# Why can't i gain weight?



## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

I was hoping somebody could give me some advice / suggestions on gaining weight (bulking) my diet and workout plan are as follows. I'm 23, been training on and off for a few years however i've stuck to it in the past year but i'm really struglling to get anywhere. I feel like i've wasted so much time and effort, it's taken me around 6 months to put on 5kg (i'm now stuck at 80kg).

recently i reduced the carbs in my diet as i was gaining a belly. I paid for the plan so i've noted it in his exact words.

Training day

Try go for a fast walk before meal 1 ...20-30 mins. This will make it so that you can eat more and it will also help with your cv, and muscle fullness due to blood flow....

Meal 1 
200g steak or chicken breast + 2 free range eggs
+ 10g creatine monohydrate

Meal 2
180g lean mince 5% or leaner or lean cut of red meat
250g sweet potato

Meal 3
2 scoops whey + 100g oats

Meal 4 (60-90mins pre workout)
180g chicken breast or 1.5 tins tuna
100g any pasta + 30g raisins

-TRAIN-
Intra workout shake........to be mixed with 800-1000ml of water and sipped during workout from start to finish (aim to finish on last set of workout)
50g waxy maize starch or maltodextrin
30g any bcaas (i use gaspari aminolast)
10g creatine monohydrate

Meal 5 (45-60mins post workout)
180g chicken breast or 1.5 tins tuna
80g thai jasmine rice + 20g raisins

Meal 6
50g micellar casein in 250ml water or unsweetned almond milk

-------------------------------

Rest day

Meal 1 
200g steak or chicken breast + 2 free range eggs
+ 10g creatine monohydrate

Meal 2 (shake)
2 scoops whey + 100g oats

Meal 3
180g lean mince 5% or leaner or lean cut of red meat
100g any pasta

Meal 4 (shake)
2 scoops whey + 100 oats

Meal 5
180g salmon or steak
200g any dark green veg (broccoli etc)

Meal 6
50g micellar casein in 250ml water or unsweetned almond milk

1. Push (chest shoulders tris)

2. Pull (back biceps)

3. Legs

4. Arms

(Fit all these workouts in within a week) rest when you feel like need it. Try not to do more than 1 day off in a row...

THESE DO NOT INCLUDE WARM UP SETS - you should always start on a light weight for the target reps and keep going up in weight until you find the weight that you fail on inside the desired rep range. The first time you fail inside the target rep range for the set is classed as the 1st working set. The first set should always be the heaviest you go on that exercise.

If you do more than the target reps then you need to increase the weight.

If you fail before you reach the target rep range you need to lower the weight.

If something doesn't feel right and you cant feel the exercise properly then move on to the next exercise or do something else. Do not waste time. - just as if you do an exercise and you really feel it good on the muscle do 1 or 2 extra working sets.

Always lift heavy and always go to failure!!!!

Keep it intense - you should be in the gym for 40-60 mins max!!!

Push through the pain and dont be a pussyole

----Chest + delts----

Keep rest to 40 seconds max

Alternate each week on/off adding in 3 working sets of flys (3 sets of 15 hard reps to pre fatigue chest slightly)

1. Inclined dumbell press 3 working sets 7-10

2. Flat dumbell press 3 working sets of 8-12

3. Any chest press machine superset with fly machine or different chest machine (3 sets of 12-15 reps) alternate machines each workout

4. Dumbell shoulder press or machine shoulder press superset with dumbell lateral raises or machine lateral raises (both arms at same time) 4 working sets 10-12 - warm up and find heaviest weight can do for 10-12 for shoulder press to use as first set - then lower weight when needed. Aim for 20-30 reps on lateral raises

----Back----

Keep rest to 45 seconds max

1. Pull overs with dumbell, pullover machine, or using cables (3 working sets (12-15)

2. Close grip pulldowns (2 working sets 10-12)

3. Bent over strict barbell rows - no jerking body (3 working sets 8-12)

4. Any seated row machine with a chest support and high elbows (chest height) - (2 working sets 12-15)

5. Rear delt dumbells or fly machine 4 hard sets of 30-40 reps pump them out fail between the rep range get at least 30

6. Deadlifts 1 working set 8-10, followed by 1 working set 15-20

----Legs----

Keep rest to 45-60seconds max

1. Laying Leg curls - each rep rest

Pause from bottom (4 working sets 12-15)

2. Leg extensions - double reps (full extension then go up again without letting it drop down) (4 working sets of 12-15)

3. Leg press - feet shoulder width apart at slight angle, push knees outwards. (2 working sets 15-20)

4. Hack squat or smith squat. Feet 6 inches apart at slight angle, push knees outwards slightly (2 working sets 12-15)

5. Stiff legged deads (2 working sets 10-12) - put a 10kg plate on floor and keep toes on it. No full lockout at the top.

5. Giant set (2 rounds) - pick a weight which you can only just about manage 20 reps on for each exercise.

- extensions

- barbell squats

- extensions

- lunges

----Arms----

Keep rest 30-40 seconds max

1b. Standing bicep ez bar rope (4 working sets 15-20)

1t. Overhead extensions from head height or above with ez bar (4 working sets 15-20)

2b. Preacher ez bar (4 working sets 8-10)

2t. Scull crushers slight incline (4 working sets 8-11)

3b. Standing ez bar or barbell (4 sets 8-10)

3t. Inclined dumbell extensions (4 sets 8-12)

4b. Bicep machine or spider curls (4 sets 12-15)

4t. Rope pushowns (4 sets 12-15)


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## Grunz (Apr 11, 2016)

Are you natural?


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Right now i'm on 500mg Test Enanthate (currently in my 6th week) - Haven't gained much from this either.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Grunz said:


> Are you natural?


 Right now i'm on 500mg Test Enanthate (currently in my 6th week) - Haven't gained much from this either


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## Ross S (Jan 31, 2014)

How many calories??

If you don't know this you are pissing in the wind


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## DappaDonDave (Dec 2, 2013)

AIDS.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Ross S said:


> How many calories??
> 
> If you don't know this you are pissing in the wind


 I was on 5000 but i cut it down to 3000 to shock the body and lose some belly fat.


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

The same reason i cant lose weight........i eat too much, you dont fkn eat enough


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## Grunz (Apr 11, 2016)

try increasing training frequency,

p/p/l/off x2 a week


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## FuqOutDaWhey (Apr 29, 2015)

Huddsmuscle said:


> I was on 5000 but i cut it down to 3000 to shock the body and lose some belly fat.


 Confuse that body right babe?


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

Not enough carbs for gainzzzz. And what kind of idiots do deadlift at the end of a back workout? People who like getting injured??


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## FuqOutDaWhey (Apr 29, 2015)

Jakemaguire said:


> And what kind of idiots do deadlift at the end of a back workout? People who like getting injured??


 Dorian Yates :whistling:


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

FuqOutDaWhey said:


> Dorian Yates :whistling:


 I don't care it's stupid. So are the reps 15 reps is stupid 20 is retarded


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

Who ever wrote that program should be sued


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## TREACLE (Jun 6, 2016)

That programme is s**t mate. You should have researched (and progressed on) a good routine way before starting steroids. The fact is you could have had amazing gains but you have wasted your first cycle.


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## TREACLE (Jun 6, 2016)

"Always go heavy and always go to failure"

Whoever wrote that routine doesn't know what their on about. After a few weeks of going to failure on every set your CNS would be f**ked.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Jakemaguire said:


> Not enough carbs for gainzzzz. And what kind of idiots do deadlift at the end of a back workout? People who like getting injured??


 Here's my diet plan before i dropped it, there's plenty of carbs there.

Training day

Try go for a fast walk before meal 1 ...20-30 mins. This will make it so that you can eat more and it will also help with your cv, and muscle fullness due to blood flow....

Meal 1

2 whole free range eggs + 200g chicken breast

60g oats + 1 scoop of whey protein + 20g raisins (eat eggs and chicken seperately.... Cook oats in water then after cooked, add whey and raisins and mix)

+ 10g creatine monohydrate

Meal 2

180g lean mince 5% or leaner or lean cut of red meat

500g sweet potato

Meal 3

2 scoops whey + 150

Meal 4 (60-90mins pre workout)

180g chicken breast or 1.5 tins tuna

150g any pasta + 30g raisins

-TRAIN-

Intra workout shake........to be mixed with 800-1000ml of water and sipped during workout from start to finish (aim to finish on last set of workout)

75g waxy maize starch or maltodextrin

30g any bcaas (i use gaspari aminolast)

10g creatine monohydrate

Meal 5 (45-60mins post workout)

180g chicken breast or 1.5 tins tuna

120g thai jasmine rice + 30g raisins + 10g honey

Meal 6

250g fage 0% greek yogurt + 1 scoop whey protein + 30g almond or peanut butter

-------------------------------

Rest day

Meal 1

2 whole free range eggs + 200g chicken breast + large bunch spinach

+ 10g creatine monohydrate

Meal 2 (shake)

2 scoops whey + 150g oats

Meal 3

180g lean mince 5% or leaner or lean cut of red meat

150g any pasta

Meal 4 (shake)

2 scoops whey + 150 oats

Meal 5

180g chicken breast or 1.5 tins tuna

400g sweet potato + 200g any dark green veg (broccoli etc)

Meal 6

250g fage 0% greek yogurt + 1 scoop whey protein + 30g almond or peanut butter


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

TREACLE said:


> That programme is s**t mate. You should have researched (and progressed on) a good routine way before starting steroids. The fact is you could have had amazing gains but you have wasted your first cycle.


 This is actually my 6th course, i just had 3 years off though. Why is it s**t?


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## TREACLE (Jun 6, 2016)

You're doing 8 exercises for arms. One is enough, two maybe. Focus in the bigger lifts and you need more frequency in my opinion. Loads of studies show strength and muscle gain is best when training lifts twice per week. When on juice this can go up to 3 times per week, as long as your eating and sleeping loads.

5 sets of heavy barbell curls and 5 sets of close grip bench press (or Skulls) twice per week and your arms will grow way quicker than doing that crap arm routine.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

AngryBuddha said:


> The same reason i cant lose weight........i eat too much, you dont fkn eat enough


 You think? Even at my previous diet which was over 5000cal?


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

Huddsmuscle said:


> You think? Even at my previous diet which was over 5000cal?


 Was it consistantly over 5k cals?


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

AngryBuddha said:


> Was it consistantly over 5k cals?


 This^^^. For how much time did you maintain your surplus?


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> This^^^. For how much time did you maintain your surplus?


 Have a look at the pic, that was the daily intake for 3 months strict, few cheats after that


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## RexEverthing (Apr 4, 2014)

How much did you pay for this and who was it you paid?


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## Ares (Dec 3, 2015)

Looks like a cookie-cutter (dogshit) program and a diet full of supps, you've been rinsed mate. What are your stats? Height, bf% etc

You need to eat in a surplus to gain weight, but you're worried about a bit of a belly and have dropped carbs.. did you up fats to counter this?


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## united (May 11, 2016)

Just remember to adjust your food intake with your weight gain, once you add weight you need to add more food.

Sounds easy, but I've always struggled to force the food in! Others struggle not to eat to much! Welcome to the mind f**k that is body building


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## RexEverthing (Apr 4, 2014)

Ares said:


> Looks like a cookie-cutter (dogshit) program and a diet full of supps, you've been rinsed mate. What are your stats? Height, bf% etc
> 
> You need to eat in a surplus to gain weight, but you're worried about a bit of a belly and have dropped carbs.. did you up fats to counter this?


 These people must be making a killing. It's frustrating for me (and I haven't even paid anything) when all the info is dotted around the internet and particularly on places like UK-M.


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

Unless you're doing a shitload of cardio, even the skinniest ecto will put weight on with 5k cals, if its an accurate 5k cals, sit and scran bags of cashew nuts, peanut butter, bars of dark choc, bowls of porridge with more fruit and nut mixed in,plus other meals consistantly every day and come back and say you cant put weight on, if thats the case then theres an underlying medical issue


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## Ares (Dec 3, 2015)

RexEverthing said:


> These people must be making a killing. It's frustrating for me (and I haven't even paid anything) when all the info is dotted around the internet and particularly on places like UK-M.


 I agree, the 'fitness' industry is rooted in deception mate. From the airbrushing to the supps to the geared up models advertising them and everything in-between.

There's a sucker born every minute... RIGHT, BABE?


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## RexEverthing (Apr 4, 2014)

Ares said:


> I agree, the 'fitness' industry is rooted in deception mate. From the airbrushing to the supps to the geared up models advertising them and everything in-between.
> 
> There's a sucker born every minute... RIGHT, BABE?


 Banzi created a thread ages ago about how BB is far more simplistic than people make it appear / sound. It was a good read although I can't seem to find it now. The point remains, the only people over-complicating it are the ones trying to make money from it.


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## Ares (Dec 3, 2015)

I might have a look, don't think I've read it before

Is this it?

https://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/topic/259762-what-i-have-learned-in-over-30-years-of-on-and-off-use-lifting-by-banzi/?do=embed

This was a good read too

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1B5T7eDfzMt_qUoRg2Er3GWmwapRvZfaZq06PPJfs3Ng/preview


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

RexEverthing said:


> How much did you pay for this and who was it you paid?


 It was a PT i've known for years, he's in fantasic shape and his clients seem to get gret results too (except me)


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## RexEverthing (Apr 4, 2014)

Huddsmuscle said:


> It was a PT i've known for years, he's in fantasic shape and his clients seem to get gret results too (except me)


 How much did it cost you?


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

RexEverthing said:


> How much did it cost you?


 £40 for the plan, i don't get what's wrong with the diet though, to me the macro's seem great, more than enough protein and carbs.


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## RexEverthing (Apr 4, 2014)

Huddsmuscle said:


> £40 for the plan, i don't get what's wrong with the diet though, to me the macro's seem great, more than enough protein and carbs.


 My only issue with the diet is that it looks like a diet he's done more or less for every single one of his clients and that it's one you could have easily put together yourself. But it's your money so rock on :beer:


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

RexEverthing said:


> My only issue with the diet is that it looks like a diet he's done more or less for every single one of his clients and that it's one you could have easily put together yourself. But it's your money so rock on [IMG alt=":beer:" data-emoticon=""]https://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=http://1.1.1.3/bmi/www.uk-muscle.co.uk/uploads/emoticons/default_beer.gif&key=c7a1fd8f3609ab58065a30731e91591348a32dec4ee820baf5ecc76329dbcc6d[/IMG]


 That's the thing though, i actually sat down with him to go through everything, all the foods i like / don't like, weight, calories etc


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## Jandir (Oct 8, 2015)

if your not gaining weight, your not eating enough. absolutely nothing else to it


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## mrwright (Oct 22, 2013)

Pasta and raisins sounds like a shite meal


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## andyboro (Oct 1, 2006)

Jakemaguire said:


> Not enough carbs for gainzzzz. And what kind of idiots do deadlift at the end of a back workout? People who like getting injured??


 me... same with squats.

far less chance of getting injured when the main muscle you're focusing on is pre-exhausted and not trying to push supporting muscles beyond their limit.


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## andyboro (Oct 1, 2006)

'why cant I gain weight'

"I cut calories because i was worried I was getting fat"

no idea what the problem is... :whistling:


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## Alvin (May 4, 2008)

At 5000 calories are you sure your not confusing bloating to belly fat?

thats a lot of calories for some one of 80kgs.


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

Alvin said:


> At 5000 calories are you sure your not confusing bloating to belly fat?
> 
> thats a lot of calories for some one of 80kgs.


 Dependant. someone 70kg may not gain on 5000kcals.


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## gymfreak2010 (Jan 6, 2016)

DappaDonDave said:


> AIDS.


 then anadrol lol


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## Alvin (May 4, 2008)

Starz said:


> Dependant. someone 70kg may not gain on 5000kcals.


 How could they not? Unless some medical condition or they are on the go 24/7


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

Alvin said:


> *How could they not?* Unless some medical condition or they are on the go 24/7


 Metabolism.


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

andyboro said:


> me... same with squats.
> 
> far less chance of getting injured when the main muscle you're focusing on is pre-exhausted and not trying to push supporting muscles beyond their limit.


 You are a mong


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

Jakemaguire said:


> You are a mong


 lol, that routine is a shambles, I have never known anyone to deadlift at the end of a back workout..... ever! you obviously cannot give it all to quiet possibly the most beneficial exercise you can do on a whole for your body. nothing gives brute strength like it. can't understand how anyone could squat or deadlift at the end of their workout. prioritise the biggest lifts first, everything else secondary.


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

Starz said:


> lol, that routine is a shambles, I have never known anyone to deadlift at the end of a back workout..... ever! you obviously cannot give it all to quiet possibly the most beneficial exercise you can do on a whole for your body. nothing gives brute strength like it. can't understand how anyone could squat or deadlift at the end of their workout. prioritise the biggest lifts first, everything else secondary.


 It's good to see some people have a brain on here


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

andyboro said:


> me... same with squats.
> 
> far less chance of getting injured when the main muscle you're focusing on is pre-exhausted and not trying to push supporting muscles beyond their limit.


 Let's just examine that statement.

The main muscle becomes fatigued before the large compound movement In which it is a prime mover.

When performing said compound additional stress will be delivered to the supporting muscles placing them at a greater risk of injury even at lower weights.

For example a 100kg squat could be delivering closer to 180kg of force to supporting muscle groups as the main muscle cannot take the share it would normally have.

Your theory is backwards and no supported by any research I have ever read. Please if you do have such evidence to support it felt free to post, I'd be interested In reading it.


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

Starz said:


> Metabolism.


 Whaaaaaaaaaaaat?!!??? No such thing as bmr of 5k, if you're a regular sized guy, not ronnie coleman, unless you're a fkn marathon runner you will gain weight on 5k cals


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

AngryBuddha said:


> Whaaaaaaaaaaaat?!!??? No such thing as bmr of 5k, if you're a regular sized guy, not ronnie coleman, unless you're a fkn marathon runner you will gain weight on 5k cals


 of course majority will, but their is folk out there, who are less than, what's considered regular and might not. if I'm not mistaken, @FelonE is a good example. obviously a lot bigger than he was now though.


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

Starz said:


> of course majority will, but their is folk out there, who are less than, what's considered regular and might not. if I'm not mistaken, @FelonE is a good example. obviously a lot bigger than he was now though.


 Lot of people bullshit, they tell you theyre sitting scranning ice cream, kebabs and donuts and losing weight, utter bollocks. Theyre eating chicken and fkn rice, even on a gram of tren and dnp you couldnt cut on 5k cals unless you trained 3hrs a day, or had 0.001% genetics like ronnie coleman, thats the truth


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## Alvin (May 4, 2008)

AngryBuddha said:


> Whaaaaaaaaaaaat?!!??? No such thing as bmr of 5k, if you're a regular sized guy, not ronnie coleman, unless you're a fkn marathon runner you will gain weight on 5k cals


 Exactly what I was getting at but couldn't be bothered lol.


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## Dogbolt (Jun 23, 2009)

OP, what's your sh1t like? Serious question, I was eating over 5000kcals a day for months and overall I lost 1kg, went from 80kg to 79. Turned out I have a lactose intolerance, and as my diet included a fair bit of whey and milk I was basically just sh1tting out all the nutrients I was eating. Now on lactose free milk and whey and can easily gain on 3500kcals.


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

AngryBuddha said:


> Lot of people bullshit, they tell you theyre sitting scranning ice cream, kebabs and donuts and losing weight, utter bollocks. Theyre eating chicken and fkn rice, even on a gram of tren and dnp you couldnt cut on 5k cals unless you trained 3hrs a day, or had 0.001% genetics like ronnie coleman, thats the truth


 I don't billsh1t and had to bulk on 6000 cals. My maintenance is about 4200


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

FelonE said:


> I don't billsh1t and had to bulk on 6000 cals. My maintenance is about 4200


 If you need 6k cals to put weight on theres an underlying medical issue such as hyperthyroidism, theres no 2 ways about it, either that or you're working a ridiculously physical job all day, in which case you wouldnt have the time to eat the 6k cals, or have the energy to train after it


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## Alvin (May 4, 2008)

FelonE said:


> I don't billsh1t and had to bulk on 6000 cals. My maintenance is about 4200


 At 70/80 kgs?


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

AngryBuddha said:


> If you need 6k cals to put weight on theres an underlying medical issue such as hyperthyroidism, theres no 2 ways about it, either that or you're working a ridiculously physical job all day, in which case you wouldnt have the time to eat the 6k cals, or have the energy to train after it


 says who?


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

Alvin said:


> At 70/80 kgs?


 I'm 96kg atm


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

FelonE said:


> says who?


 The entire medical world


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

AngryBuddha said:


> Lot of people bullshit, they tell you theyre sitting scranning ice cream, kebabs and donuts and losing weight, utter bollocks. Theyre eating chicken and fkn rice, even on a gram of tren and dnp you couldnt cut on 5k cals unless you trained 3hrs a day, or had 0.001% genetics like ronnie coleman, thats the truth


 A lot of people have an easier time than others, when dieting/gaining weight. lifestyle is also a big determining factor. The only thing, that can be done is to steadily increase the caloric intake and pay attention to the scales & mirror. people are quick to just throw numbers about and say, you should be gaining on x amount, but it's just not always the case for everybody.


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## AngryBuddha (Nov 25, 2015)

Starz said:


> A lot of people have an easier time than others, when dieting/gaining weight. lifestyle is also a big determining factor. The only thing, that can be done is to steadily increase the caloric intake and pay attention to the scales & mirror. people are quick to just throw numbers about and say, you should be gaining on x amount, but it's just not always the case for everybody.


 Thats twice the fkn food bill, twice the stress on your body processing all that, and twice the fkn bog roll, if i needed 6k cals to gain weight id be fkn sick, theres summit up, even fkn worms! Thats binge eating, buffets and tubs of hagen daz all day


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

AngryBuddha said:


> Thats twice the fkn food bill, twice the stress on your body processing all that, and twice the fkn bog roll, if i needed 6k cals to gain weight id be fkn sick, theres summit up, even fkn worms! Thats binge eating, buffets and tubs of hagen daz all day


 Not at all. My 6000 was mostly clean


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## FelonE1 (Dec 23, 2013)

AngryBuddha said:


> The entire medical world


 Proof?


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## andyboro (Oct 1, 2006)

MattGriff said:


> Let's just examine that statement.
> 
> The main muscle becomes fatigued before the large compound movement In which it is a prime mover.
> 
> ...


 Well no... because you aren't lifting anywhere near as much.

My practises are based on experience - I've had back injuries from both inside and outside of the gym and when blindly doing heavy stuff first because big dave said..They were regularly exacerbated by deadlifting. Now I do what works best for me and consistently progress without issue.. feel free to rubbish what I say all day long, but it works.

I've got to add, I'm not at all fussed about strength - racking up numbers was something for my 20's and it could be argued that this is the reason i guess, or that I'm more effectively warmed up by dead lifting last too really.

This mindset that there is one way to do something and that everything else is stupid is just plain wrong though.. there are many ways that can be effectively utilised to get bigger so long as they're consistent and carried out properly.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Dogbolt said:


> OP, what's your sh1t like? Serious question, I was eating over 5000kcals a day for months and overall I lost 1kg, went from 80kg to 79. Turned out I have a lactose intolerance, and as my diet included a fair bit of whey and milk I was basically just sh1tting out all the nutrients I was eating. Now on lactose free milk and whey and can easily gain on 3500kcals.


 When i was on my 5000cal diet it was just sloppy joe's all day. It's now solid on the 3000cal diet. I have milk with the porridge but the whey protein is mixed with oats.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

andyboro said:


> 'why cant I gain weight'
> 
> "I cut calories because i was worried I was getting fat"
> 
> no idea what the problem is... :whistling:


 Not sure i worded it right, it was weird, my weight wasn't increasing but my belly size was, and it wasn't just me being "bloated"


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## Dogbolt (Jun 23, 2009)

Huddsmuscle said:


> When i was on my 5000cal diet it was just sloppy joe's all day. It's now solid on the 3000cal diet. I have milk with the porridge but the whey protein is mixed with oats.


 That's just how mine was, and I have my whey protein with milk and oats for breakfast. I now have Lactofree milk and Myprotein ISORO 97 whey.


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

andyboro said:


> Well no... because you aren't lifting anywhere near as much.
> 
> My practises are based on experience - I've had back injuries from both inside and outside of the gym and when blindly doing heavy stuff first because big dave said..They were regularly exacerbated by deadlifting. Now I do what works best for me and consistently progress without issue.. feel free to rubbish what I say all day long, but it works.
> 
> ...


 Let's use an example as you seem rather defensive rather than practical about your response.

Let's say for example. Good you squat 200kg fresh to keep the numbers simple and the supporting groups take on 20% of the weight with the rest delivered via the prime mover.

That will be 40kg to supporting groups and 160kg to the prime mover.

Now if pre exhausted the prime move loses efficency so now is only operating at 60% vs 80% before.

You squat 100kg. The fatigued prime mover takes 60kg of weight. ...and low and behind the supporting groups take 40kg. ..The same as a fresh 200kg squat.

Hopefully this makes more sense to you now.

The usual cause if back issues etc with deadlifing is due to incorrect and improper form. As a bio mechanical coach I see this on a day to day basis from people who have 'Perfect form' which everyone claims to have.

I did not mention growing or strength work during my initial post so I find it irrelevant for it to be mentioned or responded to as my retort was simply correcting the error of your statement.

Sent from Samsung Mobile


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## Jandir (Oct 8, 2015)

why does everyone feel the need to toss their own maintenance cals into this, like its in any way relevant to the OP? "I need 6k to maintain my 13stone physique".. well fu**ing poor you lol. never understood why people think needing more calories to grow than others is something to gloat about


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## Quackerz (Dec 19, 2015)

Jandir said:


> why does everyone feel the need to toss their own maintenance cals into this, like its in any way relevant to the OP? "I need 6k to maintain my 13stone physique".. well fu**ing poor you lol. never understood why people think needing more calories to grow than others is something to gloat about


 Thought you would just tell him steroids make you gain weight.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Starz said:


> lol, that routine is a shambles, I have never known anyone to deadlift at the end of a back workout..... ever! you obviously cannot give it all to quiet possibly the most beneficial exercise you can do on a whole for your body. nothing gives brute strength like it. can't understand how anyone could squat or deadlift at the end of their workout. prioritise the biggest lifts first, everything else secondary.


 Ok, so what advice would you give? How would you train to grow? What kind of weight / rep range etc?


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

AngryBuddha said:


> The entire medical world


 If it was true i'm sure i'd be putting weight on, everyone's different, i've always had a fast metabolism. It seems like everything i eat is going to my belly rather than my muscles, that's why i've cut the cals - so i don't look like a yoga ball.


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## Huddsmuscle (Jan 14, 2010)

Jandir said:


> why does everyone feel the need to toss their own maintenance cals into this, like its in any way relevant to the OP? "I need 6k to maintain my 13stone physique".. well fu**ing poor you lol. never understood why people think needing more calories to grow than others is something to gloat about


 I think i've had 1 or 2 bits of advice and the rest of the comments are "that workout / diet is s**t" - ok guys well what would you do better?


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## Jandir (Oct 8, 2015)

Huddsmuscle said:


> I think i've had 1 or 2 bits of advice and the rest of the comments are "that workout / diet is s**t" - ok guys well what would you do better?


 tbf you asked why you cant gain weight - eat more is the answer. now you can gain weight but its all going to the stomach- such is life lol

doesn't matter what people think about the workouts. all that matters is your getting stronger on all lifts each session. are you? if not then you need to change it


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## theBEAST2002 (Oct 16, 2011)

Jakemaguire said:


> Not enough carbs for gainzzzz. And what kind of idiots do deadlift at the end of a back workout? People who like getting injured??


 I prefere doing deadlifts at the end and I've never been injured.


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

theBEAST2002 said:


> I prefere doing deadlifts at the end and I've never been injured.


 Doesn't mean it's a good idea your probably not deadlifting as heavy as you could


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## andyboro (Oct 1, 2006)

Jakemaguire said:


> Doesn't mean it's a good idea your probably not deadlifting as heavy as you could


 that doesnt matter to everyone though...

I DGAF about pushing numbers as high as possible, I train for appearance, as do most people who opt for volume routines. That doesnt make them stupid - it just means that they have different goals to you.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Jakemaguire said:


> Doesn't mean it's a good idea your probably not deadlifting as heavy as you could


 I used to deadlift after squats as part of a whole body routine. I couldn't sensibly squat after deadlifting though. I don't think there can be absolute rules here...


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Actually I missed the context there. Must admit I'd be deadlifting first if I was doing a back only workout. From a safety point of view though it is going to be how much the lower back is involved in other exercises I think.


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> I used to deadlift after squats as part of a whole body routine. I couldn't sensibly squat after deadlifting though. I don't think there can be absolute rules here...


 I also deadlift after I squat but I do light deadlift for low reps (singles) . I also do Olympic style squats after deadlift but go very very light for 1 set of 20 makes the legs grow lovely


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

andyboro said:


> that doesnt matter to everyone though...
> 
> I DGAF about pushing numbers as high as possible, I train for appearance, as do most people who opt for volume routines. That doesnt make them stupid - it just means that they have different goals to you.


 But you don't look good....


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## andyboro (Oct 1, 2006)

Jakemaguire said:


> But you don't look good....


 you look like you're stuck under a bar... but im not one to judge :thumbup1:

plus, there's not much light under bridges, you probably can't see very well.


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## Jakemaguire (Feb 17, 2016)

andyboro said:


> you look like you're stuck under a bar... but im not one to judge :thumbup1:
> 
> plus, there's not much light under bridges, you probably can't see very well.


 Lol I train to be strong and I am


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## andyboro (Oct 1, 2006)

Jakemaguire said:


> Lol I train to be strong and I am


 smelling anyway lol.

each to their own mate, I'm not at all arsed about adding plates to the bar.. I'm making progress in shape and size and that'll do me. It may be as shallow as a teaspoon but I like it.

I'm too old/knackered to be arsed with risking injury over lifting heavy things in a sweaty room full of men anyway.


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

Ultrasonic said:


> Actually I missed the context there. Must admit I'd be deadlifting first if I was doing a back only workout. From a safety point of view though it is going to be how much the lower back is involved in other exercises I think.


 Deadlifts demand respect. I've had to give them their own separate day. to deadlift at the end of a workout, tells me, the individual will be performing them pretty light - moderate and not to their full capability, as @Jakemaguire pointed out. people have different goals, but if you're serious about developing strength or size, deads are to be prioritised and will take every ounce from you. you will not deadlift near your capability or push yourself, if you're doing: Pull ups, bent over rows, lat pull downs and THEN deads, that's pretty retarded imo.


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## theBEAST2002 (Oct 16, 2011)

Jakemaguire said:


> Doesn't mean it's a good idea your probably not deadlifting as heavy as you could


 No but the lower back is not a priority area for building mass and it makes it harder to keep the bar close to my body and keep my shoulders pinned back. Thus having a fantastic effect on Lats, traps and rhomboids.


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