# Intermittent Fasting (IF) eBook / 52 Diet UK-M Trial



## Lorian (Apr 9, 2003)

I'm thinking that an Intermittent Fasting sub-forum may make an interesting section on UK-M, especially if we can get a few people onboard to trial it. I'd be up for it.

If you're new to IF, this PDF by John Berardi is a good place to start:

http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting-download

Also check out last weeks Horizon with Michael Mosley.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01lxyzc/Horizon_20122013_Eat_Fast_and_Live_Longer/

Anyone interested in joining me?


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## JANIKvonD (Jul 7, 2011)

how long ya thinking? id be up for it at the end of sept for a couple month while i cut..


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## Lorian (Apr 9, 2003)

I'd probably start early Sept and continue for as long as I made progress and/or remained happy with it.


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## JANIKvonD (Jul 7, 2011)

ill have a read up over the w.e, u gonna be doing it a day on/day off (24hr/24hr)?


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## Lorian (Apr 9, 2003)

JANIKvonD said:


> ill have a read up over the w.e, u gonna be doing it a day on/day off (24hr/24hr)?


I'm currently leaning towards 5 days regular eating, 2 days fast so a 5/2 split.

That said, I'm re-reading the book again as well so may change my mind by Monday!


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## doggy (Mar 26, 2011)

my gf has just started doing the 2 day thing. she thinks she can eat 500 cal on fasting days. i dont think the programme was clear about that.

i might try it too. at the moment i dont eat after my evening meal, although i dont count my macros, i just eat sensibly.


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## Hera (May 6, 2011)

Yep, I'm in. Started yesterday with the 5, 2 split. Given the proposed long term health benefits I can see myself doing this for many years to come.


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## reza85 (Jan 11, 2009)

I think the best way is what some of the GB team do fasted training 20hour fast 4 hour eating window


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## Fatstuff (Mar 2, 2010)

I use it when dieting i shall be dieting through september and october so ill be doing it regardless, im sure i can input in some way


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## Natty.Solider (May 4, 2012)

I will be using this when Im dieting down. Will use 5/2 when I want to keep hold to a low bf physique. Will this thread have pictures? Since watching horizon, Im absolutely fascinanted with it. Very interested to know effects on a muscular physique due to the lower levels of igf-1. I definately hope IF has a bright future in fitness and longevity.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

I'm always up for diet experiments, and would happily have another go at IF trying a different protocol, but I've less muscle on me than a sun scorched blade of grass at the moment so will be looking to lean bulk for a while... I have tried a few versions of IF before though based upon the info in the Berardi link, and these are the protocols that seemed to go really well for me:



> *Eat Stop Eat*
> 
> (24 hour fast, 1 or 2 times per week)
> 
> ...


And the one that really didn't:



> *Warrior Diet*
> 
> (20 hour fast / 4 hour feed)
> 
> ...


My issues with the warrior diet version were mostly to do with symptoms related to digestive issues and headaches during and shortly after each four our feeding period... am not sure my body responds well to short periods of intense feeding - am ok with longer fasting periods though.

Just thought I'd share that personal note for any one considering trying that particular version.


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## Greenspin (Dec 27, 2010)

I fast until 2 p.m. daily, and also have combined this way of eating with 2 days/week Eat stop Eat style (both having 2 days fasting one after the other with a small meal after the first 24 hours; and also on 2 separated days of the week) for a fair duration of time; so am interested to see how everyone else gets on with it. I'll be eating in this way for the foreseeable future.

Edit: just thought I'd say also, I say I fast until 2 p.m, but the impact I feel when saying it is much like talking about eating breakfast, lunch or dinner, if that makes sense: using the word fast just seems like an appropriate bit of trivial info to add into the sentence, as apposed to referring to this long stint of not consuming calories.


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Ive just started IF this week...

Not using any specific diet, carb cycling etc.

Just been fasting 18-20 hours/day and eating in the 4-6 hour window. Just high protien, medium fat, low carb! Total calories about 2400

Drinking nothing but water while fasting, some say you can get away with coffee, obviously without milk and sugar, and apparently suger free drinks are also ok in moderation!

But I'm just sticking to water though...


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## Fit4life (Sep 16, 2011)

Lorian said:


> I'm thinking that an Intermittent Fasting sub-forum may make an interesting section on UK-M, especially if we can get a few people onboard to trial it. I'd be up for it.
> 
> If you're new to IF, this PDF by John Berardi is a good place to start:
> 
> ...


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

I'm in...Will be starting on Monday. (been doing 16hr fasts twice a week so ready to step it up a bit)

Monday - Friday 16hrs fast 8 hours window. For me will be from 6pm through to 10am

Saturdays fast will be from 6pm Friday - 4pm Sat afternoon. 20hrs fast (will bring this in during week 2)

From Sat 4pm - Sunday 6pm is normal eating. (got to enjoy Sunday dinner, breakfast and treats with the wife and kids)

Will be working out macros etc over the weekend. Plan to run for 4 weeks and see how I get on. Got a journal already so will be posting about it in there. http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/member-journals-pictures/177119-hunt-8-a.html

Thanks for the Links.


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## LeviathanBodyBuilding (Jan 9, 2012)

downloading the ebook now, not really due a cut till next year but will make for some interesting reading and a reference point till then...is the 5 days on 2 day off detailed in it?


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## Veni (Aug 8, 2012)

I would be interested. I've only just started with leangains but it seems to be going well and if I'm still doing it by September then I think I would be in for the long haul.

Similar diet to a few posts above, high protein moderate carbs and fat. Which I think would fit well for the average gym user looking to follow progress.


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## Greenspin (Dec 27, 2010)

I don't mean to change the subject to much, but I just watched the second half of the BBC doc. and saw the bit on the alternate day fasting, so thought I'd share something I do 2x a week in place of the 24 hours fasts I was doing:

Basically, I call it a graze day. I fast until 2p.m. as per usual, but then in my feeding window I don't have any set meals/eating times. I do restrict what I eat in a sense, as I deliberately don't gorge or prepare food stuffs. I do snack on random fruits and veg. but in moderation and my protein come's from pots of quark/cottage cheese or eggs (partly choose these as it's easy to gauge how much I've consumed and if in the fridge can graze on them). I also take my omega 3 and get in some fats from olive oil/a small avocado etc. over some chopped up veg. But at the end of the day it leaves a considerable calorie deficit.

The main idea of the graze day is not to just eat randomly, but to just graze a little. And by not having particular times that normally cue you to eat or think of food, on that day, the time merges into one and you lose the "oh, it's 6, must be time to eat" mindset. I find it surprisingly satisfying, comfortable and invigorating. I could go on into more detail/reason, but don't want to detract from the main point of the thread.


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

I have been doing leangains for several months and it fits in with my lifestyle really well. After watching that doc I'm definitely going to add 2 days a week on 600 calories. I'll have some bcaa's in the morning and go swimming as I usually do and then at lunch I think a big bowl of melon or something. Usually train at 4 so a pre workout bcaa drink and shake after and then a meal in the evening making up to 600 calories. It all sounds good in theory and I'll be starting next week.


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## Dorian Gray (Dec 5, 2011)

Cant watch that documentary because im in Ireland, fuuuuuuuuk


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## Greenspin (Dec 27, 2010)

RelaxTheBody said:


> Cant watch that documentary because im in Ireland, fuuuuuuuuk


Try this:


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## Strongr (Oct 4, 2012)

A friend of mine does lean gains, I've looked In to it but with my rolling shift pattern I don think I could get it to fit my lifestyle, done think I could hack the oter versions, 18 and 24 hour fasts...,


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

I managed just over 600 cals yesterday. Was up and down the pool for half seven, drank half a 5g bcaa/ 3g leucine drink and then swam 50 lengths. Then drank other half and walked home. Gotta say there were some cravings after swimming so far so will probably cut that down next fast. A cup of black coffee sorted me out.

Lunch went as planned, just a small bowl of melon and my omega 3 supplement, although next time I might just have some coconut oil maybe. I trained at about half five and of course it was deadlift day, including romanians and good mornings. Still wasn't too bad as I am used to fasted training and I sipped a bcaa/leucine drink with some tyrosine and taurine and other bits in to keep my worry of catabolism at bay. Pwo I just had a single shake with creatine.

For dinner I had what I eat an awful lot of: Chicken curry with quinoa which works out at 392cals, 25 carbs, 13 fat, 45 protein.

Totals for the day are: 644cals, 42 carbs, 15 fat, 90 protein.

Omega 3 probably adds a little bit but I figure I need to keep taking that every day.

As you see, not too bad with some planning, now sipping a double protein shake after fasted swimming again this morning (600 cals in 36 hours!). Very wary that I need to bump up protein intake on non fasting days so I'm relaxing my normal IF protocol a bit to get protein earlier. Usually fast from 7-11 ish.

Oh yeah bit early for a weigh in but I was 175 yesterday morning and 170 this morning. The lowest I've been in the last week or two is 172 so maybe some fat burned, obviosly some water loss. Speaking of which I must have drunk 4-5 litres of water yesterday, important to keep hydrated during a fast.

Who's next?


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

Double post


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## ki3rz (Sep 12, 2011)

I've been doing Leangains style 'fasting' for nearly a year now, suits me perfectly and so much easier to fit eating in with everything, life doesn't have to revolve around getting a meal down you every 2/3 hours


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

mark22 said:


> I managed just over 600 cals yesterday. Was up and down the pool for half seven, drank half a 5g bcaa/ 3g leucine drink and then swam 50 lengths. Then drank other half and walked home. Gotta say there were some cravings after swimming so far so will probably cut that down next fast. A cup of black coffee sorted me out.
> 
> Lunch went as planned, just a small bowl of melon and my omega 3 supplement, although next time I might just have some coconut oil maybe. I trained at about half five and of course it was deadlift day, including romanians and good mornings. Still wasn't too bad as I am used to fasted training and I sipped a bcaa/leucine drink with some tyrosine and taurine and other bits in to keep my worry of catabolism at bay. Pwo I just had a single shake with creatine.
> 
> ...


am I missing something here or have you just said on your fast day you pretty much took supplements and ate little bits throughout the day? I thought the idea was to get it all in one meal then fast for 24 hours or whatever time it may be? surely having bcaa drinks and shakes and whatnot completely goes against that?

correct me if im wrong by the way as im trying to get my head round all this still, going to give it a go when I have planned the days I can do


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## defdaz (Nov 11, 2007)

It's just a way to prevent carbohydrate intake from distrupting fat burning. Just like low carb diets.


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## tyramhall (Dec 28, 2011)

Katy said:


> Yep, I'm in. Started yesterday with the 5, 2 split. Given the proposed long term health benefits I can see myself doing this for many years to come.


how are you finding it? 7pm tonight will be 48hrs without any food. surprisingly im finding it quite easy. as long as i keep busy then i dont even think about eating! this is the second week that im on it.


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

defdaz said:


> It's just a way to prevent carbohydrate intake from distrupting fat burning. Just like low carb diets.


so you can spread it out then rather than say smashing it all in at breakfast


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Tempted to join in with this, though the benefots for women are different than for men, it would seem - not so much on the fatburning. There's an excellent post on this on MArks Daily Apple, but I can't link to it as my internet crashes every time I try. I think work needs a better browser... 

When I've bedded down my routine and got myself pretty much fat adapeted, I think it will be easier, and I'm planning more of a Leangains type of thing, where effectively, I just don't eat breakfast, eat from lunchtime onwards.


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

In the program he ended up doing two 600 calories days a week. I was mostly fasted until dinner but I think it was more important just having the really low calorie day. 5g bcaa in the morning won't effect much apart from muscle loss.

My idea of a small bit of coconut oil within the 600 calories is to promote fat burning during the day due to the mcts in it.

I'm just trying something like how it seemed on the program. For me it's more about fat loss before going to Spain in september as it easily cuts out a lot of your weeks calories.

As I was already fasting 16 hours a day I figured I'd jump in and see what it does. As I say I'll keep protein as high as I can, average 1g per pound, to keep strength up.

From what I've read for people going from 12 to 15% body fat down to single digit this works well. Once there muscle being used for energy is more of an issue. So long term probably something left to older people more concerned about health than muscle mass.

If it makes a quick cut easier its all good to me. Combining it with a tkd approach seems sensible. Carbs in the evening after working out, some protein and mcts during the day.

Just my thoughts from some reading of different strategies.


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## nick-h (Nov 17, 2011)

I've been doing the leangains approach for a few weeks now, as long as i keep my marco's in check i feel great and lose fat quite nicely.


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

mark22 said:


> In the program he ended up doing two 600 calories days a week. I was mostly fasted until dinner but I think it was more important just having the really low calorie day. 5g bcaa in the morning won't effect much apart from muscle loss.
> 
> My idea of a small bit of coconut oil within the 600 calories is to promote fat burning during the day due to the mcts in it.
> 
> ...


yep makes sense, thanks mate


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## JANIKvonD (Jul 7, 2011)

Ashcrapper said:


> so you can spread it out then rather than say smashing it all in at breakfast


na ur allowed nothing but water in the fasting period im sure mate, then u have a re-feed window of whatever IF plan ur doing


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

JANIKvonD said:


> na ur allowed nothing but water in the fasting period im sure mate, then u have a re-feed window of whatever IF plan ur doing


that was what I thought after reading the links and watching horizon. getting confusing this 

im referring to doing the 2 out of 7 days fasting on 600 cals btw


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

JANIKvonD said:


> na ur allowed nothing but water in the fasting period im sure mate, then u have a re-feed window of whatever IF plan ur doing


I didn't quite pick up how that bit worked on the program but with fasted cardio and training later I feel better with some bcaas. Lots of people on leangains use bcaas in the morning if doing a lot of physical exercise. It's not really going to effect fat use for energy.


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## Need2Grow (Jun 4, 2011)

Good Idea, IF is a great tool that many people fear due to misconceptions on Muscle loss

Both lean gains and 24 hour fasts work for me 

I am currently toying with the idea of 'every other day' fasting for the last 2 weeks of my cut before my holiday.

If people want to see the extreme versions, youtube 'low carb corey'. He does long fasts and is currently in the middle of a 10 day fast and has lost over 1lb per day so far (started pre depleted so he's losing tissue not water  ) Pretty extreme but interesting to watch.

Also, I believe fasting should be water only. I also find it much easier as any calories down my neck and I start getting hungry. ECA when fasting also helps :thumb:


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

I'm currently fasting 16hrs a day and having an 8 hour feed window. I will fast 6pm-10am my first meal will be post work out. Have done fasting before but not on consecutive days, today is only day 3 and was/is the hardest so far. I believe it takes about 2 weeks to get used to it.

I've got a journal running http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/member-journals-pictures/177119-hunt-8-a-15.html and will be updating weight fluctuations daily


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## hi contrast (May 27, 2012)

I've been doing IF for a week now, and I'm loving it.

Cutting at 3200 cals on workout days 2400 on rest days (maintenance 3500)

most days I've been doing 16/8 , but some days I fast for 20 hours and eat 4 hours.

When fasting I've got so much more energy


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

I've been feeling very firm since the fast day, could be in my head but it's encouraged me. So tomorrow I plan on another 600 calorie day. I think I'll do 2 a week for a few weeks and see where I stand.


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

20 minutes long but worth a watch


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

Started lean gains on Monday weighed in at 98.8kg checked weight this morning and I'm 97.6kg drop of 1.2kg - Happy enough with that.

Going to be doing a longer fast starting tonight at 18:00 will be fasting through to 14:00 will be training at 13:00 and doing a total body high volume workout - If I don't get chance to hit the gym this will turn into a 24hr fast..

Sunday will be a cheat day but within reason. Will be enjoying a big breakfast of sausages, bacon, eggs and pancakes - roast beef with apple pie - Cold meat pickles and cheese for evening meal.


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## ammo23 (Jul 13, 2011)

Hey guys, really glad to find this thread...I started looking into IF (leangains) over past week or so, took me a while to get the correct macros sorted but think I'm there now!! I tend to follow a relaxed 16/8, with fasted training (Ive not had bcaa so have 20g protein this week).

Last wednesday I weighed 68kg and scales showed me at 16.5%bf. This morning I'm now down to 67.1 @ 15.2%bf 

Seems promising to me, although I use the scales bodyfat % as a gage and not as gospel - encouraging to see the numbers drop!!

I am struggling to hit my 200g carbs on workout days, any suggestions please?

Think after reading about these 24hr fasts I think I may have a cheat day tomorrow and fast on sunday, see how I fair! Or would the cheat day interfere with the fast and render it pointless?


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

JANIKvonD said:


> na ur allowed nothing but water in the fasting period im sure mate, then u have a re-feed window of whatever IF plan ur doing


Can anyone confirm if this is 100% correct? I am sure it says you can have coffee/s a splash of milk is acceptable, sweeteners to be used. This was

The guy in the BBC doc also had a hot drink(17 cals) every so often while fasting. Having a hot drink helped the hunger


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

amurphy said:


> Can anyone confirm if this is 100% correct? I am sure it says you can have coffee/s a splash of milk is acceptable, sweeteners to be used. This was
> 
> The guy in the BBC doc also had a hot drink(17 cals) every so often while fasting. Having a hot drink helped the hunger


All depends on what you want to do. Personally I drink black coffee, drink diet coke, chew gum and drink lots of water


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## Veni (Aug 8, 2012)

Agree with above, plenty of water will fill you. Sounds silly but downing a pint of water works due to the large volume of water in one go IMO. Or sugar free energy drink works, nice little energy boost of you are lagging aswell. Winner!


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

Elites UWLS works wonders for a boost and also suppresses appetite.


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## Veni (Aug 8, 2012)

LeBigMac said:


> Elites UWLS works wonders for a boost and also suppresses appetite.


Fair point, I tried ECA at the start but don't handle strong stims well, but if you can tolerate them it will make the fast fly by!


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## ZyZee_2012 (Jan 1, 2010)

Would be a really good idea.

Started today, running 20 hour fast with 4 hour eating window and cutting.

Have taken pics and measurements, hopefully all goes well.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

LeBigMac said:


> All depends on what you want to do. Personally I drink black coffee, drink diet coke, chew gum and drink lots of water


I do drinks lots of water all day and don't drink any fizz juice. I do have a coffee first thing with skimmed milk and would prob have one at 11am.

Just wondering if having these cals during a fast will hinder the fat burning affects of the fast?

If it did I guess I would have to acquire the taste of black coffee.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

*"More regular fasting isn't objectively better for losing body fat. While my IF experiments worked quite well, the intermittent fasting approach (bigger meals, less frequently) didn't produce better fat loss than a more conventional diet approach (smaller meals, more frequently) might have."*

From the book. i haven't read it all. Just wondering why, if your main objective is weight loss, you would subject themselves to this when there seems to be far easier ways to do it ie a conventional diet?


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

It's all about what works to make it easy to control calories. Fasting 24 hours twice a week clearly makes it easy to remove 2000+ calories. If you can easily do that otherwise it's fine but there are benefits to a short fast.

For people worried about a few calories here and there, yesterday I had bcaa's around fasted cardiovascular first thing. Then I had green tea with sweetener around 12 and took blood glucose measure about half hour later and it was 6.1. Three hours later after sweating away doing some work outside only drinking water, about 20 hours into fast, my blood sugar was 6.9. So any insulin response from bcaa's or sweetener was outplayed by what I assume was fat being burned to keep blood sugar and me up.

I could be wrong about all that but the YouTube video earlier made it sound like that's what happens.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

mark22 said:


> It's all about what works to make it easy to control calories. Fasting 24 hours twice a week clearly makes it easy to remove 2000+ calories. If you can easily do that otherwise it's fine but there are benefits to a short fast.


Yeah, i can see the other benefits, just thinking about weight loss I would find fasting a more difficult way to do it. Everyone finds their own way. Interested to see how people get on, it seems to be gaining popularity.


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

NovemberDelta said:


> Yeah, i can see the other benefits, just thinking about weight loss I would find fasting a more difficult way to do it. Everyone finds their own way. Interested to see how people get on, it seems to be gaining popularity.


For me I like the challenge of it. I also findit difficult to control calories in a 'normal' way. I'm finding that having a period where no food is allowed I'm able to resist the temptations.

Example of this is last night - we are watching a movie at home kids are eating sweets and popcorn mrs is having a few sweets too normally I would be right in there eating a whole bag of revels. Didn't eat a thing it's like im blindly following the rules laid out. Same reason why keto worked well for me.

Been doing this since Monday and I've dropped 1.5kg doing a min of 16hr fasts every day (lean gains) I fast from 18:00 - 10:00/11:00 and only consume BCAA, black coffee, green tea and water (5ltrs per day) during the 8hr feeding window I eat 3 meals the largest of these being post work out. I'm still also cab cycling so will have high carb and zero carb days on training and non training days.

My diet is still high protein aiming for 1.5g per lb body weight (300g) every day. Carbs are either 300g or zero(except green veg and salad)

My goal is still to reach 8% while keeping body weight over 90kg currently at 97.3kg and 10-12% body fat. I've had no real Consistancy with diet in my quest for this and have been a real 'slave' to food. This does feel like a great way for me to control and change my eating habits and reprograme my instincts to eat every thing in sight!

Time will tell if this is a good thing for me. My only real concern with this way of eating is muscle loss amd being in a catabolic environment for a prolonged period of time. Hopefully ass and the increase in GH will take care of this!


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## Veni (Aug 8, 2012)

I can see where you are coming from but for me it is convenience. My job makes it hard to be leaving my desk multiple times a day to heat food or prep it so my doing leangains I can prep at home as you would normally then only do a little at work around lunchtime with everyone else. I also find it hard to eat breakfast in the morning, it's always a conscious effort, so this is another aspect that works well. Horses for courses IMO


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

Veni said:


> I can see where you are coming from but for me it is convenience. My job makes it hard to be leaving my desk multiple times a day to heat food or prep it so my doing leangains I can prep at home as you would normally then only do a little at work around lunchtime with everyone else. I also find it hard to eat breakfast in the morning, it's always a conscious effort, so this is another aspect that works well. *Horses for courses IMO*


Absolutely. The key is finding what works for you.

@Lebigmac, in the example you have given how many cals do you consume a day? And do you think it is sustainable fasting for 16 hours every day? As you say, my concern would also be muscle loss and the body being in a catabolic state.


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

NovemberDelta said:


> Absolutely. The key is finding what works for you.
> 
> @Lebigmac, in the example you have given how many cals do you consume a day? And do you think it is sustainable fasting for 16 hours every day? As you say, my concern would also be muscle loss and the body being in a catabolic state.


Well, the lean gains protocal has been effective for many. I am worried (a little) about muscle loss, but from what I've read this shouldn't happen any more than being in a calorie deficit on any other diet. As long as I hit my cal required for the day I should be good. I'm actually consuming slightly more cals this week then the last 3 weeks on carb cycling diet and I've still managed to drop 1.5kg admittedly I did cheat a little too often, again this is why I feel this could very well be the answer for me, in the short term at least.

Like you quote proberbly no more or less effective than any offer form of calorie controlled diet.

My break down is this -

Medium/High Carb Day 300g P 200g Carb 50g Fat = 2450 cals (typo in last post should have read 200g)

Zero carb day 300g P 50g Fat = 1650 cals (twice per week)

This is first week so I will play with these numbers if weight loss stalls or is far to rapid.


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

looking at giving this a go this week. am I right in thinking following the 5:2 version I could for example have a 600 calorie meal for breakfast (considering scrambled eggs, toast and a CNP Pro MR) then nothing but water till the following day where I then follow the usual high protein/plenty veg/carbs diet and do it again some other time in the week?


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

Ashcrapper said:


> looking at giving this a go this week. am I right in thinking following the 5:2 version I could for example have a 600 calorie meal for breakfast (considering scrambled eggs, toast and a CNP Pro MR) then nothing but water till the following day where I then follow the usual high protein/plenty veg/carbs diet and do it again some other time in the week?


You might want to change the meal you have that day for dinner as if you have breakfast you then have the whole day and then the night to get through before you can eat again. Makes it easier to deal with.


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

LeBigMac said:


> You might want to change the meal you have that day for dinner as if you have breakfast you then have the whole day and then the night to get through before you can eat again. Makes it easier to deal with.


right ok, will take that into consideration. thanks mate


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## ZyZee_2012 (Jan 1, 2010)

People's opinions on lean gains (20hr fast/4hr eating window) vs Eat Stop Eat?

Anyone combined the 2 of them and throw in a 24 hour fast once a week?

What about that sub section then????


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

did first day yesterday. had breakfast at 8am totally around 600 cals then ate again today at same time. drank a shedload of water and did two light stationary bike sessions, one last night one this morning before breakfast. felt suprisingly good and coped with the hunger a lot better than I thought I would. now I know I can do it im going to give this a go for a while see if I can trim off a bit of fat


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## Guest (Aug 22, 2012)

I started this on sunday. 16 hours fast 8 hours feed, just as a kind of experiment. Cals are at 2000 with low carbs. But I'm not training fasted


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

ZyZee_2012 said:


> People's opinions on lean gains (20hr fast/4hr eating window) vs Eat Stop Eat?
> 
> Anyone combined the 2 of them and throw in a 24 hour fast once a week?
> 
> What about that sub section then????


I've been doing this, did 2 24 hour fasts last week, another tomorrow, 6pm-6pm fasted then 600 calories for dinner. It works a treat for fat loss and is hopefully bringing my fasting blood glucose down a little (only very slightly into the pre diabetic range).


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

I'm on day 11 of 16/8 and I've dropped 2.5kg really starting to see fat come off the mid section and some great definition in shoulders and chest. Defo losing a good amount of fat!


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## gummyp (Aug 16, 2011)

LeBigMac said:


> I'm on day 11 of 16/8 and I've dropped 2.5kg really starting to see fat come off the mid section and some great definition in shoulders and chest. Defo losing a good amount of fat!


Do you have a food log of your 11 days mate?


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

LeBigMac said:


> For me I like the challenge of it. I also findit difficult to control calories in a 'normal' way. I'm finding that having a period where no food is allowed I'm able to resist the temptations.
> 
> Example of this is last night - we are watching a movie at home kids are eating sweets and popcorn mrs is having a few sweets too normally I would be right in there eating a whole bag of revels. Didn't eat a thing it's like im blindly following the rules laid out. Same reason why keto worked well for me.
> 
> ...





LeBigMac said:


> Well, the lean gains protocal has been effective for many. I am worried (a little) about muscle loss, but from what I've read this shouldn't happen any more than being in a calorie deficit on any other diet. As long as I hit my cal required for the day I should be good. I'm actually consuming slightly more cals this week then the last 3 weeks on carb cycling diet and I've still managed to drop 1.5kg admittedly I did cheat a little too often, again this is why I feel this could very well be the answer for me, in the short term at least.
> 
> Like you quote proberbly no more or less effective than any offer form of calorie controlled diet.
> 
> ...





gummyp said:


> Do you have a food log of your 11 days mate?


http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/member-journals-pictures/177119-hunt-8-a.html This is my journal mate.

Try to hit the macros above mainly with whole foods if I'm falling short ill have a shake or two. Not ideal but suits my needs.


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## Ukmeathead (Dec 4, 2010)

ZyZee_2012 said:


> People's opinions on lean gains (20hr fast/4hr eating window) vs Eat Stop Eat?
> 
> Anyone combined the 2 of them and throw in a 24 hour fast once a week?
> 
> What about that sub section then????


This is what I want to know as well which one has more benefits.


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

Lorian said:


> I'd probably start early Sept and continue for as long as I made progress and/or remained happy with it.


I'm starting IF again 2nd September after my leave. More of a Lean gains based IF with carb cycling and different cal intakes depending on training/rest days. I'm up for contributing to an IF forum though.


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## Guest (Aug 23, 2012)

LeBigMac said:


> I'm on day 11 of 16/8 and I've dropped 2.5kg really starting to see fat come off the mid section and some great definition in shoulders and chest. Defo losing a good amount of fat!


How much cardio you doing mate? And are you doing it fasted?

Just had a 20 hour fast today as I was in work and didn't make any dinner. Felt ok though. Got hungry about 11 but after that was fine


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## Guest (Aug 23, 2012)

LeBigMac said:


> I'm on day 11 of 16/8 and I've dropped 2.5kg really starting to see fat come off the mid section and some great definition in shoulders and chest. Defo losing a good amount of fat!


How much cardio you doing mate? And are you doing it fasted?

Just had a 20 hour fast today as I was in work and didn't make any dinner. Felt ok though. Got hungry about 11 but after that was fine


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

3rd 24 hours fast just finished, double protein shake and chicken curry for dinner gets me to 600 cals. For cardio I'm doing 40-50 minutes swimming fasted 4-5 times a week, and workout 4 times a week. Today's chest, back and arms workout was fasted and finished an hour ago. Feel surprisingly good, could probably fast till tomorrow. It does effect performance a bit in the gym but then I really want to see those abs before I lean bulk.

As for leangains vs eat stop eat, the latter has the definite benefits for weight loss and for health. Leangains or IF can be used to bulk as well as cut, I'm doing both to cut right now. I'm about 4pounds down on average I'd say, it's a bit hard to say with water fluctuation so I need a few weeks at it, holiday in Benidorm at the start of september might screw that idea up. Can't be good all the time though.


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## Ukmeathead (Dec 4, 2010)

mark22 said:


> 3rd 24 hours fast just finished, double protein shake and chicken curry for dinner gets me to 600 cals. For cardio I'm doing 40-50 minutes swimming fasted 4-5 times a week, and workout 4 times a week. Today's chest, back and arms workout was fasted and finished an hour ago. Feel surprisingly good, could probably fast till tomorrow. It does effect performance a bit in the gym but then I really want to see those abs before I lean bulk.
> 
> As for leangains vs eat stop eat, the latter has the definite benefits for weight loss and for health. Leangains or IF can be used to bulk as well as cut, I'm doing both to cut right now. I'm about 4pounds down on average I'd say, it's a bit hard to say with water fluctuation so I need a few weeks at it, holiday in Benidorm at the start of september might screw that idea up. Can't be good all the time though.


So you prefer 20+ hours fast instead of the 16hr? I've read somewhere the benefits of fasting don't start untill the 18th hour of a fast.


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

Ukmeathead said:


> So you prefer 20+ hours fast instead of the 16hr? I've read somewhere the benefits of fasting don't start untill the 18th hour of a fast.


Don't suppose you have a link ? Trying to read up on IF as much as I can.


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## ZyZee_2012 (Jan 1, 2010)

Done my first 24 hours today, found it quite easy. Combining that with 20 hour fasts 4 hour eating window every day should see some results  . I don't find it magic per se, I am finding it excellent at giving me discipline.


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

Sure it was posted a few pages back youtube job


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

ZyZee_2012 said:


> Done my first 24 hours today, found it quite easy. Combining that with 20 hour fasts 4 hour eating window every day should see some results  . I don't find it magic per se, I am finding it excellent at giving me discipline.


This is why it works, you have to be strict or you're not doing it.


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## gummyp (Aug 16, 2011)

Anyone else get stomach rumbling from IF?


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

gummyp said:


> Anyone else get stomach rumbling from IF?


1st week is the worst after that you adjust. I take Amino Energy and find this helps a lot!


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## Ukmeathead (Dec 4, 2010)

Anyone got any studies on how much hgh increase's over the 16-24hr fasting period?


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## LeBigMac (Jul 17, 2011)

Jd123 said:


> How much cardio you doing mate? And are you doing it fasted?
> 
> Just had a 20 hour fast today as I was in work and didn't make any dinner. Felt ok though. Got hungry about 11 but after that was fine


Have made a small change and now do fasted cardio and then weight train later in the day ins fed state. Works much better for me. Cardio is done every day, twice a day if I can fit it in and not weight training.


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## Guest (Aug 25, 2012)

Had another 20 hour fast the other day. Had a meal about 30 mins before then did some HIIT on the cross trainer. Apart from this time, I felt like I could of gone on forever! Managed 25 minutes and the previous times not doing IF I had only managed 20. Thing that stopped me was my legs aching from a few days before.

Just curious though as It does feel wrong not eating for that amount of time. Does anyone think catabolism will be a problem at all? And how much weight are you NON-assisted boys loosing per week?


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## Ukmeathead (Dec 4, 2010)

Jd123 said:


> Had another 20 hour fast the other day. Had a meal about 30 mins before then did some HIIT on the cross trainer. Apart from this time, I felt like I could of gone on forever! Managed 25 minutes and the previous times not doing IF I had only managed 20. Thing that stopped me was my legs aching from a few days before.
> 
> Just curious though as It does feel wrong not eating for that amount of time. Does anyone think catabolism will be a problem at all? And how much weight are you NON-assisted boys loosing per week?


That is what i would like to know because catabolism doesn't really happen to muscle that quick and apparently the increase in hgh while fasting stops this.


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## HorizontalSte (Oct 8, 2009)

I've been doing IF for about two months now and I have to say it suits me.

I'm not too worried about losing muscle, I don't have much. It's all about the body fat.

Not having hunger pangs really although I know I'm ready to eat about an hour before I break the fast.

Two things I am experiencing though are a decrease in sex drive and sit down visits to the toilet are less.

Been losing about a pound and a half a week consistently though and I do like big meals better than six poxy ones.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

I'm in for this aswell if a sub forum is created.

Anyone got any studies on how long fast should last for most health benefits?


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## reza85 (Jan 11, 2009)

MutantX said:


> I'm in for this aswell if a sub forum is created.
> 
> Anyone got any studies on how long fast should last for most health benefits?


24 hours 2x a week u can only consume around 30% on ur in take in one meal on those days


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## Ukmeathead (Dec 4, 2010)

reza85 said:


> 24 hours 2x a week u can only consume around 30% on ur in take in one meal on those days


Where's the study on this pal would like to read??


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Ukmeathead said:


> Where's the study on this pal would like to read??


Just read the 'Eat Stop Eat' and it goes into detail on the 24 hr fasts

Worth a read


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

1/4 of a stone lost in just over 2 weeks since I started doing this. pretty pleased and finding the fasting bit rather easy. result


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## reza85 (Jan 11, 2009)

Ukmeathead said:


> Where's the study on this pal would like to read??


Google a book called eat stop eat it was also on the BBC science program


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## gummyp (Aug 16, 2011)

Ashcrapper said:


> 1/4 of a stone lost in just over 2 weeks since I started doing this. pretty pleased and finding the fasting bit rather easy. result


You doing full day fasts or 16/8 daily


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

I've lost 4 to 5 pounds now doing 16/8 daily with two 24 hour fast 600 calorie days thrown in. It's so easy and it's good for you! Love it. One more fast tomorrow then a week in benidorm to ruin all the progress.


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

mark22 said:


> I've lost 4 to 5 pounds now doing 16/8 daily with two 24 hour fast 600 calorie days thrown in. It's so easy and it's good for you! Love it. One more fast tomorrow then a week in benidorm to ruin all the progress.


Full 24 hours


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## mark22 (Jul 13, 2011)

Yep doing full 24 hours now, finish eating at 6pm through to 6pm the next day. I train at 5 so I can have a shake and a meal pwo and that's it, it clearly agrees with me. I have been having the odd electrolyte drink as felt a bit light headed coming out the sauna one day but that's zero calorie. A lot of water loss probably caused it and I eat pretty well so not much salt.


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

Restarted lean gains again today. Day one down!

Any news on this IF sub forum ?


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## User Name (Aug 19, 2012)

Did anyone watch The Horizon documentary?


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## loganchristophe (Sep 12, 2012)

Interesting approach...I'll also try it myself


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

4th week in now, finding the fasting very easy indeed. visible weight loss which im happy with, even the wife commented which isnt normal hahaha! also not having an adverse effects with training or cardio either. really glad I decided to try this


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## ZyZee_2012 (Jan 1, 2010)

Putting a comment in here... with major thanks to the Twins for introducing it to me I have lost so far 10lbs and 2.5" off the waist in 4 weeks.

I'm decreasin' ALLLL kinds of Bodyfat!!!!! ALLL Kinddddzz

^^ Had to be done  .

Lovin' it... no longer a diet for me... I prefer this way of eating anyway. :thumb: :thumbup1:


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Everyone still cal counting doing IF?

I've been doing fasted workouts but starting to feel burnt!


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## ZyZee_2012 (Jan 1, 2010)

MutantX said:


> Everyone still cal counting doing IF?


Of course! + Macro counting


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

ZyZee_2012 said:


> Of course! + Macro counting


X2

I try get 20%-30% of cals before work out then the rest between two post work out meals and my post work out shake.


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## Ballin (Aug 24, 2011)

Looking at jumping on this wagon.

I have two questions on it if anyone can help:

1) I take it no AM protein shakes are allowed?

2) I train in the evening- usually about 6pm so am I best having a light meal at 2pm and bigger one at 4pm train at 6pm and then eat a good protein and carb meal after?

Many thanks- the lean gains site only really mentions AM training which is not practical for me.


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## Countryboy (May 26, 2012)

im looking at coming in on this but the way ive seen/read it so far is something im allready doing. i sleep 12 hours and then eat not long before i go to bed generally.

i had breakfast at 4pm yesterday :/ my first meal today or yesterday how ever you look at it (31st) was 9pm might explain why im looking more toned but not exactly shifting the pounds :/

might have to start a alarm thing


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## Rusky87 (Jan 15, 2012)

Started I.F last week and feeling really good doing it. It was tough at the start, lots of growling in the stomach, but now, just one full week complete, I could easily shortern my eating window. I'm currently doing 19hrs fast with 5hrs eating.

I haven't done as much cardio as I'd liked due to my schedule but I've still lost weight. Mainly water in week one, I hear.

Gone from 87kgs to 84.5kgs in 7 days.

More cardio next week and hopefully will be seeing more results.


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## Bish83 (Nov 18, 2009)

Ballin said:


> Looking at jumping on this wagon. I have two questions on it if anyone can help: 1) I take it no AM protein shakes are allowed? 2) I train in the evening- usually about 6pm so am I best having a light meal at 2pm and bigger one at 4pm train at 6pm and then eat a good protein and carb meal after? Many thanks- the lean gains site only really mentions AM training which is not practical for me.


 Pretty sure on the leangains site it shows you exactly how its laid out. Fairly certain the author to LF stated having bcaas or the equivalent in whey wouldn't make much difference in terms of hampering gains anyways.


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## Rusky87 (Jan 15, 2012)

Been using I.F for 8 days now. Starting weight was 86.7kgs. I weighed myself this morning at 84.2kgs.

Before I started I was told by friends and family "Oh, that sounds stupid." or "Your starving yourself." - You know, all the usual rubbish that people uneducated in the matter would say. I guess it fueled me more to stick with it and prove them wrong.

Last week I could hide a pound coin under my damn boob-flap. Not today... even the missus has noticed my body change.

I've been using 19:5 fast/eat window with some really light home workouts every other night. 15min jog or press-ups/dumbbells is all.

Been eating much better than I used. Chicken, rice, veg, fruit, fish, oats that kinda' thing. I don't even miss crisps or pork scratchings...

I don't calorie count or anything like that... numbers totally depress me and I'm not clever enough to work out macros so I just stick to healthy, simple, good looking foods.

I kept hunger at bay by drinking tons of water. Most of the weight likely lost in trips to the bathroom every 30mins. 1-2 cups of black coffee per day.

The first 3-4 days were tough hunger wise as I'm used to stuffing my face every 2-3hours and snacking like the fat sh*t I was 8 days ago. By day 5 of I.F, my stomach was used to the eating times and I could easily push my fasting further if I wanted.

I've noticed during my eating window I don't eat as much as I thought I would. It's difficult for me to gorge on food. Stomach shrinking maybe?

Really looking forward to keeping I.F up until Christmas and maybe more if I continue to see results. I've took photos and kept a log of my weight every other day so I can look back on what a useless slob I once was.

Hopefully by next week I'll be seeing 82Kgs on the scale.


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## AuburnMuscle (May 27, 2011)

:thumbup1: Thanks for this.


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## SideEffect (Jul 17, 2012)

Ballin said:


> Looking at jumping on this wagon.
> 
> I have two questions on it if anyone can help:
> 
> ...


1-no calorias during the fasting period, no shakes, just plain coffe(no sugar or milk) and tea are allowed.

2-you could break the fast at about 20-25% of your calories at 2pm, no complex carbs, just vegetables and protein, another 20-25% at 4pm, the same as befor, may add a piece of fruit since it´s pre-workout and the rest of the calories at dinner, incluind all the complex carbs of the day.


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## Ashcrapper (Jul 3, 2008)

Rusky87 said:


> Been using I.F since November. I fell off over xmas and new year as there was too much lovely looking food being thrown in my face 24/7
> 
> Started again properly as of today. See below for pictures of me from week 1 to around the 6/7 week mark.
> 
> ...


not only have you lost weight its also given your pants a splash of colour 

im jumping back on this sometime this week after a bit off. had to stop training for a bit due to work (again). lost a full stone last time so looking forward to smashing this in again


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## Rusky87 (Jan 15, 2012)

Ashcrapper said:


> not only have you lost weight its also given your pants a splash of colour


Wow, yeah you're right! If I lose any more weight I'll be walking around in colourful Jimmy Saville style track suits lol

Good luck for when you start up IF again buddy.


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## Bobby1413 (Dec 29, 2011)

I'm kind of heading this way myself.

I work two types of shifts:

Early - which starts at 8am and

Late - which starts at 3pm

I find the lates a lot easier as I have the gym and get up a bit later to keep my busy. The earlies though are going to be the challenge as I'm up about 645 and then work from 8am through till about 1ish before I eat. It's got a lot easier in the few days I've been (casually) doing this, but I'm about to try and do it properly now.

My plan is, low carb too as that works so well with me. Only carbs are from sources other than pasta, rice, bread. No porridge either. Carbs will be from sources such as vegetables and as a by-product to the food itself.

Currently Stats:

Age: 28

Height: 5ft 7inches

Weight: 189lbs (was 196 but lost a few since starting training properly)

Condition: cardio wise I'm a disgrace, can run about a mile or so but really out of shape. I'm used to lifting but haven't done so properly for almost a year as I've been doing it on/off

My aim is to lose 22lbs by May time. This will be done by an average of 4 days of weights (traditional bodypart split) and about 3 cardio sessions per week too.

My only worry is that the I won't lose the 22lbs as I'll be maintaining the muscle and losing the fat. I ideally want to weigh a bit less.


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