# New steroid users - View before you go!



## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

I have produced some information to try and help people thinking about using steroids for the first time to enhance their physique (in terms of aesthetics, not perfromance)

The flow chart I have designed starts in the yellow box (starting 'do you'....)and the arrows will take you where you may need to go 

Its very subjective, open to debate and not conclusive interms of content or drugs used 

Big picture below as there is lots of info

Hope you you enjoy as I spent a few hours on it as there are many FAQs on this topic

If you want to view and save in a different format

http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/8472/flowcharttd1.jpg

I have the original jpeg to email if required

Not really after a debate on the drugs used or cycle choices in here


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## Captain Hero (Jun 13, 2004)

nice


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## justdiscovering (May 10, 2007)

easily understandable,time well spent there i think. reps!!!!!!


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## wogihao (Jun 15, 2007)

I have a question what about steriod use for strenght/power?

Otherwise yea, its good! :thumb:


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

thanks guys

Wogi

I generally find those looking for strength courses are already enthusiasts and competing in sports. On the whole they seem to be more erudite and have some idea of what they want to do. There is also the issue of age as many top athletes will be under 21 and close to the top of their sport. In these situations some may argue being 21 is not as much of an issue

I have made some massive sweping statements above but generally this seems to be more the way it is and the chart is aimed at those:

Who are unsure of the whole game and how serious it can be

Who have been given crap advice from the big lad in the gym

Who may not have had net access before

Who want to know "wot steds 2 take 2 get henched"


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## dogue (Nov 30, 2007)

Nice Lost Soul

Good visual aid for those blinded by, or too lazy to read words

Make it a sticky!


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## wogihao (Jun 15, 2007)

Ahh I understand, yes I agree.


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## Iron19 (Jan 18, 2008)

informative and to the point, nice one lostsoul:thumb:


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## Wee G1436114539 (Oct 6, 2007)

Another flow chart, coolios. I love flow charts (seriously). Critical path charts even more so. LS, dunno if im allowed to rep you today, but will try!


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## Thauruz (May 23, 2008)

If you resize a little bit would be a nice sticky!

Good one!


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

It loses its quality but if someone wants to have a go...be my guest, Im not that great at it


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

thats brilliant mate, good effort


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## Stig (Oct 8, 2007)

Spot on that mate, your still going to get someone ask silly questions, and will probably me when i plan my cycle towarsd the end of summer, but all my answers took me to the Test route.........


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## Ollie B (Mar 14, 2007)

thats worth the reps. Well done Lost Soul


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## marts_uk (May 9, 2007)

is 2 years realy long enough though?


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

Thanks for the comments folks



marts_uk said:


> is 2 years realy long enough though?


For some, yes, for others no but of course i stated in the post



> Its very subjective, open to debate and not conclusive interms of content or drugs used


Some people are ready earlier mentally, some later, some never. physically easy gains are made in 2 years but nobody will hit their genetic potential in 2 years. 2 years is a point where the trainer would be deemed serious and the later questions will confirm that. If they have been tw4tting about for 2 years swinging bicep curls then no, but you answer that question next


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## Captain Hero (Jun 13, 2004)

Marts, how many people actually train for 2 years before taking the plunge?


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## Mr.Elliott (May 26, 2008)

realy interesting, could help to clear peoples thoughts


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Nice job LS, just 1 small point it's too BIG. :lol:

PS, Only nolva on hand for gyno? What if you running 19 nor's?


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## 007 (Apr 27, 2008)

am sure last time i said running nolva with 19nors was a bad idea you said somethink like this..........no this is getting silly blar blar blar........i might be wrong tho but am sure it was you..... :tongue:



mars1960 said:


> Nice job LS, just 1 small point it's too BIG. :lol:
> 
> PS, Only nolva on hand for gyno? What if you running 19 nor's?


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

mars1960 said:


> Nice job LS, just 1 small point it's too BIG. :lol:
> 
> PS, Only nolva on hand for gyno? What if you running 19 nor's?


Size wise, it can be reduced, click the link and it will work

Have i nclude 19 nors on the starter list?


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Lost Soul said:


> Size wise, it can be reduced, click the link and it will work
> 
> Have i nclude 19 nors on the starter list?


After a second look, no you haven't. I'm just getting old mate, back in the day it was one of the first newbs used, how times have changed:lol:.

Weather thats good or bad, who can really say.

Anyways LS, still a good post pal.


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## Incredible Bulk (Sep 19, 2007)

for someone who wants to step on stage and has their diet and training nailed is it worth waiting the time it takes for gains to stop coming naturally?

someone could step on stage a good time earlier and gain vaulable experiance from competing compared to the guy who is taking the 'abide by all these steps' route.

respect for the time it took to draw up and post the diagram, this is not a post to provoke a reaction, more of an honest open answer.


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

mars1960 said:


> After a second look, no you haven't. I'm just getting old mate, back in the day it was one of the first newbs used, how times have changed:lol:.
> 
> Weather thats good or bad, who can really say.
> 
> Anyways LS, still a good post pal.


Back in the day blah blah blah :lol:



Incredible Bulk said:


> for someone who wants to step on stage and has their diet and training nailed is it worth waiting the time it takes for gains to stop coming naturally?
> 
> someone could step on stage a good time earlier and gain vaulable experiance from competing compared to the guy who is taking the 'abide by all these steps' route.
> 
> respect for the time it took to draw up and post the diagram, this is not a post to provoke a reaction, more of an honest open answer.


I will post what I stated the first time for the 3rd time



> Its very subjective, open to debate and not conclusive interms of content or drugs used


This is not aimed at those wishing to step on stage as they are 9 out of 10 times going to have read up on the route they wish to take. This is pitched at those who dont know what they are doing or been given sh1te info in their local gym


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## EDG301 (Oct 18, 2005)

Good Post!! Concerning Incredible Bulk's comment- yeah i think people should at least wait till they've matured (physically & mentally) and know what works best for them (training wise). I doubt anybody can truthfully say what works best for them until they've trained for at least 3-4years. I do agree though, nobody can reach they're natural ability unless they're rich, have alot of spare time, and are absolutely committed 110% to the bodybuilding lifestyle. And if they are- is it worth it?

However, I find it hard to understand people who have only trained for a year or 2 and decide to use AAS to further their gains, as normally it turns out to be a waste of time and money as they still don't understand their body and don't get as much out of it as they could do. just my opinion- welcome feedback


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## Incredible Bulk (Sep 19, 2007)

i agree with the above... i have been training on and off since my teens, took a few years training seriously before switching to MMA

now i'm back in bodybuilding i am thinking of kick starting my progress to get the ball rolling quicker to get on stage and to compete.

I am by no means a noob and did a cycle 5 years ago to great effect, its a case of either being in a position to compete in 2009 or 2010/11


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## EDG301 (Oct 18, 2005)

Bit off subject- but anyone else heard about the gov re-classifying AAS to class B?? Due to the olympics and them wanting to provide a good image.

Mayb this could be a thread starter?? Wat effects i any wud it have- good/bad?


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

wow thats well mint, ace post man

BIg BUMP!


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

bump to help people


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Very nice LS. I resized it but now it is hard to read. Should it be a tad bit bigger?


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

Thanks mate

It works ok as a jpeg...very hard to get it on here inside the size limit


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## 3weights (Jul 22, 2008)

new here,so saying hi,and got to say that diagrams top stuff,thanks dude.


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## darkiwi (Feb 25, 2008)

love it you must have the sweetest day job ever  rep


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## oggy1992 (Aug 13, 2007)

nice helpful post

added rep but 1st time iv done it dont have a clue if its done it lol


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

darkiwi said:


> love it you must have the sweetest day job ever  rep


Its easy, money is ok to good, cant complain 

Thanks for the kind words too


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## 2008S.S.S (Jul 21, 2008)

The charts really good but i've jus got sum questions about it:

1) is napalon a form of Dbol

2) is taking just napalon and winstrol a good idea

3) how would i cycle it? would i take napalon for 4 weeks then straight afters take winstrol for 4 weeks?

4) or would i take them all within 4 weeks if so do i take winstrol and napalon at the same time in the day or do i leave an hour in between?

5) PCT nolva is it important to take, what will happen if i didn't take anything for PCT.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE help me bro!!


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## Robsta (Oct 2, 2005)

lmao......

Bump for Lost Soul....


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## Impega-1 (Jul 23, 2008)

2008S.S.S said:


> The charts really good but i've jus got sum questions about it:
> 
> 1) is napalon a form of Dbol
> 
> ...


My god :whistling:

Forget steroids for at least another 2 years.


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## 2008S.S.S (Jul 21, 2008)

come people help me out.


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## 2008S.S.S (Jul 21, 2008)

wat if i take napalon for 4 weeks then winstrol for 4 weeks. would the naps bulk me then would the winstrol give my muscles more rip. then last talk milk thistle and novla for 3 weeks.

people help me out, give me sum advice.


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## Guest (Jul 23, 2008)

2008S.S.S said:


> The charts really good but i've jus got sum questions about it:
> 
> 1) is napalon a form of Dbol YES
> 
> ...


Great chart LS hadnt seen it till now.


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## adesign (Jun 10, 2008)

A quick question. If the charted cycle is followed to the T. Once the body has recovered would test levels return back to what they were previously before the cycle or is there a chance it will be even lower? I wont be doing it for quite a while, still seeing beginners gains  but its something iv been wondering about.


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

Robsta said:


> lmao......
> 
> Bump for Lost Soul....


You know i wont be able to help myself, so grab a coffee and sit back 



2008S.S.S said:


> The charts really good but i've jus got sum questions about it:
> 
> 1) is napalon a form of Dbol
> 
> ...


My standard response after trying to help many is (as in another thread)



Lost Soul said:


> fcuks sake mate
> 
> 4 of the same threads yesterday, people trying to help...
> 
> ...





2008S.S.S said:


> wat if i take napalon for 4 weeks then winstrol for 4 weeks. would the naps bulk me then would the winstrol give my muscles more rip. then last talk milk thistle and novla for 3 weeks.
> 
> people help me out, give me sum advice.


Ok, speak in english first

No, your diet dtermines rip..

advice, read the chart again and spend a long long time researching



Con said:


> Great chart LS hadnt seen it till now.


Thanks mate, I have tried to give something back to the board for the new users, shame things like these post above appear asking questions that are easily answered 



adesign said:


> A quick question. If the charted cycle is followed to the T. Once the body has recovered would test levels return back to what they were previously before the cycle or is there a chance it will be even lower? I wont be doing it for quite a while, still seeing beginners gains  but its something iv been wondering about.


depends to what extent your axis is fcuked mate.....PCT (ie 3 weeks of nolva and clomid) isnt the end of PCT, thats starting it off and endogenous test will take time time recover to base levels and the suppression will be down to length of cycle, meds used, doses used, PCT, anti catabolic protocol in PCT etc etc


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## Tinytom (Sep 16, 2005)

While I do share your sentiments LS I have to point you towards the 'no flaming of newbies' rule.



Nice chart BTW.


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## 2008S.S.S (Jul 21, 2008)

u haven't answered my question?


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## Tinytom (Sep 16, 2005)

Let me try before you get flamed out of the board

You havent really done enough research on this.

Anapolon is not the best to use.

Winstrol will not cut you

Gear is only the icing mate, if you arent seeing progress at the moment with your training then assess your diet and training methods first then use gear to finish it off.


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## 2008S.S.S (Jul 21, 2008)

thank you tinytom.


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## Robsta (Oct 2, 2005)

I think LS should be in charge of "newbie advice" and we can just send him the 20 daily "dbolz innit" threads....


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## Lost Soul (Apr 5, 2008)

Tinytom said:


> While I do share your sentiments LS I have to point you towards the 'no flaming of newbies' rule.


Sure mate, taken on board 



Robsta said:


> I think LS should be in charge of "newbie advice" and we can just send him the 20 daily "dbolz innit" threads....


It will only add fuel to the fire that roid rage exists 



2008S.S.S said:


> u haven't answered my question?


I have, read the chart and research the names of drugs

Tom has since been kinder, yet less artiscally blessed by truning pictures into words for you


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## JJH (Sep 19, 2008)

Sorry for digging up an old thread but couldn't help myself.

Great post, loving the flow chart, and extremely vital info to me right now.

Big thank you.


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## scotty6661436114635 (Jun 9, 2009)

good post L.S. i will train longer.


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## bentleymiller (May 11, 2009)

Superb Post Lost Soul.

Please email me [email protected] I need to discuss a matter with you.

Thanks

David


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

bentleymiller said:


> Superb Post Lost Soul.
> 
> Please email me [email protected] I need to discuss a matter with you.
> 
> ...


You'll be lucky, he banned himself a year ago, you might try and PM him to see if it is still linked to his email.


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## Mr Eko (Apr 16, 2009)

mars1960 said:


> You'll be lucky, he banned himself a year ago, you might try and PM him to see if it is still linked to his email.


he banned himself? :confused1: what he do


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## rhino matt (Mar 9, 2009)

spot on lost sole, like it.


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## pds999 (Jun 4, 2008)

Just seen LS's chart for the first time. Superb. Nice one LS.


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## oxo (Jul 18, 2009)

after reading through many, many hours worth of posts and being left more and more confused thats a real help looking at that chart. spot on!


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## stevenE (Jun 4, 2009)

nice post LS


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## newby79 (Sep 27, 2009)

good chart to follow,thanks.

i have done a cycle of d-bol for 6 weeks before,now gonna start a new cycle.lost alot of size and strenght after cycle finished,any advise to keep what i earnt please? also am thinking about some anti estrogen,had no issues before but better safe than sorry,any advice would be great......cheers


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## Bazooka Tooth (Apr 7, 2009)

kool


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## huge monguss (Apr 5, 2011)

glad a signed up to this web site now some realy useful information for people like me


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## Fullhouse (Mar 31, 2010)

First time I've seen this, should be a sticky imo


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## Peacock7 (Mar 10, 2013)

I can't read it how do i make it bigger?


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## DeadlyCoobra (Oct 16, 2011)

Yeah i literally cannot read it at all, even if i view the original image its still not big enough, and if i zoom in its too fuzzy, am i doing something wrong? i want to have a read!


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## AlwaysANewb (Dec 2, 2012)

Both the one hosted on the forum and the link are very low resolution to me, I can't read any text. All the rest of you see it ok?


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## lambrettalad (May 3, 2012)

AlwaysANewb said:


> Both the one hosted on the forum and the link are very low resolution to me, I can't read any text. All the rest of you see it ok?


same for me, cant read either:confused1:


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## m575 (Apr 4, 2010)

Wow 2008. Don't think he's about anymore


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## lambrettalad (May 3, 2012)

m575 said:


> Wow 2008. Don't think he's about anymore


lol, yeah I just saw that!!


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## adder (Jun 3, 2013)

I'm unable to view jpeg also, want to PM 'lost soul' but can't find the link to do that.

Can anyone help myself and others view this as it is a sticky


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## trying to get b (Sep 6, 2013)

I am a new usee.i just started sus 350 and D ball.only thing i ever took was omadren 250.am i ok doing one 350 shot a week amd one 25mg D ball every day.


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## 1010AD (May 30, 2009)

I tried reading this in 2009 and my eye sight has got much worse now. Looks interesting so can anyone edit it so we can read it when enlarged on a phone.

Please


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## Bob &amp; Weave (Apr 28, 2012)

after a bit of googling i found this...

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/beanz1/media/flowcharttd1.jpg.html


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