# Not so big Rami



## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

First photo earlier this year, second one taken today after 48 days no training


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## Dai the drive (Dec 17, 2013)

DYELB?


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> First photo earlier this year, second one taken today after 48 days no training
> 
> View attachment 117178


Do you know why?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

MissMartinez said:


> Guy beside him always trains in Golds venice


Hide Yamagishi, going out with Iris Kyle


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> Do you know why?


So he can fit on a coach provided by David Cameron to get into the UK?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

MissMartinez said:


> Really? She must be just a friend
> 
> View attachment 117179


home wrecker.


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## averagejoe95 (Apr 13, 2015)

rumour has it hes moving into mens physique


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

MissMartinez said:


> how did he get small so fast?


I think modern bodybuilding is now more about chemical manipulation than lifting and eating right.

A high level competitor I spoke to on another forum told me he could compete shredded at 195lbs and in the same shape at 230 if he used the right drugs alongside insulin.

Remember the story Mike Morris told about Milos Sarcev and the story Milos told about Flex Wheeler?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

31 minutes in


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

MissMartinez said:


> No, I don't read that much about it.
> 
> So does he take a lot of time off training like Kevin Leverone used to. *They say Kevin only trained for 6 months each year then stopped after his comps.*


I think that was later in his career but yes, he played in a rock band


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## toxyuk (Sep 8, 2015)

Dark sim said:


> Do you know why?


yeah its his twin brother hes natty lols


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## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

Apparently he's just called "Ramy" now.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

banzi said:


> *I think modern bodybuilding is now more about chemical manipulation than lifting and eating right.*
> 
> A high level competitor I spoke to on another forum told me he could compete shredded at 195lbs and in the same shape at 230 if he used the right drugs alongside insulin.
> 
> Remember the story Mike Morris told about Milos Sarcev and the story Milos told about Flex Wheeler?


Why is bostin not up there then, surely with the sheer amount of s**t he's shooting.


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## toxyuk (Sep 8, 2015)

dont slag off zyzz hes a legend lols


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Rammy who?

Never going to win MO

Wait until for this one to come


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## gibbo10 (May 16, 2013)

Jesus hes tiny,skin and bone really someone should get him a good meal


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Test-e said:


> Why is bostin not up there then, surely with the sheer amount of s**t he's shooting.


I think it has more to do with response to substances as opposed to amount.

Bostin without the drugs would be a fat kid.

Just look at his before pics in his 12 month transformation video, that's him in reality.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

banzi said:


> I think it has more to do with response to substances as opposed to amount.
> 
> Bostin without the drugs would be a fat kid.
> 
> Just look at his before pics in his 12 month transformation video, that's him in reality.


food for thought, though the thought that you're right is somewhat depressing.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> I think modern bodybuilding is now more about chemical manipulation than lifting and eating right.
> 
> A high level competitor I spoke to on another forum told me he could compete shredded at 195lbs and in the same shape at 230 if he used the right drugs alongside insulin.
> 
> Remember the story Mike Morris told about Milos Sarcev and the story Milos told about Flex Wheeler?


Does this explain this 7 month transformation, since his coach is Milos -

19st in both pictures


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Test-e said:


> food for thought, though the thought that you're right is somewhat depressing.


it doesn't matter if you jump on gear straight away or "build a base", once you come off and stop training and you eat normally, in three months you are back to looking very normal.


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## Big ape (May 5, 2011)

> Does this explain this 7 month transformation, since his coach is Milos -
> 
> 19st in both pictures
> 
> View attachment 117185


Better lighting, better angle, better tan also changed the way he displays hes front lat spread with bringing hes shoulder slightly forward.


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## Chelsea (Sep 19, 2009)

> Does this explain this 7 month transformation, since his coach is Milos -
> 
> 19st in both pictures
> 
> View attachment 117185


That's fcking impressive if he is the same weight but hugely leaner!


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

banzi said:


> it doesn't matter if you jump on gear straight away or "build a base", once you come off and stop training and you eat normally, in three months you are back to looking very normal.


not that per say, but the amount some of these guys are alleged to use. And to get to even 2/3 of where they are size wise, with genetics that arent great - how much I'll have to push the drugs in a few years.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Test-e said:


> not that per say, but the amount some of these guys are alleged to use. And to get to even 2/3 of where they are size wise, with genetics that arent great - how much I'll have to push the drugs in a few years.


doesn't matter how much you take mate, its already programmed into your genetics how big you are going to get.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Big ape said:


> Better lighting, better angle, better tan also changed the way he displays hes front lat spread with bringing hes shoulder slightly forward.


There is complete change in body composition, surely you can see that right?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> There is complete change in body composition, surely you can see that right?


remember this guy?

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/topic/252947-22lb-drop-in-24-hours/


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> doesn't matter how much you take mate, its already programmed into your genetics how big you are going to get.


That's where AAS come in. they take you past your genetic potential, a long way past.

EDIT: So, if I took a cycle of 1g of test, then run it again but with 5g, the result would be the same? No it wouldn't.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

banzi said:


> doesn't matter how much you take mate, its already programmed into your genetics how big you are going to get.


Won't know till I get there though haha.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> That's where AAS come in. they take you past your genetic potential, a long way past.


I am including your response to AAS in your genetic limitations.

Natty Genetics and AAS genetic response can vary greatly.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Test-e said:


> Won't know till I get there though haha.


If you are not responding to large amounts then taking larger amounts wont do s**t.

Someone once told me that if you take 500mgs and get results , to get double those results you need to take ten times the amount.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Chelsea said:


> That's fcking impressive if he is the same weight but hugely leaner!


He was the ukbff British super heavy winner. Personally thought he should of been 2nd, but either way epic transformation.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> If you are not responding to large amounts then taking larger amounts wont do s**t.
> 
> Someone once told me that if you take 500mgs and get results , to get double those results you need to take ten times the amount.


That is why pro's are running 3-5g+ cycles. There will be some taking less, but who will believe them.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> remember this guy?
> 
> http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/topic/252947-22lb-drop-in-24-hours/


I don't. Your point, he dropped weight? This guy has stayed same weight, but changed his whole body composition.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> I don't. Your point, he dropped weight? This guy has stayed same weight, but changed his whole body composition.


A bit of water weight in the right place can change your whole body composition.

Pulling the water into the muscle as opposed to spilled over is a different look altogether but the same weight.

Not saying the guy hasn't improved but its not a huge difference


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> A bit of water weight in the right place can change your whole body composition.
> 
> Pulling the water into the muscle as opposed to spilled over is a different look altogether but the same weight.
> 
> Not saying the guy hasn't improved but its not a huge difference


I'm not sure but I don't think this manipulation of water weight, not to the degree you showed. He is bigger and leaner.

It doesn't take 7 months to manipulate any water.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

banzi said:


> If you are not responding to large amounts then taking larger amounts wont do s**t.
> 
> Someone once told me that if you take 500mgs and get results , to get double those results you need to take ten times the amount.


Not quite, from my experience with both myself, people I have coached and also from my coach (who is a former overall British champ and IFBB pro). if you got a certain amount on 500mg EW then to get double you need to do 2g to 2.5g EW. There are no hard and fast rules, but this is typically about right. However which compounds you use (and Test should always be the base for any cycle) can affect this, so I know personally running 1.6g in the form of 800mg Test, 400mg Tren and 400mg Mast will roughly give me double what 500mg straight test will give me.

The base line is that you need to learn how your body reacts to compounds rather than just blindly sticking in whatever you can get hold of, just because 'some guy at the gym told me to'.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> I'm not sure but I don't think this manipulation of water weight, not to the degree you showed. He is bigger and leaner.
> 
> It doesn't take 7 months to manipulate any water.


most muscle size on steroids is simply retained water in the muscle.

Hence the rapid decline when you come off, if it was real muscle tissue then it wouldn't disappear so quickly.


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## oldskoolcool (Oct 4, 2009)

Dark sim said:


> That's where AAS come in. they take you past your genetic potential, a long way past.
> 
> EDIT: So, if I took a cycle of 1g of test, then run it again but with 5g, the result would be the same? No it wouldn't.


yes just with more estrogen side to run 5g of test alot more hormones will be needed on top


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

banzi said:


> most muscle size on steroids is simply retained water in the muscle.
> 
> Hence the rapid decline when you come off, if it was real muscle tissue then it wouldn't disappear so quickly.


No that is AAS taking you past your genetic potential, without AAS you cannot maintain that muscle.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

banzi said:


> most muscle size on steroids is simply retained water in the muscle.
> 
> Hence the rapid decline when you come off, if it was real muscle tissue then it wouldn't disappear so quickly.


This depends on your training and diet whilst on cycle, if you get this right then you should not lose the weight to any great extent.

I had an enforced layoff following a life altering medical event, and lets just look at one measurement. Prior to the problem I had close to 19" arms. 12 months later when I was allowed to start training again, my arms were still over 17.5. This was 12 months with zero training, and test levels of about 7 nmol/L (normal is 9-29 roughly). I lost about 10lbs of LBM in that time in total. Which with test levels that low would be expected. Had I been training I would not expect to have lost any of the weight, in fact would have probably gained LBM.

Incorrect diet, training, rest and PEDs will mean you lose a lot of your gains. Get things right and there is no reason to lose that much at all.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

oldskoolcool said:


> yes just with more estrogen side to run 5g of test alot more hormones will be needed on top


Have you run 5g? I can tell the difference between 1g and 2g, so I'm pretty sure I could see more difference with 5g, albeit with more ancillaries.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

guess theres only one way to find out ....


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

DiggyV said:


> This depends on your training and diet whilst on cycle, if you get this right then you should not lose the weight to any great extent.
> 
> I had an enforced layoff following a life altering medical event, and lets just look at one measurement. Prior to the problem I had close to 19" arms. 12 months later when I was allowed to start training again, my arms were still over 17.5. This was 12 months with zero training, and test levels of about 7 nmol/L (normal is 9-29 roughly). I lost about 10lbs of LBM in that time in total. Which with test levels that low would be expected. Had I been training I would not expect to have lost any of the weight, in fact would have probably gained LBM.
> 
> Incorrect diet, training, rest and PEDs will mean you lose a lot of your gains. Get things right and there is no reason to lose that much at all.


how big where your arms before you started training?

Also what was your body composition?

I weighed around 200lb in top shape, when I stopped training and came off everything for a few years I weighed 200lb, was my body composition the same?

Nope, nowhere near.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

banzi said:


> how big where your arms before you started training?
> 
> Also what was your body composition?
> 
> ...


Jeez mate now you're asking, but around 14" or so I reckon from memory. I was running at just over 11% (from calipers) and 12 months later at around 17%, but I was careful about my diet, although it did go astray after the issue for a while.


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## Closey91 (Aug 3, 2014)

Hopefully Big Ramy will lose some size. Its ridiculous why everyone is trying to be a 300lb plus athlete. Dexter Jack at 240lb and Phil Heath are head and shoulders above the rest along wih Shawn Rhoden at a similar weight.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Be interesting to hear thoughts on lowering dosages when you weigh considerably more at a similar bf%.

Would progress slow significantly or even at all?


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

DiggyV said:


> Jeez mate now you're asking, but around 14" or so I reckon from memory. I was running at just over 11% (from calipers) and 12 months later at around 17%, but I was careful about my diet, although it did go astray after the issue for a while.


So you lost considerable muscle but covered it with fat hence you lost more muscle than your measurements have you believe?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

BLUE(UK) said:


> So you lost considerable muscle but covered it with fat hence you lost more muscle than your measurements have you believe?


you have two choices when you come off gear

1. accept the inevitable shrinkage and loss of hardness and condition and eat normally and not get fat.

2. eat like a horse in the misguided belief that you can keep all the muscle , sure you may still look big in clothes but out of them YLLS.


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## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

> First photo earlier this year, second one taken today after 48 days no training
> 
> View attachment 117178


UPPER RESPIRATORY INFECTION I believe. http://www.flexonline.com/general-news/big-ramy-update


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

@banzi being schooled :lol:


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Dark sim said:


> No that is AAS taking you past your genetic potential, without AAS you cannot maintain that muscle.


So does that mean if I do a steroid cycle, I won't be able to keep the gains from that if I never do a cycle again after that? I thought you'd be able to keep some of the gains for good?


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

MFM said:


> So does that mean if I do a steroid cycle, I won't be able to keep the gains from that if I never do a cycle again after that? I thought you'd be able to keep some of the gains for good?


You could keep some if you managed to maintain a good diet and was consistent with your training.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Dark sim said:


> You could keep some if you managed to maintain a good diet and was consistent with your training.


So all this time I was fooling myself thinking I'd do a few cycles until I get to the size I want and then just maintain it naturally from then on. Lol


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

MFM said:


> So does that mean if I do a steroid cycle, I won't be able to keep the gains from that if I never do a cycle again after that? I thought you'd be able to keep some of the gains for good?


IMO if your cylce takes you past your natural genetic limits then at best regardless of what you do you will eventually revert back to your natural limit.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

MFM said:


> So all this time I was fooling myself thinking I'd do a few cycles until I get to the size I want and then just maintain it naturally from then on. Lol


Yes you was. If you could maintain it naturally, then you could achieve it naturally.


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## zyphy (Jun 23, 2014)

MissMartinez said:


> Really? She must be just a friend
> 
> View attachment 117179


they own a business together don't they, some cafe iirc


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## zyphy (Jun 23, 2014)

banzi said:


> I think that was later in his career but yes, he played in a rock band


full blown


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

zyphy said:


> full blown


Should that post be in the Charlie Sheen thread?


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## zyphy (Jun 23, 2014)

banzi said:


> Should that post be in the Charlie Sheen thread?


 :lol:


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> You could keep some if you managed to maintain a good diet and was consistent with your training.


And that too for a particular period i believe.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

MissMartinez said:


> *I dunno lol, no idea who she is. Just took a pic as I was going to the gym cos I knew who he was *
> 
> Who is she and what business do they own?
> 
> Dexter and Jay drive a Range Rover Well to golds they do anyway FYI!


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> Yes you was. If you could maintain it naturally, then you could achieve it naturally.


Quite a statememt :thumb: . In btw, you look great in your avi. Them delts


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## philippeb (Aug 21, 2013)

banzi said:


> I think modern bodybuilding is now more about chemical manipulation than lifting and eating right.
> 
> A high level competitor I spoke to on another forum told me he could compete shredded at 195lbs and in the same shape at 230 if he used the right drugs alongside insulin.
> 
> Remember the story Mike Morris told about Milos Sarcev and the story Milos told about Flex Wheeler?


and the story you are telling right now ?
Remember .. it's stories, not reality.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

philippeb said:


> and the story you are telling right now ?Remember .. it's stories, not reality.


stories can be about reality.

Have you ever hear the term "true story"?


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## Lean&amp;Mean&amp;Clean (May 9, 2008)

> Rammy who?
> 
> Never going to win MO
> 
> Wait until for this one to come


huge progress ,but is never going to win the O


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Frandeman said:


> Rammy who?
> 
> Never going to win MO
> 
> Wait until for this one to come


how the f**k can this guys BP be in check?


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## Lean&amp;Mean&amp;Clean (May 9, 2008)

> I dunno lol, no idea who she is. Just took a pic as I was going to the gym cos I knew who he was
> 
> Who is she and what business do they own?
> 
> Dexter and Jay drive a *Range Rover* Well to golds they do anyway FYI!


very low key for people like them, come on Mr Os and best in their field.. Jay is also a multimillionaire from what I know


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

banzi said:


> how the f**k can this guys BP be in check?


Dosent look too healty I know... Getting huge thou


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Frandeman said:


> Rammy who?
> 
> Never going to win MO
> 
> Wait until for this one to come


aesthetics > lego blocks.

He's fu**ing huge but that is not visually appealling at all.


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## SILV3RBACK (Jun 23, 2012)

Dark sim said:


> Do you know why?


I reckon it's because he's smashed the gear and gained so much in the last few years his body is fvcked. All his gains came from a syringe so he stops, gains lost!!


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

Test-e said:


> aesthetics > lego blocks.
> 
> He's fu**ing huge but that is not visually appealling at all.


Are any modern body builders?

Anyone that size just looks like a freak.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Smitch said:


> Are any modern body builders?
> 
> Anyone that size just looks like a freak.


rhoden a few years back.

I really do hope the new classic physique category doesn't dissappoint. Will be interesting to see if any of the big names take the leap from their current one into it and how they fare


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Smitch said:


> Are any modern body builders?
> 
> Anyone that size just looks like a freak.


Cedric Macmillan


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Test-e said:


> rhoden a few years back.
> 
> I really do hope the new classic physique category doesn't dissappoint. Will be interesting to see if any of the big names take the leap from their current one into it and how they fare


Sadik will be and I think he will win Mr O classic title.

Bear in mind it is a weight category class.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> Sadik will be and I think he will win Mr O classic title.
> 
> Bear in mind it is a weight category class.


division c, 6' + will be the category I'll be watching.

240lbs at 6'3 doesn't seem like a lot.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Test-e said:


> division c, 6' + will be the category I'll be watching.
> 
> 240lbs at 6'3 doesn't seem like a lot.


Where you got them figures from?


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Based on UKBFF classic class categories, which must be aligned to IFBB, 6'3" (190cm), is allowed 99kg ((height-100)+9kg)

http://www.ukbff.co.uk/pdfs/classic_bodybuilder_rules.pdf


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## Fluke82 (Sep 10, 2015)

Dark sim said:


> Sadik will be and I think he will win Mr O classic title.
> 
> Bear in mind it is a weight category class.


Sadik is fast becoming the poster boy for it...meaning even more reason for him to win


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## Magsimus (Aug 14, 2014)

He's come off his course. Heath does it too. With Phil only doing one show a year, he does shorter intense cycles where he grows into the show, then as soon as the Olympia's over, he comes off. Makes perfect sense really. Far healthier than being on all round, plus being off for longer means hid body soaks up the gear etc like a sponge when he goes back on. Levrone was the same. Look at Heath in his YouTube videos and photos around Olympia time and he looks huge, full and like Mr Olympia. Look at photos and videos 6 months after and, although he looks like he still lifts - and is still superior to most bodybuilders - he doesn't look very Olympia-esque.

Here is a video of him after a 7-week European tour after the Olympia. Yes, travelling for that time makes it hard to eat and train etc, but you can see he just isn't as big as when he is ready to hit the Olympia stage.


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## Colin (Sep 28, 2015)

Magsimus said:


> He's come off his course. Heath does it too. With Phil only doing one show a year, he does shorter intense cycles where he grows into the show, then as soon as the Olympia's over, he comes off. Makes perfect sense really. Far healthier than being on all round, plus being off for longer means hid body soaks up the gear etc like a sponge when he goes back on. Levrone was the same. Look at Heath in his YouTube videos and photos around Olympia time and he looks huge, full and like Mr Olympia. Look at photos and videos 6 months after and, although he looks like he still lifts - and is still superior to most bodybuilders - he doesn't look very Olympia-esque.
> 
> Here is a video of him after a 7-week European tour after the Olympia. Yes, travelling for that time makes it hard to eat and train etc, but you can see he just isn't as big as when he is ready to hit the Olympia stage.


How do you know his cycle routine? and also on another topic you know Phil Heaths peak week protocol.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Magsimus said:


> He's come off his course. Heath does it too. With Phil only doing one show a year, he does shorter intense cycles where he grows into the show, then as soon as the Olympia's over, he comes off. Makes perfect sense really. Far healthier than being on all round, plus being off for longer means hid body soaks up the gear etc like a sponge when he goes back on. Levrone was the same. Look at Heath in his YouTube videos and photos around Olympia time and he looks huge, full and like Mr Olympia. Look at photos and videos 6 months after and, although he looks like he still lifts - and is still superior to most bodybuilders - he doesn't look very Olympia-esque.
> 
> Here is a video of him after a 7-week European tour after the Olympia. Yes, travelling for that time makes it hard to eat and train etc, but you can see he just isn't as big as when he is ready to hit the Olympia stage.


So Phil told you he is off? OK lol.

When you are Mr O, a top pro, even lower tier competitors, you may cruise on 500mg-1g test, but you will not come off, unless blood work dictates a break, or just lower doses.

Carry on making assumptions though, it is what holds back many in this industry, who simply have no idea in reality.


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## Magsimus (Aug 14, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> So Phil told you he is off? OK lol.
> 
> When you are Mr O, a top pro, even lower tier competitors, you may cruise on 500mg-1g test, but you will not come off, unless blood work dictates a break, or just lower doses.
> 
> Carry on making assumptions though, it is what holds back many in this industry, who simply have no idea in reality.


My bad, of course he doesn't come 'off off', he cruises, but the principle's still the same: he's taking a lot less gear, hence the reduction in size. Which was what the OP was initially addressing with Ramy.



Colin said:


> How do you know his cycle routine? and also on another topic you know Phil Heaths peak week protocol.


We're best mates.


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## Colin (Sep 28, 2015)

Magsimus said:


> My bad, of course he doesn't come 'off off', he cruises, but the principle's still the same: he's taking a lot less gear, hence the reduction in size. Which was what the OP was initially addressing with Ramy.
> 
> We're best mates.


So your guessing, at least that is sorted then.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> Based on UKBFF classic class categories, which must be aligned to IFBB, 6'3" (190cm), is allowed 99kg ((height-100)+9kg)
> 
> http://www.ukbff.co.uk/pdfs/classic_bodybuilder_rules.pdf


wouldn't let me paste so this is taken off npcnewsonline -says 2016 only so subject to change?


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Test-e said:


> wouldn't let me paste so this is taken off npcnewsonline
> View attachment 117782


This makes zero sense. If a UKBFF competitor gets his pro card in classic class, he will be about 40lbs down compared to the NPC competitors.


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> This makes zero sense. If a UKBFF competitor gets his pro card in classic class, he will be about 40lbs down compared to the NPC competitors.


confusing me now, talking about the 190-98cm weight class in ukbff is 7/8 lbs lighter than the 6'3+ sub category in NPC.


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Test-e said:


> confusing me now, talking about the 190-98cm weight class in ukbff is 7/8 lbs lighter than the 6'3+ sub category in NPC.


190cm is allowed 99kg 217lbs in ukbff. NPC allowed 232.

191cm would be allowed 100kg 220lbs in ukbff. NPC allowed 240.

So, not 40lbs lol, 15-20lbs difference


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## Test-e (Mar 26, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> 190cm is allowed 99kg 217lbs in ukbff. NPC allowed 232.
> 
> 191cm would be allowed 100kg 220lbs. NPC allowed 240.
> 
> So, not 40lbs lol, 15-20lbs difference


I'll take your word for it mate, maths on my day off is a nono.

Probably be some further adjusting anyway as it's new.


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## Magsimus (Aug 14, 2014)

Colin said:


> So your guessing, at least that is sorted then.


Of course it's a guess. But it's one based on various factors that support my point. What do you think is the reason for the size loss in both Ramy and Heath if not the significant reduction in androgens and other drugs then?


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## Colin (Sep 28, 2015)

Magsimus said:


> Of course it's a guess. But it's one based on various factors that support my point. What do you think is the reason for the size loss in both Ramy and Heath if not the significant reduction in androgens and other drugs then?


I said you were guessing which you are. I never said your "theory" is incorrect.


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