?


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice squating big man. How wide are your feet?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

If you think of an Olly bar, my feet are just inside the width of the plates.

I keep it well wide as I find it helps with the power and form.

In the past I always kept my feet to narrow.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Mate you were looking great yesterday :wub:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

dmcc said:


> Mate you were looking great yesterday :wub:


x2 :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers you 2.

I didn't think so next to the big guys, but it was fun.

Bek, if you ever mention your weight again I will kick you in the face, You are tiny!!!!!!

Except the boobs, they were nice....

....mmmmmm, just..........lovely


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris - you are one of the big guys.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris I am going to smack you for that. Look in the mirror FFS.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I look forward to it sweetheart :wub:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Give me a kick step and I'll slap him too.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

By the end of last night Matt you would have struggled to slap yourself!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Smack him in the balls, if you can find them.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Nah - nothing there! Found a racoon though!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, crap workout.

To be expected after the last few days, but no excuses.

I'm just weak,

*Deads*

5 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

3 x 140kg

2 x 180kg

1 x 200kg

0.5 x 210kg

1 x 200kg

*Military Press*

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

2 x 84kg

2 x 5 x 74kg

*Pull ups*

4 x bw

4 x bw

4 x bw

4 x bw these were hard.

*DB Curls*

8 x 22kg

5 x 28kg quite impressed at that

*Preacher bar curls*

2 x 8 x 50kg

Done.

Having a bit of a crisis of confidencs at the moment.

Not sure if this is for me anymore.

Something Patirck said Wed made me think about maybe giving the BB route a go for a while, see how that is?

Might be worth a shot for a bit?

Should be getting some pics up today if I can be bothered, not that there has been any change lol


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Well, crap workout.
> 
> To be expected after the last few days, but no excuses.
> 
> ...


*I WANT PICS!!!!* :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You've seen the real thing now babe.

Thought that would have put you right off


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

You DL 200 and its a sh1t workout, ffs get a grip:cursing:

Remember where you are, not where you were:whistling:

PS Are you sure the 210 wasnt 0.4


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> Well, crap workout.
> 
> To be expected after the last few days, but no excuses.
> 
> I'm just weak,


NO YOU ARE NOT!

I would be bloody happy with that workout. Just you wait until the big bear sees you talking like that.



Beklet said:


> *I WANT PICS!!!!* :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:


Me too :wub:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

OH FOR FÚCK SAKE!!!

How much rest have you had recently? Not much. And you still got 2 reps with 200. Sweet jesus that's still a good workout. You just need to work on your aggression. Get some smelling salts or nose tork and get someone to shout at you.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Told you so.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I might cry :crying:

Nah, I know.

I am just thinking that maybe a change to a BB routine for a while will keep things fresh and maybe take a little of the pressure off that I have put on myself. Not sure really.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Lol you indecisive woman you're as bad as me! As for the pics, they are required as sadly the real thing was fully clothed . . .


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Managed 4 meals today so far, although one of them was a cheeseburger :whistling:

Looks like I may manage 5 by the time the day is through.

Getting there slowly but surely!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Got up early, had my 6 eggs, went to gym.

Had a shorter than normal workout as my shoulder was killing, maybe it could be that by the time I normally go in the afternoon my body has done a certain amount of "natural" warming up just with day to day activities. Then by going in the morning I should have done some RC warmup?

Anyways, good session, no weight uppage but got a good unassisted 2.

*Bench*

15 x bar

5 x 80

5 x 100

5 x 140kg (super stoked at this!!)

2 x 150kg (Lift off and spotter but he didn't touch the bar, again, super stoked)

2 x 5 x 130kg (maybe should have done 135kg here?)

*Incline Bench*

2 x 8 x 80kg Normally I would be doing a lot more here but my shoulder started to ache and I ran out of steam

*Rope push down thingys*

2 x 8 x 35kg

*Hi to low tricep extension things on the cable crossover*

No idea of the proper words

2 x 8 x 25kg

Decided to try mixing up the assistance exercises a bit. Can't do any harm, my triceps will be getting enough from bench alone, so may as well keep it interesting. Big fan of the rope things though.

All good in the hood. Just got to get those deads going up. Away for a stag party this weekend in Cardiff, have a guy training with me in the a.m. see if that motivates me more.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris please for the love of god take care of your shoulder. If you can feel niggles in it you need to take preventive action NOW - heat and ice. And you should always warm it up no matter when in the day you train.


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris

Just quickly

Dl is a mental thing it seems with you

I suggest you load up bar and do rack pulls with far higher than PB

10"+ off ground

Get 240kg easy that way, good to build up core strength and mentally gets you over that 200kg DL barrier


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll give that a bash on Friday Joe sounds good. We don't have a rack but we have one of those platform things, guess thats what it's for.

I'll crack on and see how far I get with that, top idea again.

I only mention the BB sh1t Dave as I had a few comments in the gym from lads there and from Patrick that I could do quite well in it. At the moment I don't have the discipline for it.

Currently sorting my diet out again as I realised writing it down that i have seriously slipped.

Sometimes you don't realise till you write it and think WTF.

So that's in hand. Sorted out some additional supps as well (legal) to help out, should get them in a few days.

Also just running over some ideas for "fat burners" for additional support, I realised though that I was depending on them to much rather than using them as an aid.

Darren, I know I should be careful, but a little discomfort should never prevent one from the pursuit of strength. I would know if it was something serious, it's just a niggle I get on inclines, however never on MP?? You are correct on the warmup though!


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Very nice bench mate. Dead jealous here.



dc55 said:


> FCUKING NICE benching mate. VERY NICE.
> 
> your making super progress.....oh and sod that BB'er sh1t off.....thats for gays!!


Not all of them Dave


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah Dave, he has caught on to this stuff quickly 

Sounds like a damn good idea and I shall be starting ASAP.

When you did them Dave, how was your routine for them? Did you just use your normal Dead routine?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sounds like a plan stan


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Not gner comment on any of that stuff above, cos, well, am a bird and what do I know.... 

So instead I shall just say....

*FLYBY!!!!!!!!!* :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:



Or maybe it should be Sail-By.... :laugh:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

I'm a stupid blonde what is a rack pull? Is that like half a deadlift?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Beklet said:


> I'm a stupid blonde what is a rack pull? Is that like half a deadlift?


Yup - the top half of it.

YouTube - Rack Pulls


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

^^^^^ what he said 

So today was legs.

*Squats*

5 x 100kg

5 x 140kg

5 x 165.5kg (stoked at that, stupid weights, only had 2 x 2kg and 2 x 1.25kg, hence the daft number)

2 x 180kg (maybe 1 inch above =)

2 x 5 x 150kg

*Seated calf raises*

2 x 20 x 60kg

*Leg extensions*

2 x 12 x full stack

Chuffed at that.

Looked in the mirror and have to say the legs are looking ok these days. Calfs are really getting some definition if still a little skinny.

Good power as well. Overall a happy bunny!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Back today. Had to move things around a bit as I am away all weekend for a stag party.

There is a gym were we are staying but I don't know how good it is. So I figured I'd do shoulders down there, that way I'm not losing out on much if it is pants.

*Rck Pulls*

Love them. I have more in the tank, but I did alot of heavy reps so burnt out finding how heavy I could go.

5 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 140kg

2 x 180kg

2 x 220kg

1 x 240kg

1 x 250kg

1 x 250kg

1 x 240kg

1 x 220kg

2 x 180kg

2 x 140kg

*T Bar rows *

8 x 15kg

8 x 55kg

8 x 75kg

8 x 95kg

8 x 115kg

*Pullups*

6 x BW then 2 x BW

5 x BW then 3 x BW

So I reckon I will try rack pulls again next week. They were from just below knee level, it was the all I could do with the platform. Didn't feel like much at the time but it's starting to kick in now.

I have a pic I'll upload of what I was using. So 1 more week of these to well and truley smash the fear, reckon with less of a lead up I have a 270kg in there realistically.

Chuffed to bits


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Nice one! You big strong bit of beefcake you :wub: xxx


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Damn you dave. And damn me for posting a video.

Congrats Chris - you must be dead chuffed - reps ahoy sailor


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Well done, as I said earlier. If you can, try to get the rack a bit lower, mid-shin. You're tall, so it should be good for you.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It was a bit lower at the start as I stood on a block of wood.

It got a bit unsteady as the weights got higher so I binned the wood incase the whole lot came on top of me.

REally feeling it now, a 5 hour drive to Cardiff tomorrow will be fun!

Next week the weight will be up defo, just need to lower the amount I do up till the max.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

And to think you think I don't care :wub:

There are some good gyms in Cardiff, but whether or not you have the time to train is another matter.


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

*Geordie Fly By - Y Aye Pet !*


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Aye hinny, gann canny 

I will be training tomorrow in the accomodation, regardless of what those numpties are doing.

In fact, I am pretty p1ssed off at this weekend anyway.

I was under the impression that we would be doing something in Cardiff for the stag party, you know, paintballing or go-karting, something memorable.

No, apparantly we are doing nothing other than drinking. Now, maybe I'm thick or I just don't get it, but why couldn't we just do that in Newcastle and save a sh1t load of travelling.

I am well annoyed, I don't really want to go in the first place and this has just made it worse. Doesn't help that they are all lightweights as well so if they start drinking early doors then I am going to be out alone when they all fall.

Have to hide my gear pretty well as well as there will no doubt be snooping.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

It's just a couple of pills - throw them in a Tupperware with your vits and a few ibuprofen or whatever, job done.

It does suck though that no activities have been arranged. What kind of stag do is that?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Feck knows. I am not a great traveller when I am home at the best of times, although I will for things like London where it is a good night out with new, like minded people.

These guys I was mates in high school with and I really have nothing in common with them anymore. They all seem to be under the impression that we are all still best mates when in reality I will see them about twice a year these days.

Isn't it weird that I have more in common with a bunch of guys and girls off a computer than I do with them at home!

Plus they will all be smoking weed which I am not into at all so it will be me sitting outside most of the night I reckon. Just was looking forward to doing something memorable, but alas!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

OK devil's advocate: Why are you going?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> Isn't it weird that I have more in common with a bunch of guys and girls off a computer than I do with them at home!


Not really mate - we've all chosen to come here and we're all choosing to improve ourselves in a pretty unique and specific way. There's a certain mindset involved which makes it easy for us to all click.

I am so glad I found this place - I've made good, real friends here in so little time - the outside world makes that so much slower.

Have fun in Cardiff though!


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Why don't you develop some exotic overseas disease ..... it sounds like hell!

I have the same problem though and I feel duty bound for some reason - once it's done you can breathe a sigh of relief for another 6 months ....


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

M_at said:


> I am so glad I found this place - I've made good, real friends here in so little time - the outside world makes that so much slower.


Agree. I have met people off here who I consider friends, close friends, people I'd never have met otherwise. One of them is practically my long-lost twin.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> OK devil's advocate: Why are you going?


Because I agreed to go when I was still at sea and it seemed like a really good idea.

But when you get home and settle in to your house you then don't want to get out of it again. Also I have so much decorating yet to do.

When they said would I go I was under the impression that we would be doing loads of stuff. So then I stumped up the money for the accomodation and said I would car share as I hate flying.

So unfortunately it was to late to back out when I found out how pants it is going to be!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm back.....

....see no-ones missed me :whistling:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

How could we miss you when you were on facebook half the time!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I'm back.....
> 
> ....see no-ones missed me :whistling:


Biding our time...

well, how was it? All the gory details, now - don't leave anything out...


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Yes and consider your butt duly smacked for what you posted there at 3 o'clock this morning...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Meh, it was an ok weekend I guess.

Had a few revelations though as time went on. Most about how was and was not friends.

Also still running over in my head this dieting down to a more sensible weight and stopping this getting massive malarky.

Although I know if I did I would probably just be miserable as I would be skinny lol


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Would you believe the first bar I walked in was a bear bar, Kings cross.

I was totally oblivious despite the flags being everywhere!!

Think I am getting WAT to used to bears!


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

You sure it's not your subconscious telling you something?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You can still be big but lean. The kind of weights you were talking about earlier would make you lighter than Matt is now, and you're 8 inches taller than him!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Meh, it was an ok weekend I guess.
> 
> Had a few revelations though as time went on. Most about how was and was not friends.
> 
> ...


Now look here, ignore those insecure gay PLers! A nice big handsome bloke like you should stop all this 1-rep PB nonsense, do bodybuilding and get huge!.

You'll be happier and get loads more sex...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Some sex would be a start lol

I know. Just having a mental crisis I think at the moment.

It was more the fact that by the end of Saturday night I could barely stand let alone walk. I'm not sure what it is thats the problem. I just assume that I am weighing to much.

Maybe just tired as second night out in a row.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris reckons he's fat and is going to diet down to 13 stone.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Some sex would be a start lol
> 
> I know. Just having a mental crisis I think at the moment.
> 
> ...


Tired, tireder from heavy lifting, and on gear - but the gains will be worthwhile...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok ok, 13 stone was probably a bit much!!!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Chris reckons he's fat and is going to diet down to 13 stone.


Bwahahaha! :laugh::laugh::laugh:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So much for the weight loss.

Went away 18 stone 4lbs, came back 18stone 11lbs lol


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I weigh 2lbs more than you at the moment...........................................


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Told you there wasn't anything between us at the moment didn't I!!

That was in Tshirt and shorts but doubt there's much in it.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I was in shorts and a polyester rugby shirt that weighs nowt...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

there you go big bear, you're officially buff


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

13 stone? Anorexic emo is not a good look for you . . . I know where you're coming from my own brain veers from wanting to be lean and wanting to be strong and have big muscles. As such i'm currently enjoying eating. Was nice to wake up this morning to freshly baked bread :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well as long as you still want me Bek :wub:

Chest and Tri's today. Really stiff today, mainly in the hips and legs for some reason. Maybe a weekend of bad eating and a lot of walking around they just stiffened up a bit.

Had my first shot of MT2 after texting the world because it turned out that what I thought I knew I didn't and I was incapable of following the most basic of instructions.

Got there in the end, only took 10iu though as was unsure of the reaction.

Feels really wierd, just the rapid warm sensation through your body, the nausea was fine, didn't really get a bad feeling just very slightly quiffy. Took it before bed so that may have helped. Shot leg. Up to 20iu tonight and see how it goes.

*Flat bench*

5 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

5 x 120kg

5 x 140kg

1 x 155.5kg (HARD! The hardest it has been for a long time benching.)

2 x 5 x 130kg (last set was super difficult, I was shaking like a sh1tting dog!)

*Incline machine*

Tries this for a change, I was damn near spent after the flat bench so decided to expirement with this.

2 x 8 x 70kg (Crippled!!)

*Rope pulldowns*

2 x 8 x 35kg

*Tri dips*

2 x 8 x BW

Really good pump this week, chest really tight and feels big and strong. Tri's nice and tight as well.

Just about given up on the weight loss idea, got back to the gym, saw the big guys and thought fvck it. I want to bigger and stronger than them!

Maybe just the last of the alcohol left my brain lol

I think next week I'll have a recovery week, high reps lighter weight, todays bench was massively hard and I have been lifting heavy for a while so I think a little recovery would be good.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

I have some mt left in the fridge. Is probably not active anymore but may take it just to see. Leg works best for me, less side effects (none lol) gym tonight and it's back and biceps though my shoulder is playing up and it's pullovers tonight. Better find someone to spot me! Never underestimate how much low weight high reps hurts - try the leg workout i did last week lol


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Oh crap yeah, needs to go in the fridge lol


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Good to see you've come to your senses


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Does that also include a congrats on my PB bench?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Congrats on your bench PB.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

M_at and I speak with one voice. We are the same. You will be assimilated.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Is that some kind of sandwich assimilation?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

You should be so lucky.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Lol, I'm pretty confindent


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

About frackin time.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

So say we all.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Can i watch?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Would be rude to not let you join in somehow Bek!


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Had my first shot of MT2 after texting the world because it turned out that what I thought I knew I didn't and I was incapable of following the most basic of instructions.
> 
> Got there in the end, only took 10iu though as was unsure of the reaction.
> 
> Feels really wierd, just the rapid warm sensation through your body, the nausea was fine, didn't really get a bad feeling just very slightly quiffy. Took it before bed so that may have helped. Shot leg. Up to 20iu tonight and see how it goes.


If you put double the amount of water in though like you said, remember that 0.1ml will be 0.5mg 

Nice workout there too hotshot :thumbup1:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

I now have visions of Chris out tanning Joe! :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Oh don't start again woman, I was in enough of a state last night texting lol

Thanks for the assist though, I would have been wandering round looking like a raisin today if you hadn't saved me. 

numner 10 on the barrel anyway, so 1iu, which I guess if I used 2ml is 0.5iu???

AAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH :angry:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Oh don't start again woman, I was in enough of a state last night texting lol
> 
> Thanks for the assist though, I would have been wandering round looking like a raisin today if you hadn't saved me.
> 
> ...


10iu on barrel mate is 0.1ml

if put 2ml bac water in

10iu mark on pin = 0.5mg of lypholised powder which is fine


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Went on sunbed as well.

Feel better for it. Love how it does that.

Cheers for your help guys.

Twas the first time I have ever injected myself and was being a bit gay about the whole thing. Just needed to man up and jab I think


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Oh don't start again woman, I was in enough of a state last night texting lol
> 
> Thanks for the assist though, I would have been wandering round looking like a raisin today if you hadn't saved me.
> 
> ...


lol ignore me above.. was jst home from gym and brain and hands weren't connected.

Was meaning remember will be 0.5mg if used double the water.

As Joe said... number 10 on barrel (10iu) is 0.1ml and if you used 2ml water is 0.5mg.

Now you've got first one out the way is easy peasy lemon squeezy  :thumbup1:

Better not get browner than me though or I shall go in the huff


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll try not to 

Not sure how long it takes to have an effect though?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Twas the first time I have ever injected myself and was being a bit gay about the whole thing. Just needed to man up and jab I think


Think of it as good practice for later.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> I'll try not to
> 
> Not sure how long it takes to have an effect though?


You'll notice a change withi a week, I expect


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Legs today.

P1ssed off as I couldn't squat. There is only 1 squat rack and I went in later than normal and it was rammed.

Nevermind

*Leg Press*

8 x 140kg

8 x 140kg

3 x 8 x 250kg Quite hard on the old knees actually. Felt good though

*Standing leg curls*

3 x 8 x 30kg

*Extensions*

3 x 8 x 90kg

*Seated calf raises*

3 x 20 x 85kg


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice workout, especially for something different, but why not just ask to work in?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Because there was already someone deadlifting as well lol

Squatting above and deadlifting below lol, only 2 bars, only 1 of which is olympic and I hate using smaller bars.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just a coupld of cr*ppy ones before bed.

Not looking bad and now the diet is Bck on track it can only get better :thumbup1:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Good progress mate, need to up my game when I get back 

I've actually decided to train like a bb for a few months:rolleyes:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Looking good Chris. I would do ya!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers guys. There's no love like man love 

I am feeling pretty good about my body, looking forward to starting some cardio when I get back to work as well, really unfit lol


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So on the back of my new photo's I did Delts today and I am well stoked.

*Seated Miltary Press*

15 x bar

5 x 60kg

5 x 80kg

2 x 94kg

2 x 100kg

2 x 5 x 74kg

*Seated Lat raises*

2 x 8 x 18kg

Super strict form, down to chest and then up to full extension on the MP.

Rally happy with the weight. I remember when my delts were weak as feck and I couldn't get past 60kg lol Now look at me.

Defo considering a BW overhead press, that would be 118.5kg. Maybe a bit adventurous and next week was supposed to be de-load but...believe to achieve!!!

Lat raises were super strict as well, even tilted the little fingers down for extra workage.

The only thing I did different this week was a little warmup. Windmilled like a motherfvcker, really worked, no twinges or anything in my RC. Simples


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Cheers guys. There's no love like man love
> 
> * Like that, is it.......*
> 
> I am feeling pretty good about my body, looking forward to starting some cardio when I get back to work as well, really unfit lol


And so you should be... :drool:

Ahem, yeah even I don't mind cardio at the moment - just unable to do the diet thing right now..I'm sure there'll be a point where I want it more than I want the cake but for now, the food is winning... :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Lol, thought it took longer than normal for you to get in for a perv.

Was starting to think I'd done something wrong


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Cheers guys. There's no love like man love
> 
> ...


Glad you're coming round, Chris...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll be sure to look you up next time I need a *cough* training partner Patrick


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Lol, thought it took longer than normal for you to get in for a perv.
> 
> Was starting to think I'd done something wrong


I still have no internet, lol....don't worry I should be back online properly next month, then you'll be in trouble!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I look forward to it


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I'll be sure to look you up next time I need a *cough* training partner Patrick


Whaddaya mean "next time"!?

You need one now to kick you out of all that PL stuff and get bodybuilding - seriously! You could be awesome!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know Patrick, and I keep saying I will do it, but then I keep lifting heavier weights and like it more.

Quick question while you're here Patrick.

500mg test for an 8 week course. How many Vials??


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

looking good big fella


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I know Patrick, and I keep saying I will do it, but then I keep lifting heavier weights and like it more.
> 
> Quick question while you're here Patrick.
> 
> 500mg test for an 8 week course. How many Vials??


Depends on the strength per ml.

PM'd you.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice photos Chris - and to think you don't/didn't think you look that good. Shame on you. You're hot.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

They're terrible photo's to be honest. I think I look better than they give me credit for.

May put another one up later.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You do look better in person... your back looks nice, very wide.

I'm not going to step on Patrick's toes here, but as he said, it depends on the concentration. I'm using test e that is 400mg/ml and it doesn't sting a bit. Happy to chat on PM - I can tell you all about my first course.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Fück me!

That's an order and not a request.

Just seen those pictures and am seriously impressed. Not been this impressed since I woke up


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

M_at said:


> Fück me!
> 
> That's an order and not a request.
> 
> Just seen those pictures and am seriously impressed. Not been this impressed since I woke up


Oi...ladies first.

You can have him when I'm finished......if there's anything left :laugh: :devil2:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Beklet said:


> Oi...ladies first.
> 
> You can have him when I'm finished......if there's anything left :laugh: :devil2:


Why weren't you this proactive when you saw him at the pub?

For the record Bek is so shy and even harder to understand. :beer:

She said she spoke the Queens English, like that was supposed to help. :innocent:

Joe, Bek and Prodiver were hard for me to understand, but loved the accent non the less.

I actually used d4ead as a translator, even though he was obliterated...lol

Chris, you are one top notch bloke and don't you ever change big man! :beer:


----------



## Guest (Sep 19, 2009)

Just saw the recent pics Chris. Your back looks very good mate, I am impressed. :thumbup1: ....and I know Darren loved that hairy chest frontal shot


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

hehe look at all this attention your getting big man, and rightly so.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know, every so often even I have to put up pictures for whoring 

Cheers Zeus, it's getting there.

Wingman, twas an absolute honour to meet you. I will hopefully be in Californ-i-a at some point and I will be looking you up for some good times.

Not gay good times I hope you understand.

Ok, gay good times, but no kissing :whistling:

Wouldn't want people to talk


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I know, every so often even I have to put up pictures for whoring
> 
> Cheers Zeus, it's getting there.
> 
> ...


Too late... :whistling:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Bring your hunk self. What port do you normally come in on?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Normally LA, we have been to San Fran though before.

I'm thinking of coming on a holiday though,

If only I ould find some accomodation :whistling:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Hackskiis wife might still be able to get deals on a Marriot for next to nothing.

If it's a holiday and I am going to the river then you are more than welcome.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So guys, new routine for a while.

I need a break from all the 1rm work and the heavy stuff.

Going to try a bit of that gay BB stuff for a change and some recovery.

Will be a nice change as well.

Need to sort out a routine though, still going to be based around Big lifts, except deads. I am taking a break from them for a while to rest up and try and regain some confidence.

Just figuring out the rest of a routine.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Tom put a good thread in the articles section. Might give it a try myself. Sorry can't link i'm on my phone! Taking refuge in here it seems to be safe for now x x


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Refuge from what? What have I missed?


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

i missed that too, what ya hiding from beks??

good luck with your new routine chris.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Having a week off first. I go back to work on Friday and my gym mebership ran out anyway so it seems sensible.

It's damn hard to sort out a routine. Trying to fiugre out all the stuff that needs to be done.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Are you sure that giving deads a miss is the right thing to do if you're having problems with them?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Politics and bullsh1t.


----------



## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

Got to be honest, I agree with Darren. You shouldn't have time out, you should just get over that damn sticking point you have. Can't remember who said it, but alot of people, including me, seem to have a mental block about 200.

Just man the f*ck up Chris, train however you want as long as you enjoy it, after all isn't that why we all started. But keep deads in, even if they are for reps and slightly lighter.

You can lift whatever you choose, it's your choice, but at the moment you are choosing to be a big girls blouse by hiding away from a lift you can nail :whistling:

Love you really though :beer:


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

hey fats, your only down the road from me mate..

indeed i think you should keep deadlift in mate, just IMO of course.

I cant break the 200 either..


----------



## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

Where are you d4ead?

Oh and i can break 200, just 190 seems easy, as soon as anything above 200 goes on it seems heavy as feck..... :cursing:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

It was Joe who said it.

Rack pulls and SLDL will help. But the strength is there. Either you need someone to load the bar for you and "make a mistake" that you don't notice, or you need someone to shout at you in the gym. Chris, I had the same problem on bench and Joe read me the Riot Act at the Cheese... I stopped posting what I was doing for bench for a few weeks and just pictured myself moving the weight with ease. And it worked.


----------



## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

Thanks Darren, couldn't remember and was too lazy to search...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Maybe, I am going to be high repping anyway though for a while.

May keep deads in at higher reps, not sure yet.

Just fancy a change like you say, to enjoy it.

Permanently being p1ssed off that I can't get over this barrier is not enjoyment, so I will switch it up for a while and see how it goes.


----------



## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

Just have fun Chris, but remember an older, lighter, natty is kicking you're *rse!!! :rockon:


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

fats said:


> Where are you d4ead?
> 
> Oh and i can break 200, just 190 seems easy, as soon as anything above 200 goes on it seems heavy as feck..... :cursing:


guildford

well ive been doing deadlifts for a month now and i still have not broken the 180kg point...

still by xmas  i want the 200


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

There's an unutterable load of bollox being uttered on here!

((Yes, I'm "on".)

All sorts of lifting will challenge you, release endorphins, bring (some) results and give pleasure.

But what do you want to be, Chris: a bodybuilder or a powerflfter?

PL will give you great personal satisfaction and kudos among other PLers.

Bodybuilding could make you awesome in the eyes of everyone who sees you. Do it, if only for a while in your life. You'll never regret it.

But it means a different kind of workout routine - easy to create but not so easy to stick to, as PB's don't feature...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Since our pep talk Patrck in the cheese I've been thinking about it.

I never thought I could stick to a diet but I have since I Joe pointed out some probllems in it :whistling:

I have been noticing some pretty good changes in my body and want to give it a shot for a couple of months, see how I get on.

Sticking to a routine is not a problem, not as much as finding one that works first of all.

There is so much out there!!!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

THE classic routine is the one Dan has adopted. It works because the exercises effectively pre-exhaust complementary muscle groups.

Mon: chest and triceps

Tue: shoulders and traps

Wed: rest

Thu: back and biceps

Fri: legs

Sat: rest

Sun: rest

2 or 3 exercises for bigger muscles, 1 or 2 for smaller.

5 sets for each exercise: 2 effectively warm-ups ~10-15 reps, 3 working sets of 8-12, failing at no less than 8 on the last set - lower the weights as necessary to keep the reps up. All reps strict and slow!

~45 mins in the gym for each session. And don't be tempted to do more sets just coz you can. It's the intesity that counts, not the quantity.

And sleeeeep!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well lol, sleep isn't a problem.

I'll work out a new routine with what you've just reccomended.

another bonus is that I should be burning more calories right?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Well lol, sleep isn't a problem.
> 
> I'll work out a new routine with what you've just reccomended.
> 
> another bonus is that I should be burning more calories right?


Not necessarily: PL burns loads of calories too.

But if you limit your carbs you'll soon trim up and build muscle.

You can use many different exercises to fulfill the routine I gave, but do the same ones for 2 weeks minimum to get the results, then change them to shock your bod into further growth.

Make sure not to avoid certain exercises coz you don't like them - which usually means your form's bad - as then you'll tend to neglect certain muscle groups.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers Patrick. I'll have a look up and post a routine up.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Prodiver said:


> THE classic routine is the one Dan has adopted. It works because the exercises effectively pre-exhaust complementary muscle groups.
> 
> Mon: chest and triceps
> 
> ...


The only part I disagree with is the order.

Mon: chest and triceps

Tue: shoulders and traps

Wed: rest

Thu: back and biceps

Fri: legs

Sat: rest

Sun: rest

In this routine Mon-Tue shoulders get hit twice in a row and triceps indirectly get hit twice in a row. I prefer this and not having a go Patrick by any means you big beast of a man. Your knowledge is second to none by the way. God I learned allot from you at the Cheese.

Mon: chest and triceps

Tue: legs

Wed: rest

Thu: back and biceps

Fri: rest

Sat: shoulders and traps

Sun: rest

Here is a routine that I have been doing for a while now and still love it. Nine Pack (Paul) set this up for me years ago. I have done so many routines it isn't funny.

Now this is a 9 day split so you might have to over lap with exercises that will touch the muscles so you don't have to go 9 days before hitting said body part, for example.

On tricep day dips and close grip bench press will hit some chest so that is covered.

The way this routine is set up the reason I like it is because I am an older guy that needs more rest, I also lift to failure so I need more rest. Just remember if you are getting stronger or adding weight to the bar then you are doing the right thing. Chris I gota say I love ya, not sure where that came from...lol

Day 1) delts & tri's

Day 2) rest

Day 3) quads & calves

Day 4) rest

Day 5) chest & bi's

Day 6) rest

Day 7) back & Hams

Day 8) rest

Day 9) delts & tri's


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Well I like

Mon - chest and bicep

Tue - legs

Wed - rest

Thu - shoulders and tricep

Fri - back

Sat, sun - rest

That's just me, I also found personaly that hiting 8-12 on every set didn't work for me. I make much bigger progress with lower reps. But you allways have to play with these things.


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

winger said:


> Here is a routine that I have been doing for a while now and still love it. Nine Pack (Paul) set this up for me years ago. I have done so many routines it isn't funny.
> 
> Now this is a 9 day split so you might have to over lap with exercises that will touch the muscles so you don't have to go 9 days before hitting said body part, for example.
> 
> ...


A very nice workout winger baby:thumbup1:

And exactly the way I would set it out and the same reasoning:thumb:

Hulk seal of approval


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chest and biceps is not the way to go, as they're not complementary: the triceps are used for chest pressing, so they effectively get pre-exhausted by chest exercises.

Back and biceps are complementary because biceps are used in pull-downs and rowing, and so are effectively pre-exhausted.

You could swap the back and biceps day for the shoulders and traps day. But it shouldn't matter because if you're using your triceps much in shoulder exercises you're doing them wrong.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok, some good stuff there to work with.

Bare in mind that when I go back to work I am very limited in what I have to work with. I'l list it here so that I can see where I stand and maybe get some suggestions.

Flat bench as part of olymipic bar set up.

Olympic bar

Around 250kg plates

Up to 26kg DB's

Squat Rack, Adjustable, can be used for inclines and MP

Lat Pulldown

Press machine

Shoulder press machine

Bicep curl machine

Leg extension

Leg curl

Thats it, but as I say I have been quite imaginative in the past.

The only thing I would struggle with with the above is what to do for Hams and Quads separately.

Can't do SLDL and Deads in a week, or maybe I could use Romanian deadlifts instead.

Squats would be a whole leg workout so which day would they be done on.

Man it's hard making a routine.

I do like the 9 day split, but I also prefer the chest and tri's that Patrick has suggested. I did chest and bi's and back and tri's for a while and it didn't really work out for me. Although I think thats how Ramsay and Weeman do it.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> Can't do SLDL and Deads in a week, or maybe I could use Romanian deadlifts instead.


Or you could do bent over rows, which is my favorite for thickness of the back.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok, so my main lifts are to be

Flat bench

Squats

MP

Rack deads/deads, if the rack can handle them.

I think in addition

Chest: Inclines, Dips, Flye's

Hams: Romanian Deadlift, Leg curl

Quads: Extensions

Delts: Bent over flye's, Lat raises, Front raises

Back: Bent over Rows, Lat pulldowns, wide grip rows.

Traps: BB shrugs

Anything else people can think of with the equipment I have?


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Chest and biceps is not the way to go, *as they're not complementary: the triceps are used for chest pressing, so they effectively get pre-exhausted by chest exercises.*
> 
> Back and biceps are complementary because biceps are used in pull-downs and rowing, and so are effectively pre-exhausted.
> 
> You could swap the back and biceps day for the shoulders and traps day. But it shouldn't matter because if you're using your triceps much in shoulder exercises you're doing them wrong.


Thats Exactly the reason why I do them together..

When I train bodyparts, I dont want them pre exhausted or fatigued from the previous bodypart

I like them fresh so I can give 100%

Also That way enables me to effectively workout muscle twice without 2 dedicated workouts

secondary hit on back day for biceps, Then Biceps Hit primarily after chest etc etc...

I do see your reasoning, and that method is used by a lot of people, But I dont like it and get more from way I posted


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

jw007 said:


> Thats Exactly the reason why I do them together..
> 
> When I train bodyparts, I dont want them pre exhausted or fatigued from the previous bodypart
> 
> ...


If it works for you, Joe, fine, but it never did for me. I suspect that this is because on chest/bi's day your triceps inevitably get some sort of unstructured workout, and then when you work them again on back/tri's day they're at some sort of unkown stage of recovery and in danger of being over-trained.


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

i did chest/tricep, and back/bicep for years (it just seemed logicle) but defo got a boost when i started doing it joes way.

So at the moment im liking it.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So I am getting close to UPPING the dose it seems.


----------



## WRT (May 21, 2009)

d4ead said:


> i did chest/tricep, and back/bicep for years (it just seemed logicle) but defo got a boost when i started doing it joes way.
> 
> So at the moment im liking it.


Ditto, seen more results from doing chest/bi, back/tri but everyone responds differently.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

WRT said:


> Ditto, seen more results from doing chest/bi, back/tri but *everyone responds differently*.


I'm surprised.

See, unless they're an alien, guys respond much the same.

If you got more results your way, you must've been doing something different from me when you did it my way...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

What did he do your way Patrick :whistling:

I have to say I have had far better results from Chest/Tri's and then Back/bi's.

The pre-exhaust seems to work very well for me.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

I'm doing back and biceps right now and i find i have no strength or grip left after back to hold the dumbbells! Prefer chest/biceps but it's nice to change things at times.

Chris, you rock :wub: looking forward to dose uppage x


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> I'm surprised.
> 
> See, unless they're an alien, guys respond much the same.
> 
> If you got more results your way, you must've been doing something different from me when you did it my way...


i think a lot of the time the change itself it was brings new success, not what you change too.

i know people that have made huge gains on all body workouts 5 days a week. i don't gain much doing that.

there's guys that swear by 5x5 and make huge gains, 10x10, pyamiding, it all works, and thats the key everything works.

I like to mix up what i do, others find something they like and stick to it.

either way you cant deny plenty of people get results from doing very different things to what you swear by and what you say shouldn't work.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tend to agree with you there D4ead.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

d4ead said:


> i think a lot of the time the *change itself it was brings new success, not what you change too.*...
> 
> either way you cant deny plenty of people get results from doing very different things to what you swear by and what you say shouldn't work.


I'm sure this is true.

I don't swear by any particular routine or deny differences in results, but if 2 guys are doing the same thing and not responding the same there must be other differences responsible, not the exercise itself.

IYSWIM...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Wow, that was a hell of an abbreviation lol.

I had to think about that one.

So anyway guys, going to be starting 400mg Test and 200mg Tren soon. See how that goes, probably a 10 week cycle but to be extended as I see fit.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Running tren already mate?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thinking about it fella.

I was going to start on 400mg Test only, but I discussed it with a few people, some of those guys on there first cycle ran the 200mg in addition.

I thought about it and decided I would try the same.

I am very open to any suggestions or comments you have though mate as I am still quite a novice in these matters.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Oh no mate, was just wondering about the reason behind the decision pal! I am more novice than you are


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Thinking about it fella.
> 
> I was going to start on 400mg Test only, but I discussed it with a few people, some of those guys on there first cycle ran the 200mg in addition.
> 
> ...


Take both together for the full cycle for best results!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Everything I have read points towards it being a winning combination.

Tren seems to give exceptional strength and size gains.


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> I'm sure this is true.
> 
> I don't swear by any particular routine or deny differences in results, but if 2 guys are doing the same thing and not responding the same there must be other differences responsible, not the exercise itself.
> 
> IYSWIM...


indeed though i think the differences are mostly mental, if 1 person particularly enjoys 1 type of routine, there's no doubt a mental edge over one he dislikes that will probably show up in the results he gets.


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Everything I have read points towards it being a winning combination.
> 
> Tren seems to give exceptional strength and size gains.


my first was 600mg test with 400mg tren worked well enough for me


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

My first was 450mg test, 100mg tren (with some extras) and it was a winner.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Would be lying if I said I wasn't nervous though!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Of course you're nervous. Perfectly natural reaction. I was a bag of nerves beforehand but once I actually got my hands on the gear, I was fine. And remarkably calm going my first jab.

How's the MT2 going?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Jabbing is fine. Can't say it is having the effect I though it would.

Although it's only been 1.5 weeks.

I loaded on 20iu a day for 5 days, then I have done 2 more 10iu jabs.

The injecting is fine, although I am still trying to find that sweet spot.

The first time I did it I felt it going in and a warm flow through my body. Although I have been getting the mild sickness so I think I am doing it right.

I will probably maintain on 2 x 10iu jabs a week.

The nerves are just me wondering if this is the right thing to do.

At the end of the day, it's 1 cycle, towards the end of it I can decide to PCT or cruise.

10 weeks isn't going to kill me at that dose.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

No it certainly won't. It'll be all good. Are you still waiting till Jan or thinking of earlier?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Earlier.

Much earlier :whistling:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Next week? Tomorrow? Tonight?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I figure 2 weeks after getting back to work.

So, maybe 2.5 from now.

Shh, don't tell anyone


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Cool. Nice. Get it in you. How long are you on board for?

Oh and you still owe me £10 as I said you'd be on gear by the end of the year.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Fecking hell, it was a fiver last month!!!

And don't give me inflation bull!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

No it was always a tenner.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

OK, I'll trust you, but only because you're gay.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> OK, I'll trust you, but only because you're gay.


In that case you owe me a tenner too


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No, I am not just giving out tenners to gays.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Not just - are you giving out something else too?

I'll email you a request list.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You're a married man Matthew!!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

jw007 said:


> Thats Exactly the reason why I do them together..
> 
> When I train bodyparts, I dont want them pre exhausted or fatigued from the previous bodypart
> 
> ...


Agreed. Remember Prodiver, this is a 9 day split so you need some over lap.

Thanks Joe, I wanted to post up some long winded post to defend the routine, but didn't want to make Big Prodiver mad. I am just a small fry. :lol:


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

You will love the juice dude..


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Mmm beefcake for christmas? Yum!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You'll get special pics Bek :whistling:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

:bounce: :bounce: wibble


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Wibble indeed.

For I am the king of the potato people 

I'm such a geek,


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

I love geeks. Geeks are cool. It's nerds that are the problem x


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Can I have special pics too?

One of you naked apart from a Santa hat would be a very nice Christmas card.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll see, may blur out the naughty bits though


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

NOT the point, Christopher.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

We'll see, maybe something a little suggestive


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> We'll see, maybe something a little suggestive


Might I suggest a bath with some candles and soft music? Ooopsie wrong thread. :whistling:


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Ahhh love is in the air again...

Chirs can anyone get one your your gay love photos or is it special readers only?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

It's not gay if it's for me . .


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

it depends if there taken before dmcc get there or not


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Or if it was taken by me. There are photos of Chris that I have not published.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

A4post it, B5 black and white book, you can have some as well princess 

If I take them for Bek but then accidently send them by multiple text to a few gay guys that doesn't make me gay, it just makes me careless.

Don't worry Winger, I'll cut you in on it to 

Ok guys, I'm bak off to work, driving to Southampton this very day.

Wish me luck and I'll get on here and update asap.

peace out!!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> If I take them for Bek but then accidently send them by multiple text to a few gay guys that doesn't make me gay, it just makes me careless.
> 
> Don't worry Winger, I'll cut you in on it to


That is funny.....careless becomes priceless.


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

haha classic mate..


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

d4ead said:


> haha classic mate..


It is ok to spam Chris's journal right?

I think Chris can take his journal to the next level and actually beat JW's journal (who) and all he has to do is post up pics of him on all the ports/beaches with some nice tight pants...lol

Darren paid me to say that. :beer: Matt wanted to pay me but just repped me instead. Being the rep whore that I am I obliged. :innocent:


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Chris is a man of the world he knows the score..


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well guys, I'm here back at work, already heading out into the Atlantic.

Nice to be back actually, need to adapt a bit more and unpack properly.

Good nights sleep wouldn't go a miss either. Hardly slept a wink in the hotel last night.

Went to boots today to see if they had any barrels and pins and the woman asked me if I wanted to see a doctor about my drug problem. Couldn't believe the cheek of her.

Didn't get any anyway as they don't stick them, but I was in town and thought I would ask.

Waiting for sandwich's, mmmmmm, haven't really eaten in a day. Starving.

Ready to hit the gym tomorrow, chest and tri's. Will be using the BB routine, well excited for it.

Going to kick off with flat bench and then incline, the rest I will just play by ear and see how I get on!


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Cheeky cow indeed! Needle exchange would have been a good bet no idea where you'd get them from tho . . . Tight pants and your cap please lol


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, I'm at a bit of a loss as well!!!

I'm not sure I own any tight pants, would naked be ok instead?


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> Yeah, I'm at a bit of a loss as well!!!
> 
> I'm not sure I own any tight pants, would naked be ok instead?


I can't speak for Bek but I would look, just for comparison reasons is all.


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Would you suk just for comparason reasons too wingman?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Fooking cheeky cow. I hope you told her that too.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So, back in the gym today, new routine.

Well, I say new routine, it's not really, I just used the same one and re-arranged the sets for now.

Also got myself a new training partner, he's brand new to the gym so teaching him really fired me up and made me push on.

Definately liking this high rep stuff, the pump was amazing, felt sooooooo good, came out of there really back in love with the gym, hoping for serious DOMS tomorrow.

Starting tennis tomorrow and boxing for cardio, I can't run on a treadmill like some people, bores the sh1t out of me so this seems like a god alternative, also the sun is shining so tops of tennis and max MT2 assisted tannage is the order of the day tomorrow!!!

*Flat Bench*

Warm up:

15 x bar

8 x 60kg

Working sets

8 x 100kg

2 x 8 x 120kg 2 assisted on last set

8 x 110kg

Was more to find out what I could manage after all the srm stuff. 115kg I think is the sweet spot for next week

*Incline Bench*

3 x 8 x 80kg

*Dips*

2 x 8 x bw

12 x bw

*Rope pulldowns*

3 x 8 x 35kg

*Tri Pushdowns*

3 sets of 30kg with varying width grips from narrow to wide. Rapid. Mainly for the pump to finish off.

So a bit of messing around trying to find my weight that I should be using on the main compound, was shagged by the end of that. 115kg will be good for next week. Have to keep your ego in check, expecially when I had done a 155kg for 1 last time. All reps were slow and controlled, trying to develop that mind - muscle connection.

However towards the end of the sets of bench it was my arms that were tiring, just not used to high repping I think.

Practice is the key. Also nice to go to failure for a change. I have a feeling I will be crippled tomorrow. :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just to add, I would really relish any constructive criticism here as I am pretty new to the BB side so am likely to be making mistakes.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Higher reps - try for the higher end of 8 - 12. 8 reps is generally seen as the mid point between strength and size.

Now take you're impressive benching away before I get too jealous


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

There's to many varying opinions mate to be too criticle. Just do what feels right to you.

Just push 100% and results will come.

Good luck mate


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Naked will be fine . . . :lol:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Yes, I concur.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

What the last two said.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

When I've confirmed that I am in a position to UP said dose I shall be putting before pics up for sure.

I have to say, I am feeling fecking awesome at the moment. The Doms today have been crippling but SSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO good. Tan is coming along nicely.

Been very bloated today but I would put that down to ship food and the fact that there are very few nutrients in the green veg, I am starting the digestive enzymes again so hopefully that will brak things down more.

I think I am looking the mutts nuts though, which is very unusual for me, the only thing I have changed is the MT2, but as far as I know that doesn't have any sort of psychological effect???


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

It makes you look better, therefore you feel better.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I guess so. It isn't having as rapid an effect as I thought though.

]I mean, it is working, but I just imagined it being quicker.

Although in fairness, I have only had 4 sinbed sessions and 1.5 hours in the sun since starting lol.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

An sinbed session? And you didn't invite me? Just as long as you were saying my name and thinking of me. :wub:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Jesus, Im typing like a child these days!!!

Always darling xxx :wub:

Oooo, legs tomorrow, some high rep squats and other shinanigans.

Hope the DOMS are half as good as the chest and Tri ones I have at the moment!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So, just through Gibraltar, nice. Sun is beaming.

Legs today, will make it up as I go along.

Measured arms yesterday, 17 inch's give or take. Chest is weighing in at 51 inch's.

May explain why my arms always look so pumy from the sides against my chest.

More bicep curls needed me thinks!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Want big arms? Work your triceps (too).


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I do work my triceps. Harder than my biceps as it happens.

I need to up my bicep work to be honest, especially as I'm doing all this BB stuff now.

*Squats*

15 x bar

12 x 60kg

4 x 12 x 120kg

*Leg extensions*

3 x 12 x 97.5kg

Should have gone heavier on the Squats but my right knee was in crippling pain, and my hips also. This seems to be a recurring problem on squats. I got round it by staying above parralel, which is perfectly acceptable now I think as its not for PL.

Seemed to get around the problem.

Shall be upping fish oils to 20g now to see if that helps. Really struggled to finish the leg extensions, so thats good.

Looking forward to crippling myself with Delts in a couple of days


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

What's with the knee? Have you done something to it? Anti-inflammatories, dear boy, and lots of ice.

Good squattage though.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

To be honest Darren, I would say not good squattage. I think I could go for 140kg if it is going to be above parallel.

Dodgy knees runs in the family, I aggravated mine with the stupid technogym leg curl machine, which I have to say is the most unatural moving piece of kit in the world.

Sometimes it just flares up.

My hips are the thing that worries me the most. Will start warming up on the bike on leg days I thinks. What would you use as anti-inflams Darren?

I can't use Ibroprofen for my kidneys. Well, not supposed to and would prefer not to.

Is there a more natural substitute? Or just carry on with the Fish oils?


----------



## Guest (Sep 29, 2009)

Havent stop in for awhile, so just a drive-by to say hello Chris. Nice squating 4x12 at 120 isnt bad at all. Keep up the good work mate:thumbup1:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Keep with the oils and order some 6-methyluracil from Bulkpowders, maybe some cissus too. Can you use aspirin? It's also an NSAID. Or what about ibuprofen gel? Failing those, ice packs. 10 mins on, 10 off, 10 on then wait at least 30 before doing it again.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers Zeus. Like a long lost friend these days 

Hope you're well!


----------



## Guest (Sep 29, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> Cheers Zeus. Like a long lost friend these days
> 
> Hope you're well!


Awe man... That made me feel bad Never a lost friend Chris. Not online quite as much of late. But I keep my eye on your journal when it pops up:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cissus does seem to get very good mentions on here. I shall have a look.

I need to order more Omega from Zipvit so sure I will be able to just throw some cissus in there and maybe I will be able to find some of that other stuff you mentioned.

I prefer to stay away from all pain killers mate. Slight personal preference and also I really don't like to mess with my one good kidney.

Although I am perfectly happy to strain my liver lol


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, i know that feeling Zeus. It's hard to keep up with everything when you haven't been on for a while.

Brief synopsis of all the tosh in here is that I have decided to become a BB now and use various "enhancing" things to help me.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Zipvit doesn't do cissus, though MP does and I think so does Bulkpowders. I've never seen 6MU anywhere other than Bulkpowders though.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

OK, I'll have a look and see.

Suppose it doesn't really matter where I get it from although MP would be prefferable as I need some protein as well.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Smashed Delts today.

In agony now, feels great.

It is messing with my head the perceived loss of strength from high repping.

Got to leave the ego behind and carry on lifting as I am though for maximum results.

I have even surprised myself with how strict I have kept my form.

I haven't done any cheat repping and all reps have been slow and controlled.

*Military Press*

4 x 8 x 60kg Bloody hard, a bit dissapointing seeing as I can get 90 for 2, but hey ho, felt good.

*Side raises*

3 x 8 x 18kg

*Front raises*

8 x 16kg

2 x 8 x 12kg Could barely move after this, dropped the weight to save the form.

My delts were so sore afterwards that it was actually painful to lie down. A really good pain though. Not the normal agony in the joints and RC that I normally get.

I am going to be a seriously sore boy tomorrow.

I have started taking 10g of fish oils in the morning in addition to the 10g at night and I am already starting to feel better. Need to up the water as well.

One day I'll remember!!! :thumb:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Thinking about it fella.
> 
> I was going to start on 400mg Test only, but I discussed it with a few people, some of those guys on there first cycle ran the 200mg in addition.
> 
> ...


My 2p worth

Having done a test only and a test/tren/orals cycle, I noticed some differences, It maybe

my agebut who knows.

On test only, my first cycle, I felt extremely euphoric after about 4 or 5 weeks, the

strength gains were good and my sex drive went through the roof, although

I also noticed it took a long time to get there, if you know what I meannot

a bad thing I might add:thumb:

I'd expected better gains but in hind sight I was probably carrying too much lard

and should of dieted more before starting, although dieting does get very much

harder the older you get (slower metabolism I believe)

I also believe because I had trained for so long as a natty that it is only natural

that my muscles would be more developed than someone who jumped on after

a year or two, hence, the gains are smaller. Thats all my opinion btw. Perhaps

if I'd jumped on 20 years ago I'd be a 20 stoner instead of 15/16

The reason I never kick started with DBol or mixed with Tren, was I wanted to

see how I reacted to AAS, if I hit problems I would know that they weren't for me.

I did PCT and that was the worst bit but in fairness it wasn't for that long that

I felt sh1t.

2nd cycle was orals, (which didn't agree with me imo) 600mg Test, and 200mg Tren.

Strength gains were more significant but sex drive was imo surpressed somewhat

by Tren.

Not amazingly so, but enough that I noticed I didn't want to sh4g the Mrs all day

every day Now this must be true imo, as when I stopped the Tren the sex

drive went through the roof even more so than the first time (and still is:thumbup1

I would say I've made much better gains on the mix but would also say "whats

the rush"

Your a lot younger than me and I think that your more of an intermdiate BB with

imo, massive potential to go a long way, but you have to get the basics correct

diet (including water intake), training, rest and the mental side as well.

You also say you can't take Ibuprofen because of your kidney's:confused1:That worried me!!

I would also recommend a full blood analysis as a baseline before you take anything

This imo is a MUST

I found it fascinating to compare the results of my bloods before and after.

Now if I'm to be totally honest I'm really only playing Devils Advocate here, I'm

not very experienced with AAS and know people on here that are infinitely more so.

Its just a post to make you think about things a bit more, its all very well joking

about and talking "gay":lol: but AAS are serious stuff, and only you should make

the decisions about what you are going to do.

Right, enough of the serious mode

Lets all get naked:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice post Tel, I was talking about the naked part. :whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers Tel, very informative there.

Well, I have been on an oral only cycle of AAS for a few month now actually. The MST. All be it a modest form, that was my tester if you like.

I had my bloods done a while ago, but I don't have the results with me unfortunately.

My kidney is not a disease or anything, it is something I was born with that has become a problem. Unfortunately it is part of my physical make up and was left to long by the doctors un-noticed so now they can't fix it.

It is not something that will bother me with AAS as I have one kidney which is functioning perfectly. I only stop the Ibuprofen and such like as a course of habit mainly. When I was younger and didn't fully understand what the problem was with my kidney I just stopped doing everything that could be harmful to kidneys. I didn't drink till I was 24!

Now after becoming more educated I realise that taking ibuprofen probably wouldn't cause me any problems, and indeed hasn't, just that thought is always there.

I understand it is serious business and I have toiled many a night over it. I was so against steroids for years and years and now I find myself taking the plunge. I have researched and I have some very experienced people onboard to help, and some new people also, which in my opinion can be more useful as they are experiencing it now, new.

I am in no rush Tel, I had people reccomending me a 1g test cycle for my first one lol.

I was going to run just the 400mg test, but after talking to some people I decided that taking into consideration my size, 400mg of test probably wouldn't do much for me, at least in the sense of maximising gains. Therefore I decided to add in the 200mg Tren.

I have decided to do it now so that I am at home when I finish the cycle so that if I decide to run PCT I will be away from work, which will hopefully make it easier.

I'm really glad you took the time to write that Tel, nice to have people looking out for me :thumb:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

:wub: :wub:

Fatty Natty fly-by


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Love ya to babe :wub:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So decided now, after my hangover cleared lol, that I will pick a competition next year and use it as an aim to get myself into shape.

I lack motivation and guidance. I won't be competeing, mainly as I don't see myself getting anywhere near the condition and size of these guys.

It came about as I was talking to Zara and i said I could never diet like the people competing do, and she said you would if you had a competition to go into, it gives you the drive. So I figure if I pick one I have a goal then!!

I was thinking classic class, as I don't have the urge at the moment to come in as a super heavy lol, I'm not ready for that kind of lifestyle yet, and the things you have to put into your body and do to yourself yet.

The one problem I have found though, is it is very hard to find any indication of the gear that the people doing the varying types of shows use. I know it is very personal to the individual, but it can be quite frustrating to a relative noob who is trying to get an idea of whats involved.

I guess it is way to dependant on individuals and how they react to certain things, certainly to give any definitave indication as to what I would require. Just it would be nice to have an idea!

'So any comments or suggestions would be highly appreciative guys!!!

Also if anyone knows how you work out the way to compete in the classic classes so i can get an idea of weight? I'm 6ft 3 and 18.5 stone at the moment.

Cheers guys!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Bump for a contest prep guy that wants to work for free...he he

Chris, I would stick to injectibles and run gear that doesn't raise blood pressure, only saying because of your kidneys.

If you hold water it puts a strain on your kidneys.

For example, dbol will help you to hold water, holding water raised blood pressure, raising blood pressure is hard on the kidneys.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok Winger, thanks alot for that. I was only planning on carrying on with the orals for maybe 2 weeks until the injectables kick in. Just to avoid that period of time where nothing is working, try to avoid any kind of "dead zone" as another member put it.

Do you have any tricks for helping cut back on water retention?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Ok Winger, thanks alot for that. I was only planning on carrying on with the orals for maybe 2 weeks until the injectables kick in. Just to avoid that period of time where nothing is working, try to avoid any kind of "dead zone" as another member put it.
> 
> *Do you have any tricks for helping cut back on water retention?*


Drink at least 5 litres pday of water, don't drink alcohol or sugary drinks, avoid salty foods,

avoid saturated fats.

All these things work for me and I've never looked like the Michelin Man:thumbup1:

6-3 18.5 Stone, you are a large fooker aren't you


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I feel large Tel, but I would prefer to be leaner. GUess we all would.

51 inch chest to go with it, but it looks like crap.

I've just ordered 48litres of water. Will get more, not like its expensive on here 20p a bottle.

When you calculate your fluid intake do you allow for the likes of tea or juice if you have it? I drink lots of Green tea, would this count?

I have cut the alcohol right back now. I had a blow out in Istanbul as we are in overnight, but other than that I am barely drinking at all these days.

Not a massive fan of saturated fats either, but I will research further into what is and isn't, you never know what is heiding in foods these days!!

I am hoping the Tren will help with leaning out as well.

How did you find it worked for you in that aspect Tel?


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

i never touch plain water at all, while its obviously best to drink water the fact i dont often get too bloated or die must indicate you can count your green tea or juice for some part of it mate.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I really struggle with "just" water, not sure why.

If I drink 2 litres of water I feel sick, bloated and funnily my mouth goes dry. If I mix it with a bit of Ribena I can quite happily chug the lot.

I would say it is better to sacrifice the little bit of sugar you get in the Ribena for the benefits of getting the full 5 litres in? Although Tel is advising staying clear of sugary drinks? Would you say this would be ok in this circumstance?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I feel large Tel, but I would prefer to be leaner. GUess we all would.
> 
> 51 inch chest to go with it, but it looks like crap.
> 
> ...


I did a lot of research mate as the one look I simply can't stand is the bloated

look, so popular with newbies

I also took/take Aromasin at 12.5mg pd, sure this helps as well. I've actually

changed to Adex in the last fortnight and can't notice any difference.

The T3/Clen mix is very good for stripping the fat off, or it is when you take

the correct dose and not a quater of what you should as I did:lol:

Do you still struggle getting the food down? at 18.5 stone you should be eating

a third world countries amount per day, I reckon at least 5000+ cals, jmo if you

want to get the best of the AAS. I still don't think I ate enough at 15 stone on 4200 cals


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Men's Classic Bodybuilding Tall Over 180cm

Up to and including 190cm

Height (cm) - 100cm + 8kg = ______ kg Max you can weigh for class

*Up to and including 198cm*

*
Height (cm) - 100cm + 9kg = _______ kg Max you can weigh for class*

Over 198cm

Height (cm) - 100cm + 10kg = ______ kg Max you can weigh for class

Just dug that out of some website for the qualifictaion standards for a classic class.

I just qualify for the above 190cm, I am 190.5cm. This means basically that I could come in at 99.5kg.

Basically at the moment I am 118.5, so that would basically involve chopping of at least one major limb in order to qualify!!! I would look ridiculous at that weight. That is 219.36lbs or 15.7 stone.

Better make that all major limbs and a nut. Although that will probably disapear on its own!


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

118.5? Didn't realise you were so big mate


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> I did a lot of research mate as the one look I simply can't stand is the bloated
> 
> look, so popular with newbies
> 
> ...


I do still struggle quite alot with the eating Tel. I still struggle to grasp the eating little and often. 5000+ calories frankly scares the sh1t out of me. Although I am aware that it is necessary. I am trying to get a routine sorted now. I will be making at least 2 of the meals in the day shakes. It is just easier that way for me. I am aware that solid food is better, but at the end of the day, getting the protein into you is more important than where it comes from, and I am more likely to get it from shakes when I am on watch!

I do need to detail out my diet more and will do in course. I still have over a week (if I get the pims) so I have time.

Still more research beeded as well, I am reading like a mofo every night now. To be honest though, I have always struggled with reading and learning, I have always been a do-er. Althogh obviously some assemblance of knowledge is needed.

Last night I ccalmed my nerves and studied injection techniques, which I am now happy about.

I'm not sure I found the Clen/T3 all that good TBH, although if I am honest, I am carrying alot of fat, maybe slipped back up to 20+%m so any change it had would not be immediately noticeable anyway.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

pastanchicken said:


> 118.5? Didn't realise you were so big mate


Yeah mate, but I am honest in the fact that I am carrying alot of BF, maybe back up to 20+%.

I WILL be starticardio now. More for fitness than anything.

Although unfortunately that means more calories need to go in and I struggle with that as it is.

i was talking to Sean (tainted soul) in London and my diet is terrible in the fact that I eat hardly anything, I just seem to be massively mesomorphic. I gain size and muscle relatively easily, but losing it is a b1tch!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just in addition I forgot to mention that I will have on standby in case of Gyno 100 x 1 mg Arimidex tabs.

Does anyone have a preference between these and say Nolva? I have read that Arimidex is a superior quality product.


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Yeah mate, but I am honest in the fact that I am carrying alot of BF, maybe back up to 20+%.
> 
> I WILL be starticardio now. More for fitness than anything.
> 
> ...


Sounds just like me to be honest mate


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

What size are you sitting at? What height are you?

Back and bi's today. Going to try some rack pulls. Will try 200kg +, try and isolate the back.

Rack is only rated 150kg lol, should be ok as long as I'm not [email protected] the bar around.


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

I'm just over 5' 11", last weigh in was about 92kg, though will check that again later.

Bodyfat far too high!!


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Morning Chris - well, you discovered what I did in the regs for the Classic class! You're just going to have to be content to be a real monster bodybuilder! :laugh:

Don't listen to all the stuff about how many calories you must eat. Sure you need to eat plenty, but the actual numbers are irrelevant as your daily life, workout intensity and even the ambient temperature and sea state (trying to stand still!) vary significantly!

Eat sufficient protein to grow: 2 gms/kg actual bodyweight/day will give you a good margin. (Unused protein is turned to carbs.) Eat loads of meat, whole eggs, fish, cheese, milk, and top up with shakes.

Then don't worry about eating good fats. Some will be in your protein foods, but also eat real butter, salad dressings and mayo, peanut butter.

Then eat only just enough carbs for energy to power your daily life and intense workouts. This will train your bod to use its fat stores first and most efficiently. It's your carb intake that determines your fat storage.

Get your carbs first from salads, vegetables and fruit, and then from potatoes, rice, wholemeal bread and pasta. The quick carbs will provide energy when you need it but be metabolized fast and direct your bod back to its fat reserves.

Before working out eat protein and a little carbs for energy, and the same after working out for the insulin spike to drive the nutrients into your system. The carbs can be anything fast like fruit or a mars bar. The after-workout protein and carbs can be a main meal.

You do not need to eat little and often. 3 main meals a day will work fine, You can have your top-up shakes between meals.

Eat a protein, fat and carbs meal before bed, like a tuna or chicken wholemeal sandwich or a shake and some fruit, to stay anabolic. Then don't eat breakfast when you get up, but a couple of hours later when you've done some work and your bod has tapped its fat reserves.

If you lack power and are generally tired, up your cabs a little bit by bit until you have ample energy; if you are not losing flab or are getting porkier, back the carbs off. Once you get the balance right it only takes a day or so to see the difference in the mirror.

Using this approach you have to caculate nothing except your rising protein intake as you gain lean mass, but you will be able to lose flab at the same time, yet can eat almost anything.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Lets start with the workout first.

Man I can't remember when I last had a back workout like this. My back, biceps and especially forearms are pumped to hell. I feel awesome.

Tried rack deads but had to knock them on the head. The rack only goes to just above knee level and I tried doing it on a reebok step but it was no good. Nevermind.

Hopefully when I stop the caps my lower back will not be as sore. I always had problems with it before, but I feel these may have added to the problem, not that they are known for it though.

*Rack deads*

Done without the bar touching the floor or rack

8 x 60kg

8 x 140kg

3 x 180kg

8 x 100kg Stopped there, just not working.

*Bent over rows*

4 x 12 x 90kg

*BB shrugs*

2 x 12 x 100kg

10 x 100kg followed by 10 x 100kg super fast

*Lat pulldowns*

3 x 12 x 75kg

*Wide grip rows*

3 x 12 x 70kg

*Bicep curl machine*

3 x 12 x 40kg

*Alternate DB Hammer curls*

3 x 8 x 20kg

Now, looking at that the weights aren't hugely impressive, but they were all very slow and extremely strict, with maybe the exception of the wide grip rows.

My forearms were gone by the end of the bent over rows. I had to strap myself into everything, still was in agony.

I could bend my arms at all after, even in the shower.

The whole thing just proves that it's not how much you lift, it's how you lift it. I am lifting less than ever but with stricter form and I am feeling so much better.

Still thinking up some numbers as goals in a little mini comp with Shaun, trying to think of something achievable, but i have no idea how my body will react so we'll see.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

pastanchicken said:


> I'm just over 5' 11", last weigh in was about 92kg, though will check that again later.
> 
> Bodyfat far too high!!


That's a good size mate. If that is you in your avi then I could only hope to be as lean as you.

I will be taking more pics tonight. Was going to now but I am way to stuffed after lunch!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> Morning Chris - well, you discovered what I did in the regs for the Classic class! You're just going to have to be content to be a real monster bodybuilder! :laugh:
> 
> Don't listen to all the stuff about how many calories you must eat. Sure you need to eat plenty, but the actual numbers are irrelevant as your daily life, workout intensity and even the ambient temperature and sea state (trying to stand still!) vary significantly!
> 
> ...


This seems a bit easier to follow given my lifestyle.

Can i sub mayonaise with salad cream?? mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Weighed myself in the gym today, 19stone. Not sure how accurate that is, but if it is then I can definately kiss the classic class goodbye.

You've met me Patrick, would you say my frame would be too large for classic anyway?

In an honest opinion (which I know you will all give) could I be competative in my weight class? What weight class would that be for a start? I am imagining it would be in with the big boys and seeing as my confidence is not that high to begin with I would say I don't stand much of a chance lol.

I have taken on board what you have said about the food stuffs. I will plan around that, although I have not been watching to much at the moment. Just staying away from fast food and junk food. In fact, apart from 1 burger I have been very healthy, and feel all the better for it!!

I will work out calories anyway, just for interest more than anything and comparing what has changed.


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> That's a good size mate. If that is you in your avi then I could only hope to be as lean as you.
> 
> I will be taking more pics tonight. Was going to now but I am way to stuffed after lunch!


lol, I assure you that is me in the avi. I don't normally look as lean as that, think I got lucky with that shot!

Bring on the pics! :thumbup1:


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I really struggle with "just" water, not sure why.
> 
> If I drink 2 litres of water I feel sick, bloated and funnily my mouth goes dry. If I mix it with a bit of Ribena I can quite happily chug the lot.
> 
> I would say it is better to sacrifice the little bit of sugar you get in the Ribena for the benefits of getting the full 5 litres in? Although Tel is advising staying clear of sugary drinks? Would you say this would be ok in this circumstance?


Yes - any fluid that is mostly water counts to your daily water intake. If your pi$$ is pale straw colour you're drinking enough: darker means you need more water; colourless and pi$$ing all the time means you're drinking excess.

Alcohol is high in carbs and will make you fat!

Sip plain carbonated water by preference - it'll hydrate you and give you a healthy appetite! :thumb:


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> This seems a bit easier to follow given my lifestyle.
> 
> Can i sub mayonaise with salad cream?? mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
> 
> ...


Salad cream is fine! It's controlling your carb intake that's important.

I didn't really think you'd make the Classic class! But if you're truly serious about bodybuilding, in a year you could be huge and awesome, and gain some good experience comparing yourself against competitors in the heavier classes whethter or not you choose to compete. You'd have to see what weight you come in at once you'd cut, but I doubt you'll ever come in under 100 kg! So what? Get HUGE and enjoy it!

Count calories if you like - but they won't be accurate enough to be meaningful!


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

If memory serves dandilion and vitamin c help with water retension.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

To be honest Patrick, I am not a massive fan of over complicating things. Your way seems very simple and easy to manage, especially given my varied work and lifestyle.

Thanks for the positive feedback. I very much doubt I will ever be sub 100kg again either Patrick. I was once before and I hated it.

I do need to generally work on my fitness though.

Unfortunately I can't drink just plain carbonated water, not sure, just hate the taste. I may get a bottle and see how it goes done with a little Ribena maybe. I really think that any negative effects Ribena has will be outweighed hugely by the fact that I am more likely to drink the required amount of water.

Glad you mentioned the urine, mine is dark, and I mean seriously dark, at the moment. I shall be upping water asap. I was wondering if it was a problem. I have 24 2 litre bottles now to work through and I will be ordering another 24 on thurs.

Sometimes a ship is good  24p a bottle is an excellent deal!!


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

How dark is your urine?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

winger said:


> If memory serves dandilion and vitamin c help with water retension.


Good to know Wingman :thumbs:

I may wait and see how I get on the first few weeks and the address any problems that I have one here. I may be fine with water and gyno, but lets wait and see.

I just want to get it in me!!!!!! 

Still a little worried re, injection and techniques. I had a look and am happy with everything apart from maybe aspirating. At the moment I am up to.

Wash hands thoroughly, use alcohol hand santizer

Attach green pin to barrel, slowly push into phial and draw back 1ml test, then into next phial 1ml of Tren.

Place cap back on needle.

Swab area carefully in thigh where injection is to be placed. Approximately one hand down from hip.

Change pins, putting blue pin on.

Slowly push needle in to break the skin, then continue down, leaving a little of the pin showing incase it breaks off and you need to remove.

Pull back a little on the syringe to check no blood comes through.

Push slowly and steadily down on the plunger till it is empty.

Slowly and carefully remove the needle and then swab the area again, then massage for 1 minute to help distribute the solution.

Walk like a 3 legged dog for rest of day blaming everything on a bad squat session.

Apologies if I have over simplified that, it's just how my brain works.

Any comments would be appreciated! :rockon:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

winger said:


> How dark is your urine?


Well, I can still see through it. It's just more orangey than yellowy. A bit more of a potent smell as well. By my own admission though my water intake has been shocking recently.

I just (as ridiculous as it sounds) forget to drink water. I am a complete idiot for it I know.


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

That's what I do and I'm still alive.

I agree a lot with Patrick. Frankly, you'd look emaciated under 100kg; at the moment I out-weigh you by only 1kg! Maybe less... (though you look hotter IMO) But don't complicate things, eat lots of protein and get fúcking big.

Then can I have your gay man-babies?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Of course you can sweetie. They would be particularly large and hairy man babies 

It makes me wonder how tall guys can compete in classic class though without looking emaciated. Seems like it is very set up towards the smaller guys and yet I was under the impression that it existed to promote the more classic "arnold era" style of body?

Maybe I mis-read that?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

pastanchicken said:


> lol, I assure you that is me in the avi. I don't normally look as lean as that, *think I got lucky with that shot!*
> 
> Bring on the pics! :thumbup1:


They all count buddy.

I am a massive believer that I look a hundred times better in the flesh than in pictures. I just can never get the right shot as an accurate representation of how I look.

Alot of people on here I think were surprised when they first met me as I appear a lot bigger in the flesh. Which can only be a good thing


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Not trying to scare you by any means.

You have one kidney. If blood pressure is high it puts a strain on the kidneys and can darken the urine from blood being in the urine. Get it checked. That happened to Hackskii.

Ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

i will get a blood-pressure-o-meter ordered as well.

Not to keen on the doctors onboard checking, they ask too many questions.

So say it is high, how could we go about lowering it??

Would exercise be a start?


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> It makes me wonder how tall guys can compete in classic class though without looking emaciated. Seems like it is very set up towards the smaller guys and yet I was under the impression that it existed to promote the more classic "arnold era" style of body?
> 
> Maybe I mis-read that?


I think more the Steve Reeves era sometimes.

From what I've seen, a lot of Classic guys are shorter. Jamie (Magic Torch) is around the 6ft mark and that's tall for a Classic IMO. It's also a very competitive class - at the UKBFF Portsmouth, it was the single largest class, 15 competitors.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah. Not a bad bloke to look like TBH, but I just don't think my frame was designed for it.

So, heavyweight it is


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dc55 said:


> You forgot swab top if vial!
> 
> ;-)


Good point stranger. I'll remember tat.


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> To be honest Patrick, I am not a massive fan of over complicating things. Your way seems very simple and easy to manage, especially given my varied work and lifestyle.
> 
> Thanks for the positive feedback. I very much doubt I will ever be sub 100kg again either Patrick. I was once before and I hated it.
> 
> ...


Squeeze a lemon, or add a few drops of bottled lemon juice, into plain or carbonated water to make it (even more) delicious!


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> ...Still a little worried re, injection and techniques....


Maybe you've found this but - sit or stand and tense your quad(s). You can then see and feel where the quad is fullest. From the centre of this area you have 2-3 inches north and south, and 1-2 inches east and west in which to inject.

Prepare your syringe using the sterile technique I posted in the sticky on jabbing.

When you're ready to inject sit on a dining chair and move your lower leg until the quad is full but relaxed.

Use ordinary Listerine on a tissue - twice - to swab the area clean and let it just dry.

Push the needle into your chosen site deliberately with your pen hand - don't jab. Only the first mm or so will pr**k. Go in fairly upright, but a small angle won't matter - especially to avoid aiming for the bone. Go in 1 inch (leaving about 6 mm of a 1-1/4 needle out).

If you feel an electric nerve pain, pull out. press on the wound, and try again elsewhere. If you feel a dull ache, you may have touched a blood vessel - but don't worry - leave the needle in for now.

Let go of the syringe and let the needle find its own angle - it'll do no harm. Change hands to hold the needle top firm, pull back a ml on the plunger for a few seconds. If you see a few bubbles don't worry. If there's no blood in the needle top, inject smoothly over several seconds - don't rush. Withdraw the needle smartly, press on the wound for a few seconds, then massage well for a minute or two.

If you get blood on pulling back, withdraw the needle, press on the wound, hold the syringe needle down, expel just the blood and try again elsewhere.

Take your time - it's really easy and safe this way and hardly hurts!


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Prodiver said:


> Maybe you've found this but - sit or stand and tense your quad(s). You can then see and feel where the quad is fullest. From the centre of this area you have 2-3 inches north and south, and 1-2 inches east and west in which to inject.
> 
> Prepare your syringe using the sterile technique I posted in the sticky on jabbing.
> 
> ...


Nice post!

When I was at the Cheese, I really liked Prodiver, he is just a wealth of info.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

He certainly has an amazing database of knowledge. Comes from living the life for a long time. Experience means everything.

Knowing my luck I'll pin a nerve and a blood vessel straight onto the bone lol.

Would I be right in saying that the more muscle you put on the less chance you have of hitting the bone?

Bump for anyone with information with regards lowering blood pressure!

I'm off ot have a look now myself as well,


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I'd be very surprised if you hit the bone when pinning quads. It's a 1.25-inch needle, your quad is thicker than that. I've gone through (but not into) veins in my time and only noticed when there was some blood on withdrawing the pin.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, it'll be fine.

Worried about nothing at the moment as I still haven't got the pims yet!!!


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I was a bit worried before the first one, but when it came to actually doing it, I was rather cool and calm about it.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Dudes!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Chest and Tri's today.

Tried stupid bench challenge for Dave, I suck a55. Strength was no-where to be found and I tried a Pre-workout shake that just made me want to hurl everywhere!!!

*Flat bench*

15 x bar

8 x 60kg

8 x 120kg ([email protected])

2 x 8 x 115kg

6 x 115kg

2 x 110kg

3 x 100kg

Death........

.....only joking 

*Incline bench*

3 x 8 x 80kg

*CGBP*

3 x 8 x 90kg

*Rope pulldowns*

12 x 35kg

10 x 35kg

8 x 30kg

*Skull crusher*

8 x 40kg

*Tri pushdowns*

3 x 12 x 50kg

It was a very weird workout today. The flat bench and incline went as plaqbbed, although I forgot all about 12 reps lol. Couldn't have if I'd wanted to though.

Then it went a bit mad, forgot about dips again. Did massive amounts with my Triceps, but have to say in general, have never felt so destroyed coming out of a gym in my life.

This new routine is crippling me, and I love it. My body is responding massively as well.

My chest is still 51inch but by arms are up to 17.5inch. I am guessing that is maybe the pump, but still, thats an inch I think in very little time.

Need to get the whole thing a bit more regimented though. Get a set routine of exercises worked out.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Health wise update.

Drank probably 3 litres of water (2 bottles), I am hoping that over the course of the day I should make up another couple of litres with maybe water in the gym, Green tea and the odd coke with my PWO lunch. I feel alot better for it and slept like a baby last night.

My urine is back to a normal colour as well. Maybe it was just dehydration, which to be honest i think is the route case of most of my health issues.

The only problems I have at the moment are, I still have loads of small spots on my upper arms. This is nothing to do with AAS, these were here before. Maybe hydration also.

My liver is starting to hurt again. I have had one big night on the p1ss, and a maybe 2 nights where I have had 2 0r 3 drinks and it is tingling again. Maybe now I have upped the water it may ease off, although I have to say I can't wait to stop the orals and get on the injectabels, which should further help out,

Another bonus of this is that maybe then I can get rid of these back pumps and do some high rep deads. It is agony sometimes.

Exercise may be starting tomorrow, I keep putting of cardio and I really can't afford to. Especially if I want lean gains.

Still a little worried about BP now, although there is no real reason to be, only that it was raised as a potential cause of one issue. I have ordered a BP meter and some magnesium stuff D4ead PM'd me about. Just in case.


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## mumzi (Oct 7, 2009)

Hey guys im new here, can any one tell me how to post !


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

:confused1:


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice benching Mr.


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Can I join in? I did 8+2f the other week...


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Course you can Darren.

That is probably a bit more accurate as to what I did. I don't normally count failures, I did 2 negatives though.

I just can't do high repping, I am to lazy lol. Lets see what can do at the end of my first cycle!!!!


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Course you can Darren.
> 
> That is probably a bit more accurate as to what I did. I don't normally count failures, I did 2 negatives though.
> 
> *I just can't do high repping, I am to lazy lol.* Lets see what can do at the end of my first cycle!!!!


Not just me then!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It kills me Bek. My muscles just can't take it.

I guess they will eventually get used to it but jeez, it is hard work.

I am loving it though.


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Course you can Darren.
> 
> That is probably a bit more accurate as to what I did. I don't normally count failures, I did 2 negatives though.
> 
> I just can't do high repping, I am to lazy lol. Lets see what can do at the end of my first cycle!!!!


If you let the reps drop below 8, Chris, you'll get stronger, like a PLer, but you won't get much bigger...


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No, I am doing as you suggested Patrick, keep going until I can manage 4 x 12 and then up the weight.

Just getting used to the higher repping really. Most of the assistance exercises I do to 12 and failure. Sometimes I forget though.

That one above was just a challenenge that I was having with Dave thats all. It will all be higher reps from now on boss


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> No, I am doing as you suggested Patrick, keep going until I can manage 4 x 12 and then up the weight.
> 
> Just getting used to the higher repping really. Most of the assistance exercises I do to 12 and failure. Sometimes I forget though.
> 
> That one above was just a challenenge that I was having with Dave thats all. It will all be higher reps from now on boss


Prepare to buy bigger clothes...


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know, I just bought some bloody nice stuff as well. Got it a bigger size than normal but it will still be to small.

Who knows, maybe I won't get much bigger.

Might sound daft, but are there any mental sides to this, could it help with confidence issues say, or is that more just a side effect of getting big than steroids themselves??


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> If you let the reps drop below 8, Chris, you'll get stronger, like a PLer, but you won't get much bigger...


Do you not advocate the use of lower reps for size Pro?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I know, I just bought some bloody nice stuff as well. Got it a bigger size than normal but it will still be to small.
> 
> Who knows, maybe I won't get much bigger.
> 
> Might sound daft, but are there any mental sides to this, could it help with confidence issues say, or is that more just a side effect of getting big than steroids themselves??


Gear is only a tool.

A sensible bloke like you IMO can gain nothing but good from bodybuilding: stature, fitness, character, attractiveness, confidence, authority, kindness, forbearance, grace...

Think about them, and do it right.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

pastanchicken said:


> Do you not advocate the use of lower reps for size Pro?


Absolutely not!

With conventional sets and reps exercise routines (not HIT), to recruit all the muscle fibres, to gain maximum size, reps need to be in the 8 - 15 range.

Higher, and exercise becomes aerobic stamina building.

Lower, and it becomes 1 rep max strength increasing, but not size.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> Absolutely not!
> 
> To recruit all the muscle fibres, to gain maximum size, reps need to be in the 8 - 15 range.
> 
> ...


Always been a 8 - 12 man myself. Just recently I've been experimenting with lower reps, to build up my feeble strength more than anything! 

Keep reading 'a stronger muscle is a bigger muscle', so got me thinking


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

pastanchicken said:


> Always been a 8 - 12 man myself. Just recently I've been experimenting with lower reps, to build up my feeble strength more than anything!
> 
> Keep reading 'a stronger muscle is a bigger muscle', so got me thinking


Stronger muscles are not always bigger, whatever people say!

It depends on which and how many muscle fibres are regularly stressed - faster or slower twitch.

Powerlifters' muscles are often smaller than bodybuilders', yet they can lift much heavier weights for one or a few reps.

However, a serious bodybuilder will not only have big, hard muscles, but will also be able to lift very respectable weights for a significant number of reps.

Both PLers and bodybuilders will be much stronger than a fit guy with similar-sized muscles who doesn't work out.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Well seeing as I aspire to be a bodybuilder rather than a PLer, I will stick to my usual rep range.

Thanks mate


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Guys, I'm having a real crisis of confidence here.

Can I really do this?? Is it the right thing.

I had 2 people today say I look disgustingly big already?????????

I'm really questioning myself now. I know I should be doing it for me and not them.

What if doing it mess's me up and I don't end up looking like I should?

Jesus I hate second thoughts, it's killing me here!!!


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Guys, I'm having a real crisis of confidence here.
> 
> Can I really do this?? Is it the right thing.
> 
> ...


Mate, Congrats:thumb:

Thats fckin awesome.. Those are the type of comments I aspire to along with "steroid freak" and "thats not normal urghh" Disgusting is right up there at top mate for a term of endearment...

You should be fckin proud..

Cause I love that sh1t


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## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

Lol @ JW.

Chris, sorry to burst your bubble but you aren't "disgustingly big".

Sure, you are a reasonable size, but fúck what anyone else thinks it what you think and want... So do you want to be an also ran, looking back later on in your life thinking "if only" or do you want to be all that you can be?

Simples.......JFDI Chris :rockon:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Guys, I'm having a real crisis of confidence here.
> 
> Can I really do this?? Is it the right thing.
> 
> ...


Don't be daft! You'll end up looking very much as you've imagined - and you do want to be huge! Take no notice of the wimps around you!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers JW, telling it straight like always.

Fats, believe me mate, it is not a bubble that I hold, this was an outside observation. I am no-where near disgustingly huge and I am very well aware of that. If I was then maybe these comments wouldn't have annoyed me so much.

Patrick - All I can say is thanks again.

I don't know what's wrong with me at the moment to be honest. I am training harder than ever and yet I just feel down all the time. Maybe these comments have just caught me on a bad day.

I don't understand the way my mind is wired up at the moment. I used to be out all the time socialising and partying and now I am just sitting in with a book. It's not lie a manic depression and I wouldn't say they are extreme swings of emotion. Just a steady below average low.

I am putting it down to maybe anxiety at starting the cycle next week. Maybe I am just a bit nervous.

Also work is a bit stale at the moment as well, not a lot happening. I think I just need to break the rut, bite the bullet and go out and socialise a bit more, not necessarily drinking, just getting out and about a bit and getting a bit of drive back!!

Anyway, I know I will do it, I have to do it, I made promises to myself and to others that I would try this at least once and see where it takes me.

Just got to man the fvck up and do it!!

Cheers guys


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris we all go through phases like that - sometimes it's good to be a recluse, especially when, like you, you are surrounded by the same people 24/7. I really wouldn't worry about it.

As for the comments from others, I'm with Joe on this one. I'm still living for that day.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Darren, you're digustingly shexy. You're getting less bear everyday!!

I know, especially 3 years of the same sh1t. Need that change.


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Just keep thinking of January. That's a nice change coming up.

And bears don't have to be just fat. Muscle too.


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## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> I had 2 people today say I look disgustingly big already?????????


Only two? Stop when JW tell you the same.


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

chris get a grip lad.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Did delts yesterday.

Had to change the routine around as the equipment was being used.

I hate change, if anything inteferes with my routine I get angry. I also underestimated how much pre-fatiguimg knackers you out!!!

*Side raises*

3 x 12 x 15kg Super slow and very strict

*Front raises with Oly bar*

3 x 12 x 25kg (this hurt alot, spesh in my RC)

*Military press*

6 x 65kg hurt alot

3 x 8 x 60kg

Done. Thinking next week I'll add in upright rows as well and maybe some flye's.

Any ideas?

Looking good, will finish this weeks routine tomorrow with back, and then it's time to darken my already grey side. Should be getting pins on 14th!!!

Can't wait to get off these bloody orals. Doing my head in now.

Going to do cardio today definately. My health is shocking, my CV is non-existent.

No fast walking either, going to try and improve my stamina. It's affecting me day to day now, and I believe alot of these minor issues I am having may be done to 0 exercise. Also I have to watch my BP now, cardio will help with that.

:wub: y'all


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

If your RC is hurting, drop the front raises!

If you do side raises strictly out to the side and don't let the weight drift to the front you'll work all 3 delt heads well and build them up big and equal and not put extra strain on your RC.

2 exercises - an overhead press and side raises - should be enough for shoulders if done intensely. You'll certainly feel them every week if you do them correctly!

Upright rows are upper back exercises, not shoulders.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok, thanks for that Patrick.

Still learning every day


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Sorry - I misread! - bent-over rows are back exercises!

Upright rows are good for the front delts and traps, but again can put a strain on the RC.


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris, imo its just a reaction to the cycle you have coming up, sort of an oh sh1t what am

I doing thing

Wish I was disgustingly big  *tries to milk a compliment from somebody/anybody*

Its all good baby, and even if its not, then you can just come off mate, no biggy


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Tel, you're so huge it makes me sick :thumbup1:


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

tell if im as big as you when i get to your age id be well chuffed... still i have 30 or 40 years to get there


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

If the equipment is being used, either ask to work in or tell them to get the fook off the rack that you paid your own money for.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tel, I think you're bang on right. Just nerve's.

Shall commence manning up procedures imminantly 

Finally dragged my ar5e into the gym today to do some cardio. I thought I was going to die. I can't believe how unfit I have let myself get.

Did 6 minutes on the treadmill and had to stop, my calf's had siezed and I could feel the Grim Reaper looking over my shoulder at my heart rate.

Jumped onto the bikes we have. They're called Xtrail and you race on a screen against the computer. Good fun. Did 15 mins on that. Think that is the way forward, helps prevent boredom.

Then hit the Xtrainer for 15 minutes. Nearly puked.

Felt awesome though after I'd finished. Had a shake and then a shower.

Drip dried while playing Mario Kart, then couldn't sleep. Absolutely buzzing now!

Have somethimg wrong with my eye now!!! My right eye has been swollen for a few days and now the swelling has gone down there is a tiny lump left under the eyelid.

Feels like a little stone in there but it is stationary. Seems to be on the eyelid not the eye though. Not sure what it is!

Would be nice to have one day where my whole body works to be honest.

Just had the results back from the tests they did on my kidneys. They do a renogram to check kidney function. These were very important as I wanted to see if the gear I had been using would have any effect on them. They went up.

My function is now 20%/80% left/right. It was only 18%/72% last time.

Could just have been a good day though, but the important thing is that it isn't changing down. Seems to be hanging in there. Has been steady now for maybe 5 years!!!

Very happy boy :thumb:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> If the equipment is being used, either ask to work in or tell them to get the fook off the rack that you paid your own money for.


Lol, true. It;s just that we have a flat bench and a rack but only one Oly bar!!

I would tell them to feck off, but frankly I encourage everyone to get in the gym, so I could never stop anyone trying to better themselves.

Just frustrates me sometimes lol


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris, the lump in the eyelid could be just a blocked tear duct and it should clear itself in a day or so. Just keep it clean and resist the urge to constantly rub your eye to avoid a stye.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I ought it was a stye at first, but then realised I had no idea what a stye was lol.

It should be fine. I found some old anti-biotics lying around so took them just to help out.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> I encourage everyone to get in the gym, so I could never stop anyone trying to better themselves.


That is very nice you beast!


Chris1 said:


> It should be fine. I found some old anti-biotics lying around so took them just to help out.


In my ever so humble opinion you should always avoid taking antibiotics unless you absolutely need them. I have not taken them in over 20 years.

One thing about antibiotics is they kill good and bad bacteria. Also, some antibiotics work for some stuff and not others and if ever in your life you really need them I would want a body that isn't used to taking them. It makes them more efficient.

Take some good bacteria from a good quality yogurt that says live bacteria on it, or take a good pill with live cultures in it. They will say 2 billion or some high number like that.

Not having a go but you guys are way to quick to take a magic pill.

Antibiotic for female generally will give them a yeast infection and stuff like that. For you and I it is just another dry pussy....lol

Do I make myself clear Chris! :beer:


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## M_at (May 2, 2009)

winger said:


> That is very nice you beast!In my ever so humble opinion you should always avoid taking antibiotics unless you absolutely need them. I have not taken them in over 20 years.
> 
> One thing about antibiotics is they kill good and bad bacteria. Also, some antibiotics work for some stuff and not others and if ever in your life you really need them I would want a body that isn't used to taking them. It makes them more efficient.
> 
> ...


Listen to the man - he speaks sense.

I used to be prescribed antibiotics for a recurring sore throat by an old GP and it did me no good. I stopped going and the sore throats still clear up just as quickly without them.

The last time I needed them was for a bout of Legionella that knocked me for size and I'm pretty sure that because I've not used them for years the worked quicker than they'd ever done before.


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

If it was a stye you'd know it, as you'd have an angry red weeping lump on your eyelid. Step away from the antibiotics, I doubt they'll do any good - and they lose their efficacy after a while anyway.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Eye's better today. No more swelling. Little lump is still there but lessening.

Did back today, think I narrowly avoided a Bicep tear. Felt it straining and not in a good way so knocked arms on the head after 3 sets. TBH after the back workout I don't think I really needed it.

Still mixing things up with no set routine to see what works. Seemed to hit a pretty good spot today, although I still think I will have to put deads back in, nothing hits you like they do.

Maybe a little to much rowing moves, but I liked it.

*Lat Pulldowns*

2 x 12 x 80kg

1 x 11 x 80kg

*Wide grip rows*

3 12 x 75kg

*Narrow grip rows*

12 x 75kg

8 x 75kg

11 x 70kg

*Shrugs*

On the shoulder press machine (don't ask)

3 x 15 x 67.5kg. 10 super slow. 5 super fast

*Incline Alternate DB surls*

3 x 12 x 20kg

That's where I stopped after I felt the arm strain.

Liked that workout, shall keep it like that but start with Deads at 4 x 12 (if I can manage 12). Also Shrugs will be BB from now on and maybe alternate close grip rows and bent over rows weekly.

All things being well tomorrow at the exchange, next time I update my journal with weights I should be well and truley darkened :thumbs:


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Sounds nasty on the arm. Can you describe it? Or was it just general discomfort?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It's fine now. You know when you just get a feeling that something isn't right. in the past I would have pushed it, hence why my knee's are screwed.

It was kind of like over streching elastic if you know what I mean? Literally the last 2 reps of the last set. My arms were pumped to hell though after all that rowing.

It really feels fine now.


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Eye's better today. No more swelling. Little lump is still there but lessening.
> 
> Did back today, think I narrowly avoided a Bicep tear. Felt it straining and not in a good way so knocked arms on the head after 3 sets. TBH after the back workout I don't think I really needed it.
> 
> ...


NIce one, Chris!

Never "throw" the weight! Do the reps slowly, even if you have to use a lower weight. If you strain and create any momentum you're moving too fast and lessening any benefit, and this is how many injuries happen. Trying to lift impressive, too heavy weights is a mistake!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I think that may have been the case Patrick if I'm honest. Because I have always trained for strength in the past I am not so used to this much fatigue and "pump" by the time the workout goes on. I need to adjust the weights accordingly.

I didn't feel like I was throwing the weights around though, although with the incline curls you never really take the strain off the bicels so that maybe one to watch in the future.

Looking at these ECA 30 as a fat burner. What do you guys think. Would they help at all? I haven't had much luck with fat burners in the past, but could give a months worth a shot just to see if they are any good? Only £20!


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I think that may have been the case Patrick if I'm honest. Because I have always trained for strength in the past I am not so used to this much fatigue and "pump" by the time the workout goes on. I need to adjust the weights accordingly.
> 
> I didn't feel like I was throwing the weights around though, although with the incline curls you never really take the strain off the bicels so that maybe one to watch in the future.
> 
> Looking at these ECA 30 as a fat burner. What do you guys think. Would they help at all? I haven't had much luck with fat burners in the past, but could give a months worth a shot just to see if they are any good? Only £20!


You do NOT need fat burners! Duh! Eat protein and fats and control your carb intake: you'll lose flab and gain lean muscle!


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## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> *Shrugs*
> 
> On the shoulder press machine (don't ask)
> 
> 3 x 15 x 67.5kg. 10 super slow. 5 super fast


You standing on the seat? 



Chris1 said:


> Liked that workout, shall keep it like that but start with Deads at 4 x 12 (if I can manage 12). Also Shrugs will be BB from now on and maybe alternate close grip rows and bent over rows weekly.


You can manage 12 - you just need to find the appropriate weight and don't worry about starting low and working up.

For me the sweet spot for 12 would be around the 100kg mark - try around there and see how it goes?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

M_at said:


> You standing on the seat?
> 
> You can manage 12 - you just need to find the appropriate weight and don't worry about starting low and working up.
> 
> For me the sweet spot for 12 would be around the 100kg mark - try around there and see how it goes?


Sure am  Works a treat, just wish there was more weight!!

It is not he weight that I can't handle Matt, it is my obscenely bad cardio levels!!! The thought of 12 reps on Deads or squats gives me the shakes without even going to the gym!!

I can but try anyway. 100kg would be a sensible starting point for me also I believe.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> You do NOT need fat burners! Duh! Eat protein and fats and control your carb intake: you'll lose flab and gain lean muscle!


Is there a particular reason you don't reccomend or is it just a case that if it can be achieved through diet there is no need?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Is there a particular reason you don't reccomend or is it just a case that if it can be achieved through diet there is no need?


You're not obese or cutting hard for a comp, meds are always best avoided if they're unnecessaary, and you can lose flab by controlling your carb intake, so you simply don't need fat burners!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Point well taken!!!

PlusI saw what the Tren did to help Darren out as well with BF so they should all come together nicely. I have unloaded my basket


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Sure am  Works a treat, just wish there was more weight!!
> 
> It is not he weight that I can't handle Matt, it is my obscenely bad cardio levels!!! *The thought of 12 reps on Deads or squats gives me the shakes without even going to the gym!!*
> 
> ...


Man up you pussy


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

The thought of doing 12 reps of anthing makes me feel faint, well maybe if you add the 4 sets together.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Prodiver said:


> You're not obese or cutting hard for a comp, meds are always best avoided if they're unnecessaary, and you can lose flab by controlling your carb intake, so you simply don't need fat burners!


Nice Patrick. Stimulants take a toll on the adrenal glands and yes they should be avoided unless you are getting ready for a contest.

You can take all the stimulants in the world and still gain weight if you eat too many calories. That is why Patrick said eat your protein and fats and control your body fat by cutting back on carbs.

On a side not too many carbs will/can spike insulin. Insulin is a fat storing hormone so eat low glycimic fruits and vegetables and avoid big meals and you wont spike insulin as bad if at all.

Low glycimic carbs usually contain high fiber so avoid breads, sugars.


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## Guest (Oct 14, 2009)

Just dropping by to say hello Chris. Sent you a friend request on facebook.. Will you be my friend?  :laugh: :thumbup1:


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Zues do you really think he's that desperate?? Although you did have a nice ass, add me add me...


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

winger said:


> Nice Patrick. Stimulants take a toll on the adrenal glands and yes they should be avoided unless you are getting ready for a contest.
> 
> You can take all the stimulants in the world and still gain weight if you eat too many calories. That is why Patrick said eat your protein and fats and control your body fat by cutting back on carbs.
> 
> ...


Cheers Winger.

Jeez you're on a roll these days. What happened to the smut filled innuendo's you used to post??? I hope you haven't gone permaserious!

On a serious note, thanks for the input. I still have lots to learn, or need reminding about all the things i forget more like!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

ZEUS said:


> Just dropping by to say hello Chris. Sent you a friend request on facebook.. Will you be my friend?  :laugh: :thumbup1:


Sure will hunk. Just going on now


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

d4ead said:


> Zues do you really think he's that desperate?? Although you did have a nice ass, add me add me...


Mate, I was born desperate :laugh:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

On a side note, wish me luck.

Of to see whether I can get my pins and barrels on today.

I'm sure there won't be a problem, but I worry.

My 7 books arrived today as well from Amazon and a new mess jacket as well 

7 years on cruise ships and I finally have a mess jacket that fits!!!!


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> On a side note, wish me luck.
> 
> Of to see whether I can get my pins and barrels on today.
> 
> ...


Good Luck!!!

Amazon are sneaky bastards - last week they had free postage on orders over £5, and I bought two books for £9.59. Now they have free postage for all orders and same books cost £11.68. Hmm..... 

Oh yeah, I nearly forgot.......

:tt2: :wub: :wub:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Mmmmmmm. I'm feeling rather trenendous 

The dark side is well and truley strong in this one!

Thank you for all the pep talking patrick. You are an extremely kind man to help a wimp out like me. It couldn't have been easier :thumb:

shall update after celebration cheat meal.

Thanks guys.

P.s. How's about you put that cheeky Tongue to some use


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

How did the pinning go, were you a quibbering wreck or did you man up:whistling:

Welcome to the darker side


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Piece of cake mate. Little blunder half way through when I forgot to expel about 0.5ml of air after drawing the Tren. So had to take of syringe with pin in. No biggy really though.

Just took it super slow and was very kindly talked through it by a very experienced guy. All this stuff about jabbing fast seems like bollocks as I did it slow and it was a dream!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Jabbing fast, as in sticking the needle in fast?

Glad it went well mate, how long you on the test/tren for, any orals?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah. I did it really slowly. Like over 30 seconds. Some guys talk about doing it really quickly like a dart.

No orals. The orals I did have I'm stopping now. Sick of them and the liver pains so I've been pretty desperate to stop them.

Look forward to some nice gains!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Yeah. I did it really slowly. Like over 30 seconds. Some guys talk about doing it really quickly like a dart.
> 
> No orals. The orals I did have I'm stopping now. Sick of them and the liver pains so I've been pretty desperate to stop them.
> 
> Look forward to some nice gains!


How did you take 30 seconds to jab a needle in, must say I just push it in, are

you scared of hitting a nerve/blood cell??

Sure you'll come on a ton mate, literally

Hope you can cope with the anxiety attacks though:lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No fear. Just took it easy. Gently broke the skin in and then eased it the test of the way in. No point rushing. Especially the first time.

Looking forward to it all mate. Sure anxiety won't be to much of an issue!


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

dc55 said:


> FPMSL.....i'd be quite worried if he didnt hit a blood CELL mate!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> Nice to see you've finally seen sense Chris.....you'll love tren. The dreams are a bit dodgy though......been having seriously scary ones lately. And got no MRSDC to cuddle me:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> Whats the doses big boy?


I noticed that before I posted it, just thought I'd leave it in to see who spotted it:whistling:

You back on tren, your a tren monster, how ya keeping nowadays mate, whats

life like with Mrs at Uni


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris - first jab congratulations.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

dc55 said:


> Yeah back on the tren....missed it too much pmsl. Also having a go at some deca, which im liking at moment. Started kicking in last few days.
> 
> Chris will be a monster on tren as he's a large chap anyway. Just wondering what training he's gonna be doing????
> 
> *No MRSDC = very lonely DC:confused1:* :confused1:


Feel for ya bud, weekends must be good though:thumb:

I don't think chris knows what training he's doing:rolleyes:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

tel3563 said:


> Feel for ya bud, weekends must be good though:thumb:
> 
> I don't think chris knows what training he's doing:rolleyes:


Have you read Dave's journal - he doesn't know what he wants to do either :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Lol. Just doing 12 of lots of things.

I have chest and legs and shoulders sorted. Back days a bit of a mystery.

Time to man up and deadlift again. I hate the things but miss them at the same time. Nothing else smash's your back like them.

I should be huge dave. All the tools are there no more excuses.

Thinking we should all have a beer in jan just to admire how bug I've become :tongue:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> Lol. Just doing 12 of lots of things.
> 
> I have chest and legs and shoulders sorted. Back days a bit of a mystery.
> 
> ...


I'll drink to admiring how big you've become. :beer:

And start deadlifting again. Throw in bent over rows, pull ups and shrugs.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

400/200 dave. For the size of me more might have been better but no harm in starting small is there. Marathon not a sprint and all that!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

M_at said:


> I'll drink to admiring how big you've become. :beer:
> 
> And start deadlifting again. Throw in bent over rows, pull ups and shrugs.


pretty much what I do mate. Just need to add the deads again.

Hopefully now I've stopped the orals the back pumps won't be as bad. Although I'm not sure they were to blame. Really glad to be off them now though.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

dc55 said:


> I know im pulling near off 1/4 of a tonne


I'm working towards that 



dc55 said:


> SHRUGS = GAY:rolleyes:
> 
> Dead
> 
> ...


So what if it's gay? :lol:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Lol. Just doing 12 of lots of things.
> 
> I have chest and legs and shoulders sorted. Back days a bit of a mystery.
> 
> ...


Not fvcking London though, somewhere halfway:thumbup1:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

M_at said:


> I'll drink to admiring how big you've become. :beer:
> 
> And start deadlifting again. *Throw in bent over rows, pull ups and shrugs.*


Concur, actually my workout atm


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

dc55 said:


> ...
> 
> *SHRUGS = GAY*
> 
> ...


Bollox! If you don't do shrugs you'll never get awesome traps! Deads will never do enough


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey guys.

Bloody shattered, and my cheat meal didn't exactly agree with me. May have been the obscene rate at which I devoured the pizza mind, I was late back to the ship.

No PIP as of yet, but been keeping active, nothing else really to report from that side.

All for something a bit closer Tel, maybe Newcastle???

You didn't specify half way between where 

Dave, I enjoy shrugs, they certainly won't do any harm when thrown in with deads.

2 stone!!!! Sheesh, that will put me at a rather scarey 21 stone. Hopefully a leaner one at that.

Now I see why Patrick was saying I need new clothes!!

Wouldn't say I've abandoned the power side altogether. Just fancy getting fecking huge for a while :thumb:

A higher dose probably would have been better Dave I do agree, but I would rather start of conservatively and then work up. Dip my feet before I dive in, maybe I'll get called a pussy a few times, but I want to be careful.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Hey guys.
> 
> Bloody shattered, and my cheat meal didn't exactly agree with me. May have been the obscene rate at which I devoured the pizza mind, I was late back to the ship.
> 
> ...


I have an idea, lets say York:thumbup1: Lovely city, good pubs, easy to get to and central to the UK:beer:

2 stone, blah, nafc imo, I ate shed loads and put on about 6 lean lbs, some

of us tried to reach our natty potential before jumping on the AAS bandwagon:whistling: :whistling:

Not mentioning no names like


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

ok I'm here you filthy slut!!!

My only excuse for not seeing people journals is I honestly sit in Steroids and General section only and refresh the pages for days on end. Terrible habit.

I think you will gain well on your first course, you a big chap and can could have handled more but why rush it hey. You still going to gain really well and that's the important thing and there is many more to come later on where you can increase the dose as needed.

I'll bookmark your journal sweatie, so I can pop in from time to time. xx

EDIT : P.S. ( whats pages have your current progress pics on with you wearing that thong you were telling me about? )


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll put some up in the next few days just for you Saffir boy.

I know that's how you Shark's roll 

Tel, York sounds good, I shall drag my hot sexy 2 stone heavier body down in a super tight Wife beater, just so you can admire how real men gain xxx :whistling:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I'll put some up in the next few days just for you Saffir boy.
> 
> I know that's how you Shark's roll
> 
> Tel, York sounds good, I shall drag my hot sexy 2 stone heavier body down in a super tight Wife beater, *just so you can admire how real men gain xxx * :whistling:


yahdi yahdi yah:whistling:

York does sound good doesn't it

Don't think any of them southern softy cocktail drinkers will go north of watford though

We'll see:rolleyes:

Any other Northeners up for a xmas drink in York ya think??


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I'll put some up in the next few days just for you Saffir boy.
> 
> I know that's how you Shark's roll
> 
> Tel, York sounds good, I shall drag my hot sexy 2 stone heavier body down in a super tight Wife beater, just so you can admire how real men gain xxx :whistling:


Did we have a challenge set or not?? Or should I make the trip to York to show you up?

.... where the fvck is York? :confused1:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

TaintedSoul said:


> Did we have a challenge set or not?? Or should I make the trip to York to show you up?
> 
> .... *where the fvck is York? * :confused1:


 :lol:

You ignoramous, its near Leeds, straight down M1, M1/A1 link, A64

even you could find it on your bison or buffalo or whatever they have in saffy:lol:


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> :lol:
> 
> You ignoramous, its near Leeds, straight down M1, M1/A1 link, A64
> 
> even you could find it on your bison or buffalo or whatever they have in saffy:lol:


I'm from south london.. init bruv!

The Bison is out in the fields and the Buffalo is hanging up slowly becomming biltong!! I'll see what the Camel can do and if the Solars GPS is working I'll try head on up!!

Though I'm a lazy cvnt so dont count on it..... :confused1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well I aint home till Jan Tel, so, me you and Leafy I reckon lol.

There are a few lads on here from round us, we should be able to organise something.

Although I don't mind the trip to London so much, it was a cracking night last time.

TS, we did have a comp, but I couldn't decide what my goals should be lol

Let me look at my numbers tomorrow when I have more time and I'll post them up and see if we can come up with a reasonable goal. Although I have to keep reminding myself that I'm here for size not strength.

At least I'll always be better looking anyway, we can have a pose down for the gays, one with the most reach arounds wins


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Don't leave me out I'm happy to help hunky.


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Hey guys.
> 
> Bloody shattered, and my cheat meal didn't exactly agree with me. May have been the obscene rate at which I devoured the pizza mind, I was late back to the ship.
> 
> ...


stronger you are, bigger you get

why dont you do both types training???

chest example

bench heavy, like a powerlifter

then incline dumbell and whatever else as per BBder

Chris, you are abig dude already, quite imposing in real life

pics dont do justive 

same back, do Dl then rows\chins higer reps

Get everything doing that way


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Well I aint home till Jan Tel, so, me you and Leafy I reckon lol.
> 
> There are a few lads on here from round us, we should be able to organise something.
> 
> ...


140kg bench reps

180kg DL reps

poss chins, or sqauts but thats too much open for interpretation

leg extention to failure would be nasty


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

jw007 said:


> stronger you are, bigger you get
> 
> why dont you do both types training???
> 
> ...


So heavy compound lifts with bb finishing moves per each body parts?

An Alpha man after my own heart. Can it really be this simple? :beer:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

tel3563 said:


> :lol:
> 
> You ignoramous, its near Leeds, straight down M1, M1/A1 link, A64
> 
> even you could find it on your bison or buffalo or whatever they have in saffy:lol:


Train into town, tube to Kings Cross then a 2hr Train Journey up to York.

You don't drive to York from London - you get the train.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

jw007 said:


> stronger you are, bigger you get
> 
> why dont you do both types training???
> 
> ...


That is what I was doing before hand and was getting stronger but I never seemed to be getting bigger. May revert to this though in a while. Just liking the high rep stuff at the moment as a change.

Thanks very much for the compliments as well, means alot coming from you. Next time we all have a p1ss up I'll have a mini gun off with the Saffir Slvt before you and DB have a re-match 



jw007 said:


> 140kg bench reps
> 
> 180kg DL reps
> 
> ...


I am starting DL again this week Joe, just stupid mental blocks. Maybe the gear will help to overcome the fear once I feel the strength coming on.

Lifts currently are

Bench: 150kg for 2; 115kg for 4 x 8 (ish)

Squats: Probably around 130kg for 4 x 12, 160kg for 2

Deads: 205kg for 1; never really repped out TBH would imagine 140kg for 8ish if my ar5e doesn't blow out.

MP: 90kg for 2; 60kg 4 x 12

They're the main ones anyway. Try and pluck some numbers out of that lol

I think Joe's 180kg dead for reps and 140kg bench for reps should be well in grasp.

MP I would like 80kg for reps, squats I have no idea as I never reached my potential with them so I expect them to be around 180kg for reps as well.

What were you aiming for Sean??


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So, I received all my supps yesterday. When do you think the best time to be taking them is? I was just taking them all before bed for ease, but maybe spread them out as there is a few.

At the moment I am taking;

10g Omega 3

5g Vit C

2g CLA These 3 taken together at night

5g Omega 3 and 10g Cranberry Extract (for the kidneys, keeps them healthy)

Usually take these on waking

Also now have Milk Thistle 5.7g tabs and Chelated Magnesium with Vitamin B6 100mg magnesium and 8.4mg B6 (keep the old BP in check).

Chuck in some digestive enzymes every meal.

Also received some melt in the mouth Glucosamine tablets as well, they were the Zipvit free gifts and I have no idea what to do with them, think they're HCL 750mg.

Any suggestions? How many would you guys be taking and when? I had the impression to just add the extra ones in at lunch times TBH.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

On another note, slept like a baby last night.

I used some anti-snore spray and it seemed to work a treat. I mean, I have no way of knowing whether it stopped me snoring or not, but I felt better and slept straight through. Someone mentioned something which made me think snoring may be the enemy with my sleeping so I bought the spray just to trial and it seems to be a success!

I also feel fantastic this morning, I woke up and for the first time (aside from a slighty stuffy nose) in ages I feel fantastic, ready to face the world.

Maybe it is just a placebo thing, but fvck it, I'm keeping it 

No PIP to speak of either. Just a very small, almost like bruised feeling. Nothing at all to write home about. Just proves how good Patricks injection techniques are. Worked a dream.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> They're the main ones anyway. Try and pluck some numbers out of that lol
> 
> I think Joe's 180kg dead for reps and 140kg bench for reps should be well in grasp.
> 
> ...


Irish spelling, you have some Irish in you TS?



M_at said:


> Train into town, tube to Kings Cross then a 2hr Train Journey up to York.
> 
> You don't drive to York from London - you get the train.


what are these "trains" you speak of:confused1:

smarta55

concur with Joe, do PL/BB routine whilst on cycle, do the higher reps bb ting

afterwards, give the muscles a rest from the mega weights you'll be pushing whilst

on AAS

Not sure about meet in Jan, depends how big you get, nobodies taking away

my thunder, my Mrs is now saying I look like a muscular George Clooney

or did she say George Foreman:confused1:

:lol:

PS Your Pb's are ridiculously low for someone of your stature, I'm 15 7 and can

beat most of them

JUST A LITTLE REVERSE PYSCHOLOGY THERE:whistling:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Well done on first jab Chris! Hope it all goes well.

As for York, lovely city, mrs hasn't been so going to take her for a weekend in the new year :thumbup1:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

pastanchicken said:


> Well done on first jab Chris! Hope it all goes well.
> 
> As for York, lovely city, mrs hasn't been so *going to take her for a weekend in the new year* :thumbup1:


Bad news on that front Pasta, just read in local paper as of 2010 no lancastrians

allowed within City limits:whistling:

What a Bummer:lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I should hope so to Tel with all the "experience" *cough* you have on your side :whistling:

I'm going to keep the higher reps for while though as I am enjoying them at the moment. See how it goes. I had been doing that very same routine for a good few months so I reckon the change will do me good.

Well thats sorted Pasta mate, you can come to our p1ss up 

I am sure I will be no-where near the size of a Demi-god like you by them Tel 

Well, maybe :whistling:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Bad news on that front Pasta, just read in local paper as of 2010 no lancastrians
> 
> allowed within City limits:whistling:
> 
> What a Bummer:lol:


I'll have to adopt my dodgy Yorkshire accent then and hope I don't get spotted :laugh:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Well thats sorted Pasta mate, you can come to our p1ss up
> 
> I am sure I will be no-where near the size of a Demi-god like you by them Tel


Can we go to one of those kids eat free restaurants? I'd prob get some free grub, as I'll be dwarfed by the big boys!! 

Lol @ demi-god :laugh:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I should hope so to Tel with all the "experience" *cough* you have on your side :whistling:
> 
> I'm going to keep the higher reps for while though as I am enjoying them at the moment. See how it goes. I had been doing that very same routine for a good few months so I reckon the change will do me good.
> 
> ...


Low reps for strength are good to mix in occasionally, Chris, but while you're going for mass don't let the reps drop - you'll be fitter for doing them too.

Remember how certain guys who do low reps and don't like cardio have recently taken to biking? :whistling:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I should hope so to Tel with all the *"experience" **cough* you have on your side :whistling:
> 
> How very dare you:lol:
> 
> ...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yes we can, and you can have the chicken nuggets 

But the bigger boys might steal your chips :whistling:

I thought you and Tel were around the same height though?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Low reps for strength are good to mix in occasionally, Chris, but while you're going for mass don't let the reps drop - you'll be fitter for doing them too.
> 
> *Remember how certain guys who do low reps and don't like cardio have recently taken to biking? * :whistling:


 :lol:

No pics yet though:whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It's ok Tel, when I meet your wife after doing my 12's we'll tell her it's all an illusion.

Blame the lighting. Tell her size isn't everything. Tell her it's because it's because the sun shines more in the Med when I'm away and due to Photosynthesis I have grown to abnormal size.

Or you could just accept the fact that you'll be picking up the tab


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

The cardio part is a big bonus as well as I am ridiculously unfit these days.

Tempted to go off and do cardio today actually. I should do and then hit the old Chest tomorrow.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Yes we can, and you can have the chicken nuggets
> 
> But the bigger boys might steal your chips :whistling:
> 
> I thought you and Tel were around the same height though?


Nice one, though can I have smiley faces rather than chips? :laugh:

Not sure how tall Tel is, I'm 5 11. Though he's heavier than me, and go by the avi, in much better condition!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I have to say Tel is in very good nick.

He's 15stone 7 I think but not sure how tall. I will be well above my expectations if I look as good as he does post cycle!! :thumb:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> *It's ok Tel, when I meet your wife after doing my 12's we'll tell her it's all an illusion.*
> 
> Blame the lighting. Tell her *size isn't everything **(she knows this)**.* Tell her it's because it's because the sun shines more in the Med when I'm away and due to Photosynthesis I have grown to abnormal size.
> 
> ...


**shudder**TEL GOES TO ORDER MORE TREN:whistling: :whistling:

5 ft 10 and a half inches


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

lol. Check me out and my new found confidence 

You and pasta are about the same size then. Seriously though, if I'm still alive at your age and I look half as good I'll have been doing something very right!!!

We still need a training session as well though boss  I seem to remember you owe me a Delts Session.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> lol. Check me out and my new found confidence
> 
> You and pasta are about the same size then. Seriously though, *if I'm still alive at your age *and I look half as good I'll have been doing something very right!!!
> 
> We still need a training session as well though boss  I seem to remember you owe me a Delts Session.


And why wouldn't you be, I've not had a sheltered life:whistling: Far from it:thumb:

The single difference between myself and my mostly porky wrinkled mates is

I've always been a fanatic about my fitness.

boxing, taekwondo, kick boxing, footy, rugby, weights, since the age of 11

We have the tools


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

tel3563 said:


> And why wouldn't you be, I've not had a sheltered life:whistling: Far from it:thumb:
> 
> The single difference between myself and my mostly porky wrinkled mates is
> 
> ...


Agrees !

Erm Pics Chris :whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Pics will be along shortly, just need to get them done lol.

I really needt o sort the fitness side out Tel. Even if it's judst d1cking round on a static bike once every couple of days. Cardio is just a b1tch to get into.

I would much prefer to do some team sports or something.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Pics will be along shortly, just need to get them done lol.
> 
> I really needt o sort the fitness side out Tel. Even if it's judst d1cking round on a static bike once every couple of days. Cardio is just a b1tch to get into.
> 
> I would much prefer to do some team sports or something.


While you're gaining mass, Chris, lifting intensely with minimal rests between sets so that your heart rate's raised during the workout can be as effective as doing cardio.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Jem said:


> Agrees !
> 
> Erm Pics Chris :whistling:


:lol:The power of the Edit

You'll pay for that Missy:cursing:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Indeed Patrick, but also doing cardio on my off days at a sensible rate shouldn't do ne any harm?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Pics will be along shortly, just need to get them done lol.
> 
> I really needt o sort the fitness side out Tel. Even if it's judst d1cking round on a static bike once every couple of days. Cardio is just a b1tch to get into.
> 
> *I would much prefer to do some team sports or something.*


Can't you join in with the cruisers playing badminton:laugh:

Right, if you have no time for cardio I have something for you, its not easy, in fact,

its fvcking so hard it will, the first few times, make you want to vomit, the question is...

Are you man enough........... :whistling: :whistling:

And boy does it works very fast at killing the jelly


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Please don't say the T word Tel.

Let's see what you got though big boy


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Please don't say the T word Tel.
> 
> Let's see what you got though big boy


Whats the T word?

Right, pick your favourite cardio machine, mines x trainer as it don't hurt my back

warm up as usual for 3 mins

right, if your fitness levels are decent then after the warm up you got all out, and

I mean all out for 1 minute, then you go at a resting rate for one minute, all out

for 1 minute, resting, all out etc etc

You get the picture.

I'd be surprised, if your doing the full 1 minute at top pace, if you can do

more

than 10 mins on machine. On Tren maybe say 6 mins:lol:

Obviously you'll of heard of this before, its high impact interval training, but it

works, and works well, it strips the fat like no other training and fast, last time

I did this, when I was natty, it stripped the fat off in no time, and the other

benefit is I got as fit as fvck as well.

I started this again on wednesday and got 10 mins before I collapsed in a heap on

the floor. Its so hard its brilliant.

Give it a go, whats the worst that can happen

If your a pussy you can start with 30 second sprints and 30 second intervals, and build up


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thats the T word mate.

Tabatas. The work of the devil. Another term for HIIT. I hate it.

I can literally manage 3 minutes at the moment. It is a good idea though and it minimises boring cardio time as well.

How much will it impact on gains though?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Thats the T word mate.
> 
> Tabatas. The work of the devil. Another term for HIIT. I hate it.
> 
> ...


Imo none, although like everything else there's a few more opinions out there

I think its great, 10-15 mins and cardio done, no endless drolling on the machines

This is of course not appliable if there is some hotty on machine in front of you


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

M_at said:


> Train into town, tube to Kings Cross then a *2hr Train Journey up to York.*
> 
> *
> *
> ...


Would have to stay over for that one, dam what a journey!! That's easily 3 hours one way. For me that like immigrating!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'd probably puke on her lol

On the bonus side it can be done after weights or on a separate day. Depending on time.

I am yet to experience Tren and cardio together. First day in the gym tomorrow for chest and tri's. Probably won't see much benefit so soon, maybe some Placebo sides.

I need to get out some frustration, my ex is killing me at the moment. I actually nearly cried today out of frustration. Spiteful womens logic is unreal. I need a clear mind for this part of my life and this is not helping.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

TaintedSoul said:


> Would have to stay over for that one, dam what a journey!! That's easily 3 hours one way. For me that like immigrating!


You'll be used to it then Gypsy boy


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> I'd probably puke on her lol
> 
> On the bonus side it can be done after weights or on a separate day. Depending on time.
> 
> ...


What's she doing? Being female I can do vindictive very well too......you should know by now that the average spiteful ex has absolutely no sense of logic whatsoever! :laugh:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just like screaming at me in the bar, screaming at my other ex in the bar who I'm friends with, screaming at friends. Constant barrage of abuse over the phone.

It's difficult on a ship, you can't just turn your phone off in case there's an emergency, you can't disapear as there is only 1 bar for officers. You are cocooned in this environment which you can't escape from.

Imagine your office where you work, but you have to live in it, eat in it, sleep in it, socialise in it, all with the same people 24/7 for 4 months.

Normally it's fine, but when you get issues like this it is untenable.

Now she is pulling allsorts of stuff out to just upset me more and more. Kids being one of them. Just feel like sh1t. I have been on a high all day after starting yesterday, I finally feel like I am firing 100% again and she starts.

Anyway, upshot is, she goes home on the 17th for 2 months so I will be free. Then I can concentrate and get my head back in it.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Kids?

Can't you pull rank on her? Get her moved onto another ship?

Does she want you back or something or is she just a bitter old witch???

Bah, stupid girl, I think you're great :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, if I am fair I wasn't great at the end. We had dragged the relationship on and off for 2 years, it was always self-destructive.

At the end I said I thought we could make it work, she got her hopes up, then I decided it was bad, so I get the upset, but jeez, grow some self respect!!!

She is in a different department, unfortunately ships don't work that way anymore. I wish I could move her off.


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> You'll be used to it then Gypsy boy


 :lol: :lol: Can I park my caravan outside your house?

Unless you have a sister with a double bed? :whistling:



Chris1 said:


> Well, if I am fair I wasn't great at the end. We had dragged the relationship on and off for 2 years, it was always self-destructive.
> 
> At the end I said I thought we could make it work, she got her hopes up, then I decided it was bad, so I get the upset, but jeez, grow some self respect!!!
> 
> She is in a different department, unfortunately ships don't work that way anymore. I wish I could move her off.


Thats gotta suck big time. But a great excuse to keep you out the work bar and in the gym or in the kitchen eating. Hope it works out. Perhaps she might slip off the edge of the boat someday, alcohol is a dangerous thing!! :whistling:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Tabatas are 20 seconds all out and 10 seconds cruise for 8 times. That's 4 minutes total and that's it.

If done correctly you can't do it. Also if done correctly you should only do it twice a week because it is hard on the CNS. Scientifically proven.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

TaintedSoul said:


> Thats gotta suck big time. But a great excuse to keep you out the work bar and in the gym or in the kitchen eating. Hope it works out. Perhaps she might slip off the edge of the boat someday, alcohol is a dangerous thing!! whistling:


  :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Quick update. Had a really rough couple of days with the b1tch.

No training. Back in today hopefully for chest and tri's.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> Quick update. Had a really rough couple of days with the b1tch.
> 
> No training. Back in today hopefully for chest and tri's.


What's this hopefully sh1t, get your ass in the gym. You need it for your sanity son, now step up!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> What's this hopefully sh1t, get your ass in the gym. You need it for your sanity son, now step up!


He's got no dedication mate, boys a loser

That should do the trick


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You're lucky I was always taught to respect my elders!!

Chest and Tri's, weak as p1ss water, but feel amazing?????

Flat becn was particularly suffering today. Not sure whats up, although with all the sh1t I've been drinking a bit and not really eaten. I really fvcking hate myself for letting her do my head in againj.

Still, she's gone home like I said, so game, by the time she gets back in 1.5 months there'll be so many women hanging off me she won't be able to get close enough to shout :thumb:

*Flat bench*

8 x 115kg

10 x 110kg

8 x 110kg

10 x 100kg

9 x 100kg They all should have been 12 reps but I can't press for sh1t today.

*Flye's on chest press machine*

4 x 12 x 75kg

*Tri pushdowns*

3 x 12 x 50kg

*Rope pulldowns*

2 x 9 x 20kg!!!!!!!!!!

I couldn't move by the rope pulldowns. So guess I was doing something right!

The new programme is based around something Prodiver mentioned in Joes thread so thought I would try it. Like it, just would like the strength to go up a bit.

Could it be just the transition between stopping the orals and theTest/Tren kicking in?? Probably not.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

What no declines? winger runs over and pm's Patrick..lol


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> What no declines? winger runs over and pm's Patrick..lol


 :lol: :lol:

Chris has been a naughty boy Patrick

I can almost see his whiskers frowning:laugh:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

lol, we don't have a decline bench and the last time I put the bench ar5e end up on a reebok step I snapped the step in half.

I may do dips but I wouldn't say they were really working for me.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> lol, we don't have a decline bench and the last time I put the bench ar5e end up on a reebok step I snapped the step in half.
> 
> I may do dips but I wouldn't say they were really working for me.


Use an abs board at 45 degrees with the back of your knees hooked over the top end and dumbells..?

Be inventive!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

only have 26kg dumbells and no abs board. I am very inventive, just struggling to get round this one.

Surely flat bench is good though?maybe not the best, but nearly as good?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Hello you filthy roider :lol: Nice new avvy, very sexy.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Glad you likey 

17.5 inch bad boys there. Better be a damn site bigger than that come Jan


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Hope so. Can I feel you up?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You know you don't have to ask sweety :wub:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Do I?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hell no, dive in


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Dayum you look hot in that avi! I think i need a lie down. Care to join me? X


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm swimming as we speak babe


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, cardio today, did HIIT, blew out my fecking ar5e.

Managed 7 minutes. 2 minutes warm up, 30 secs on 30 secs off.

To be honest, it's sh1t, but it was a hell of a lot better than I thought I would do.

Will keep going at 30 secs for a while, then try and ramp up to the full minute.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Well, cardio today, did HIIT, blew out my fecking ar5e.
> 
> Managed 7 minutes. 2 minutes warm up, 30 secs on 30 secs off.
> 
> ...


Nice one mate, rock hard ain't it:laugh:

How's the other things coming along:whistling: Any pip?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm not sure to be honest mate. I feel healthier and that's really about it.

I did have that euphoric feeling for a bit, but then it kind of petered out.

Maybe just all the sh1t that was going on took it's toll this week. I am eating again and sleeping properly so hopefully that will help.

PIP, not really TBH, there was a dull sort of pain, but I put that down to me having just stuck a 1.25 inch needle in me lol. Then I had a sort of bruised feeling for a while, certainly not anything that would hinder me.

It is a bit deflating when I read some other peoples accounts of what they felt and how it affected them, I feel like more should be happening.

It does make me wonder if I should have used a higher dose as I am a big ish lad anyway. Probably looking to much into it really, and the stuff won't have fully kicked in yet anyway. REally need to learn to think positively lol


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

believe me, your not feeling anything I didn't, try not to expect the stupid " I gained 2 stone

on first cycle" ****e.

Believe me again when I say, it will come mate:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, I'm not sur Tel. I was never expecting to gain even a stone on first cycle, it was more a mental feeling if you get what I mean.

The Euphoris people talk about. I was reading about IanStu and the psychological impact he had. Although sometimes (not saying him) you have to wonder how much of it is boll*cks.

Patience has never been one of my strong points lol, but I am sure with the hard work and dedication I am putting in I will see the gains I want.

I have noticed I am hungrier more and finding it easier to eat more and more often, I have also found that I am thristier more so am drinking more water and Green Tea as well, so these are all things that indicate something is happening for the good.

TBH Tel I think the last few weeks I have just been worn down mentally from the sh1t onboard, in hindsight I would have waited till now when she has gone to do it. I think I just need a couple of nights out with the good friends I have onboard (and the new gym instructor :thumb: ) to pick me up again and I'll be good to go!


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

not sure what euphoric feeling you expect mate on tren.

Don't know if you had enth or ace but enth takes about 4 plus weeks to make itself felt IME.

You'll just get fuking strong, sweat like a pedo on the school run, vascular and bang some good lean mass on but it's not heroin or crack bro.....no superhero feelings. Might fvck with your angry valve a tad


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Uriel said:


> not sure what euphoric feeling you expect mate on tren.
> 
> Don't know if you had enth or ace but enth takes about 4 plus weeks to make itself felt IME.
> 
> You'll just get fuking strong, sweat like a pedo on the school run, vascular and bang some good lean mass on but it's not heroin or crack bro.....no superhero feelings. Might fvck with your angry valve a tad


Have to disagree Uriel, I've felt euphoria, or to put it another way, like God

a few times, not all the time, but some of the time.

Agree with the 4 weeks though, which is why you should of maybe bridged this

gap with an oral chris


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Uriel, it is 400mg Test and 200mg Tren, enth.

TBH, I know I'm just being a fvcking whinging [email protected] atm. Just need to snap out of it.

P1ssing myself off now. Continuing the orals would have been a better plan in hindsight, even if only for a week of 2, live and learn I guess.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Uriel, it is 400mg Test and 200mg Tren, enth.
> 
> TBH, I know I'm just being a fvcking whinging [email protected] atm. Just need to snap out of it.
> 
> P1ssing myself off now. Continuing the orals would have been a better plan in hindsight, even if only for a week of 2, live and learn I guess.


I was advised same and chose to ignore, we do live and learn


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You've not been off the orals long. If you have some left, get back on them.

Still looking shexi.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Uriel, it is 400mg Test and 200mg Tren, enth.
> 
> TBH, I know I'm just being a fvcking whinging [email protected] atm. Just need to snap out of it.
> 
> P1ssing myself off now. Continuing the orals would have been a better plan in hindsight, even if only for a week of 2, live and learn I guess.


I did start on 200 EW but doubled it up - was on 800mg Test Enth and 400 mg Tren Enth on that blast EW. No euphoria atall.

had a good training buzz....too fuking good at times - honestly keep your weights lower than you can press, I hurt myself a bit launching big weights up week on week:thumbup1:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Uriel, it is 400mg Test and 200mg Tren, enth.
> 
> TBH, I know I'm just being a fvcking whinging [email protected] atm. Just need to snap out of it.
> 
> ...


*No - you really wouldn't know where you were then at all! Duh!*

*
*

*
Feleing hungrier is an initial sign the Tren is working. Are you getting night sweats and lurid dreams?*

*
*

*
Maybe you need a stronger dose...*

*
*


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> *No - you really wouldn't know where you were then at all! Duh!*
> 
> *
> *
> ...


Yeh, them dreams are manic:thumb:night sweats a pain though:rolleyes:

Did you enjoy the finals Prov??

Agree with zack khan winning overall?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Oh god stuff I'd forgotten about tren - the dreams and the appetite... And it's only been a month or so.

I miss tren.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Actually, now I think of it my dreams are a bit weird at the moment. Wouldn't say lurid, but this afternoon I was in Tron. Not what a normal man dreams about lol

I do seem to have a higher body temperature but it's more constant raise than specifically at nights.

I could double up but would need either 2 injections or find bigger barrels. TBH I would rather just stick at this for a while and see how it goes for a few weeks. I've had no sides as of yet, but the last thing I need is to be on 400mg test enth and find out my body doesn't like it.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Yeh, them dreams are manic:thumb:night sweats a pain though:rolleyes:
> 
> Did you enjoy the finals Prov??
> 
> Agree with zack khan winning overall?


Hi! - yes great day - some awesome competitors and very close judging!

Some of us thought that Shaun should have got overall!

Did you have a good time? 

Long drive but well worth it - knackered now and off to bed soon...


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Didn't go Prov, saw the pics on MT, looked like a great day, good night mate:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheered up now after reading Jamie's thread.

I always did like Warrior :thumb:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Didn't go Prov, saw the pics on MT, looked like a great day, good night mate:thumbup1:


Hoped we hadn't missed or ignored each other! :thumb:


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris stop expecting miracles and relax mate. There is the placebo affect feeling I believe some experience where they believe, want and then act upto it feeling something way more than what they probably are.

Give it time to work buddy, lifts should be start going up and if diet clean some good lean gains will be coming on. Unless you doing orals like dbol you wont see drastic changes which are water anyway with dbol. Keep injecting, eat like a pig and get on with your training and let it happen.

What brand you using?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Pro labs, Tri test and tren enth.

I know what you mean. When you hear all these stories though you just get carried away. Especially on first cycle when you aren't really sure what to expect.

Already looking forward to my next jab though on the 21st. Will do it while at work, sneak away, and then ashore for some nice tucker and a walk to get it worked in!!


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

I find the whole gear thing very subtle mate. after years of natty training - some weeks were tough, some were a complete buzz and I was feeling unreal...that's just the way it was...

Now on tren or whatever, you start having a really good sesh, bamg on an extra pair of plates and rep the p1ss out of them - then think yeah great session....then it happens again and again and it's like fuk yeah....I'm on gear.

That's when it amazes me but it's no more than that.

Tren's big ace is the way it changes your body and for me it wen on a couple of months off it too.


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Pro labs, Tri test and tren enth.
> 
> I know what you mean. When you hear all these stories though you just get carried away. Especially on first cycle when you aren't really sure what to expect.
> 
> Already looking forward to my next jab though on the 21st. Will do it while at work, sneak away, and then ashore for some nice tucker and a walk to get it worked in!!


My first 3 courses I only did injectible no orals. Deca and Sust.

I recall getting my jab at a local doctors and I swear by the time I reached the door I felt awesome, natty men in the street were starting to look inferior!!! :lol: Delusion at it's best!!

That night at gym I went mental on the weights.... amasing what a little placebo affect and want to believe can do..... :thumbup1:

Though I did make incredible gains off that course and gained upto about 8kg whilst on if I recall right. Dose about 200mg each I think?? But also only weighed about 75kg's. Dont know if there is a recomened formula on optimal test dose required for lean body mass?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Liking the posts guys, keeps me in a sense of reality.

I think its just waiting for it to kick in Uriel that's all, bit of impatience.

Massive sweats today with my afternoon sleep, hope it's the Tren and not something else.

Woke up this morning in the sh1ttiest mood ever, I have never been that p1ssed off with the world in my life, went to breakfast like a man possessed. God knows what was up with me, soon passed though and had a really nice morning in the end.

Had a wedding coupld up on the bridge with the brides kids, said I made there day which is always nice to hear :thumb:

One of the kids is autistic, I've always had alot of time for kids like that, really brightens me up when they are happy and enjoying themselves. Reminded me of when I worked with kids who had Cerebal Palsey, happy days.

Did squats today, my knees and hips are sh*gged, but I found a way to work round it so I can squat relatively pain free.

My legs were way to wide, which is fine for PL but it kills my hips. So brought my feet to shoulder width and stayed above parallel, jobs a good 'un.

Needed more weight on the bar though, just wasn't sure what I could do. Got some really sh1tty looks in the gym doing extensions as I was nearly crying going to failure.

Normal trainers really don't get it do they!

*Squats*

12 x bar

12 x 60kg

12 x 100kg

5 x 12 x 120kg Effort = 6/10

*Leg extensions*

3 x full stack to failure. Effort = 9/10

Thought I would start adding in effort now in memory of Tall, also a good way of checking what I need to do with weights.


----------



## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

"I recall getting my jab at a local doctors and I swear by the time I reached the door I felt awesome, natty men in the street were starting to look* interior*!!! Delusion at it's best!!"

They looked like centre, heart etc??? :whistling: Oh and yes i used a Thesauraus.....

Proof read TS, proof read :beer:


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

fats said:


> "I recall getting my jab at a local doctors and I swear by the time I reached the door I felt awesome, natty men in the street were starting to look* interior*!!! Delusion at it's best!!"
> 
> They looked like centre, heart etc??? :whistling: Oh *andy *yes i used a Thesauraus.....
> 
> Proof read TS, proof read :beer:


I dont need to apologies.. I was hungover yesterday and tired!! :lol: :lol:

But you see now what I mean with delusion at it's best. :laugh:

P.S. ( who's andy ? )

proof read fats, proof read!! :lol:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> *Squats*
> 
> 12 x bar
> 
> ...


Sorry mate, anything less than all out effort then you may as well fvcking give

up, 6/10 is simply sh1te mate, fook me I did 4 sets of 12 with 120 today, then

fst extensions, I couldn't walk and was actually nearly crying, gym owner kept

looking at me as if I was mental, after 5 mins rest I still managed to train

hams, calves and abs.

Cmon chris, you have the tools.................... 

Tel tells it like it is:thumb:


----------



## fats (Jun 15, 2008)

ROFLMFAO!!! I did, but i'm dyslexic...... Or just an arsé, or rather drunk :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know Tel, but given the fact that I nearly collapsed 2 weesk ago when I thought my hip blew, I was more interested in seeing if I was going to be able to do any, and also modifying the technique so I can squat at all.

If I can't squat then I am left with Leg extensions and curls.

You are correct though, normally 6/10 is sh1te and I would treat it with the contempt it deserves. Exactly why next week I shall have no less than 140kg on the bar and will be doing it till I pass out.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Another thing I noticed today, I was crazy out of breath doing squats. I mean inbetween sets I was blowing out of my ar5e.

Sounds weird, but it didn't feel like an unfit kind of thing, just really out of breath.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I know Tel, but given the fact that I nearly collapsed 2 weesk ago when I thought my hip blew, I was more interested in seeing if I was going to be able to do any, and also modifying the technique so I can squat at all.
> 
> If I can't squat then I am left with Leg extensions and curls.
> 
> You are correct though, normally 6/10 is sh1te and I would treat it with the contempt it deserves. Exactly why next week *I shall have no less than 140kg on the bar and will be doing it till I pass out*.


 :thumbup1:

Chris, after my 4th set today I couldn't walk, breath or see (sweat in eyes)

Fvking ace though:bounce:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I have seen some reports on Tren and how it can cause this reaction, especially when working out.

Would that be a reasonable explanation? I have never had it before so I don't see it could be anything else really.

You see, I, dissapointingly, can walk. Very faint DOMS, but certainly not what I expect from myself.


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I know Tel, but given the fact that I nearly collapsed 2 weesk ago when I thought my hip blew, I was more interested in seeing if I was going to be able to do any, and also modifying the technique so I can squat at all.
> 
> *If I can't squat then I am left with Leg extensions and curls.*
> 
> You are correct though, normally 6/10 is sh1te and I would treat it with the contempt it deserves. Exactly why next week I shall have no less than 140kg on the bar and will be doing it till I pass out.


What about leg press?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not on the ship mate. We only have a squat rack because I went out and bought it myself!


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Not on the ship mate. We only have a squat rack because I went out and bought it myself!


fvck!!! I hope you have a £1 coin box on the side to recover the money! :lol: :lol:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I have seen some reports on Tren and how it can cause this reaction, especially when working out.
> 
> Would that be a reasonable explanation? I have never had it before so I don't see it could be anything else really.
> 
> You see, I, dissapointingly, can walk. Very faint DOMS, but certainly not what I expect from myself.


Shortness of breath is a possible tren side

So is dry joints so there's something to look forward to, ie knees when squatting


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

cardio is difficult on tren imo, making love on tren is also difficult, felt like a heart attack was

imminent every time, the Mrs said my sex face was like something off a horror film :lol:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Sweats, grumpiness and shortness of breath?

The tren's kicing in well then... :thumb:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Sweats, grumpiness and shortness of breath?

The tren's kicing in well then... :thumb:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Worth repeating.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> Worth repeating.


Indeed.

Indeed.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Hey Prodiver, can I get you opinion on this? Click here.

Have you tried Static Contraction?

I did post it up and people gave their opinion but I wasn't asking their opinions...lol

I do know a guy that used if for a shoulder injury after sergery and just about kept most of his strength on Bench press.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> Hey Prodiver, can I get you opinion on this? Click here.
> 
> Have you tried Static Contraction?
> 
> ...


Hi! Wings - I'm going to watch the vids and give my opinion on what they say tomorrow.

Static contraction, properly performed, was certainly promoted by the Canadian Air Force since many years for its strength-building properties. But does it give mass increases? I did it when a teenager before I started weight training, but I was growing obscenely then anyway. So I must investigate further...


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Prodiver said:


> Hi! Wings - I'm going to watch the vids and give my opinion on what they say tomorrow.
> 
> Static contraction, properly performed, was certainly promoted by the Canadian Air Force since many years for its strength-building properties. But does it give mass increases? I did it when a teenager before I started weight training, but I was growing obscenely then anyway. So I must investigate further...


Cool, I am not sure if they talk about how to do it so here goes.

You stay with a weight you can hold in the 10-20 second range. When you go over 20 seconds you add weight.

If you do less than 10 seconds you reduce the weight.

Now here is the fun part, if you don't get stronger take one more day off. If you still don't get stronger take another day off.

When the guys start using really really heavy weights they are training (if memory serves) every 3 weeks and even longer.

What I do like about the approach is it pretty much eliminates over training, and I suspect most guys do that are natural.

I am one of those guys that likes to go heavy 8-12 rep range and add weight to the bar. As you know I am a H.I.T. type of guy, you like volume.

I did some volume about 3 years ago and will talk about that later..Thanks Patrick.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> Cool, I am not sure if they talk about how to do it so here goes.
> 
> You stay with a weight you can hold in the 10-20 second range. When you go over 20 seconds you add weight.
> 
> ...


Actually Wings I'm not a volume man - I've been a Mike Menzer Heavy Duty fan for years. I don't really regard 2 exercises of 3 working sets of 8-12 reps as volume in conventional training.

I find the videos persuasive, and especially in light of the Canadian Air Force manual, the (in)famous "Dynamic Tension", and the Bullworker, I find the static contraction principle very convincing.

I still want to know how good it is at producing mass increases, though its strength increases seem indisputable...


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Yea I tend to agree.

I thought you were a volume guy, nice to know we are now on the same page.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just snuck off to do my second jab.

simples, last one was 15 minutes, this took about 2, still very clean and careful, and took time on the injection part.

At point I panicked because I thought I had taken 400mg Tren and no test as I forgot to move the phial away when I'd finished and the colours didn't seem different.

Then I saw them start to separate so I was good to go, mixed it up and off I went.

Well I have that feeling back again. I may half the dose and do it twice a week, I love the feeling just after jabbing, it makes me feel like a superhero. Hopefully if the stuff is kicking in now that feeling with last.

Have the shakes though, which makes it a bit trickier, not sure whats wrong with me and why I am shaking.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Just snuck off to do my second jab.
> 
> simples, last one was 15 minutes, this took about 2, still very clean and careful, and took time on the injection part.
> 
> ...


Wouldn't bother mate, that feeling sort of wares off after a while and then its

like shelling peas:rolleyes:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ah well, worth an idea.

Feeling big and lean these days, had a look in the mirror this morning and I'm sure I'm thinning out a bit, not like me to be positive. Starting to feel a bit randy as well now.

Was a nightmare this morning, luckily I may have a little someone on hand :whistling:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Was a nightmare this morning, luckily I have a little hand :whistling:


Ok mate, bit too much info there:lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

lol, [email protected] 

Off to do delts in a minute, nothing less than 9/10 workout.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> lol, [email protected]
> 
> Off to do delts in a minute, nothing less than 10/10 workout.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You can never have 10/10 Tel, that would mean you could never improve, and everyone can improve.

Otherwise there would never be a chance if you being as big and strong as me  :whistling:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> You can never have 10/10 Tel, that would mean you could never improve, and everyone can improve.
> 
> Otherwise there would never be a chance if you being as big and strong as me  :whistling:


Bllx, you can always have 10/10 effort, and I never give any less no matter what

I'm doing

9/10 is for losers:tongue:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Caned it today, great workout, dead simples.

9/10, only way it could have been Tels imaginary 10/10 is if I'd had a spotter and gone failure.

However, seeing as I have no wish to injure myself, especially considering the other thread I went as close as poss to failure and to failure on the last exercise.

*Military press*

12 x bar

12 x 40kg

10 x 60kg

4 x 8 x 60kg

*Lat raises*

2 x 12 x 18kg

8 x 18kg, 2 x 18kg, 1 then 0.5 F @ 18kg

Should really be able to do more reps on the mp at 60kg, but I did push 100%. Now I will stick at that weight till I get 12 reps on all sets.

Best thing about shoulders is that you can hit all your shoulders with just 2 simple exercises, no need for over complication. Did consider throwing in and upright row, but just did more MP instead and saved my RC.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

tren and test made me super randy mate, hope your little someone likes c0ck (I'm sure he will knowing you sailors lol). I used to have a fuk at night, one in the morning then a [email protected] at its worse


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

lol. SHE is very partial to a piece.

It is raised slightly, however not nearly to the levels some people have reported.

Something to look forward to though


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Damn you're sexy. Sexy avvy, sexy workouts. Yum.

Don't jab twice a week because you WILL feel like a pin cushion and when it's only 2ml of long-estered gear, once a week is sufficient.

As others have said, tren wrecks your CV fitness. I noticed that massively the first time I used it, but during the blast I was much better.

Mmmm sexy. Can I grope you?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You been drinking?

I thought you'd fallen off the edge of the earth, but yes, grope away


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

No perfectly sober. And busy, this is the first time I've had time to get online properly since we came home on Monday! Speaking of online presence you never replied to my email from work the other week :crying:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Email me again Darren, I told you I deleted it by mistake.

Bried update, up to 19.5 stone now, and looking leaner I think. Pics will be up ASAP.

Just feel a little bloated, so will hopefully be able to sort out soon.

Thats 273lbs or about 124kg's.

So in answer to your rep Saffir boy, alot more awesome than you


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> lol. SHE is very partial to a piece.
> 
> It is raised slightly, however not nearly to the levels some people have reported.
> 
> Something to look forward to though


I found the tren supressive, sort of countered the test, so not as horny as test

only, once I'd come off the tren though it was "Thunderbirds are go" :thumb:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Looking forward to the pics mate :thumbup1:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

pastanchicken said:


> Looking forward to the pics mate :thumbup1:


If they ever appear........................................... :whistling:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> If they ever appear........................................... :whistling:


Good point, don't let us down big man :cool2:


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Email me again Darren, I told you I deleted it by mistake.
> 
> Bried update, up to 19.5 stone now, and looking leaner I think. Pics will be up ASAP.
> 
> ...


Why you filthy fvcking ar$e eating bastard!!!!! :cursing: :cursing:

That's a good effort mate, you seem to have shot right up since we last discussed weight. I bet looking back now since you started you can see it's working hey?

I'm currently 114.5kg's...... :confused1:

EDIT : in lbs that's 18.030663585861 - Dont forget the .030663585861 it counts! :lol:

P.S. ( How much water do you drink before you weigh yourself? :whistling: )


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

TaintedSoul said:


> P.S. ( How much water do you drink before you weigh yourself? :whistling: )


Thats a good point TS, weight should always be first thing on waking imo, consistent reading then.

I've weighed myself in the morning and weighed 15/7 and at early evening, same scales

16 stone, although it was a cheat day

Just goes to show though, 273lbs is a monster weight, how much is water retention:whistling:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

2.5 gallons. 

To be honest though, my BF is still to high, that is my one falling down point, although it is getting better.

So, here are the pics, be kind, I can see the weak points, my waist is massive, my BF is to high, I lack definition in my chest.

However, back is still a strong point I think, as I lean out I think that will look good.

I will defend myself in saying that I do not believe pics do me justice, most people who meet me say I look a lot bigger in real life, and leaner as well.

For some reason I cannpt get pictures to give a fair representation. I mean, I'm not trying to say I really have abs and the camera hides them, but I think I do look better.

I will fling in some more front shots when I have time, legs and tri's as well. Just a bit stretched at the moment, only did these because Tel called me out.

These are only 30 mins after food as well!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

To be honest Tel, alot I reckon, or just good old plain fat.

If I leaned to Shauns BF there wouldn't be much in it.

I think Sean and I have very similar physiques, same height, sameish weight. Only difference I reckon is that I am very very mesomorphic, where as he has to eat like a barsteward to stay big, I hardly eat a thing!


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> Thats a good point TS, weight should always be first thing on waking imo, consistent reading then.
> 
> I've weighed myself in the morning and weighed 15/7 and at early evening, same scales
> 
> ...


Yeah I only weigh myself first thing in the morning after all the body movements have been completed to get as close to a raw value as possible.

The evening weigh in is for personnel comedy value, how much can the scale can say but it's never the figure I quote on here as it can 2 or more kg's heavier.



Chris1 said:


> To be honest Tel, alot I reckon, or just good old plain fat.
> 
> If I leaned to Shauns BF there wouldn't be much in it. <- That's spelt Sean
> 
> I think Sean and I have very similar physiques, same height, sameish weight. Only difference I reckon is that I am very very mesomorphic, *where as he has to eat like a barsteward to stay bi*g, I hardly eat a thing!


Yip, force feeding, huge meals with weight gainer drink on top to get in the calories. Painful!!! though these days I'm more endo than ecto like I was my entire life. Used to be a fvcking string bean with a pip on top!!

I find on all my courses I always lean up nicely in fact I often feel the gains stop as I reach a certain weight around 6 weeks but then I lean out nicely so it's a give and take really.. out with the fat and in with the muscle, so the gains havent really stopped. Keep diet clean and the rest will happen.

You got a good back there Chris, bring in that waist line and it'll look even bigger. rear double bi shot looks good.

Throw in some early morning cardio+eca stack oen or two days. Can only help fitness when pushing the weights I find.

I've seen you in person and you have a big presence mate. Probably even bigger now. :thumb:

I'm going to continue stuffing my face now...... roast chicken, mash potatoe and two scoops of nlarge2!!


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Yum! I think i need a towel . . That's just made a boring day in the office a lot better! Yes you look bigger and leaner in real life looking forward to the leg pics


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Looking big mate, as you say, back is defo you're best asset at the mo. But definition in chest etc will no doubt come on with this cycle.

Onwards and upwards mate!! :thumbup1:


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Good job Chris, you look good. Actually when you said your weight, I thought you would have higher bodyfat than that.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

winger said:


> I thought you would have higher bodyfat than that.


Agreed


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers for the comments guys. I know my flaw is BF, I can feel the definition there all around, it's just a case of tidying up. Cardio needs to be added frequently if i am to make the most of this.

My diet is good now, clean. Only 3 big meals a day though going on Patrick's advice and I am responding well to it. I can't do the whole force feeding thing and TBH it has never worked for me in the past. This meal plan works great with my schedule and my life atm.

I need to start forcing myself up in the mornings to get that fasted cardio in though, when I think back to maybe a year ago, everyone on here was taking the p1ss as I was doing 3 cardio sessions a day, 1 hour each! Obviously that was overkill.

I'm going to stick with the HIIT as it is quick and easy and I enjoy it and the cardio benefits. I was considering ECA and all that jazz but I consulted with Winger and Patrick and they convinced me that it wasn't necessary as I could do it without, plus I've never really responded well to them in the past.

Lets see if I can get the magic 20 stone and look leaner, that is what I would call a succesful cycle, maybe adventurous, but you gotta have a goal!!


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Honest opinion

Looking good I'd say:thumb:

Double bi is best shot, lighting is probably wrong as well, makes a big difference:thumb:

If I was to make one or two points it would be more trap work needed and

where's your fcking legs:rolleyes: :whistling:



Nice one Chris:thumbup1:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll do legs when I do a front double bi.

didn't have a lot of time or space to work in, I'll leave them up anyways as a pre cycle comparison. Not sure how often I'll do the pics, probably not every week though.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

fuk me chris - you'll be a big dude when you really stick the meat on.

3 big meals a day sound sh1t IMO but suck it and see. It's never benefited me when I've had to do it (better than 3 days with no food when I've had to do that too though) - 4 minimum IMO

Don't sweat the bf for a while I'd say, you're not that fat and the more muscle you get on - the bigger the engine to burn it when you cut.

I'd leave pics now til end of cycle for a good comparison


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I do have a shake in there as well, and I will have smaller "meals" when I am hungry. Just the 3 big ones though, Brekkie, lunch and dinner.

The only thing that sucks is trying to get food that is good for you. All our food is catered for Passengers, and lets just say I can count on one hand the ones that are worried about calories. So I just have to make do, some meals it is just cold cuts.

Today was Turkey meatball day though, with Broccoli.........today was a good day :thumb:

Think you've got it right with the pics, wait till the end. Would be good if s*EA*n could stick a few up on here as well for comparison and give me something to aim for??


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Why would Ts's pics give you something to aim for, thats a falsity mate, aim for what you

want to achieve, not what others have.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Because it's motivation for me. I always respond better when pushed.

He's only and inch shorter and the same build, so I figure he's a decent comparison.

Plus, it'll make Darrens day as well. 2 sets of pics from big dudes, I can see his smile now


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

but you set your self up for a fall, if you look like him then you'll say ok I did it, but if you don't

look like him it will demotivate you and you'll give up and go back to your ex 

I'm same size as JW, should I aim for his physique?

Just trying to offer you an alternative to comparing yourself to others, which in my eyes

is plain daft 

Edit: Actually I'm half an inch bigger than JW


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Yeah come on Sean get your títs out for the lads.

Looking shexi Chris - I'm looking forward to the end photos. You saw the difference that test and tren made to me so you will do well.

And I e-mailed you today but you never mailed back :crying:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I did, I even said loverboy in it, maybe it'll be there in the morning.

Tel, you're right mate, be the best you can be, and anyway, by the end of this cycle I'll need those Cutler pics for comparison :whistling:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I did, I even said loverboy in it, maybe it'll be there in the morning.
> 
> Tel, you're right mate, be the best you can be, and anyway, by the end of this cycle *I'll need those Cutler pics for comparison* :whistling:


Dat a boy:thumbup1:

Chris, are you planning on competing in the next year or two?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You know what Tel, that thought would have never entered my head until I was driving back from London with Zara. I have always believed that:

1. I aint big enough

2. I don't have the genetics

3. I would never be able to be strict in my diet

4. I would never be able to inject gear (whoops)

Zara just mentioned that I would be able to diet, if I had a show and I had to, just kind of motivates you to do it.

So, it is definately a very strong thought at the moment, depending how points 1 and 2 work out. I know I'm big, but I'm not sure I could get big enough.

Genetics, I don't think I have them TBH, but then again I have seen lots of people say that and still be decent am's.

FFS, here I go again, I talk myself out of the running before I've even started.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

cool mate with shakes/bars etc,you don't need much food in between your main ones- just a hand full of nuts, mouthfull of salmon/chicken or even a pint of milk etc

just though you were going like 8 or more hours with nothing


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

fuk genetics mate - I think you'll be surprised what a few tren cycles a lot of good food and a years hard training will do to you.......play the long game mate,


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> You know what Tel, that thought would have never entered my head until I was driving back from London with Zara. I have always believed that:
> 
> 1. I aint big enough
> 
> ...


I should bloody well slap you, but I'm no better....... :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Beklet said:


> I should bloody well slap you, but I'm no better....... :lol: :lol: :lol:


Hmm.....................


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Uriel said:


> cool mate with shakes/bars etc,you don't need much food in between your main ones- just a hand full of nuts, mouthfull of salmon/chicken or even a pint of milk etc
> 
> just though you were going like 8 or more hours with nothing


No no, I have about 25kg of Almonds I bought when they were going cheap lol,I have them all round the ship so wherever I am I always have something.

I could do with getting the Cassein back in before bed though :thumbup1:



Uriel said:


> fuk genetics mate - I think you'll be surprised what a few tren cycles a lot of good food and a years hard training will do to you.......play the long game mate,


Very good advice mate, I have been very careful with this. A few people have reccomended upping the dose, and starting on a higher dose. My thinking was no point in rushing in, especially if something like Tren doesn't agree with you. In hindsightI would probably have started with Tren ACE if I'd done a little more research, for that very fact.

If after week 5 I feel good and am not seeing the kind of gains I would expect then I may double up as you did



Beklet said:


> I should bloody well slap you, but I'm no better....... :lol: :lol: :lol:


How's about I slap you instead, now what could I have to hand that would be a suitable tool to slap you with :whistling:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nooooooo step away from the ace, it's worse for sides. And cough.

Competing is not out of the realms of the possible. You know that it's harder for tall guys to build mass but equally we've seen it time and again - look at Noah Steere FFS, he's 6' 7"!! So you could do it if you want to. As long as I can apply your tan and oil.

Left work at 5, no mail.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

even though tren made a a bit sharky, i'll do it again (had 20ml in the stash for months). I love it despite the sides. I'll probably do at least 500mg EW - my goal is to step onstage 2010 or 11 so I'm on a mission.

You need a wee bit more self belief bro.

Don't think this is doable don't even knd of know it's achievable....just do it through laser beam focused determination


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I don't think I could live with the guilt trip if I didn't let you and Beks do it!!

Ace is a bit nastier, BUT it has a much shorter half life and so if it doesn't agree with you it is out a lot quicker. Pro's and Con's I guess,

Lou Ferrigno to me was the daddy, I wouldn't say it was the greatest physique, but it truley was immense. 6ft 5ins, 300lbs in contest shape, still the heaviest man to set foot on an Olympia stage. Imagine he was competeing now, 315lbs 325 maybe!!

I did initially look at classic class, but I think when Patrick and I worked it out I would have had to be 99kg, which like I said a few pages back, that would need amputation!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You would not suit the classics. You would suit being fooking huge. If I'm not wrong, Daz Ball and Zack Khan are both about 6 foot, so you know you can do it.

Oh and I love tren and can't wait to get back on it. Deca first though.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> ...
> 
> Ace is a bit nastier, BUT it has a much shorter half life and so if it doesn't agree with you it is out a lot quicker. Pro's and Con's I guess.../QUOTE]
> 
> ...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Uriel said:


> even though tren made a a bit sharky, i'll do it again (had 20ml in the stash for months). I love it despite the sides. I'll probably do at least 500mg EW - my goal is to step onstage 2010 or 11 so I'm on a mission.
> 
> You need a wee bit more self belief bro.
> 
> Don't think this is doable don't even knd of know it's achievable....just do it through laser beam focused determination


You know, I have always had self confidence issues. I always joked on that I was this and that, but I never really thought of myself as anything particularly good, but recently, I dunno, something is changing.

I would have said the gear, but it was starting before that, I actually do think something of me now, I am starting to see me as someone who stands out from the crowd

...and I fecking love it 

As long as I stop it from becoming arrogance, I'll be a happy man:thumbup1:

Then again, I would fully expect people on here to keep me well in check should that ever happen.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> I will be Paddy, I mentioned it as in "in hindsight" before I knew I could handle it, it may have been a safer option for someone doing it first time.
> 
> I shall be sticking with what I have, but maybe just using a little bit more


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> You know what Tel, that thought would have never entered my head until I was driving back from London with Zara. I have always believed that:
> 
> 1. I aint big enough
> 
> ...


In short

TBH mate, you cant say

Its all about mental attitude and will power

Some people have great genetics, but cant diet for sh1t because too lazy

Others cant be consistant with training..

Others have great genetics and will power but fear failure so will never even try

Flip side, some people are delusional PMSL

It would be my suggestion to get a date of a comp and start preparing like you would..

People stress too much thinking that if they decide to do it they have to do it or let people down blah blah blah

Pick a comp, start preparing

You may find its not for you or you may love it

either way dont put yourself under pressure..

Come nearer time, if happy how look and comfortable, go for it other wise dont put yourself thro something you wont enjoy

If you dont put pressure on yourslef it will make it easier

Saying that, a comp prep will help your progress no end in many ways


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Agree with Joe. If nothing else, it will tell you if you have the mental cojones to do it - reading the prep journals around here, it never fails to surprise me just how hard a contest prep is.

As for the confidence... Well, you're bigger, you look better, you can do things that most people around you can't do, you're getting more looks and approving glances.... Of course your confidence is improving. Fúcking great, innit? :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> You would not suit the classics. You would suit being fooking huge. If I'm not wrong, Daz Ball and Zack Khan are both about 6 foot, so you know you can do it.
> 
> Oh and I love tren and can't wait to get back on it. Deca first though.


And both thoroughly nice blokes and great role models! :thumbup1:

I can do it, the only sh1tty thing is the equipment I have, but there is always a way, even if on the next ship I have to order in myself again.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> You would not suit the classics. You would suit being fooking huge. If I'm not wrong, Daz Ball and Zack Khan are both about 6 foot, so you know you can do it.
> 
> Oh and I love tren and can't wait to get back on it.* Deca first though.*


funny how things go with us mate, similar time on and gear course. i did a tren blast 6 week cruise deca test (just finished) need to cruise for at least a couple of moths now but next blast will be a trener again:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So Joe/other people, I am still very naive to this.

When you decide you're going for it, do you just continue on with getting massive, till you reach a good size, and then pick a comp and diet down for it?

Or do you pick a comp and then bulk and cut for that date?

If you get what I mean?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Uriel said:


> funny how things go with us mate, similar time on and gear course. i did a tren blast 6 week cruise deca test (just finished) need to cruise for at least a couple of moths now but next blast will be a trener again:thumbup1:


Separated at birth? :lol: Nice doses I'll be using too... How did you find the deca? I hear it's good for mass... Then next year, I'm banging in the tren like it's going out of fashion.


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> So Joe/other people, I am still very naive to this.
> 
> When you decide you're going for it, do you just continue on with getting massive, till you reach a good size, and then pick a comp and diet down for it?
> 
> ...


Depends on time scale

Baiscally i would allow 16 weeks for a prep

That would start with cleaning up diet, sorting out consitant training etc etc..

Then depending on how fat you are adjust diet and energy expenditure week by week to halt or slow progress

You would def need someone experienced to check progress 1st time, make sure doing enough or not doing too much etc etc

Aas and other things are whole new thing again


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Uriel said:


> funny how things go with us mate, similar time on and gear course. i did a tren blast 6 week cruise deca test (just finished) need to cruise for at least a couple of moths now but next blast will be a trener again:thumbup1:


Darren/Uriel.

Whats the logic behind Deca if you know and love Tren?

Is it just a change to see how you like it?


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Separated at birth? :lol: Nice doses I'll be using too... How did you find the deca? I hear it's good for mass... Then next year, I'm banging in the tren like it's going out of fashion.


I shot 2 vials of PC Nadrotest 500 at about 1250 EW (and some mast enth for to try it really).

deca is a slow burner -don't expect too much for a month and a half - then it makes you very strong. I ate like fuk initially then started controlling it.

I'm very happy with the gains mate


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Darren/Uriel.
> 
> Whats the logic behind Deca if you know and love Tren?
> 
> Is it just a change to see how you like it?


I just wanted 1 blast away from tren to rest any body systems that it may have been hard on for safety (I'm aware I just said hardon)


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Darren/Uriel.
> 
> Whats the logic behind Deca if you know and love Tren?
> 
> Is it just a change to see how you like it?


For me, it's trying something new to see how I react to it, and saving a very powerful drug (tren) for the big blasts.



Uriel said:


> I shot 2 vials of PC Nadrotest 500 at about 1250 EW (and some mast enth for to try it really).
> 
> deca is a slow burner -don't expect too much for a month and a half - then it makes you very strong. I ate like fuk initially then started controlling it.
> 
> I'm very happy with the gains mate


Good-oh. I'm also using Nandrotest 500 but I'll be shooting 1500mg PW. Again, 2 vials so 7 weeks. I also have some quality oralage with it.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> For me, it's trying something new to see how I react to it, and saving a very powerful drug (tren) for the big blasts.
> 
> Good-oh. I'm also using Nandrotest 500 but I'll be shooting 1500mg PW. Again, 2 vials so 7 weeks. *I also have some quality oralage with it*.


that'll be Oxy:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

jw007 said:


> Depends on time scale
> 
> Baiscally i would allow 16 weeks for a prep
> 
> ...


So 16 weeks would be the cut I imagine.

I mean, I could cut now, but I would be no-where near a good enough size. Pretty unsure as to how long it would take to get to a size ready to cut. I guess this cycle would at least by an indication.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

That's interesting. I always figured that Bor PL just found something that they liked and stuck with it. Tren can be pretty tough on you though, so it does make sense to shift to something else for a while.

Does anyone have any idea what doseages someone like say, an Olympian would be running? More for interest than anything else.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Uriel said:


> that'll be Oxy:thumbup1:


Nope. MST, and we all saw how Chris reacted to that.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Nope. MST, and we all saw how Chris reacted to that.


Top stuff, although I am the fist to admit that I didn't do it enough justice as I wasn't eating enough at the time.

Just be careful with the beers. It was fine for me for a while, but then I got a bit silly and it let me know.

How long are you using it for?


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Bump


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Just 7 weeks. I go to Berlin again 7 weeks today and I start on Sunday. Might start the orals tomorrow.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I wouldn't bother mate. Just do it all at the same time, easier to keep track of.

Although with the orals it shouldn't be such a trauma. I did 2 a day, one after breakfast and one at night.

I would have to think long and hard about orals again in the future, they were ok but not a wholey pleasant experience. That was my own fault though.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

See, I've had no bother on orals and I've used a range now. Hardly any sides.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just my bloody liver thats all. SAying that, it was fine when I was at home, just when I was away it acted up!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Change of routine/food/water?

It's all about experimentation - find a steroid that works for you.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I think I may just have done that.

Pizza is on you in Jan 

Well, not ON you, I mean you will.......oh nevermind!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Admit it Chris, you want to eat it off my sexy, hairy body. Well, you can but you'll have to fight Matt.

Don't be afraid to experiment with other steroids though.


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Think you've got it right with the pics, wait till the end. * Would be good if sEAn could stick a few up on here as well for comparison and give me something to aim for??*


I could do you. You know in our PM's I have encouraged me and you get some ompetition going between us to spur us on as our stats are simliar.

Do you want me posting my awesomeness here or should I put them in my profile for you to view?

(I've shot myself in the d!ck now havent I :confused1: )



tel3563 said:


> Why would Ts's pics give you something to aim for, thats a falsity mate, aim for what you
> 
> want to achieve, not what others have.


Competition is healthy if it's freindly. Failure is only failure when you lose and except it and dont try harder! i can see Chris doing extremelly well over the next year or two!



Chris1 said:


> You know what Tel, that thought would have never entered my head until I was driving back from London with Zara. I have always believed that:
> 
> 1. I aint big enough
> 
> ...


Yeah mate, fvcking hell you are your own worse enemy whereas everyone is encouraging you here.

Add me to the list for someone thinking you should prep for a comp. I think you could do well with the right coach.

Though do you want to weigh 99kg's ripped doing classics? I'd rather aim for 120kg's ripped.

What's your current bodyfat do you know?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ordering calipers as we speak. Maybe no use for accurate measurements, but at least I can get a trend.

Throw them up in here mate. Why not, we can get a little friendly banter going if nothing else. I work better with a little encouragement.

Not a snowball in hells chance I could be 99kg mate, if I'm doing it, I'm doing it MASSIVE. 120kg's ripped would be a nice start, but it aint gonna win me feck all at my height. I'm thinking into the 130 are might be necessary if I was to make a dint, although I'm not entirely sure what respectable amateurs come in at,

who wants to be a respectable amateur though? :tongue:

As for shooting yourself in the d1ck, it makes hell of a difference from your d1ck shooting some other poor b*stard in the a55 like it normally does


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Ordering calipers as we speak. Maybe no use for accurate measurements, but at least I can get a trend.
> 
> Throw them up in here mate. Why not, we can get a little friendly banter going if nothing else. I work better with a little encouragement.
> 
> ...


Yeah 130kg's more than likely what you would need. I think KingProp is our height and he competes at that? 125 to 130kg's. That's alot of meat to pack on. blast/cruise perhaps and look into growth and slin down the line maybe?

Might post some pics for you tomorrow....


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I've never even heard of him lol.

If I'm 124kg now, then I think that would look pretty awesome as a ripped weight and size. Although I hold my hands up to being baffled by the whole fat/weight thing.

If muscle is denser than fat, then to be 124kg ripped I will be alot smaller than I am now surely? At the moment I'm not big enough to get out there, so if I rip up I will be even smaller??

TBH Sean I know we chatted about slin but I haven't even begun to look at things like that, but defo down the line. I've had brief chats with people about growth, but defo more research is needed with that.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> I've never even heard of him lol.
> 
> If I'm 124kg now, then I think that would look pretty awesome as a ripped weight and size. Although I hold my hands up to being baffled by the whole fat/weight thing.
> 
> ...


It's all about the illusion - they look massive on stage but being ripped makes you look bigger than being chubby 

Face it, some of the blokes in the 70kg class look quite big, but they all weigh less than me :lol:


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I've never even heard of him lol.
> 
> If I'm 124kg now, then I think that would look pretty awesome as a ripped weight and size. Although I hold my hands up to being baffled by the whole fat/weight thing.
> 
> ...


Trust me if you weighed 124kg's ripped you would being looking freaky!! Muscle would be in all the right places which as Beks said it's creates an illusion.

There is a chap at my gym, alot leaner than me and I honestly thought he was simliar weight though I do always think I'm thinner than I am. Anyway turns out he's about 100kg's. Definitely looks alot bigger than that. :thumb:

Like I say to one of my best mates, unless it's muscle do we really want it jsut for the sake of weighing more? All I want is to be as heavy as possible around 10 to 12% bodyfat. So got a bit of work to do. :thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You and me to Morphie.

Guess I'll have to be ripped to find out what it'll look like. Best get that cardio in lol.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

dc55 said:


> Genetics = load of boll0x mainly. You think ALL bb'ers have supreme genetics? NO
> 
> Tren will change your body composition amazingly.


What about a guy with good genetics and even better genetics on Tren?

Genetics yes, but some guys explode on gear. That's the true genetics, the guys that respond way to well on gear. IMO


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

winger said:


> What about a guy with good genetics and even better genetics on Tren?
> 
> Genetics yes, but some guys explode on gear. That's the true genetics, the guys that respond way to well on gear. IMO


^^^^^

But unless he can physically and mentally handle the dieting and sacrifices is irrelevant


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

jw007 said:


> ^^^^^
> 
> But unless he can physically and mentally handle the dieting and sacrifices is irrelevant


That leaves me out, too many beers and too much weed.....ooopsie

It's the late night binge eating that's all...lol

Joe, why do you always have to put sh1t back into perspective. :cursing:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

winger said:


> That leaves me out, too many beers and too much weed.....ooopsie
> 
> diet coke and vodka, weed reduces test
> 
> ...


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

My take on weed reducing tes levels.

The body probably will, but the body is very resilient and makes adaptations if you will. So if guys change up routines to keep the body guessing as well as carb cycling, don't you think the body will adapt to weed?

I feel like slapping you now, but I would probably roughen up my hands on that manly 5 o'clock shadow..lol

Now, if you were to say my high bf lowers tes levels, then we wouldn't have a debate. :beer:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

winger said:


> My take on weed reducing tes levels.
> 
> The body probably will, but the body is very resilient and makes adaptations if you will. So if guys change up routines to keep the body guessing as well as carb cycling, don't you think the body will adapt to weed?
> 
> ...


Weed reduces test, but heavy training increases it

who knows

Injecting test makes it negligeable:lol: :lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

jw007 said:


> Weed reduces test, but heavy training increases it
> 
> who knows
> 
> Injecting test makes it negligible:lol: :lol:


LOL :lol: :lol:

Next you will be telling me to take some Nolva while getting high...lol

Joe, I gota say on a public board that you are the best, fcuk you are so like-able.

One of these days I want to meet you again, not in a dark alley though, in a pub. :beer:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Vegas is on my hit list so who knows


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

jw007 said:


> Vegas is on my hit list so who knows


I am there, you name the time and date and I will be there. Geranteed, but if I have to wipe your ass it's going to cost you..lol


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I feel like sh1t this morning. My chest is so heavy and it is hard breathing.

Not sure whats up with that, hopefully it will shift before lunch and the gym. Was out of breath when I walk 150m this morning.

Joe: you're bang on mate, mentally is the big one for me, I need that bit more confidence to know I can do it. Hopefully that will keep coming and I will be in a good frame of mind.

Physically, well thats out of my hands, all I can do is eat and train like a b*stard and grow to my maximum size.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I feel like sh1t this morning. My chest is so heavy and it is hard breathing.
> 
> Not sure whats up with that, hopefully it will shift before lunch and the gym. Was out of breath when I walk 150m this morning...


Tren can do that - just persevere...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, I feel better now, just when I first woke up, felt like back when I used to smoke.

Looking forward to a killer back session and then some good HIIT as well afterwards.

Getting some great advice from some very experienced people, means alot guys, got to knuckle down and do the hard work now.

I think once my body starts changing again and I get a little leaner and start seeing results it will puch me on even further. Exciting times for lil ol' me


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Yeah, I feel better now, just when I first woke up, felt like back when I used to smoke.
> 
> Looking forward to a killer back session and then some good HIIT as well afterwards.
> 
> ...


They are the key words right there mate:thumbup1: Its not rocket science


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I have the tools


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Just got a look at your recent pics.

There is a lot more muscle there than you are giving yourself credit for, and what the pics don't show due to lack of scale is that at 6ft 3 you will be a very imposing sight, and as wide as a house.

No, your frame isnt as full as it would be if you were, say, 5ft 11 at a similar wieght, so you probably feel you arent big enough but i don't agree.

Nobody ever thinks they are big enough, and, at the end of the day, you can always get a bit bigger - so what do you do - keep chasing your tail, getting bigger, but still never feeling big enough?

Or bit the bullet, set a goal, and look better+bigger for getting shredded anyway?

Remember you aren't commited to doing the show in actuality until your foot steps on stage, so you can always back out of you don't come in quick enough - there is always a get out clause - but by aiming and PROVSIONALLY commiting to the show, you give yourself a date, you make yourself HAVE to get your sh1t in order.

For my first show, right up until 4am the morning of the show, I still wasn't sure I was doing it.

I def wasnt big enough, thats a fact, got outsized by a few guys in my lineup.

Still won tho' :thumbup1:

It is not all about size, it is not all about genetics - as has been said, many a big genetically gifted guy has fell by the wayside and never reached potential, simply because he ahs been lazy - or more commonly - his mind has went and he has bottled it.

What use are 20inch arms in bodybuilding competition, if they never make it to stage?

Its an amalgamation of things, some in your control, and some not.

And as cliched as it is, placings are largely irrelevant - no matter how good you are, someone better could always turn up and change the outcome. The main thing is that you can look at yourself in the mirror, and know you done the best you could at that point in time, thats all anyone can do, and if you have done that I cannot convey to you in words the feeling it will give you.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

thats a great post rs, reps when I'm reloaded mate


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Agree with Tel, great post. Makes me want it more. :thumb:

Thought I would quickly post up my training as it stands ATM.

Just working day on, day off.

*Chest and Tris*

Flat bench. Aiming for 5 sets 12 reps (not including warm up)

Flye's on chest press machine. 4 sets 12 reps

Tri Pushdowns. 3 x 12

Rope pulldowns 3 x 12

*Legs*

Squats. 5 x 12

Leg extensions. aim for 3 sets of failure

*Delts*

Military Press seated. 5 x 12

Lit raises. 3 x 12

*Back and Bi's*

Deads. 5 x 12

Lat pulldowns. 3 x 12

Wide grip rows. 3 x 12

Hammer curls. 3 x 12

DB curls. 3 x 12

As I said, day on day off, so it would be

Monday: Chest and Tris

Tuesday: rest

Wednesday: Legs

Thursday: rest

Friday: Delts

Saturday: rest

Sunday: Back and Bi's

Monday: rest

Tuesday: Chest and Tris

Going to be doing cardio at least every other day as well. HIIT.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Could be missing it, but I can't see any hamstring/calf work?

If there is one thing that can tip a show for you at first timer and novice level (and soemtimes even Mr level!!), its having big split hams, and rockhard glutes.

You can't ignore them IMO, I've seen too many awesome physiques, only for them to turn round for their rear poses, soft ar$e, soft up the back of the legs etc etc Yes i know this is largely a matter of bodyfat, but you still need something to push through, lumps n' bumps.

Brian an me both started hammering ours when we decided we wanted to compete, and pretty much brought them up to standout level in our respective lineups... although your squats/deads will hit them, I don't personally feel its enough...

I'd do some hamstring curls and some stiff leg deads on leg days personally, or, if you can handle it mentally, extend your training cycle further and put a dedicated hamstring/calf session in.

I can't comment on calfs specifically as I don't train mine but unless you have been gifted a set, you should be hitting them IMO


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

and one more wee pointer... this may cause a bit of arguement but IMO I'd give yourself 20 weeks for your first diet.

This is not because I think you are fat, far from it - but being your first time, you will almost certainly take a lot longer to hit your sweet spot than if you were experienced.

Even if you do hit it from the get go, having spare time in the pot is a great tool, allows you to experiment a bit with drying out and carbing up strategies etc

Spare time on a diet - better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I can't understand the delt only training, small muscle, yet you train chest, big muscle, with

tri's??

agree, not enough hams work, I know its in vogue not to do a lot in the gym but...........

Also traps work, if your tall you need to do more trap work that short bullish type, yet you

have none, not even rear delt work??

Imo needs a rethink


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> I can't understand the delt only training, small muscle, yet you train chest, big muscle, with
> 
> tri's??
> 
> ...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

TBH, this workout is a carry over from the one I was using when training for strength.

I work Tris with chest mainly as I use chest as a pre-fatigue, same with back and bi's. I have considered other possibilities, I even trialled switching it to back and tris and chest and bis, but that didn't work.

The other option as Tel does it I believe is Delts and Tri's and then Bi's somewhere else.

Chest is a big muscle, but I don't do as much now as I did. I dropped incline as I agreed with Patrick that it is mainly, or at least in my case, a Delt exercise. Maybe I could experiment with a shallower incline though. I definately want to get some dips back in there, elbow out ones, they were awesome for my chest. I think maybe the 3 of them with the flye's would be good. However that would be 14 sets. Too much???

Hams I could easily throw in Curls, I stopped them as they weren't necessary in the PL routine, but deffo a good idea here I think. Calfs might be a struggle. I was hoping they would be coveredd in squats, I could manufacture something with an Olly bar.

SLDL worry me, mainly because my lower back can't handle normal deads, worry how it would hold out against SLDL. I suppose an option is to keep the weight low and to up the reps, might help.

Traps is my fault, I should have had them in this week, I got myself all messed up as I was always doing them on back day, then I stopped them as heavy deads should have had them covered, then I went to re-start and someone mentioned hitting them on delts day also, so i am a bit baffled lol.

I think delt day would be a good plan actually as more time.

How does this look then

Chest: Flat, 5 x 12. Incline, 3 x 12. Dips, 3 x 12. Machine fly's, 3 x 12.

Legs: Squats, 5 x 12. SLDL (possibly) 3 x 12. Extensions, 3 x 12. Curls, 3 x 12.

Delts/Tris: Seated MP, 5 x 12. Seated Lat raises, 3 x 12. BB shrugs, 3 x 12. Tri pushdowns, 3 x 12. Rope Pulldowns, 3 x 12.

Back/Bis: Part Deads, 5 x 12 (depending on lower back). Palms in narrow grip Pulldowns, 3 x 12. Wide Grip rows, 3 x 12. Narrow Grip Rows, 3 x 12. Hammer curls, 3 x 12. Alternate DB curls, 3 x 12.

Any advice on that. Deads I would like to drop TBH, but I really don't know of another exercise that does so much. Bent over rows are an option I guess.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Back and Bi's just done.

Deads are just becoming a nuisance to me now. I literally can't move with lower back pain whenever I look at a bar. I managed a decent few sets and reps, more than I thought I would, but my lower back just shot out.

I am all for fighting through pain to get to where I need to be BUT I still have a job to do and this effects me for a long time afterwards and sometimes my work.

I did however have a little better luck when I adjusted and just came down to just below knee height with them. Sadly I don't have a rack so it was me stopping the momentum of the weight, but it did seem to alleviate some of the issues. Also takes the legs out of it.

*Deads/Partial Deads*

4 x 12 x 100kg Weight not a problem, crippled back was

*Narrow grip/Palms in Pulldowns*

3 x 12 x 85kg

*Wide grip rows*

12 x 75kg

8 x 75kg

12 x 70kg

*Hammer curls*

3 x 12 x 20kg

*DB curl machine*

3 x 12 x 47.5kg

Alot happier with form on these as well.

So next week new routine probably, and more gains definately


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

I assumed this was remnants of a primarily strength orientated routine.

If full deads are causing you bother, drop them, I don't care how good an exercise it is supposed to be. Try rack pulls which keep a lot of the back benefit, but ease up on the knees and lower back, or just drop them completely, there are other ways - and no one exercise is the universal king, no matter how many people repeat it parrot fashion :lol:

Stiff legged deads, the way I was talking, would be relatively light wieght, and focusing on rotating the pelvis by contracting the sh1t out of your hams - but if you have a lower back issue, just dont do it. Work up to heavy and intense on ham curls until its mended.

How do you feel about your rep range - seem to be aiming for 12 every time? Not saying its wrong, everyone is different - as long as you know its def working for you. When I am trying to drive on I usually keep 8 as my upper limit, 6 as my minimum for what I consider a full set where I am "allowed" to up the wieght lol. Might try some higher reps myself tho' for a change :thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I was using it as a basis that when I get all 3 sets for a full 12 reps I then up the weight, continue on at new weight till I reach 12 reps again and so on and so forth. not that I am in the least bit worried about how much weight I am shifting these days, it is all about form for me now and trying to develop that fabled mind-muscle connection.

I will try the Stiff legged deads. I think I saw them in Colemans DVD, you don't bring the bar to the floor either do you, stop just short. If I don't try I won't know!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ramsay got me thinking when he said it's hard to judge comparisons as to height and weight in my pics, as I am on my own.

So I dug out these photo's from the expo of me standing next to people you may (should) recognise. Helps to put it into perspective I think a bit better.

But jeez, looking at Alvins biceps, long way to go


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I'd drop the rep range whilst on the cycle, I'm only doing 12's for a change and to give my

muscles a rest from the HUGE weights I've been lifting. I'll drop the rep range as soon as I

go back onto blast.

Your wasting it imo.

Workout looks better, I struggle on deads and suffer from a worse back than yours mate, 30

years of bricklaying done that Its all about the form and keeping the rep range LOW. If its

mechanical then why would you put it through so many reps, doesn't matter what the weight is, I bet if you just did 12 dl's with bar only you'd get the same pain.

If you hate them (pussy:whistling just drop them mate, like rams said, plenty

other ways to skin a cat.

Just fooked my lats up doing bo rows underarm, first injury for as long as i can remember

Oh the pain:cursing:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Hams respond well to the 5 rep range.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ouch, sorry to hear that Tel, hope it's just a little strain and nothing major.

Tel, it happens to me all the time, I don't know what the problem is.

I say deads, but anything that involves just generally picking stuff up I am shot.

I really don't know what the problem is, maybe I am just succeptable to things like that.

You're bang on about the bar on it's own. Even when I just bend down to pick up something I've dropped on the floor it flares up.

Maybe there is a deeper issue that I don't know about.

I do agree though that quads, trips, doubles and singles are better for deads. I believe they do more for you, plus they are easier for me, so why not.

I'll try the 5's for hams Winger, would you reccomend that on Stiff legs and curls, or just the Stiff legs?

So what do you drop to Tel? Would you not consider the 8-12, or maybe even 8-15 rep range optimum for size? I really am not fussed about the strength side of things ATM, that will come naturally with size.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

If you're doing deads (regular or SL) drop the rep range. High reps on deads is not a good idea, though that is purely my opinion. But why the dodgy back all of a sudden?

Don't stress too much about the shortness of breath, as Patrick said it's entirely the tren. It will get better.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not all of a sudden, it's always happened. Well, since I started lifting anyway.

I will throw in hyperextensions on back day as well at the end I think, may help strengthen a bit.

The back goes on squats as well. It is probably a simple form issue that is exacerbating something that would not normally be a problem, who knows.

After doing deads today I do agree that the lower rep ranges feel a lot better and more beneficial than the higher stuff for deads. Unsure about stiff legged though, never really tried them with any real vigour TBH.


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Just got a look at your recent pics.
> 
> *There is a lot more muscle there than you are giving yourself credit for, and what the pics don't show due to lack of scale is that at 6ft 3 you will be a very imposing sight, and as wide as a house.*
> 
> ...


Excellent post Strachan :thumbup1:

As regards scale.... is a shame theres no pic of me and Chris at that night out in London as he is over a foot taller than me and as wide as a barn door pmsl. Poor bugger got folded up and driven down there in my wee corsa 



Chris1 said:


> Ramsay got me thinking when he said it's hard to judge comparisons as to height and weight in my pics, as I am on my own.
> 
> So I dug out these photo's from the expo of me standing next to people you may (should) recognise. Helps to put it into perspective I think a bit better.
> 
> But jeez, looking at Alvins biceps, long way to go


You're bigger than that now though? That was good number of months back


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, probably another inch on my arms. They better watch out lol.

Just strange that I don't think there is much difference in weight between me and say Alvin. Although I confess I don't know exactly how much he weighs. I doubt he is much bigger than 270 ish, any more than that and you're in Coleman terretory.

Yet he looks massive. I know people say its all an illusion, but Derren Brown couldn't pull that bad boy off lol.

Darren took those pics and he saw me at London so he may be the best person to comment. My BF has gone up since then though unfortunately, something that needs addressing. Got a little annoyed at myself recently when I saw the pics of London what a belly I've gained.

Still, tis all in hand!!


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Jeez bro you look like a gym pervo stalking sex offender in the pics....

yeah, drop the deads. I rarely do thm as I blew my L5 in 96.

I do the lightly when I feel ok but my toffee spine can get a bit craky an poppy anytime. lots of other ways to skin a cat


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> You know what Tel, that thought would have never entered my head until I was driving back from London with Zara. I have always believed that:
> 
> 1. I aint big enough
> 
> ...


Thank fvck I've finally been of some use to someone :lol:



jw007 said:


> In short
> 
> TBH mate, you cant say
> 
> ...


This is true.

I think Chris has the willpower, but I think he'd be a worrier. However many ppl are on 1st diet and this can have the effect of making them try harder and make more effort. 



jw007 said:


> It would be my suggestion to get a date of a comp and start preparing like you would..
> 
> People stress too much thinking that if they decide to do it they have to do it or let people down blah blah blah
> 
> ...


This is good advice.

If you think you want to try it, Pick a show and count back 16-20 weeks from show date to get the date you will need to start dieting.

You then know how much time you have til day one of diet.

From now to then keep diet clean ish so dont have too much fat to lose, and you will find you have extra focus and motivation in your training as you know you have a goal and deadline in mind.

As Ramsay said... you can pull out RIGHT up until the moment you walk out from behind that curtain. I've been in this situation myself.

I will say the first competion I ever did (NABBA Scotland) I was miles behind until about a month out. I was doing that whole "well if I'm not ready I just wont do it thing". Then Robert started going on at me in the gym.... "Listen babe.... if you can't manage it theres no shame in pulling out now you know.... I mean, its your first diet, you don't really know what you're doing, you had 3 months off training before you started and a lot to lose, you only gave yourself 12 weeks so everyone will understand if you pull out, theres no shame in it you know....." To which I thought "Fvck you.... You don't think I can do it!!!!" THEN my @rse got in gear and I reckon I was pretty much spot on for my class pmsl! The amount I lost in those 4 weeks was phenomenal.



jw007 said:


> If you dont put pressure on yourslef it will make it easier
> 
> Saying that, a comp prep will help your progress no end in many ways


This is also good advice. The rebound after comp is awesome :thumb:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Time for some ego stroking.

Chris there is a massive difference in you physically between May and when I saw you in the Cheese. Your chest and shoulders have really filled out. If you thought I was moist for you before.........

Joking aside though, you were noticeably bigger. You need to get up a photo from the Expo and a photo from the Cheese, god knows there's enough around that you could crop so that it's just you.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Ouch, sorry to hear that Tel, hope it's just a little strain and nothing major.
> 
> Tel, it happens to me all the time, I don't know what the problem is.
> 
> ...


8 is ok but not 12, I think on tren you should be making the most of the extra

kick it gives your strength, I'd say 4-6 on a compound exercise, really try to

get them weights up, then perhaps couple of exercises 8-10, thats on major

muscle group ie chest.

Can't undestand dropping the incline either, but thats just me, for it to work

your front delts more than your chest you must have the incline above 30 degrees.

Thats far too much incline anyway

I don't care what anyone says, since I started concentrating on db incline my

upper chest has come on leaps and bounds, FACT

just need to find out how to stimulate the lower part now


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I was just looking Darren, unfortunately work comp and sattelite connection means I can't.

Thanks for the kind comments. I am just looking for shows now, not that I really have much of a clue what I am looking for TBH.

I think you probably help alot more people than you let on Zar. Although after 10 hours in a car with you though the law of averages said you had to come out with at least one pearl :tongue:

Uriel, I know you're right mate, but I'm a stubborn b*stard, I think I will try the Stiff legged though as I have never done and see how I get on. Doesn't have to be heavy.

Blame Darren for the pics, he took them  I was like a kid in a candy store though, I wanted pics with everyone


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I did drop them, but I miss them. I do agree that they can be a delt exercise if you over do the incline, which I was, and it fecked my RC up as well sometimes.

I guess thats why they make more than one notch on the bench though, so let's do it :thumb:

I would like to hear someone arguing pro the 12 rep range as TBH I don't really know enough yet to have an informed opinion. I like both for different reasons. I am enjoying the 12 rep range ATM and it does seem to be working. No strength gains though as yet, I believe someone mentioned 4 weeks though as a time frame.

Maybe just carry on with the high reps till then as I am enjoying them, give it a month to see how it works for me, then I can change to the lower rep ranges if needs be.

I would like to at least give the higer reps a chance after a year of strength training and low repping, owe it at least a go, my body could respond differently. A month or aint going to kill me, especially on what looks like it may be a 12 week cycle.


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

As requested......

Stats:

189.7cm

Weight 114kg (weighed this morning first thing)

I need to work on arms and chest!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I hate you :tongue:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice MM, Sean. Very nice. Want a shag? Can I at least cop a feel??

In some ways I think Chris might just have you on width, though he is a little taller after all and has a wide frame. But looking very nice there.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I think the main difference there is BF. I need to bring my waist in, especially from the rear.

I'm liking the competition.

Seriously dude though, you look awesome!!!


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I love you :tongue:


aaahhhh I love you too mate. xx



dmcc said:


> Nice MM, Sean. Very nice. Want a shag? Can I at least cop a feel??
> 
> In some ways I think Chris might just have you on width, though he is a little taller after all and has a wide frame. But looking very nice there.


Yeah I was saying to my gym partner today I need to be wider! So that's another thing I need to focus on over the next 5 months!



Chris1 said:


> I think the main difference there is BF. I need to bring my waist in, especially from the rear.
> 
> I'm liking the competition.
> 
> Seriously dude though, you look awesome!!!


Cheers mate. So come on now.... you can easily get leaned up and still be heavier than me. Set a date either for a comp or to check back in with me and see where we both are.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I was just going to say, when do you fancy doing update pics??

Every fortnight, longer? Every week would be pointless I reckon, wouldn't be an appreciable change.

I want to pick a comp mate, but I am clueless as to how long it would take to bulk!! 6 months, a year?? It's difficult having never done it and coming from scratch nearly.

Leaning up is on fecker, you better believe it!! Hopefully I'll get a good nights sleep tonight and be able to get up for morning cardio. Haven't been sleeping to well ATM, lets get this done big boy


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I was just going to say, when do you fancy doing update pics??
> 
> Every fortnight, longer? Every week would be pointless I reckon, wouldn't be an appreciable change.
> 
> ...


I never sleep through the night. It's a given that I will wake up about 6 times or so during the night to change sides to sleep on. Then I also get confused with whats going on with my pillows and need to also wake up, find them and rearrange those!! Painful!!!!

But I'm up tomorrow morning 8am for 9am morning cardio, then doing nothing else rest of weekend except relaxing so monday I'm hitting back recharged and not hungover!! Even missing my cousins birthday p!ssup tomorrow as I cant do anymore parties!

How about beginning of every month. So seeing as we almost there 1st week of December will be next target?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Monthly. Every fortnight is still too close to see a good difference unless you are on a major contest prep. JMO


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

dmcc said:


> Monthly. Every fortnight is still too close to see a good difference unless you are on a major contest prep. JMO


I have to agree with Bender here. So probably middle of January then to get xmas and new year out of theway and recover.. That's what 2 months and a bit?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I wouldn't say there would be any harm in doimg Dec 1st then middle Jan, shift that Christmas flab.

Sounds like a hell of a plan. Now I just have to plan cycle length, which may have been a better idea at the start lol. 12 weeks I think is a good length, then cruise.

See if I pick out a show, then can plan cycles or blast/cruise around that.


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

TaintedSoul said:


> As requested......
> 
> Stats:
> 
> ...





Chris1 said:


> I hate you :tongue:


Ah if you two will cast your minds back this may sound familiar....

"Your brothers are the biggest fvcking guys I have ever seen in my life... especially the tall ones..... :crying:"

:lol: :lol:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Ah if you two will cast your minds back this may sound familiar....
> 
> "Your brothers are the biggest fvcking guys I have ever seen in my life... especially the tall ones..... :crying:"
> 
> :lol: :lol:


:laugh::laugh: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I wouldn't say there would be any harm in doimg Dec 1st then middle Jan, shift that Christmas flab.
> 
> Sounds like a hell of a plan. Now I just have to plan cycle length, which may have been a better idea at the start lol. 12 weeks I think is a good length, then cruise.
> 
> See if I pick out a show, then can plan cycles or blast/cruise around that.


With NABBA you must do your area show if its a qualifier unless you are doing an open show (eg NABBA England which is Oct) so.....

*15th (sat) May 2010 NABBA NORTH EAST AREA SHOW*

........Batley Frontier Variety Club, Bradford Road, Batley, W.Yorks, WF17 6JD. Judging & show combined. Registration from 1100 hrs, competition starts at 12 noon. Contact show organiser, Paul Jeffreys, for entry forms and further details: Wolfwear Sports & Fitness on (01274) 730718 or 07889 399107

UKBFF you can do any qualifier but they haven't posted the dates yet... only one I know so far is the 2nd May (sunday) in Scotland (Paisley).


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Ah if you two will cast your minds back this may sound familiar....
> 
> "Your brothers are the biggest fvcking guys I have ever seen in my life... especially the tall ones..... :crying:"
> 
> :lol: :lol:


hahahaha yeah that chap at the bar. Bought us all a round of whiskey!! :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I didn't know it was whiskey ffs. No wonder my head was battered.

Lol, yeah, brothers. Th Geordie, the Saffir, the Scot and the short one 

I couldn't be ready for May surely, would that give me time to bulk and diet??


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I couldn't be ready for May surely, would that give me time to bulk and diet??


Get that bulk/diet notion out your head, or at least dont think of it in those terms - remember, done right, you will keep growing for most of your prep phase.

May might be a bit tight, but then again maybe not? It's just down to you.

About bodywieght - stop comparing yourself to others lol

How can you compare yourself to Alvin small :lol:

Come on now, this is one of the reasons bodywieght should be put right down the list of things to think about - like we discussed in pm's RE callipers - usefule for spotting a trend specific to your own physique, but irrelevant and fundamentally innacurate.

I think Zara may be right - I think we have a worrier on our hands 

You need a very simple train of thought right now.

First and utmost priority - get diet nailed - gear it right now to the clean but plentiful stage.

Add a sprinkling of meds, which I think you are doing - dont stress, just bang in what youa re going to bang in, and forget about it - let it do its stuff quietly.

Training - really needs nailed as well, you need to make every session count. What I'd do personally - format wise for this pick maybe 3 exercises per bodypart, maybe 3ish sets of each working up the wieght. Your last set of each exercise should be to failure IMO, in your target rep range. I prefer 6 to 8 as mentioned earlier. If i can get 6 unnassisted, I can allow myself to go a little heavier next time.

And thats it, simple - no worrying, no panic. :thumbup1:

Comp date is kinda irrelevant I guess, becasue you should kinda be doing this anyway!


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

just a bit more about picking a date. When you think about it, you can't fail - you simply can't lose.

Say it gets closer to the comp and it becomes apparent that it was a bit soon after all - you just abort.

Your physique will still have went next level, you will still have learnt so much on the way, and you will still prob get a level of rebound to help you on your way. You have nothing to lose, and everything to gain!


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

I agree with what Ned is saying Chris, the man makes sense on the whole comp thing.

Get postitive, motivated and go for it. And if you do get on stage I promise you today that if I am in the country and I'll make the trip wherever to watch your first show!!!

That's a promise you can bank!! :lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

rs007 said:


> - format wise for this pick maybe 3 exercises per bodypart, maybe 3ish sets of each working up the wieght. Your last set of each exercise should be to failure IMO, in your target rep range. I prefer 6 to 8 as mentioned earlier. If i can get 6 unnassisted, I can allow myself to go a little heavier next time.


Agree with all above except rep range, I like 8-12 myself but no worries and here is why.

When I feel strong I will go between 6-8 reps on my work set.

If I come in to the gym and the weights feel a tad bit off, I will use the 8-12 rep range.

I have pb rep ranges on almost all my heavy compound exercises.

For Db bench presses I am around 7 with the 110 lb db's, when not feeling it I am around 12 with the 100 lb db's.

I try to meet or exceed my last workout and if I don't then I drop that exercise for a while and ramp it back up. What's the point of doing the same weight and the same rep range day in and day out, that means you need a change and your getting stale.

You could also do 6-8 on flat bench then go do inclines and do 8-12, then next workout switch it, keep the body guessing, I hope this helps. :beer:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Oh yea, Sean you look very good for a very tall guy!


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I didn't know it was whiskey ffs. No wonder my head was battered.
> 
> Lol, yeah, brothers. Th Geordie, the Saffir, the Scot and the short one
> 
> I couldn't be ready for May surely, would that give me time to bulk and diet??


If you competed on 15th May and started dieting on Saturday 2nd January that would give you 19 weeks, and still allow you to enjoy Xmas and New Year... final blow out and all that 

It is now 10 weeks exactly until 2nd January.

As Ramsay says... forget bulking. You dont want to bulk, you just want to grow as much as you can so exactly as he says. Nail the training, take whatever gear you are gonna take, try and keep diet cleanish, get into the habit of religiously eating enough protein as you want to GROW, make sure you get enough carbs to train heavy though, you need energy. Use the time to get into a routine of eating meals at set times and knowing whats going in every day - this will make it easier when you start to diet and stop you losing the first 2-3 weeks as many people do.

Remember - you will STILL grow during your diet.

If you're not ready - you don't do it.

Simples


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just checked, my next leave next year is not till the 12th July, so it would have to be after that. I can't find anymore dates though on the websites. Will keep checking though.

That gives me plenty of time to do everything slowly!!


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

I don't really have any reasons to argue with the logic of pick a show then prep for it except.....

I personally don't think I'm big enough to get up on stage, look good enough and DO WELL. so I'm going to spend 1 more year adding size.

probably just my ego but I want to look good if i am going to go through all that prep.

Maybe my age too, i don't have as many bites at the apple as a young guy like you chris


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Totally agree with you there Uriel........except.

Like they say, why not try it, if you're not ready then you don't do.

I do understand your logic, but I don't think we will ever see ourselves as big enough, don't keep chasing a size dream at the risk of not getting up there.

Although you are a lot more screwed on than me and I am sure you will know when you are big enough, if I did that I would just keep going till I was dead.

I think you're right in that you maybe have to be a bit more careful, if I diet and I'm too small then I have lost a year at most.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> 8 is ok but not 12, I think on tren you should be making the most of the extra
> 
> kick it gives your strength, I'd say 4-6 on a compound exercise, really try to
> 
> ...


It's simply because you concentrated on your pecs at all and your pecs happen to grow that way! Inclines cannot grow your upper chest more. I don't know how many times this has to be said. You cannot isolate any particular part of the pecs - unless you have an alien anatomy..!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I did drop them, but I miss them. I do agree that they can be a delt exercise if you over do the incline, which I was, and it fecked my RC up as well sometimes.
> 
> I guess thats why they make more than one notch on the bench though, so let's do it :thumb:
> 
> ...


If you want to be a bodybuilder, Chris, beware of the advice to lower the reps. You're aiming for size, not strength per se, which will come anyway.

You've already told me that your bod responded surprisingly to the higher reps. 12 is not too high for optimizing muscle growth. IMT guys invariably grow bigger faster when they use this rep range...


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> If you want to be a bodybuilder, Chris, beware of the advice to lower the reps. You're aiming for size, not strength per se, which will come anyway.
> 
> You've already told me that your bod responded surprisingly to the higher reps. 12 is not too high for optimizing muscle growth. IMT guys invariably grow bigger faster when they use this rep range...


Vary it, get the best of both worlds, not rocket science

Regards the inclines, development in my upper pecs has never been v good, I have

trained a number of year ya know:rolleyes:

Since doing inclines and db pullover significant progress has been made, are you

saying that over the years the pecs decide to grow in certain areas, whether

stimulated in that area or not.

Despite your black and white mentality, I will believe what I believe, training in

the gym of a pro bb who also disagrees with you will do for me:thumbup1:

I also think your posts are both pompous and self gratifying, in short you know

your stuff but are somewhat blinkered in your opinions, but why should you

care what a dummy like me thinks, duh

Anyway, regards debating with you, I'm out


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Oooh handbags. :lol:

:wub: to Tel and :wub: to Pro.

Now how about a quick grope to get this journal back to normal?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Guys, I appreciate all your opinions and you know that, but lets keep debates nice in here please.

Journals going great recently.

I do understand what you say Patrick, but if thats what works for Tel then so be it. As you say a particular part of the pec cannot be isolated, then does it really matter how they are stimulated.

Ronnie Coleman did flat and incline, he did alright. However, I readily admit that I don't know anywhere near as much as you guys on matters like anatomy or BB in general. I just know that I enjoy doing Flat, incline and dips, as you say, as long as I am stimulating the pecs and keep it away from being a delt exercise then I should be ok shouldn't I?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Vary it, get the best of both worlds, not rocket science
> 
> Regards the inclines, development in my upper pecs has never been v good, I have
> 
> ...


To be honest, tel, I don't, as I have no personal beef with you.

Anyone who knows me knows I in no way have a black and white mentality, nor blinkered opinions.

I always listen to experience, but observe there's so much guff in bodybuilding and always make a point of studying the latest scientific findings on muscle growth, as I want to grow as fast and efficiently as possible, and don't want others like Chris to waste tiime and effort and become disillusioned.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

On a side note, I'm off to get my hair cut, that should knock a few kg's off


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Just checked, my next leave next year is not till the 12th July, so it would have to be after that. I can't find anymore dates though on the websites. Will keep checking though.
> 
> That gives me plenty of time to do everything slowly!!


You can do any UKBFF show you like plus there are a couple of open shows with NABBA....

Bear in mind though that the classes are different eg NABBA goes on height and UKBFF goes on weight, so one fed may suit you more than the other


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

You're a star Zara, just need to get looking, but they don't seem to have there schedules up yet???


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> You're a star Zara, just need to get looking, but they don't seem to have there schedules up yet???


Now they haven't.... only reason we know the Scottish one is everyone knows everyone up here and the organisers always tell us when it is 

Area shows are always around same time every year give or take a week or two either way so its easy to guess roughly


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thanks for all your help Barbie 

HIIT today, I hate you Tel for reminding me what this is.

9 minutes!!! 30 second intervals.

Now I know I won't be winning the olympics any time soon, but I am well chuffed with that considering my levels of fitness. I am absolutely over the moon.

I think I had more, but the impending heart attack begged me to stop, pluss the RPM was dropping lower and lower so I was cheating myself in the end.

If I can just find that long distance stamina I used to have I will be fine, there is signs of it.

Will keep going to 12 minutes, then up to 60 second intervals. Will do every other day as I think every day may be too much, but we'll see.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I'm dreading the HIIT, not too sure you should be doing so much cardio on the tren?? any

particular

reason why you want to do so much cardo when on a test and tren cycle, tren will lean you

out anyways?

Just lift heavy weights mate and rest for now, your impatience is only matched by your lack

of confidence


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

A massive reason Tel is more just health reasons. I am sick of being unfit. I am out of breath just walking upstairs some days. So HIIT is great in that aspect, plus I have BF to spare, so it will help with the leaning out.

I am very impatient Tel, I know, and yet I am being very conservative with my doses at the same time. I will only be doing it every other day anyway, hopefully it won't affect my gains to much??

I really would just like to be a little bit fitter, and the Tren is no excuse for me, I was like this before all of that.

I've only done 2 sessions of cardio in 2 weeks lol, I just talk about it alot


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

On another note. I am feeling a lot more irritated these days.

I am letting little things get to me, and finding 99% of people I meet intolerable.

Is this normal with Tren, i have heard of these sides. Will they last all cycle???

I will post something In Steroid section later as well me thinks.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> On another note. I am feeling a lot more irritated these days.
> 
> I am letting little things get to me, and finding 99% of people I meet intolerable.
> 
> ...


Yep. Pretty much par for the course with Tren. Sometimes they diminish as you plateau...

But since you know this, you've no need to give into it...


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> On another note. I am feeling a lot more irritated these days.
> 
> I am letting little things get to me, and finding 99% of people I meet intolerable.
> 
> ...


Normal to Tren for some, I thought it was affecting me but once I stopped the

orals i was on, oxy & dbol, I became a lot calmer, in fact I am pretty chilled out

on AAS as long as no orals:whistling:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

I love the debate, lots of information in a short amount of time. :beer:

Chris, you do dips, very similar movement to declines if your leaning forward while doing them.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> I love the debate, lots of information in a short amount of time. :beer:
> 
> Chris, you do dips, very similar movement to declines if your leaning forward while doing them.


If you keep your elbows out - which is hard..!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I actually don't have a problem keeping my elbows out. Must be my gangly long limbs.

When I get back up to strength on dips I often wear a Backpack on the front and put weights in it, that helps with leaning forward.

I'm trying not to give in to it, and today the cardio helped.

I think I must have slept better this afternoon after the cardio, kept me much calmer when I woke up.

Just little things winding me up thats all. Sure it will ease off. Not liking the sound of plateu already lol :tongue:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

An indecisive, irritable worrier? Are you my mother? :lol:

Don't forget that the tren will make you feel more unfit than you really are.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I hope not, or the world just became a much stranger place lol

I was horribly unfit before any of this Darren. I feel like a new man after doing just that little HIIT today. I forgot hoe good a bit of cardio can make you feel.

I think the Tren mixed with the already cr*ppy CV is what has been making me so down recently, I already feel happier having done a bit.

See how I sleep tonight as well though.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Yesterday I did one set of 15 reps on cable crossovers and my whole chest has light doms. Feels good.

Thanks Patrick, I think these might be what the doctor ordered.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just had an awesome chest session.

Not alot of weight shifted, but massive pump and actually could not actually do another rep when I collapsed. Not thats fvcking failure 

Really pumped up for it. Just thought of the guy I would mist like to smash to bits, who is dating my ex, and channeled it.

Not great weights shifted, beggining to wonder whne this strength is going to come? However my irritability seems to have passed.

*Flat bench*

110kg x 12, 10, 8, 7

105kg x 8

*Incline*

8 x 75kg

8 x 75kg

7 x 75kg weak as p1ss on these

*Machine flyes*

3 x 12 x 80kg

*Dips*

3 x 12 x BW

Think I may sack dips off and do another set each on the other 3.

Feel awesome now, really strong, also feel very lean.

I didn't have a solid breakfast this morning and felt much better for it.

Had a shake when I woke up and then at 10 had tuna and salad cream.

Then a nice fish lunch, workout and shake now, don't feel bloated or sickly. I thiink it may be because they use powdered eggs for the scrambled eggs.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

You've only been on 12 days - it does take a few weeks for the strength to really pick up. I still bet your pressing is a PB.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sorry been quiet this afternoon.

Had a search and rescue, blazing inferno on a small yacht.

Didn't find anyone.

Hate the feeling that someone could be out there, if they are, I hope the sea is kind to them and God has mercy on them to.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Shít I had no idea that you guys got involved in that kind of stuff...

Hugs x


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

There's a legal and moral obligation for all seafarers to assist each other in times of distress.

Just, it's so easy to forget when you're on a big ship that in reality, you're never more than 2 complacent minutes away from disaster.

Could easily be one of us in the drink.

I'm hoping it's just an insurance job, actually, praying is more the word!


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Jeez chris that sucks mate


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

I feel safer actually.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok, back to normal today.

Been arguing with useless fecking Greek linesmen all morning.

Shall be enjoying a nice feed at lunch time and a few "dirty beers" for relaxation purposes.

May attempt some HIIT later after it's all settled. This job is crazy, 95% of the time we do absolutely nothing, then the other 5% we are off our heads busy.

Nearly battered one of the hotel officers last night, sat there in the bar whinging about how "he would have to deal with all the passenger complaints tomorrow", some poor b*stard could be drowning and that's all these people can think about.

Makes me sad people can have such dis-regard for life. I hope to god that pr1ck never has to be in the situation those poor b*stards were in and then has to lie there thinking some arrogant [email protected] is worrying about passenger complaints rather than praying for his safety.

Sometimes our species makes me sick to my stomach.

Anyways, onwards and upwards people.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Ok, back to normal today.
> 
> *
> Been arguing with useless fecking Greek linesmen all morning.*
> ...


Cool down tren boy, deep breaths and count to 10 mate

I wish I could take my own advice, I'd still have a job


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Just noticed a story running over hear about a couple who may have been kidnapped

by pirates in there yacht, are they the same ones, although I suspect your in the Carribean:confused1:

A search is under way for a British couple feared to have been hijacked by pirates off the east coast of Africa.

Paul and Rachel Chandler, from Tunbridge Wells in Kent, were heading for Tanzania from the Seychelles in their yacht, the Lynn Rival, when a distress signal was received, and they have not been heard from since.

A Foreign Office spokesman said officials were investigating claims that Somali pirates had seized the couple's yacht. According to reports, a news agency was contacted by a pirate to say the couple were "in our hands now".

He said the captives were healthy and ransom demands would follow.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> Cool down tren boy, deep breaths and count to 10 mate
> 
> I wish I could take my own advice, I'd still have a job


Good advice though Tel. Chris, you do seem to be a bit more short tempered of late. Don't let the possible known effects of tren be an excuse.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

So Chris, at any given moment there is someone looking for people that might fall overboard?


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

need to watch the mentals on tren Chris as you are finding. It made me very competative...

One manager at my last contract was talking sh1te about how quickly he changed out an engine (like it was ever a race on an aircraft!! More erm safety first), anyway he was clearly talking out of his @rsehole...

Normally some inhibiting system would have kicked in but oh no....tren disables that....I could hear myself telling him he was talking out of his fuking @rsehole and he can get his overalls on and show me how it's done....but I couldn't quite believe I was saying it quite as loudly lol


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Just noticed a story running over hear about a couple who may have been kidnapped
> 
> by pirates in there yacht, are they the same ones, although I suspect your in the Carribean:confused1:
> 
> ...


I spotted that too Tel, wondered if it was linked


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Tel mate, at the risk of sounding like a [email protected], why would I be arguing with Greek linesmen in the Carribean? The clue's in the bit you underlined 

No guys, arguing with linesman is an age old tradition that Merchant Seaman have, basically, we drive boats day in day out and moor them anywhere, linesmen pick up ropes and put them where we tell them.

Unfortunately they get a real sh1tty on about there lowness on the pecking order and decide they know best. Then they have to be told the error of there ways as the safety of the ship, and keeping it safely docked is our responsibility not theres.

Winger, part of my job as navigator is to monitor all radio and emergency signals for maydays or ships in distress. Also navigators are responsible for carrying out initial actions in case of any emergency outside of the Engine room, including man overboards.

I'm also a trained Firefighter and medic, although on cruise ships we have medical staff that take over these responsibilities. If there is a fire onboard though I will be one of the fire teams that go in to extinguish and retrieve any casualties.

Scary thought guys


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Actually the last 3-4 days I've found that my irritability is down to normalish levels. If I get frustrated then I do have to catch myself early and bring myself back down to earth, but I am very calm at the moment.

I think I may have just not been sleeping properly, so I knocked the drink on the head and have been sleeping alot more, made a big difference.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Tel mate, at the risk of sounding like a [email protected], why would I be arguing with Greek linesmen in the Carribean? The clue's in the bit you underlined


I just thought you'd had a goal disallowed in the 5 a side indoor intership footy

tournament:confused1:



Chris1 said:


> Actually the last 3-4 days I've found that my irritability is down to normalish levels. If I get frustrated then I do have to catch myself early and bring myself back down to earth, but I am very calm at the moment.
> 
> I think I may have just not been sleeping properly, so *I knocked the drink on the head* and have been sleeping alot more, made a big difference.


Not a bad idea as your taking test and tren for the FIRST time:whistling:

some fecking ppl:rolleyes:

Next post will be "I can't make gains what am I doing wrong, i drink 10 stella's

a night and eat 2 packs of jaffa's a day, any ideas anyone"


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Seems to be working for some people 

I wasn't drinking heavily Tel, with the exception of 1 night recently. Just a social couple here and there. My trouble is extremes, if I start I keep going till I am destroyed, which, unfortunately, takes a lot.

Since I started the cycle I have had the focus to just have 1 or 2 and then go to bed. This is only once a week or so.

On a plus note, still have amazing chest DOMS, love it. I could barely support myself to get out of bed yesterday, loved it 

Legs and Biceps tomorrow, figured I would try the 2 together and see what happens!


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> I just thought you'd had a goal disallowed in the 5 a side indoor intership footy
> 
> tournament:confused1:


I just assumed they were part of the united-nations that works aboard his ship.... :tongue: "linesman" means nowt to me, being a bird an' all.... 



tel3563 said:


> Next post will be "I can't make gains what am I doing wrong, i drink 10 stella's a night and eat 2 packs of jaffa's a day, any ideas anyone"


....not enough MT2.....


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> I just assumed they were part of the united-nations that works aboard his ship.... :tongue: "linesman" means nowt to me, being a bird an' all....


Surely you know the offside rule:confused1:

Its where a mans hand creeps just that little bit too far up the ladies leg and

his wrist gets caught in a thigh lock which hurts like hell, so I'm told


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I'm also a trained Firefighter and medic, although on cruise ships we have medical staff that take over these responsibilities. If there is a fire onboard though I will be one of the fire teams that go in to extinguish and retrieve any casualties.
> 
> Scary thought guys


I had the same sort of deal when I worked at M&S as a student. Being part of the 'fire party' involved getting people out the builidng and tackling SMALL fires if poss. No worries :cool2:

However when they said I also had to search the building for bombs in case of bomb alerts, I told them where to go :laugh:


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Tel mate, at the risk of sounding like a [email protected], why would I be arguing with Greek linesmen in the Carribean? The clue's in the bit you underlined
> 
> No guys, arguing with linesman is an age old tradition that Merchant Seaman have, basically, we drive boats day in day out and moor them anywhere, linesmen pick up ropes and put them where we tell them.
> 
> ...


Dam mate, and here I thought you were the ships hairdresser!! :thumb:

You seem to know your stuff, definitely someone to have with at sea hey.

It's cool learning about other fields of work, your journal alone has been pretty good to learn a bit about your line of work so far.

How is the training going?


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> *Surely you know the offside rule* :confused1:
> 
> Its where a mans hand creeps just that little bit too far up the ladies leg and
> 
> his wrist gets caught in a thigh lock which hurts like hell, so I'm told


Oh THATS what it is!

I always wondered! Cheers for that :thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hey guys,

Hven't been on for a while due to the gay satelites being down.

Suffering withdrawl symptons.

Jabbed yesterday and did legs, no PIP at all as of yet. Jabbing is down to no time whatsoever these days. Although I still take around 30 second or more with the actual injection, no point in rushing.

Legs was interesting to say the least, Force 9 Gale made the ground less than stable, my abs are killing today with all the core work needed, thought I'd lost it a few times but held on.

Weight was ok, up more next week. Kept to 8 reps and my back was fine, knees were still giving me grief, but hips were great. Had some real good depth by the 2nd set.

If I had upped the weight more in the weather conditions I wouldn't have been able to hold it when it got frisky, so it was somewhat a balance between safety and a pushing hard.

*Squats*

5 x 8 x 140kg

*Standing leg curls*

3 x 12 x 27.5kg Not very strong on these.

*Leg extensions*

2 x 12 x full stack

1 x failure (approx 14) full stack

*Machine Bi Curls*

3 x 12 x 55kg

*Alternate DB hammer curls*

3 x 12 x 22kg

Really liked the work out, need another bi exercise in there I think as without the pre-exhaust from back it wasn't enough.

The new gym guy is an ex bodybuilder so I have someone to finally talk to about things. Unfortunately his English is sh1te, and he is absolutley obsessed with Sustanon, I mean, since the 2nd time we talked all he has gone on about is getting me on Sus.

I have told him god know how many times I am perfectly happy the way I am, but he won't have it. He has asked if we can train together and initially I said yes, but he is blindly ignorant to any other forms of training than his own, so he is just going to try and change the way I do things, which I am not so happy about.

Still, All's good in the hood


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Pasta.

I'm an actual firefighter. I mean, we are no-where near the standard of the shore guys, but we can hold our own. We do live fire exercise course ashore to train us.

We are actually the guys that turn up after you've done your bit and we were the full protective outfit and breathing apparatus and go in to extinguish the fires, rescue casualties etc.

We drive the rescue boats onboard as well incase there needs to be a rescue from the sea. Anything that you think of as an emergency at home we have to be trained and prepared to deal with onboard.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Pasta.
> 
> I'm an actual firefighter. I mean, we are no-where near the standard of the shore guys, but we can hold our own. We do live fire exercise course ashore to train us.
> 
> ...


Chris, I've got my flies stuck in my windies, any advice??


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Pasta.
> 
> I'm an actual firefighter. I mean, we are no-where near the standard of the shore guys, but we can hold our own. We do live fire exercise course ashore to train us.
> 
> ...


I have that t-shirt!  Did you do the heli escape stuff too, Chris?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Prodiver said:


> I have that t-shirt!  Did you do the heli escape stuff too, Chris?


I've done Heli ops, but that is mainly for offshore ops.

Had an amazing time at the sea survival, I've done it 3 times now, done the FF 3 times as well. Love those courses.

Finished my Command and Control 2 years ago and want to go again now!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

tel3563 said:


> Chris, I've got my flies stuck in my windies, any advice??


Vinegar and Savlon mate :thumb:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Pasta.
> 
> I'm an actual firefighter. I mean, we are no-where near the standard of the shore guys, but we can hold our own. We do live fire exercise course ashore to train us.
> 
> ...


That's quality mate :thumbup1:

The honour was bestowed on me, then 3 yrs later they showed me how use an extinguisher!! Sounds like my training fell a little short of yours :ban: :lol: :lol:

They never did show me how to find a bomb 

Some good skills there mate. Any plans to do it full time if you ever finish on the ships?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I would love to be a full time firefighter, but I would have to re-take all the training and they hardly ever take people on these days.

Plus it is a massive pay drop, not that that would bother me if I was doing something I love.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

6 sets for your bi's should be enough... don't forget they're a tiny muscle. You don't do much more for your legs, after all.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

dmcc said:


> 6 sets for your bi's should be enough... *don't forget they're a tiny muscle.* You don't do much more for your legs, after all.


Thats not nice D, I know he aint got the biggest bi's but tiny's a bit much:lol:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

making some good progress Chris 

Try not to over analyze stuff as it does not help lol...

You do seem to be a bit negative at times, I would suggest any thing you feel negative about, set yourself a goal to improve it in some way..

That way it wil help you progress rather than hinder


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> 6 sets for your bi's should be enough... don't forget they're a tiny muscle. You don't do much more for your legs, after all.


Fair point, I do 12 sets for legs now, and will probs be adding 3 more in the way of Stiff legged deads or Romanian deads next week if the weathers better. Lower back was much better this week :thumbup1:



tel3563 said:


> Thats not nice D, I know he aint got the biggest bi's but tiny's a bit much:lol:


You sir, are a twunt. I shall take great pleasure in making you kiss them when I finished demolishing you in Jan and you're lying there in a big spazzy mess 



jw007 said:


> making some good progress Chris
> 
> Try not to over analyze stuff as it does not help lol...
> 
> ...


Cheers for popping in Joe.

I am negative, a little bit to self critical at times. I always seem to set myself un-realistic goals and then get p1ssed when I don't achieve them. I'm putting it down to lack of experince of how gear affects me this time as I wasn't sure what would happen.

A better indication would have been to carry on with strength training I guess, but thats done. I am going to do 1rm on deads in a couple of days as I just can't hack the high rep stuff on deads and that may give a good indication of how I've come on.

Great advice as always matey, I may rep you if I can get suthorisation from Tel if post is rep-worthy :tongue:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I shall take great pleasure in making you kiss them


Can I kiss them too when you come visit?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Great advice as always matey, I may rep you if I can get suthorisation from Tel if post is rep-worthy :tongue:


*Authorised:thumbup1:*

*
*

*
*carry on


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Can I kiss them too when you come visit?


Of course you can sweety.

Although I didn't get a mention in your post in Tels thread, so I may have to withold.

Oh, who am I kidding, pucker up big boy


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Lots of people didn't get a particular mention Chris but you know you hold a special place in my cock. Heart. Yes, heart.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

I don't get why people are always going on about cutting sets down....It's training!

I love training. I do 9 sets on bi's n tri's, even what I was natty. Don't look too bad do they?

I never suffer from the symptoms of overtraining.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

I even do bi's twice a week sometimes


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Yes mate but what was the total volume? At one point I was doing 10 sets for bi's and up to 15 for tri's but since I but the sets and increased the weight, they've grown. :confused1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm with you on this Uriel.

I have only experienced over training once, and that was banging heavy 1rm deads weekly. Killed me dead and fvcked my head up totally.

I love the fact that after that chest session 3 days later I still have DOMS and feel like I have achieved something.

I'm not sure how much is right for bi's, I know I should be doing more for Tri's though definately as a bigger muscle. I think 9 sets would work for me.

Although then we are getting back to the argument as to whether, if I am capable of doing 9 sets, am I working 100% up to that point???


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I think overtraining has a lot to do with what else you do, ie manual work, stress at work and

home, other sports, etc

I've certainly suffered from it in the past, went backwards for a while, not good


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Fair point, I do 12 sets for legs now, and will probs be adding 3 more in the way of Stiff legged deads or Romanian deads next week if the weathers better. Lower back was much better this week :thumbup1:
> 
> You sir, are a twunt. I shall take great pleasure in making you kiss them when I finished demolishing you in Jan and you're lying there in a big spazzy mess
> 
> ...


cheers :thumb:


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Although then we are getting back to the argument as to whether, if I am capable of doing 9 sets, am I working 100% up to that point???


Mate, IMO - it's not about doing 100% on every set.

What is the point of training?

It's to stimulate growth. How is this done?

By fatigueing the muscle and overstressing it, getting it way out it's comfort zone - giving it a message that it is too weedy for what you now demand of it.

Pre exhaustion etc is just another way of saying - do a few sets before you max it out.

Cheat sets are just another way of saying - lift more than you can and get a bit of help.

None of this is you working at 100% all the time.

You need to work the muscle in the most effective way (for you) to stimulate hypertrophy.

Darren is right, 4 sets of FUKING heavy curl might be enough. Me personally, I cant bi curl much more than an olly bar and 2 plates so I go for 9 sets...I cannot curl 4 plates. It's a training decision for that muscle, for me that experience has taught me:thumbup1:

It's not too much for me and it's not lifting girlie weights (like that matters)


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

2 plates ffs. I can curl 60kg max.

Bloody hell.

I think a good point well made there Uriel, mainly the point about experience, and more importantly experience in relation to your own body.

No-one knows how you work like you do. Sure, in the beggining you take all the advice and listen to what people say, but after the years I guess you get a feeling of what works for you and stick to it, maybe try new things along the way.

I'm all for trying higher reps, more sets, or doing the complete opposite to see what is of more benefit to me.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> 2 plates ffs. I can curl 60kg max.
> 
> Bloody hell.


No bro I meant 2 plates and a bar not 2 a side, that is like 60 kg. Bi is a wee muscle even on a big guy, I couldn't curl 100 kg with any class:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thank god for that.

I was nearly puking when I read that!!!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Thank god for that.
> 
> I was nearly puking when I read that!!!


that w4nking into your own mouth ain't good for yer Chris, how many times eh:rolleyes:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

But when you showed me it looked so much fun!!!!

Just had Tuna and salad cream, didn't taste as good as I remember.

Need more Salad cream me thinks :thumb:


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> But when you showed me it looked so much fun!!!!
> 
> Just had Tuna and salad cream, didn't taste as good as I remember.
> 
> Need more Salad cream me thinks :thumb:


Nother dash of "Sailors sauce" mate:thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Re-useable protein my friend!!!

It comes from all sources


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Bump


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Meh, no gym today.

I have this daft grievance and disciplinary training I have to attend atm which takes up most of my day, on top of work, gong to try to get in tomorrow and do delts and Tri's.

I put a post up in Personal care but got no answers.

I have really swollen ankles and feet at the moment. I have just noticed it the last week or so. It is getting very painful to wear shoes.

I thought it was water retention but I don't seem to have it anywhere else. It feels kinda hard as well, like swelling rather than watery.

Wonder what it could be??


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

High BP?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Maybe, but I'm taking magnesium tabs for that, not that it was particularly high to begin with.

May go see the doc tomorrow and get it done.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I think I'd make that may a deffo mate, swollen ankles and feet can mean many things

as I've just googled it, 2 of which are liver and kidney related

Best be on safe side mate, go see Doc


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

list of causes mate

* Arthritis

* Bug Bites and Stings

* Bumps and Bruises

* Burns (First Aid)

* Cellulitis

* Cirrhosis (Liver)

* Congestive Heart Failure

* Deep Vein Thrombosis (DVT)

* Fracture

* Gout

* Kidney Failure

* Obesity

* Pseudogout

* Rheumatoid Arthritis

* Scleroderma

* Sprains and Strains

* Vasculitis

Strangely Cowboy boots ain't on there


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

They all sound a bit serious mate.

Well, I have come off the orals and it only seems to have started with the injectables.

Although this could be coincidence.

My kidney function is fine, at least in the right side.

Liver it could be, but there are no other obvious signs of liver problems there.

I honestly believe it is more than likely just the boots, I have never worn them for actually walking around, and to be honest, at my weight now they are less than comfortable.

Just ordered some nice hush puppies on amazon lol Going to assume it is something like that until something more serious is diagnosed.

It may be strain on my liver as well though, I wouldn't say I have been drinking much, but then again, after my life before what I consider not much, may in fact still be much.

Time to get sensiblke and just stop it I think. Especially as I am promoted again on the 1st.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> They all sound a bit serious mate.
> 
> Well, I have come off the orals and it only seems to have started with the injectables.
> 
> ...


Just get it checked out by a Doctor, not brill idea asking on here with all the

experts:tongue: :lol:

Are you getting promoted to a position where you can hand out free holiday, the Mrs want to know


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Because both legs and feet are affected quickly at the same time, the list can most likely be reduced as follows:

* Cirrhosis (Liver)

* Congestive Heart Failure

* Kidney Failure

* Rheumatoid Arthritis

* Scleroderma

* Strains

* Vasculitis


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Hypochondria?  It's probably the boots.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I've always thought he was a wannabe hypochondriac

Best to get it checked though, better safe than sorry


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Thanks Patrick, you picked out all my favourites :crying:

I'm convinced it's not serious guys. I will have it checked out obviously.

The more I am thinking the more I reckon it could be water.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris what is your BP? <----this is the bottom line!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ok guys, been to the docs this morning.

The Edema we stablished is a Gravity Edema with slight pitting.

Basically everyone suffers from it to some degree as the day goes on, often you will find your feet and ankles more swollen at the end of the day just due to gravity pulling the water in your body down to your feet.

Then when you sleep at night the water re-distributes, especially if you keep your legs slightly raised, as this allows the water to drain back towards your lymph glands.

We deduced that this was most likely caused by the magnesium tablets.

Magnesium helps to regulate BP, it does this by dilating the blood vessels, it is often used by medics intraveinously when heart conditions arise. This exacerbated the normal swelling that happens due to gravity.

Answer, stop taking magnesium. It does all fit in with the time frame when we discussed it, allowing for the time taken for the magnesium tablets to take effect.

Phew 

Now, for information purposes only, and you should always get this checked by a medical proffesional.

He explained to me why it couldn't have been the following reasons.

Heart:

When it is your heart, the fluid is caused by the heart backing up fluids. These fluids empty into your lungs and then into your legs. If my heart had been the cause I would have had severe resperatory problems first long before any swelling had occured. Chances are that lying down would have been a struggle, let alone walking a few feet.

Liver:

If it had been my liver then aside from pain, there would have been yellowing of the skin, especially around the eyes.

Kidneys:

Well, I knew this from personal experience, the pain you suffer when kidneys are strained is like no other pain in the world.

However, aside from that, kidneys cause an all over swelling, so my fingers, face etc would have been massive.

The words "face like a chipmunk" were used as a description.

So, it is nothing for me to worry about. We discussed alsorts after that and it was nice to get the opinons of a doctor for a change. He spoke alot of sense.

Basically, all supps are rubbish "he said". Now, I am not convinced all of them are, however he explained that Supps are not regulated by any governing body such as the FDA, therefore they could have anything in them. He, and I believe he is correct, agrees that all nutrition, vitamins and minerals should come from solid good wholesome food (something I know many of you believe strongly in).

He also reccomended dropping protein shakes, however I do believe they have there place.

I'll copy and paste this into my journal and will come back later when I have more time and tidy it up with more technical descriptions for those that are interested, might help someone.

So, in conclusion, I am fine, no need to stop gear. Cut back on alcohol, sleep with legs slightly raised until swelling completely goes (it has already dissapeared in right leg).

Knock most of the supps on the head, especially magnesium.

Eat well, train hard and rest 

Chris


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

BP I had taken at the time, I can't remember the number, but he said it was as normal as can be, bang on the middle of the healthy zone.

I've asked him if I can get it checked once a week with him to be safe.

Very shuffed about that also.

I was sh1tting myself last night guys, about my health, hated the thought of stopping gear when I'd just started.

So glad it turned out to be somethign simple.

I guess only time will tell if it is the magnesium, he said give it 3 days.

I can't wait to wear shows again


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

yeah it's worth keeping an eye on bp.

I bought a proper docs Omron M6 BP monitor reccommended by P divor (can get it calibrated), it's the same one as my misses uses at work...was about £80 from Medisave mate.

Mine was 134 over 82 this morning on gear and stims lol ready for back and shoulders


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, mine was a cheapo amazon jobbie.

Worth investing mayeb, but then again there is a medial centre 10 decks down, not a million miles to go to get it done properly lol.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

I was thinking more if you were keeping your gear use to your self...might appear weird you wanting you bp done all the time


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

That's good news Chris. :thumbup1:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Good news indeed. However I do believe that supplements produced in the EU are regulated so don't worry too much.

Have you ever heard of Occam's Razor? This is a case in point.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I haven't heard of that Darren.

I think I should clarify, when I said knocking supplements on the head I just meant the Milk thistle, Magnesium and poss some other tablets.

The protein will stay, I just meant i would try and get it from solid foods as much as I coud stomach.

I didn't tell them about gear usage Uriel, actually, he didn't ask.

I just said that my dad has high BP and I would like to keep and eye on it, he seemed to be ok with that.

The only guy onboard that knows about my gear is the gym guy, who is an ex BB, and all he talks about is ramming Sus into me, although today he was also convincing me I should be using Winny every day now and poss Deca as well.

This is all on top of the Test and Tren lol.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

When I said "supplements" that's what I was referring to - soz.

Occam's Razor is a principle that states, in short, the simplest explanation is usually the right one. You thought it was the magnesium and inactivity, and the quack corroborates this.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Delts and Tri's today.

Don't feel like I am doing enough here, although I was wrecked when finshed.

Almost like my body says, that's enough, but my mind is saying I should have more exercises, although they are only small muscle groups.

*Seated Military Press*

10 x 60kg

10 x 60kg

9 x 60kg

9 x 60kg

6 x 60kg then imeediately 4 x 60kg

*Seated Lat Raises*

3 x 12 x 18kg

*Tri Pushdowns*

3 x 12 x 55kg

*Rope pulldowns*

10 x 30kg

2 x 12 x 25kg Really should be doing more weight on these but my triceps weren't having it.

Happy with the workout, but can't help feeling could do with another Delts exercise in there still.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> When I said "supplements" that's what I was referring to - soz.
> 
> Occam's Razor is a principle that states, in short, the simplest explanation is usually the right one. You thought it was the magnesium and inactivity, and the quack corroborates this.


Yip, sometimes I should have more faith in myself and my decisions.

I'm to quick to immediately discount what I think in favour of something else.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Don't feel like I am doing enough here, *although I was wrecked when finshed.*
> 
> *
> *
> ...


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> Yip, sometimes I should have more faith in myself and my decisions.
> 
> I'm to quick to immediately discount what I think in favour of something else.


There's a great book about how people often make the best decisions instantly and automatically. I try to rely on that myself and now try not to doubt myself - every time I do I regret it and my original decisions have been borne out.

Really glad you've found the problem and can take some quick steps to fix it!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

See how I feel in the morning, my Tri's are crippled though.

It's always a good feeling when you can't push yourself out of a chair.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

M_at said:


> There's a great book about how people often make the best decisions instantly and automatically. I try to rely on that myself and now try not to doubt myself - every time I do I regret it and my original decisions have been borne out.
> 
> Really glad you've found the problem and can take some quick steps to fix it!


It just all boils back to self confidence again with me, I never believe I am right.

In this case though it was definately the best decision to get it seen to. It is better already, although slightly swelling up at times.

Enjoying my hour after work with my feet up reading a book and chilling.

At night I can pull my sofa round and look out my window at the stars.

Very gay, but very nice as well


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Sounds idyllic and I feel a little jealous actually.

Chris, enough of the confidence talk. Don't forget you are in a supremely responsible job, you are third in command of a bloody large ship and your decisions could affect over a thousand people. You are mature beyond your years and are more confident than you think.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yes, but I find confidence to be very focused.

In my job I am supremly confident, I know what I am capable of and I know how good I am at doing it. Then out of that scenario, I am very different.

It is very strange when you look at it from a logical point of view, in that, there is no logic at all.

Same when I am say on a night out, if I'm out in a gay bar with some of the gay lads, I am massively confident, put me in a bar full of women, I sit there like a scared cat.

Very strange.

I would say though that I am becoming more and more confident as the gym gets better and better. 2 or 3 years ago I was a wreck outside of work. It was terrible!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

But there you go - confidence in some parts of your life are spilling over to others. And it'll only get better.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Bloody hell people weren't lying about sweats!!!

I was out last night for a leaving party, not even drinking, a couple of ABBA songs later and I was drenched. This was at 1 a.m. so technically it was night sweats. My shirt was dripping.

Looked much leaner though today 

Just re-taken over the 1/O's job, so there won't be much training for a couple of days as I settle back into the new watch and job.

E-mail has Changed Darren, just so you know.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

How long have you been on the tren Chris?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> Bloody hell people weren't lying about sweats!!!
> 
> I was out last night for a leaving party, not even drinking, a couple of ABBA songs later and I was drenched. This was at 1 a.m. so technically it was night sweats. My shirt was dripping.
> 
> ...


I didn't know him before he had email...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Lol.

4th Jab will be on the 4th Nov Winger.

Think this week and next should be when I start to see the benefits of it.

I have noticed a generally higher body temperature, and last night and the night before I have been drenched in sweat.

Hopefully the weights will start heading up as well 

Cheat day tomorrow, quite pathetic that I can get so excited about a BK breakfast and then a pizza later.

Simple things in life eh 

The other news is that the Edema has gone completely now, so it was almost definately the magnesium tablets.

Lesson learned!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I'm not on tren at the moment but I am on the clen/T3... apparently last night I was boiling up without the covers on and so hot I was practically vibrating - but not sweating.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

dc55 said:


> lol.....think you've got heat problems!!
> 
> I currently take:
> 
> ...





dmcc said:


> I'm not on tren at the moment but I am on the clen/T3... apparently last night I was boiling up without the covers on and so hot I was practically vibrating - but not sweating.


I've not experienced any of them side effects:confused1: They sound pretty fvcking dangerous

to me, high body temperature etc

Should I up the dose:lol:


----------



## carbsnwhey (Jul 24, 2009)

Nice journal


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

'ang on young Dave... the label on the Thermo bottle states "Do *NOT* take ANY other fat burner while using this".............. :lol:

Tel I'm just using 2ml per day but high doses of gear can fook up my thermostat.


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Ok guys, been to the docs this morning.
> 
> The Edema we stablished is a Gravity Edema with slight pitting.
> 
> ...


Not strictly true hence some products being banned in USA and not here and vice-versa.

Each country just has different regulations.

Choose companies with ISO accreditation then you have confidence that what it says is in it, IS in it :thumbup1:

As to getting everything from food.... thats pish sorry... doctors annoy me.

Bodybuilders have extreme dietary requirements (as do other athletes) compared to your average joe bloggs. The reason there was a market for supps in the first place is that its almost impossible for the average person with a normal lifestyle to go out and eat everything we need.

Simple example... taking orals... how much of a pain in the ass to get milk thistle without jst taking a supplement?

They are called "supplements" for a reason... they are there to "supplement" a healthy balanced diet


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Zara-Leoni said:


> They are called "supplements" for a reason... they are there to "supplement" a healthy balanced diet


Now why oh why do you have to clutter up the issues with the facts? :innocent:


----------



## Guest (Nov 3, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> I have noticed a generally higher body temperature, and last night and the night before I have been drenched in *Seman*.


Drenched in Seman? What were you doing? :lol:

:laugh: :tongue: Sorry, I had to get you back for the post in my journal


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Not strictly true hence some products being banned in USA and not here and vice-versa.
> 
> Each country just has different regulations.
> 
> ...


It's true - unless you're eating a very clean diet with loads of fruit and veg, it's pretty unlikely you can get everything from food, especially as a lot of starchy, refined carbs actually hinder the absorption or leech certain vitamins from us (the amount of vitamin c we actually need isn't that much but eating lots of carbs raises our requirement for it)

Bear in mind that the RDA of most vitamins and minerals is the bare minimum we can get away with and remain healthy - not applicable for someone who works out hard - we need far more than the average


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

This is also true. I meant though that good wholesome foods should be the prime source of nutrients, not necessarily the only source!

I have cut back my supps to.

Omega-3, Vit C, CLA, Protein, L-Glutamine, BCAA's.

I still have Milk Thistle and Cranberry Extract although am not using at the moment.

Magnesium I will not use again unless i have no choice.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Anyways, finally back in the gym today after a few days of work related absence.

Sadly missed back from last week, decided to hit chest today.

Mixed bag of a workout, can't workout whether it is a really good one or a really bad one.

Weight shifted + pants BUT I am currently ina Force 10 Gale with a 10m swell, so even though it is a lower weight, the ROM I have put my body through is unreal.

Every time the ship rolled I was going from Decline through flat to incline.

Had to leave the bench after a while as it was getting too dangerous and went on to chest press machine instead.

*Bench*

12 x 100kg

10 x 100kg

8 x 100kg

8 x 100kg

8 x 100kg

*Chest Press Machine*

5 x 12 x 105kg

So, I am in agony in a good way, my chest is nice and tight and pumped right up, so I'm going with a really good workout 

Also, jab 4 today, in a gale. Was very worried about the ship rolling and me snapping a pin inside me, but I took it slow and steady as always and it worked out fine.

Only problem is that when I aspirated there was no blood, but when I pulled the pin out I was p1ssing blood. Think I may have gone through one.

At least I didn't inject into it though 

Hope you're all well!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I always get it, just normally a small pin pr**k thats all, this time it stained a whole tissue.

Still, hardly life threatening 

No PIP to speak of either this time. Maybe later, and that sort of post injection high didn't really happen this time.

Guess it's like Tel said, after a while it becomes like shelling peas. I said I would wait till the end of this week to see how my body has reacted and then take stock of whether to up or not.

I'm still in 2 minds, and there is no rush I know, but I should get the most out of this.

Any comments on that would be appreciated.

The Chest thing today more or less proved to me that Patrick was correct in that you cannot stimulate the chest individually and that in reality you're as good doing 12 sets of flat bench as you are doing all the others individually.

I have exactly the same feeling as I do every other time, whether or not I would progress exactly the same I don't know.

I would like to trial it on one day when the sea is flat to see how it goes, today my whole body is aching with the stablilisation involved.

Will get some pics up of the waves when I can :thumb:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Sound advice from young Dave there.

Don't worry about a bit of blood on withdrawing the needle, I get it all the time, especially in shoulders.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

I always feel like an AAS newbie when the two D's comment, shoulders!!!, I've only done 1 pin

that wasn't in my A55, that was quad and I couldn't walk next fecking day??

I'm only doing 1ml cruise atm so could be a good time to practise in other sites, besides

I looked in mirror at gym and areas of my a55 looks like a discarded 2nd hand dartboard


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> I always feel like an AAS newbie when the two D's comment, shoulders!!!, I've only done 1 pin
> 
> that wasn't in my A55, that was quad and I couldn't walk next fecking day??
> 
> ...


Post up a pic...lol

TMI baby. :innocent:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So guys, the challenge has been been laid by Tel.

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/shows-pros-inspiration/70596-hert-beds-open-first-timers-bodybuilding-championships-2010-a.html

No excuses (like I did in Tels journal straight away :whistling: ) , going to do it. Trying to work back a start prep date from then, 20 weeks prior to see how long I've got to pack on as much muscle as possible!!!

So guys, one word.........help :crying:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> So guys, the challenge has been been laid by Tel.
> 
> http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/shows-pros-inspiration/70596-hert-beds-open-first-timers-bodybuilding-championships-2010-a.html
> 
> ...


You can still pack on muscle when your dieting

If you back out you pay my entry fee and vice versa, deal


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It's a deal.

It's on old man, it's definately on


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> So guys, the challenge has been been laid by Tel.
> 
> http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/shows-pros-inspiration/70596-hert-beds-open-first-timers-bodybuilding-championships-2010-a.html
> 
> ...


NICE!!!!! :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

My local show too.......I'll look forward to seeing this!!!!!!!

:wub:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Beklet said:


> NICE!!!!! :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
> 
> My local show too.......I'll look forward to seeing this!!!!!!!
> 
> :wub:


No need for a hotel then eh Beks:whistling: I think Chris has an invite to Robsta's:lol:


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

tel3563 said:


> No need for a hotel then eh Beks:whistling: I think Chris has an invite to Robsta's:lol:


I think you will find that is already taken - no vacancies there I can assure you :thumb:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

tel3563 said:


> No need for a hotel then eh Beks:whistling: I think Chris has an invite to Robsta's:lol:


HAHAHAHA!!! It's not that local - still 20 miles away.....


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Jem said:


> I think you will find that is already taken - no vacancies there I can assure you :thumb:


Ok Jem, don't get nasty, I can stay in your gaff

I was only checking it out:innocent:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No room for a small one :crying:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> No room for a small one :crying:


You're hardly small...... :lol:

However there's a chance I have room for 2 on the day, assuming I don't get extra lodgers etc.....it is a few months away though


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sounds like a plan. We could apply each others tan, although I already promised Darren that honour.

Maybe a coat each?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Sounds like a plan. We could apply each others tan, although I already promised Darren that honour.
> 
> Maybe a coat each?


I'll be taking a photo of you, Tel and Darren applying tan to each other...that would be too funny :lol:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Beklet said:


> I'll be taking a photo of you, Tel and Darren applying tan to each other...that would be too funny :lol:


why would Darren need a Tan:lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

He gets upset when he's not included


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Have you seen the posing posts I made?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Not yet mate, will have a gander now.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

http://video.voila.fr/video/iLyROoafI2-k.html


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cr*p, can't get vids at work, barstewards.

Will try later from private.

Excited about this now Tel, considering uppage as well in anticipation. Will have to go off whoring advice till then!!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Cr*p, can't get vids at work, barstewards.
> 
> Will try later from private.
> 
> Excited about this now Tel, considering uppage as well in anticipation. Will have to go off whoring advice till then!!


I was thinking about this, the advice bit, not uppage, thats a given

I've no real clue about comp diet and posing, the vid shows the basics and seems

pretty good, Peahead says there's a bit in pumping iron with Arnold showing

someone how to pose, cant remember but its a long time since I watched it.

Dialing it in, as they say, haven't got a fvcking clue:confused1:

There's also the Tan, I presume we'll all get together on this and Tan

each other, I'm bagsing Jem and beks now so thats sorted

Also the free routine, is there one in first timers, I imagine there is, normally 1 minute

posing to music, should bring back memories of my old nightclub nights:whistling:

I have an idea I'm gonna use Sex on Fire, because I love the record and its upbeat

plus I just love KOL

Last thing, I think we must take a show in before hand so we kinda know what to expect, that Bedford one could be a possible, its fairly easy to get to

as well

what you think:confused1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I agree with what you're saying.

I also have Arnie's Bodybuilding encyclopeida thing which has posing info in it.

TBH Tel, I haven't veen began to think of the intricate details yet, other than I would rather use the stuff that Jay Cutler used in the Olympia than the real dark stuff.

I would also like to look like him, should get me the first timers 

Music, jesus, no idea! Probably something from ABBA :whistling:

I have already bagged Darren for tannage so thats sorted 

I don't get back till the 12th July so it will be hard to take in a show inbetween.

This will be a massive challenge alround for me, but I am excited about it, very excited!!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I agree with what you're saying.
> 
> I also have Arnie's Bodybuilding encyclopeida thing which has posing info in it.
> 
> ...


Big D can do us boys, and I'll do the girls, sorted:thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

FFS Tel, you can't have them all.

Fine, I'll bring my own reinforcements down 

Alot of work to do before now and then, trying to work back a 20 week prep from the date, my calender is b*llocks though, keep losing count lol.


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> I agree with what you're saying.
> 
> I also have Arnie's Bodybuilding encyclopeida thing which has posing info in it.
> 
> ...


ABBA ISNT ALLOWED - IT IS AGAINST THE RULES :cursing:

At the moment I am liking Ian Carey Project - Get Shakey [hoping it's not shakey though]

Tanning - No dream tan allowed now ? or is this show different ?

MT2 abuse well in advance


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Hmm, no comment on me doing the girls tans from Jem, must be cool with it:thumbup1:

will have to put my posing trunks on after I've done this ok


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> FFS Tel, you can't have them all.
> 
> Fine, I'll bring my own reinforcements down
> 
> Alot of work to do before now and then, trying to work back a 20 week prep from the date, my calender is b*llocks though, keep losing count lol.


could we have a look at your reinforcements around January:whistling:


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

tel3563 said:


> Hmm, no comment on me doing the girls tans from Jem, must be cool with it:thumbup1:
> 
> will have to put my posing trunks on after I've done this ok


 :blink: :w00t: :blush: :rolleye: 



tel3563 said:


> could we have a look at your reinforcements around January:whistling:


and any nice sailors you should chose to bring [sans cowboy boots mind you]


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Jem said:


> :blink: :w00t: :blush: :rolleye:
> 
> and any nice sailors you should chose to bring [sans cowboy boots mind you]


You coming to York in January:confused1: you're more than welcome:thumb:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Jem said:


> :blink: :w00t: :blush: :rolleye:
> 
> and any nice sailors you should chose to bring [sans cowboy boots mind you]


Cowboy boots are fine - I have a rather fetching pair myself, even if I can't get my bloody calves in them :cursing:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

OK Chris what I couldn't say on work e-mail was:

JUST GET ON THAT STAGE AND FÚCKING DO IT!!!!

100% behind you, it's a no-pressure comp and you'll have a lot of fun.

Plus, I get to rub my hands over two sexy muscular chests, I'll be messing my pants.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Wot he said.

We'll be there cheering you on.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

March 13th Dingbat  ie 20 weeks, isn't that a bit much?? was thinking 12-14 weeks myself

Oh, hang on, forgot your a fat fvcker :lol: :lol:

xx

24 weeks might suit you better mate


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Ouch.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'd better start now mate 

I'm all excited.

So from now till mid march I am just going to eat like a MOFO, clean, but lots.

Going to have to pack on some rather decent mass if I am going to be in any decent shape to diet and step up.

Jem; Cowboy boots and ABBA are the way forward, and I shall convince ye of the benefits.

I have always said, ABBA are impossible to dislike, and anyone who says otherwise is gay, and that includes women!!

So, I'm about to go off out whoring people to help me get in shape to kick Tels a55. Might navigate safely through Gibraltar first, but then, it's full on!!!

On a serious note, music wise I was thinking something along the lines of Linkin Park/Kanye west or maybe Motorhead - "The Game" but you really have to make sure you're on form to pull that bad boy off!


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Tel, how say you?


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> On a serious note, music wise I was thinking something along the lines of Linkin Park/Kanye west or maybe Motorhead - "The Game" but you really have to make sure you're on form to pull that bad boy off!


May I suggest Daft Punk - they have some brilliant tracks perfect for posing routines.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I am rather fond of a bit of Daft Punk.

Still not sure. Ate a bigger breakfast as well, need to seriously up food intake now and keep it clean if I am to stand any chance of getting good mass.

My poxy 17 inch guns aint gonna cut it 

Legs today, just waiting for breaky to settle. To be done with extra feeling like beating an old man is a matter of life and death.....

.....oh wait, it is


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I...
> 
> Still not sure. Ate a bigger breakfast as well, *need to seriously up food intake now and keep it clean if I am to stand any chance of getting good mass...*


NO YOU DON'T! There's absoutely no point in packing on weight to gain some muscle, only to have to shed most of it again. 

Eat the right amount of protein, eat a moderate amount of fats, and eat just enough carbs to keep yourself energised without getting porkier.

You will gain muscle just as well!

And then when you start your contest prep you won't have so much bodyfat to lose.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> Tel, how say you?


How say me what big boy:confused1:

Chris, 17" arms are gonna need some work on your frame mate, I had to measure

mine after seeing this, disappointed they were only 18" but it was cold:whistling:

All kidding aside I think it will be a good laugh if nothing else, I'm sure if you

get your training right you'll blow us all off the stage, but tbh I'd rather one

of the girls blew me off stage

You are still coming down for a pint January, course we'll have to do the gym first:rolleyes:

The one thing that concerns me is diet, I'm clueless on competition diet but have

started reading a few old comp journals on here, Miles has 2 good ones from

2008 and 2009:thumbup1: Have read first few pages and its very interesting


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> Chris, 17" arms are gonna need some work on your frame mate, I had to measure
> 
> mine after seeing this, disappointed they were only 18" but it was cold:whistling:


Ouch


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

True, but I have only started concentrating on arms a few weeks ago really.

So I will look forward to a gun off 

In all seriousness I have many week points to work on, started today when I hammered legs and realised I'd been cheating myself as today I couldn't walk out of the gym it hurt so much. Excellent kick up the ar5e it was.

I'm trying to stay away from inch's though and measuring, Ramsay knocked that right on the head, it's how you look in the mirror that counts, if you concentrate on measurements then you can overlook the important factors.

I am taking this seriously, but also as a laugh. I also see it as finally doing something to the end, or at least the start of the end if you know what I mean. Always been to frightened of failure to do anything like competition. I could have been a good rugby and basketball player but I bottled it. This is a chance to see something through that I am good at.

It will be massive fun though, a good few of us together having a laugh and getting up there, winning isn't really that important to me, it's just the getting up there and doing that matters to me, especially with my confidence issues!!!

Deffo on for training and a beer in Jan, good excuse to see each others progress as well!

Patrick, when I say seriously up food intake I mean clean, but for me a serious uppage on food intake will probably be the same as what you guys eat normally.

I think I am going to ask some one to prep me. It has been suggested and I think a very good idea, especially as then you have paid for it and it will help you stick to it, and I openly admit I don't have a clue what is required from a diet or gear perspective. Or even just getting someone in for advice would be cool, then you have another guy you don't want to let down.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Legs today, great session.

*Squats*

5 x 8 x 150kg

*Standing leg curls*

4 x 12 x 27.5kg

*Leg Extensions*

2 x 12 x full stack

10f x full stack

10f full stack

Squats were good, recovery time was minimal, although I did get caught in a daydresm between 3 and 4 set. My heart was racing and sweating buckets.

Depth and reps could maybe have been better, ship is still rolling though and I was rocking forward as it did so I kept them above parralel for safety.

My knees and hips gave me no grief at all today, good as gold!!! I even forgot my knee supports. Very chuffed at that, reckon I'm gonna be sore tomorrow!!! :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Have I been forgotten?? :crying:

So, I got a top man in to help me get ready for this.

As previously thought, loads of work to be done. Diet has been identified as a major problem. I was only consuming around 250g protein a day when in reality I need around 500gms. So plenty work to be done there!!!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Have I been forgotten?? :crying:
> 
> So, I got a top man in to help me get ready for this.
> 
> As previously thought, loads of work to be done. Diet has been identified as a major problem. I was only consuming around 250g protein a day when in reality I need around *500gms*. So plenty work to be done there!!!




Are you introducing "Your Man" onto the thread

Can you tell me what that figure is based upon? Prov won't like it:whistling:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> Are you introducing "Your Man" onto the thread


Don't tell him Chris, he has asked you twice now and you can tell it bugs him...lol

Mind games so many weeks out ya gota love it. :lol:


----------



## WRT (May 21, 2009)

500g of protein? Fvck me! How many grams of fat and carbs will you be eating on top of that?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> Don't tell him Chris, he has asked you twice now and you can tell it bugs him...lol
> 
> Mind games so many weeks out ya gota love it. :lol:


and Winger nails his colors to the mast:whistling: Tut tut, and I thought we had a bond:thumbdown:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

WRT said:


> 500g of protein? Fvck me! How many grams of fat and carbs will you be eating on top of that?


500 of each I believe, he's getting delivered to Leighton Buzzard by Wide Load Articulated Lorry:lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

tel3563 said:


> and Winger nails his colors to the mast:whistling: Tut tut, and I thought we had a bond:thumbdown:


We do but you don't weight 273 lbs...lol


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

winger said:


> We do but you don't weight 273 lbs...lol


Wingman, your forgetting one thing, BF, if chris was to get down to my levels

of BF he'd only be 193lbs, and at 7ft 2inch he's not gonna look like a Mass, is he


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

I see your point Tel. Hey Chris who is your prep guy?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I don't have any secrets from Tel.

We owe it to each other to turn up in the best condition we can for the 1 - 2.

But mainly because I'm the better man, and could be getting prepped by the Honey Monster, I'll still wipe him off that stage :tongue:


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I don't have any secrets from Tel.
> 
> We owe it to each other to turn up in the best condition we can *for the 1 - 2.*
> 
> But mainly because I'm the better man, and could be getting prepped by the Honey Monster, I'll still wipe him off that stage :tongue:


Not joking here Chris, couple of big lads down the gym have said entering a first timers is near on impossible to win, so many big fvckers who have been training all there lives on the juice etc plus a few cheating fvckers who have entered a few but don't say. Just saying don't get your hopes up:rolleyes:

I'll be happy if I dont' finish plum last:thumb:

Maybe its the classics*snigger*for us:confused1:

Could do with some informed information on this:thumbup1:

BTW I can announce that Chris's Head man is Arnold Swarfega, he's gonna clean up:lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Mate, there is also no reason not to have some hope!!

I've never entered anything trying to lose.

Not that I would be dissapointed if I didn't win, but I always aim to.

Let's just get on with it and kick there ar5es!!!!


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> Not joking here Chris, couple of big lads down the gym have said entering a first timers is near on impossible to win,* so many big fvckers who have been training all there lives on the juice et*c plus a few cheating fvckers who have entered a few but don't say. Just saying don't get your hopes up:rolleyes:
> 
> I'll be happy if I dont' finish plum last:thumb:
> 
> ...


You can only ever do 1st timers once.

These kinda guys are gonna do their area show... they're in it to win and they want to do so in front of their home crowd 

Remember with these big guys.... they may be huge and trained all their days etc.... but the pressure on them is immense as everybody has been asking them for years "when are you getting up on that stage big man....?"

They kinda have to win.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

The protein was 420 - 450gms, not 500gms, that was another conversation lol

Great start!!

Exactly Zara, and everyone has to start somewhere. I have no mis-conceptions about it at all, but I am not going there to expect last place.

Just going to train hard and eat big and let nature take its course. I know I can be massive. If I have managed to get to this size with a poor, depleted diet, I am loving the thought of what I can achieve with a good diet and more food!!!

The only other thing is that the gear will be increased as well. Upping the Test to 800mg pw, Tren should stay the same. Also I will (all things being well) not be coming off until the show is done. Then I will probs do a PCT as I am interested to see how it affects me. Will see closer to the date though.

Diet is sorted, just need to get the stuff in for it. Alot of my diet will have to come from shakes due to the lack of *GOOD* food available. Also, I just don't think I can stomach that much to get at least 450gms of protein in!!!


----------



## evad (Mar 17, 2008)

i've not been in your journal for ages fella, infact im not sure if ive been in this new one

your looking big though pal, im going to read back a few pages and see what your on/were on/etc

keep it up flower


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Nice to see you fella.

I've only just realised you have a new one as well. Some reading to do myself


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

will be good to see how you go with that higher protein intake, even if it is a little excessive (and I dont believe it is) then you can dial things aobut with your carbs and fats to ensure you gain as much muscle as possible, and as little muscle as possible. In your situation - ie time limited - I'd rather take EXCESS protein to maximise muscle growth and have some possibly wasted, than not take in enough, and lose out on potential muscle gain.

You wont get fat, or not at any degree to worry about, since you are going to monitor this and adjust carbs as you go. A little bit of fat creeping on is not a problem, probably the margin you want to be running tbh, but if too much comes on too quick, you need to tweak back the carbs - but keep that protein pinned.

The gear jump to 800mg on the test is prob a good thing overall IMO. I think your 400mg dose was a bit conservative given the bulk of you, 800mg won't be harsh or bring on any major sides (unless you are extremely unlucky) but will provide adequate environment for again maxing out the muscle you can gain, in teh time specified.

Id maybe up that tren a little too - its only at 200mg per week just now isnt it? Id go 3, or 400mg.

Going to be an interesting run until March!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

rs007 said:


> will be good to see how you go with that higher protein intake, even if it is a little excessive (and I dont believe it is) then you can dial things aobut with your carbs and fats to ensure you gain as much muscle as possible, and as little muscle as possible. In your situation - ie time limited - I'd rather take EXCESS protein to maximise muscle growth and have some possibly wasted, than not take in enough, and lose out on potential muscle gain.
> 
> You wont get fat, or not at any degree to worry about, since you are going to monitor this and adjust carbs as you go. A little bit of fat creeping on is not a problem, probably the margin you want to be running tbh, but if too much comes on too quick, you need to tweak back the carbs - but keep that protein pinned.
> 
> ...


In view of your previous survey, have you any idea how much protein per day (per kg bodyweight) maximum a guy can assimilate, Ramsay?

Your 1.8 gms/kg (IIRC) for maintenance is convincing. All the official government agency figures are lower, as are those given for athletes for growth.

The recommended 2 gms/kg actual bodyweight for growth is an apparently reasonable guess, as you can only put on so much muscle per year, and no-one has stated unequivocally how efficient the conversion of protein is.

Mike Mentzer originally disparaged "high" protein diets, but he didn't factor in conversion inefficiency, and they patently do work.

But it would be great to know how much is enough, and what too much!

I agree about upping the Tren as well as the test, BTW.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well maybe we can use me as a little test subject?

I certainly was not allowing for that much protein, I was going for 2gms/kg, which at the time was 236gms, around 200gms short, and I have always believed I should have been making more gains than I have been. Now it is upped I can see what effect it will have.

I will probably be posting pics up more often as well so that people can help me out. Being first time I still am unsure as to what may be seen as excessive fat gain or water and all that jazz.

TBH though, I have at most 1 serving spoon of rice with the 2 main meals, and at breakfast 1 serving spoon of beans and a piece of brown toast, I don't think that will break me.

Speaking to the man there, I have ordered 5 small protein shakers and then night before when I make my cassein night shake I will make the 5 shakes for the next day and put them in the fridge. That way I have everything ready for the day and I know exactly how many I have to drink, takes the thought process out of it and gets the routine going.

The only other issue I have at the moment is supps, I have on hand, Omega 3, Vit C, CLA, BCAA's, Cranberry extract, Milk Thistle plus some other bits an pieces.

I know I said I was knocking them on the head, but I think it's time I use all the tools to help me get this nailed down, so if you guys can think of a way to make these help me I'd be appreciative.

Yes Ramsay/Patrick, Tren is to be upped to 400mg as well as Test to 800mg. Time to speak to a man about a dog 

Cardio is being knocked on the head, dependant upon general health and fitness, fat will be controlled exclusively through diet.


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## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> *will be good to see how you go with that higher protein intake, even if it is a little excessive (and I dont believe it is) then you can dial things aobut with your carbs and fats to ensure you gain as much muscle as possible, and as little muscle as possible. In your situation - ie time limited - I'd rather take EXCESS protein to maximise muscle growth and have some possibly wasted, than not take in enough, and lose out on potential muscle gain.*
> 
> *
> *
> ...


You and I are completely singing from the same hym sheet on this one as you know... so totally agree its not too much.

I'm 132lbs and assuming I have 17lbs fat I take weight as 115lbs x 1.818gms protein per lean lb my daily protein intake is 210gms.

Has always worked for me...... :thumbup1:


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> You and I are completely singing from the same hym sheet on this one as you know... so totally agree its not too much.
> 
> I'm 132lbs and assuming I have 17lbs fat I take weight as 115lbs x 1.818gms protein per lean lb my daily protein intake is 210gms.
> 
> Has always worked for me...... :thumbup1:


There's some confusion over this!

As far as I know Ramsay's figure is 1.8 gms per kilo, not per pound.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> There's some confusion over this!
> 
> As far as I know Ramsay's figure is 1.8 gms per kilo, not per pound.


per pound Patrick!

Thing is there are folks can get by on much less - clearly, those are the lucky ones. Maybe their muscles tissue is more robust than average, and doesnt get broken down as quickly, or maybe thier digestion/absrbtion is super efficient - or maybe both. And maybe 101 other unknown factors. But for the average non blessed guy, 1.8g per lb lean wieght (add the .018 for zara, she's a bit anal  ) seems a good ballpark for maintenance and logically, anything over that provides growth margin - which is why, as long as an individual isnt obese, I tell them jsut to use their actual wieght - gives growth margin.

RE your question about maximum assimilation etc, I just cannot answer that, so I am not going to bullsh1t and make out I can.

And, I don't think it is a question that can get an answer anyway. So many things interfere with protein before it even gets to the muscle, let alone after that.

Some genetically or environmentally advantageous people, clearly, can assimilate at a crazy rate, and get to crazy amounts of muscle tissue. This is your Ronnie Colemans of the world.

I don't know if Chris is like this. But, by him going on a higher protein intake the fact is all the raw materials are there for the taking, there if his body is prepared ot use it.

Kinda like a "better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it" situation.

There are so so many variables though. I mean I think digestion/assimilation or SOMTHING in the chain can get lazy when there is plenty of nutrition around. The human body seems wonderfully adaptive and adept at attaining homeostasis. Just recently I have wondered about periodic fasting to prevent this from happening, I might experiment with this myself soon.

I think assimilation of protein can also be "swamped" for want of a better word, on an instantaneous scale. Like, for example, if you neck a large whey protein drink - down it in seconds - I think your digestive system (due to teh ease of digestion of whey) cansupply it into the blood stream and the muscles at a far higher rate than the muscle tissue coudl ever hope to do anything with - and most of it gets wasted. This is why I tend to sip or take my time with whey shakes, taking the odd mouthful over the course of 30-60 minutes. Kinda like a drip feed situation, hoping to drop enough into my system to do the job, but not overwhelm it.

I suppose the key would be to define this rate of assimilation for a given individual, and aim proitein intake to feed this. But I jsut don't know if we are looking for the holy grail here, I don't know if this can ever be determined. I mean I suspect its going to be highly variable, constantly changing....

Who knows.

Simplest approach - find a ball park amount, and eat slightly above that, spacing the protein out as well as is practically possible.

Anyway - you could take all this wild rambling with a hefty pinch of salt if you like. I am not a big guy. I have trouble putting size on. So - anyone reading this post, if it interests you, and you find it makes logical sense, great - but always keep in mind I myself admit I cant show the proof of it... don't place too much faith in me, I don't hold the greatest of it in me myself!


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Well maybe we can use me as a little test subject?
> 
> I certainly was not allowing for that much protein, I was going for 2gms/kg, which at the time was 236gms, around 200gms short, and I have always believed I should have been making more gains than I have been. Now it is upped I can see what effect it will have.
> 
> ...


Seen as I am always the gentleman, just to let you know that most protein

manufacturers DON'T recommend making up more than 20 mins before drinking.

This is to do with the degradation of the protein, Ithink its called degradation:confused1:

ie it starts to break down after 30 mins (mixed), so if left overnight it will be considerably compromised.

Suprised your guru didn't know this, pffft, I hope your not paying him much

You are on 1.8g's protein per lb yes? Probably not far off what I'm on tbh, I'm nearer 1.5

but your taking lashings of more gear than me:whistling: Any orals involved?

Interesting that your upping everything rather than upping the important thing "workrate":whistling:

Cardio knocked on the head, you lazy b4stard:rolleyes:

I'll be interested to see how you get on over the next couple of weeks, as you have fvck all left to blame now:lol:

xx


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## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Nice post RS

I think I read too much and worry too much about the details, then get bogged down in the figures, confuse myself and give up.

Keeping it simple sounds good to me !


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

chris keeping it simple :lol: :lol: :lol:

Read back a few pages love, he's tried everything except sticking a daffodil up his arris

I believe thats next on the agenda

Just saying


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## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

tel3563 said:


> Seen as I am always the gentleman, just to let you know that most protein
> 
> manufacturers DON'T recommend making up more than 20 mins before drinking.
> 
> ...


Tel :confused1: give it a rest, anyone would think you were competitive :whistling:


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Jem said:


> Tel :confused1: give it a rest, anyone would think you were competitive :whistling:


Me:eek: :innocent:

He fecking knows i'm joshing:cool2:


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

rs puts tel on ignore   

Re the protein breaking down thing, I have heard this, Dougie from Extreme says that in dried out powder form, protein powder essentially doesnt degrade in any time we will be likely to use it - but as soon as it is in liquid, it can (think can is the key word) start to degrade.

I'd imagine if you keep it refrigerated, and maybe make them up the morning of the day you intend to drink them, they will probably be alright - weeman and myself do this successfully, just for the practicality of it to be honest.

What is your "working shift" on the boat? Like even if you jsut make up 2 or 3 in advance to cover you for this, then make up the rest (when you arent working) as and when you need them? Just in case you are worried about degradation...

Who is your guru, if its that fkn weeman you need to have a word with yourself :lol:


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Jem said:


> I think I read too much and worry too much about the details, then get bogged down in the figures, confuse myself and give up.
> 
> Keeping it simple sounds good to me !


I def do that to, and I know myself I can spout a lot of sh1t in posts. But the only reason I do is so I can counter all the myth and bullsh1t that you come accross in this sport - you need to learn the language to pick the flaws out of the arguments - if it werent for that, I wouldnt bother my ar$e because to be honest, I believe in Keep It Simple myself!!!


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

rs007 said:


> rs puts tel on ignore    You can't ignore the truth
> 
> Who is your guru, if its that fkn weeman you need to have a word with yourself :lol:


Is that last bit directed at me or Chris:confused1: If he's got Weeman he'd be a very lucky boy imo:cool2:He really knows his stuff:thumbup1:


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Fvck off tel, who do you think weeman comes to :whistling:


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Now, please note, I'm not contradicting Ramsay for the sake of it, but 1.8 gms per pound b/weight per day equates to 3.96 gms per kilo - which is a huge amount of protein.

A 250 pound bloke would then eat 450 gms of protein alone a day - a whole pound, or 7 pounds a week. I find it hard to believe that even allowing for a poor assimilation ratio, youd need to eat 364 pounds of protein a year to put on the 12 pounds or so pure muscle generally reckoned possible, or even 20 pounds!

And consider this, corroborated from several sources:

"The world health organization established a daily protein requirement less than the UK Department of Health and Social Security and US RDA. Using the high and low recommendations together provides an acceptable range for daily protein requirement.

Men and women protein intake range based on ideal body weight:

Minimum Daily Protein Requirement: W.H.O. recommends 0.45 grams of nprotein per kilogram of ideal body weight per day.

Maximum Daily Protein Requirement: US RDA recommends 0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of ideal body weight per day. The UK Department of Health and Social Security is approximately the same.

If you are currently doing endurance training your daily protein requirement increases by 1 to 1.2 grams per kilogram of ideal body weight per day.

However, there is no recommended daily protein requirement for weight or strength training.

Additionally, the daily requirements do not increase for people over their ideal body weight. This is because amino acids are not needed to support fat cells.

...

High Protein Diet - exceeding the daily maximum protein requirement:

Most people meet their daily protein requirements by many times over. In addition there is a misconception that a high protein diet is helpful for training. High protein diets do not help improve muscle strength or aid in training. In fact, high protein diets can be harmful to your health. There is far more risk to your health from high protein diet than from low protein diet.

Proteins have a high amount of nitrogen. When nitrogen is broken down in the liver it creates ammonia. Ammonia is poisonous. The increased level of ammonia in the body is harmful to cells and may decrease atheletic performance.

Stress on kidneys occurs when more than 2 grams per kilogram of ideal body weight per day is consumed.

High levels of protein intake require increased amount of vitamin B6. It is possible to become deficient in vitamin B6 while using a high protein diet.

Calcium loss, which leads to osteoporosis, occurs with high levels of protein intake."

The bit saying "there is a misconception that a high protein diet is helpful for training. High protein diets do not help improve muscle strength or aid in training" needs careful reading. It is indeed the case that a higher than necessary protein intake will not give greater gains in strength or size than is possible. But what is the optimum amount?

Taking judicious note of all the above, I suggest that 2 gms per *kilogram* actual (rather than ideal) bodyweight per day seems an ample amount for gaining muscle.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

it is a lot of protein Patrick, I wish I could get away on less as I am sure plenty others do to - but regardless to the sources you have quoted, I have corooborated this in real life with a number of competitive bbers and it bears out.

The other thing is, I think you are equating protein intake purely with muscle gained, struggling to reason why you should have to take in so much protein to gain such a small amount.

I don't see why this is so hard to understand?

Muscle is in a constant state of flux. So much of that protein is just getting turned over in the muscle, just meeting maintenance needs. Obviously, if you don't meet this, you cant grow, so must eat above this.

In fact, I am surprised it isnt higher in a lot of cases.

Then, forgetting muscle for a moment, we are all growing/replacing/repairing hair, nails, skin, organs - and this requires protein too.

There is logical reason to believe that most or all of these requirements are drastically increased with the type of training that we, as bodybuilders, put ourselves through. I say logical reason, because, to my knowledge, no specific long term study has ever been done on us specifically and what we do. No profit in it.

So we only have anecdotal to go by.

As for kidney stress, calcium loss, higher levels of vits etc, this is all fairly logically obvious - think about it - what is the average wieght of a standard, healthy, non trianing male.

Then look at what we are trying to achieve. 60 70 80 lb or more muscular tissue on our frames, than we were ever designed to carry.

It simply is not natural in any meaning of the word.

Obviously other systems are going to become limiting, weak link in the chain. Its a non question, and if it surprises anyone, then they need to slap themselves. I mean if it werent for this, people could probably keep growing - fact is you can only be as strong as the weakes link in your chain.

Luckily, for the most of us, we have enough in built margin for safety in our systems and organs to cope. Unluckily for some, some don't, and we have seen that over the decades.

What do you expect? Massive amount of muscle are not built on fresh air.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Taking judicious note of all the above, I suggest that 2 gms per *kilogram* actual (rather than ideal) bodyweight per day seems an ample amount for gaining muscle.


I disagree Patrick. Unlike your post, which seems a collection of cut and paste from organisations and sources who do not have the faintest idea of bodybuilding much less any real world experience of it, I have SEEN with my OWN eyes, that a range of advanced bodybuilders always end up with a bodywieght in lb around 1.8 times their protein intake in g.

I have seen it first hand with myself. If I have a protein intake of 350g, I end up at at pretty much bang on 14 stone - 196lb - pretty much 350/1.8. Obviously there is some interaction with carb levels, that goes without saying, but this is concrete for me and plenty others. A few weeks out last year I had more muscle. I was on 400g protein. I was heavier as a result. I panicked, thinking I needed to be lighter (even I get sucked into that mind fvck occasionally) dropped my protien 50g, and hit the glide slope which brough me in at 14 stone, quite simply because there wasnt enough protein there to maintain any more muscle - and I lost size.

People can take from that what they will - hey its up to each individual on this site what they want to go with, no skin of my nose. But think on this.

How many avatars do we see that although changed regularly, the subject has not.

How many progress journals, have viable, actual progress in them.

Protein is expensive. Therefore people are all to willing to accept and believe they should get away with less.

All fine by me, to each his (or her!) own!


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

here is one last parting thought, RE protein levels, and what we need for growth.

I was watching a TopGear repeat last night, James May was taking the Bugatti Veyron to its max speed - 250odd mph.

They were talking about power requirements, to reach certain speeds. Apparently, to reach 155mph, the car only needs 270bhp.

But, to get the next 100mph to take the car to 253mph, requires another 730bhp.

The reasoning James May gave for this is almost poetic, and totaly portable to our cause.

He says "The faster you go, the more mother nature tries to hold you back"

Think about that for a moment, maybe in your mind, replace "faster you go" with "bigger you get"

That analogy is perfect, I don't think I need to explain it any further, it covers every concern that Patrick raises.


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

I have no problem believing the bodybuilders need significantly more protein than ordinary people, Ramsay.

But the difference between even 2 gms/kg recommended for athletes and 3.96 gms/kg needs serious questioning.

A 250 pound bloke consuming (at 1.8 gms/pound) 450 gms protein a day rather than 227 gms (at 2 gms/kg) might be eating a surplus of at least 223 gms a day, or 892 calories' worth, some 47% of which which could ultimately be stored as fat.

I suspect that, allowing for some statistical variation, most guys have very similar protein assimilation rates, as your survey seemed to show.

The protein makers would love us to eat loads of the stuff. I'm perfectly happy to eat just as much as is necessary to gain the maximum possible lean muscle.

But for our pockets' and health's sake it would be good to know how much protein we really do need.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I suspect that, allowing for some statistical variation, most guys have very similar protein assimilation rates, as your survey seemed to show.
> 
> I suspect this too
> 
> ...


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Well, I suspect in your terms I must be a minor freak, then, as I've been gaining lean muscle steadily, blasting and cruising over the year, such that people at the Hercules remark on it, and I'm eating about 2 gms protein/kg/day and no-where near 1.8 gms/pound. :thumb:

But I'd still value more info on the optimum protein intake rate - maybe I could grow bigger even faster, but I think necking much more protein would be a chore! Perhaps I'll experiment.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Not disagreeing with anyone here but what if the more protein your body gets used to the more your body needs that level of protein just to maintain that size?

Also how much protein can you assimilate in one feed?


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Well, I suspect in your terms I must be a minor freak, then, as I've been gaining lean muscle steadily, blasting and cruising over the year, such that people at the Hercules remark on it, and I'm eating about 2 gms protein/kg/day and no-where near 1.8 gms/pound. :thumb:


Patrick - I know I said in message nothing personal, but what I am about to say, has to get a little personal, I only hope you do not take offence at it.

[RS thinks hard for best wording to get point accross]

Patrick, you are a big guy, but the pics I have seen, I would never have said 270lb (I think this is what you said you wiegh?)

You do look big... but you don't look like what I would want a man of average hieght to look like, at 270lb. Are you really tall?

Especially, when you take into consideration certain physical constraints you have - for you to STILL wiegh 270, with a major part of your body missing, is no mean feat. But I'd expect you to be a good bit more muscular in appearance for that bodywieght.

Also, you arent anywhere near ripped either - you arent fat - but you do have enough bodyfat to significantly skew things.

Let me underscore this by stating that I am only going on your avatar, and a few pics of the night out at Cheshire Cheese to go by - I accept hardly the most accurate of mediums. - I also therefore accept that everything I have just said could be a lot of sh1t.

I genuinely hope you don't take offence to this - but if you serve yourself up as an example, you have to expect counter. I have also put myself up as example a couple of posts up - feel free to tear apart mate 

But my main limiting factor is finance, I know that myself.

However, in answer to your question, I do reckon their must be something of the genetic positive about you, for you to hold that mass, regardless of what that mass might comprise.

BUT

No matter how you look right now, I bet you could change your composition around with upping protein, and lowering carbs a bit, its a no brainer - everyone could.


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

I'll PM you Ramsay, so we don't hijack Chris's thread any longer!


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I'll PM you Ramsay, so we don't hijack Chris's thread any longer!


Personally I'd like to see the debate continue on the thread, its very interesting

and I'm sure I'm not the only one to think so and I can almost certainly say on his

behalf that chris will be interested in the difference in opinion


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

winger said:


> Not disagreeing with anyone here but what if the more protein your body gets used to the more your body needs that level of protein just to maintain that size?
> 
> I think acclimatisation could be an issue, maybe efficiency? Like, when your body has plenty of anything, it doesnt have to be so efficient? Yet when a restriction is in place, metabolic changes occur, and efficiency goes through the roof.
> 
> ...


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> Personally I'd like to see the debate continue on the thread, its very interesting
> 
> and I'm sure I'm not the only one to think so and I can almost certainly say on his
> 
> behalf that chris will be interested in the difference in opinion


No, it prob has went a bit too far, I can get carried away sometimes and I apologise - we will just go round in circles if it goes on much longer - there is no right and wrong here, I dont think it is a debate that can be "won" (for want of a better word).

Each individual just has to think outside the box, try what they think makes sense, and measure what happens.

So many people just go on doing the same thing, expecting different results.



Prodiver said:


> I'll PM you Ramsay, so we don't hijack Chris's thread any longer!


No problem Patrick, I genuinely didnt mean any offence with my post above, only too happy to go to pms if you prefer.


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## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> Seen as I am always the gentleman, just to let you know that most protein
> 
> manufacturers DON'T recommend making up more than 20 mins before drinking.
> 
> ...


Is called "denaturing" and am fairly certain his "guru" is aware of it.... 



tel3563 said:


> chris keeping it simple :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> Read back a few pages love, he's tried everything except sticking a daffodil up his arris
> 
> ...


Least he's trying things.... 



Prodiver said:


> Now, please note, I'm not contradicting Ramsay for the sake of it, but 1.8 gms per pound b/weight per day equates to 3.96 gms per kilo - which is a huge amount of protein.
> 
> A 250 pound bloke would then eat 450 gms of protein alone a day - a whole pound, or 7 pounds a week. I find it hard to believe that even allowing for a poor assimilation ratio, youd need to eat 364 pounds of protein a year to put on the 12 pounds or so pure muscle generally reckoned possible, or even 20 pounds!


Patrick not being funny but ask round competitive bodybuilders and you will find that this is exactly what they do.... Seriously.... go google some well known names for their diets as many of them are available to see...



Prodiver said:


> And consider this, corroborated from several sources:
> 
> "The world health organization established a daily protein requirement less than the UK Department of Health and Social Security and US RDA. Using the high and low recommendations together provides an acceptable range for daily protein requirement.
> 
> ...


These figures are very very old and [email protected] and not been updated in YEARS and based on a very flawed study done in the 70's on recovering alcoholics who were already suffering renal and liver failure and it was could not assimilate more than 30gms protein per serving as it caused stress to the subjects renal system as the demands put on the kidneys to process the additional nitrogen (and elevated urea) were increased.... Pretty much all other studies around that time were done on sick people who's bodies were not working efficiently. Subsequent studies have shown them to be completely inaccurate but the organisations you quote have never updated their recommendations.



Prodiver said:


> If you are currently doing endurance training your daily protein requirement increases by 1 to 1.2 grams per kilogram of ideal body weight per day.
> 
> *However, there is no recommended daily protein requirement for weight or strength training.*


Just because some outdated organisation doesnt specifically recommend it doesnt mean its not required.



Prodiver said:


> Additionally, the daily requirements do not increase for people over their ideal body weight. This is because amino acids are not needed to support fat cells.


we're not talking about fat people here...

hang on where is this from because i have read it before somewhere else word for word....... :confused1:



Prodiver said:


> ...
> 
> High Protein Diet - exceeding the daily maximum protein requirement:
> 
> ...


I tell you this right now patrick and sorry to be so blunt about this.....

Go state that last part to an olympian and watch them p1ss their knickers laughing at you mate.....


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## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> In fact, I would go so far to say, the only ones who I do see making progress, are typically on similar levels of protein to what I am talking about. Apart from cnts like Con or Joe who are clearly freaks of the highest order


Dunno about Con but sure we had this convo with Joe and it turned out that despite the jaffa cakes and all, he does actually take in around this amount of protein too..... jokes and all that about diet but is careful to keep protein intake up...

[/QUOTE]


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Keep the debate going, it's informative and Chris needs more posts on his journal, trust me, I doubt he minds. :whistling:

But Rams, like I said before in the same debate, 2 guys at my gym that are the leanest and strongest are vegetarians and they don't even eat meat or eggs.

One of the guys does dips and pull-ups each workout and trains for at least an hour a day, 5 days a week.

So what I am saying is there is always exceptions to the rule and that throws everything off.

I said a whole lot of nothing...lol

How about this, eat a chicken breast that's about 35 grams of protein and eat the for 5 meals with your carbs and fats and tell me that isn't a lot of food. That's only 175 grams of protein and that is light by any one's standards, or is it?


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> ...
> 
> I tell you this right now patrick and sorry to be so blunt about this.....
> 
> Go state that last part to an olympian and watch them p1ss their knickers laughing at you mate.....


I really don't think there's any reason to believe that the daily protein requirements that were worked out independently by a number of organizations and which largely concur are wrong because they haven't been updated!

I've talked to two bodybuilding-friendly docs about protein intake, and they both doubt that such large amounts are necessary. But we're open to being persuaded by hard evidence, though not anecdote.

I'm not convinced that all the Olympians eat so much protein - the literally great Mike Mentzer certainly didn't. And if any do, it may simply go to provide part of their energy needs rather than protein. Expensive - though they prob get their protein free...


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

OK here's what I just PMd Ramsay:

After cruising for some 6 weeks and having had flu, I'm currently around 110 kg, down from 116 kg, and smoother than I was, but not noticeably fat. I seem to have kept my muscle gains but rather lost bodyfat! :thumb:

My carbon-fibre and alloy prosthesis weighs around 7 kg. But let's say my actual remaining bodyweight is 100 kg.

My prosthetist tells me that a whole leg of a normally-muscled guy equates with 25% of his bodyweight, a muscle guy maybe more but, since I have a stump, in my case I have lost around 20%. So currently I have about 80% of my "complete" bodyweight.

So if we multiply 100 kg by 100/80 I would normally weigh 125 kg, or 275 lbs. At 116 kg I would be approaching 300 lbs.

It may be that my current protein intake is more than adequate for my actual remaining body weight as, thinking about it, I suspect I eat neaer 250 gms of protein a day on average rather than 200, but certainly nowhere near 396 (100 kg @ 1.8 gms/lb).

There's apparently no easy way to determine protein conversion. Protein does not appear at unusual levels in the urine until a significant excess is being metabolized to glucose and already stored as fat.

If you don't eat sufficient protein you won't grow lean muscle at all, or slower than you could by eating more.

If you eat excess protein, you will grow lean muscle no faster but get fatter, yet you won't know if this is from excess carbs or protein unless you limit your carbs.

Then if you reduce your protein intake and find you haven't enough energy and lose muscle you know your carb intake isn't high enough and your prtotein is being robbed for energy.

But if you have enough energy to live and do intense workouts, but are maintining the same amount of fat or losing it yet gaining muscle, you would be justified in increasing your protein intake to see if you gained faster. If you got fatter you'd know you were eating excess protein.

This is the only way I can see we can arrive at sensible protein and carb intakes.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice post Patrick.

From the great Mike Mentzer, notice the ratios? I disagree but just throwing that out there.

He recommends 60c-25p-15f click http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1KKzIAu-ms.

If Chris maintained that ratio and ate 300 grams of protein what would his over all caloric intake be? It's not rhetorical, you guys do the math and post that sh1t up....lol :beer:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I really don't think there's any reason to believe that the daily protein requirements that were worked out independently by a number of organizations and which largely concur are wrong because they haven't been updated!


They wont have worked them out themselves, they will have based them on medical studies and scientific papers published already. And as such the likelihood is they had access to the same studies and papers....

And no that cant have been updated since they concur with the 1970's studies and subsequent studies have disproven this...



Prodiver said:


> I've talked to two bodybuilding-friendly docs about protein intake, and they both doubt that such large amounts are necessary. But we're open to being persuaded by hard evidence, though not anecdote.
> 
> I'm not convinced that all the Olympians eat so much protein - the literally great Mike Mentzer certainly didn't. And if any do, it may simply go to provide part of their energy needs rather than protein. Expensive - though they prob get their protein free...


Mike Mentzer had a pleasing shape but was half the size of Ronnie Coleman.....

And I'm not debating cost here thats another subject.



Prodiver said:


> OK here's what I just PMd Ramsay:
> 
> After cruising for some 6 weeks and having had flu, I'm currently around 110 kg, down from 116 kg, and smoother than I was, but not noticeably fat. I seem to have kept my muscle gains but rather lost bodyfat! :thumb:
> 
> ...


which is precisely what competitve bodybuilders do... when dieting and often offseason to regulate weight too.

If I cut carbs and eat 1.818gms protein per lean lb, I lose fat and can continue to grow muscle.

Conclusive enough that it works for me.

Am not gonna name names as its not my place, but I could name Uni and Mr Britain winners who I know for a fact agree the same.



Prodiver said:


> Then if you reduce your protein intake and find you haven't enough energy and lose muscle you know your carb intake isn't high enough and your prtotein is being robbed for energy.


Indeed but sod that....



Prodiver said:


> But if you have enough energy to live and do intense workouts, but are maintining the same amount of fat or losing it yet gaining muscle, you would be justified in increasing your protein intake to see if you gained faster. If you got fatter you'd know you were eating excess protein.


which is what ramsay and myself and all these people we are talking about have been doing for years and have figured out already.... then we realised that it wasnt just us lot but is happening the same all over at much higher levels everywhere and seem to be settled on very similar or same figures as we are saying here.



Prodiver said:


> This is the only way I can see we can arrive at sensible protein and carb intakes.


Yeah. Done already mate.

All over the world and for years. How else do you think people diet for comps and stay full and muscular and lose all the fat....??? :confused1:

Its not guesswork you know.... trial and error and experience by many many different people.... these figures weren't plucked out of nowhere.....


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> Nice post Patrick.
> 
> From the great Mike Mentzer, notice the ratios? I disagree but just throwing that out there.
> 
> ...


5700 cals a day.

300 gms protein @ 2 gms/kg/day would indicate he weighed 150 kg, or 330 pounds. What did he actually weigh?

He originally said that you only need eat about 1 gram extra protein over normal requirements a day to gain 12 pounds of muscle a year...


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

What works for some wont work for others. I myself I can take in 20 grams a day for carbs and feel great with no bloat, but another person will feel tired and lethargic.

This is why no one can come up with solid evidence of how many grams can we take in for one meal for protein or carbs. We are all different.

Funny, IMO the elite bb has the genetics and responds well to all drugs, that is why he is the elite. How do I pic out the elite?

That is the person that can train for 2 years and win competitions!

Chris, I love the way your journal just went...lol


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> What works for some wont work for others. I myself I can take in 20 grams a day for carbs and feel great with no bloat, but another person will feel tired and lethargic.
> 
> This is why no one can come up with solid evidence of how many grams can we take in for one meal for protein or carbs. We are all different.
> 
> ...


There will always be some exceptional cases, but we shouldn't over-emphasise them. Humans differ much less than they are alike.

Actual differences in exercise strictness, persistence, true diet, supplements and gear and other activities are far more sgfnificant than genetics for the great majority of bodybuilders, and what works for the average guy will work for most - ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Prodiver said:


> There will always be some exceptional cases, but we shouldn't over-emphasise them. Humans differ much less than they are alike.
> 
> Actual differences in exercise strictness, persistence, true diet, supplements and gear and other activities are far more sgfnificant than genetics for the great majority of bodybuilders, and what works for the average guy will work for most - ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL.


I agree 100% Patrick.

So let me ask in your opinion what would be the perfect ratio of proteins to carbs to fats beings as all beings are equal?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> They wont have worked them out themselves, they will have based them on medical studies and scientific papers published already. And as such the likelihood is they had access to the same studies and papers....
> 
> And no that cant have been updated since they concur with the 1970's studies and subsequent studies have disproven this...
> 
> ...


Can't rebutt all the points easily as the quoting's all fvcked up.

But how can I have been so ignorant!? Forgive me - I've only been bodybuilding for about 35 years. 

Most bodybuilders do not use the approach I'm talking about here and in other threads - that's why I've been slated. Most are incredibly hit and miss. The figures often quoted do seem to be largely plucked out of nowhere - and yet when I do quote some credible official figures they're dismissed!

As I say, I remain to be convinced but, especially in the light of long discussions with doctor friends, I have yet to see any convincing evidence that amything like 1.8 grams per *pound* bodyweight is necessary!

Anyone's free to eat as much protein as they believe is necessary. I want to know how much really is.

Just think of all that (expensive) protein being necked and turned into energy, not muscle!


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> I agree 100% Patrick.
> 
> So let me ask in your opinion what would be the perfect ratio of proteins to carbs to fats beings as all beings are equal?


I don't know - and I haven't found anyone else who convincingly does! All the recommended ratios seem to be "plucked out of thin air"!

That's why I adopted my lean muscle gain approach (which few bodybuilders till now have followed) of not sticking to any amounts except your protein intake - which is why it's so important to know what it needs to be.

And no-one seems to know that either. So far from a hit and miss cutting-type diet, we need a solidly-documented empirical approach, backed up by repeatable observation and nutritional logic.

In fact what we need is a sliva- or breath-type test to show whether all the protein we eat is being assimilated or how much is being turned into glucose.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Boom for post sakes....lol

Chris you slipped in when Joe is on the mend.. :beer:


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Calories in calories burned, now figure out what the ratios are for carbs to fats, to proteins, or does it really boil down to just numbers.

Fiber counts?

What type of fats?

The type of protein?

Or is it just calories?

Oh yea drink lots of water...lol


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> Calories in calories burned, now figure out what the ratios are for carbs to fats, to proteins, or does it really boil down to just numbers.
> 
> Fiber counts?
> 
> ...


See, Wings, this is the problem - good hard facts mixed up with uncertainty and heresay.

"Calories in calories burned" has a grain of truth about it: any calories you consume but don't burn will be stored as fat.

But it tells us nothing about the ratios, and certainly not the types od carbs, fats amd protein we need.

Fortunately there's a reliable way to assess whether we're drinking too little, sufficient or too much water...


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

That's why I recommend a good beer..lol





 :whistling:

Maximum expenditure in the shortest amount of time.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Jeez, I slip off for a few hours rest and come back and the place has exploded.

All good 

Seriously, I love the debate in here, keep it coming as long as possible, as long as everyone plays nice!! Just wish I could contribute more to it that's all :whistling:

From my point of view, I'm not discounting anything, but I have a game plan, so I am going to stick with it and see how it goes. If as we progress it doesn't seem to be working then things can be changed down the line :thumb:

Tel, keep the banter coming, I love it. Got to have some light heartedness in here as well, I know it's all in fun 

Winger, I think there is something wrong with me mate, I went out for my trainee's 21st last night, managed 1/4 of a Vodka Diet Coke and had to leave it! You wouldn't have been proud :crying:

Point taken on the denaturing. No reason why I can't make 2 batchs a day. One at 3 am and one at 3pm, routine is the key!

Ramsay/Patrick, great discussion, loved it. Can't say either way who'e correct, maybe it's just all down to personal experience?? Why don't you try it Ramsay's way Patrick and see if it does make a difference? Is that not a possibility?


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> That's why I recommend a good beer..lol
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Presumably your wife's shopping philosophy..?


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> ...
> 
> Ramsay/Patrick, great discussion, loved it. Can't say either way who'e correct, maybe it's just all down to personal experience?? Why don't you try it Ramsay's way Patrick and see if it does make a difference? Is that not a possibility?


Yes - already said I'll prob experiment. But do you realize how much protein 1.8 gms per *pound* bodyweight is!?

For me at an actual weight of 100 kg that's almost 400 gms protein.

Without food, that's 10 scoops of high quality protein a day, more of lower quality!

For you it's even more! Yuk! :laugh:

I suspect it's not such a high protein intake that's responsible for maximum growth, but sufficient gear.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Well as I mentioned, gear will be doubled. 800mg Test and 400mg Tren.

Bit confused as I only have 2ml barrels, so I would have to do 2 jabs? Same site?

Yes Patrick, I am on 420-450gms protein a day, 5 x 50/60gms a day, unfortunately due to the rubbish unhealthy food I have to do it this way.

It will all be for the greater good I am sure. Although I am full all the time now


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Is called "denaturing" and am fairly certain his "guru" is aware of it....
> 
> Least he's trying things....


Zara, are you aware that both myself and Chris both have a sense of humour, I think the phase I'm looking for is chillax:thumbup1:


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Am I missing something here, as I see it on both pov

If you take in too much protein the body utilitses it as an energy source, ie it sort of becomes

a carb! Yes??

So as long as you get enough or too much protein (keeping it same every day is obviously

preferential), the rest of the diet can be adjusted so you don't get fat but have enough energy

for workouts and day to day things.

If this is correct then there will never be a correct ratio of protein to bw as any amount

as long as its above your needs will be correct, you just adjust carbs and fats, or have I got it

all wrong


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Yes - already said I'll prob experiment. But do you realize how much protein 1.8 gms per *pound* bodyweight is!?
> 
> For me at an actual weight of 100 kg that's almost 400 gms protein.
> 
> ...


I don't know why you have such a hard time getting your head round this number?

Its not a new thing, I could name countless examples. Serge Nubret used to eat 3-4 KILOGRAMS of horsemeat each day at his peak (the man himself said this)

Kinda reminds me of a physics teacher who flatly refused to believe us when I told him his car wieghed about a tonne, couldn't comprehend it wieghed that much. But it did, and most cars do. Just the way it is.

Are you really 100kg though Patrick - I am 115kg as the scale reads, not a lot smaller and maybe a little leaner than you... but even then I know come show time I'll be lucky to be 15 stone - probably closer to 14 and a half - and I already know I will need 365-370g of protein to maintain, never mind any formula.

As we have discussed, you will need markedly less protein in terms of total amount anyway to see results, as there is a large area of your body you simply do not have to maintain anymore.

Finally, this is not an effort to sell Protein - I am a little unsure if that is the drive of some of the cynicism in here? Apologies if I am picking up on a red herring. I am sponsored by a protien company, but i have never tried to flog protein on my way of thinking here - hell, eat it in meat if you want - plenty have over the decades - I could care less.

Winger - RE ratios - my gut feeling (and it is just that) is that an ideal ratio will not exist - why would it? Carbs requirements are going to be based solely on the individual, their metabolism, and their activity level.

Protein requirements - regardless what your stance on overall intake is, I think we can all agree will be relatively static, tied to the amount of tissue you hold.

I cant see why their would be any explicit tie between carb and protein levels.

I find fats more interesting, but tbh just havent looked into them in too great a detail as of yet.


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## DanJ (Sep 12, 2008)

rs007 said:


> I don't know why you have such a hard time getting your head round this number?
> 
> Its not a new thing, I could name countless examples. Serge Nubret used to eat 3-4 KILOGRAMS of horsemeat each day at his peak (the man himself said this)
> 
> ...


I have to say i'm with you on this Rams, i have gained 7 1/2 stone in just under three years and always kept my protein high. Whenever i dropped back my gains seemed to stop until i increased again. I'm not fat and consider myself to be in relatively decent condition for someone who has gained so quickly.

Good luck with the show by the way Chris, it will be good to meet you.

Dan:thumbup1:


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## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Yes - already said I'll prob experiment. But do you realize how much protein 1.8 gms per *pound* bodyweight is!?
> 
> For me at an actual weight of 100 kg that's almost 400 gms protein.
> 
> ...


I wasnt on last night so missed all this but here's my input.

Instead of mega quoting posts from the last cpl pages i'll just try and address things quickly from my point of view.

Pat,the thing i think you are missing all thru this thread regarding proof of what works is this,there are an insurmountable amount of competitors out there using the 1.8g per lb thing with great success,they have also tried every other method going i'll bet but its no coincidence that the vast majority have arrived at the same conclusion.

Look at what all the top prep guys recomend,if they want to be worth their salt and produce results and the best they can from their athletes then they need to be on the game and know their sh1t,if they were to go by some paltry figures that were deemed the recomended amounts during the 70's,on untrained recovering alcoholics i couldnt bare to imagine how badly athletes would look these days on stage.

A friend of mine,a NABBA pro,been competing for about 20 years,has probably tried every method going in order to gain and maintain muscle size,this year did something different for a change,he normally dropped off his protein coinsumption going into shows,this time around he didnt,his protein consumption was just over 500g a day in the end,the result?the biggest hardest version of himself yet.

Thats just one man,as you know Rams did a survey encompassing a lot of competitive bodybuilders who have all arrived at the same conclusion,again some of their careers are tipping into 3 decades on certain individuals,what do they do now,1.8g per lb,how do they look?better than at any other point.

Its not a coincidence.

Using myself as an example,i dont have super genetics,not by a long shot,i stay on gear pretty much year round these days as most know,the only thing that actually really does vary with me is protein consumption.

Now in these last few months i have gone thru what i could only call a lazy patch diet wise,my prot intake would have been around the 200g mark per day at a bodyweight of about 210-220lbs,it didnt budge and condition was soft by my terms in the offseason.

Now suddenly these past few weeks i get the spark back again and between food and shakes i up my protein to 400g per day,slightly more some days if lucky,my carb and fat intake remains the same as before because it generally never changes as such,whats happened,my bodyweight has creeped up to 236lbs as of today,i am leaner and harder and stronger,to the point where gym goers have started to comment on my leanness at my size considering i am whats supposed to be offseason,now i am hardly ripped but i am prob one of your best examples of these figures working based on a person with average to good genetics who has their sh1t nailed in all other aspects.

Now i am not saying that 1.8g is the be all and end all,as there are clearly guys out there who CAN grow on less,but call me being elitist or whatever,i tend not to put solice into anyones recomendations unless i have seen them get peeled to the bone condition at some point,because until you have actually achieved that sort of thing i dont really think that you can say what works and doesnt for you as regards protein intake versus building muscle,and no matter how you argue it (yes but my bf is staying the same and i'm getting leaner etc etc) i simply wont accept it till i see the hard evidence in front of me.

Now that may seem a contradictory thing for me to say considering i just said i have gained weight and gotten leaner,but then again i regularly get into stage condition and when offseason i am only around 20lbs or so out of contest shape,so for those reasons i feel what i am saying is more than relevant.

Bottom line is this,1.8g per lb is the perfect ballpark figure if you cant accept it for anything else,some guys will grow perfectly using that amount,some will grow perfectly well on a bit less,some will require a bit more,but theres no denying that the majority arrive at this figure,and by majority again to sound elitist,just take a look at the amount of athletes gracing the stage every year and what do you think they are doing.

Also to go slightly off at a tangent,your stating that you basically wont accept it till you see proof to back it up,you want some sort of study like your outdated irrelevant one from the 70's based on untrained,ill,recovering alcoholics,yet when i ask you for evidence on another thread to back up your adament reasons for how synthol works on a muscle (ie it lubricates,not fascia stretches) you cant come up with a solid piece of evidence there,but you are insistent that the way you describe works.

sound familiar?......


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

rs007 said:


> I don't know why you have such a hard time getting your head round this number?
> 
> Its not a new thing, I could name countless examples. Serge Nubret used to eat 3-4 KILOGRAMS of horsemeat each day at his peak (the man himself said this)
> 
> ...


I don't have any trouble getting my head round the number, Rams. But if true it suggests an astonishingly low protein assimilation ratio which is just cause for caution.

It may well be that protein requirements per muscle mass gained rise exponentially - but I want to know more about this.

I wonder what the protein content per kg of horsemeat is. 

Yes, I really am about 100 kg without clothes and prosthesis, as I explained. I need about 20% less protein than a normal guy of my size. Even so at about 250 gms I currently eat nowhere near 1.8 gms/pound actual bodyweight: 396 gms.

I never believed you were trying to encourage protein sales - but I'm sure the manufacturers like to.

I agree entirely on the lack of a link between protein and carb requirements.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

weeman said:


> I wasnt on last night so missed all this but here's my input.
> 
> Instead of mega quoting posts from the last cpl pages i'll just try and address things quickly from my point of view.
> 
> ...


The SEO comparison isn't fair, Weeman. I have lots of personal experience of guys using it but unsurprisingly no accredited scientific studies have been done so I can't quote any. I did however adduce some logic to explain why I doubt fascia stretching happens, and why lubrication seems plausible.

On the other hand there's been a huge number of nutritional studies on protein requirements, most of which concur and can be found by trawling the web. They're not all out of date and on dubious cohorts, either!

Nowhere have I found an accredited study of bodybuilders' mass gains vs. protein intake - which you'd think the protein manufacturers would cite with relish.

Even so, if you read my previous posts I said I'd accept a solidly-documented empirical approach, backed up by repeatable observation and nutritional logic.

This really means getting a large number of bodybuilders to record lean mass gains vs. protein, carbs, fat, gear and other supplement intakes honestly over a considerable period.

I'm not trying to disparage the successes of any dedicated bodybuilders. I'm genuinely interested in the high protein intakes suggested and want to know how much really is necessary.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I don't have any trouble getting my head round the number, Rams. But if true it suggests an astonishingly low protein assimilation ratio which is just cause for caution.


But thats just it, I dont think it does?

I mean think about it our muscle is not fixed. It is in constant flux, proteins get damaged, through training, toxins - or simply just fail, nothing lasts forever.

How much muscle does the average non trianing human hold - and remember, muscle isnt the only tissue by a long shot that is constantly turning over protein.

Then, take a person at the extreme of development - maybe as much as 80 to 100lb EXTRA lean muscle tissue?

Since this is constantly turning over, I am actually surprised it isnt higher to be honest.

I mean for average bicep boy not an issue, but the further you go, thinking about it like that - I think it can't be a linear relationship, jsut like the horsepower/top speed analogy. Might just be that the range of guys and gals I spoke to all fell within a relatively narrow range where this could not be observed.

I wish I still had the files, I would post them all - but lost them in an unfortunate encryption incident, along with a pile of my own logs, including my 2008 prep :cursing:


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Nowhere have I found an accredited study of bodybuilders' mass gains vs. protein intake - which you'd think the protein manufacturers would cite with relish.
> 
> That, IMO is a fair point. But I guess the cost and plausibility of conducting such a study is just prohibitive - so doubt we will see it. No point waiting for the tooth fairy, she doesnt exist
> 
> ...


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

God I'm scared now. Sometimes I think I consume enough protein, sometimes not enough, now I'm really not sure at all..

Chris, draw 2ml of each of your test and tren into 2 barrels. Put the blue on the first barrel just tight enough to hold and shoot; then swap the barrels quickly, leaving the pin in your leg. I did that in my blast and it works fine. But be quick in the swap and make sure there's no air in the second barrel.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

dmcc said:


> God I'm scared now. Sometimes I think I consume enough protein, sometimes not enough, now I'm really not sure at all..
> 
> Chris, draw 2ml of each of your test and tren into 2 barrels. Put the blue on the first barrel just tight enough to hold and shoot; then swap the barrels quickly, leaving the pin in your leg. I did that in my blast and it works fine. But be quick in the swap and make sure there's no air in the second barrel.


Damn, thats hardcore!!!   

I'd just whack two different jabs in personally, but to each his own!


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Here is a pretty nice article. Click here. Take notice of this guy, Dr. Peter Lemon.


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Damn, thats hardcore!!!
> 
> I'd just whack two different jabs in personally, but to each his own!


It's what I was advised, just paying it forward :lol:


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

dmcc said:


> It's what I was advised, just paying it forward :lol:


Fancy a shag :whistling:

Only saying it becasue you havent in a while, you not fancy me any more big boy :lol:


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

rs007 said:


> Fancy a shag :whistling:
> 
> Only saying it becasue you havent in a while, you not fancy me any more big boy :lol:


If he doesn't I do.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Everyone wants a piece of the ramster :lol:


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Fancy a shag :whistling:
> 
> Only saying it becasue you havent in a while, you not fancy me any more big boy :lol:





winger said:


> If he doesn't I do.


I'll take on both of you. Chris too, if he's game.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Damn, its a sausage fest!!!

:lol:

Sorry Chris :lol:


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Darren, that's not an entirely alien concept to me after the first time I jabbed I forgot to expel the air and had to take off the barrel and leave the pin in to do this. So it should be all good.

Guys, great discussion, loving it. Hopefully I can be some proof either way in this, at least from a normal just starting off kinda guy.

Weeman, DanJ, thanks for coming in here and contributing, it's always good to meet a new face off here Dan so look forward to seeing you there!!

Unfortunately nit been very well today, kidney has been playnig up today. Not sure if it is because I had 1 drink last night. Hopefully it will pass and I'll be back together tomorrow for Delts/Tri's and eating.

So, I will be upping from next jab now, no point in hanging round. Gear should be here in Southampton all being well so may as well get on with it.

I have a really good feeling about this guys, a really good feeling.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Take some skills for a spit roast Darren. 114kg at one end and 125kg at the other.

One way to up your protein though


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## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Dose uppage already?? :lol:

Good man :thumbup1:


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Darren, that's not an entirely alien concept to me after the first time I jabbed I forgot to expel the air and had to take off the barrel and leave the pin in to do this. So it should be all good.
> 
> Guys, great discussion, loving it. Hopefully I can be some proof either way in this, at least from a normal just starting off kinda guy.
> 
> ...


This kidney thing is a bit of a concern, especially since you are going to be ramping up your protien intake - I am tempted to say hold off.

Do you have underlying probs with your kidneys?

Unusual that you should get any trouble from one drink, unless that one drink was a litre bottle of neat vodka 

If there is something adrift there, this needs sorted. You need your organs working if you are going to push envelopes mate.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Well Chris there'll be 119,5 in the middle.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

winger said:


> Here is a pretty nice article. Click here. Take notice of this guy, Dr. Peter Lemon.


Thanks, Wings. A great read. I'll just quote a few bits:

"For more than 20 years Dr. Lemon has researched nutrition and exercise, concentrating on the role of protein and muscle growth. He left Kent State in 1997 to return to Canada and holds the Joe Weider chair in Exercise Nutrition at the University of Western Ontario.

Dr. Lemon primarily studies athletes and he is convinced there is an additional dietary protein requirement for both endurance and strength athletes -- especially strength athletes, since their protein levels are higher than endurance athletes.

The current recommended daily allowance (RDA) of the Food Pyramid is 0.8 grams of protein/kg body mass/day. Dr. Lemon's research demonstrates a much higher RDA for both athletic groups is necessary for optimal performance.

*Strength athletes: 1.7-1.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body mass per day (or 0.77-0.82 grams of protein per pound of body mass per day)*

*
*

'One of my grad students is a bodybuilder and he consumes 4.0 grams. It may be overkill, certainly in standardized measures of protein needs, nothing indicates that high a need. I don't recommend intakes above 2.0 grams because there is no data saying they are safe, but I suspect in a healthy person going above 2.0 grams is not a problem.'

[4 gms protein per kilo equates with 1.8 gms per pound.]

... it is more difficult to obtain an estimate of lean mass for most, so recommendations are based on total mass.

Finally, excess protein is broken down as fat so a high-protein diet may lead to increased fat stores."


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> But how can I have been so ignorant!? Forgive me - I've only been bodybuilding for about 35 years.
> 
> *Most bodybuilders **do not** use the approach I'm talking about here and in other threads - that's why I've been slated. Most are incredibly hit and miss. The figures often quoted do seem to be largely plucked out of nowhere - and yet when I do quote some credible official figures they're dismissed!*


No offence patrick but 35 years means nothing without good results.

Since my first show in 2007 I've put on 3 inches on my arms and 7 inches on my chest measurement (and no I've not had implants pmsl.... in fact they're smaller as I am leaner so its prob more than 7 inches).

Thats only 2 years and its harder for females. My protein intake as said is 210gms/day. Its 6 meals with 35gms protein in each.... thats not hard lol.

So clearly its working for me.

Ans sorry, but they do... go look through some of the stuff even just on this site by the guys who are competing or prepping ppl at top level... there have been threads debating this before, and you will find you are wrong there....



DanJ said:


> I have to say i'm with you on this Rams, i have gained 7 1/2 stone in just under three years and always kept my protein high. Whenever i dropped back my gains seemed to stop until i increased again. I'm not fat and consider myself to be in relatively decent condition for someone who has gained so quickly.
> 
> Dan:thumbup1:


 :thumbup1:



weeman said:


> I wasnt on last night so missed all this but here's my input.
> 
> Instead of mega quoting posts from the last cpl pages i'll just try and address things quickly from my point of view.
> 
> ...


Good post very well worded.... have to quote instead of rep lol  :thumbup1:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> No offence patrick but 35 years means nothing without good results.
> 
> Since my first show in 2007 I've put on 3 inches on my arms and 7 inches on my chest measurement (and no I've not had implants pmsl.... in fact they're smaller as I am leaner so its prob more than 7 inches).
> 
> ...


I'm more impressed by Dr Lemon...


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I'm more impressed by Dr Lemon...


Wonder what Dr Lemon looks like.....


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## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Wonder what Dr Lemon looks like.....


Google says...


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It's a problem I was born with Ramsay and technically it has nothing to do with kidney useage. It is infections due to reflux back into the kidney.

Technically alcohol shouldn't matter, or protein intake for that matter, it seems to be more of a coincidence than anything TBH.. Mentally though since I was young I have always accredited it to alcohol, I didn't touch a drop till I was 24.

1 kidney is still 100% fine though. It probably won't bother me for another 12 months now once this passes. If it happens again though with the high protein I'll take a more serious look at that, but the surgeon told me in the past that as long as I drink water (which I am now) it should be cool :thumb:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Thanks, Wings. A great read. I'll just quote a few bits:
> 
> "For more than 20 years Dr. Lemon has researched nutrition and exercise, concentrating on the role of protein and muscle growth.
> 
> ...


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Thanks, Wings. A great read. I'll just quote a few bits:
> 
> "For more than 20 years Dr. Lemon has researched nutrition and exercise, concentrating on the role of protein and muscle growth. He left Kent State in 1997 to return to Canada and holds the Joe Weider chair in Exercise Nutrition at the University of Western Ontario.
> 
> ...


I was looking for the word evidence or proof or some link to a study of some sort there but nope......

Its really just his opinion isn't it? 

Wonder what his opinion would be if he worked with Ronnie Coleman and so on rather than some college track athlete...

Anyway I'm not going to hijack Chris's journal with this anymore its not fair.

TBH Patrick, the people I care about and that are competing are eating enough protein (1.8gms/lb) so I couldn't care less what anyone else does as they're not important to me.

In addition, the people I see eating 1.8gms/lb are getting good results.

'nuff for me.

Over and out


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> I was looking for the word evidence or proof or some link to a study of some sort there but nope......
> 
> Its really just his opinion isn't it?
> 
> ...


Do keep up, Zara - see Winger's link above and read the article. It's not just "opinion". Dr Lemon is an accredited University researcher sponsored by Weider who studies bodybuilders.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> It's a problem I was born with Ramsay and technically it has nothing to do with kidney useage. It is infections due to reflux back into the kidney.
> 
> Technically alcohol shouldn't matter, or protein intake for that matter, it seems to be more of a coincidence than anything TBH.. Mentally though since I was young I have always accredited it to alcohol, I didn't touch a drop till I was 24.
> 
> 1 kidney is still 100% fine though. It probably won't bother me for another 12 months now once this passes. If it happens again though with the high protein I'll take a more serious look at that, but the surgeon told me in the past that as long as I drink water (which I am now) it should be cool :thumb:


I'll be honest - this doesnt put my mind at rest at all.

BUT

It is not a subject I know a lot about.

My worry would be kidneys working fine under heavier load, all going well - then for whatever reason you get an infection and BANG impairment of function way beyond what a typical person would get. I don't know what would happen in this situation.

But it is your risk, your responsibility to know what happens. If any danger signs do crop up, it is up to you to react - you know the situation better than anyone.

I assume you ahve easy access to a doc and prescription meds while at sea - incase you needed antibiotics etc?


----------



## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

winger said:


> Here is a pretty nice article. Click here. Take notice of this guy, Dr. Peter Lemon.





Prodiver said:


> Do keep up, Zara - see Winger's link above and read the article. It's not just "opinion". Dr Lemon is an accredited University researcher sponsored by Weider who studies bodybuilders.


Pat....the link above doesnt prove anything as regarding bodybuilders mate,if you read the bit where it is talking about the bodybuilder the guy is surmising what he assumes he should do,its not a study he actually did using a bodybuilder to see what effect the different protein ratios would have on the bodybuilder,so i'm sorry to say it,but it IS just opinion he is using,nothing factual at all regarding BODYBUILDERS looking to build lean muscle tissue.


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

weeman said:


> Pat....the link above doesnt prove anything as regarding bodybuilders mate,if you read the bit where it is talking about the bodybuilder the guy is surmising what he assumes he should do,its not a study he actually did using a bodybuilder to see what effect the different protein ratios would have on the bodybuilder,so i'm sorry to say it,but it IS just opinion he is using,nothing factual at all regarding BODYBUILDERS looking to build lean muscle tissue.


Why would one want to eat massive amounts of protein if one could grow as well without?

Read the article again. "Protein and *muscle development*" it says.

"From this fact we get the popular term, "nitrogen balance." By measuring the amount of nitrogen in the urine, it can be determined if the diet has an adequate amount of protein.If the body has an appropriate amount of amino acids, it is in positive nitrogen balance. In this state *muscle building* can occur. If one is in negative nitrogen balance, proteins from the muscle are broken down to use their amino acids for more important functions. This is why too little protein in one's diet leads to muscle loss."

By strength athletes he means bodybuilders. "Strength training builds *muscle size* because it stimulates the building of myofibrillar protein faster than protein is broken down."

"Together, these data suggest that the RDA for those who engage in regular strength exercise should be about 212-225% of the current RDA...

And what figure does he give for this?

Strength athletes: *1.7-1.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body mass per day (or 0.77-0.82 grams of protein per pound of body mass per day)*

Now I have no beef with people eating whatever amount of protein they wish. But for years I've been hearing bodybuilding-friendly doctors and nutritionists expressing doubt about excessive protein intake, as did Mike Mentzer. And nutritional logic itself strongly suggests they are right. Now this expert studying strength athletes - bodybuilders - supports this contention:

"One of my grad students is a bodybuilder and he consumes 4.0 grams. It may be overkill, certainly in standardized measures of protein needs, *nothing indicates that high a need."*

Now he and others could be wrong, though he did reach this conclusion from research. I accept that apparently many serious competitive bodybuilders eat about 4 grams per kilo. But they could be following false received wisdom too, and other overlooked factors could be responsible for their gains.

And I simply want to know what's true.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I accept that apparently many serious competitive bodybuilders eat about 4 grams per kilo. But they could be following false received wisdom too, and other overlooked factors could be responsible for their gains.


Ahhh I think you are missing something.

In most of the athletes I spoke to, they didnt deliberately set that amount of protein.

The were a certain wieght on stage, and it just so happened that with unnerving frequency, the wieght they were on stage in lb, was whatever their protien intake was in g, divided by 1.8.

Not a conscious thing, rather clear cause effect - action/result. Indeed one of the athletes concerned didnt even count food intake that closely - went on "instinct". Only when talking to them later, doing a bit of digging, did it turn out they actually were eating this same level too.

This is a clear cut observation / correlation which I do feel you are choosing to ignore - fair enough - I am not a PHD, so maybe it doesnt count


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

rs007 said:


> ...
> 
> The were a certain wieght on stage, and it just so happened that with unnerving frequency, the wieght they were on stage in lb, was whatever their protien intake was in g, divided by 1.8.
> 
> Not a conscious thing, *rather clear cause effect - action/result.* ...


Trouble is, it isn't, Rams. It could simply be total coincidence!

It's not evidence that it's essential to eat about 4 grams per kilo protein per day to achieve competitive muscle mass levels; that those levels cannot be achieved without that intake; and that no other factors are actually responsible.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Trouble is, it isn't, Rams. It could simply be total coincidence!
> 
> It's not evidence that it's essential to eat about 4 grams per kilo protein per day to achieve competitive muscle mass levels; *that those levels cannot be achieved without that intake; and that no other factors are actually responsible*.


But it IS Patrick - you are choosing to take on bits you like to pick apart, and ignoring the rest. You arent reading the glaring obvious truth between the lines.

THESE ATHLETES COULD NOT ATTAIN OBSERVABLE MUSCLE GAIN ON ANY LESS!!!!!! Ergo, their levels of muscularity could not be achieved without that intake.

I really can't explain it in any simpler terms than this Patrick, and about the only thing that really does get to irk me, is having to repeat myself needlessly, to explain what should be glaringly obvious.

Coincidence? Come on, that is a bit of an insult mate to be totally honest - done a quick tote up in the gym earlier - there were somethign like 14 athletes I examined - a lot of them competing agianst each other so almost certainly keeping things close to their chest during the diet - so no real exchange of info.

Many of them didnt know each other, didnt talk to each other with any regularity.

Some would have undoubtedly been using different dieting strategies with regards to carb manipulation, fat burners, etc

All different ages from early 20s through to 40s, male and female.

Yet that 1.8ish kept coming out.

Yes, coincidence.

And you dismissed my experiment too, for reasons of it being small scale.

I think you will find at 14 athletes it is the largest of its type yet conducted (willing to be proven otherwise) SPECIFICALLY on bodybuilders with EXTREME muscularity, and with an ACTUAL PRACTICING IN THE TRENCHES BODYBUILDER as its instigator, not some dislocated nobody with half the alphabet after his name.

Patrick - this is probably the most heated post I will make on the subject (I am only minorly elevated :lol: ) plus I need to stop typing and start eating becasue I have only had 300g of protein so far and I am def going catabolic :lol:

I don't want to fall out with you, so I am going to cease and desist - I have said all I really can anyway, I am just goiing over same old ground.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Just had a thought actually.

Pretty sure all the bodybuilders concerned were Scottish.

Maybe we are all just greedy fat bastards


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## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

I'm happy not to bang on. As I PMd you:

I don't want to disbelieve your survey. I quoted it several times until I found that it was per pound rather than per kilo. and that rang alarm bells because of my previous reading on protein intake and elimination.

History is littered with false deductions from observations. I accept that all the bodybuilders you surveyed ate about the same intake. But that proved simply that they did, not that they all needed to. And nutritional studies like those by Dr Lemon have long suggested they needn't. And I simply want to know what's true!

I wonder how they actually all arrived at how much protein to eat. It doesn't seem likely they read any nutritional studies. Whose advice did they accept, I wonder...


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## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Just had a thought actually.
> 
> Pretty sure all the bodybuilders concerned were Scottish.
> 
> Maybe we are all just greedy fat bastards


Everyone in our gym follows same so you can add on another 6-8 competitive bodybuilders...

Oh hang on aye....

Scottish again 



Prodiver said:


> I'm happy not to bang on. As I PMd you:
> 
> I don't want to disbelieve your survey. I quoted it several times until I found that it was per pound rather than per kilo. and that rang alarm bells because of my previous reading on protein intake and elimination.
> 
> ...


For about the umpteenth time.....

*TRIAL AND ERROR.*

*
*

*
*Are you being deliberately obtuse and refusing to acknowledge this part?

Me, weeman, DanJ, Ramsay, about 6-8 bodybuilders from my gym plus Ramsays 14.... ALL learned through their own TRIAL AND ERROR that if we eat less we DO NOT GROW.

Jesus its not hard mate.....


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Everyone in our gym follows same so you can add on another 6-8 competitive bodybuilders...
> 
> Oh hang on aye....
> 
> ...


I'll resist treating this with the contempt it deserves.


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I'll resist treating this with the comtempt it deserves.


The word you are looking for is "contempt".....


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I'll resist treating this with the comtempt it deserves.


I know, its shocking

She should know full well she was one of my 14, not seperate from it :lol:

Seriously guys, lets all just agree to disagree. My head hurts.

Some interesting stuff in here regardless, hope you don't mind too much Chris!

Hey, it beats random off topic hijacks at least about bumming and such :lol:

Now get an ass pic up Chris mate before we all get bored and fk off to a4pads journal

:lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Now get an ass pic up Chris mate before we all get bored and fk off to a4pads journal
> 
> :lol: :lol: :lol:


Is A4pad still a member???

I've not seen him around (or some others) since the reps went.... :whistling: :lol:


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Funny no one mentioned the gear use for all those competitive bb's....lol

Doesn't gear help you to assimilate more protein?

So in theory wouldn't who ever took more gear get the biggest because they can assimilate more protein?

See the theories work both ways do they not?

What I like is Patrick has fueled a debate and Chris's journal is better than ever.

I often do the devil's advocate and force the person or persons to explain their point, it makes for great discussion...lol

Patrick, I got to say I love ya. :beer:

Rams, stay with us will ya!

I did up the protein today, but that doesn't mean I agree...lol


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Bumping this thread, just to subscribe.

Had a few, have not read one post yet, just some input from an old as heck/hack, fart.

Protein, depends.

When I was young, massive food.

When I was single, massive parties.

When I got older..........Well, things slow down and priorities change....

How many would alot of eggs be?

12?

if you want to eat 12 eggs at one sitting cool.

Thats 84 grams of protein.

Yet, 3 scoops of powder is almost equal to or exceeds this requirement for protein......????

A chicken brest, 35 grams?

Perfect.

Bump cuz I am drunk............Too many cals and also need to relax..........


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I don't mind at all Ramsay. As long as it stays nice. Although I don't see a break through really so I accept that you all may have to agree to disagree.

I don't have enough experience one way or another, when you first told me I needed that much Ramsay I sh1t myself, but I am willing to try it and see the differences it makes.

There definately seems to be something hindering my progress as I believe I should be bigger than I am now. This could be it. Who knows.

My kidney is better this morning. I'll take it careful, see how it goes. If it becomes a repetative thing then it will have to be addressed. Hopefully not though.

Wow I'm tired. 4 a.m. is not a good time to be starting work :crying:


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## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Well I am now on a protein eating mission as a result of this little debate ....it's hard work when you don't really like chicken :confused1:


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## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Jem said:


> Well I am now on a protein eating mission as a result of this little debate ....it's hard work when you don't really like chicken :confused1:


Turkey, steak, joints of beef, quark, eggs, fish, milk etc

You were saying..................


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Plenty of other options babe, as Tel was saying.

In fact, as I recal, chicken is no-where near the best source of protein you can get.

I'll try and find a post by Lost Soul from about a year ago about this where he explains that I think Red Meat is actually a better protein source.

See what I can dig up.


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## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Yeah wellllllll......god try and keep up with me please boys ...

Until about 6 months again I had been veggie [since the age of 10, precocious moi :innocent: ]

Soooo I introduced [after much deliberation, but all for the cause..] Fish and chicken and turkey at a push bleurgh]

Dont really like any of it tbh - have to force it down [other than tuna]

NO RED MEAT

So there you go

Dont really like eggs

Like quark and like cottage cheese [sort of]

It's all a struggle

Sorry for the 'me, me, me' post :laugh:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

So, finally back in the gym after a rough couple of days.

When I get kidney problems it knocks me for six, absolutely destroys me, the pain is indescribable. Hasn't been as bad these last few times, I think maybe this is due to the elevated water intake.

Still. Going to maintain the almost no alcohol intake policy. As I said. this shouldn't make a difference, but for some reason my mind won't believe that.

To be extra careful, something reccomended by Flex Wheeler I think (he has kidney problems I believe), I will be mixing my protein shakes with more water. Instead of 300ml I will use 500ml. Cranberry extract is back in at 3000mg a day and Milk Thistle at 3 tabs a day, think there strength is 5400mg each.

Strength really doesn't seem to be going anywhere. Backwards if anything. Maybe that is just because of the sickness. I did still eat though, quite a bit as well, drank loads of green tea and water.

Also had a little fun in a shower for the first time in my life :whistling: Actually the hot water helps alot. I turn in to such an only child when I'm ill, apparantly it's the only time I show any affection. 

So, Delts today.

*Military Press Seated*

12 x 60kg

4 x 8 x 60kg

*Seated side raises*

3 x 12 x 17.5kg

*Shrugs*

3 x 12 x 120kg

*CGBP*

3 x 8 x 80kg

*Tri Pushdowns*

3 x 12 x 50kg

*Rope pulldowns*

3 x 12 x 20kg

CGBP I tried my hands in further, hurt like hell as I forgot my wrist wraps. Also when I'd finished I realised I had 5kg more on one side than the other :angry: IDIOT!!!! That's how I keep injuring myself!

Actually though, all in all, felt like an awesome workout, very low recovery time between sets, if it wasn't for the low poundage I'd be very chuffed!

Hope all is well.

Just wanted to thank everyone involved for making this journal and informative and fun place to be. Feel quite honoured! :thumbup1: :rockon:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Hell no pet, don't be sorry, there are plenty ways around it I'm sure.

I'm by now means an expert on nutrition though, but I am sure there must be something that can be done. You don't like Fish??


----------



## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> I'll resist treating this with the contempt it deserves.


I dont see that post as deserving contempt Pat,tbh thats a very immature thing of you to say,is there a reason you feel contempt towards Zara yet non of our posts despite the fact she is stating the same things?.....

What she has done in that last post is state the obvious in bold capital so its embedded once and for all for you to (probably ignore) perhaps take in finally,everyone of these athletes arrived at the conclusion via trial and error,tbh to take this to the extremes you could probably address the protein intake of as many competitive BODYBUILDERS as we can and i would be willing to bet anything on it that the vast majority will be around 1.8g per lb of protein,NOT by coincidence,not by some freak of nature or an inexplicable calling from within their loins that they cant explain,but through TRIAL AND ERROR!!!!!

Now that holds infinitly more weight i feel than some fker with a phd who happened to speak to some 'bodybuilding friendly' doctors,you know......ACTUAL real world evidence versus a theory a cpl of guys had using a different theory they used to accern the protein needs of athletes with no similarity to a bodybuilders goals...... :confused1: :confused1:

all the way through this debate you have had REAL WORLD fact after REAL WORLD fact laid down in front of you,yet you choose to ignore whatever parts dont suit you,you know for an intelligent man your coming across very ignorantly.

Nobodies asking you to accept this,but there is a damn site better arguement for the 1.8g per lbs of leant tissue case than what you have put across for your side of the debate,it really does mystify the way you have dodged and weaved and blatantly avoided points throughout.

Tell you what in fact,i have a few friends within the sports industry who have phd's etc after their names,would it help if i asked them to go around the same athletes that we have,asking them the same questions that we did,and then get them to present it to you the way we did,but apparantly have much more weight behind it because they have a fuking phd???!?!!

TBH i am of the same mindset as Ramsay in that i feel really quite insulted by the way you are going on.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/food-diet-nutrition-info/72431-vegetarian-diet.html

Try this one Jem, not a lot of info in it, but there is a guy in there who knows his stuff who may be able to help you out better than I can.

Sorry if you've already done this.


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Thanks darling - you are a treasure, fook the beans though. Hard work to meet daily requirements on lentils methinks. I just need to man up and swallow 

Pm incoming ...


----------



## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I don't mind at all Ramsay. As long as it stays nice. Although I don't see a break through really so I accept that you all may have to agree to disagree.
> 
> I don't have enough experience one way or another, when you first told me I needed that much Ramsay I sh1t myself, but I am willing to try it and see the differences it makes.
> 
> ...


what causes your kidney reflux chris?my daughter suffers from this and is on permanent antibiotics due to it,when she gets an infection it knocks her down!!

thought it was about time i actually ask you a question being as i have been debating away in your journal lolol


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

winger said:


> Funny no one mentioned the gear use for all those competitive bb's....lol


Not really funny, it doesnt seem to matter as much as you might think.

For a start, each of the athletes would have been on different things - especially the women.

Yet that number kept coming out. It is fair to estimate though, that as competition prepping athletes, there would have safely been adequate levels in place in all cases :lol:

More gear does not = more of anything for most people, that is a fallacy. Just recently I put my gear up to 2g test, 800mg deca per week for around 5 weeks, just for an experiment. All this current BS of 2g being the magic number caught me out.

I'm normally a 750mg test per week man.

What did I get - massive strength increase? Noticeable size gains?

No.

Palpitations, struggling to breath, stinking sweat, headaches, nausea, bloating, really greasy skin, increase in acne on arms/shoulders and a feeling that I can only describe as the opposite of wellbeing.

All of which I would accept if the gains were massive :lol:

Funnily enough, for most of it my protein was a little lower than I woudl normally take in - probably a little under 1.8 g per lb - another coincidence? Might try it again in the new year with 500g of protein   

What I am saying is that is probably individual, but largely a moot point - it seems as long as you are getting enough, then you are getting enough.

Some lucky buggers will no doubt soak it all up like a sponge and grow like weeds :cursing:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Plenty of other options babe, as Tel was saying.
> 
> In fact, as I recal, chicken is no-where near the best source of protein you can get.
> 
> ...


Best source of protein as far as ahdhering as closely as possible to the spectrum of amino acids us humans require, is to eat another human being 

That aside, the closest profile would be a good protein shake is this is specifically engineered to be a mimic, but for solid foods, whole egg is the closest match and turkey is the 2nd closest. 



Jem said:


> Yeah wellllllll......god try and keep up with me please boys ...
> 
> Until about 6 months again I had been veggie [since the age of 10, precocious moi :innocent: ]
> 
> ...


Cottage cheese is good as its slow releasing.... is particularly good at bedtime for this reason 



weeman said:


> I dont see that post as deserving contempt Pat,tbh thats a very immature thing of you to say,*is there a reason you feel contempt towards Zara yet non of our posts despite the fact she is stating the same things?.....*


I'd be interested to hear the answer to this though I suspect I know already and I doubt we'll get the truth.

I've seen Patrick be told to STFU for his "opinions" in other threads yet never react as vehemently.... 



weeman said:


> What she has done in that last post is state the obvious in bold capital so its embedded once and for all for you to (probably ignore) perhaps take in finally,everyone of these athletes arrived at the conclusion via trial and error,tbh to take this to the extremes you could probably address the protein intake of as many competitive BODYBUILDERS as we can and i would be willing to bet anything on it that the vast majority will be around 1.8g per lb of protein,NOT by coincidence,not by some freak of nature or an inexplicable calling from within their loins that they cant explain,but through TRIAL AND ERROR!!!!!
> 
> Now that holds infinitly more weight i feel than some fker with a phd who happened to speak to some 'bodybuilding friendly' doctors,you know......ACTUAL real world evidence versus a theory a cpl of guys had using a different theory they used to accern the protein needs of athletes with no similarity to a bodybuilders goals...... :confused1: :confused1:
> 
> ...


Might be worth pointing out that one of our 1.8gms/lb'ers is 19stone with an MChem..... Maybe I should ask him to come on and give his experiences? :tongue:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Great to have you in here Weeman!!!

It's called a Congenital Mega Ureta, basically it means that the tube that joins my kidney to my bladder is over sized, therefore the valve that prevents urine from coming back up into the kidney cannot function correctly.

When you get reflux you can get urine staying around the entrance to the bladder, leading to infection and crippling pain. I remember very well how it was as a child, when you don't really understand what is happening just that you are crippled with pain.

Unfortunately it wasn't till I was 18 that they diagnosed me, and the surgeon at the time told me there was no point in operating. A few years later in Canada a surgeon told me he could have me in and out in a day fixed. How I wish I had taken that choice.

If I was you I would be asking the surgeon about operations now if she is still young as what will happen over the years is the problem kidney will shut down slowly and the good one will have to take all the load.

The only solution for me now is removal, which I am holding off on, as i believe 18% is better than nowt.

If you catch it soon enough they can take the ureta and replace it in a different section of the bladder where the valve can prevent the reflux. It's complicated to explain how they do it, and I don't really understand. If that is whats wrong with her then that has to be better than a life of anti-biotics and the harm they will be doing to her immune system???

God, I really feel for her, it was horrible as a child for me, I hope she gets it sorted bless her.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm 19stone 7 and I've got a an HND in Nautical Science....

....no particular relevance, I was just feeling left out


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Jem said:


> Thanks darling - you are a treasure, fook the beans though. Hard work to meet daily requirements on lentils methinks. I just need to man up and swallow
> 
> Pm incoming ...


Jem I can give you a list of foods you can eat to get your daily protein without eating what you dont like and sticking with what you are comfortable with, and the best times to eat each one... I'm not too [email protected] at the old nutrition business even if I am [email protected] at everything else....  will go on your journal or pm you save clogging up here.



rs007 said:


> Not really funny, it doesnt seem to matter as much as you might think.
> 
> For a start, each of the athletes would have been on different things - especially the women.
> 
> ...


You'd be shocked at how little gear R takes as he suffers dreadfully with all probs you described so he takes less than many newbies BUT keeps the protein high religiously.

Seems right enough as you say.... some can soak it up and use it, others just get ill/feel sh1t/suffer bad sides.


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

I'm 5'11 and addicted to coffee

Solidarity

Cheers Zara !


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I am on 400mg Test and 200mg Tren, I get no sides but unfortunately I don't seem to have made any gains.

Even allowing for my inbuilt inpatience I would have expected to see something by now. Tomorrow it shall be 800/400. Probably be all over the bloody place lol


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> I am on 400mg Test and 200mg Tren, I get no sides but unfortunately I don't seem to have made any gains.
> 
> Even allowing for my inbuilt inpatience I would have expected to see something by now. Tomorrow it shall be 800/400. Probably be all over the bloody place lol


How long have you been on cycle now??

surely you could wait a little longer, upping seems illogical atm.

Can you say in all honesty you've been getting the cals/protein in? getting enough

sleep/rest/recouperation.

training with the intensity required to grow.

Test and Tren aren't sugar and salt, there can be dangerous side effects, plus

if any of the above aren't in place you could shovel it in and still not see a change

Imo your being very naive, give it a few weeks yet, I never got strength gains

till week 4 or 5 on first cycle, whats the fecking rush??

Your health is more important than any other thing you could mention.

400mg test 200mg tren should be ample to see how your body, and fvcked up

kidney, is going to react, leave it for now ffs. Your being ridiculous, but its your

body ateotd

:beer:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

weeman said:


> I dont see that post as deserving contempt Pat,tbh thats a very immature thing of you to say,is there a reason you feel contempt towards Zara yet non of our posts despite the fact she is stating the same things?.....
> 
> What she has done in that last post is state the obvious in bold capital so its embedded once and for all for you to (probably ignore) perhaps take in finally,everyone of these athletes arrived at the conclusion via trial and error,tbh to take this to the extremes you could probably address the protein intake of as many competitive BODYBUILDERS as we can and i would be willing to bet anything on it that the vast majority will be around 1.8g per lb of protein,NOT by coincidence,not by some freak of nature or an inexplicable calling from within their loins that they cant explain,but through TRIAL AND ERROR!!!!!
> 
> ...


You're insulted!?  And here's me being treated as if I'm some kind of dumb idiot and people getting personal simply because their claims seem incompatible with extensive nutritional research, and I'm duly sceptical.

As a technical author I always read others' posts and use my words extremely carefully. Note that though I'm sceptical I've never said Ramsay's claims are false.

I was paid for years to highlight real world erroneous assumptions made from observations on oil rigs, so I know a bit about cause and effect, double blind testing, etc.

Bodybuilding especially has been full of clearly absurd received wisdoms and all too little science. Just because people believe from experience that something causes a certain effect doesn't for a moment prove it's so, especially in something as complex as nutrition, as any medical researcher will vouch.

And I simply want to discover what's true.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

tel3563 said:


> How long have you been on cycle now??
> 
> surely you could wait a little longer, upping seems illogical atm.
> 
> ...


Although I think you could have put it a little better, and you don't state what experience youa re drawing this on, I am tempted to agree in principal only because I know nothing of this kidney situation.

Test is surprisingly gentle for most people, 800mg is not a frightening dose by any stretch of the imagination. 400mg of tren enanthate makes it more risque, but still not anything to get overly worried about - in a person with two fully functioning kidneys.

I simply do not know what impact this will have.

But then again does anyone. In fact, the only person who has half a clue of his condition is Chris himself, to call him naive and ridiculous is, IMO, heading toward being out of order.

This sport is full of all sorts of different things that each of us might find accpetable or not, just because of where WE draw our OWN lines in the sand. Think of the synthol debate, and how vehemntly some people jump on that. Yet, it is a useful tool, and here to stay.

To each his own, and some coudl say the pursuit of bodybuildign full stop with an impaired Kidney is ridiculous... all I will say is Chris, you are going to ahve to be very very vigilant on this, and get help at the first sign of trouble - if it occurs.


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Although I think you could have put it a little better, and you don't state what experience youa re drawing this on, I am tempted to agree in principal only because I know nothing of this kidney situation.
> 
> Test is surprisingly gentle for most people, 800mg is not a frightening dose by any stretch of the imagination. 400mg of tren enanthate makes it more risque, but still not anything to get overly worried about - in a person with two fully functioning kidneys.
> 
> ...


You don't mention chris's gullability to any piece of information he gleens, harsh

but true and pussy footing around telling him it may or may not be ok is not what

is required, why would it bother me so much, I've never even met the guy yet

but don't believe he should go "upping the dose" just on a whim somebody has

told him.

don't try and play the experience card either, I'm plenty experienced in

caring for the health of a mate, be it on the internet or in real life:thumbup1:

explain why he should take more when he hasn't had any results from his relatively small doses

I'm sure its only being approx 4 weeks:confused1: What next, a gram, 2 grams. He just

needs to give it a little longer on his present dose, thats my opinion based on

my first cycle, what else can I base it on?


----------



## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Great to have you in here Weeman!!!
> 
> It's called a Congenital Mega Ureta, basically it means that the tube that joins my kidney to my bladder is over sized, therefore the valve that prevents urine from coming back up into the kidney cannot function correctly.
> 
> ...


oh mate,the mrs and i are like an encyclopidia regards this lol

Our daughter has multiple things wrong with her,the similarity to what you have is one of them,when she was born her ureters werent connected to her bladder they connected straight to her urethra bypassing the bladder altogether which in the end would have left her with a useless perfarated bladder,but the problem was she was so small (under 4lbs) that MRI's and ultrasounds werent clear enought to make head nor tale of her so we didnt know this till they had no choice but to open her up.

Now like you she has one giant ureter and one normal sized one,only she also has one giant kidney (the dying one) and one small normal sized one (which is compensating for the bad one luckily) so they took a strip out of the 'baggy' ureter and then reconnected both of them back to the bladder in an attempt to get all things working as they should.

The problem is the stripped ureter didnt remain repaired and just got baggy again,which causes pockets within the tube where urine can lie and go stagnant,cause reflux,lead to infection/scarring of the kidney,basically the same as you,its slowly killing it.

She is on a permanent low dose of co amoxiclav to try to prevent further infection and slowing down the damage to the kidney,at 4 years old she is down to around 40% functionality in her damaged kidney.

What also doesnt help matters is her bladder doesnt fully drain of urine either which also causes reflux,we are desperatly trying to hold them off on manual drainage via catheter multiple times a day,we basically have until she is 8 years old for her to gain as much bladder control as possible otherwise they will take a drastic route,possible removing the bladder,external bag etc etc this as you can imagine is a route we want to try and avoid if possible.

Its going to be on going forever with her,this is only one of many problems! (she had a tumour removed from her spinal chord in the same operation to repair her ureters)



Prodiver said:


> You're insulted!?  *And here's me being treated as if I'm some kind of dumb idiot and people getting personal simply because their claims seem incompatible with extensive nutritional research, and I'm duly sceptical. *
> 
> unless you have some sort of chip on your shoulder i dont know where you are getting people trying to make you out as dumb,no one here has implied that,ignorant to blatant facts yes,dumb,no.
> 
> ...





tel3563 said:


> You don't mention chris's gullability to any piece of information he gleens, harsh
> 
> but true and pussy footing around telling him it may or may not be ok is not what
> 
> ...


i dont think Rams was actually recomending that he jump up in dose unless i've missed something here,tho i would have to say,if all other factors were in place ie nutrition/rest.training and can be sure the gear is legit,then if after 4 weeks i wasnt seeing any results(and after 4 weeks you very much SHOULD be seeing changes in strength/body comp/size) i would be looking to up the dose most definatly,regardless of first cycle or not.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Best source of protein as far as ahdhering as closely as possible to the spectrum of amino acids us humans require, is to eat another human being


Can it be the opposite sex?


----------



## TH0R (Aug 15, 2007)

weeman said:


> i dont think Rams was actually recomending that he jump up in dose unless i've missed something here,tho i would have to say,if all other factors were in place ie nutrition/rest.training and can be sure the gear is legit,then if after 4 weeks i wasnt seeing any results(and after 4 weeks you very much SHOULD be seeing changes in strength/body comp/size) i would be looking to up the dose most definatly,regardless of first cycle or not.


Could be less than that weeman, my point is over the months I've heard and seen

that Chris will grasp at any short term solution, I'm sure if you told him to do

DL's with his head up his arris, he'd give it a go just in case

Only 3 weeks ago Prov's diet was the answer to all his previous worries (I pointed out

because it was easier than what we would consider a normal bb diet) but no,

2 or 3 weeks down the line and things have changed, Paddy no longer knows his stuff and

now, Rams is the "Man", I'm not getting at Ramsey, I just think Chris is gullable.

He'd be a salesmans dream tbh. That may sound harsh, and probably is, but I'm

not going to pull punches on my opinions, at my age its a bit late to turn over

a new leaf and become all wishy washy

I'm also certain if chris stood back and thought about problems he has this would

be on the agenda. If it makes him feel better for me to say, well done, you go

for it, then you'll be waiting a long time:whistling:

My strength gains became apparent on week 5 of my first cycle, if chris isn't

getting any gains in strength from 400 test 200 tren does this mean his natural

test production must be more than that, we know thats impossible so there must

be some governing reason why he has no gains at all, be it its not kicked in yet

or others I have stated before

Maybe its something to consider he has only 1 proper kidney functioning:confused1:that would

worry me, another reason to give it a week or two.

I'm not saying Rams doesn't know what he's talking about, I know he does and has

a vastly more superior knowledge than I will probably ever have about AAS and diet,

that is and never will be disputed by me:thumbup1:


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

OK,

HULK is here to settle this little argument..

Everybody is different, everybody can utilise and covert protein carbs ad vastly differening rates...

when patrick says "we are more similar than you realise" tis true to a certain extent, but why in past can i take 6g plus aas a week and not experience any negative sides per se

Nytol cant take tren in any does without going loopy and hacks struggles with many issues over 600mg per week??

Why can I survive on jaffa cakes and lucozade and stil ookm fckin awesome and chris just has to look at crisps to get fat?????

So of course dietry requirements for all vary, and prob genetic elite can either 1) assimilate mage amounts of proteins or coversly 2) effeciently use minimal protein to convert to mega muscle mass..

Also, its different for a "recreational trainer" like your self Pro, or competitive athletes such as Ramsey and Weeman..

Sure, you can eat less "dedicated" sources of protein, but your diet is rich in calories and full of lots of variety of healthy food.

If you want to compete and lean up, then you need to drop calories, the most effective way of muscle sparing =, keeping calories high while losing fat is to eat high amounts of protein, END OFF

When I competed and wanted to get super ripped, basically i cut out carbs, ate a few fats but got most of my calories from protein 300-400g at 200lb ish..

I was able to gain muscle (while on gear) lean up, get stronger all at same time.

whenever protein was dropped, muscle was wasted

Now I have not much clue of processes that ocurred, maybe a lot of protein was converted to energy, maybe the convesrion process attributed to added leaness, HOWEVER

Fat remains, very high protein consumptionwas required to achieve this...

thousansds of competing BBders cant be wrong??

I feel your arguments are flawed Pat, and quoting others is not really relevant to this argument

My suggestion, would be to get yourself into contest condition, diet at same tim ealong with chris using your principles, just to see what results you would expect.

You say your 280lb at the moment, it would be very interesting what you could achieve and what weight you would end up contest ready.....

Im 5'9ish

I competed last time at 22 at a ripped 196lb..

That was eating mega high protein, zero carbs (not helathy but there you go)

Weeman and ramsay prob much more..

what would you ascertain your comp weight to be, especially with a restricted protein intake???


----------



## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Nice debate.

Group hug&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.

I for one feel many people eat just too much protein. Over time this becomes something that is needed as the body utilizes enzymes to sustain itself with large amounts of protein.

A guy named Bill Phillips and Torbjorn Akerfeldt had a discussion on this very topic probably 15 years ago.

http://musclemedia.com/training/abcde/v61_abc4.asp

Nice article and may shine some light about the current discussion.

The question was really how much should we consume?

Snip

Several recent studies, however, indicate that dietary protein intake in excess of the current RDA [.8 g/kgBW/d-that's only 72 grams a day for a 200-lb bodybuilder] is likely needed for optimal muscle growth. For example, in one study, heavy resistance-training young adult men consuming 3.3 g/kgBW/d [which is about 300 grams per day for a 200-lb guy] versus 1.3 [about 120 grams a day] gained 2.2 more pounds of bodyweight in just 14 days4!

Another study found protein synthesis in strength-training subjects went up when protein intake was increased from .9 to 2.4 g/kgBW/d.21 These studies concluded that 2.4 and 3.3 g/kgBW/d, respectively, were in excess of the amount needed for optimal muscle growth. For example, in the study using 3.3 g/kgBW/d, the "safety valve," called oxidation, increased by 159%.4 These and other researchers now think that the "optimal" protein intake for strength-training athletes might be 1.8 g/kgBW/d11,21 [about 160 grams of protein for a 200-lb lifter].

I strongly disagree with this theory. I do not believe the subjects who put on an additional 2.2 lbs of mass in 14 days by increasing their protein intake to 3.3 g/kgBW/d4 would have been equally successful if they had increased it only to 1.8 g/kgBW/d.

I will give some of my thoughts on protein in a minute once I catch up with the posts.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Before I look at the rest of the posts.

Tel, Ramsay has never suggested a gear increase. In fact, Ramsay has never suggested anything at all, so coming out with sh1t like that is unacceptable and completely unwarranted.

I have gone to him with an idea and he has told me the pros and cons of it and I have made a decision. I have also passed this idea around 3 or 4 other people, and they have also told me the pros of cons.

Ramsay has helped me with diet, and by helped, I mean suggested ways in which it could be improved.

At times I may be a little gullable, but only when it comes to things like this, because I do not know much about it, and I am very capable of admiting that, that's why I ask people that I trust, that's why I bounce ideas (no matter how ridiculous) off so many people.

I have never said what Patrick said was a wonder diet, it was the best available for me at that time so I went with it.

TBH Tel, I don't give 2 sh1ts how I come accross on the internet, gullible, naive, yes probably, because I am at this game. But if you're trying to insinuate that I am just some fvcking kid who's never experienced life then you couldn't be further from the truth.

I am looking for maximum gains in what is a very short space of time before I start my prep 20 weeks out, I am taking this seriously and want to get up there ready to go.

re my kidney. This is a birth defect, there is nothing I can do to fix it, if they had operated years ago then it would be ok, but they didn't and it's not. The kidney is dying, it doesn't matter what I do, I can't slow or reverse the process, it's game over, only question is when is it finally going to go. For some reason it is hanging on at 72%/18% functionality split right/left. Nobosy knows why. TBH, my life would be a lot better if it just fecked off and went as then these pains would not be an issue.

My other kidney is as healthy as any they have seen. It is working 100%, no damage, no apparant risk of damage, nothing at all wrong with it that they can see.

In fact the only change is, I am getting slight pains maybe once a year, as opposed to once a month, the pains now are slight, before they were crippling bed ridden pains. So all that seems to have happened since I have started working out is I am in better nick now than ever.

Please don't insult me and tell me that I need to step back and look at my health and body. I have lived with this since I was born, I missed some of the most important days of my life with this. I didn't drink a drop of alcohol till I was 24. I have had tests, probes, scans, catheters, x-rays, bloods and God knows what else done to me once a month till I was 18 and every single leave since then.

The only mistake I made in life was not starting this game sooner and getting in shape when I should have years ago.

There's being honest Tel and then there's just being rude, there's a thin line mate.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Jem said:


> Thanks darling - you are a treasure, fook the beans though. Hard work to meet daily requirements on lentils methinks. I just need to man up and swallow
> 
> Pm incoming ...


THere's always Quorn, which isn't too bad, actually......the mince is quite acceptable

My local health food shop sells really nice flavoured tofu (and anyone will tell you I am a total carnivore lol :lol: )

Failing that there's the horror of TVP

CNP flapjacks are getting a lot of time from me at the moment - 25 - 30g each lol


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Hahaha Yes quorn, quorn and more quorn

I have a quorn filled life

there is nothing I cannot make with quorn ...........

I have sat down today and worked it all out

Basically - the substance is not the problem - getting it all down me [fook me - how much is necessary] is the hard bit ...

What aboot the fat in them there flapjacks Beks - I'm all for flapping the jack daily but ...you know


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Well well well, its fun time :lol:



tel3563 said:


> You don't mention chris's gullability to any piece of information he gleens, harsh but true and pussy footing around telling him it may or may not be ok is not what is required, why would it bother me so much, I've never even met the guy yet but don't believe he should go "upping the dose" just on a whim somebody has told him.
> 
> I dont mention it, because I am not aware of it. Im good, but Im not that good. I cannot mention something of which I am not aware, can I? Maybe escaped you, but I have only joined this journal very recently, and only started conversing with Chris regularly recently. So don't come that attitude with me, its unwarranted. :thumbup1:
> 
> ...





tel3563 said:


> Could be less than that weeman, my point is over the months I've heard and seen that Chris will grasp at any short term solution, I'm sure if you told him to do DL's with his head up his arris, he'd give it a go just in case
> 
> Hmmm, I think I shall be telling him in that case, that letting a Scotsman dry-bum you is the best way to go for growth - deep anal testosterone therapy, its all true :lol:
> 
> ...


(CHRIS NEW THOUGHT, UP TO 4g TEST)

:lol:


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

rs007 said:


> Well well well, its fun time :lol:
> 
> (CHRIS NEW THOUGHT, UP TO 4g TEST)
> 
> :lol:


Just drink lots of water Chris...lol :lol:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

winger said:


> Just drink lots of water Chris...lol :lol:


And get som god damned cranberry extract :lol:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Jem said:


> Hahaha Yes quorn, quorn and more quorn
> 
> I have a quorn filled life
> 
> ...


Will post on your journal....


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris - RE your kidney - lets see if we can move forward/get a workaround for this :lol:

How is it monitored - is it monitored at all?

You could quote function percentages - when was the last time you had these done? How often are they done? Can you request them more often?

What I am getting at is, is there a way that you can be alerted immediately - or as close to as possible - if things start to go south.

This is important because forget gear doses just now, the extreme diet alone could cause problems, even on modest gear. Its the DIET, depeletion and over all running down that are the killer, as anyone who has been through it will tell you.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Oh, I enjoed tha last few pages....missed all the fun

Some good info amongst all that sh1t too


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Fúck me this place needs some gayness and a hug...


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> And get som god damned cranberry extract :lol:


No, no, no....

Its acai berries..... and grapetides..... sheesh man..... 

(ssshhhhh dont mention sources though..... :whistling: )



rs007 said:


> Its the DIET, depeletion and over all running down that are the killer, as anyone who has been through it will tell you.


Yeah it is.....

Not that my experience counts for anything.

Plus, I'm a girl.... so I'll just shut up and get back to the kitchen and stay out of things I have no business knowing about.

Cup of tea lads....? Biscuit perhaps? Must be lots of protein in a biscuit, yes...?


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## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

I'll wash the dishes & the berries ..


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

:lol:

"wash the berries"

So many conotations :lol:


----------



## RedKola (Nov 27, 2008)

I'll dry and put away


----------



## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> No, no, no....
> 
> Its acai berries..... and grapetides..... sheesh man.....
> 
> ...


I'll take some of those AAB biscuits (Anabolic Androgenic Biscuits-aka jaffa cakes)

oh fuk i gone and done it now,i just called jaffa cake's a biscuit,this is gner have all hell breaking loose.

Does anyone have any scientific reports on wether jaffa cakes are biscuits or not? and i dont mean that old test from the eighties where they tested out the buscuityness of several brands but not jaffa cakes themselves,then deduced using facts based on those assumption wether jaffa cakes were in fact a buscuit or not. :confused1:

:thumbup1:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Jaffa cakes are cakes - McVitie's v Commissioners of Customs & Excise. They go hard when stale whereas biscuits go soft.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Allow me to answer this weeman.

A biscuit is identified by the fact that when fresh it is crisp, and when it starts to spoil it goes soft.

A cake is identifed by having the opposite characteristic.

Of course I have no pHD so feel free to ignore   

Im just playin'

:lol:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Damn you darren and your no nonsense quick fire posting :cursing:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Ramsay, fancy a shag?


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

least the wimmen folk seem to be getting their prioritise right for once

Milk no sugar in that tea wench, i'm sweet enough


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

:lol: oh I have missed those words :lol:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Zara-Leoni said:


> No, no, no....
> 
> Its acai berries..... and grapetides..... sheesh man.....
> 
> ...














weeman said:


> I'll take some of those AAB biscuits (Anabolic Androgenic Biscuits-aka jaffa cakes)
> 
> oh fuk i gone and done it now,i just called jaffa cake's a biscuit,this is gner have all hell breaking loose.
> 
> ...


Well.......there was the VAT tribunal that ruled they were biscuits, as some clever VAT inspector decided that as they were in the biscuit aisle and were partly covered in 'chocolate', they were therefore a chocolate covered biscuit and therefore liable to VAT.......(cakes aren't, whether they're covered on chocolate or not)

Anyhow, it went to appeal and Jaffa Cakes were deemed to be cakes as (apart from the bleeding obvious - they are CAKES, dammit! ), cakes go hard when they go stale and biscuits go soft. Jaffa CAKES, of course, go hard :thumb:

Meanwhile, teacakes (of the marshmallow on a biscuit base) are zero rated cakes, yet snowballs (marshmallows coated in coconut not on a base) are standard rated confectionery....

You'll not ask again...... :lol:

Oh and Ferrero Rocher are biscuits, allegedly......


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ramsay, I mentioned it above, but I think it got lost because I was a bit annoyed.

I have had kidney function tests every month from 16 - 18, and every leave since then, so that is approx every 3 months.

I have had every kind of probe, scan, xray, catheter, alsorts, and I continue to do so, and will until it clears. I was considering putting it to a year as there has been no appreciable change for 3, but I decided for the sake of 2 hours once a leave it wasn't worth it.

More so than that, and there is no logical reasoning for this, I just "know" when things aren't right.

I have lived with this since I was born, I know the signs long before any Doctor would be able to tell me. This is not me being naive, this is experience.

If it is going, or under to much strain, it will tell me and it will be addressed immediately.

I can get medical help in minutes if needed. and a surgeon in a few hours in extremes.

The gear I am 90% sure at that dose will not be a problem. I would have known by now if this dose was the issue. The pain I had the last few days was a grumble, nothing serious, I get them regardless of what I am doing. I think sometimes it just likes to let me know it's there.

Ultimately though, there was never a problem with the kidney itself in the first place, it was the reflux from the bladder through a faulty ureta that caused the decay.

So, in fact, I am in correct to say that I have bad kidneys, they are only bad due to a crappy ureta.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Damn you all beat me to it......:laugh:


----------



## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Allow me to answer this weeman.
> 
> A biscuit is identified by the fact that when fresh it is crisp, and when it starts to spoil it goes soft.
> 
> ...





Beklet said:


> Well.......there was the VAT tribunal that ruled they were biscuits, as some clever VAT inspector decided that as they were in the biscuit aisle and were partly covered in 'chocolate', they were therefore a chocolate covered biscuit and therefore liable to VAT.......(cakes aren't, whether they're covered on chocolate or not)
> 
> Anyhow, it went to appeal and Jaffa Cakes were deemed to be cakes as (apart from the bleeding obvious - they are CAKES, dammit! ), cakes go hard when they go stale and biscuits go soft. Jaffa CAKES, of course, go hard :thumb:
> 
> ...


i present my case,enter the realm...........of the pseudobiscuit.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Beklet said:


> Well.......there was the VAT tribunal that ruled they were biscuits, as some clever VAT inspector decided that as they were in the biscuit aisle and were partly covered in 'chocolate', they were therefore a chocolate covered biscuit and therefore liable to VAT.......(cakes aren't, whether they're covered on chocolate or not)
> 
> Anyhow, it went to appeal and Jaffa Cakes were deemed to be cakes as (apart from the bleeding obvious - they are CAKES, dammit! ), cakes go hard when they go stale and biscuits go soft. Jaffa CAKES, of course, go hard :thumb:
> 
> ...


Beklet - you need to get out more

:lol:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Beklet said:


> Oh and Ferrero Rocher are biscuits, allegedly......


Ever eaten a Ferrero Rocher that's gone off? Now you know.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Chris.....Yev No hid Ma Kidney probe yet!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Pseudo-biscuit ffs?????

Is it anywonder I'm so messed up and confused


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Jaffa cakes are cakes - McVitie's v Commissioners of Customs & Excise. They go hard when stale whereas biscuits go soft.


Just reflect on what kind of fvcked-up world we live in when supposedly intelligent people occupy their time determining such things!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Prodiver said:


> Just reflect on what kind of fvcked-up world we live in when supposedly intelligent people occupy their time determining such things!


Well... when a considerable amount of money was at stake, it doesn't surprise me.


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

weeman said:


> oh fuk i gone and done it now,i just called jaffa cake's a biscuit,this is gner have all hell breaking loose.
> 
> Does anyone have any scientific reports on wether jaffa cakes are biscuits or not? and i dont mean that old test from the eighties where they tested out the buscuityness of several brands but not jaffa cakes themselves,then deduced using facts based on those assumption wether jaffa cakes were in fact a biscuit or not. :confused1:
> 
> :thumbup1:


I remember this...

Which is a worry.

Where the fvck do we learn this sh1t? Seriously?

And how do we all know it? :confused1: :confused1:

Did you all know too that the reason there is no cremola foam any more is that when the company that made it was sold, they were bought exclusively for another recipe they owned and the new owners were uninterested in cremola foam.

When the resulting uproar ensued, they decided to make it again, but in the transfer of all the stuff in the factories they bought... they lost the recipe and its never been found.

Repeated/multiple attempts at reverse engineering have thus far been unsuccessful and as a result there is VERY little actual cremola foam left in the world to try and reverse engineer (even though its all from the 70's and is well off now....) and as such what there is is worth an absolute fortune....

I need to get out more.....



dmcc said:


> Jaffa cakes are cakes - McVitie's v Commissioners of Customs & Excise. They go hard when stale whereas biscuits go soft.





rs007 said:


> Beklet - you need to get out more
> 
> :lol:


Methinks Darren and Bek work for C&E haha....


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Uriel said:


> Chris.....Yev No hid Ma Kidney probe yet!


Well, it won't be much wider than a catheter so crack on fella :tongue:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Well... when a considerable amount of money was at stake, it doesn't surprise me.


Precisely!  Doesn't make it intelligent though!

He who is ignorant of history is destined to repeat the mistakes of the past.

(This isn't a non-sequitur.)


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Guess what this is.....


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

A train?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

rs007 said:


> Beklet - you need to get out more
> 
> :lol:


Ah, I take pride in my job lol I could tell you about a company who swore blind their creatine product was 'food' :laugh:



dmcc said:


> Ever eaten a Ferrero Rocher that's gone off? Now you know.


Bleurgh, no thanks!!! :lol:



Zara-Leoni said:


> I remember this...
> 
> Which is a worry.
> 
> ...


Not anymore - he escaped and I've been assimilated..... :crying:

I did used to work in VAT though...

Old woman - Excuse me, I'd like to know how long there's been VAT on cat food

Me - Since 1972 (it's around 1998 at this point)

OW - Well, that's ridiculous, no-one told me!!! I don't see why i should have to pay VAT on food I buy for my cat!!

Me - Well you could feed it tins of tuna - there's no VAT on that. Or chicken.... 

(I have no idea how I still have a job) :laugh:

/hijack


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Proof that airfoil theory is flawed?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

weeman said:


> oh mate,the mrs and i are like an encyclopidia regards this lol
> 
> Our daughter has multiple things wrong with her,the similarity to what you have is one of them,when she was born her ureters werent connected to her bladder they connected straight to her urethra bypassing the bladder altogether which in the end would have left her with a useless perfarated bladder,but the problem was she was so small (under 4lbs) that MRI's and ultrasounds werent clear enought to make head nor tale of her so we didnt know this till they had no choice but to open her up.
> 
> ...


This is really gutting to read Weeman as I know exactly how she feels with reflux. For a girl of that age it is horrible. To try and explain the pain it's like a slow dull pain, but excruciating and no matter how you twist and turn it won't go.

I'm sure as a father you know that already.

For what it's worth, I find Ribena, Green Tea and Cranberry juice help. Not all at once lol, but individually. A hot bath helps to relieve the pain and also the compulsary hot water bottle.

Do you not think having the kidney completely removed would be a better option? Or have they already discussed this? I just think if you take the kidney away which is dying anyway (if they can't fix it) that means no more pain and no more anti-biotics. I wish sometimes that I would do that, I just keep hanging to the dream that it will magically grow back lol.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Guess what this is.....


It's a McDonnell Douglas F-14 Tomcat..

(can you tell I was in the airforce?)


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Uriel said:


> It's a McDonnell Douglas F-14 Tomcat..
> 
> (can you tell I was in the airforce?)


Correctemundo :cool2:

T'is also the worlds greatest....

*FLYBY!!!!!!*

*
*

*
*  * *  * *  **

*
*


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Uriel said:


> It's a McDonnell Douglas F-14 Tomcat..
> 
> (can you tell I was in the airforce?)


What fkn airforce were you in - wasnt it Grumman made the F14?



(can you tell I was an avid Airfixer :lol: )


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Zara-Leoni said:


> Correctemundo :cool2:
> 
> T'is also the worlds greatest....
> 
> ...


Fly by fail.

now if the wings were swept back indicating supersonic flight, that - THAT - would be the worlds greatest fly-by

:lol:


----------



## RedKola (Nov 27, 2008)

rs007 said:


> What fkn airforce were you in - wasnt it Grumman made the F14?
> 
> 
> 
> (can you tell I was an *avid Airfixer* :lol: )


Anal Airfixer you mean....! :lol:


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

rs007 said:


> Fly by fail.
> 
> now if the wings were swept back indicating supersonic flight, that - THAT - would be the worlds greatest fly-by
> 
> :lol:


Airplane geek


----------



## Rob68 (Sep 16, 2008)

rs007 said:


> Fly by fail.
> 
> now if the wings were swept back indicating supersonic flight, that - THAT - would be the worlds greatest fly-by
> 
> :lol:


that you outside glasgow airport ramsey?... :whistling: ....you wanna lay off that protein mate

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=33345&stc=1&d=1257893543


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Uriel said:


> It's a McDonnell Douglas F-14 Tomcat..
> 
> (can you tell I was in the airforce?)


If you right click the pic it says f14flyby, how many different f 14's did they make? :beer:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Grumann F-14A is one of the first toys I can remember owning.

It was from the VF-111 squadron, the "Sundowners".

The names of the Tomcat squadrons were awesom, I always remember being well impressed. The F14 was used in Top Gun and JAG. Very famous aeroplane, served nearly 30 years in the US NAVY.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

winger said:


> If you right click the pic it says f14flyby, how many different f 14's did they make? :beer:


I might be wrong, but I think there were 3 variations on the original, so 4 in total.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just jabbed again today.

After much deliberation dose was upped, not taken lightly, although I am sure there will be others who think I did.

I was up till 1am last nigth researching effects of gear on kidneys, and the result is that the protein is far mor likely to damage than the gear.

Dropped the first needle and barrel onto the sofa, so had to stop and put a fresh pin on. Found a cut on the back of my hand, so spent ages sanitizing everything 3 times.

Injected one site, changed barrels, no problems there. Probablly should have aspirated when second barrel was attached, but no blood came out as barrel was taken off, so no vein.

Injected slowly and no pain. As I removed the needle I nicked a nerve, leg went into spasm for a second, just kept pulling till needle was out. This caused pain, and now I know what to expect if I ever do hit a nerve. Electric shock is very accurate.

All in all it went well. Although nervous as hell for some reason. Feel good now it's done.

Now it is just a case of monitoring health and progress. There is definately no intentions for more gear between now and until way after the show. If I don't at least make some gains on this then I am in the wrong game.

Ramsay *SUGGESTED* and I agree that I will up the protein slowly over a period of around 2 weeks, so that kidneys (if there is a problem) and digestive system has time to adjust to changes. All should be good.

Going to be taking a look at my training programme as well, see if there are any things that can be improved upon.

No doubt I will be slated for changing it again.

Again, big personal thanks to all who have commented in here. Been some pretty lively debating in here and it has been great.

Lets keep moving forward!!!


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

:wub:


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Well done Chris - now stop worrying about what other people think and listen to whomsoever you choose to !

There are a lot of opinions flying about [as well as F14's] so pick one i.e. Ramsay and follow his advice. Anything else is just background noise. Me, I'm like elevator musak ...x


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Just jabbed again today.
> 
> After much deliberation dose was upped, not taken lightly, although I am sure there will be others who think I did.
> 
> ...


Yes mate, gear does not really hit kidneys that hard in itself, especially on doses you are running.

Only thing is watch your blood pressure as thats bad for kidneys as are painkillers and binge drinking combined with dehydration effects after a session..

Good advice from Ramsay, I would suggest you would do well listening to him:thumb:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

jw007 said:


> Yes mate, gear does not really hit kidneys that hard in itself, especially on doses you are running.
> 
> Only thing is watch your blood pressure as thats bad for kidneys as are painkillers and binge drinking combined with dehydration effects after a session..
> 
> *Good advice from Ramsay, I would suggest you would do well listening to him* :thumb:


Cheers Hulk, don't want anyone building hype tho - by my own admission I am only a novice myself and its not like I am "prepping" Chris... he has asked my opinion on a few things, I have gave it, thats what this place is all about. I will not be offended in the slightest if he asks others opinions, and makes his own mind up :thumbup1:

Already on the blood pressure situation tho 

Great minds


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Grumann F-14A is one of the first toys I can remember owning.
> 
> It was from the VF-111 squadron, the "Sundowners".
> 
> The names of the Tomcat squadrons were awesom, I always remember being well impressed. The F14 was used in Top Gun and JAG. Very famous aeroplane, served nearly 30 years in the US NAVY.


Just for you Chris, I present, a Sundowner, complete with freshly launched Pheonix missile - I remember building a kit of one of these :lol:

Then blowing it to bits as it hung from my ceiling with the trusty 0.22 :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I actually think they used this squadron for the filming of Top Gun, I could be wrong though.

Blood pressure is under control, and all good advice from you guys.

Tell you what though, sex drive is through the roof today. I'm like a man possessed.

I know it can't be from today already, but jesus, it's almost painful 

Feel pretty good today as well. Eating properly again. Ordered Protein, although for some reason it doesn't seem to be allowing a bulk discount for me on Myprotein which is annoying.

All good in the hood though. Back tomorrow, should be fun. Haven't deadlifted in ages. Going to do a little 1rm work for a warm up, see what I can do. Should be a good indication if there has been any strength increase!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

4ml in your leg will be sore - it took me a good while to get used to it! Don't worry too much about aspiration when you attach the second barrel, there will be some gear in the needle and the fluid in the second barrel should be just about to spill out from the top, so all good.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

rs007 said:


> What fkn airforce were you in - wasnt it Grumman made the F14?
> 
> 
> 
> (can you tell I was an avid Airfixer :lol: )


Ach it's all yankee sh1te....I was a Tornado man:thumbup1:

(yeah I was thinking F 4 Phantom with the manufacturer)


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Talk about sh1t aircraft....I'm off to Sweden tomorrow to rebuild a BAE ATP ("Advanced Turbo Prop", But Contracters changed it to "Another Thousand Pounds") that has been in fuking pieces for years....apparently all the bits are there - No paperwork lol....

Guess I'll be earning a few quid on the run up to chistmas.....(good job I'm cruising!)

Up the dose Big Chris....Kindeys are for poofs


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

God the ATP's were crap... Had the misfortune of flying in one many times. Give me a Dash-8 or an ATR any day.


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> God the ATP's were crap... Had the misfortune of flying in one many times. Give me a Dash-8 or an ATR any day.


I've got Dash 8 on my license too but not the ATR, I'd like to do the course though as there is sh1t loads of work on them.

They all have the same engine give or take some shaft horse power BTW Pratt & Whitney 120 series.

You'll probably never fly on one again DMCC, they only ever built about 68 of them and the ones flying now are all freighters


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

In some ways it's a good way that SAS offloaded all their 8-400's as now there's loads on the "pre-flown" market. Did you see that ATR is bringing out the -600 series? Looks like a good bird, though TBH I'm biased a little towards European machines.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Wow, you 2 have even begun to lose me now.

Dose upped Uriel, no worries


----------



## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

dmcc said:


> In some ways it's a good way that SAS offloaded all their 8-400's as now there's loads on the "pre-flown" market. Did you see that ATR is bringing out the -600 series? Looks like a good bird, though TBH I'm biased a little towards European machines.


I don't have the Q400 - it's a different type, I have the old 1, 2 & 300's.

The Q 4's are ok it just SAS has sh1te engineers that don't know how to fettle them. I have a few mates at flybe who were a launch customer - working on q4's since 02 with no probs. :thumbup1:

Sorry Chris, we diverge:innocent:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

No apologies here, I'm a civil aviation geek - a planespotter, if you will - so I'm loving this.

Ooh, Airliner World is out...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

no worries mate, allsorts popping up in here these days 

very informative place to be. Aircraft have always fascinated me, probably because I am slightly scared of flying.

In fact Engineering in general is fascinating!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

I can't wait to get in an A380 - Matt was in one last month. Its rotate speed is really low, it takes off at a genteel walking pace :lol:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Threre's nothing genteel about modern flying! Now when I were a lad travelling on BOAC...

If God had meant us to fly he wouldn't have given us the railways!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Actually, I saw the inside of an Emirates one and it looked amazing.

Apparantly Singapore Airlines is even better!!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

No Chris, EK is better than SQ - First Class pax in EK have access to private shower suites!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I saw them in Emirates, I have yet to see inside Singapore, but a friend who has flown both said Singapore wipes the floor with them.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Here's the video of the A380 take off from a unique perspective.






I get to watch them from my house now


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

M_at said:


> Here's the video of the A380 take off from a unique perspective.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I watched your vids, espec the fly-by one.

I understand the forces at work, and know it isn't magic how something like that should fly.

But my brain still thinks it isnt possible, looks far too slow to stay in the air :lol:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Ramsay - the Airbus Beluga taking off from the factory in Hamburg.

http://www.youtube.com/user/dmcc77#p/u/9/acDni1gYDMg


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Hey Uriel what do you do?

I have been building airplanes for a living for over 30 years and even before that I have built so many remote control planes it isn't funny. God I love this stuff!

Sorry for the hijack big Chris, but just go with it..lol

Oh by the way I have been experimenting on upping the protein and my jaws are sore..lol


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

As a result of this thread I have upped my protein and feel like a right bloated fatty - thanks folks :thumbup1:

All for the good I'm sure - I was eating bog all before so I expect to have bigger muscles than chris on stage :whistling:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Am I on the wrong site?? :confused1:

I come for some bodybuilding advice, and get lots of aircraft info :lol:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

You come for the advice - but why do you stay?

I think it's the smut


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Bump for more smut.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

No smut lads, just training today. I have shamelessly pilfered A4pads journal keeping (Iasked him first) in a way to make it a little more interesting to keep up with and easier to look back throuhg.

Minus the in depth ****ing bits


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

D4ead has quite a good journal layout, it isnt just numbers and figures, but gives an insight into how he is going as a whole.

If you can be bothered, dig out Delhi's journal from his first show prep in 2007 - another brilliant layout, loads of info. Probably my favourite journal to date, real rollercoaster stuff - and, super-relevant to you as it is a first timer prep journal too.

Don't get me wrong, a lot of the info can seem unnecessary or overkill - but it can sometimes help you spot things... sometimes it is more beneficial to know how a person is doing, rather than just how much wieght they are pushing.

Plus, nothing puts folks to sleep more than a exhaustive list of sets,reps and wieghts alone :thumbup1:


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

M_at said:


> You come for the advice - but why do you stay?
> 
> I think it's the smut


Got it in one :thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

*training*

*Deads*

5 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

3 x 140kg

2 x 160kg

1 x 180kg

1 x 200kg

1 x 210kg (Come on )you futher mucker!!!!!!  8 months it's taken!!!!)

*Lat pulldowns, palms facing narrow grip*5 x 90kg

8 x 75kg

8 x 80kg

8 x 85kg

7 x 90kg

*Wide Grip Rows*

8 x 75kg

8 x 80kg

7.5 x 85kg

*Narrow Grip rows*

8 x 60kg

8 x 65kg

8 x 75kg

relaxation

sleep = 4 + 3hrs ( I work shifts)

quality = 6/10

sexy time = x 1

quality = very good

emotional state

Health = :thumbup1:

Love Life = :thumb:

Sex = :thumb:

Life = :thumbup1:

Work = :yawn:

Overall = :thumbup1:

diet

*Meal1:* - 50g Protein,50g instant oats, 5g Glutamine, 3000mg BCAA

*Meal 2:* - One peice wholemeal toast, 1 serving spoon baked beans, 6 egg whites (hard boiled), cheese, yoghurt with raisans.

*Train*

*Meal 3:* - PWO - 50g Protein, 5g Glutamine, 3000mg BCAA, 7100mg Milk Thistle, 3000mg Cranberry extract

*Meal 4:* - 50g Protein

*Meal 5:* - 2 Steak, Green Beans, Sauce Bernaise, (cheeky desert :tongue: ) (2 lads 21st's)

*Meal 6:* - 50g Cassein Whey, 5g Glutamine, 3000mg BCAA

So, amazingly chuffed at the 210kg, massive mental block overcome. it felt super easy. I know the gear is there, but TBF I think that just gave me the mental confidence to do it.

The rest of the workout felt sooo good, that 6-8 rep range feels good. 8 - 12 reps was good for a while, but I didn't feel like I was progressing. Weights were stagnant. I think this was more to do with my CV blowing out before the muscles did.

No doubt I'll get ripped for changing it again, but, do I really give 2 sh1ts???

Diet is not normal today, although it is still in transition anyway. I didn't sleep to well last night, so I went to bed straight after breakfast and then got up and trained. Normally there would be another solid meal in there at lunch.

Having to be a bit careful with the shake ATM as I am running low, have ordered 10kg for the 17th, so I can ramp that up when they arrive.


----------



## pastanchicken (Sep 29, 2008)

Well done on the 210 mate! Very nice


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Cheers Pasta, I'm on top of the world.

When I pulled it I accidently texted Darren and offered my ar5e to him I was so excited. He politely refused and offered me his lol


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

nice training session mate and i have to say i love the style you use to right it up ;D


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I also like the way I *WRITE* it up to


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

ohh hitting me with a spelling mistake thats low, you have been talking to pat to much. pmsl


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

d4ead said:


> ohh hitting me with a spelling mistake thats low, you have been talking to pat *to much*. pmsl


That should be "*too* much" :whistling:

Just trying to help out :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

OWNED!!!!!


----------



## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

hahaha, thats it! Must find grammar and spelling plug-in for firefox

leave the simpleton alone people... we bite ...


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Scott your better known for your good looks anyways.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Cheers Pasta, I'm on top of the world.
> 
> When I pulled it I accidently texted Darren and offered my ar5e to him I was so excited. He politely refused and offered me his lol


There was nothing "accidental" about it.

Good pulling you big gay poof sailor, it's about time. By any chance have you been working off any aggression? :lol:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Yay.

Now I have a reason to pull 215. :tongue:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Nice lifting!!!! We'll all be putting smileys up on our journals lol though how many angry faces can I get on mine?? :lol: :lol: :lol:

I need to up my game on the deads (and everything, tbh...)

x


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> When I pulled it I accidently texted Darren and offered my ar5e to him I was so excited. He politely refused and offered me his lol


LOL


----------



## Zara-Leoni (Mar 12, 2007)

Beklet said:


> Nice lifting!!!! We'll all be putting smileys up on our journals lol though how many angry faces can I get on mine?? :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> I need to up my game on the deads (and everything, tbh...)
> 
> x


^^^^^^^^^^^ What she said with the lifting :thumb:

210kg - go on! :thumbup1:

Smiley-Fest is it? Oh ok then....


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

*training*

*Flat Bench*

8 x 100kg

8 x 110kg

8 x 115kg

7 x 115kg

7 x 115kg

*Incline Bench*

8 x 80kg

8 x 90kg

6 x 90kg

*CGBP*

8 x 85kg

8 x 90kg

7 x 90kg

*Chest press flyes*

8 x 90kg

8 x 90kg

7 x 90kg

*Tri Pushdowns*

8 x 50kg

8 x 55kg

8 x 55kg

*Rope pulldowns*

3 x 8 x 35kg

Daydreaming between sets = none :thumb:

*relaxation*

sleep = 6 + 1hrs ( I work shifts)

quality = 8/10

sexy time = x 1

quality = very good

*emotional state*

Health = :thumb:

Love Life = :confused1:

Sex = :thumb:

Life = :thumbup1:

Work = :cursing:

Mood = :cursing:

Overall = :thumbup1:

diet

Pretty obscure today to be fair, but getting the protein in, should have just enough to get me back home with shakes. Piling the food in though 

Posh meal tonight, so will be having a slight departure from the norm, however I imagine mainly it will be a massive steak so not so bad!!

Must say, probably the best chest workout I've done.

I was in a rush, so did it before breakfast, as a result of needing to hurry, rest time was minimal. Blasted through it, feel awesome, jobs good!!!

Felt the need to add in 2 more smiley box's for general mood and for day dreaming between sets, for which I am terrible.

My mood is funny, not sure if it is the Tren. I am getting incredibly frustrated with people again. I have absolutely no time for fools anymore. I find them insufferable to the utmost.

Today there was an argument about how to pay the bill, and I felt myself boiling up at how difficult people can make such a simple task and had to go outside.

Last time it passed after a while, so hopefully it will settle down again.

Don't even want to talk about work!!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Watch the mood swings and DO NOT let the tren become an excuse. TBH you've not really been on long enough for it to have had any real psychoactive effects but what others have observed is that if you are naturally irritable or aggressive, it will make you worse.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Irritable yes, aggresive, definately not.

On a side note, is this place getting quiet or what.

Ever thread I am subscribed to seems to be absolutely dead! Hardly any posting whatsoever.

Please don't tell me everyone got a life :crying:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Nah, not everyone got a life.

Fancy a shag? :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Jeez, about bloody time. I thought no-one was going to ask!!!!


----------



## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Hey chris

Fantastic DL buddy 

Onwards and upwards


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Irritable yes, aggresive, definately not.
> 
> On a side note, is this place getting quiet or what.
> 
> ...


Yeah it's getting quiet - I ws off having a life yesterday, today I'm bloody busy and next week I'm working LOTS.

Will update in a minute....


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I know, the forum is absolutely dead.

Shame really, maybe it really is on it's last legs. I've been checking out other forums as well to see what else is around. UKiron looks good!


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

UKIron has a ton of excellent information but is a morgue in comparison to this place. Maybe people have gone and got lives...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

True, just sad old me sitting here at the comp whilst supposed to be working wishing I had someone to talk to :crying:


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

And who am I, chopped liver? :lol:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> I know, the forum is absolutely dead.
> 
> Shame really, maybe it really is on it's last legs. I've been checking out other forums as well to see what else is around. UKiron looks good!


I'm on there - not posted for AGES - is a bit dead tbh.....

I used to be on bb.com a lot, but it can be full of twunts, so I try to be careful where I post.....(Over 35 section, and British thread usually) I still go on there a fair bit just to read.

I'm on MT as well but rarely post cos the layout does my head in...

I think this forum is going through another mardy phase - it does that sometimes, then picks up again...


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, true. Hopefully it will pick up again soon.

Work is cr*p without it


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

At least you can access it at work.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

For now, they're clamping right down on things now.

Hope they overlook this!


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

OK - sorry I've not been the life and soul of the forum recently but I've been a bit busy moving house. :bounce:

So today I had a family engagement - 3 year old cousins birthday party - and there was cake. It was meant to be a rocket but it just looked like the fattest black dildo. Big bell end, japs eye and everything - I really didn't know where to look :lol:

I really wanted to facebook it but as everyone there is on facebook it doesn't seem right somehow


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Oh man, you gotta do it.

You owe it to society!!!


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

M_at said:


> OK - sorry I've not been the life and soul of the forum recently but I've been a bit busy moving house. :bounce:
> 
> So today I had a family engagement - 3 year old cousins birthday party - and there was cake. It was meant to be a rocket but it just looked like the fattest black dildo. Big bell end, japs eye and everything - I really didn't know where to look :lol:
> 
> I really wanted to facebook it but as everyone there is on facebook it doesn't seem right somehow


Post it on here.....


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

M_at said:


> OK - sorry I've not been the life and soul of the forum recently but I've been a bit busy moving house. :bounce:
> 
> So today I had a family engagement - 3 year old cousins birthday party - and there was cake. It was meant to be a rocket but it just looked like the fattest black dildo. Big bell end, japs eye and everything - I really didn't know where to look :lol:
> 
> I really wanted to facebook it but as everyone there is on facebook it doesn't seem right somehow


That is so funny.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

*training*

*Squats*

8 x 140kg

8 x 140kg

8 x 140kg

8 x 140kg

8 x 140kg

*Standing leg curls*

8 x 25kg

8 x 30kg

8 x 35kg

*Leg extensions*

12 x 97.5kg

12 x 97.5kg

12 x 97.5kg

Daydreaming between sets = none

relaxation

sleep = 6 + 3hrs ( I work shifts)

quality = 8/10

sexy time = x 0

quality = very good

emotional state

Health = :thumb:

Love Life = :crying:

Sex = :crying:

Life = :mellow:

Work = :mellow:

Mood = :mellow:

Overall = :mellow:

diet

Got my protein order from stores this morning, was crying in case it didn't turn up, but it got here. So shakes can be upped now to a good amount. Also upping Glutamine to 10g to see how that goes.

Other diet bits are cool. Managing to get fresh omlettes for Breakfast now which is nice, stay away from the powdered cr*p.

So all in all pretty good there.

Generally though a bit upset as missus has left and is back in Canada now, so cabin is very empty now except for a cuddly dog and a lobster ballon. This is why I don't let women get close, always ends up like this.

Anyway, she is coming to mine for a belated Christmas in Jan for a few days which will be nice, and then we will have to work something out after that if all is still well. Can concentrate on training though without having to worry about giving my time to anyone else.

Plus I promised her that by Jan I would look better than Hugh Jackman, so I better get my a55 in gear 

Jabbed again today. Tried 2ml in each quad instead of 4ml in one today, see how that goes.

Anyways guys, bed time for me, hope you're all well :beer:


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Aaaah poor Chris 

Yes forget about women -we're all evil anyway mwahahahaha.

Concentrate on the training

[& getting a bod which pretty much guarantees everyone falling over themselves to say hello to you]

That's my plan :thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Steady on Jem, I always be an ugly fecker 

Nah, she is a good girl, and when you get a good one (and by good I mean she hasn't tried to set alight to me yet) you gotta keep them.

Also have to try not to only child the whoel situation and get bored :whistling:

Will throw a pic up of us if I can find a nice one.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> (and by good I mean she hasn't tried to set alight to me yet) .


 :lol: thats def a keeper in my book :lol:

just a quicky - not having a dig - but why 5 full sets of 8 with 140 on squats - surely you could have pushed a little harder there, went a little heavier on the latter sets?

Or is it because you didnt have a spot?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Ha See i'm a vindictive bitch. . . If people suddenly start talking to me only when i have an amazing body they're shallow cretins who need their eyes poking out with a rusty nail lol


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Beklet said:


> Ha See i'm a vindictive bitch. . . If people suddenly start talking to me only when i have an amazing body they're shallow cretins who need their eyes poking out with a rusty nail lol


Well I'd call that being a realist actually ! Same way I think Beks, difference is I could be smug then 

I'd love to be smug about something  I hate most people [issues:confused1:] - Think I had the right idea when I was little - live like Grizzly Adams & just talk to the animals 

Chris your standards are erm interesting :whistling: :lol:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Jem said:


> I hate most people [issues:confused1:] - Think I had the right idea when I was little - live like Grizzly Adams & just talk to the animals


Nah, you have just fell into the trap of associating with the wrong people :lol:

I cant be fcked with most people either :cursing: :lol:

Lets start a "We Hate Everyone" group thread, you Beks and me can be founding members :lol:


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Aye -probably right ! 

Erm yeah -I'll leave you tostart that thread then R.

Meet you in there:thumb:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

rs007 said:


> :lol: thats def a keeper in my book :lol:
> 
> just a quicky - not having a dig - but why 5 full sets of 8 with 140 on squats - surely you could have pushed a little harder there, went a little heavier on the latter sets?
> 
> Or is it because you didnt have a spot?


Weather mate, back in the North Atlantic so it is sh1t, but I coudn't really afford waiting another 2 days to get back in the gym. I know I have 150 or 160 even, but on the first set the ship rolled and damn near cleaned me out, all my weight was on the tips of my toes.

You're right to have a dig, it isn't ideal, hopefully in the med though it will be calmer so more can be achieved!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Beklet said:


> Ha See i'm a vindictive bitch. . . If people suddenly start talking to me only when i have an amazing body they're shallow cretins who need their eyes poking out with a rusty nail lol


To be fair she was with me before I started really training that seriously. She isn't someone who is driven at all by physical appearance, just need to look at her ex for that!!!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm the same mate, I have very little time for others. People I call idiots.

The gym makes it worse I think, when I look around they're all sitting there smug and full of sh1t, telling me how everything is wrong with my life and how there's is so great. Very few of them have any clue what I do, so I just stopped interacting with people I don't know.

Not a healthy way to exist really.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris, my reply was to Jem pmsl! And i'd love to be smug about something too maybe i will one day. One thing that winds me up is people who only talk to you to make themselves look better . . I'll remember . .


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Weather mate, back in the North Atlantic so it is sh1t, but I coudn't really afford waiting another 2 days to get back in the gym. I know I have 150 or 160 even, but on the first set the ship rolled and damn near cleaned me out, all my weight was on the tips of my toes.
> 
> You're right to have a dig, it isn't ideal, hopefully in the med though it will be calmer so more can be achieved!


Damn I just never thought about that!! Rough seas, fkn hell, that puts a new light on it, squatting 140kg when the ground beneath your feet is moving around!

Should have said mate!


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Ah, sorry petal.

Me replying to fast again.

Need a hug, any offers?? :crying:


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Big hug from me - as many as you need sweetie


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

rs007 said:


> Damn I just never thought about that!! Rough seas, fkn hell, that puts a new light on it, squatting 140kg when the ground beneath your feet is moving around!
> 
> Should have said mate!


It is interesting mate. Makes it even more of a compound. Abs are normally killing the next day!!!

TBH, 90% of the time she's steady, just getting to the Med in Winter is interesting. On the way up it was terrible so I had to skip an extra day.

Bench is bad enough in rough weather, but squats and MP are near on impossible


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Beklet said:


> Big hug from me - as many as you need sweetie


Lots


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Just thought I would throw up a couple of pics of a dinner we had not so long ago.

Please excuse how [email protected] I look in them as I always do look horrible in photos.

My missus is the blondish one 2nd in beneath the guy who looks completely out of place.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Looking nicely big in the second photo.

Now I have to take issue with a few things you said:

1. You are not ugly. Far from it.

2. So what if you are ignoring people in the gym? They're not in the same zone as you. Just as long as you don't come across as an asshole, don't worry.

3. Fancy a shag?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

What Darren said.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

What Beklet said.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

What Mat said.


----------



## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

What winger said.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

*training*

*Lat side raises*

8 x 17.5kg

8 x 20kg

8 x 20kg

7 x 20kg

*Seated Military Press*

7 x 60kg

7 x 60kg

6 x 60kg

8 x 57.5kg

7 x 57.5kg

Daydreaming between sets = none

relaxation

sleep = 4 + 3hrs ( I work shifts)

quality = 8/10

sexy time = x 0

quality = meh

emotional state

Health = :thumb:

Love Life = :thumbup1: even though she isn't here :crying:

Sex = :cursing:

Life = :thumbup1:

Work = 

Mood = :thumbup1:

Overall = :thumbup1:

diet

Just about there with the protein. Got the 5 shakes a day in and probably onto about 4 meals solid now. Seem to be handling it well. Was a struggle at first but seems to have settled

Workout was a little disjointed due to hordes of people in the gym, will have to start going even earlier now!

Had a bit of attitude with one of the guys, using the squat rack for Overhead press, which is fine. I asked him how many sets he had left and all I got was "why do you care", I just laughed and started dismantling it.

He asked me what the fcuk I thought I was doing, I said I bought the thing, I own the thing and I'm taking it away. He then backed off very quickly, THEN I informed him if he ever addressed me in that manner again he would become an extremely ornamental fence post with the Olympic bar.

Cheeky sh1t.

Was a bit strange doing the pre-exhaust, made the pressing hard, but I feel awesome now, all the right pains and non of the wrong ones. Will put shrugs in tomorrow with back.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> *training*
> 
> *Lat side raises*
> 
> ...


Ha ha nice one!!! Cheeky bastard lol I'd have loved to have seen his face!!!! :laugh: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> *training*
> 
> *Lat side raises*
> 
> ...


Did you do one side at a time?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Did you pull rank on him too?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

no, both together. I find it to easy one at a time. Normally do them seated as well but there was no bench.

Very stricyt though, with the exception of the last 2 reps maybe.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

dmcc said:


> Did you pull rank on him too?


I can only assume he genuinely didn't know who I was.

I have never been given sh1t like that from an Indian water, but generally they are getting worse on here.

Some of the attitudes these guys join with is dreadful, just another reason why I am considering options.


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> I can only assume he genuinely didn't know who I was.
> 
> I have never been given sh1t like that from an Indian water, but generally they are getting worse on here.
> 
> Some of the attitudes these guys join with is dreadful, just another reason why I am considering options.


Throw the little scrote overboard.....


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> no, both together. I find it to easy one at a time. Normally do them seated as well but there was no bench.
> 
> Very stricyt though, with the exception of the last 2 reps maybe.


Interesting - it's normally more difficult one arm at a time - if you do them correctly! Usually you can't use as much weight as you can't heave or swing, especially with your other shoulder against a firm upright, and of course you keep the weights out to the side properly and don't let them drift to the front - which endangers your RCs.


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I keep them to the side with a slight bend in the elbow as I feel it takes a little of the unnecessary strain off the joints.

Certainly do not bring them right forward though.

I did used to do them one armed against a wall, I just find this way better. And admittedly I love watching myself in the mirror as I do them. Look bloody awesome


----------



## Prodiver (Nov 14, 2008)

Chris1 said:


> I keep them to the side with a slight bend in the elbow as I feel it takes a little of the unnecessary strain off the joints.
> 
> Certainly do not bring them right forward though.
> 
> I did used to do them one armed against a wall, I just find this way better. And admittedly I love watching myself in the mirror as I do them. Look bloody awesome


Great! The slight elbow bend is wise. Just don't swing or heave! :thumb:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

just out of passing interest - I do mine single arm, don't hold onto an upright or anything with my other arm - what I do is my untrained arm I compose into a lat spread, and go from there. I do let my upper body move a little - just a little - to find the groove, and get the feeling into the muscle - but nowhere near as much as someone typically moves their body in a double arm lateral raise.

I prefer it, I can get a better squeeze at the top - the reason I started it tho is I just lack feeling a little on my RHS (pinched a nerve a couple of years back, can only presume this is why) so splitting it one side at a time I then know each side is getting hit.

Could be total bollocks, but I also kinda hope there might be some core benefit through having to stabilise the torso with a wieght held way out on one side?


----------



## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Could even do them on a swiss ball if you wanted to.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Swiss ball? He's not that gay.


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

What's so gay about a Swiss ball? I've got one!

Oh. Yeah maybe that is a bit gay after all :lol:


----------



## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Try doing dumbell bench and inclines on one with slow controlled movements and tell me they dont feel diffrent.

Next day you will be sore.

Just variations mates just variations, not sexual variations, workout variations....lol


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Swiss ball is for the guy that already has too much muscle, not met too many of those guys..lol


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Whats up slut... how's things. I've been away from the board lately since beeing on holiday, not been reading up much here.

Hope training is going well? What's the weight now, are you leaning up nicely too?


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Had a bit of attitude with one of the guys, using the squat rack for Overhead press, which is fine. I asked him how many sets he had left and all I got was "why do you care", I just laughed and started dismantling it.
> 
> He asked me what the fcuk I thought I was doing, *I said I bought the thing, I own the thing and I'm taking it away.* He then backed off very quickly, THEN I informed him if he ever addressed me in that manner again he would become an extremely ornamental fence post with the Olympic bar.
> 
> ...


hahahah brilliant. make it known that it's your gym!! You allow them to train!! :thumb: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

FFs, just wrote out a post and it's gone!!

So basically, we are not allowed to use the Passenger gym for reasons I can't diiscuss, had a f days off as a result.

Bit of stress with the missus over somethign she held back to try and protect me and not lose me, as usual it came out in the end, but I have to accept responsibility as well.

Booked in for therapy at home.. Somethign I said I would never do.

Will be seeing a NLP/Hypno expert for pre-existing insecurities, which seem to rip through me and make realtionships nearly immpossible and a couples therapist thingy to help with aforementioned problems.

I'm really dedicated to making this one work so whatever is necessary. Thought I would feel ashamed of doing it, but I am actually quite excited.

Kidneys shagged a little, I have a feeling now that there may be some relationship between it and emotional stress, as every time it kicks off it is normally at a time when I am pretty low. Something else to watch out for I reckon. Anyway, it is by no means bad, just niggling.

Decided to just go in today and have a bot of fun, get back into the swing of things, we still only have the Olly bar and the bench, so I did flat bench and deads.

What do you know 2 PB's down 

*Flat bench*

8 x 60kg

6 x 100kg

4 x 120kg

4 x 140kg

1 x 150kg

1 x 160kg No spotter, no lift in, not big or clever, but makes it a bit more impressive

*Deads*

5 x 60kg

5 x 100kg

3 x 140kg

1 x 180kg

1 x 200kg

1 x 220kg  mini BOOM

Not bad considering no food today due to general bleurgh.

Might skip a day then do Military Press and Squats as the problem doesn't show signs of slowing down so gym may be a few days from being opened.

TS you Saffir slut, how are ya?

Haven't weighed myself in ages mate, should get on it really!!

Hope your training is going well fella???


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice job on the PB's big man. Fancy a shag?


----------



## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> FFs, just wrote out a post and it's gone!!
> 
> So basically, we are not allowed to use the Passenger gym for reasons I can't diiscuss, had a f days off as a result.
> 
> ...


Nice PBs :thumb:

xxx


----------



## Jem (Mar 5, 2009)

Beks and Chris - you are a right pair honestly ! What is with all these insecurities please ?

Why - you 're both lovely people with a lot going for you - where does all this doubt come from

Therapy Chris ? OMG really ...hope it goes well

Chris are you still planning on doing that show ?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Nice work on the PB's even though you know what I think about lifting that in by yourself on an unstable surface..... :wub:


----------



## M_at (May 2, 2009)

Chris1 said:


> 1 x 160kg No spotter, no lift in, not big or clever, but makes it a bit more impressive


*glare* Be careful you.



Chris1 said:


> 1 x 220kg  mini BOOM


Bugger.

That's a request. :lol:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Gone kinda quiet in here - hows things Chris?


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Everything is cool Ramsay.

Not done anything epic really to comment on.

Ship is about to go into Drydock so it is as busy as it gets.

Still training though and still eating like a b*stard. 4 shakes a day on top.

I tried 5 but jeez it was hard. I may try upping again soon.

Just haven't really been ar5ed with journals recently TBH, lazy probably. Got alittle tired of having to update all the time. I am home soon though, so I will have no excuse!!!


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Everything is cool Ramsay.
> 
> Not done anything epic really to comment on.
> 
> ...


Thats all good mate, I was just a bit worried is all.

Thing is, once you get into routine, it does get a bit like "nothing new to report" - you just have your head down going for it all the time.

Keep up the good work mate :thumbup1:


----------



## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Feeling good though.

Health has returned to as good as it gets. Lets just hope it stays there,

Will throw some dry dock pics up of the hsip high and dry when we're in if anyones interested.


----------



## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Chris1 said:


> Feeling good though.
> 
> Health has returned to as good as it gets. Lets just hope it stays there,
> 
> Will throw some dry dock pics up of the hsip high and dry when we're in if anyones interested.


Post that sh1t will ya, I love those kind of pics big man.

Nice to hear you are on the up and up.

After listening to Rams talk about upping the protein I did it about 2-3 weeks ago and I am the heaviest I have ever been ever. It doesn't appear to be fat but my height (5'8") at 222 lbs isn't good, IMO.


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> FFs, just wrote out a post and it's gone!!
> 
> So basically, we are not allowed to use the Passenger gym for reasons I can't diiscuss, had a f days off as a result.
> 
> ...


Yeah I'm keeping well mate, just been busy with stuff, training, flu trying to take hold and forcing feeding my trap!! Weight is not going up much if at all but getting more and more attention when I go out and people at gym asking me my weight and how long to get big etc.. etc.. they must be seeing something. Decided I need more calories so slowly upping that and seeing where it gets me. January 2nd is the start of the major onslaught towards 116+kg's.

Nice benching and dedlifting there slut. How long you on shore for, hopefully you can get some access to a decent gym for a awhile and get some solid regular training in.

Your benching seems to have gone up about 20kg's it seems? What can you do with a spotter I wonder. Keep going buddy.

Glad you positive about the therepay and all that, if things bug you or hold you back they gotta get sorted any way you see fit. All the best there.

I'll post some pics end of January once this catabolic abusive period called xmas is over. I'm skipping my birthday to avoid one more day of drinking. Amazing how many birthdays, engagement parties etc.. etc.. come up when you want to focus on gym.

If you ever in south london looking for a place to train give us a shout and pull in my side at David Lloyds.


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

Are you still alive, sailor?


----------



## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Very quiet in here.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Will throw some dry dock pics up of the hsip high and dry when we're in if anyones interested.


Any of these pics available yet, would love to see mate.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

:confused1: :confused1: :confused1:

Whats happening, getting a bit worried here - anyone heard from Chris?

He told me he was back ashore from beginning Jan... havent heard from him since, or seen him on here?


----------



## dmcc (Nov 25, 2007)

He has posted, but in his other journal... he's doing a masters and is also being a good househusband.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Sorry dudes, just had alot going on.

I think I underestimated just how much work I would have to do to get my captains certificate. I am being a good house husband as well, but not a brilliant one at the moment due to studying.

Exam is 1 month today, will be happy when it's all done and dusted.

Plus side I have found a gym near college which may be an option with the rush hour traffic. So fingers crossed.


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## Guest (Jan 24, 2010)

Chris1 said:


> Sorry dudes, just had alot going on.
> 
> I think I underestimated just how much work I would have to do to get my captains certificate. I am being a good house husband as well, but not a brilliant one at the moment due to studying.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup1: Nice to see a post from you Chris. Very exciting news with you going for your captain's certificate. Good luck on the test!!! Is it a very dificult test? How will your responsibilities change once you get it?


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Chris1 said:


> Sorry dudes, just had alot going on.
> 
> I think I underestimated just how much work I would have to do to get my captains certificate. I am being a good house husband as well, but not a brilliant one at the moment due to studying.
> 
> ...


Yay good luck with the exams - about to start studying for a qualification ad I'm bricking it lol!!! x


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## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> Sorry dudes, just had alot going on.
> 
> I think I underestimated just how much work I would have to do to get my captains certificate. I am being a good house husband as well, but not a brilliant one at the moment due to studying.
> 
> ...


Yeah was wondering where you were yesterday. Does sound like you pretty busy at the moment mate. Studying and advancing career is always a good thing. Wish you all the best on the exam.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

It will qualify me to be captain of any ship in the world so it's pretty major!

It's just hard getting back to studying after 2 years working. It's only a short course though so it will be over fast.

Exam is a 90 minute oral exam and he can ask me anything about being at sea and all that I've learnt in 10 years. Very intense.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

90 minutes oral, man thats a lot of head :whistling:



Glad to hear you are OK mate, got a bit concerned at the sudden silence.

I take it this has put your competing plans for this year on hold? Should do IMO, something as important as this is - there will always be another show.


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## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> It will qualify me to be captain of any ship in the world so it's pretty major!
> 
> It's just hard getting back to studying after 2 years working. It's only a short course though so it will be over fast.
> 
> Exam is a 90 minute oral exam and he can ask me anything about being at sea and all that I've learnt in 10 years. Very intense.


Well get it done sailor!! Will be worth it, though when it comes to stdying I battle also.

But hey when you qualified we can hit Thames in summer, grab a boat and some beers and cruise down. You think you will be able to handle one of these?


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Shouldn't be a problem Saffir boy 

At this rate my first command would be about 100,000 tonnes and 4000 passengers so that thing you and an 'esky shouldn't be a problem.

Yeah Ramsay, unfortunately I have neglected the competition and the gym full stop really for the last 2 months.

One thing, I don't think I was to good on the Tren, turned me aggresive, not madly so that I was tearing up the streets, but a real lack of patience I guess is the best description and a feeling of isolation.

I have been off now since 2nd Jan, I tapered to 100mg Test and then just stopped, nothing has happened to be honest, no ill effects as of yet, no problems apart from getting the itch to get back on.

I did have a trip planned to see the in laws in late Feb to March planned to Canada but that has been knocked on the head, so I am eager to give the Test on it's own a go, but there is no hurry.

Back in the gym today after that lay off and was pleasantly surprised, I thought I would be weak as a kitten but I was ok.

Worked up to 120kg for 8 which is about what i was on before, all be it less sets.

Did 5 flat, 4 incline machine and 4 shoulder press machine.

Thursday will be legs and Tri's and Fri back and bi's I reckon, keep it simple to fit around college and studying for now. I found myself tonight alot more receptive to studying as well after the workout so I think this can only be a good thing, especially for focus.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Good luck Chris!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll need it Winger, although in fairness I am putting more work into this one than all the rest put together and am feeling a lot more confident as a result.

Just got to remember the guys examining you aren't there to fail you, just gotta stay safe!!


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Just glad you are OK mate, you had been pming me quite regular then ZIP - nothing, I was thinking all sorts :lol:

You are doing the right thing - screw the show, this is far more important, you can do a show anytime, all the time in the world for that!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

I came off cold though. Wasn't a problem at all actually. It's been a month now and not a single I'll effect. Other than now I'm itching to get back on as I know I won't be off to Canada. May just go 300 mg.

Sorry about that Ramsay. I think it was just that everything in my life just took off at once with getting engaged and then the exam. Actually both are going quite well.

Promise I'll sort out those pictures soon for you guys as well when I find my hard drive.

Did legs today actually. Nothing special as I have had loads of what feel like strains recently. But a few good leg presses and extensions rounded off with some curls did the trick.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Good job Chris, nice to see you back in the gym training and updating your journal.

Big bear hug!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Little bear hug back atcha wingman. 19 stone this morning. But that may be the pancakes from last night. Sick as a dog now! Back today

going to avoid deadlifts though. Fancy trying some other stuff for a change.


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Dudes,

Here's the pictures that I promised you ages ago and forgot all about.

2 of the rudders and propellers and 1 each of the bow and stabilzer fins.

I'll see if I can find anymore that make sense to people.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

It's so big!


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## Chris1 (Jul 23, 2008)

76512 tonnes, small ship by todays standards!!!


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## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

Chris1 said:


> 76512 tonnes, small ship by todays standards!!!


It's huge by my standards!! Stand no chance trying to swim out of that things way!


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

glad you all good mate...


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

TaintedSoul said:


> It's huge by my standards!! Stand no chance trying to swim out of that things way!


You actually have standards? :whistling:


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