# On a cut, progress slowing



## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

I'm aiming for 10% bf and have lost 12kg in 4 months being on the first cut I've ever been on.

I'm on around 2000 calories a day, which I know seems very little, but this is the only way I've been able to drop the fat so far. I'm sticking to my daily macros which are as follows.

Protein - 240g

Carbs - 140g

Fat - 60g

I'm at a point now where things have slowed down so I'm looking for some advice on how to get rid of the last bit of belly fat.

Stats:

Age - 33

Weight - 83kg(down from 95kg)

Height - 6'2"

Training, 3 weight sessions a week and two cardio(30 min HIIT).


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## Queenie (May 30, 2013)

Train more... and do more cardio?


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## Boshlop (Apr 1, 2012)

the fact you started on such low cals might make this harder, you have adjusted to that and now going lower might be bad for your health. either do more training to help it along, or look at a different type of diet such as low carbs with more calories in it to start losing again


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

RXQueenie said:


> Train more... and do more cardio?


I train 5 days a week so training more is not an option for me. Doing more cardio certainly is, but I'm mindful of trying to keep as much muscle as possible as I'm going on a lean bulk once I've reached my bf goal, so I'd like to do at least 3 days of weight training a week.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Josh Heslop said:


> the fact you started on such low cals might make this harder, you have adjusted to that and now going lower might be bad for your health. either do more training to help it along, or look at a different type of diet such as low carbs with more calories in it to start losing again


I didn't start on so few calories. I gradually decreased it as the weeks went by to keep the progress going. Is it always such a pain in the bellend to shift this last bit of fat?


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## Boshlop (Apr 1, 2012)

MFM said:


> I didn't start on so few calories. I gradually decreased it as the weeks went by to keep the progress going. Is it always such a pain in the bellend to shift this last bit of fat?


ah right, thats ok then, wasnt to clear on that. yea the last bit is hard, your body wants to hold onto the last bits of fat for survival more than anything. i would say change a diet into something more specific for fat burning, look inot PScarbs sticky on weight loss and read up on timed carbs and keto, your body usually needs a bit push to get low low


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## Queenie (May 30, 2013)

MFM said:


> I didn't start on so few calories. I gradually decreased it as the weeks went by to keep the progress going. Is it always such a pain in the bellend to shift this last bit of fat?


Yeah it is...

Oh i thought u said above u train weights x 3 per week... not x 5.

So... switch up your current weight sessions to ones that are focused to conditioning maybe? What is your current split?

At the moment, I do x 5 weights per week and x 6 cardio (HIIT & steady state) and macros change most weeks (although cal totals don't) - u really do have to change things to keep the body from stalling.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Thing is, due to work commitments and commuting etc, I can only train first thing in the morning, so I can either do weight training or cardio. It kind of limits the amount of cardio I can do so I'll have to look at changing up the diet. Ugh


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## Queenie (May 30, 2013)

MFM said:


> Thing is, due to work commitments and commuting etc, I can only train first thing in the morning, so I can either do weight training or cardio. It kind of limits the amount of cardio I can do so I'll have to look at changing up the diet. Ugh


Could u not do some days weights, other days weights followed by cardio, therefore fitting more cardio in over the week?


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

RXQueenie said:


> Could u not do some days weights, other days weights followed by cardio, therefore fitting more cardio in over the week?


There's no time unfortunately. I barely have an hour in the morning before work, so have to make due with what I've got!


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## Guest (Feb 12, 2014)

Add some uphill walking in or ECA perhaps

Got a before and after by any chance?


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

MattTwoWheels said:


> Got a before and after by any chance?


Yeah I've got a couple of progress pics. Still have some way to go though.

4 Months ago.



Few weeks ago.


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## Queenie (May 30, 2013)

MFM said:


> There's no time unfortunately. I barely have an hour in the morning before work, so have to make due with what I've got!


cardio in evening? ie sprints outside?


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## DiscSupps (Oct 26, 2012)

MFM said:


> I'm aiming for 10% bf and have lost 12kg in 4 months being on the first cut I've ever been on.
> 
> I'm on around 2000 calories a day, which I know seems very little, but this is the only way I've been able to drop the fat so far. I'm sticking to my daily macros which are as follows.
> 
> ...


Resistance and Interval training burns more fat than cardio alone! So stick with that... Nutrition is key also so make sure you are eating enough of the right foods!! Scott


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

I see from the lack of response my progress isn't what it should have been. Lol


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## Matthew5 (Mar 17, 2011)

MFM said:


> I see from the lack of response my progress isn't what it should have been. Lol


Your progress has been great mate! Think you need to switch your diet up a bit without lowering your cals much more, have you tried keto before?

In terms of training and your time constraints I would suggest switching your cardio in the evening. 3-5 heavy weight sessions a week with 30mins cardio 4 nights a week.


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## Dagman72 (Apr 2, 2009)

MFM said:


> Thing is, due to work commitments and commuting etc, I can only train first thing in the morning, so I can either do weight training or cardio. It kind of limits the amount of cardio I can do so I'll have to look at changing up the diet. Ugh


Get up half hour earlier and walk the streets or round the park.


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## micros (May 15, 2013)

Keeping all consideration about cardio sessions, I'd add up that I found me very reactive with the alternation of low carbs days and recharging days,

you are doing about 50%,25% and 25% (prot,carbs and fats).

e.g.

low carb day could be about: 50% 35% 15%

recharging clould be about: 30% 60% 10%

day1,2,3,4 LC

day5 R

bye


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

Have one day where you eat 5k calories of carbs then the next day eat 1500 cals of high pro and med fats and I bet you will look the best you have done in a long time the day after your binge and weight low will accelerate again


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

simonthepieman said:


> Have one day where you eat 5k calories of carbs then the next day eat 1500 cals of high pro and med fats and I bet you will look the best you have done in a long time the day after your binge and weight low will accelerate again


I do have a refeed day every Sunday where I eat twice the amount of carbs, but not 5k!!

Could you explain how this will help me burn more fat please as I'm not very clued up!


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

MFM said:


> I do have a refeed day every Sunday where I eat twice the amount of carbs, but not 5k!!
> 
> Could you explain how this will help me burn more fat please as I'm not very clued up!


Anything less than 4k isn't a refeed 

Your metabolism responds to volume of food so large days of eating raise you metabolism. Have a littl research into leptin. I'm on my phone and there's too much to type.

Also your body has a natural tendency to seek homeostasis. An equilibrium. When you consistently lower cals your body adjusts it's self to operate on lower cals. It's a survival mechanism.

In the way you won't get bigger without upping weights. The body is malleable to its demands.

By having days of large calories you stop this process and often do a brief reversal


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

simonthepieman said:


> Anything less than 4k isn't a refeed
> 
> Your metabolism responds to volume of food so large days of eating raise you metabolism. Have a littl research into leptin. I'm on my phone and there's too much to type.
> 
> ...


Very interesting! So I will keep my low cal diet the same but once a week I will eat a **** load of carbs?

Thanks for the info.


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

MFM said:


> Very interesting! So I will keep my low cal diet the same but once a week I will eat a **** load of carbs?
> 
> Thanks for the info.


That's the one.

Maybe the day before have low carbs to prime yourself for it.

Don't worry about high GI too. Pizza and Haribo are all good


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

Maybe just start with once a fortnight first


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## jayDP (Jan 31, 2012)

Add cheat meals twice a meal

Edit

Yeah wat simonthepieman said


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## jayDP (Jan 31, 2012)

Cheat meals explained by a doctor that helps pro bodybuilders diet


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## ohh_danielson (Oct 16, 2013)

jayDP said:


> Cheat meals explained by a doctor that helps pro bodybuilders diet


Great video, thanks for that! Learned quite a few things I didnt know!


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

jayDP said:


> Cheat meals explained by a doctor that helps pro bodybuilders diet


I've just watched the video. Very informative. My only question is, surely there's a difference between eating a cheat meal and consuming 5000 calories worth of carbs??


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## jayDP (Jan 31, 2012)

MFM said:


> I've just watched the video. Very informative. My only question is, surely there's a difference between eating a cheat meal and consuming 5000 calories worth of carbs??


Well I never eat 5000kcals of carbs on my diet so can't comment on that

I dieted on 300 carbs, 400 protein an 20 fat.

And twice aweek for my tea I'd have a take away with a ton of sweats or cakes. More like 2000cals extra on top of my diet


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

jayDP said:


> Well I never eat 5000kcals of carbs on my diet so can't comment on that
> 
> I dieted on 300 carbs, 400 protein an 20 fat.
> 
> And twice aweek for my tea I'd have a take away with a ton of sweats or cakes. More like 2000cals extra on top of my diet


Wow, 20g of fat? I'm on 60g of fat a day now and I thought that was low.

Could this possibly be why I'm struggling too? Maybe I should lower my fat intake some more?


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## jayDP (Jan 31, 2012)

MFM said:


> Wow, 20g of fat? I'm on 60g of fat a day now and I thought that was low.
> 
> Could this possibly be why I'm struggling too? Maybe I should lower my fat intake some more?


Worth a try, the 20g of fat is just the tiny amounts you get in chicken breast and rice, I don't add "fats" to any meal just carbs an protein


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Wicked. I'm giving this a go and will report back if it's made a difference.


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## Snorbitz1uk (Sep 21, 2005)

I suggest fasted hiit, i do 30-40 mins 5 days a week of this and the fat just falls off. i also do 10-20 mins hiit after weights or if not a little 5k run. havent lost any muscle really and eating around 3000 cal a day.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

I do fasted HIIT twice a week and weights 3 times. I only have time in the morning for training/cardio so I can only do one or the other. I don't really want to reduce the amount of weight training I do so cardio twice a week will have to do!


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## Snorbitz1uk (Sep 21, 2005)

MFM said:


> I do fasted HIIT twice a week and weights 3 times. I only have time in the morning for training/cardio so I can only do one or the other. I don't really want to reduce the amount of weight training I do so cardio twice a week will have to do!


Could you not just get to the gym earlier? you only get out what you put in.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

I'm waiting in front of the door before it opens in the morning. With the commute and work commitments, it's the best I can do and frankly all I have time for.


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## saiyanlift (Feb 4, 2014)

maybe get on something to optimise thyroid output?

Try a little bit of intermittant fasting? Or just stick it out bro! these things take time


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> Anything less than 4k isn't a refeed
> 
> Your metabolism responds to volume of food so large days of eating raise you metabolism. Have a littl research into leptin. I'm on my phone and there's too much to type.
> 
> ...


Should this always be done on a cut mate?

I'm doing timed carbs just now and going to have a refeed day on Saturday but was unsure of how much carbs and cals ect

Should I go for 5k cals???


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

leezers said:


> Should this always be done on a cut mate?
> 
> I'm doing timed carbs just now and going to have a refeed day on Saturday but was unsure of how much carbs and cals ect
> 
> Should I go for 5k cals???


What do you eat on a normal 'low' days and what's your current rate of loss


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> What do you eat on a normal 'low' days and what's your current rate of loss


Just now I'm eating 2000 cals everyday. Having 100 grams of liquid carbs after my training on workout days only. Zero carbs all other times.

My rate of loss was great doing keto a few months back, lost around 2 stone. Only been doing timed carbs for 10 days but I can feel it's slowing you know.


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

4k of mostly high GI carbs from food would be where I would aim.

Be warred you weight will skyrocket for a few days with the water and glycogen uptake. But by weds you should be back to losing weight again


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## micros (May 15, 2013)

leezers said:


> Just now I'm eating 2000 cals everyday. Having 100 grams of liquid carbs after my training on workout days only. Zero carbs all other times.
> 
> My rate of loss was great doing keto a few months back, lost around 2 stone. Only been doing timed carbs for 10 days but I can feel it's slowing you know.


2000 cals included the 400cals after wo? How much cals are you under your maintance value? Maybe it's time to adjust them?


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

micros said:


> 2000 cals included the 400cals after wo? How much cals are you under your maintance value? Maybe it's time to adjust them?


That's exactly the next question I was gonna ask, I've been including the 400 cals. Has that to be added to the 2000? So on workout days I'll be eating 2400?


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> 4k of mostly high GI carbs from food would be where I would aim.
> 
> Be warred you weight will skyrocket for a few days with the water and glycogen uptake. But by weds you should be back to losing weight again


Ok mate ill try that. Forgive me as I'm not clued up on macros ect, how many grams of carbs am I aiming for on Saturday?

Also what's the best foods for high GI?


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

leezers said:


> Ok mate ill try that. Forgive me as I'm not clued up on macros ect, how many grams of carbs am I aiming for on Saturday?
> 
> Also what's the best foods for high GI?


800+

Haribo, pizza, ice cream, chocolate, white rice, pasta, beer


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> 800+
> 
> Haribo, pizza, ice cream, chocolate, white rice, pasta, beer


Holy **** mate really? Lol this sat is gonna be magic!

So 4k+ cals and make sure I have 800+ carbs. Sorted!


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## micros (May 15, 2013)

leezers said:


> That's exactly the next question I was gonna ask, I've been including the 400 cals. Has that to be added to the 2000? So on workout days I'll be eating 2400?


The 400cals would be added to the 2k. Total zero carbs I think it is a little bit exaggerated and very stressfull for your system, and maybe counterproductive also.

I have done a couple of times the ckd and during that I've always had carbs on breakfast from oat and from fruit in the other meals but no carbs after 3pm, do your math considering your maintaning cals as less than 10% in carbs in low carbs days.

On low carbs days use only low GI carbs, if you want to control after work out's catabolism use bcaa and stay away from creatine and powder proteins in every day they cause water retention.

During high carbs day, take a cake big like a cow and eat it with bare hands.. :-D


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

Remember. On the Sunday try to fast until lunch and eat mostly protein.


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## micros (May 15, 2013)

simonthepieman said:


> Remember. On the Sunday try to fast until lunch and eat mostly protein.


Hi, why fasting?


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

micros said:


> Hi, why fasting?


It's a little brosciency, but theoretically it makes sense

The idea is to boost your metabolism and fat burning with a high cal high GI day. By introduce carbs on the following day you are discouraging the body's fat burning mechanisms.


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

micros said:


> The 400cals would be added to the 2k. Total zero carbs I think it is a little bit exaggerated and very stressfull for your system, and maybe counterproductive also.
> 
> I have done a couple of times the ckd and during that I've always had carbs on breakfast from oat and from fruit in the other meals but no carbs after 3pm, do your math considering your maintaning cals as less than 10% in carbs in low carbs days.
> 
> ...


I say no carbs, I'd say it's under 25. I have salads and an apple here and there throughout the day


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> 800+
> 
> Haribo, pizza, ice cream, chocolate, white rice, pasta, beer


Meant to say mate, obv there's loadsa fat in these foods, does that matter on refeed day?


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> Remember. On the Sunday try to fast until lunch and eat mostly protein.


Eat mostly protein all day after 12pm? Then back to normal on Monday?


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

leezers said:


> Meant to say mate, obv there's loadsa fat in these foods, does that matter on refeed day?


It's not make or break. Low fat options are normally a good bet. So long as carb makes approx 60% I wouldn't stress


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

leezers said:


> Eat mostly protein all day after 12pm? Then back to normal on Monday?


Yep


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

simonthepieman said:


> Yep


Do I do a refeed every week mate??


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## cplmadison (Nov 26, 2013)

MFM said:


> I'm aiming for 10% bf and have lost 12kg in 4 months being on the first cut I've ever been on.
> 
> I'm on around 2000 calories a day, which I know seems very little, but this is the only way I've been able to drop the fat so far. I'm sticking to my daily macros which are as follows.
> 
> ...


quite late replying and havnt read all the replies but look into the keto diet, 2000 cals <40g carbs 120g fat

with 30 mins cardio you should lose more bodyfat

honestly with your weight which is very similar to mine i would say your overeating on protein by about 80 grams


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## Sharp161 (Jan 31, 2010)

I didn't read whole thread but if were me I'd throw in some days of maintenance cals with some cardio on those days to try and fire up metabolism. Works well for me similar to a calorie cycling approach


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## andyhuggins (Nov 21, 2008)

I will try and read the whole thread first :lol:


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## NoGutsNoGloryy (Jan 7, 2013)

Train more and split up your routine different body part each day and do like 10-15mins cardio at end of each workout it's better than doing separate days for cardio cause your metabolism is already jacked up from weight training


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## lufc90 (Mar 27, 2014)

MFM said:


> Wow, 20g of fat? I'm on 60g of fat a day now and I thought that was low.
> 
> Could this possibly be why I'm struggling too? Maybe I should lower my fat intake some more?


If you are natty don't even think about dropping your fat never mind dropping it to 20g per day

Your testosterone will drop dramatically resulting in loss of sex drive,increased fatigue,muscle loss and even fat gain, don't even think about dropping the fat if you like feeling like a man


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