# My progress after 6 months-ish, with first course of oral steroids



## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

Where to start? I'm 23, and in the past have always attempted the gym, but given up after a month. But, i'm 6 months in now, and loving every second.

The picture was taken about 4 weeks ago. Weighing 77kg.

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About 3 weeks ago I started, for the first time, my first course of oral steroids... For the first week, I took 3 a day, and after that, 4 a day, with food, spread throughout the day. I've got about 7-8 days left, then i'll take a month off, and then start the second course of oral steroids. Once that is finished, I plan to move onto injectable.

I've kind of neglected my cardio, partly due to lazyness/boredom of pounding tarmac/groin and hamstring injury. At some point I will re-start, but weight loss isn't a goal of mine. I know I need to lose the fat around my lower abs, but i'm happy with the way it is for now. My major concern is hiding my high rib cage. It's starting to become less prominent, (if you could see photos of me from when I was 15...) I've been doing a lot of chest and upper ab workouts to try and sort of cover them up, anyone got any other suggestions?

Other than that, I keep my leg exercises light. I bicep curl 16kg on each arm with dumb bells. There's a machine at the gym I really like using, but don't know what it's called... you sit down, lock your legs under padded support, and using both arms, pull the bar down. I think it's meant to replicate pull ups, working your lats and biceps. I do 85kg with that.

I've been keeping my amount of sets to 3 with 6-8 reps, depending how i'm feeling.

I'm spending about 40 minutes in the gym, 3-4 times a week, my brother (who used to be built like a s*** house door years ago) says I need to be spending more time there now I'm taking steroids but honestly, my arms are f***** after 40 minutes, those 40 minutes are so intense I can barely move my arms afterwards. Should I be spending more? I'm seeing the gains with what I'm doing. Each gym session consists of all over body workout, I'm not isolating muscles groups, and leaving 1-2 day rest inbetween. Also, i'm not taking protein or creatine, can't afford it right now so I adjusted my diet, cheaper and healthier

So any help/comments (be nice  ) would be much appreciated and i'll get another photo up tomorrow evening after i've been to the gym.

Cheers and merry christmas


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## mark_star1466868017 (Jul 14, 2011)

very restrained there, Fleg mate, well done


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## justheretosnoop (Jun 15, 2012)

Ha, Fleg's internally raging right now I know!!

As for not affording the likes of creatine/protein - ok but where are the magic beans coming from, the tooth fairy???!


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

Dont take this the wrong way fella but you have got a lot to learn.

As fleg says, what about pct? General time between steroid cycles is time on+pct off minimum before going on again.

I'd be pretty sure from what you have written your diet and training won't be 100% spot on.

You can afford gear but no protien supps but yet supps can be cheaper than food although not a replacement granted.

Have a good read through the sections on here and get some basic knowledge. Look up PCT.

Post up your full work out routine, your stats height weight bf etc and diet and people will be able to give you a few pointers.


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## allbro75 (Mar 15, 2007)

Hello esquire, A few things to maybe getting more advice.

Whats your full stats including height?

Whats your average diet i a day like, just list example meals ad times.

What's your workout split ie what muscle groups are you working together.

What's your goals from doing weights?

You don't need to work your abs to get a six pack, doing things like squats, deadlifts and a good compound based routine will hit your abs along with dropping body fat. You don't need to take protein and creatine but protein is usefull and cheaper than most protein rich foods so don't understand what you saying there.

I think you have a lot to learn and there is a friendly bunch of well educated people on here that are willing to help you but they might tell you things that you won't want to hear but will help you to progress.

Welcome to the board and feel free to ask questions no matter how dumb they might seem, only way to learn.

Allen.

What oral steroids are you doing?


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## allbro75 (Mar 15, 2007)

I didn't copy sx dave by the way i must've been writing that while he posted it lol


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

Great mind ay Allen, they are both pretty much the same response lol.


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## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

Thanks for posting so quickly. Why am I not ready for steroids? I drinks lots of water, cranberry, and milk thistle every day. I haven't noticed a change in my mood, maybe slightly more emotional, and I haven't had any stomach pains, or blood in my urine or stool.

My height is 6ft 3", I'm fairly lanky.

My BMI is 21.8.

Weight is 77kg.

My daily diet would be something like...breakfast at 8am which is cereal with a banana chopped up on it with semi-skimmed milk. Then a snack mid-morning, nuts or a piece of fruit. For lunch, normally 2 sandwiches (4x slices of wholemeal bread) with lowfat marge, tuna mayo and cucumber is a favourite, or ham and salad. Or sometimes its a jacket potato and beans. Mid-afternoon, another piece of fruit. Then I get home and go to the gym, after the gym i scramble up a couple of eggs. Then for dinner, we normally have lightly steamed veg with fish, or cous cous, or chicken, we often eat lentils and various types of beans. Not much red meat in the house tbh. That's normally it for the day. Not one piece of processed food in our fridge or cupboards.

The reason I don't buy protein powder is because we get eggs very cheaply from my girlfriends family who has a hen farm. I just give the yolks to our dogs/cat/wild birds in the garden and a visiting hedgehog which comes along every now and again. I was using MyProtein prior to the eggs.

A general upper body workout for me includes: (assume all are 3x sets of 8x reps with a 30 second rest between each set and normally 90 seconds between each exercise)

Standing bicep curl 14kg each side

Preacher curl, but with dumbbells, not a barbell 16kg each side

Drag curl, again with dumbbells 12kg each side

30 wide press ups, rest for 15 seconds, as many close-press ups as possible, normally 7-9. Repeated twice more.

Lat pull down machine 80-85kg

Fly Chest machine 85kg

Bench press 50kg (with dumb bells)

20 sit ups, then hang from the pull up bar and raise my thighs to my chest 15 times. Repeated twice more.

If I feel ok the next day, I go to the gym and repeat, but I never do more than 2 consecutive days, and always have 2 days rest on Saturday and Sunday.

Some of the research (I did do some, see) suggested that in your first year of training, I shouldn't isolate muscle groups, but to try and work every muscle during the workout. I don't squat and don't deadlift. At some point I would like to start, but there is no barbell at the gym and i'm tied into the contract for another 6 months, at which point i'll be heading down the road to a new gym with a much more focused outlook on body building. I don't want to be absolutely massive with veins popping out of every inch of my skin, just to look good. Maybe an extra 10-15kg of muscle? I'm not really sure. And the orals are 10g methandrostenolone.

I'm here to learn and sure as hell didn't mean to piss anybody off. The steroids were just to give me a boost so I could work out harder and longer, and see gains for my efforts. I'd read somewhere that for orally taken steroids, that the Post Cycle Therapy wasn't necessary?


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## allbro75 (Mar 15, 2007)

Your diet is ok for someone living a healthy lifestyle but for someone doing weight training I'd say it was lacking. The only real protein in your first 2 meals comes from a little drop of nuts. Your first meal would be a better place for some eggs IMO alog with your cereal. I try and have every meal balanced with protein, carbs & fat, my carb sources change throughout the day. You have quite a lea physique to build on but don't think you will with that diet while training.

You said you didn't think you were to isolate muscles in the first year but you list quite a few isolation exercises in your routine, and you are concentrate on biceps far too much, they won't grow that way IME. Forget chest flys just now and concentrate on pressing, thats what will stimulate more growth, as crazycal says why try and shape something you don't have. Press ups are great, too many people overlook bodyweight exercises, you could always balance a weight plate on your back to make it harder.

I'd recomend pull ups over a lat pull down TBH, chins is what changed the shape of my back after wasting too long on lat pull downs. You can do deads and squats with dumbells mate, look up vids on youtube if you need to. My body changed completely when I started doing deads and squats and there's no reason not to do them if you are healthy. I'm injured just now and actualy miss the feeling of completing a heavy dead/squat sesh.

I think Fleg meant at your age and for what you want you don't eed any kind of steroids because your natural test levels will still be decent and if you eat and train right you will see good gains in a year. I don't have any experience with those orals so maybe someone else can jump in and help out with pct an d what not.

Go to the beginers section and there is a sticky post at the top about a fullbody workout, have a quick read ad see what you think, the guy who wrote it has a lot of experience helping people getting started the right way.

Allen.


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## justheretosnoop (Jun 15, 2012)

Diet alone says your not ready for gear, let alone other factors.

Sorry cant write more, in a mad dash. I'm sure the guys will add though....


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## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

More protein it is. I read somewhere that glucose can help your body digest the protein so that it reaches your musces quicker, do you know if there's any truth to that? Maybe I'll have to bite the bullet and buy some protein powder. I've got a bit of cash in the paypal account, can anyone point in the right direction on Ebay for decent stuff? I still have quite a lot of Creatine left over, so that's an option as well.

I do want to bulk up, I feel my muscles are fairly well conditioned now, they're used to the movements, so maybe it would be time to change my workout anyway?

I'll have a look on youtube for the squats  Only problem with doing pull ups is that the pull up bar attached to one of those multi workout machines, so there's always somebody on the damn thing.

Could I do a chest press as well as chest fly in the same workout, with success? Only reason I ask is 'cos I feel that the fly machine has given me the greatest growths so far.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

you could make lots of natural gains at your height and weight.

youre the same weight as me dude and am nearly lol 5"9

basically you dont train your legs.

cos you dotn train youre legs youre not training half your body.

so youre not getting maximal natural test/gh output.

read my sticky in the beginners section dude..


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## scotty T (Oct 8, 2011)

Get on amazon and buy the book sliced by negrita jayde, it will sort out all your nutrition qeustions.


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## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

Thanks Cal, looks interesting. I'm definitely going to use the military press, done it a few times before, it hurts! Also going to include the bench press. I'll give the squats a go but working out on my own, i'm a bit worried about my posture. Thanks Scotty, i'll have a look after new year


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## allbro75 (Mar 15, 2007)

Extreme nutrition gives you a decent discount on here, I like myprotein, it dosen't have to be eBay, another cheapish one is nutrisport 90+ its not the worst out there and its about £40 for 5kg. If taste and quality is your aim, use extreme.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

search *mark ripptoe squats and deadlift form *on youtube mate.

up until recently i`d been doing them wrong.

i can now squat without a belt with a fusion on my back and theres not a hint of discomfort.


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## BurnsideNo1 (May 14, 2011)

Esquire.....get back on Amazon after purchasing the Scotty T's book suggestion and add to cart - Beyond Brawn, Stuart McRobert - I'm sure CAL and the guys will agree - you'll learn a lot from reading too!  I did it mate and I reckon a lot of the guys on here also started with it. In fact I think most of the guys on here have it as a pdf....maybe, as it's Christmas, and f you ask REAL nice they might let you have a copy? Only maybe though 

Good luck with it mate, it's well worth doing it right! And these guys will straighten you out should you stray.


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## eglwys (Aug 28, 2011)

Esquire, Don't be put off Welcome to Muscle Chat and listen to the guys I started on here not long ago and the knowledge I have gained from the guys on here is invaluable. Spend a good hour of your time reading through as many threads on here as possible, If their are any terms you are unsure of chances are their is a thread on here like PCT etc just an example.

When I started I did not learn the value of compound movements until speaking to people on here, Deadlifts, Squats, Bench Press, Mill Press all of these make up the basis of your workouts and then slip in other exercises to build your routine. Working leg's is a must I hate legs but you must do them, You wish to add weight you must do legs and all the compound movements give you a good solid core.

Like others have said your not ready for steroids. You have only been training like myself for 6 months that is no where near enough time to establish what your body can achieve naturally you need to get everything spot on your routine, diet everything then build up naturally over time, then and only when you have reached a max you without gaining should you CONSIDER maybe using gear. Your 23 your a young man testosterone should be flowing through you without the need to add anymore.


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## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

Cheers guys, it's really good for moral having all these tips. Tomorrow night, after the gym, i'm gunna post a picture up, for my own records as much as anything. Even though it is obvious my knowledge is somewhat lacking, the exercises i have been doing..i've made sure my form is absolutely 100% with every single lift, slow, and steady, and I have seen some gains and have slowly upped the weight i'm lifting. I don't think the last 6 months have been a complete waste :/ I think if i change my routine around a bit, get some proper protein into me (think i've got the resting part down ok, i do love lying in bed lol) and get me some good reading like you suggested, i should start to see much quicker results. Actually really excited to go back to the gym tomorrow night. I wont start asking for anything but advice just yet, i'll let them know i'm here to stay before I get cheeky 

Edit: It probably won't sound it, but i've done a lot of research into weight lifting, im not walking into this completely blind, I watched scooby's videos on youtube for hours at a time, its getting it all together, so everything comes into harmoy and balance at the same time so that you can find that little piece of perfection, that i'm struggling with. So far, you guys have been a massive help


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## Chrissy....... (Nov 25, 2013)

Get benching, squatting and deadlifting, and cut all the bicep curls, what are you actually taking in the way of gear.


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## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

10g methandrostenolone 4x a day...

I know how many of you are saying i'm not ready, so after this course, i'll up the protein, squats and deadlift, and see how much weight I can pack on over a couple of months. Then if i cut after that, i might be getting somewhere towards what id like to achieve. Or maybe ill become addicted to bulking,, ,dont think my girlfriend would like it too much if i shave my head though...


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

its not that youre just not ready bud, if your training was good and your diet was good you`d have more leeway, basically no one waits till theyre ready.. lets have it right..

btw sod scooby doo, search mark ripptoe on you tube and check out his form vids.

you can download a copy of beyond brawn at my forum or straight off any torrent site.

they are the biggest things you can do to sort your trainingn out.

n read my beginners thread cos its a heavily shortened version of SOME of what brawn suggests


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## allbro75 (Mar 15, 2007)

TBH I do't think you realy need to be bulking and cutting, you are quite lea as it is so it will quite easy with a balanced diet to put on muscle without and fat.

What chris says is so true, if you workout 3x a weeks then put one of those exercises on each day as they are the main 3 and take the most effort. If you go to thecrazycal's progress journal and you can see from his workouts that more is not better and you can achieve a good look with concentrating on the right exercises and being consistant with your diet. And I'm sure he wont take offence when I say he dosen't have your age on his side either.

Anyway mate hope you're taking some of the advice and hope you stick around ad join in the forum.

If you think some people are being a bit tough on you its probably because they wasted time on the same thing you are doing and its frustrating watching other people doing the same mistakes.

A example of my workout is

Day 1 - Bench press, Shoulder press, bodyweight dips & close grip bench press

Day 2 - Deadlifts, pullups, seated rows & 21's

Day 3 - Squats, leg curls, calf raises & farmers walk with DB's

I'm not saying its perfect but its done me well, I put most effort into the first exercise and it takes a lot of will to get through the end of it. It dosen't seem a lot but I have grown quite well using this as a base.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

forget about the next couple of months, think about training hard for a year..

i`m on my second 5 year plan,,


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

allen put chest day i n the middle and you got a good one..


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## Esquire (Dec 22, 2011)

Ok, I get that, look ahead one year so you're mentally prepared to be in it for the long haul sorta thing?


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

yes matey, there are no quick fixes..


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## allbro75 (Mar 15, 2007)

Thats what I do cal, i never do chest at the start of the week as all the pests are in the way, don't know why i wrote it that way.


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## Hard Trainer (Apr 29, 2009)

Oh dear is all im saying!


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## renshaw (Jun 5, 2012)

hows it going?? have you been following the advice and sorting your diet & training?


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## Tom84 (Dec 12, 2005)

'I'm 23, and in the past have always attempted the gym, but given up after a month. But, i'm 6 months in now'... Good you have your whole first year of fantastic natural gains to come through eating 6 solid meals of 30g protein+ with a solid amino profile, + complex carbs tapered throughout the day + fats with the correct omega 3,6,9 ratios + a solid sleeping pattern if your lifestyle allows + a solid lifting routine based around compound movements...

'About 3 weeks ago I started, for the first time, my first course of oral steroids...' Wait what?

' For the first week, I took 3 a day, and after that, 4 a day'... of what...

'I've got about 7-8 days left, then i'll take a month off, and then start the second course of oral steroids.' Once that is finished, I plan to move onto injectable.'... Oh good so no PCT then, this sounds like a clearly structured plan. In fact this is in no way the reason why people more experienced than yourself who do decide to use AAS feel they get an undeserved bad name.

...Oh and your routine appears to be structured around bicep curls. I would have never guessed


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