# Please help me get my body back



## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Now a bit of a background. Just 3 years ago I was a retired from stage classical ballerina and part owned a studio, danced , choreographed and had students. Tall 165cm, was 44-45kg then.

Then I had a real bad car accidence and all changed i.e. went downhill. I was put on heavy doses of corticosteroids i.e. Prednisone. Developed pseudo-Cushing from them so my calves are not what a ballerina has anymore and a terrible looking buffalo hump on my neck all those typical for Cushing sufferers or people on high long term doses of corticosteroids.

My adrenals shut down and at some point on the second year I was diagnosed with advanced Hashimoto, my thyroid is full of pearl-like necklaces of cysts ...thats how the endo described it. I was prescribed Tiromel(T3). Was bedriden for 20 months as kneecap and ancle were broken, better say smashed. Afterwards on crutches, scuters etc and a lot of physio. Finally since last October I could manage walking around the house without the crutches and now I am capable of walking outside and generally no pain if I dont try running. My weight soared at the staggering 75kgs. I was on counceling for identity crisis as I could not recognise myself and identify myself with my new physical image but ditched the therapy as all they try to tell me is to do my best and convince myself that at least I am alive, moving and try enjoy my life the way it is.

The thing is - this is not my life the way I want it, as the person I see in the mirror is not someone I recognise and associate with. NHS is only concerned about my general health and they say I am ok now. I am not.

I got a new private doc and he put me through tests, so I am on the following meds:

100-120mgs Tiromel

10-20 mg Hydrocortisone (bioidentical)

200mg bioidentical micronized transdermal Progesteron

Testogel twice a week sometimes 3 x weel 5mg

Combo of Naltrexone and Rasagiline or

Naltrexone and Madopar (L-dopa+benzeraside) as I cannot source Contrave so I cook my own

It does nothing to my appetite but lifts my apathy and make me want to do things and generally makes me like life ...oh yes, put me off Nutella forever as I was destroying a couple of jars a day. Cannot even look at the stuff now.

Been on Aurorix for a year (MAO inhibitor) and was doing well. But just didnt have the same effect like Madopar/Naltrexone combo or Rasagiline/Naltrexon combo.

The best appetite suppresants have been sibutramine for me and in the olden golden days of my dancing life the old good Polish produced Mazindol...Sibutramine compared to that is like frozen yougurt to Ben&Jerry's. I just thougth at the time the communists were giving us cocaine disguised in a pill.  .

Tried ECA, another disaster, cannot stop eating on it, how it rediuces your appetites I dont understand guys.

Supplements:

Iron 85mg a day (diagnosed with iron and B12 deficit anemia) ferrous gluconate

B12 sublingual 5000 mcg

Bcomplex

B6

D3 5 000 IU a day

K2

Vit A 1000 IU

SAMe or NAC alternating

Protein shake

Chromium 800mg a day (diagnosed recently with hypoglicaemia and insulin resistance)

Tried while on sibutramine the VLCD of 600-700 cals and 350-500 IU of HCG subQ and indeed afterwards didnt get the weight back on, still maintain the new weight I lost 12kgs in 7 weeks but sibutramine ran out and the site went down so I had to stop. It was 5 months ago, still maintaining.

So what should I do you reckon? Any advice will be appreciated, just have in mind I have never set foot in a gym so even the lingo is alien to me so have some mercy on me

Thanks for reading that far.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

I presumed that you're female.....but then you say you have Testogel. I'm a little confused....

You're taking B Complex (which contains B6), but you're also taking extra B6. Why?

It seems you're also taking two MAO's, for what reason?

Lastly, what's the purpose/reason for Naltraxone?


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

My hormonal profile at Genova Lab showed virtually non-existent testosterone and progesterone levels, high prolactin, estrogen over the roof especially the estrone and estradiol, while the good estriol simply was barely there so my doc prescribed all these. After the car crash libido was the last thing on my mind but doc said test is needed not just for sex drive so I take it or to be correct smear it

I take a for of B6 which does not need conversion P-5P (Pyridoxal-5-Phospate)so it works faster together with the ready no-conversion form of B12 (Methylcobalamin) to aid the absorbtion of B12 AND Iron.

I used to take only one MAOinhibitor and thats Aurorix but stopped it, not worthed the money. I have not taken it together with Sibutramine and together with either Rasagiline or Madopar didnt have any side effect on me, probably 2 years on heavy doses of cortisone have totally wiped out my neurotransmitters so no reaction at all.

Naltrexone and Bupropione = Contrave but I cannot find it. Bupropione is a dopamine reuptak inhibitor but Rasagiline works on the same issue but in a different manner by just inhibitting the enzime that destroys dopamine in brain, Madopar as L-dopa simply floods the brain with Dopamine, so I cook up my own Contrave by using whatever I can put my hands on either Azilect(Rasagiline) or Madopar(L-Dopa+Benzeraside).

Naltrexone is a med that is prescribed to tread alcoholics as it blocks the part of the brain sensitive to carbs - simple carbs such as ethyl alcohol, sucrose, glucose etc and acts as a numbing sort of chemical...With Naltrex I just dont care about anything containing sugar, alcohol, sweets and sugary fruits like bananas, grapes, melons etc. Just cannot stand the stuff. Even complex carbs I reduce a lot, I can hardly manage a couple of pieces of bread or a potato medium size or a small bowl of rice - its simply feels too nauseous to handle anything starchy.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Thanks for explaining, Yana.

Doesn't sound as if you've had much luck, these last few years.

I too have been through some incredibly difficult times, was on alot of meds also.

However, the body is very resilient & has alot of spare capacity & can repair itself.

You're still comparitively young (compared to me that is  ), nothing lasts forever & I'm sure that slowly things with you will improve.

There are many members on here, who have alot of knowledge in many different fields & not just BB'ing etc.

Plenty of good help & advice can be found.

Stay positive.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Thanks latblaster...v.kind of you...as you might already know sometimes the assault on the body can be so vast and so fast that one simply doesnt know where to start afterwards ....I suppose just one step at a time but patience is not among my fortes..What kind of meds combos have you been on if thats not confidential? For what sort of conditions? I hope you keep improving ..

P.S. you are an Engineer in Paradise and still get old? No hope for us mere mortals


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

If you want to draw someone's attention to your Thread at any time, & they're not already posting on it,

you can do so by using the @ symbol followed by their name, like this @Theseus. 

I've tagged this member into your thread as he has very considerable Medical Expertise, & he would be able to digest your PMH very well.

When you have pm capability (after 30 days & 30 post, I think) I'll pm you.

Yup, I'm busy Engineering Paradise in SE Asia - although I'm back in blighty for a short while. Bloody cold here!!


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## Plate (May 14, 2015)

Hi Yana, I skimmed over your post because I read most in your intro.

I see you have had some bad luck and looking to get back to it, my advice would be to go to the gym and start steady like slow walking on the treadmill for as long as you can handle and just keep doing that till you get strength back up.

But while your doing that you can look around and see how the gym works and pick up on things witch when you feel ready you can give them a go, when you find what your limits are set yourself goals and try to beat them every time you are at the gym.

Every time you leave the gym you will be restoring your self confidence and feel better all round. Gl


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

I have to summon the courage I guess. I am sure you are both right but is it really that simple? Do I ask for someone to show me around and draw a plan for me or just blurt out that I want to shed the weight and be myself again?

And Latblaster you find it bloody cold here? - you are spoiled I think...wanna try Murmansk? auntie said its summer, got hot, nearly 5C, must be so pleasant


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## Plate (May 14, 2015)

Once you are in there you will wonder why you ever worried, just tell them at the desk you have never been in a gym before and they will probs give you an induction and you can pick there brains on the way round.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

I see...thanks...I might give it a try...do you mean there will be someone to show me the routine or somebody like a trainer for total beginners like me?


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/losing-weight/134264-set-generic-fat-loss-diet.html


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

That's a pretty high dose of T3 there, knew it was dosed fairly high for Hashimoto's but didn't know they went upwards of 100mcg. Was it also prescribed to help obesity at the time? Either way, should help with the weight loss once you get back on track.

How much do you weigh at the moment?


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## Plate (May 14, 2015)

Yana said:


> I see...thanks...I might give it a try...do you mean there will be someone to show me the routine or somebody like a trainer for total beginners like me?


If you ask them for an induction they will show you round every machine and how it works, just ask them if you don't understand something.

If you want a trainer to set you out a routine they should have 1 but then you will probably have to pay for it, but if I was in your position I would go a few times to see what's what and then ask somebody on here to help set a routine up.

You're over thinking it, just go a few times and you will gain the confidence you need.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Thanks a lot. Good useful info. I think I am lacking enough protein though. Is it ok to compensate with the shakes and which one is the best? I take a combo of Casein and Whey, makes me feel fuller and calmer especially before bed so I dont hit the choc. I never had to diet before in my life, I just loved fats and used to eat pure butter or lard with either veg or fruits like a fondue and then hit the dancefloor. Plus old good sourcream with honey and cocoa .

I was always on the anorectic sort of side without being one. Now I know what will sort the anorexia people, huge injections of cortisone 4 times a day. In a years time they will be overweight, wonder why someone hasnt got the Nobel's for it, its so simple, I am the perfect example. I dont know how to diet apart from never been in a gym, so I think its going to be tough love.

I hear some of the girls in the field take stuff, or maybe in my case at this stage wont do much. Somehow I have the gut feeling it will be the food first to sort, then the routine. Still can swim, thats not painful, its just that fatigue and tiredness after every single exertion even when having a shower is tiresome. Dont want ECA, get fat on it, anything else to make me a bit more energetic, love coffee but dont have much of a boost from it. Hopefully when my sibutramine arrives next week will be easier to motivate myself to do more. Have no idea what sort of diet is the best for me.

And how people manage to diet? What do they do when hungry?


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

> That's a pretty high dose of T3 there, knew it was dosed fairly high for Hashimoto's but didn't know they went upwards of 100mcg. Was it also prescribed to help obesity at the time? Either way, should help with the weight loss once you get back on track.
> 
> How much do you weigh at the moment?


I am 75kgs and 165cm tall. I started at 25mcgs and went up to 100 in the summer and 125-150 in the winter. I thought it was high dose too but below that I start shivering, always cold extremities, hair falls like I am in chemo, cannot get out of the bed , sleeping 14-16 times a day. I am a hypotonic as well with a BP 90/60 so all this stuff plus the stims is a heaven to me. No reaction whatsoever I can assure you, and being with Hashimoto there is no equipment on earth that can measure my antibodies, beyong 6000 they cannot count so they might be 6 milion for that matter nobody knows.

The fat accumulation stopped (i wouldnt even call it a weight gain, thats fat invasion full stop) even drinking water can make fat. But even at that dose I do not lose weight with T3, I dont gain anymore though, so thats a bonus, at least to me as I have learned the hard way that it can always get worse.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Plate said:


> If you ask them for an induction they will show you round every machine and how it works, just ask them if you don't understand something.
> 
> If you want a trainer to set you out a routine they should have 1 but then you will probably have to pay for it, but if I was in your position I would go a few times to see what's what and then ask somebody on here to help set a routine up.
> 
> You're over thinking it, just go a few times and you will gain the confidence you need.


Thanks, you've nailed it. I always worry about stuff...


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## Plate (May 14, 2015)

Yana said:


> Thanks, you've nailed it. I always worry about stuff...


No problem you will be fine, gl


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Yana said:


> I am 75kgs and 165cm tall. I started at 25mcgs and went up to 100 in the summer and 125-150 in the winter. I thought it was high dose too but below that I start shivering, always cold extremities, hair falls like I am in chemo, cannot get out of the bed , sleeping 14-16 times a day. I am a hypotonic as well with a BP 90/60 so all this stuff plus the stims is a heaven to me. No reaction whatsoever I can assure you, and being with Hashimoto there is no equipment on earth that can measure my antibodies, beyong 6000 they cannot count so they might be 6 milion for that matter nobody knows.
> 
> The fat accumulation stopped (i wouldnt even call it a weight gain, thats fat invasion full stop) even drinking water can make fat. But even at that dose I do not lose weight with T3, I dont gain anymore though, so thats a bonus, at least to me as I have learned the hard way that it can always get worse.


Yeah, I'm no stranger to high doses of T3 myself, albeit for non-medicinal purposes :laugh: Do you know how much you're eating per dat at the momebt, calorie wise? Seems like you've found your maintenance (at your current dose of T3 anyhow) so theoritically you will start losing weight by cutting out some calories again.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

I said:


> Yeah' date=' I'm no stranger to high doses of T3 myself, albeit for non-medicinal purposes :laugh: Do you know how much you're eating per dat at the momebt, calorie wise? Seems like you've found your maintenance (at your current dose of T3 anyhow) so theoritically you will start losing weight by cutting out some calories again.[/quote']
> 
> I have recently realized that too so for the last couple of months I am trying to figure out how much I eat, and I say months because I am a shift worker and very often when night shift or second shift I simply forget stuff that I have been eating to log it.
> 
> ...


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

You eat Lard?

Hmm......


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## richardrahl (Nov 19, 2007)

latblaster said:


> You eat Lard?
> 
> Hmm......


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Yana said:


> I can see I have a long way to go...its almost like *trying to live somebody else's life*.


If you did live someone elses life, would it be under a bridge?


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

latblaster said:


> If you did live someone elses life, would it be under a bridge?


Where's the bridge?


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

richardrahl said:


> View attachment 171705


even your girls at the Royal Ballet Academy know that the best lunch is fat. 100grams of butter, lard or cream and then the feeling of satiety without the ''full'' stomach syndrome and one can dance away for nearly 2 hours, if you mix it with honey then on stage for another hour no problem. protein is eaten after show...full stomach or feeling full is a disaster in dancing and thats not just ballet.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Yana said:


> Where's the bridge?


Scandinavia....or Cheshire.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

latblaster said:


> Scandinavia....or Cheshire.


going for Cheshire.... I got enough of the Arctic thanks v.much.  ...may I alternate between the Budapest bridges over Danube as well or just Cheshire or Scandinavia you offer?


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Hi Siggy....very good effort. :thumb:


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## dt36 (Jun 3, 2005)

latblaster said:


> If you did live someone elses life, would it be under a bridge?


I smell it too...


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## Ghoosst (Jun 6, 2013)

Yana said:


> I have recently realized that too so for the last couple of months I am trying to figure out how much I eat, and I say months because I am a shift worker and very often when night shift or second shift I simply forget stuff that I have been eating to log it.
> 
> When that happens I start all over again so for the last week more or less considering I missed logging just 2 items I got it down to 2800 cals. The good thing is I am not into starches, and while on the self concocted ''Contrave'' I am not into simple sugars that much, which is good as they used to be a staple along with dairy eggs and fish for nearly 40 years. The bad thing is I love fats, can eat them with a spoon, butter, lard, cream, nut butters, I can even drink walnut oil from the bottle, its my favorite.
> 
> ...


You are a lucky girl... I am an ex endurance athlete. Although I burned a lot during training, 1000 cal/h often, I was always hungry, always had to log everything. Carb loading before a race was cruel, never enough, I could not indulge and staff myself, just the amount needed, not more. I am still hungry, still log everything. So welcome in the real world 

Anyway I am sorry for what happened in your life. Do you think that you doctor is the best possible one? Why don't you're have a mixture of T4 and T3? How big is your thyroid ATM? I have mild Hashimoto, t3 is good for weight loss, but t4 is more stable, provides you a more constant level of thyroid hormones. So a mixture of both may give you both aspects. T3 only is prescribed when body cannot convert t4 to t3 due to several anemia (iron and b12 deficiency - that you have) and non existing thyroid (shrinked or removed/radiated). Selen lowers antibodies.

The good thing is that looking at your diet it seems very easy just to fix it. It looks so terrible - sorry.. - that just fixing it may give you a lot. So the situation is not hopeless, just opposite, easy steps can give you a lot. 2800 kcal is much too much, structure/timing and content are also far from perfect. But you have to start from scratch and learn basis. There are very useful threads at the top of the page. So you have to learn a lot but this way you can get close to your old back again.

Regarding you earlier posts on protein and shakes, real whole food is much more satisfying and filling for me. Steaks (I fry them on lard  ) trout (same), cottage cheese pre bed instead of casein.


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## andyhuggins (Nov 21, 2008)

Sniff sniff LOL.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Yana said:


> I have recently realized that too so for the last couple of months I am trying to figure out how much I eat, and I say months because I am a shift worker and very often when night shift or second shift I simply forget stuff that I have been eating to log it.
> 
> When that happens I start all over again so for the last week more or less considering I missed logging just 2 items I got it down to 2800 cals. The good thing is I am not into starches, and while on the self concocted ''Contrave'' I am not into simple sugars that much, which is good as they used to be a staple along with dairy eggs and fish for nearly 40 years. The bad thing is I love fats, can eat them with a spoon, butter, lard, cream, nut butters, I can even drink walnut oil from the bottle, its my favorite.
> 
> ...


Well, I'm a lot heavier than yourself and I was losing weight on 2000kcal a day, on 100mcg of T3. Though I was losing 3lbs a week, I would have lost about 1lb a week at 3000kcal a day but then, as I said, I'm heavier than you are.

But yeah, best thing you can do is start getting an idea of how much you're eating and then reduce calories from there. Don't fuss over where you're getting your calories from, it's pretty much irrelevant in my experience though you'll likely benefit from ensuring that a good percentage of those calories are coming from proteins. Meal timing is pretty much irrelevant as well, just make sure you're sticking to a certain level of calories each day and the weight will start coming off.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Ghoosst said:


> You are a lucky girl... I am an ex endurance athlete. Although I burned a lot during training, 1000 cal/h often, I was always hungry, always had to log everything. Carb loading before a race was cruel, never enough, I could not indulge and staff myself, just the amount needed, not more. I am still hungry, still log everything. So welcome in the real world
> 
> Anyway I am sorry for what happened in your life. Do you think that you doctor is the best possible one? Why don't you're have a mixture of T4 and T3? How big is your thyroid ATM? I have mild Hashimoto, t3 is good for weight loss, but t4 is more stable, provides you a more constant level of thyroid hormones. So a mixture of both may give you both aspects. T3 only is prescribed when body cannot convert t4 to t3 due to several anemia (iron and b12 deficiency - that you have) and non existing thyroid (shrinked or removed/radiated). Selen lowers antibodies.
> 
> ...


Thanks for stopping by and for the suggestions about my diet. Its kind of you.

Thats exactly why I am on T3 only - the iron and B12 anemia and sadly although I work for NHS, it was not my doctors who diagnosed either.

I have been on Eutyrox T4 when I first got diagnosed and felt so bad all the time that in the end I stopped it.I could not convince neither my GP nor the Endo that T4 is not for me and I have to switch and I was blamed that I am overreacting. And this went back and forth for 8 miserable months. Then out of the blue while browsing through Amazon I found a patient's book called Stop the Thyroid Madness by Mary Shomon and the rest is a history as they say.

I found out there is a book published by an UK Dr Bary Durant -Peatfield and I got that book as well. After reading them I knew I had to see Dr Peatfield. He has chosen the tests and the therapy and he explained to me that the NHS test didnt show the iron deficit anemia because the serum ferritin is not included in the general blood test where it shoes only haemoglobin which mine was always within the range. Ferritin however was 2 - the range is between 20-140 and the optimal range is 70-120. Needless to say B12 test was never offred to me neither by the GP not by the Endo.I cannot convert T4 to T3 so I dont take it.

I can see that the most chalenging part will be the diet. I mean I dont mind dieting and restricting calories but when I try that I feel hungry.  Not that I am surprised by it, just not used to it. I think by Thursday the sibutramine should reach my doorsteps so then will be another attempt after the october success. I still have some HCG and I might use whatever was left from the last batch. A friend told me it does help not to regain the weight later and it didnt indeed after my I dropped the first 12 kgs last fall. Should I get more, what is generally the experience of those of you who have used it.

Now I am going to ask the stupidest question on Earth - if HCG does stop the fat returning why dont they combo it with the diets...or make it more popular? I asked some people in the hospital and got the looks. Now I am not that dumb but hey if its used in arts and sports why not in general. The population is getting bigger and fatter. Not everyone is a candidate for a bariatric surgery.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Also when I lost the 12 kgs last time I dont think I was on a diet of any sort, just by taking the Sibutramine and the subq jab I was living happily on 2 cucumbers, an apple and probably 150-200 grams either cheese, ful fat of course or small piece of chicken or fish. And tomatoes. I didnt count calories then either.


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## Ghoosst (Jun 6, 2013)

Yana said:


> Thanks for stopping by and for the suggestions about my diet. Its kind of you.
> 
> Thats exactly why I am on T3 only - the iron and B12 anemia and sadly although I work for NHS, it was not my doctors who diagnosed either.
> 
> ...


When I was diagnosed with Hashimoto my endo run also tests for iron b12 adrenal deficiency. I had low levers of iron and b12, although still in range, just in 1/4 range - iron and in 1/3 - b12. She said that before upping the dose of t4, we have to supplement iron and b12, as with these defienciences the body will not make use of t4 nor convert it to t3. It took few months and worked, but I took 200 mg of iron, together with folic acid and vitamin C. And b complex and b12 sublingual. I don't understand why you have a rather low dose of iron with such a big deficiency, neither why you weren't prescribed ferrum injections. This way of course only t3 will work, but rather due to you malfunctioning body. And no wonder t4 did not work, you body could not utilize it. I cannot myself take t3 as it increases heart rate, has short halflife so somehow impairs heart, so we worked on improving my body's natural conversion. However a lot of people are happy on armour, pig thyroid extract providing t3 and t4 lixture in similar proportions as human body produces. There are trends and popular books, but human thyroid produces both t3 and t4 for some reason.

Also low carb diet suppresses t4->t3 conversion, I have been on such for a year, when I was inactive due to injury. I lost some weight, did not gain any, but felt like sh*t, had to up t4 dose twice, still feeling cold and still feeling lethargic. Upping carbs to 40-50% helped and solved this issue.

You have to heal you body also, provide it with substances it lacks, like iron and b12, and probably a lot of other micronutitients that are in vegetables, fruit, meat eggs etc. Lard provides only energy, it does contain some essential micronutritients, nor protein needed by body to heal and recover. I think in your situation drugs should be left for last resort, first you need to heal your body and provide it with all micro and macro it needs. Eating 2 cucumbers and some cheese a day dose not provide neither protein nor micros. How your body is supposed to heal when it is starved? Myself I always feel much better when eating whole foods than eating poorly and having a lot of supplements. And a lot of veggies fills up and suppresses apatite.

Btw why were you treated with corticosteroid in the first place? They suppress healing?


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Thank you so much for taking the time. I seriously think you should either join the Thyroid UK or just leave a message there with your Endo's contact details. Here's the site Thyroid UK - Thyroid UK Support Network

I can assure you you will be surprised what a vast number of people will be grateful to you. And even if you take the time to read some of the stories there and the posts you will begin to understand how lucky you are with such an Endo. I work in the field and even I was not able to convince my docs that things the way they lined them up for me dont work. In the end I just didnt have any strenght left to fight it and decided to go my way.

The reason I dont take more iron is that my stomach gets very upset by it, I tried the sulphate form, the gluconate and the fumarate. The fumarate is best but I cannot always find it, then gluconate. The sulphate form is the worst, the cramps are unbearable so I dont take that. And as I already mentioned because my haemoglobin levels while hospitalized were within the normal range there was no reason for alarm and Serum Ferritin was not tested. I did the test a lot later when I found Dr Peatfield, who by the way I think is the patron of the Thyroid UK.

I could go for transfusions but just fed up with all hospital treatments and having 4 ESIs(Epidural Steroid Injections) just couldnt stand all this. Physio was painful enough by itself.

The answer why so much corticosteroids is because as a result of the accident I was involved in caused spondylolysis - a crack between the upper and lower facets of the spinal vertebrae. The pain was excrutiating and life was a hell, there was no way I could have physio with this level of pain. The max number of ESIs is about 4, had them, the pain always came back and the Specialist said untill the crack heals itself the pain will be there. And the healing will take for someone over 40 (its to do with the amount of HGH produced by the body) will be about a year. At that time it was important to start the physio so I strated with intramuscular Depo-Medrol , only the steroids relieved the pain so I can go through the physio session which was painful enough on its own.

My ex is a professional in martial sports or arts whatever so he suggested for a faster recovery to take either subq or intramuscular HGH exogenously. The doc didnt want to hear any of it and said I will quote: ''Where do you two get all these ideas is beyond me. If we prescribe to everybody with broken bones HGH the NHS will colapse overnigh''. My ex said F it and then we got it from Turkey and I was on 3 IU subq Norditropin by Novo Nordisk for a year. Everyone at hospital was amazed by my recovery, I was able to stand for 10 min on both my feet before I feel the pain and need to sit back again 6 months into physio. Usually with my type of fractures, better say mashed up ankle people are on wheel chairs, crutches etc aids most of the cases for life.

I know my diet has to be sorted, and yes I feel miserable without carbs thats way I was so happy like a pig on 2 jars of Nutella a day, but I cannot affort gaining more, it makes it difficult to keep walking and this is the last thing I need. But yes, I have to learn how to eat properly. just dont know how to start and where from. I am reading here varios diet plans and have no idea which one is for me and what will do for me. Thanks again for posting.


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## Ghoosst (Jun 6, 2013)

Hi Yana, I spent two years mostly in bed/home confined myself, due to bad injuries so I am glad to help if I only can. I can feel you pain.

I don't live in UK, so giving contact details for an abroad endo is rather pointless. She is a well known doctor, there is a six month waiting list for a private paid appointment, two years in public hospital. I believe there are similar doctors in UK. When I visit regular doctors, under regular health care system, the results are miserable, often I dont even get the full thyroid panel. So it is better to cry and pay.

I have heard that people having stomach problems might take iron with meals. It is less absorbed, but then might be added to every meal. Vitamun C improves absorption. There are foods containing high amount of iron, like liver. It is really tasty when fried (on lard  ) with garlic and onion. Add kimmi for high vitamin C content and you have a perfect meal with lots of iron and vitamins B. Can't a private doctor prescribe iron injections? A few years ago I was reading some local thyroid forum, and patients exchanged details, who eg treats with iron and b12 injections. Some patients did not absorb B12 orally, due to something lacking in their stomach, autoimmune disease that often goes in pair with Hashimoto, I don't remember details. That is why monitoring b12 levels are important, I had to pay for this test but it was worth from a health point of view. Sadly people having health problems have often to invest some money to do additional tests not prescribed by a health care system.

During treating my injuries I was offered HGH by some pro friends, abut after examining the vials I strongly suspected that it was fake, so gave up on this, this was the best possible source. I have taken growth hormon releasing peptides, different types, maybe they produced less hgh but better this than nothing. Doctors were astonished how quickly I heal, as the watched tendons during prp injection and six week later. They said I was the best responder they've ever seen, ha ha. You may consider Ostarine, a type of SARM, it is supposed e.g. to speed bone healing, which may help your knee and ankle.

Oh, I think exogenic hgh can induce prediabetic stage. Specially if not separated from carbs. Do you still take it?

As for diet I will write more tomorrow. I can only advise you not to go low carb way, as it is proven to suppress thyroid and t4->t3 conversion. For healthy people it is very efficient for losing weight, but not advisable for the ones with an ill thyroid. There are very knowledgable ladies here, like @Kristina, who might give you better female specific advise.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Hello Gooost, thank v.much for the reply , I hope you enjoy your weekend.

I am very sorry for your own ordeals and one understand how the med system operates only when it happen that they depend on its efficiency unfortunately. I also do my tests privately as the whole general med service drives me mad with their procrastination, who has time to wait 3 to 6 weeks for a blood test and that is if they go along with you for the test you demand and not what they think you need, or the other ridiculous situation 12 weeks for a an ultra sound for my thyroid while I can just hop on the plane to Riga, Prague or Gdansk over the weekend and do it on a Saturday afternoon for £ 40 and meanwhile enjoy a weekend break and see the area. Yes I know the system is under a lot of burden but in my life I come first so I manage the way I have always managed. If something I need is not offered to me I just go and get it myself. 

I usually visit also the branch of John Hopkins in Istanbul, cheap and cheerful John Hopkins it is, not costing an arm and a leg like in the States. If you need good pharma grade HGH Turkey is the place.Just go in a pharmacy. It cost 2 to 3 times less for what you would pay for the same brand in the west and almost the same as the chinese brands or underground labs.They stock Novo Nordisk, Novartis and Sarono Saizen as well I think, I have seen Ely Lili Humatrope there too.

About iron absorbtion I heard the same, that hardly 1/3 is absorbed with meals so thought it doesnt worth it. As fumarate form is the best when I manage to find some I take 3 a day, but with gluconate doesnt always happen so its a hit and miss, sometimes I take 2 a day but then after a few days my stomach complains and I either have to stop altogether for a couple of days or just keep taking one a day, my ferritin reached 25 in about 18 months like that so its not too bad. Yes I can have injections and transfusions but I so freak out of all this hospital stuff right now, so when all the paranoya;s gone and I still need it I will opt for it.

And yes, in our household we all love liver fried of course in lard with copious amounts of onions and mushrooms so I do eat that at average 2 a week.  I generally love all sorts of veg although my doctor and in various book and online I have read that cruciferous veg in fresh raw form is not good for underactive thyroids as it blocks the enzime converting the T4 to T3 but cooked is not a problem so I cook most cabbage family veggies, also another ''blocker'' is peanut and anything from them no matter raw or roasted so I just switched to almond and other kind of butters, another product is the fresh milk especially the one thats not organic and its loaded with the bovine growth hormon.

I know about the efects of the HGH on blood sugar levels, the same is with cortisone so I suspect my insulin resistance is because of these two factors, I dont take HGH anymore and the hydrocortisone is within the physiological doses as my adrenals went down after the initial steroid flood and stil have adrenal insufficiency.

My ex said the peptides and the secretagogues dont have any effect on the people over 40-45, so as far as I know he is on the real McCoy He takes SARMS as far as I know but its not Ostarine, its another one it sounds the same but I dont remember. He says its good stuff but he has never offered to me to try but again as you said yourself not everybody is knowledgeable about what works with females, and considering I am nearly menopausal and my sex hormones are like popcorns, one day they fly this way, the next on the other way and sometimes non-existant at all.  ..

Thank you for tagging Kristina, I will check her posts. I still read the posts of another member here who was tagged by Latblaster and I find very interesting info there as well.

Any idea in terms of food and diet will be appreciated as its the weakest link obviously in the entire picture. Thanks for your time.


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## Ghoosst (Jun 6, 2013)

I am almost 45 and use GH secretagogues with some good results. First I had some test vials, made hgh blood test 40 minutes after injection, result w good enough to continue. It was the weakest peptide brand of those I have tried. Blood test showed I am still responder. ATM I am not thinking of hgh , due to my concern about its overall safety, although I would have agreed to have it injected into the joint by a professional. It seems there is no need for this ATM, however it is possible, although it is not that easy. peptides seem safer and cheaper, specially recently discovered oral mk-677, ridiculous ratio price per visible results.

Swarms generally are supposed to increase lean tissue mass, decrease fat and increase endurance. I mentioned Ostarine, as it has also bone healing capabilities. I have joint inflammation and surrounding bone edema, so it is supposed that anything healing bone should help. I am at the end on 3 month cycle of Ostarine, and there is not edema on the last MRI, so something should have helped, either Ostarine or peptides. I started back training, quickly recover lost muscle mass, really quick, muscle memory and prob all this peptides/sarm combo. I was offered test treatment, to help healing, but I was not sure, this clinic screwed me up already, and I don't know if they don't screw my hormone system, I have everything mid range, would rather not spoil it. As for you, I think estrogens help in bone healing, maybe for a time being it would be better to set you on HRT? Until you fully recover?

As for a diet. I would start simple, as described in http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/losing-weight/134264-set-generic-fat-loss-diet.html. Calculate your weight mail maintenance calories through some online calculator, subtract 300-400 for a weight loss at the beginning. Set macros: 1 g of protein per lb of body mass (165 g for you) 0,8-1 g fat for kg of body mass (60-75 g), the rest fill with carbs. Observe during the first week or two grow you weight behaves and adjust. During this time you may study different diets, and make adjustment, but is is better to start something simple first and have some staring point, then spend weeks on planning without actually trying something.

The only problem with this approach is that this procedure estimates your daily maintenance calories as 1700 , and you said you eat 2800 kcal a day. But those calculators are not accurate, they give my tdee 300 kcal too low. Anyway you should either gain a lot eating 2800 kcal a day, if not then you metabolism is highly increased by T3. If so, maybe better idea would be to take 2800 as a starting point, and try 2400 kcal a day, observing how you handle this, if there is a weight loss. If weight loss is to small, then increase deficit further, 2300, 2200 and so on. I assume you will be performing some kind of cardio, walking, maybe riding stationery bike. There are also hand bikes in the gym, if you legs are not fully healed yet, you may also swim with a pullboy between the legs, this is really good cardio.1-2 lbm a week of weight loss is optimal, should be quicker, you don't want to deal with loose skin etc, specially as a ballerina. Thera are stickies on setting a diet for beginners in the other diet-nutrition sub forum, I cannot paste more than one link at a time on my iPad.

So when you set you macros than you have to log everything, measure amounts of food on a kitchen scale, put in some convenient app, a lot of people use my fitness pal. I use something other that also counts micros, I want to be sure that all my vitamin and mineral need are filled. When you start probably it will not be perfect at the beginning but it is trial error process, the most important thing is just to start, see how adding this and that fulfills calorie requirement and macro split. Proteins in meat and fish and vitamins and minerals in vegetables are essential to enhance healing and recovery, they cannot be substituted. After you recover, heal, and go back to you old self, you may probably go back to you old eating habits, I know that a lot of food, a lot of veggies fill stomach a lot, which does not look well on a dancing floor, but important thing is first to get there.


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## Yana (May 14, 2015)

Hello Ghooost, thank you v.much for taking the time. I do appreciate it.

I had a look at the link and yes, I realized I have to furnish myself with 3 items I never cared about: calculator, kitchen scales and normal scales. Well the calculator I have on my mobile, the other two I will buy today.

I can ride a bike, stationary too for quite a while as I dont have to carry my entire bodyweight this way. Only when I try to run it hurts. I suppose there is no point considering walking as I dont think it helps with weight loss. I love swimming so I will do that too. I will carry on with the bellydancing as it helps with stretching and it generally lift my depression or black thoughts as the music makes me happy.

I will try and construct a diet plan according to the required ratios of proteins/fat/carbs and within the 1700 cals.

I dont worry about the effects of T3 .To be honest my thyroid gland whether will upregulate or downregulate as long as it work it will challenge the immune system to attack it, so the more exogenous T3 comes in the less the poor gland will work and the less viscious attacks the immune system will launch. After all who fights the dead.

If I reach a dosage of T3 that will make the gland totally inactive I might soon see on the test whether the antibodies will drop. I am very worried about it as very advanced undetectable on the equipment Hashimoto antibodies of both types TAT & MAT (the previously called Anti-TPO and Anti TG) cause shut down of the T killer cells of the immune system and cause also secondary autoimmune diseases like dermatitis, ekzema, psoriasis etc and heavy allergies. The immune system also cannot fight bacterial infections and invasion, cancerous cells etc because of the lack of T cells.

And my T cells count is very low so the doc suggested we try this option as I am lucky to be a severe hypotonic. I have already recurrent dermatitis for the last year and almost never ending runny nose since last August and I am quite distressed about it. So I will gear myself with T3 to the point where my PB goes up to some bearable digits...with 150mcgs it hardly reaches 85/130 so I am not worried. My heart doesnt react at all, no palpitations, no tahicardia, nothing, just feel clear headed, think faster, coordination faster, even maneuvaring with the car is so easy, like something in me knows exactly what to do and does it fast. I dont trip also on high doses of T3, I used to a lot even walking on a perfectly straight terrain without any obstacles. Feel steady on my feet and can stand on one and lift the other for a few seconds without needing a barre or something to lean on or hold on to.

I talked to my ex last night and he wonders whether Andarine will be the better option for me than Ostarine as he said it offers more protection agains osteoporosis as well and helps preserving lean body mass more. Thats what he takes , he is 58 and doesnt respond to peptitds and anything of the sort and hasnt considered trying the MK677 because of the same reason, the aging process programmed in the human physiology or biology starts after 35, so at 58 hardly anything but the straightforward replacement of the actual substance will have any effect.Thats what he thinks and I have no idea as my education about a huge amount of stuff in every aspect of life just begins now I am afraid.

He thinks it wouldnt hurt if I carry on with the HCG IPregnyl) while on restricted calories at least till the batch runs out, I have for about a couple of months worth however not to take it with the SARM just because none of us has any idea whether it will be dangerous. Neither he does nor I know what I can take, as he has never trained women and I have never had any need to diet so maybe its best one thing at a time and see how my body respond or whether there are other reactions. I did well on 350-500 IU HCG last time and still keep the new weight 6-7 months on.

As Test goes down with calorie restriction I am not sure to keep the Testogel 5mg x 2 week if I take SARM or its not necessary.

The only reason I dont take estrogen RT is because my estrogens are not balanced right now, estradiol goes up and down and in a period of 10 days the tests show different amounts released, and I dont mean the usual differences when the hormone fluctuates through the month, just completely out of sync. I can try though some transdermal bio-identical Estriol , at least its gentle and beneficial, ''the good girl'' among the 3 of them.

Well I have some planning to do this week and I will will post in a few days what I have accomplished. Constructing the actual diet will be the toughest, who has though food shouldnt be eaten without thinking first  hahaha My ex cannot help with it as he is also the type that all his life he is struggling to put on mass, between us too we can destroy the contents of a fully loaded fridge in a matter of few hours so he suggested I join a forum or community where there are people who know stuff about the subject of losing and can be of help ...poor me...going to stuff myself with antidepressants of the non fattening kind..

Have a good week and any input from you or anybody reading this thread and having some ideas on whatever aspect of the subject please share. Thank you.


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