# Am I over doing it on the calorie front?



## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

As title. I've been sticking with my diet for nearly two weeks and have only just added the macros. Getting around 4400 calories, is this overkill for someone who is 180lbs @ 5'11?

Looking to bulk. Also try and be as health as possible with green smoothies - like the ones on https://www.grainsandbrawn.com

Will post up diet with macros on request for someone with a clue to have a look.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

some people will say yes im sure, but alot of it will come down to you personally. i was same as you when i started,i was consuming 5000 +

per day easily,but i wanted too get big over a number of years.

I had a fast metabolism,so i could eat more.

Do you work? have a hard job,all these things will burn cals,so its

not an easy question to answer.

are you on gear? steroids metabolise cal's for them too work.

Lot's to think about,but in the end,as long as your not putting on too much fat,its ok.Maybe you could actually have more?


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## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

sounds like a fast road to chubville to me mate


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Far too much.


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2010)

You could die.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Dan said:


> You could die.


From embarrassment when you have to take your shirt off at the beach.


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## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

Lois_Lane said:


> From embarrassment when you have to take your shirt off at the beach.


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

4400 cals, looks like your heading for fat*ass*, not leanm*ass* 



Lois_Lane said:


> From embarrassment when you have to take your shirt off at the beach.


:laugh::laugh:


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## Dean00 (Jan 25, 2009)

Could you post up your diet for me.... cheers :beer:


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

But seriously at 180lb natural not overly lean you don't need that much but you need quality.

Instead of concentrating on a caloric number concentrate on the foods you are eating.

10 whole eggs per day.

1lb of lean steak per day.

1 container of low fat cottage cheese.

1/2 lb salmon.

4 servings of green veg.

3 servings of varied fruit.

100 grams oats.

1lb potato/sweet potato.

2 TBS olive oil.

Eat that every day (rough example) and you will be fueling your body and calories are not in the 4000s...


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

Right, current diet;

Meal1

50g Whey

100g Oats

30ml Olive Oil

1 Banana

300ml Milk (I know you hate milk cons, but :tongue: )

Meal 2

1 tin of tuna

2 slices grainary bread

30g mayo

Meal 3

250g Chicken breast

100g rice

greens

Meal 4

250g Chicken Breast

100g rice

greens

Meal 5 (PWO)

50g Whey

5g l-glutamine

Meal 6

250g Lean Steak Mince

100g Rice

greens

Meal 7

300ml Milk (Same as above, cons)

30ml Udos Oil

50g Whey

Banana

This comes to roughly 4400 cals & 300g Protein (Only including the meat and whey)

After writing it out like this it does look a lot... :confused1: :confused1:


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## coldo (Dec 7, 2008)

WWR said:


> Right, current diet;
> 
> Meal1
> 
> ...


Im surprised if that is 4400cals! Doesn't strike me as being excessive. Maybe i'm, wrong though.


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## Dean00 (Jan 25, 2009)

writing it out make a differnce then yeh? itll be easier to knock off anything you dont need now mate! :thumbup1:


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## Wee G1436114539 (Oct 6, 2007)

Lois_Lane said:


> But seriously at 180lb natural not overly lean you don't need that much but you need quality.
> 
> Instead of concentrating on a caloric number concentrate on the foods you are eating.
> 
> ...


3800 or so by my count.

Not exactly a whole other ball park but a really good diet in terms of nutrients barring calcium. Why not add some *MILK*...lol.

Calcium (mg) (show foods) 826.5 1200 69%

Capric (gm) (show foods) 0.1 * *

Caproic (gm) (show foods) - * *

Caprylic (gm) (show foods) - * *

Carotene (RE) (show foods) 3665.5 * *

Copper (mg) (show foods) 3.1 * *

Docosahexaenoic 22:6 (gm) (show foods) 1.7 * *

Docosapentaenoic 22:5 (gm) (show foods) 0.5 * *

Eicosapentaenoic (gm) (show foods) 1 * *

Erucic (gm) (show foods) 0.3 * *

Folate (mcg) (show foods) 640.2 170 377%

Gadoleic (gm) (show foods) 0.8 * *

Lauric (gm) (show foods) 0.1 * *

Linoleic (gm) (show foods) 13.1 * *

Linolenic (gm) (show foods) 1.2 * *

Magnesium (mg) (show foods) 708.3 287 247%

Moisture (gm) (show foods) 2942.9 * *

Monounsaturated Fat (gm) (show foods) 63.8 * *

Myristic (gm) (show foods) 2.2 * *

Niacin (mg) (show foods) 55.5 15 371%

Oleic (gm) (show foods) 58.2 * *

Palmitic (gm) (show foods) 27.5 * *

Palmitoleic (gm) (show foods) 4.3 * *

Parinaric (gm) (show foods) 0.3 * *

Phosphorus (mg) (show foods) 3872.5 1200 323%

Polyunsaturated Fat (gm) (show foods) 19.1 * *

Riboflavin (mg) (show foods) 5.3 1.3 406%

Selenium (mcg) (show foods) 434.2 * *

Stearic (gm) (show foods) 10.5 * *

Theobromine (mg) - * *

Thiamin (mg) (show foods) 2.7 1.1 243%

Vitamin A (IU) (show foods) 40229.4 * *

Vitamin A (RE) (show foods) 4723.3 800 591%

Vitamin B-12 (mcg) (show foods) 29.1 2 1454%

Vitamin B-6 (mg) (show foods) 7 1.5 470%

Vitamin C (mg) (show foods) 213.4 60 356%

Vitamin E (ATE) (show foods) 16.9 8 212%

Zinc (mg) (show foods) 43.6 12 364%


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

I'll write the macros up if you like. Deffo 4400.

50g Whey - 240c

100g Oats - 350c

30ml Olive Oil - 250c

1 Banana

300ml Milk - 150c

1 tin of tuna - 100c

2 slices grainary bread - 200c

30g mayo - 200c

250g Chicken breast - 300c

100g rice - 350c

greens

250g Chicken breast - 300c

100g rice - 350c

greens

50g Whey - 240

5g l-glutamine

250g Lean Steak Mince - 460c

100g Rice - 350c

greens

300ml Milk - 150c

30ml Udos Oil - 250c

50g Whey - 240c

= 4480 calories


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

Should I drop some of the carbs/fats or both? Maybe even the *milk*?


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

you'l never be big,on those cal's mate.these guys are winding you up!

look too make 5000+ a day,unless you want a more fitness look.


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

mal said:


> you'l never be big,on those cal's mate.these guys are winding you up!
> 
> look too make 5000+ a day,unless you want a more fitness look.


But I'm a natty, surely that will end up with me being a fatty?


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

i would say your not eating enough. but depends on your genetics. mine are sh1te so i have to eat alot


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

Wow this thread has confused me.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

Dan said:


> You could die.


yes of starvation


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

WWR said:


> I'll write the macros up if you like. Deffo 4400.
> 
> 50g Whey - 240c
> 
> ...


 looks good to me mate,if you find your not putting on lean gains,just add in an extra shake.did not know you were natty sorry. :whistling:


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## weeman (Sep 6, 2007)

lol you eat more in a day than i do mate!


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

eating that much is a fast trip to illness , this eating big thing where did it came from , who invented it ..


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## BillC (Jun 11, 2009)

I'm with weeman ( as always your worship) I'm 5'11.5 and I 'd go from 93 to 103 in amonth on that - with free carry handles on the hips :lol: Too many carbs 100g of rice is a lot, especially with 30 g of oil.

In fact cancel that , with all that oil I'd lose weight through sh!tting non stop.

Seriouly though, halve all your carb portions and see how you go. 100g of oats, if made into porridge would be two full bowls. Then you have milk, oill and whey. If 50g is leaving you hungry, have more greens in your diet.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Wee G said:


> 3800 or so by my count.
> 
> Not exactly a whole other ball park but a really good diet in terms of nutrients barring calcium. Why not add some *MILK*...lol.


Perhaps but he probably couldn't eat that all any way.

It is easy to eat some foods and not as easy to eat other foods.

600 calorie difference is rather large actually lets say my diet put him in a 500 calorie surplus per day he would be gaining about a 1lb a week which is ok, a little high but ok. An extra 600lb would double that weight gain and that would not be ok.

Sure organic raw milk is great and i love it, i will leave that other garbage to you


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## XJPX (Jan 10, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> eating that much is a fast trip to illness , this eating big thing where did it came from , who invented it ..


lol it was invented by those who r actually big lol!, u cant get big unless u eat big end of story


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

XJPX said:


> lol it was invented by those who r actually big lol!, u cant get big unless u eat big end of story


I suspect you mean Olympia level bodybuilders with a lot higher than average genes , who do a variety of drugs in ultra high doses? Where does eating big apply to someone a bit more moderate on everything?


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

So what should I be doing? Keep the protein as it is but half carbs and fats?


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

weeman said:


> lol you eat more in a day than i do mate!


Only been doing this for around 2 weeks, yet to step on the scales :whistling: :whistling:

My weights being lifted are going up each session which is good though.


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## gujkhan (Mar 17, 2009)

it depends on the individual, my last test cycle i only weigh 73kg i was eating 4,000 cals a day 250g protein minimum daily, i gained 5kg and was much more vascular lost abit of bodyfat i was not fat in the first place had abs clearly visible, although it could be down to my job as i have to walk alot


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

mate just try it out for yourself. some guys need to eat less, some more. you will only find what works for you by experimenting


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## XJPX (Jan 10, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> I suspect you mean Olympia level bodybuilders with a lot higher than average genes , who do a variety of drugs in ultra high doses? Where does eating big apply to someone a bit more moderate on everything?


im not an olympia level bodybuilder but defo wouldnt of got upto the size i am without eating big


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

WWR said:


> Only been doing this for around 2 weeks, yet to step on the scales :whistling: :whistling:
> 
> *My weights being lifted are going up each session which is good though.*


Then youve got nothing to worry about.

Thats all im focusing on, all eating 10 million cals a day ever did fckall for me mate but make me ill and a horrid skinny fat looking disgusting freak, i dont even count calories anymore full stop, i just keep protein high and eat just enough carbs to keep me ticking over and my lifts are still going up every session and as long as thats happening, i am satisfied everythings working.

I dont even bother weighing myself anymore, i judge my progress by the mirror and amount of plates I can put on the bar, not a set of numbers on a pair of scales.

There was a guy on here for example who was a member named "007" he was a 150lbs ecto and hes 210lbs solid now and hes never ate more than 3000 calories a day.

Just goes to show you its down to the individual.


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2010)

Do whatever you want, try it. Pointless people telling you its good or not because everyone responds differently. Theres too many factors too simply say yes this diet is perfect for you without knowing the ins and outs IMO.


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

XJPX said:


> im not an olympia level bodybuilder but defo wouldnt of got upto the size i am without eating big


Would eating more than that get you to an Olympia level of muscularity? Yes or no ? Why?


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## XJPX (Jan 10, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> Would eating more than that get you to an Olympia level of muscularity? Yes or no ? Why?


of course not, we have now totally branched off the topic of eating to get big onto needing olympia level genetics to attain their levels of physique.....all im saying is ppl dont grow cos they dnt eat enough.....eat more and you will grow......obv it is all subjective.....but if anyone ever asks me how to get big, the answer is to just eat!


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

XJPX said:


> of course not, we have now totally branched off the topic of eating to get big onto needing olympia level genetics to attain their levels of physique.....all im saying is ppl dont grow cos they dnt eat enough.....eat more and you will grow......obv it is all subjective.....but if anyone ever asks me how to get big, the answer is to just eat!


Most people I ve seen in gyms , they do eat (proof their high BF) but 99% either undertrain or overtrain.


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## XJPX (Jan 10, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> Most people I ve seen in gyms , they do eat (proof their high BF) but 99% either undertrain or overtrain.


again when i say eat i dont advocate anything apart from clean food. im on 6000 or so cals a day soley from oats, sweet potato, waixy maize, rice cakes, lean meat, good fats....no junk whatsoever......impossible not to grow when feeding ur body with that


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

XJPX said:


> again when i say eat i dont advocate anything apart from clean food. im on 6000 or so cals a day soley from oats, sweet potato, waixy maize, rice cakes, lean meat, good fats....no junk whatsoever......impossible not to grow when feeding ur body with that


6000 kcals .. Have you tried that without taking any AAS?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Jordan you are obviously an ectomorph with mesomorph in there also.

You need tons to grow obviously you don't gain a lot of fat doing this i have seen your pictures but you are also using plenty of drugs.

Thus without with your body type and drugs your diet would make most people fat as fvck.

Personally i have hit 255lb last year on about 4k per day from clean food.

Gaining weight is not hard for every one in fact for some people it is hard not to gain weight..........

The only way to handle this problem is to keep a log of your eating as well as your training but i should hope every one does that already...


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## Tommy10 (Feb 17, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> Jordan you are obviously an ectomorph with mesomorph in there also.
> 
> You need tons to grow obviously you don't gain a lot of fat doing this i have seen your pictures but you are also using plenty of drugs.
> 
> ...


Defo....for example....i went on a weeks holiday...ate like a c.unt.....came back and lost 6lbs!!!!.....went back to clean eating and put 3lbs on in a week....go figure???....i HAVE to eat constantly to keep my weight...if i have a few busy days at work or dont eat enough...the weight falls off me.....


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## XJPX (Jan 10, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> 6000 kcals .. Have you tried that without taking any AAS?


lol y wud i wanna do tht....i have competitions to win lol :s


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## XJPX (Jan 10, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> Jordan you are obviously an ectomorph with mesomorph in there also.
> 
> You need tons to grow obviously you don't gain a lot of fat doing this i have seen your pictures but you are also using plenty of drugs.
> 
> ...


im not using as much drugs as i was :thumb: , new cycle is pretty moderate....

i wish i cud hit 255 on 4k...wud make my life much easier lol,

from the ppl i tend to come across its that the majority struggle to gain weight, iv rarely met ppl in this sport who gain weight too easily, thats y i sed my common advice is to just eat more.....

agreed everyone shud jus hav control of their own diets, know their cals in vs cals outs, their maintenace and this wudnt b a problem lol


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

XJPX said:


> im not using as much drugs as i was :thumb: , new cycle is pretty moderate....
> 
> i wish i cud hit 255 on 4k...wud make my life much easier lol,
> 
> ...


I agree buddy most people under eat but are still out of shape.

Its not hard you just have to eat a pizza or some thing every night or so and you can get fat even if the rest of the day is lacking vastly!

You have great genetics mate and look great all the best with the contests!

I wish i had your metabolism right now, a week of sub 2200calories with 90minutes of cardio and 1 hour of weights each day along with lots of fat burners has given me a nice 2lb weight drop:cursing: :lol:


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

XJPX said:


> lol y wud i wanna do tht....i have competitions to win lol :s


lol. Love that attitude


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

WWR said:


> lol. Love that attitude


GET BIG OR DIE TRYING! That's my motto right there........well not really but i always wanted to say it:lol:


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> GET BIG OR DIE TRYING! That's my motto right there........well not really but i always wanted to say it:lol:


"Drink Milk and get Fat" would be one suited for you.

Also post a link to that routine you were doing. You dont have to type anything, just a C&P jobby. I'll keep bugging you till you do it.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

XJPX said:


> of course not, we have now totally branched off the topic of eating to get big onto needing olympia level genetics to attain their levels of physique.....all im saying is ppl dont grow cos they dnt eat enough.....eat more and you will grow......obv it is all subjective.....but if anyone ever asks me how to get big, the answer is to just eat!


yes ,sence at last,you talk about olympia bodybuilders,there on 10,000

cals per day,i know for a fact dorian used too consume this amount in the past.you eat you grow simple.If you consume these diets that are posted up on here,yes you will develop,but not at a rate too reach your genetic

potential,eating is hard,il admit i failed, if i could have put on 2 more stone? but i could not do it,you look at these guys off season they look like sh1t,fat yes ,but thats bodybuilding.


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

mal said:


> i know for a fact dorian used too consume this amount in the past.you eat you grow simple.


Well good for Dorian and the lot but what's got to do with people that are on less/no AAS and don't have the Mr O genetics ?

Btw muscle growth was never simple , if it was that simple bodybuilding would be an eating contest , which it clearly isn't as things like genetics, drug use and training come also into play . As with any sport.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> Well good for Dorian and the lot but what's got to do with people that are on less/no AAS and don't have the Mr O genetics ?
> 
> Btw muscle growth was never simple , if it was that simple bodybuilding would be an eating contest , which it clearly isn't as things like genetics, drug use and training come also into play . As with any sport.


Well to totally switch roles in this thread:lol:

Explain why sumo wrestlers have higher muscle mass levels than bbs and the experiments of heavy food intake that lead to muscle growth even though no resistance training was being performed.

Eat a lot even if you don't work out you are going to gain some extra muscular tissue unless of course it is the ice cream only diet:tongue:


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> Well good for Dorian and the lot but what's got to do with people that are on less/no AAS and don't have the Mr O genetics ?
> 
> how will you know if you dont eat? like i said if you want too look like a fitness model yes,3000 cals all year round will do you.
> 
> My post is about bodybuilding.


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## Andrikos (Sep 10, 2008)

Lois_Lane said:


> Well to totally switch roles in this thread:lol:
> 
> Explain why sumo wrestlers have higher muscle mass levels than bbs and the experiments of heavy food intake that lead to muscle growth even though no resistance training was being performed.
> 
> Eat a lot even if you don't work out you are going to gain some extra muscular tissue unless of course it is the ice cream only diet:tongue:


Nice question there

I am aware of the experiments of high food intake , but that is on untrained people , not trained bodybuilders.When someone untrained raises his body weigh then he will quickly gain muscle in some areas such as the gastrocnemius and the quadriceps just by walking because there is an increased workload.

Now about the Sumo wrestlers having large muscle mass than bbers that again maybe happening by adapting to having to drag around a large body weight all day.

And that doesn 't show where is that muscle distributed: there is muscle tissue in the stomach which hypertrophies with increased food intake and same thing with the intestine too. Same with the heart etc etc. So I am not sure at all we can make generalisations on this.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Andrikos said:


> Nice question there
> 
> I am aware of the experiments of high food intake , but that is on untrained people , not trained bodybuilders.When someone untrained raises his body weigh then he will quickly gain muscle in some areas such as the gastrocnemius and the quadriceps just by walking because there is an increased workload.
> 
> ...


Good reply:thumbup1:

At the end of the day having tried both approaches i am on your side bro.

Dieting down is far too much of a stress on the body and pain in the ass to be getting overly fat.


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

ah thanks for reminding me, this is a question ive been meaning to ask forever.

Keeping it simple, protein directly repairs and builds muscle, carbs fire nutriants into the body and excess cals do nothing but build fat.

So when people are on gear, why is the main focus calories and not protein? why do people only ever direct advice towards calories?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

andysutils said:


> ah thanks for reminding me, this is a question ive been meaning to ask forever.
> 
> Keeping it simple, protein directly repairs and builds muscle, carbs fire nutriants into the body and excess cals do nothing but build fat.
> 
> So when people are on gear, why is the main focus calories and not protein? why do people only ever direct advice towards calories?


Protein and FATS are required for growth and repair of body tissues.

Carbs are energy nothing more but energy is very important at certain times.

That said you could live and grow just fine without carbs the same can not be said for either of the other two nutrients....


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

Lois_Lane said:


> Protein and FATS are required for growth and repair of body tissues.
> 
> Carbs are energy nothing more but energy is very important at certain times.
> 
> That said you could live and grow just fine without carbs the same can not be said for either of the other two nutrients....


and whilst on a cycle, calories do??


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

andysutils said:


> ah thanks for reminding me, this is a question ive been meaning to ask forever.
> 
> Keeping it simple, protein directly repairs and builds muscle, carbs fire nutriants into the body and excess cals do nothing but build fat.
> 
> So when people are on gear, why is the main focus calories and not protein? why do people only ever direct advice towards calories?


*steroids need calories too work!*


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

Arnt we all forgetting something here?


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

WWR said:


> Arnt we all forgetting something here?


yes your a natty


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

andysutils said:


> yes your a natty


And getting fatty... Just stood on the scales for the hell of it... 192lbs

And yes, I have had a No.2 today.


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## WWR (Feb 28, 2010)

Think I'm going to stick with the same protein. Fiddle around with the fats and carbs to get around 3500 cals then adjust if needs be.


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## Jux (Jul 23, 2008)

Try tapering off the carbs towads bedtime because that will be what will get you fat if anything.

At 4400 kcals you need to be training hard and NO TREADMILL DODGING.

However you could be one of those freaks with a white-hot metabolism but as you've got some muscle already i doubt it.

Just be patient.


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