# Simeon Panda and Ulisses Jr - Do You Juice!



## JuggernautJake (Nov 6, 2013)

go to 7.20 for da lulz


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## damn shame (Jan 2, 2015)

Their full of ****. I bet they both got a nutribullet from Argo in the January sales. 

I think they train with @johnv


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

Bullsh1tters


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

Simeon is the worst liar ever lol

Do I stutter motherfvcker?


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

Cue the army of natty believers.

"Just cos you can't do it naturally it's doesn't mean they can't"

"Why all the hate, they're just super dedicated"

"They've been training since they were 15 years old"

"You're just jealous"

Etc......

:lol:


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## dbol Kid (Apr 13, 2013)

Funny that, stuttering all over the place.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

Noble78 said:


> Funny that, stuttering all over the place.


It's a common side effect of steroid use.

As we all know though, the main side effect of steroid use is lying. :laugh:


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## niko69 (Feb 4, 2015)

lmao at these goofs tryna laugh it off. sadly, most viewers believe these two


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## zyphy (Jun 23, 2014)

In b4 ryda


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

niko69 said:


> lmao at these goofs tryna laugh it off. sadly, most viewers believe these two


The same as everyone thinks no one in professional sports is using either.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

Smitch said:


> Cue the army of natty believers.
> 
> "Just cos you can't do it naturally it's doesn't mean they can't"
> 
> ...


If you train natty you will get as big as you are going to get in 2 years, thats you then maxed out

Using gear takes 5 years, then thats you done.


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)




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## DC1 (May 5, 2014)

I actually quite like how Ulisses comes across but Simeon does not come across well at all.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

banzi said:


> If you train natty you will get as big as you are going to get in 2 years, thats you then maxed out
> 
> Using gear takes 5 years, then thats you done.


Unsure about this but could depend if you're already fully grown.

For example I started at 14/15 and I'd say I maxed out at 22(16.5st at approx 12%...abs 24/7). I remained this way til 24-25 when I broke some bones in an accident. I've been fat since really and unable to shift it whilst keeping good strength n muscle which I put down to my thyroid issues. :-D


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## IGotTekkers (Jun 6, 2012)

He can say he ain't on steroids, but what he can't do is not look ripped and big as **** while he's saying it.


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## damn shame (Jan 2, 2015)

Maybe he takes 30g of creatine a day.


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## brunzz (Feb 28, 2012)

I believe both are natty. Honestly all it takes is years of hardwork and obviously myprotein supps.


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## damn shame (Jan 2, 2015)

brunzz said:


> I believe both are natty. Honestly all it takes is years of hardwork and obviously myprotein supps.


That's where I have messed up I use ON Nutrition Whey. DAMN!


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

11:04 check the way Simeon say's ''am proud that am a natural bodybuilder.'' look at his eye's look straight to the ground when he say's it! LIAR. These people make me sick tbh! they really do, I don't know how they sleep at night knowing they sell dreams to young teen kids, who think they can just look like them of their own natural hormones.

I really do hope that Simeon one day, does get called out or tested for some bullsh1t & gets exposed, almost like Rob Riches did... Pr1cks! makes me wanna deliver a nasty headbutt, uppercut, hook combo to him. Their is fake natties, yeah ok, lie to keep your sponsor - fair enough. then their is just really overdoing it to an extent, that you see just how good of a liars these people are!

I don't know about you lot, but I can't rate a person or respect someone, who looks you straight in the eye, well directly at the camera (Practically bare faced.) and lies, lies, lies, so much that they actually believe their own lies. fcuk him with no Vaseline........pr1ck


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## damn shame (Jan 2, 2015)

Starz said:


> 11:04 check the way Simeon say's ''am proud that am a natural bodybuilder.'' look at his eye's look straight to the ground when he say's it! LIAR. These people make me sick tbh! they really do, I don't know how they sleep at night knowing they sell dreams to young teen kids, who think they can just look like them of their own natural hormones.
> 
> I really do hope that Simeon one day, does get called out or tested for some bullsh1t & gets exposed, almost like Rob Riches did... Pr1cks! makes me wanna deliver a nasty headbutt, uppercut, hook combo to him. Their is fake natties, yeah ok, lie to keep your sponsor - fair enough. then their is just really overdoing it to an extent, that you see just how good of a liars these people are!
> 
> I don't know about you lot, but I can't rate a person or respect someone, who looks you straight in the eye, well directly at the camera (Practically bare faced.) and lies, lies, lies, so much that they actually believe their own lies. fcuk him with no Vaseline........pr1ck


Well said

So not a fan?


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

damn shame said:


> Well said
> 
> So not a fan?


No. fantastic physique & strength, but like I said, I can't rate a guy like him. I'd love to know, what he tells young kids, who clearly are inspired by him, when they ask how he got like that. it's as almost like, when someone asks you for directions and you tell them the complete wrong direction to head, knowing full well they will never reach their destination. BUT, persistently stating it's the correct direction, because you got there yourself, that's more or less a Simeon Panda tactic right there.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> If you train natty you will get as big as you are going to get in 2 years, thats you then maxed out
> 
> Using gear takes 5 years, then thats you done.


What a load of bolix banzi


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> What a load of bolix banzi


How do you know, you are natty.


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## waaky (Feb 12, 2015)

Bull****! They use steroids and get free supplements all year round. I dont get why they have the need to lie about it, who gives a **** if you take roids or not, if hes an honest and straight up guy then him using roids shouldn't effect anyone else.. They are doing it for themselves


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## TLWFAP (Sep 20, 2013)

Forget this natty business. Why is Simeon Panda allowed to speak? His voice is UNBELIEVABLY irritating.


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## TLWFAP (Sep 20, 2013)

banzi said:


> If you train natty you will get as big as you are going to get in 2 years, thats you then maxed out
> 
> Using gear takes 5 years, then thats you done.


Don't say stuff like this, people will actually believe you mate lol


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Come on lads, you know you're gonna be asked this question, at least rehe**** a response so you don't start stuttering and show yourself to be a rubbish liar :lol:


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## DaveCW (Dec 9, 2013)

Starz said:


> No. fantastic physique & strength, but like I said, I can't rate a guy like him.* I'd love to know, what he tells young kids*, who clearly are inspired by him, when they ask how he got like that. it's as almost like, when someone asks you for directions and you tell them the complete wrong direction to head, knowing full well they will never reach their destination. BUT, persistently stating it's the correct direction, because you got there yourself, that's more or less a Simeon Panda tactic right there.


Same thing my mum told me... Eat Ya Greens..


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## peanutbob69 (Aug 26, 2010)

> What a load of bolix banzi


Well if it takes you longer than 2 years to max out as a natty then you must be doing something wrong...you might still get stronger but not bigger. You might get bigger but with more bodyfat.


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## TRT lifter (Oct 25, 2014)

Their answers to the last question at 13:20 sums up their credibility for me.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> How do you know, you are natty.


because I have trained for more than two years..... :whistling:


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

peanutbob69 said:


> Well if it takes you longer than 2 years to max out as a natty then you must be doing something wrong...you might still get stronger but not bigger. You might get bigger but with more bodyfat.


I must be doing it wrong then......PMSL


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## Lewy_h (Jan 4, 2012)

View attachment 166496


View attachment 166497


Haha can see it on there faces !


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> because I have trained for more than two years..... :whistling:


making gains doesnt mean getting fatter

What was your lean body mass when you started and what was it after 2 years?


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

LOL @banzi ..... getting fatter....

My bench press has increased over the last few years, you cant bench press with fat it takes muscle contractions to move...Its all relative. Gains may be slow but you still can gain over long periods of time... Strength and muscle size is also relative when training naturally. A big muscle is a strong muscle. If your full of synthesized man made hormones then its a different ball game. As You will know!


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## teenphysique (Jul 1, 2014)

Lieing they are but guys ive got to say They have nothing to gain by coming out as a steroid user they will lose their sponsors and then be ridiculed for making all that progress on gear not that they didnt though


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> LOL @banzi ..... getting fatter....
> 
> My bench press has increased over the last few years, you cant bench press with fat it takes muscle contractions to move...Its all relative. Gains may be slow but you still can gain over long periods of time... Strength and muscle size is also relative when training naturally. A big muscle is a strong muscle. If your full of synthesized man made hormones then its a different ball game. As You will know!


Why are you changing the subject?


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> Why are you changing the subject?


Eeerrmmmm .... How am I changing the subject?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> Eeerrmmmm .... How am I changing the subject?


"What was your lean body mass when you started and what was it after 2 years?"

Did your reply address that?


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> "What was your lean body mass when you started and what was it after 2 years?"
> 
> Did your reply address that?


@ 10 years old I cant really remember then at 12 I cant really say..... it was a fkn long time ago?


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> @ 10 years old I cant really remember then at 12 I cant really say..... it was a fkn long time ago?


Jeez, we are talking about adults not children.

Dont tell me you are claiming natty gains from 10 years old to now?

Its called growing up FFS.


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## Proteincarb (Oct 12, 2010)

They all say it. Even ronnie Coleman said he was natty ????????


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## C.Hill (Nov 21, 2010)

Proteincarb said:


> They all say it. Even ronnie Coleman said he was natty ????????


Ronnie Coleman is natty! He said it himself!


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> Jeez, we are talking about adults not children.
> 
> Dont tell me you are claiming natty gains from 10 years old to now?
> 
> Its called growing up FFS.


I answered your question

I can say @ 24 I was 12.5 - 13 stone. I'm a lot more muscular and stronger now than I was then. Over the years I have slowly increased my poundage's resulting in more muscle mass. As a younger man I had a high metabolism which meant I always looked ripped @ around 10% bf without even trying, I could burn energy for fun. Obviously as I have grown older (and wiser lol) my metabolism has slowed I have been able to pack on more muscle along with gaining some BF probably @ 17 -18% now which is within normal acceptable range for a healthy adult male. I'm still in my bulking phase until the end of march atm. Hoping to get down to 10% with a good size.

To dishearten natural trainers in the way your going on is just wrong in my book. 2 years tch.....!

If you juice for 5 years you say you hit your max potential..... more bolix IMO..... just take more juice. Mr Olimpia 6x running = six years D.Yates came back bigger n in better shape each year by his own admission.


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

> I answered your question
> 
> I can say @ 24 I was 12.5 - 13 stone. I'm a lot more muscular and stronger now than I was then. Over the years I have slowly increased my poundage's resulting in more muscle mass. As a younger man I had a high metabolism which meant I always looked ripped @ around 10% bf without even trying, I could burn energy for fun. Obviously as I have grown older (and wiser lol) my metabolism has slowed I have been able to pack on more muscle along with gaining some BF probably @ 17 -18% now which is within normal acceptable range for a healthy adult male. I'm still in my bulking phase until the end of march atm. Hoping to get down to 10% with a good size.
> 
> ...


I think you'll shrink dramatically if you cut down to 10%


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> I answered your question
> 
> I can say @ 24 I was 12.5 - 13 stone. I'm a lot more muscular and stronger now than I was then. Over the years I have slowly increased my poundage's resulting in more muscle mass. As a younger man I had a high metabolism which meant I always looked ripped @ around 10% bf without even trying, I could burn energy for fun. Obviously as I have grown older (and wiser lol) *my metabolism has slowed *I have been able to pack on more muscle along with gaining some BF probably @ 17 -18% now which is within normal acceptable range for a healthy adult male. I'm still in my bulking phase until the end of march atm. Hoping to get down to 10% with a good size.
> 
> ...


Myth, you are just less active now.

Nope, Dorian had a big spurt from 92-93 (GH no doubt) then was only adding a few pounds a year at the most after that.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

> I answered your question
> 
> I can say @ 24 I was 12.5 - 13 stone. I'm a lot more muscular and stronger now than I was then. Over the years I have slowly increased my poundage's resulting in more muscle mass. As a younger man I had a high metabolism which meant I always looked ripped @ around 10% bf without even trying, I could burn energy for fun. Obviously as I have grown older (and wiser lol) my metabolism has slowed I have been able to pack on more muscle along with gaining some BF probably @ 17 -18% now which is within normal acceptable range for a healthy adult male. I'm still in my bulking phase until the end of march atm. Hoping to get down to 10% with a good size.
> 
> ...


I like you posts, and Banzi seems to have it in for you. But you are giving them ammunition with these bodyfat figures you quote, having seen your pics.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

NovemberDelta said:


> I like you posts, and *Banzi seems to have it in for you*. But you are giving them ammunition with these bodyfat figures you quote, having seen your pics.


Seriously mate, its just a forum, I like the guy.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

banzi said:


> Seriously mate, its just a forum, I like the guy.


I know, I mean in context.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

NovemberDelta said:


> I know, I mean in context.


Ah right,

The comment about a slowing metabolism doesn't wash, if hes more muscular now than when he was younger then his metabolism would be faster.

A slowing metabolism with age is down to decrease in muscle mass as we get older.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

banzi said:


> Ah right,
> 
> The comment about a slowing metabolism doesn't wash, if hes more muscular now than when he was younger then his metabolism would be faster.
> 
> A slowing metabolism with age is down to decrease in muscle mass as we get older.


Trying to be natural is an absolute nightmare. I don't know why he defends it so much. I have been trying to lose weight for about a year on SNRis, no dice. If I took AAS I could do it (from experience). If I could tolerate AAS I would take, but I just get anxious on them, even just test. I am prone to this. Even if it is placebo it is still powerful.

I don't really see the honour/argument about being natty. It's just a choice, everyone works hard regardless. If you take AAS you can do things that are completely impossible for a natural trainer. No sour grapes, just experience and observation.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

NovemberDelta said:


> Trying to be natural is an absolute nightmare. I don't know why he defends it so much. I have been trying to lose weight for about a year on SNRis, no dice. If I took AAS I could do it (from experience). If I could tolerate AAS I would take, but I just get anxious on them, even just test. I am prone to this. Even if it is placebo it is still powerful.
> 
> I don't really see the honour/argument about being natty. It's just a choice, everyone works hard regardless. If you take AAS you can do things that are completely impossible for a natural trainer. No sour grapes, just experience and observation.


I have never argued his natty status, its irrelevant to any discussions we have had.

his claim to be natty doesnt match his stats, we do however know his stats are incorrect.


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## SkinnyJ (Apr 21, 2012)

> I answered your question
> 
> I can say @ 24 I was 12.5 - 13 stone. I'm a lot more muscular and stronger now than I was then. Over the years I have slowly increased my poundage's resulting in more muscle mass. As a younger man I had a high metabolism which meant I always looked ripped @ around 10% bf without even trying, I could burn energy for fun. Obviously as I have grown older (and wiser lol) my metabolism has slowed I have been able to pack on more muscle along with gaining some BF probably @ 17 -18% now which is within normal acceptable range for a healthy adult male. I'm still in my bulking phase until the end of march atm. Hoping to get down to 10% with a good size.
> 
> ...


17-18% BF lolol Dreamer.

Starting to think you're a natty troll.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

banzi said:


> I have never argued his natty status, its irrelevant to any discussions we have had.
> 
> his claim to be natty doesnt match his stats, we do however know his stats are incorrect.


Oh yeah, I know you believe him. It is obvious from his pics that he is natural. I just think he claims this moral high ground on being natural that is inappropriate.

And the stats, yeah I don't know where that sh.t comes from he is just unrealistic.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

FelonE said:


> I think you'll shrink dramatically if you cut down to 10%


Yeah that maybe the case, I'll just wait and see but hey we all need a goal


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

Natty Steve said:


> Yeah that maybe the case' date=' I'll just wait and see but hey we all need a goal  [/quote']
> 
> Not having a dig mate. When I cut natty I wasted away lol.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

NovemberDelta said:


> I like you posts, and Banzi seems to have it in for you. But you are giving them ammunition with these bodyfat figures you quote, having seen your pics.


Yeah may be so but its fun lol We will just have to wait and see what I can achieve naturally. If I surpass the doubters expectations they will all just cry ASS... I cant really win on this one lol


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> Seriously mate, its just a forum, I like the guy.


Likewise.....

If you cant have a discussion with someone on here it would be a sad place....We have different views on some things but on the whole we tend to agree.... :thumbup1:


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

banzi said:


> I have never argued his natty status, its irrelevant to any discussions we have had.
> 
> his claim to be natty doesnt match his stats, we do however know his stats are incorrect.


can you expand on this?


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

SkinnyJ said:


> 17-18% BF lolol Dreamer.
> 
> Starting to think you're a natty troll.


Its your post that is trolling for response so here it is........Go do some squats.....


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## FlunkyTurtle (Aug 5, 2013)

> Its your post that is trolling for response so here it is........Go do some squats.....


why does this forum always end up on everyone hating each other lol

Chill bitches!

I don't blame them for lying, i would do the same as the rest of the world just doesn't understand it and you wouldn't be sponsored as people wouldn't buy your **** if they knew it was steroids and hard work not the latest and greatest creatine ****.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

> Its your post that is trolling for response so here it is........Go do some squats.....


Seriously though mate. You asked Banzi to expnd on his "incorrect stats" comment. You are just totally, utterly, wildly out with yuor bodyfat estimates. They are far more than your estimates. In my opinion you look good, strong, big, trained in the context of a natural trainer. But you are not at these BF levels.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

NovemberDelta said:


> Oh yeah, I know you believe him. It is obvious from his pics that he is natural. I just think he claims this moral high ground on being natural that is inappropriate.
> 
> And the stats, yeah I don't know where that sh.t comes from he is just unrealistic.


Ok guys what moral high ground are you talking about? I am what I am simple as that. My stats are what they are so get over it. Ive been training for over 30 years off and on so I might have gained some muscle throughout that time. I'm not making this [email protected] up.... your welcome to believe and think what you like as your opinions don't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Just because something cant be labeled or categorized or put neatly in a box doesn't mean its not true!

I'm happy to invite anyone along to come and train with me drop me a PM and take it from there. Srs.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

NovemberDelta said:


> Seriously though mate. You asked Banzi to expnd on his "incorrect stats" comment. You are just totally, utterly, wildly out with yuor bodyfat estimates. They are far more than your estimates. In my opinion you look good, strong, big, trained in the context of a natural trainer. But you are not at these BF levels.


Ok so what do you recon honestly.


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

> Ok so what do you recon honestly.


Put a clear topless front pic up mate.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

FlunkyTurtle said:


> why does this forum always end up on everyone hating each other lol
> 
> Chill bitches!
> 
> I don't blame them for lying, i would do the same as the rest of the world just doesn't understand it and you wouldn't be sponsored as people wouldn't buy your **** if they knew it was steroids and hard work not the latest and greatest creatine ****.


Of course they're not gonna admit it.

But it's just their reaction to the question, their PR team should at least give them a few pointers on how to lie convincingly, they looked like a couple of school kids that had been caught out by the teacher. ::laugh:


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

> Ok so what do you recon honestly.


I don't know mate. From the post you have made I can't tell. From the "back fat" photos, maybe 25-30. But at the end of the day, who cares? If oyu ask me you look good, you train hard and you are big. But not 17%


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> can you expand on this?


I wouldnt need to if you expanded on your BF% level.


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## banzi (Mar 9, 2014)

> Ok so what do you recon honestly.


from your avi, 30% minimum.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

FelonE said:


> Put a clear topless front pic up mate.


Yeah I will do mate, but all in good time. :wink:


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## lewishart (Mar 13, 2012)

Simeon likes being sponsored my MP.... and all the other endorsements etc.

He cant disclose anything, because it by law breaches his contract and he would be stricken off instantly.

Its as simple as that.


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## lewishart (Mar 13, 2012)

> Ok so what do you recon honestly.


Stick up a front photo.

I would say 25%


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/natural-bodybuilding/178495-ukms-natty-physiques.html

There's some short clips here mostly covered though last post.


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## SelflessSelfie (May 25, 2014)

FelonE said:


> Not having a dig mate. When I cut natty I wasted away lol.


This is one of the main reasons I decided to start using AAS. I can get big natty, but get fat. I can cut down natty but lose a lot of what I gained and feel like **** towards the end of it.

Back on cycle in a week and I'm hoping to drop 5-8% body fat in fifteen weeks and still maintain my weight.

Fvck being natty and proud, I'd rather get somewhere from the effort I put in and feel good. Not feel ****e and take ten steps backwards every time I wanna lose some fat.

Fvck Simeon Panda, the lying cvnt. He could at least just dodge the question. We all could have something on the line with gear use, but there are other ways to stop people asking without fvcking lying.


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## TheScam (Apr 30, 2013)

lewishart said:


> Simeon likes being sponsored my MP.... and all the other endorsements etc.
> 
> He cant disclose anything, because it by law breaches his contract and he would be stricken off instantly.
> 
> Its as simple as that.


I get that, but don't you think its wrong? Like @Natty Steve'o said , there will be young, influential kids looking up to guys like this who clearly juice but deny it. They are being led up a garden path by these people lying to them.

By far the worst though are magazines like Mens Fitness featuring Hollywood movie stars and giving you their "routines" as if you'll be able to get a body like theirs if you follow it.


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## lewishart (Mar 13, 2012)

Scammell29 said:


> I get that, but don't you think its wrong? Like @Natty Steve'o said , there will be young, influential kids looking up to guys like this who clearly juice but deny it. They are being led up a garden path by these people lying to them.
> 
> By far the worst though are magazines like Mens Fitness featuring Hollywood movie stars and giving you their "routines" as if you'll be able to get a body like theirs if you follow it.


Such is life mate people have commitments and can't disclose (wrongly I admit) what they do or don't do.

But if you where paid 50k a year to be sponsored by a company, and on that sheet of paper you sign says you can't disclose IF you do any performance enhancers in interviews and otherwise the likes of, I think many would choose free supplements and cash and a free gym membership and deny it all.. Just being a realist.

But i do agree he and everybody's dog knows these guys are wacked on gear year around.

I knew this guy he at my old gym, he didn't compete and by my understanding wasn't sponsored, guy was 5% and thick dense hard and not to mention huge, he did have some of the best genetics I've seen (bloody black guys lol good at everything) and I asked him what do you take etc and he said protien powders I was like .... Okay mate sure lol.


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## Arnold999 (Sep 8, 2014)

Smitch said:


> Cue the army of natty believers.
> 
> "Just cos you can't do it naturally it's doesn't mean they can't"
> 
> ...


You can't get that muscle thickness and separation naturally ITS FICTION


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## Arnold999 (Sep 8, 2014)

lewishart said:


> Such is life mate people have commitments and can't disclose (wrongly I admit) what they do or don't do.
> 
> But if you where paid 50k a year to be sponsored by a company, and on that sheet of paper you sign says you can't disclose IF you do any performance enhancers in interviews and otherwise the likes of, I think many would choose free supplements and cash and a free gym membership and deny it all.. Just being a realist.
> 
> ...


he said protien powders ((I was like ....)) HAHAHA


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## SkinnyJ (Apr 21, 2012)

> Its your post that is trolling for response so here it is........Go do some squats.....


Seems legit..

No trolling here. There is no way you are under 20% BF.


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## JonnyBoy81 (Jun 26, 2013)

if these guys had been taking gear for x amount of years, wouldn't it be out by now??

how do they keep it secret? must be a few peeps in the know, if they do it and could make an excellent story if they blabbed..

i don't believe they are natty, but denying 'juice' when there are plenty of other PEDS out there, they don't necessarily have had to inject.

just wonder how they keep it a secret if there was a chance it could all leak out and they would be complete liars etc.

not that i give a **** but their fans might..


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## b0t13 (Jan 3, 2013)

JonnyBoy81 said:


> if these guys had been taking gear for x amount of years, wouldn't it be out by now??
> 
> how do they keep it secret? must be a few peeps in the know, if they do it and could make an excellent story if they blabbed..
> 
> ...


They'll jab at home or with other juicers from the gym, unless his house gets raided and they find it then anyone who says he's using will be called a hater or something lol, the whole industry is a bunch of lies as the only things that work are AAS but these companies make millions from useless supps lol, us guys on this forum are a very small knowledgeable 'group' whereas 95% of the cash comes from noobs and part time trainers


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

If they are natural, I am Barack Obama


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## AlexB18 (Dec 10, 2013)

Of course hes natural, its all the free MP creatine he gets.

Not srs


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## RocoElBurn (May 31, 2010)

I'm honestly passed caring about such things. As an unassisted trainer myself, I used to ponder it, especially training alongside Sim at my old gym, but I know what really counts for me, is me. If I want to achieve more than I am, I either need to work harder, smarter, assisted, or a combination of those things. That's it. We are not all equal, and some will do better, with gear, without gear, and unfortunately at times with or without knowledge :O/


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## Mogadishu (Aug 29, 2014)

Christian Boeving - YouTube

Boeving got dropped by his sponsor for admitting use of steroids. Is he the only one with balls in the industry?


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## GeordieOak70 (Sep 16, 2013)

Mogadishu said:


> Christian Boeving - YouTube
> 
> Boeving got dropped by his sponsor for admitting use of steroids. Is he the only one with balls in the industry?


Depends if he's using HCG or not id guess.


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