# My Routine



## Biggum (Sep 1, 2004)

I've kept an eye on this site for a while now, and thought it was about time I started taking things a little bit more seriousy, I'm not exactly a beginner I'm 32 next month and I've been training for almost 6 years now for what all too often seems like meager results, which I always complain about, especially when all around me seem to be getting massive!!!. I consider myself a fairly positive person when it comes to training, but find it difficult to keep focus as I seem to have been on a plateau forever...

Anyway, instead of moaning about it I've decided to take action, which is where You guys come in!!!. To start with my diet is good, in a nutshell I have 6 meals a day 2 of which are MR's the rest consist of roughly 30grams protein from my source of choice chicken (Hate Tuna) and a good source of clean carbs (brown rice, pasta or potato). I also eat at least 4 pieces of fruit a day, and I have saturdays off!. I take a good multivitamin (optimen) and use pro creatine (the dorian yates stuff). Any advice here would be appreciated.

For CV I cycle 25 miles a day 5 days a week 12.5 in morning and 12.5 in the evening (it's my comute to work).

I train 4 days a week as follows:

after each set I increase the weight for all excercises

Sunday Shoulders and Traps

Seated military press 4 sets + 1 drop set

Standing Arnold press 4 sets

Dumbell Lateral raise 4 sets

Machine rear delt 4 sets

Shrugs on hammer Press 4 sets

Standing dumbell shrugs 4 sets

Tuesday Chest and Tri's

Incline flies bench @ 30 degrees 4 sets + 1 dropset

Incline flies bench @ 45 degrees 4 sets + 1 dropset

Flat bench 4 sets

cable crossovers 4 sets

decline cable fly 4 sets

Thursday Back and bi's

lat pull downs 4 sets

deadlifts 4 sets

bent over dumbell rows 4 sets

ez bar curls 4 sets

hammer dumbells curls 4 sets

friday legs

squat 4 sets

hammer leg press 4 sets

leg ext 4 sets

hamstring curl 4 sets

machine calf raise 4 sets

calf raise dumbell in one hand 4 sets.

I addition i do abs at least twice a week. This is my regime at the moment and it's all subject to change. At the moment I train between 4 and 7 in the afternoon, it is possible i can train in the mornings if more days are required.

My weak points are upper chest, legs especially calfs, and despite all the cv and diet my gut is terrible especially round the love handles!!!, I blame it on my sedentary job (I sit in front of a computer all day).

Rough stats are as follows:

6'4" 220lbs (100kgs)

Chest 47"

bicep 17.5"

quad 24"

calf 16"

waist 34"


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## big (Sep 14, 2004)

It sounds like you're trying to do the classic "lose fat and gain mass" approach. You have found out over the past 6 years that this doesn't work particularly well. You need to pick one and focus on it.

If you're focus is on gaining mass, you're not eating anywhere near enough for the amount of cardio that you do. You also have no fats in your diet. Do you have any idea on your total calories and your exact breakdown of carbs/fat/protein.

You may well be overtraining too.


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## Biggum (Sep 1, 2004)

I am a bit sketchy on exact amounts of Protein, Carb and fats however I feel a little more detail on my diet would help. A typical day for me would start at about 6 am, when I have a bowl of porridge oats with a couple of scoops of protein supplement with semi skimmed milk, I then cycle to work. At 9 I will have a couple of boiled eggs in a wholemeal sandwich (2 slices) and an apple. at 12 I will have something like 200g of chicken breast with about the same of brown rice with red and green peppers for flavour followed by a banana. At 3pm I have a Protein shake an apple and a banana. If it's a training day I'll cycle to the gym at 4 train for about 60-75 minutes. Then I will have an MR straight after training, cycle home have Chicken breast and Jacket potato at around 8 and another protein shake before bed at 10ish if I'm lucky. 2 kids have to take priorty over my needs, that's why so many protein shakes (convenience).

In terms of "pick one and focus on it." My intention is to bulk up until early spring and then go for fat loss when the weather is better I find it like most a lot easier to eat less when it's warmer.

Overtraining, it has been said many times by people in the gym, I tried the HIT approach once, this sort of approach could well be the one for me, the only reason I didn't keep it up before is I have a training partner who is at best unreliable, fortunately for him he's one of those guys who only has to look at weights and he grows like a weed!!!.


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

diet is bad mate

try this

6am

keep the same

9am

4-6 whole eggs

salad cream/mayo

1-2 fruit

12pm

200g chicken (uncooked weight)

60g rice (uncooked weight)

2-3tsp oil

veg

3pm

can tuna

salad

2-3 tsp oil

vinegar

5 rice cakes

1 fruit

train 4-5pm (no more than 1 hour MAX)

5pm

50g whey in water

50g dextrose (optional)

6pm

steak

jacket potato

veg

cheese and butter if required

9pm

300g cottage cheese

salad

200g yogurt

1 fruit


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

you have too many excersizes per muscle group

pick 2-3 depending on muscle

warm up for 30 reps (till failure)

x1 med 8-10 reps

x1 heavy 6-8 reps

x1 triple drop 6/6/6 reps

then move on to next excersize

if done correctly you need no more, trust me


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## Biggum (Sep 1, 2004)

Thanks for the advice Jimmy, with regards to the diet, is that every day? or does it differ on non training days, is there a day off?. You will have to forgive all the dumb questions, I train mostly alone at a fitness first gym and don't get exposure to your level of obvious know how, to my knowledge there's only one competetive bodybuilder who frequents my gym. So far my limited experience of bodybuilding comes from my 'bible' the encyclopedia of modern bodybuilding (Arnie), HIT (Mentzer) and Body for life (Bill Phillips). All very different approaches, perhaps my source of confusion?. By the way I checked out the forest gym website, very impressive, it gives me a degree of confidence I'm talking to the right guy!.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Well, for starters you need more than 30 grams of protein if you are eating potato, rice, and all that fruit.

I would up the protein to double that with each meal. 60 grams would be ok then the MRP's for the other are alright.

For shoulders 8 sets of shrugs I feel is too much. Just 4 will do.

You are already doing deadlifts anyway and they do hit traps.

I think you could rotate every other week with the Arnold presses and seated presses (never do behind the neck presses).

8 sets of military it too much.

Too many shaping/isolation movements for chest. You will be better off doing

Bench, Inclines, If you want to do a fly then you can do them last as the chest is pumped and with a good stretch you will stretch out the fascia. I would not do more than a couple of sets.

You wont pack on much size or strength doing flys and cable crossovers.

I did those for years (maybe 15) when I dropped them and went heavy on the pressing movements I got a bigger chest.

Could drop a set of bent over rows and all another thickening exercise for back like T-bar rows for like 3 sets.

Ok, you are doing 8 sets for calves and 4 sets for hamstrings? You dont have to do that many calve exercise drop them to 4 and get a good stretch at the bottom full range movement and stretch them out at the bottom. This will stretch the fascia out and allow more room for growth.

Maybe ad a set of Stiff leg dead lifts or maybe good mornings for a set or two.


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

eat like that ED but swap the pwo drink for a meal on non wo days if poss


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## Biggum (Sep 1, 2004)

Thanks Guys,

The advice on training should prove very helpful, I have a few questions though, I currently train 4 times a week Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday, Friday. These are days which a are convenient to me, but would I benefit from shorter routines on a more regular basis, I have heard conflicting views on this, some suggest up to 6 times a week for an hour a time, others say only 3.

Sorry it's all questions a the moment, after I've gathered enough info my plan is to post my new regime diet/training and get a response I shall then log my progress.


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## andy78139 (Oct 11, 2004)

biggum you seem confused which is understandable given there is alot of conflicting advice out there.

I suggest you start with a brief routine, e.g mike mentzer style and see how you progress from there. If you feel you need more sets or more often then do that. Start at 0 and work your way up if and when you need to. Its the only logical approach.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Well, I used to train with low volume and high intensity.

Lately (due to injuries), I train with high volume and low intensity.

I chose this way because I did not want to lay off but didnt want to make matters worse.

Most guys here are on a 4 day split routine.

Some pushing, some pulling.

Some just pushing, some just pulling.


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## Biggum (Sep 1, 2004)

Trained Back And Bi's yesterday as per Jimmy's advice

Lat Pull Down (wide grip)

Deadlift

T-Bar rows (Thanks Hackski)

Ez Curls

Hammer curls

Felt great, still had a job keeping it inside 1 hour, found high repetition warm ups difficult especially deadlifts, but definately felt the benefit on the heavier sets the triple drop is a killer (EZ ouch!!) hammers ended up really light!. Legs this evening.

Squat or Leg Press

Leg ext

Calf Raise

Straight leg dealift

What do ya reckon?


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2004)

I reckon if you put deadlifts first and made the pulldowns, chins or pullups, it would be an awesome workout. I also reckon you should put the SLDL's 2nd (and preferably make them RDL's) and ditch leg ext for any 1 of the 50 or so leg exercises that are 100x more productive.


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## skizxi (Sep 16, 2004)

I think you could rotate every other week with the Arnold presses and seated presses (never do behind the neck presses).

]whys that mate? i find it a good exercise, that works the rear delts more. i maybe wrong, but would like to know your opion why you think you shoudnt do it. :beer: cheers mate


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2004)

There is nothign wrong with a BTN press. Provided you don't bring the bar down past you ears. Arnold presses on the other hand are totally useless. IMO, of course


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I disagree with behind the neck presses and pulldowns.

This is not a natural movement to the shoulder.

The shoulder is the most complex joint in the body and injurying this is not good.

Hey, just ask me about shoulder injuries?

Do I do them?.............NO.

Will I do them?............NEVER!

Bad rotation on the shoulder. Gives you the best pump but just do dumbbells or bar, in front.


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2004)

Have you seen the bar postition in a full squat-Snatch at the midpoint Hackskii?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

directly overhead.

The bar is not behind the neck.

Look at the machanics of lets say pushing something overhead.

The natural movement is not with the object behind you or in back of you but in front of you, this is where the power is and this is where the least chance of injury is.

When you go behind the neck on the presses it rotates your shoulders out and your elbos out this is not natural shoulder rotation.

If you want to go and use dumbbells then this would be better but you cant go behind the neck with dumbbells, the body wont allow it.

If you dont believe my try it.


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## fits (Feb 3, 2004)

I prefer behind the neck press, the seem to hit more of my shoulder than the militry press! although I do think you have to take more care when doing them! i recently started to rotate behind the neck and Militry press, 4 to 6 weeks each!


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2004)

No it isn't. If you have ever seen, (or better still; done) an Overhead Squat, or Snatch, you'll know that the bar is about 2-3" behind the head.


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2004)

The bar shoudl be directly above the feet, which would place it behind the head.


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2004)

fits said:


> I prefer behind the neck press, the seem to hit more of my shoulder than the militry press! although I do think you have to take more care when doing them! i recently started to rotate behind the neck and Militry press, 4 to 6 weeks each!


Its not an isolation exercise! Use it carefully. You should never use a compound exercise to target 1 bodypart.


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## powerU (Oct 22, 2003)

I dislocated my shoulder using dumbells for shoulder presses - I stick to a bar now, and I do sometimes do behind the head presses, I won't touch dumbells for shoulder presses now though.


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2004)

You were probablly doing them with utterly awful form or a weight that was inexcess of 150% too heavy! I can't fathom how you managed to dislocate your shoudler with DB's. The whole point of them is its easier to control as you can tailor the ROM in 3 dimensions, not just 2 like a BB, or 1 like a machine.


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## powerU (Oct 22, 2003)

previously dislocated it twice - form was bang on, just a bit too much too soon for my shoulder.


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2004)

Ahhh. Ok then. Go lighter next time then eh?


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## powerU (Oct 22, 2003)

Absolutely, tried them last week with 24kg dumbells (it dislocated with 30s), not gonna bother again, it's too uncomfortable.


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## Majesticpower (Jul 22, 2004)

Seriously bad advice offered across this thread.. 

Must say i agree with you hackskii.

MP.


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## Guest (Nov 3, 2004)

LMFAO. Though I agree to an extent. Care to be more specific?


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## Majesticpower (Jul 22, 2004)

Damn, clint eastwood aint as quick off the trigger as you.

Bare with me please, abit busy at present, sorry.

MP.


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## Majesticpower (Jul 22, 2004)

Firstly i find it rather depressing that someone has been put off dumbbells becasue they caused them injury.

Bro, a bad workman blames his tools, and in dumbbell you have one of the best tools available to you... Dont give up on them, return to them, perfect the form and advance.

Dont be afraid of the equipment.



hackskii said:


> directly overhead.
> 
> When you go behind the neck on the presses it *rotates* your shoulders out and your elbos out this is not natural shoulder rotation.


Agree, your inviting for rotor cuff problems.



James.Titor said:


> Have you seen the bar postition in a full squat-Snatch at the midpoint Hackskii?


What point where you making with this comment james?

MP.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

powerU said:


> Absolutely, tried them last week with 24kg dumbells (it dislocated with 30s), not gonna bother again, it's too uncomfortable.


That is a bummer. I love db presses. Maybe you can change and do Arnie presses. I do db presses every other shoulder workout. 



Majesticpower said:


> Damn, clint eastwood aint as quick off the trigger as you.


Lol



Majesticpower said:


> Firstly i find it rather depressing that someone has been put off dumbbells becasue they caused them injury.
> 
> Bro, a bad workman blames his tools, and in dumbbell you have one of the best tools available to you... Dont give up on them, return to them, perfect the form and advance.
> 
> ...


Good advice Big clean MP


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## powerU (Oct 22, 2003)

I'd love too - BUT - I can't risk dislocating again, I get no pain at all with a barbell press and it's so much more stable for me.

I'm not 'anti-dumbells' in the slightest and have only stopped using them for shoulder presses, I still love dumbell inclines. The problem I have is keeping the stability with my left on a shoulder press, if it starts to creep backwards it seriously mis-aligns my shoulder which is when it is most prone to pop out again.


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## Guest (Nov 5, 2004)

> Firstly i find it rather depressing that someone has been put off dumbbells becasue they caused them injury.
> 
> Bro, a bad workman blames his tools, and in dumbbell you have one of the best tools available to you... Dont give up on them, return to them, perfect the form and advance.
> 
> Dont be afraid of the equipment


Good post.



> What point where you making with this comment james?


You know very well what point I was making, but for the benifit of others:

When you catch a snatch, the bar is over your head, your **** is on your calves and your body is lent forward, with the bar being directly over your feet (I.e. depending on how tall/flexibile you are - up to 4" behind the head).

See link below, and then tell me all the Oly lifters in the world have RC problems and are beggin for an injury. Bear in mind some of them do this with upwards of 210kg.

http://www.hhs.csus.edu/homepages/khs/Kilogram4/public/KINS%20144/Kins144_Hang%20Snatch.htm


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

Nice link James!


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## Majesticpower (Jul 22, 2004)

James.Titor said:


> Good post.
> 
> You know very well what point I was making, but for the benifit of others:


No really i didnt but now i do- Id appreciate you be abit more polite in future since im sure you wouldnt appreciate me being abrasive in the future.

But the simple fact of the matter is, that you cant compare a snatch, with *pressing* the barbell behind your back.

Its the rotating of shoulder(being in an un-natural position) because of the actual *pressing* that causes rotar cuff problems.

At no point do they *lower* and *raise* the weight behind their neck, and that was the point that was made earlier within the thread.

MP.


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## GoldenArrow (Mar 30, 2004)

Damn, and I went to all the trouble of finding this pic...










They press Behind the neck and do dropunders in training though. I still wouldnt risk it personally.


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## Majesticpower (Jul 22, 2004)

GoldenArrow said:


> They press Behind the neck and do dropunders in training though


Thats true mate, but as a mass building movement it really isnt worth the risk indeed.

They are conditioned strength athletes(who run high risks in serious injury), and i know of 2 strength guy in their 40's mate who used to admit to living by behind neck presses and now BOTH have seriously fecked rotar cuff- I s*it you not.

The reason why people find behind neck pressing easier is because they are not forced to lean back to avoid the barbell slightly when pressing to the front.

I have alot of mass on my shoulder, and i can certainly feel how uncomfortable it is for my rotar cuff and anterior delt when pressing behind my neck.

At the end of the day thats my opinion.

I would say this though- That behind neck pressing is something that i wouldnt say id NEVER do, just i would *never* make it a *regular* excercise within my training schedules.

MP.


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## sweet_FA (Feb 1, 2005)

powerU said:


> if it starts to creep backwards it seriously mis-aligns my shoulder which is when it is most prone to pop out again.


Sounds like you need your shoulder pinning


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