# Low dose (3iu) growth, any point?



## Suprakill4

Do you see much benefit on 3iu of hgh when using it pre fasted cardio whilst eating for size? Unfortunately this is as much as i can afford to run, over a long period so im just wandering if theres any point.


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## MRSTRONG

i was just thinking the same this morning but 2iu everyday for 1 year .


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## Sureno

I was running 4iu for about 6 months but now I'm running 8iu as using test and slin


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## Suprakill4

How did you find it sureno?? The reason i ask is finanacially its all i can afford. What i want from the gh isnt muscle growth, thats why i use aas and eat copious ammounts of food, what i want it for is to stay relatively lean so will use pre fasted cardio. They will hopefully be kigtropin.....


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## Rick89

I cant comment fully as have never used but I Asked Pscarb if 4iu over 6 months was worth doing and he said that there would be decent results


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## Suprakill4

Rick89 said:


> I cant comment fully as have never used but I Asked Pscarb if 4iu over 6 months was worth doing and he said that there would be decent results


Nice one mate, 3 iu may be OK then......


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## MRSTRONG

from what i know about hgh is that its a length drug not a large dose short cycle thing , 2iu over 1 year might not be enough maybe 4 iu ed for 1 year would be , cant talk price but its fairly cheap to run at 2-3-4 iu ed for 6 - 12 months imo ..


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## Sureno

Suprakill4 said:


> How did you find it sureno?? The reason i ask is finanacially its all i can afford. What i want from the gh isnt muscle growth, thats why i use aas and eat copious ammounts of food, what i want it for is to stay relatively lean so will use pre fasted cardio. They will hopefully be kigtropin.....


Well I stayed lean, was taking T4 with it too, I'm on hyge and sides lasted about 2 months, but I just put up with them as they where not unbearable. I usually train first thing anyway so don't eat before the gym. I want cell growth tbh

Also afaik pscarb uses pharma grade HGH so in Essenes 2iu is equivalent to 8+iu of gen stuff


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## MRSTRONG

Sureno said:


> Well I stayed lean, was taking T4 with it too, I'm on hyge and sides lasted about 2 months, but I just put up with them as they where not unbearable. I usually train first thing anyway so don't eat before the gym. I want cell growth tbh


what would you suggest is minimal needed for cell growth ? as the more muscle cells the more fat is burnt .


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## Suprakill4

Sureno said:


> Well I stayed lean, was taking T4 with it too, I'm on hyge and sides lasted about 2 months, but I just put up with them as they where not unbearable. I usually train first thing anyway so don't eat before the gym. I want cell growth tbh
> 
> Also afaik pscarb uses pharma grade HGH so in Essenes 2iu is equivalent to 8+iu of gen stuff


And you used 4iu of genuine hyge, which is pharma right?

Is kigtropin pharma? Sorry im a little clueless about hgh. I may just give it a shot then and see what happens at 3iu per day, and t4?


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## Sureno

Hyge is one of the better gen, pharma is [email protected] mega money.

I could only afford 4iu a day but for cell growth 5iu+ I believe


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## hilly

Suprakill4 said:


> Do you see much benefit on 3iu of hgh when using it pre fasted cardio whilst eating for size? Unfortunately this is as much as i can afford to run, over a long period so im just wandering if theres any point.


If ure in the off season and not dieting particularly i would look to run 7iu pwo or pre bed 3 x a week personally presuming u can afford 3iu per day.

Also it depends on the type of growth u are going to use.

if dieting id be tempted to try 1.5iu pre cardio and the same pre bed daily or 4iu split the same mon-fri


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## Suprakill4

hilly said:


> If ure in the off season and not dieting particularly i would look to run 7iu pwo or pre bed 3 x a week personally presuming u can afford 3iu per day.
> 
> Also it depends on the type of growth u are going to use.
> 
> if dieting id be tempted to try 1.5iu pre cardio and the same pre bed daily or 4iu split the same mon-fri


Yes im off season and bulking mate, the only reason i want to use it is for the fat burning properties not for muscle growth as this is limited ammount anyway... thats why i suggested running it 7 days a week, 3iu pre fasted cardio as will do cardio every day if i can as got too high bodyfat at the minute.... no idea what to do now. GHRP i have used with cjc at 100mcg a day 3 x per day and to be honest noticed nothing at all with it, this is another reason i wanted to try growth to be honest. and pinning 3 times a day is very difficult when working....


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## 3752

Suprakill4 said:


> Do you see much benefit on 3iu of hgh when using it pre fasted cardio whilst eating for size? Unfortunately this is as much as i can afford to run, over a long period so im just wandering if theres any point.


yes there is a point Hyge(tribal top) is decent GH brand probably the best non Pharma GH around.....



Sureno said:


> Well I stayed lean, was taking T4 with it too, I'm on hyge and sides lasted about 2 months, but I just put up with them as they where not unbearable. I usually train first thing anyway so don't eat before the gym. I want cell growth tbh
> 
> Also afaik pscarb uses pharma grade HGH so in Essenes 2iu is equivalent to 8+iu of gen stuff


who said this? GH is GH 2iu is 2iu the difference is the purity and the dose being exact, the problem with cheap generic relabelled crap like Kig's, Rips etc.......are unreliable with the dose, when they first come out they are notorious;y overdosed to create a buzz(those who used Kigs when they first came out and lately can vouch for this) but the dose will vary from batch to batch some containing the 10iu advertised some others between 4-8iu's.....


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## ausbuilt

Suprakill4 said:


> How did you find it sureno?? The reason i ask is finanacially its all i can afford. What i want from the gh isnt muscle growth, thats why i use aas and eat copious ammounts of food, what i want it for is to stay relatively lean so will use pre fasted cardio. They will hopefully be kigtropin.....


i've tried 2iu.. and 12iu (for 3months)... apart from a bit of carpal tunnel and increased water retention, i can't say 12iu did anything for me..

I stick to 2iu for anti-aging purposes, and it think its great for as i'm over 40, and I have anti-aging doc.. (who says 2iu is a bit to much.. LOL).

however for fat loss, especially with 'slin... DNP is cheap and provides amazing results..

if GH was great for fat loss.. half the people on UK-M should be shredded.. but here's the secret why not (wish i realised this before wasting money on 12iu..): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citric_acid_cycle

read that link.. pay particular attention to what happens to fats- they first get broken down to fatty acids and gycerol.. the glycerol is converted in the liver to glucose... IN THE ABSENCE OF further glucose, glycogen in the liver.. fatty acids are used for energy...

Now GH increases the RELEASE of fatty acids (free fatty acids, FFA's) by about 35%... problem is wont happen unless you're in a fasted state with a liver empty of glycogen..


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## Raptor

Pscarb said:


> who said this? GH is GH 2iu is 2iu the difference is the purity and the dose being exact, the problem with cheap generic relabelled crap like Kig's, Rips etc.......are unreliable with the dose, when they first come out they are notorious;y overdosed to create a buzz(those who used Kigs when they first came out and lately can vouch for this) but the dose will vary from batch to batch some containing the 10iu advertised some others between 4-8iu's.....


That concerns me what you say about rips and kigs as i have used both and they seemed gtg, i was planning to use Kigs for my cycle in jan but i am unsure on dose and also the best way to protocol it, people have got all sorts of ideas about carbs blunting the effect of HGH... is there any truth to this? Would it be worth splitting a 5iu jab in to 2 x 2.5iu? As there are some that say you better absorb it that way


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## Sureno

@pscarb I remember you saying 2iu of pharma usually gave similar results to that of a high dose of gen. I'm fully aware an iu is just a measurement, what I was trying to bring to the attention of the OP was a question of quality assurance or a dosing issue poor gen products often require a higher iu to match the effects of a lower iu dose of pharma grade HGH. Is this correct? And yes from experience and consensus on the board, hygetropin appear to be at the higher end of the scale in regards to quality of gen HGH


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## Suprakill4

I have researches loads on kigs today an it's got so many good comment both in the past and up to date but your post makes me worry now pscarb.

So ausbuilt I was planing in using the kigs at 3iu pre fasted cardio so will this work for fat reduction in thst scenario? Thanks for everyones help.


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## ausbuilt

Suprakill4 said:


> I have researches loads on kigs today an it's got so many good comment both in the past and up to date but your post makes me worry now pscarb.
> 
> So ausbuilt I was planing in using the kigs at 3iu pre fasted cardio so will this work for fat reduction in thst scenario? Thanks for everyones help.


generics do work.. dosing may be out by a bit, but that may mean you're getting 1.7 iu when you think you're using 2.0 and vice versa.

As for fasted cardio.. on the right track... but really you need to try an alternate day fasting protocol.. you lose the benefit once you eat...


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## Suprakill4

Ok thanks for that mate. Suppose even the anti ageing benefits will be nice  . Suppose can give it a try an see how I go on.


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## Sureno

Suprakill4 said:


> Ok thanks for that mate. Suppose even the anti ageing benefits will be nice  . Suppose can give it a try an see how I go on.


How old are you btw?


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## Suprakill4

25 mate.


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## matsu

hi guys

ive been using 2ui 4/5 days on 2 off for 5 weeks and enjoying a little HRT effects-my boyfat levels are def better-my diet good 85% of the time

my skin better-havent had the euphoric zest for life i read about in a few places lol- in fact ive felt a little tired and almost spaced out at times- ive been followingt a reltively ketogenic based diet-and i,m thirsty alot more than i can remember- these can be signs of diabetes- is there any relation between gh and onset of diabetes..... esp if there is family history?

wanted to ask here before i hit the docs......

thanks in advance

matsu


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## ausbuilt

matsu said:


> hi guys
> 
> ive been using 2ui 4/5 days on 2 off for 5 weeks and enjoying a little HRT effects-my boyfat levels are def better-my diet good 85% of the time
> 
> my skin better-havent had the euphoric zest for life i read about in a few places lol- in fact ive felt a little tired and almost spaced out at times- ive been followingt a reltively ketogenic based diet-and i,m thirsty alot more than i can remember- these can be signs of diabetes- is there any relation between gh and onset of diabetes..... esp if there is family history?
> 
> wanted to ask here before i hit the docs......
> 
> thanks in advance
> 
> matsu


my anti-aging doc says 2iu is overdosing... he recommends closer to 1iu daily.. also, he provides a t4/t3 mix (a black market version is Bi-Tiron from turkey i think); at the very least 100mcg of t4/day helps most who feel lethargic- apparently its an indication your body is unable to provide enough t4 to convert to t3 owing to the greater T requirements of GH; and there is a process in the conversion of t4 to t3 thats is needed for the conversion of GH to IGF-1 (which is what does the wanted effects on the body).


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## matsu

thanks for the input mate

ill think ill cut dosage down for few weeks to 1ui and see how i feel.

honestly....i feel like **** today!

and then i might have to add some t4 into the mix.

been thinking of getting bloods done anyway but that would mean stopping the "hrt" for couple of weeks to get an honest result.

sorry if this a threadjack-but it might help others in the process.

matsu


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## Sureno

ausbuilt said:


> my anti-aging doc says 2iu is overdosing... he recommends closer to 1iu daily.. also, he provides a t4/t3 mix (a black market version is Bi-Tiron from turkey i think); at the very least 100mcg of t4/day helps most who feel lethargic- apparently its an indication your body is unable to provide enough t4 to convert to t3 owing to the greater T requirements of GH; and there is a process in the conversion of t4 to t3 thats is needed for the conversion of GH to IGF-1 (which is what does the wanted effects on the body).


Would the T4 still be 2 on 2 off?


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## 3752

Generics do work but the dosing is inconsistant and that is where the problem lies........as for thyroid meds if you have a normal within range thyroid level you do not need to use them with GH the effect they will give will be the same as a ECA or clen stack as they will increase the metabolism........


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## dt36

I have been on 2iu of Pharma growth (Humatrope) for 11 months, also on Testogel at present.

The first six months did not really show any noticeable fatloss, but i was also taking insulin. I then dropped the insulin, and added a GHRP & GHRF (branded as CJC ). Since then I have noticed fatloss by dropping 2 belt holes with little change in my training. Diet is probably slightly cleaner too through the week.

In truth, I believe that GH is slightly over-rated and is not the Holy Grail people think it is. Don't get me wrong, health wise it is great, but at 2iu don't expect great results size or fatloss wise. This though is only my experience and could be different for others.

On a downside, I came back from Afghanistan in August, where I got heavily bit by some typre of fly on my leg, so decided to have my bloods done. The results were clear for malaria, but my hemoglobin count was too high at 18.5gm/dL. Normal results vary, but in general are 13.8 to 17.2 gm/dL for a male. I am not sure if this is related to what I've been taking, but I would be interested if anyone else has noticed this if they have had their bloods done with long term GH or Peptide use.

Paul Scarb, I don't know if you remember, but when I was at The Citadel and trained with you, this is why I stopped my useage of heavy anabolics. I was giving a pint a week then to keep my red bloods down. That sorted it out, so I am curious now as to why its gone back up, when I don't do the heavy doses any more...

Could just be a coincidence, but again, I am interested if anyone else has had a high result and why?


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## dt36

Just looking at the post concerning T3 & T4 meds, my bloods results showed no abnormalities regarding thyroid levels after 11 months of GH use.


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## 3752

Dale yes mate i remember, not sure if it is connected but i will ask Dat on his forum he will know......hope you are well mate?


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## matsu

ok thanks guys- how about the hypo symptoms?

i have felt off my head at times today?

matsu


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## Raptor

matsu said:


> ok thanks guys- how about the hypo symptoms?
> 
> i have felt off my head at times today?
> 
> matsu


Not sure about going Hypo on HGH, the reason i say this is because earlier on in the year i was confused to why my blood glucose would rise after doing morning fasted cardio when i did a BG test. It turned out that it was likely because i was doing some HGH before the cardio, it elevated my BG for a short period after each jab so i can't see it sending you hypo tbh as thats signs of having a low BG


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## matsu

how long if i stop jabs,before i can get an honest bloodtest done at the docs-ill tell him the score but i want the blood test to be able to give me a true reading.

thanks guys

matsu


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## vigdor

I think that if you naturally produce little GH, a low as 2 IU a day can make a difference.


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## Papa Lazarou

I personally used 2iu ED for months on end and I stay fairly lean. I used rips.


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## Suprakill4

Papa Lazarou said:


> I personally used 2iu ED for months on end and I stay fairly lean. I used rips.


Nice one mate, thats what im looking for, was this pre morning cardio or at another time?

Im hoping to not just stay at same bodyfat as i am, but get leaner with addition of the gh and cardio which i havnt done for over 6 months.


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## Papa Lazarou

I did it PostWO


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## Suprakill4

ok thanks mate, have you tired both ways and could you tell a difference?

Sorry for all the daft question, i really have researched and just want to get this right.


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## Papa Lazarou

Personally, can't tell the difference. That said, couldn't personally see a difference between 2iu and 5iu either!


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## Suprakill4

ah right ok mate, was very reluctant to even bother with 3iu as sounds such a low dose compared to what i see others use but by the sounds of it, i will benefit quite well off this and financially can JUST afford this.


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## J.Smith

Interesting by ausbuilt...so for fat loss...eod fasting would be ideal..with using hgh on days when you fast?


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## james12345

make sure you jab IM


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## ausbuilt

Suprakill4 said:


> ah right ok mate, was very reluctant to even bother with 3iu as sounds such a low dose compared to what i see others use but by the sounds of it, i will benefit quite well off this and financially can JUST afford this.


its plenty (in fact 2iu is fine) if you want fat loss, using the alternate day fast approach; 2iu is good for having joints that feel good etc as well..



J.Smith said:


> Interesting by ausbuilt...so for fat loss...eod fasting would be ideal..with using hgh on days when you fast?


yes, so instead of 2iu/day, do 2iu 2xday when fasting..



james12345 said:


> make sure you jab IM


absolutely no proof this offers quicker absorption than sub-q for HGH; IV is the only way for instant absorption...


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