# Dorian yates' cycle posted (apparently legit)



## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

''just got the new md and dorian put his olympia stack and offseason cycle in his article, this is what he said,

pre olympia- weekly Test Prop 300mg

tren 152 mg

primobolan 500mg

Daily- Anavar 50mg

GH 8 ius

offseason cycle- weekly- Test 750mg didnt say what kind.

Deca- 500mg

daily- 50mg''

http://forums.musculardevelopment.com/showthread.php/115119-Dorians-olympia-stack-and-offseason-cycle-in-new-md

and

''*His very first cycle, in 1985 for his first contest was:*

*Weeks 1-4:*

*20 mg. d-bol a day*

*Weeks 5-8*

*Daily: 15 mg Anavar tabs*

*Weekly: 100 mg. Primobolan injectable''*

http://forums.musculardevelopment.com/showthread.php/115119-Dorians-olympia-stack-and-offseason-cycle-in-new-md/page6

Ron Harris throughout swears it's true, and Lee Priest chips in once to offer support. Interesting stuff.


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## C.Hill (Nov 21, 2010)

Tren seems a low dose? How accurate do you think this info is?


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

C.Hill said:


> Tren seems a low dose? How accurate do you think this info is?


Ron Harris swears its legit, and says he verified the article several times with Dorian. It's in the new MD... which I don't have. I actually bought a copy of Flex the other day. Was a nice novelty reading it again.


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## arnoldisnumerou (Jan 7, 2009)

This will please the hordes continually speculating/guessing his cycles


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## MusclesBound (Jul 5, 2011)

You sure that's not daily? Or EOD?


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

As in the MD thread, and people who don't post, many are saying the doses are too low. it must be fake or a PR stunt to discourage the excessive doses used by AAS users.

Whereas, maybe, he just responded/s really well to gear, and training, and nutrition.


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## Chelsea (Sep 19, 2009)

Pre Olympia that has to be a daily dose!


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

ive been following that thread on MD and 75% of people think its BS, and apparently the pre olympia cycle is 300mg prop a week! Im only on my first cycle so im no chem expert but Tbh, i honestly dont believe it, unless he is the most genetically superior freak to ever walk the earth (which he obvoiulsy had good genetics). But common on now, hardly a total of a gram a week pre contest.


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

1MR said:


> ive been following that thread on MD and 75% of people think its BS, and apparently the pre olympia cycle is 300mg prop a week! Im only on my first cycle so im no chem expert but Tbh, i honestly dont believe it, unless he is the most *genetically superior freak to ever walk the earth* (which he obvoiulsy had good genetics). But common on now, hardly a total of a gram a week pre contest.


Mr Olympia 6x so he probably is among the best in the world. Not the best, but among a handful.


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## Fatstuff (Mar 2, 2010)

I work with a guy who doesnt train whatsoever i reckon his genetics must be mental, he looks lean big and fairly muscular. particularly for someone who doesnt train


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

m118 said:


> Mr Olympia 6x so he probably is among the best in the world. Not the best, but among a handful.


he is one in a million in terms of genetics thats for sure. But lets take his offseason cycle, you see a lot of guys doing that on like there second or third cycle.Still, his dosages were probably a lot less than what pros use today.


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

fatmanstan! said:


> I work with a guy who doesnt train whatsoever i reckon his genetics must be mental, he looks lean big and fairly muscular. particularly for someone who doesnt train


how i envy them sort of people. i wish i was a genetic freak lol


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

1MR said:


> how i envy them sort of people. i wish i was a genetic freak lol


me too. at times it seems my genetics resist me putting on muscle.


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## Rick89 (Feb 27, 2009)

The thing with dorian was he worked hard everyday day in day out for years, he stuck to a plan 365 days a year and was the most dedicated man in bodybuilding IMO, this made up for his genetics being poorer than his competitor (not poor genes but not that of sonbaty and dilllet etc), he always said he used fairly low doses but who knows, well never truly know tbh, although I know some very big guys that claim low doses and know their **** with peps etc and maybe this was his thinking, he sufffered some serious health issues at one point but they were down to painkiller reliant when he suffered his tears and this caused stomach bleeding etc, my geuss though to be honest is he used more than stated IMO.


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## darksider (Apr 5, 2011)

Theres loads of cycles flying about that are supposed to be Dorians for sure unless he comes out and says what he was using we will never know imo its all just speculation.

To hold onto 250 lbs of solid muscle that pre oly cycle seems low to me but like I said just guessing!


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

I don't find that unbelievable tbh (on the gear front that is) - there is no fixed correlation that a big guy needs more gear.

I still grow on doses the same as I was using years ago; my issue - and I'll bet the issue with most other people too - is that we don't have the drive, or the day by day, hour by hour, minute by minute consistency, that the guys who make it to the top do.

Genetics play an issue of course, but consistency is the one key IMO.

Also, I used to think I train like a pussy, still do - but the more folk I see I realise I am not that bad - the majority of people train half ar$ed and stop when it starts to get interesting. No WAY I train as intensely as these guys tho, I don't think I am capable, just like no matter how much I boot a ball, I'll never be a pro footballer.

Apart from all that, I just don't see what relevance it has, in the context of comparing individual to individual - but interesting none the less.

Of course, we all want to believe he and all pros are on insane amounts - hey, it gives us all an excuse for having done a few cycles and still looking sh1t :lol:


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

i think a lot of people get to worked up when they see a supposedly pro cycle and start calling it lies, they must assume that the reason guys like jay, ronnie, branch, kai are so huge is that they must be Juiced to the gills with extremely high doses of aas, peptides and insulin, true that some of them are, however no amount of drugs in the world is going to turn everyone into mr olympia


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

offseason cycle- weekly-

Test 750mg didnt say what kind.

Deca- 500mg

Anavar daily- 50mg

Yup, tbh, I would grow like a weed on that if I got my finger out, trained like I know I am capable of, ate like I know I am capable of, got my 8 hrs sleep, stopped drinking, stopped stressing, and above all just got consistent - pretty much my doses too, except due to expense I'll use dbol rather than Anavar - might try this tho, less aromatisation, less water - and possibly more strength.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

i think the cycles that people THINK Pro's use are more the cycles that got them to be a Pro rather than what they used as a Pro......when you have attained a certain size it is much easier to use less and grow as you build a certain knowledge of what works and what does not....those who do not believe this are normally those who bang in to much gear and either look like sh1t or do not grow to justify the dose they are using......

it is human nature to try and find the easiest route to the end goal and in many peoples eyes that route is by using a sh1t load of steroids and PED's this could not be more untrue......

know your body and use less gear......Fact!!!


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Pscarb said:


> i think the cycles that people THINK Pro's use are more the cycles that got them to be a Pro rather than what they used as a Pro......when you have attained a certain size it is much easier to use less and grow as you build a certain knowledge of what works and what does not....those who do not believe this are normally those who bang in to much gear and either look like sh1t or do not grow to justify the dose they are using......
> 
> it is human nature to try and find the easiest route to the end goal and in many peoples eyes that route is by using a sh1t load of steroids and PED's this could not be more untrue......
> 
> know your body and use less gear......Fact!!!


I agree, buy however the more gear you use the better results you get... also fact. I'm not supporting the idea of more is better, but the more you use the more you gain, also the more side effects you get of course


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

ironman1985bcn said:


> I agree, buy however the more gear you use the better results you get... also fact. I'm not supporting the idea of more is better, but the more you use the more you gain, also the more side effects you get of course


That is simply not true, at least not universally.

Everyones benefit to side effect ratio is different, I have tried higher doses, they just make me ill, and everything suffers. I'd wager a lot of trainers could cut their gear in half and still make the same gains.

Indeed Paul is a great example, by his own admission uses far less now that he once did, and is looking best ever. I know a good few people who are in same situ.

So, more gear CAN equal more gains, but only ever to a point.


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## The Ultimate Warrior (Dec 20, 2010)

Funnily enough I have to agree.

I know I often post about quite high dose cycles, however I have always been the first to admit I use too much. Like its been said, knowing your body in depth will always trump a higher dose.

And for the record, I would happily believe thats what Dorian used to take or has taken at one time, however, and I don't wish to offend anyone, but I would say it would be very nieve to believe this is his dosages while being MR. O.


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

rs007 said:


> That is simply not true, at least not universally.
> 
> Everyones benefit to side effect ratio is different, I have tried higher doses, they just make me ill, and everything suffers. I'd wager a lot of trainers could cut their gear in half and still make the same gains.
> 
> ...


And for it, is wh I don't support the "more the better", I think you must use the "higer dosage" you can handle. In therms of "pro's" I doubt anyone of them goes lower than what they can handle... I mean, why would they?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

ironman1985bcn said:


> I agree, buy however the more gear you use the better results you get... also fact. I'm not supporting the idea of more is better, but the more you use the more you gain, also the more side effects you get of course


i am assuming that by results you mean keepable gains?? lets assume this is the case then you are incorrect.......then all anyone would need to do is to use large doses and they would look huge yes? so where is the saturation point? where sides and bad weight outweighs decent results? 2g, 3g, 5g per week?

i could use 5grams a week and i would gain shed loads but i would look like **** so if your goal is to just look big in a jumper or hoodie then that is correct that more is better but if you want to gain decent size and keep more than 50% of that gain more is not better and looking at the synergy one steriod has with another is more important than dose.......

i know plenty of guys on this and other forums who use 3 or 4 times more than i do but they are not any where near my size but they use more than me so they should be bigger??? the reason they are not is because they do not eat enough......as they believe in the one sided myth that the more gear you use the bigger you will be......if this was true there would be more super heavies than there is


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## Zangief (Aug 5, 2010)

Surly the likes of Coleman & Cuttler use very high doses of AAS along with GH & peptides to achieve such immense muslce growth??


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

ironman1985bcn said:


> And for it, is wh I don't support the "more the better", I think you must use the "higer dosage" you can handle. In therms of "pro's" I doubt anyone of them goes lower than what they can handle... I mean, why would they?


you miss the point mate it is about the big picture and the big picture is more about synergy than dose......many like to believe it takes huge doses to become a Pro and i am sure some have used huge doses to become Pro's but the majority do not when you compare to what is considered a NORMAL dose these days.......i know several Pro's personnelly one of my close friends is a Pro that stands on stage at 280lbs yet in comparison to the doses used on these forums his use is mild.......why because he lives and breathes it......his food is weighed year round, he routinely takes his supplements, he trains like a savage and he rests alot combine this with the right gear in the right amounts and you will be big but for many this is to hard and so using more gear makes up for not resting or missing a meal etc.....

i will admit there are some that look huge on huge doses but i have yet to see those guys onstage........i have seen plenty who use high doses and look huge off season but look normal onstage???

As RS has said i am looking and weighing the biggest i have ever been yet my last cycle was 525mg and my current one is 825mg the reason is because this is all i need to grow and grow well in my opinion more is not better....more = more sides....


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

MrMike said:


> Surly the likes of Coleman & Cuttler use very high doses of AAS along with GH & peptides to achieve such immense muslce growth??


they just might do but what is considered high doses when the norm these days is 2g for normal guys who go to the gym???

all we can do is assume because we will never know....but it is easier for someone to assume this as that gives them the excuse of "well if i took more like all the big guys do, i would look much bigger"


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## Zangief (Aug 5, 2010)

Pscarb said:


> they just might do but what is considered high doses when the norm these days is 2g for normal guys who go to the gym???
> 
> all we can do is assume because we will never know....but it is easier for someone to assume this as that gives them the excuse of "well if i took more like all the big guys do, i would look much bigger"


Well to me 2g a week is a high dose, but mayb not in some peoples mind. I found 500mg ew of test e very effective! I've also seen the documentary about Ronnie and i know what the guy eats.. i could not put that much away no matter how hard i tried.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Mike that is good to here mylast cycle was 525mg per week and it was extremly effective......this is my point who determines what is high?? and Pro's are like us some need more some don't...non of the Pro's i know use what i would say is a high dose


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## C.Hill (Nov 21, 2010)

rs007 said:


> just like no matter how much I boot a ball, I'll never be a pro footballer.


I like that^


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## Zangief (Aug 5, 2010)

Yeah there has to be a limit to how much test will actualy be effective? Surly when you hit 2/3g a week your wasting money ?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

MrMike said:


> Yeah there has to be a limit to how much test will actualy be effective? Surly when you hit 2/3g a week your wasting money ?


Although i do not buy into the more is better idea i also do not believe there is one figure that covers everyone....this is my point there is no one dose that anyone can say is to high as you need to attain what is considered the norm and that is impossible to attain.


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## GoHeavy (Jul 12, 2011)

There so many rumours on what he toke for comps, his seminar in Swasnea was mad - all the questions were about gear etc...

Even stuff like, growth on drip while he slept...... think thats getting beyond tbh.


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## Tinytom (Sep 16, 2005)

I think a lot has to be said for real gear as well.

Many people use underdosed or fake gear and because they dont get gains they use more and thats where the high dose theory gains weight so to speak 

Anyone who's used cambridge sus for example will know that you definately dont need 2g a week to see considerable results.

Plus as been said many use gear as a crutch to support poor training, diet and recovery.

Also as Paul has said the more you know your body the less you actually need. This diet Im using less than I ever have before but looking better. Theoretically of course, cos Im natural.


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## Pav Singh B. (Nov 6, 2010)

everybody is different, like Pscarb said there is not one figure that covers everyone..

one of the main things that separates a pro or a serious bodybuilder from the average joe in the gym is that a pro knows his own body and listens to his bodies feedback.. so a pro can use the same amount of gear/dose as most people on this thread consider 'normal dose', but the reason he is gaining more or better is because he knows his own body and what works, simples.


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

On bb.com there's the typical 'i know a few pros, and trust me, they use way more' or 'its bs, no way he can get that big, maybe it was his 1st cycle'

The denial is vast. Too many people assume if they can't get to Dorian's size based on the amount of gear they use then the story must be BS. Too many don't seem to consider any other factors.


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## Pav Singh B. (Nov 6, 2010)

Empire Boy said:


> I don't buy it for a second Yates is only injecting test prop 300mg tren 150mg a week for his 'cut' precomp, yeah, right. For sure its not all about the gear, but diet and training, but to get that freakishly big, THAT BIG and maintain that MASS ON A CUT, requires much more than food, genetics and training, and it sure as fck is more than 300mg test and 150mg of tren, with a bit or primo and var thrown in...


I agree to most of that,

with the years of training behind him, experience and knowledge he prob could still be able to use doses like that and still utilize the gear and gain well.. but having said that, even if he was using them compounds I also don't think he could have been using that low of a dose (20mg/day dbol, 300mg/week test and 150mg/week tren)

ofcourse its not all about the gear, it is ofcourse training and diet which is the key part..

but we all know deep inside us that nothing beats a good jab from a barrel of test, whether it be 'low' or high' dose :beer:


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## Beans (Sep 1, 2008)

m118 said:


> ''just got the new md and dorian put his olympia stack and offseason cycle in his article, this is what he said,
> 
> pre olympia- weekly Test Prop 300mg
> 
> ...


If you believe those cycles are all he ever used you'll believe anything..


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Well, Muscular development is owned by Twin Labs, so they no doubt pump their products and yes there would be some slant in that for money reasons.

Here is an article written by Big A that is a pro, posted here years ago.

Taken from professionalmuscle forum and written by the owner and IFBB Pro:

This site was always set up as an advanced site, where you can find TRUTHFUL information about bodybuilding, not bul**** and ideology promoted by people who generally have agendas.

This is the truth:

If your diet, training, health and rest are completely up to scratch, the more steroids you take, the bigger you will get. It's as simple as that.

Pros have got their diet, training (health for the most part) and rest up to a standard that works for them perfectly, but they are only the size they are due to the drugs they take. Don't beleive the crap from anyone, that they are not, even from the 'in the know' people that are on this board. Those very same people for the most part have used/use extremely higher dosages than what they preach. Why do they preach the low dosages? - various personal agendas.

Reality is that as a rule, 1g per week of test non stop year round is the 'off' time for the pros. Gear is added as it's obtained - no real detailed cycles as such. As long as they take the high dosages of gear, they'll grow (as long as the diet, training, health and sleep is up to scratch as mentioned previously).

Several grams of test per week, several grams of anabolics per week, up to 2g/week of tren, a **** load of orals, insulin several times a day year round, GH as much as can be afforded - 15 to 30IU/day, etc.

BUT, pros have the genetics to have their bodies accept the gear, and generally not get sick on it.

And ancilliary use is huge - liver aids to the max, anti-e's, dht blockers, cardio supps, cholesterol supps, etc.

Still, most of them are complete wrecks. They can't control bodily functions,

they pass out from walking a flight of stairs, they get drenched in sweat from tying their shoelaces. Gyno, baldness, dry skin, gout, excess bodily hair, acne, etc are ALL existant in virtually all of them.

It is not a healthy sport, drug use is ENORMOUS, but to ignore it and to preach otherwise is pathetic and not what this site is about.

BTW, Synthetek's books have on them who's who of current pros ordering Syntherol constantly. They ALL use it extensively. It is pathetic though, when one orders a bottle and their credit card gets declined due to not enough funds. You think a 30+ yo would have his life in order more than that.

Hillys post almost 2 years ago, in red is Phils comments:

Just to add to this guys.

As some of you no i was getting help from phil hernon over on pro muscle. I stoped working with him as when i stoped making gaisn his answere was just more gear no adjustment to diet or training.

when i questioned him he said the realuty and truth is more gear equals more growth. Most pro's and good level amatuers if not all are using alot of gear and thats just the way it is.

i have no reason to doubt him or big a as i believe both of them. below is a post BIG A put up i saved regarding his drug use.

thought it was a good post thats why i kept it.

I never took anything for BP. It was always perfect. Proscar for the prostate and hair loss. HCG/Clomid throughout. Femara and Nolvadex throughout. Niacin, fish oils, green tea, CQ10, aspirin for the cv system. metformin to counteract the insulin resistance. Inj B12 and l-carnintine. Liver aids. T3.

I owned my own vet drug company at the time, so I was paying less than $50 for a 500ml vial of test prop of 100mg/ml. That would last 1 year at 1g/week. All other gear was either through my vet company or on script through my pharmacy that I partially own. 50ml Stan was $18. 10ml Deca was $12 and so on. GH was the only expensive thing at $500 for 24IU.

So apart from the GH, the stuff to keep me healthy cost WAY more than the gear itself.

I do need to point out, that I did build up to that over many years, the way BBoy said. I didn't just jump from 250mg/week to the above regimen.

Also, Steele's post is spot on. Getting to pro size is having the genetics to accept the drugs in any quantity without sides. Most people don't have that ability.

And no, I didnt' have any mental issues that I remember. If anything, I am much happier on gear than off.

Personal experience - 1g/week of test in the form of Sustanon or Test Prop was my non stop base for many years. I lost count of the years when I was doing that, but it was way over 5.

Then I would 'cycle' on top of that - 3g of test/week, 1g/week anabolics, orals, insulin, gh.

Never had any sides. BP was always 120/80. Hdl/LDL was fine. No libido issues. Recovery did not take long when I stopped. Years later I fathered 2 children, while on hrt. No hairloss, no prostate issues, no gyno.

I was getting full health check ups (blood, heart, ultrasounds of liver, etc) every 3 months and every 4 weeks when cycling. I was using a HUGE amount of drugs/products to make sure I was getting no sides

Taken from another board Tom Princes cycle:

Week #1: 4 iu's GH/day; 4 x Sostenon 250 mg.; 200 mg. Deca Durabolin; 1 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day

Week #2: 4 iu's GH/day; 5 x Sostenon 250 mg.; 200 mg. Deca Durabolin; 1 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day

Week #3: 4 iu's GH/day; 5 x Sostenon 250 mg.; 200 mg. Deca Durabolin; 2 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; (pre a.m. workout) 2 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 200 mg. caffeine tab

Week #4: 4 iu's GH/day; 6 x Sostenon 250 mg.; 400 mg. Deca Durabolin; 2 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; (pre a.m. workout) 2 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 200 mg. caffeine tab

Week #5: 6iu's GH/day; 6 x Sostenon 250 mg.; 400 mg. Deca Durabolin; 2 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; (pre a.m. workout) 3 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 200 mg. caffeine tab

Week #6: 6 iu's GH/day; 6 x Sostenon 250 mg.; 400 mg. Deca Durabolin; 2 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; (pre a.m. workout) 3 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 200 mg. caffeine tab

Week #7: off; 5000 iu HCG/day; 2 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 4 clenbuterol/day (2 days on 1 day off); 300 mg. caffeine x 6 days/week (a.m. only)

Week #8: off; 2 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 4 clenbuterol/day (2 days on 1 day off); 300 mg. caffeine x 6 days/week (a.m. only)

Week #9: 6 iu's GH/day; 1200 mg. Test Cypionate; 600 mg. Deca Durabolin; 150 mg. Winstrol-V (50 mg. each M-W-F); 4 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 4 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 300 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

Week #10: 6 iu's GH/day; 1200 mg. Test Cypionate; 600 mg. Deca Durabolin; 150 mg. Winstrol-V (50 mg. each M-W-F); 4 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 4 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 300 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

Week #11: 6 iu's GH/day; 1200 mg. Test Cypionate; 600 mg. Deca Durabolin; 150 mg. Winstrol-V (50 mg. each M-W-F); 4 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 5 x Clenbuterol tabs, 300 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

Week #12: 6 iu's GH/day; 1200 mg. Test Cypionate; 600 mg. Deca Durabolin; 150 mg. Winstrol-V (50 mg. each M-W-F); 4 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 5 x Clenbuterol tabs, 400 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

Week #13: 6 iu's GH/day; 1200 mg. Test Cypionate; 600 mg. Deca Durabolin; 300 mg. Winstrol-V (100 mg. each M-W-F); 6 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 2 x 20 mg. Nolvadex tabs/day; 5 x 25 mg. Ephedrine tab, 400 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

Week #14: 6 iu's GH/day; 1500 mg. Test Cypionate; 600 mg. Deca Durabolin; 300 mg. Winstrol-V (100 mg. each M-W-F); 6 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 2 x 20 mg. Nolvadex tabs/day; 6 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 400 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

Week #15: off 6 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 2 x 20 mg. Nolvadex tabs/day; 6 x 25 mg. ephedrine tab, 400 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

**Week #16: off; 6 x 50 mg. Teslac tabs/day; 2 x 20 mg. Nolvadex tabs/day; 10 x Clenbuterol tab (Sun, Mon, Tue only), 400 mg. caffeine tab (a.m. only)

**Day of contest was at the end of 16th Week.


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## Zangief (Aug 5, 2010)

Thinking about taking that much gear turns my stomach, don't think i could do it!


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## Slight of hand (Sep 30, 2008)

don't believe DY doses for a second.

every single competitor i know takes at least 2/3 times that...and the rest.


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Pscarb said:


> i am assuming that by results you mean keepable gains?? lets assume this is the case then you are incorrect.......then all anyone would need to do is to use large doses and they would look huge yes? so where is the saturation point? where sides and bad weight outweighs decent results? 2g, 3g, 5g per week?
> 
> i could use 5grams a week and i would gain shed loads but i would look like **** so if your goal is to just look big in a jumper or hoodie then that is correct that more is better but if you want to gain decent size and keep more than 50% of that gain more is not better and looking at the synergy one steriod has with another is more important than dose.......
> 
> i know plenty of guys on this and other forums who use 3 or 4 times more than i do but they are not any where near my size but they use more than me so they should be bigger??? the reason they are not is because they do not eat enough......as they believe in the one sided myth that the more gear you use the bigger you will be......if this was true there would be more super heavies than there is


Obviously the diet is a crucial point, but I was asuming a correct food intake with the gear used. It's pretty much obvious you must eat according to how much AAS you are going to use.

There is no point in using 2g test and eating like you where using 500mg. It's just a waste of AAS and health.


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

i think you all missed one clue.....

look at the esters quoted at the start of the OP...

they are fast acting and so are at least eod more likely daily.....NOT weekly, they'd be though you in a few days at best


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

and how do you draw 152 mg????


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## JM (Oct 28, 2010)

Uriel said:


> and how do you draw 152 mg????


Parabolin amps are 76.5 MG each


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

ironman1985bcn said:


> Obviously the diet is a crucial point, but I was asuming a correct food intake with the gear used. It's pretty much obvious you must eat according to how much AAS you are going to use.
> 
> There is no point in using 2g test and eating like you where using 500mg. It's just a waste of AAS and health.


you would definatly think that wouldnt you


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

JM said:


> Parabolin amps are 76.5 MG each


ahhh

that makes sense lol


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

Beans said:


> If you believe those cycles are all he ever used you'll believe anything..


I believe Dorian was among the BEST in the world, not your average joe in the gym. This applies to his training, eating, rest, drive, and most likely his response to gear too.


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

does anyone recall hearing all the weird rumours about him having a litre of blood drawn out, doped overnight with some "wonder drug" and pumped back in the morning?? lol


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

Uriel said:


> does anyone recall hearing all the weird rumours about him having a litre of blood drawn out, doped overnight with some "wonder drug" and pumped back in the morning?? lol


 Who on earth comes up with these riducolous rumours lol. I mean what diffrence does taking the blood out have as opposed to just injecting the drug into you.


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

1MR said:


> Who on earth comes up with these riducolous rumours lol. I mean what diffrence does taking the blood out have as opposed to just injecting the drug into you.


I think people need an excuse as to how they simply cant get to his size, other than the obvious that he was in a minorty of genetics, drive and ability lol


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

Uriel said:


> I think people need an excuse as to how they simply cant get to his size/QUOTE]So true mate, people just assume as there not the size of a pro, the pros then must be on much more gear than them.


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## goonerton (Sep 7, 2009)

I am pretty confident that if I took the same amount or even double what the average pro takes, I would never get near their size. But IMO anyone who believes Yates was on less than 1.5g total AAS in his heyday in the build up to the Olympias , they could probably also be convinced that fairies exist...

I think what Hacksi posted is far nearer the truth...Just my opinion of course.


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## 1MR (Aug 12, 2011)

goonerton said:


> I am pretty confident that if I took the same amount or even double what the average pro takes, I would never get near their size. But IMO anyone who believes Yates was on less than 1.5g total AAS in his heyday in the build up to the Olympias , they could probably also be convinced that fairies exist...I think what Hacksi posted is far nearer the truth...Just my opinion of course.


 If most of us took what the pros took we prob wouldn't get to their size, however are they considered to have good genetics to building a lot more muscle than the average joe because maybe there myostatin levels are lower, so could these new peptides such as follistatin that are suppose to inhibit myostatin potentially give the average joe the ability to get as huge as the pros or closer. I know slightly random and off topic lol


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## manaja (Feb 10, 2008)

I think he would of used in a mass cycle as much gear as a small hospital, they used massive amounts Two years ago , the guy who owns our gym was competeing , he was on 3 grammes of cypionate (200mg-1ml ) week , 400 mg deca week , 150mg of test prop every day , plus growth, ins etc , very expensive !

I think Dorian would of been on much more. Theres no such thing as "proffesional stack" , people use what they think will suit them best and how they react gain wise from the stacks they use .


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## albion_dk (Dec 29, 2011)

I would like to point out that

More is not better

talking to some pro bodybuilders i was told that the magic numbers are

slow test E 750mg a week

Deca 500mg a week

Also that in MD DY said he did 50mg D-bol ED not anavar, and he was 8 weeks on 4 weeks off Year round.from the late 80th to 1997

that is like 10- 12 years of that is approx. 40 cycles of that

and that he didn't do these cycles to "get Big" he was doing them when he was already big so

Off Season Weight: 290 lbs

Competition Weight: 265 lbs

Pre comp

300mg of test p a week is 100 mg EOD

152 mg tren a week is 76.5 MG twice a week (half life of Tren H is 4.5 days)

500 mg primo is 5 times a week

So ya it is true and it will work

What i really would like to know is HOW many injections needles went into that making of dorian yates


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## james12345 (Jan 13, 2010)

Slight of hand said:


> don't believe DY doses for a second.
> 
> every single competitor i know takes at least 2/3 times that...and the rest.


Its post like this that are just cringeworthy.

my mate took this so X must be on Y.

who cares what your mates take?

Do they train like dorian did? do they eat like he did? do they have dorians genetics to respond to gear etc? is training and rest their full time job?

want me to answer that one for you?

Look at James L cycles, are your mates better bbers than him even though they take more than him???

Is dorian superior in every way to james L genetics ? yep


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## m118 (Feb 4, 2011)

albion_dk said:


> I would like to point out that
> 
> More is not better
> 
> ...


why are you bumping a thread that's 5 months old?


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## albion_dk (Dec 29, 2011)

m118 said:


> why are you bumping a thread that's 5 months old?


took that long t do the research


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## theBEAST2002 (Oct 16, 2011)

An old thread but i'll comment none the less. Dorian yates was part of the generation that startes to effectively use a new drug that'll change bodybuilding forever. That drug is called insulin. And that is responsible for his awe inspiring size. But those doses are WRONG, he well and truly had superior genetics and his body was able to process the greater amounts of gear...that coued with his greatest weapon, his drive to suceed. Is the reason bodybuilding will never be the same again.


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## ItsaSecret (May 28, 2012)

absolute bull **** he would of ran grams of gear. like seriously theres young dudes on here running grams so why/how the hell wouldnt this world class bber.

and lol at cycle. permenant blast changing compounds to suit his goals more like.


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

theBEAST2002 said:


> An old thread but i'll comment none the less. Dorian yates was part of the generation that startes to effectively use a new drug that'll change bodybuilding forever. That drug is called insulin. And that is responsible for his awe inspiring size


wow, finally someone on here who is a personal friend of Yates, how did he run it?


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## flecks (Dec 1, 2011)

hackskii said:


> Well, Muscular development is owned by Twin Labs, so they no doubt pump their products and yes there would be some slant in that for money reasons.
> 
> Here is an article written by Big A that is a pro, posted here years ago.
> 
> ...


 Im down here lol

great read, really enjoyed that...


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## Marshan (Aug 27, 2010)

Its hard to know....although I think that if you are able to, or force yourself, to eat vast quantities of food along with your (even minimal) AAS's you *HAVE* to grow. I know for myself what limits me is diet..quite simply the more I eat the bigger I get, even with as 'little' as 500 mg a week of test. Shur even with 40 mgs of dbol a day people can pack on big size easily...and again the limiting factor is how much they were eating at that time. Look at what Jay said he eats in the run up to the Mr.O...140 odd egg whites a day and thats not all of his protein. Its very simple really...the increased protein synthesis from AAS use will make anyone very big but not many are willing to make themselves eat the kind of quantities of protein pro's do. Add a wee bit insulin and GH in the mix (also something not a lot of people are willing to use) and its a recipe for hugeness.


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## flecks (Dec 1, 2011)

what does the insuilin do mate, do you know...? It sounds a bit dodgy to me but if its been around for so long mabe not.y


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2012)

I remember seeing the Muntzer cycle that got leaked, he was jabbing 3 times more than that along with crazy (for back then) Gh dosages.


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## Gridlock1436114498 (Nov 11, 2004)

I think its a vanity thing from him, put this out to try and pretend that he did what he did on doses about 1/4th what they actually were.

Same as when people talk crap like Arnie winning Olympia on 5mg of Anvar a week because it makes him sound even more super Human.


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## flecks (Dec 1, 2011)

hackskii said:


> Well, Muscular development is owned by Twin Labs, so they no doubt pump their products and yes there would be some slant in that for money reasons.
> 
> Here is an article written by Big A that is a pro, posted here years ago.
> 
> ...


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

Gridlock said:


> I think its a vanity thing from him, put this out to try and pretend that he did what he did on doses about 1/4th what they actually were.
> 
> Same as when people talk crap like Arnie winning Olympia on 5mg of Anvar a week because it makes him sound even more super Human.


couldnt agree more, very similar to the same BS he states that he mostly spends no more than 45minutes in the gym 3-4x per week. :whistling:


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## moochman (May 9, 2006)

I used to have PT with a very well known pro from tghe 90's and one of the best we have produced. I spoke to him about gear usage and he used to take 300mg of prop a week as the mainstay of his cycles. He used to say my 2000mg of test a week was proposterously over the top and was a waste of time and money. And he advocated "the more you take, the bigger you do not get." People just think it is BS because they don't get anywhere near as big for taking way more than the pro's. Sure, there are pro's that may have/do take a ton of gear but that doesn't mean all. And I count a number of pro's as friends and I know what they all take also.


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## Matdylan (Jun 3, 2012)

Good post thank you. Dorian is the one I usaly follow for work outs I like heavy short sets myself.


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## B.I.G (Jun 23, 2011)

I don't believe those doses for a second. Maybe they were the doses before he got his pro card.

Notice how when these guys win their pro card the next year they blow up.. Do you think they're eating or training can add another 30lbs that quick? I can't see it, must be the increase in juice, gh and slin.


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## robbo9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Im guessing he will be using all of the purest steroids no bunk ugl


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## moochman (May 9, 2006)

I don't think anyone seriously thinks that pro's use the same underground sh*t that most boys at the gym use do they? I remember when gear really was gear and when I took 1000mg of enanthate a week, after about 4 weeks I was unable to function; constantly tired, cramping, headaches etc. And one of my pro friends said "I told you, you take way too much gear than is good for you." Fast forward a few years and I could easily handle a combined weekly total of over 3000mgs (jabs and tabs) and I handled that fine. I really don't think my tolerance for gear increased as I got older, just that the quality of the gear was sh*t.

The simple facts are these; anyone who is good enough to make the top 10 the the Mr Olympia has off the planet genetics and respond way better than we could ever dream of to diet, training and gear. Those who doubt are just jealous because they take more gear than top pro's and get very little results in comparison.

I had a meeting with a 'Master Trainer" back in June 2009 and he was shocked at the amount of gear I took and explained that my body was having to work so hard to process what I was putting in, there was no way my body could function efficiently to process food so my diet was not going to be nearly as effective as it would be normally. Tthe result of my meeting? He reduced my gear intake by a 3rd. Despite what all the doubters think, everywhere I turned throughout the last 8 years, the answers have been the same; "You don't need anywhere near that much gear - it isn't the miracle answer people think it is..."

On another note, didn't Flex Wheeler post his cycles in MD a few years back and if I recall, he was using doses totally about 800mg a week and I am sure Kevin Levrone published something somewhere where he said the same.


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## TheMeatWagon (Dec 3, 2012)

m118 said:


> ''just got the new md and dorian put his olympia stack and offseason cycle in his article, this is what he said,
> 
> pre olympia- weekly Test Prop 300mg
> 
> ...


HGH in 1996? Whoa, lots of skulls ripped open eh


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## Goosh (Jun 24, 2012)

I've just watched





 (start at 23:48) and found this thread (I wanted to find out his cycle).

About his dosages, Dorian mentions his cycle in the video and I think he touches on it quite well that:

- labs back then were legitimate pharmaceutical companies and are now underground labs so the quality might not be as good.

- He suspects peoples dosages that they are running might be as "true" in terms of how much they contain 'cause the volumes he hears of people taking scares him.

Great explanation of steroids; what they are, why they use them and why they are safer than a lot of over-the-counter drugs.


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## Zorrin (Sep 24, 2010)

RIP Joe Weider, just saw on the news that he's passed on.

Poppycock and Balderdash! Yates already lied for years, saying it was all down to hard work, this protein and this creatine.

Unless he's a homeopathist, he will know that no steroids = no effect, some steroids = some effect, more steroids = more effect. He's a competitor who wants to win, and will have to stand on stage almost naked while every bodypart is scrutinized.

Think how big he could have been if only he'd taken bigger, but still reasonable doses. He must regret not using enough steroids every day of his life. He could have been a monstrous vascular pro bodybuilder, and one of the most muscular men on the planet.

Oh.


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## boxinmetx (Sep 30, 2012)

Tinytom said:


> I think a lot has to be said for real gear as well.
> 
> Many people use underdosed or fake gear and because they dont get gains they use more and thats where the high dose theory gains weight so to speak
> 
> ...


sorry it's a reply to an old comment but couldn't help it  I joined the gym and was working out with two blokes that started together at the same time, they had been training 7 years and where on tons of gear and i thought wow, i want to look like that, i was 9st4lb and 5ft 10.5" i did my research and decided i''d take stuff too, i took 500mg a week of karachi sust for 20 weeks, i ate loads of clean food and by the end and after i lost the bloat and did pct i was 11st 7 and u could still see my ab's, the guys who took tons and had trained for years couldn't believe it when i told they i was eating 8 full meals a day and a shake with every meal and didn't drink on weekends or eat junk for the whole cycle, anyway they continued drinking and taking loads of gear and now 4 years later they look exactly the same, i did a 12 week cycle and went up to 12st 6lb after pct and i looked like they did after 7 years, i realised they assumed they took gear and grew,and went the whole week end drinking and eating crap when they where hungry, they said oh it must be ur genetics, not the food.. but imo i wouldn't take any more that 750mg of test a week as long as i knew it had the amount of gear it says on the label, i think i could easily take 500mg a week and be happy with the gains indefinitely, but i'm not ever going to compete..i think??


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## zack amin (Mar 13, 2012)

Do I believe doriyans cycle??hhmmmmm deep down I think I don't want to believe it, but speaking to n ifbb pro few days back, he told me the exact cycle doriyan stated down to the T. And his own cycle for the Olympia, certainly interesting


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## The Cheese (Sep 22, 2012)

boxinmetx said:


> i did a 12 week cycle and went up to 12st 6lb after pct and i looked like they did after 7 years


12 stone 6lbs?

And they looked the same as you after 7 years of using gear?

You sure they were using gear?


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

zack amin said:


> Do I believe doriyans cycle??hhmmmmm deep down I think I don't want to believe it, but speaking to n ifbb pro few days back, he told me the exact cycle doriyan stated down to the T. And his own cycle for the Olympia, certainly interesting


ExactlyAs i said earlier in the thread he was well known to my circle of friends back in the day,he came down and stayed at my mates house and without doubt he is not telling porkies,there is no point now is there?

Realy if you have the best genetics and food it aint too hard too grow that well.Another friend of mine had the Genetics too Peter Spencer(Rip)he grew like no other,i was fully aware what he was on i assisted his requirements back in the daytfd


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## boxinmetx (Sep 30, 2012)

The Cheese said:


> 12 stone 6lbs?
> 
> And they looked the same as you after 7 years of using gear?
> 
> You sure they were using gear?


yeah they def where but i don't know how long, i know they used to just stop when they couldn't get hold of anything and they would lift the same amounts for months at a time, and they where not lean, the one looked better than the other and was 13st or just a bit heavier, i bought sust of the one once and there where 3 different nile vials in the box, there was 3 legit amps and the rest where fakes and they didn't spot it or believe it was fake until they checked so they might have been doing as much bunk and legit, they still train now and they aren't really lifting more now, maybe they jusy go in get a pump and think they r done?


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## bigmitch69 (May 14, 2008)

robbo9 said:


> Im guessing he will be using all of the purest steroids no bunk ugl


Was thinking the same. Was gear better quality back in his day and Arnie's for that matter? I know there is still decent pharma gear about but also alot of fakes and UGLs which can be hit and miss.


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## boxinmetx (Sep 30, 2012)

after watching the youtube vid in which dorian talked about steroids, i noticed he said i was taking them consistently for 12 years and at way way in excess of medical doses, and any medicine that u can take excessive doses of for 12 years with no sides can't be that harmful...so i think it is the writer either misquoting, or it was ONE of dorians cycles ;D


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## boxinmetx (Sep 30, 2012)

bigmitch69 said:


> Was thinking the same. Was gear better quality back in his day and Arnie's for that matter? I know there is still decent pharma gear about but also alot of fakes and UGLs which can be hit and miss.


Yep definitely, Arnold talks about only needing one dianabol and using 3 at the most, iv'e used pharma test and it was amazing, the sust was awesome compared to any test iv'e used...watch ric drasins videos on youtube, he used to train with arnold he has 100's of videos talking about gear and the golden days, training with arnold, how they ate...really good videos


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## MrM (Feb 6, 2012)

But I guess modern pharma gear would be just as good as pharma gear from years ago?? Was pharma just more available then?


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## Marshan (Aug 27, 2010)

I'd be much more interested in how much insulin he was using.


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## Guest (Apr 2, 2013)

I can believe the dosage.i know a bloke that was dy training partner around 93,he told me there cycles were this.test 400mg ,eq 300mg,tren 150mg,shot twice per week,50mg dbol day,1 adex day.1 tamox a day,and he was a very big guy in awesome condition.nearl y turned pro himself but messed up due to other reasons.just what I know.


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## Poke (May 31, 2012)

Sorry to ask a dumb question but when you say 'pharma gear' do you mean gear that the official chemists stock and not the underground labs?


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## Guest (Apr 2, 2013)

yes.but even nhs have been stung with counterfeit pharma


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## fastcar_uk (Jan 30, 2013)

Poke said:


> Sorry to ask a dumb question but when you say 'pharma gear' do you mean gear that the official chemists stock and not the underground labs?


yup:thumb:


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## zack amin (Mar 13, 2012)

biglbs said:


> ExactlyAs i said earlier in the thread he was well known to my circle of friends back in the day,he came down and stayed at my mates house and without doubt he is not telling porkies,there is no point now is there?
> 
> Realy if you have the best genetics and food it aint too hard too grow that well.Another friend of mine had the Genetics too Peter Spencer(Rip)he grew like no other,i was fully aware what he was on i assisted his requirements back in the daytfd


Funny thing is, the lad I spoke to new the ecl

exact doses Dorian stated himself, I bbelieve he is a friend off Yates, the initial discussion was on the crazy cycles people are using in today's time, Dorian was shocked when he heard how much gear ausbuilt was using! Makes you think mate, how good is my diet and training really?


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

zack amin said:


> Funny thing is, the lad I spoke to new the ecl
> 
> exact doses Dorian stated himself, I bbelieve he is a friend off Yates, the initial discussion was on the crazy cycles people are using in today's time, Dorian was shocked when he heard how much gear ausbuilt was using! Makes you think mate, how good is my diet and training really?


The main thing being back in the day the gear was out of pharmacies uk and abroad,all of it,gh/slin the lot, it was like ferrari versus skoda mainly,when i came back on the scene just over a year ago i was appaled that guys got home made/ugl stuff it was multi dose and it had rubber bungs on top(usualy the reserve of vet class gear).I use amps only to this day as the hygeine issue is far better,so is the chances of getting good gear not bunk,Alpha pharma in amps has my vote,yes it is dear but then oil by itself is cheap:laugh:


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## lundgren (Feb 15, 2008)

Pscarb said:


> i think the cycles that people THINK Pro's use are more the cycles that got them to be a Pro rather than what they used as a Pro......when you have attained a certain size it is much easier to use less and grow as you build a certain knowledge of what works and what does not....those who do not believe this are normally those who bang in to much gear and either look like sh1t or do not grow to justify the dose they are using......
> 
> it is human nature to try and find the easiest route to the end goal and in many peoples eyes that route is by using a sh1t load of steroids and PED's this could not be more untrue......
> 
> know your body and use less gear......Fact!!!


 I agree @ 1000 %


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