# Steriods on a low calorie diet



## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

What would happen if I took dbol on a low calorie diet? Would I see any gains or would it be pretty pointless?

Cheers guys


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Pointless.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

I thought so, was talking dbol for 2 weeks and I didnt notice any gains, then I realised that I was only taking in 1500 calories per day..


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## Guest (Nov 28, 2010)

it'd help stave off catabolism if you're deliberately tryin to lose weight


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## micreed (Sep 9, 2008)

Graham-jack said:


> I thought so, was talking dbol for 2 weeks and I didnt notice any gains, then I realised that I was only taking in 1500 calories per day..


fvck me i couldnt get out off bed on that many....,


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

lmao!! I'm taking in 3000 per day now, that's including my mass shakes, I only weight 65kg so that should be enough for me


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## Malibu (May 13, 2010)

ALR said:


> it'd help stave off catabolism if you're deliberately tryin to lose weight


sorry to hi jack the thread, since the dbol would stop some canbolism, would is be good to cycle clen/t3 along side a dbol only cycle


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## nc007 (Nov 21, 2010)

how is it pointless?

im using 30mg dbol atm whilst on low food.....

no real pump when i was a carb junkie like last tiem but its better then nothing.


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## benniedwards (Jun 12, 2010)

Argee with Malibu


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

nc007 said:


> how is it pointless?
> 
> im using 30mg dbol atm whilst on low food.....
> 
> no real pump when i was a carb junkie like last tiem but its better then nothing.


I assume what is meant by "pointless" was refering to muscle gain. We know the MOA of steroids and how they increase muscle mass if there is an *excess* of calories.


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

So nobody here uses any AAS during cutting cycles? show prep?


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

bayman said:


> So nobody here uses any AAS during cutting cycles? show prep?


Yes of course we do: whats your point?


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

My point is it was stated above that dbol would be useless to the op. Is this just the case for dbol or all AAS?

I'd have thought any AAS on a cut would help limit LBM, having said that I think LBM loss is overrated if protein is sufficient in the first place and you're not running a horrendous caloric defecit.

Surely plain old test is your best bet whilst cuttting? unless you're specifically prepping for something and need the muscle hardness etc.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

bayman said:


> My point is it was stated above that dbol would be useless to the op. Is this just the case for dbol or all AAS?
> 
> I'd have thought any AAS on a cut would help limit LBM, having said that I think LBM loss is overrated if protein is sufficient in the first place and you're not running a horrendous caloric defecit.
> 
> Surely plain old test is your best bet whilst cuttting? unless you're specifically prepping for something and need the muscle hardness etc.


The op said, and i quote "Would I see any gains or would it be pretty pointless?"

What we have to ask is what exactly does the OP mean by a low calorie diet. If he means a diet thats so low in cals that it wouldn't ellicit growth without steroids then taking dbol "to make gains" would be pointless.

Basically we need to know exactly what the OP means and what he is trying to achieve.


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## PHMG (Jun 15, 2010)

Malibu said:


> sorry to hi jack the thread, since the dbol would stop some *canbolism*, would is be good to cycle clen/t3 along side a dbol only cycle


I dont think dbol stops canabolism mate haha.


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> The op said, and i quote "Would I see any gains or would it be pretty pointless?"
> 
> What we have to ask is what exactly does the OP mean by a low calorie diet. If he means a diet thats so low in cals that it wouldn't ellicit growth without steroids then taking dbol "to make gains" would be pointless.
> 
> Basically we need to know exactly what the OP means and what he is trying to achieve.


I see. Would you say that the main advantages from AAS would come in a calorie excess then? Favourably scewing the ratio of muscle to fat gains?

I'm curious as I was considering running my first cycle during a modest caloric defecit, and hoping the test combined with some t-bol would keep strength up whilst losing fat.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

bayman said:


> I see. Would you say that the main advantages from AAS would come in a calorie excess then? Favourably scewing the ratio of muscle to fat gains?
> 
> I'm curious as I was considering running my first cycle during a modest caloric defecit, and hoping the test combined with some t-bol would keep strength up whilst losing fat.


 Stop attempting to sound smart.

The guy is eating 1500 calories per day either the man is very poor or he is dieting completely wrong.

Hell weight watchers would be a better diet than that level of starvation!

NC007 yes you are a great example for steroids. Not training drinking wiskey on the bus while taking dbol.......when i grow up i want to be just like you!

To the guys who used the word canabolism i am not sure if you mean anabolism or catabolism but seeing that you are asking about t3 i think you mean anabolism. No there is no reason to use clen or t3 because you are using dbol.

Steroids work BEST with a caloric surplus but you can lose fat and gain muscle at the same time but it requires a different approach than a 1500 calorie diet!

A guy who has never used steroids argueing with Mars on what steroids do.......board is going down hill rapidly!


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> The guy is eating 1500 calories per day either the man is very poor or he is dieting completely wrong.
> 
> Hell weight watchers would be a better diet than that level of starvation!


Well without knowing more about his situation we don't know whether 1500 cals is appropriate or not do we? He may have a lot a fat to lose fast. He may want to get his results quicker. He may not weigh a great deal.

A harsh caloric defecit is only really retarded with a high training load IMO. 3 x per week training + steady state cardio like walking ,and the fat would fall off if protein is sufficient at that level of cals. There are many approaches that use high defecits: Rapid Fat Loss, Warp Speed Fat, The Radical Diet etc etc, all seem to work well.



Lois_Lane said:


> Steroids work BEST with a caloric surplus but you can lose fat and gain muscle at the same time but it requires a different approach than a 1500 calorie diet!


Carb / Calorie cycling etc?



Lois_Lane said:


> A guy who has never used steroids argueing with Mars on what steroids do.......board is going down hill rapidly!


Don't think I was arguing with Mars, I'm genuinely interested as to how to get the best out of a cycle. If it's of lower efficiacy on a diet then I'll hold off from using until I've dieted, then add them in.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Bayman thanks for a reasonable response to my post 

1500 calories will make you lose fat fast YES however if you consistantly eat that little you will slow your metabolism down and fvck your self up. Now perhaps he does 3 low days and then 1 higher day in which case that may work but still that is VERY low and more like a womans diet than a mans.

Yes a caloric cycling approach would work well...

I realize you were not really argueing with him my post was tongue in cheek as this thread has gone off the rails and is a bit silly IMO


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Eat a bit more and make sure you're getting PLENTY of protein, as Dianabol vastly increases protein synthesis.

Arnold Schwarzenegger claimed he took Dianabol while dieting for competitions, to *maintain* muscle mass.


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## PHMG (Jun 15, 2010)

suliktribal said:


> Eat a bit more and make sure you're getting PLENTY of protein, as Dianabol vastly increases protein synthesis.
> 
> Arnold Schwarzenegger claimed he took Dianabol while dieting for competitions, to *maintain* muscle mass.


arnold claimed a lot of things. And even said he said a lot of ideas to confuse people  (of was that a double bluff???)


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## paddyrr3 (Oct 15, 2010)

PowerHouseMcGru said:


> arnold claimed a lot of things. And even said he said a lot of ideas to confuse people  (of was that a double bluff???)


fcuk me that is the funniest avatar i have seen in a long time, a bit off topic, but im still ****ing myself after seeing it, so much so ive just drew a c*ock on the wifes snow covered windscreen.


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## micreed (Sep 9, 2008)

op weighs 65 kilo...1500 calories ...now taking in 3000 think we can asume he wants to put muscle on ..yes?? so all said done louis and mars are right ...bayman a bloke at 65 kilo and i qoute you here "He may have a lot a fat to lose fast." no he wont.... eat more add muscle burn more calories through extra said muscle lean out as ya go ..simples.......nobody would take anabolics on 1500 calories a day to maintain muscle at 65 kilo unless he was a midget as he wouldnt have any to maintain....


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## PHMG (Jun 15, 2010)

paddyrr3 said:


> fcuk me that is the funniest avatar i have seen in a long time, a bit off topic, but im still ****ing myself after seeing it, so much so ive just drew a c*ock on the wifes snow covered windscreen.


i aim to please lol


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

The question was would I gain weight taking steriods while on a low calorie diet, loislane answered my question "NO"


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## nc007 (Nov 21, 2010)

Graham-jack said:


> The question was would I *gain weight* taking steriods while on a* low calorie diet*, loislane answered my question "NO"


Your question didnt need answering :lol:


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

bayman said:


> I see. *Would you say that the main advantages from AAS would come in a calorie excess then?* Favourably scewing the ratio of muscle to fat gains?
> 
> I'm curious as I was considering running my first cycle during a modest caloric defecit, and hoping the test combined with some t-bol would keep strength up whilst losing fat.


Are you serious? thats how steroids work, maybe do a little reading on the MOA of AAS mate, nitrogen retention, increased protein synthesis providing enough calories are consumed etc etc.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

I weigh 65kg and am taking 30mg dbol per day while taking in 3000 cals per day, I also take animo acids and fish oils.

I will see some gains on that won't I? I train for 3 days have a day off then train for 3 days than have a day off etc....obviously I train a seperate muscle group each day.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Depends where the 3000 cals are coming from really.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

Pasta, Chicken, lean mince beef, grilled bacon & eggs and mass shakes...I know it's a repetitive diet but im just starting out.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> Depends where the 3000 cals are coming from really.


My diet

Breakfast: 3 grilled bacon, 2 eggs on wholemeal bread.

fish oils.

10am: Mass shake

12pm: 2 whole (4 halfs) chicken and salad sandwiches on wholemeal bread.

2pm; Mass shake

4pm: Beef ravioli (supposed to be a meal for two but i have a full one to myself) 806 cals 

6pm: Mass shake

8pm: Chicken pasta

10pm: 2 weetabix

Instead of the chicken pasta and beef ravioli I sometimes have spaghetti bolognaise or fish


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

why 2 weetabix before you go bed?


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

And where's the real food? mass shakes, sarnies and a beef ravioli for two lol isn't going to cut it.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Try a tub of Morrisons value cottage cheese (47p/250g tub) and 3 slices of thick granary toast before bed.


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## nc007 (Nov 21, 2010)

how much protien in that sulik


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

Cottage cheese is normally 10g odd protein per 100g in my experience, regardless of brand.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

nc007 said:


> how much protien in that sulik


4.9g per slice toast, (Alinson wholemeal) 13.6g per half tub.

So 42g ish in that lot. Eating a full tub.


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## micreed (Sep 9, 2008)

suliktribal said:


> Try a tub of Morrisons value cottage cheese (47p/250g tub) and 3 slices of thick granary toast before bed.


not quite what the guys are getting at...where is the quility food ...red meat oily fish good carbs good fats poultry ..fresh veg fruit ...that sorta thing ...not cottage cheese on bread ...if guys gonna eat 3 thou calories and gain they gotta be quility ones


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

micreed said:


> not quite what the guys are getting at...where is the quility food ...red meat oily fish good carbs good fats poultry ..fresh veg fruit ...that sorta thing ...not cottage cheese on bread ...if guys gonna eat 3 thou calories and gain they gotta be quility ones


For bedtime, it's perfect.

Wasn't on about the rest of the day.


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## micreed (Sep 9, 2008)

my bad bud


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## cecil_sensation (Jan 26, 2009)

its totally point less imo.

if your looking to put on mass (which im presuming the op is/or your self is) why would you eat low amounts of food. its not the steriods that make you big its the food we eat. if you want to keep gains then diet is critical

point is if you want to take a risk of taking steroids then you may just as well make the most of it with a good diet


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## cecil_sensation (Jan 26, 2009)

Graham-jack said:


> My diet
> 
> Breakfast: 3 grilled bacon, 2 eggs on wholemeal bread.
> 
> ...


diets poor mate

why weetabix before bed time?? no protein there at all

cottage cheese or peanut butter is better


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

How is pasta,eggs, chicken, steak, beef and fish not a good diet, it's got loads of protein and pasta is great for complex carbs.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

This is how I'd do 3000 cals.

4 slices toast

2 boiled eggs 2 grilled bacon

half a tin of beans

850 cals

200g chicken

100g pasta, cooked weight

teaspoon pesto

640 cals

250g steak

large baked potato

green veg

580 cals

250g cottage cheese

2 slices of toast

Total

2460 cals, approx. Make up the 3000 with your 'mass gainer'


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

suliktribal said:


> This is how I'd do 3000 cals.
> 
> 4 slices toast
> 
> ...


The only difference between yours and mine is the cottage cheese at night, which you won't find me eating as it tastes likes my a r s e


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Graham-jack said:


> The only difference between yours and mine is the cottage cheese at night, which you won't find me eating as it tastes likes my a r s e


And the half a tin of beans, veg at dinner and jacket potato. Cottage cheese doesn't taste great but, hey.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

P1ss poor diet and attitude!


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> P1ss poor diet and attitude!


How would you split 3000 cals, big boy?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

suliktribal said:


> How would you split 3000 cals, big boy?


Was talking to Grayham, your diet looks pretty solid to me, old man.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Was talking to Grayham, your diet looks pretty solid to me, old man.


I know you were, sugar lumps. But he rejected mine.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

suliktribal said:


> I know you were, sugar lumps. But he rejected mine.


Lol gotcha! Honestly i don't care enough to make him a diet. This site is filled with starter diets....

To his credit he will put on weight with this diet, probably even some muscle but plenty of fat....plus its a lazy diet which has many nutritional holes.

I would split up the macro's as 250 protein 250 carb and 110 fat and even 1:1:1 split.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Lol gotcha! Honestly i don't care enough to make him a diet. This site is filled with starter diets....
> 
> To his credit he will put on weight with this diet, probably even some muscle but plenty of fat....plus its a lazy diet which has many nutritional holes.
> 
> I would split up the macro's as 250 protein 250 carb and 110 fat and even 1:1:1 split.


As he said there's no difference between mine and his, what would you say to that?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

His diet

Breakfast: 3 grilled bacon, 2 eggs on wholemeal bread.

fish oils.

10am: Mass shake

12pm: 2 whole (4 halfs) chicken and salad sandwiches on wholemeal bread.

2pm; Mass shake

4pm: Beef ravioli (supposed to be a meal for two but i have a full one to myself) 806 cals 

6pm: Mass shake

8pm: Chicken pasta

10pm: 2 weetabix

Suliks diet

4 slices toast

2 boiled eggs 2 grilled bacon

half a tin of beans

850 cals

200g chicken

100g pasta, cooked weight

teaspoon pesto

640 cals

250g steak

large baked potato

green veg

580 cals

250g cottage cheese

2 slices of toast

Total

2460 cals, approx. Make up the 3000 with your 'mass gainer'

The diets look nothing alike.

Suliks diet i like but i would constantly change things such as meat sources every few days to avoid allergies.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> His diet
> 
> Breakfast: 3 grilled bacon, 2 eggs on wholemeal bread.
> 
> ...


Indeed.

But he needs to know why mine is better 

Love you.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

suliktribal said:


> Indeed.
> 
> But he needs to know why mine is better
> 
> Love you.


Inclusion of the green veg make it superior as his diet seemed to have none and that will cause health problems eventually.

Beef ravioli is processed crap nice for a treat but not for a staple.

Wheetabix before bed is silly as you don't need energy while you sleep.

Mass shakes are always crap unless you make them your self.

That said i wouldn't have bacon every day like in your diet, pork is an inferior meat.

BUT my fav part of his diet is this.......whenever someone posts up a diet on here they are listing their best possible day of eating and in fact most days will never be this good. So if this is the highlite i dread to see what a true day of eating looks like.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Inclusion of the green veg make it superior as his diet seemed to have none and that will cause health problems eventually.
> 
> Beef ravioli is processed crap nice for a treat but not for a staple.
> 
> ...


Not my 'pork' baby.


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## Guest (Nov 30, 2010)

why's pork inferior


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

I wouldn't say Pork is inferior, at least not in the UK. Our animal welfare standards over here are night and day compared to the US, no need to worry about "grass fed meat", as most of ours is anyway, I work in the agricultural industry for reference.

And I see no need to rotate meat to prevent allergies, meats head to head are nutritionally superior to veg anyway, and don't contain antinutrients.

So long as your diet is mainly based on wholefoods, I don't think you can go far wrong.


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

I fine this whole topic rather strange. I have read forum after forum on here and with next to NO knowledge other than what I have read I can honestly say some of you guys are mad. One is taking Setroids when he is new to training. Another is considering taking Steroids before he has even bulked up a little on a high calorie diet. Another claims to eat 3000K a day and seems to be eating half of what I am and I am eating 3000K a day and track it through another website.

My Diet every single day and not my best day to acheive 3000 is the following.

This was today

8.30ish Bowl of Oats, bannana, couple of eggs

10.00ish 2 tins of tuna, green beans, protein shake

10.30 Bowl of Oats Banana

12.00 2 chicken breasts a red pepper

1PM Mass shake

3 pm 4 hard boiled eggs, tin of tuna

6PM Chicken breast, potatoes, brocolli, carrotts dinner

8PM Mass protein shake

10PM I will have about 5 or 6 table spoons of peanut butter and a few table spoons of cottage cheese

Now I weight at present 147lbs 10 stone 7 and thats about 65K I think. I struggle to eat what I do and force soem of it down me.

I seem to be eating a hell of a lot more to get my 3K that some of you guys do. And I enter every one of these foods into the tracking website to make sure that each day I have a 40/40/20 split.

I have now gained 7lbs in 2 months and feel so far away from thinking about steroids its unreal. I am still practicing eating this much and training hard 3/4 times per week.

Sorry but I think this whole topic is mad.

When I have put on the weight and muscle mass and get to 170lbs then I may consider getting advice on juice but until I feel I am going in the right direction and have actually seen my body change shape dramatically I am staying well out the way of things I have no idea if I can handle. Plus I love my nuts so much I am scared of messing them up like my brother almost did in the other forum I started.

I'd say until you look similar to some of these guys, do it properly or you'll end up a skinny ****ed up mess


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

Sorry, just went on a mad one. TIme of month


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

suliktribal said:


> And the half a tin of beans, veg at dinner and jacket potato. Cottage cheese doesn't taste great but, hey.


I eat veg with most meals, i thought that would have been a given. I also have beans and eat jacket potato but not every day, I have fish and steak also, the diet i put up was a typical one, i dont eat that everyday, some times i'll eat fish and steak, so there is nothing in your diet apart from the cottage cheese that I dont eat.


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## xzx (Jun 6, 2008)

Graham-jack said:


> My diet
> 
> Breakfast: 3 grilled bacon, 2 eggs on wholemeal bread.
> 
> ...


Keep it *simple* mate. 6-7 meals. 1 large portion of protein and 1 portion of carbs every meal except bedtime. Swap the chicken or tuna for steak or turkey. Swap the cous cous and rice for potato & pasta

Sample

Meal 1

2 large eggs, 6 large egg whites, 2 scoops whey, 1/2 cup oats raw + water. approx 700 cals

Meal 2

1 large tin tuna in Sunflower oil, on 2 slices thick wholemeal bread with salad & 1 tablespoon mayo approx 700 cals

Meal 3

2 chicken breast, 1 cup cous cous, cooked, tablespoon olive oil, green salad. approx 700 cals

Meal 4

As meal 2 approx 700 cals

Meal 4 post w/o

2 Scoops whey 2 Small Scoops dextrose water approx 350 cals

Meal 5

2 Chicken, Breast, grilled,

1 cup brown rice cooked,

large portion of any mixed Vegetables, say broccoli cauliflower carrots, approx 700 cals

Meal 6

1 small tub of cottage cheese, 1 heaped tablespoon peanut butter approx 250 cals

The calorie summary is average, somewhere around 4000 cals but will be effective.


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

Just to confirm, if you can get your cals in over LESS meals it's in no way inferior. And carbs before bed DO NOT make you fat, excess calories do.


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

bayman said:


> Just to confirm, if you can get your cals in over LESS meals it's in no way inferior. And carbs before bed DO NOT make you fat, excess calories do.


That is potentially true but for a guy weighing 65K eating that many cal in less meals is very difficult IMO, thats why I choose to eat almolst constantly through out the day.

And Carbs before bed is surely just a waste of energy when you could put a better suited food in your body while you sleep. Like protein for example.

I am no expert but thats the impression I get mate?


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

that's a fair point about the amount of cals he needs to injest, if he finds it more comfortable over more meals then fine, it's no better than less meals though if comfort isn't an issue.

Carbs are protein sparing, so if anything taking them before bed could be beneficial. They may help with sleep if you choose a source rich in trytophan also. Energy is energy at the end of thr day, be that from protein, carbs or fat. If he's in a calorie excess he's going to gain some fat regardless, unless that is he is going to use AAS alongside his diet. But at 65kg he just need to get to the gym and get his eat on IMO.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

bayman said:


> Just to confirm, if you can get your cals in over LESS meals it's in no way inferior. And carbs before bed DO NOT make you fat, excess calories do.


Do you have any pictures bayman you sound really clued up (based on various posts)and must look pretty impressive assuming you put all of this into practice.


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## Guest (Nov 30, 2010)

It's true that less meals is fine.

Look at leangains.com for evidence, excellent site.

also carbs before bed are not a problem dependent on caloric intake as a whole


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

ALR said:


> It's true that less meals is fine.
> 
> Look at leangains.com for evidence, excellent site.
> 
> also carbs before bed are not a problem dependent on caloric intake as a whole


I just have to laugh..........you and bayman why not actually add something constructive to the thread instead of argueing with me........


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## Guest (Nov 30, 2010)

You're rather conceited aren't you. Agreeing with a point someone else made isn't arguing with you.

I don't even see the post where you said you need to eat lots of meals which I am apparently arguing with?

What an ego.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

ALR said:


> You're rather conceited aren't you. Agreeing with a point someone else made isn't arguing with you.
> 
> I don't even see the post where you said you need to eat lots of meals which I am apparently arguing with?
> 
> What an ego.


No its in regards to the carbs before bed. Sure no problem in most cases but this guy is eating wheetabix by them self prior to bed that's the problem........

Sorry harsh sounding post from me (i am bad for that)


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2010)

oh i think weetabix before bed is pointless, i don't disagree with that.

when people say carbs before bed will automatically be stored as fat thats all i was disagreeing with, during ramadan for example muslims feast on carbs all night and it has negligible effect on bodyfat levels because they're still in a deficit.

for some 150lb twink there are definitely better food sources than weetabix at night, lol


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

ALR said:


> oh i think weetabix before bed is pointless, i don't disagree with that.
> 
> when people say carbs before bed will automatically be stored as fat thats all i was disagreeing with, during ramadan for example muslims feast on carbs all night and it has negligible effect on bodyfat levels because they're still in a deficit.
> 
> for some 150lb twink there are definitely better food sources than weetabix at night, lol


Well this is true.

When dieting i sometimes eat all my carbs right before bed to aid sleeping.

That said if he actually does manage to consistantly down all those mass shakes and every thing else he will pile on fat.

I never understand why small guys NEED to get to lets say 200lb as quickly as possible rather gain muscle and look good the whole time.........chubby guys with a bit of muscle are everywhere nothing hard or special about that.


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

ALR said:


> for some 150lb twink there are definitely better food sources than weetabix at night, lol


Behave. Some of us who weigh around that are far from a twink

This topic is way off now and getting on my tits. Im off to read something a little less insulting. And it wasnt even my thread.

Ill be back when you stick a pic up of your 200lbs god like physique


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

Lois_Lane said:


> Well this is true.
> 
> When dieting i sometimes eat all my carbs right before bed to aid sleeping.
> 
> ...


My goal as stated in at least 20 different threads is to be 170lbs in around 18 months. Clean.

So lets not tar all us small fellas with the same text


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Gee-Spot said:


> My goal as stated in at least 20 different threads is to be 170lbs in around 18 months. Clean.
> 
> So lets not tar all us small fellas with the same text


Do you have a small man complex by any chance? :lol: Getting wound up over this thread is just funny

Honestly i am not familiar with you or your posts so don't worry i didn't read your post and was not refering to you.


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## james12345 (Jan 13, 2010)

con roughly what ratios would you say for someone whos 230lbs and gains weight quite easily? say over 4 meals a day?


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2010)

yeah ever heard of bluestreak and his 25lbs in 25 days drinking a gallon of milk a day?

im all for milk on a bulk and consume about a litre myself but this idiot thins he gained mostly muscle in 25 days

http://stronglifts.com/forum/f30/skinny-happy-gained-25lbs-25-days-3330.html

he went from 10% @ 90kg to 16% @ 100kg. assuming he underestimated his fat gain like everyone does he probably gained 8% fat in that time...leaving him with a net gain of maybe 2% muscle in a month.

and this is what newbs aspire to..genius


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

Far from it usually. 15 years of time in the ring tends to let you know where you stand in the food chain. Keeps you grounded and realistic.

What gives me a small man complex every single time is the lines like " I dont understand why small men.........."

Its tarring us with the same brush that brings it out in me. My height/weight/stature is never an issue until some BIG geezer brings it up.


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

ALR said:


> yeah ever heard of bluestreak and his 25lbs in 25 days drinking a gallon of milk a day?
> 
> im all for milk on a bulk and consume about a litre myself but this idiot thins he gained mostly muscle in 25 days
> 
> ...


Still waiting a pic genius


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

james12345 said:


> con roughly what ratios would you say for someone whos 230lbs and gains weight quite easily? say over 4 meals a day?


 Kinda depends on things like daily activity, how tall, how lean/how much muscle.

I like to start on an even split calorie wise between the 3 nutrients.

I think food choices are the key.....if you give the body the right nutrients you can gain muscle while losing fat which is my personal goal.

I think if you have a list of specific foods that are healthy and eat protein first then lots of green veggies with starches for taste and essential fats you should just eat until you are satisfied then eat again when hungry. The body is smart and if you give it a few weeks of eating like this you will become instinctual and eat when/what is needed.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2010)

Gee-Spot said:


> Still waiting a pic genius


awww do you not know how to click a link?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Gee-Spot said:


> Far from it usually. 15 years of time in the ring tends to let you know where you stand in the food chain. Keeps you grounded and realistic.
> 
> What gives me a small man complex every single time is the lines like " I dont understand why small men.........."
> 
> Its tarring us with the same brush that brings it out in me. My height/weight/stature is never an issue until some BIG geezer brings it up.


Well for the sake of your heart health i suggest you stop getting annoyed at these comments at least ones made in jest on the internet!

In person i am a very quiet poliet person so don't take my jokes online to be a direct reflection of my actual behavior.


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

ALR said:


> awww do you not know how to click a link?


Look, I aint going to argue like a baby all night behind my computer screen.

All I am trying to say is that. Regardless of my size. I have taking a massive amount of care to focus on my diet and my training. I have stuck to it solidly for 2 months after coming back from a very long term boxing injury including 2 broken bones in my neck and radial nerve damage. My body and particulary my shouldrs almost went skeletal where my muscle deteriated through not being able to move.

I feel I have set very realistic goals, i,e to gain 25-30lbs in 18 months, I work hard, eat hard and train hard. And I spend every night reading and trying to improve my knowledge.

Therefore I dont want to be tarred with the typical short man or typical newbie brush. I aint steriotypical and I dont steriotype.

Maybe if I am still here in 18 months ill have earnt a little more respect maybe. I accept that. Proof is in the pudding and all


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

Lois_Lane said:


> Well for the sake of your heart health i suggest you stop getting annoyed at these comments at least ones made in jest on the internet!
> 
> In person i am a very quiet poliet person so don't take my jokes online to be a direct reflection of my actual behavior.


OK, I apprecaite that. My previous post was aimed towards you to be fair, quoted the worng one.

Anyway, ive ranted my point enough now. Ill shut it lol


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2010)

angry, lol.

no one said anything about you, you just got really upset about a complete generalisation which was clearly just that. take a chill pill buddy


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

ALR said:


> angry, lol.
> 
> no one said anything about you, you just got really upset about a complete generalisation which was clearly just that. take a chill pill buddy


lol. ok


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Well for the sake of your heart health i suggest you stop getting annoyed at these comments at least ones made in jest on the internet!
> 
> In person i am a very quiet *poliet* person so don't take my jokes online to be a direct reflection of my actual behavior.


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## james12345 (Jan 13, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Kinda depends on things like daily activity, how tall, how lean/how much muscle.
> 
> I like to start on an even split calorie wise between the 3 nutrients.
> 
> ...


certainly food for thought  , i must admit ever since you posting about the whole greens thing ive re-evaluated my outlook and do eat alot healthier, i remember reading about one of your home made shakes but cant remember what was in it??

do you not think calories are as important as everyone makes out? reading a few things, and if stored fats going to be used for energy and protein for muscle repair it kind of does make you wander wether you really need to be going a long way over maintence unless your horrifically skinny?


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Well yet another thread that has turned into a total farce and of no help to the OP whatsoever due to a couple of uneducated idiots who are so far up their own ar53s....................... well you get the idea.

Sad we have to suffer these kind of idiots on a forum like this where ppl are looking for help and just asking for some advice.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> Well yet another thread that has turned into a total farce and of no help to the OP whatsoever due to a couple of uneducated idiots who are so far up their own ar53s....................... well you get the idea.
> 
> Sad we have to suffer these kind of idiots on a forum like this where ppl are looking for help and just asking for some advice.


But your post was really helpful and constructive


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> Well yet another thread that has turned into a total farce and of no help to the OP whatsoever due to a couple of uneducated idiots who are so far up their own ar53s....................... well you get the idea.
> 
> Sad we have to suffer these kind of idiots on a forum like this where ppl are looking for help and just asking for some advice.


Hey, I tried to help. I sat there and spent 10 mins trying to work out a better way of getting his 3000 calories a day (IMO) then wrote it down. I never do anything other than try and help people on here.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

suliktribal said:


> Hey, I tried to help. I sat there and spent 10 mins trying to work out a better way of getting his 3000 calories a day (IMO) then wrote it down. I never do anything other than try and help people on here.


I have just polished off, 2 eggs, 2 bacon, 2 toast (wholemeal) and half a tin of beans


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

suliktribal said:


> Hey, I tried to help. I sat there and spent 10 mins trying to work out a better way of getting his 3000 calories a day (IMO) then wrote it down. I never do anything other than try and help people on here.


I wasn't refering to you. Thought it was obvious the two i was refering to.


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## suliktribal (Apr 4, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> I wasn't refering to you. Thought it was obvious the two i was refering to.


Nothing is obvious to me.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Graham-jack said:


> I have just polished off, 2 eggs, 2 bacon, 2 toast (wholemeal) and half a tin of beans


Iv'e already had 6 weetabix/banana/pint of green top (7.00) 6 egg omelette (9.30) another half hour and it's time for peanut butter on two slices of wholemeal and my pre workout shakel.

Get up earlier lol.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> Iv'e already had 6 weetabix/banana/pint of green top (7.00) 6 egg omelette (9.30) another half hour and it's time for peanut butter on two slices of wholemeal and my pre workout shakel.
> 
> Get up earlier lol.


haha that's just greedy, I've got this book called 'the works' had for ages, have you ever read it?


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Graham-jack said:


> haha that's just greedy, I've got this book called 'the works' had for ages, have you ever read it?


No, thats called eating to grow lol.

I haven't read it.


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## Graham-jack (Apr 7, 2010)

What does weetabix have in it that makes it so good? protein or carbs?


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## Twilight (Aug 3, 2012)

mars1960 said:


> I wasn't refering to you. Thought it was obvious the two i was refering to.


Not obviousto me either. Dont dance around spit it out my man. What two?


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

mars1960 said:


> I wasn't refering to you. Thought it was obvious the two i was refering to.


If you're referring to me, then if by questioning statements by others is seen as unhelpful, I won't bother in future. I only have the OP's best interests in mind.

There's droves of misinformation in the BB'ing world, and some people on this forum seem keen to perpetuate it, especially where diet is concerned. So if the odd newb gets better information than the standard "eat 6 meals per day" "no carbs before bed" rubbish, or is forced to question these oft held bodubuilding dogma's and the "science" behind them, then I think he'll be better off in the long run for it.

Whether that's constructive or not is open for debate, and after all, this is a FORUM.


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## micreed (Sep 9, 2008)

QUOTE..I think if you have a list of specific foods that are healthy and eat protein first then lots of green veggies with starches for taste and essential fats you should just eat until you are satisfied then eat again when hungry. The body is smart and if you give it a few weeks of eating like this you will become instinctual and eat when/what is needed. UN QOUTE

BEST ADVICE ON THREAD... its so simple eat a balanced healthy diet with bias to protien ...4/5 good meals and couple good shakes...not that store brought ****e though...

really a healthy diet needs to be balanced just like a average guy should .. of course u need more espescialy protien.... . veg/salads not enough guys eat them get em in ya .... then fruit nuts for snacks ...aint rocket science


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

^^^Micreed; appreciated mate.......i tried to keep it basic as this works for most people its a pity others want to argue over small points simply to be heard.

Bayman; you have a strange attitude about you. I still fail to see how wheetabix prior to bed with nothing else is a good idea but yes in theory carbs before bed are fine.......HAPPY?


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## thereisnoexit (Aug 26, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> ^^^Micreed; appreciated mate.......i tried to keep it basic as this works for most people its a pity others want to argue over small points simply to be heard.
> 
> Bayman; you have a strange attitude about you. I still fail to see how wheetabix prior to bed with nothing else is a good idea but yes in theory carbs before bed are fine.......HAPPY?


Shouldnt they preferably be avoided in a "perfect" diet since they stunt gh release?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

thereisnoexit said:


> Shouldnt they preferably be avoided in a "perfect" diet since they stunt gh release?


LMAO, well yeah if you want to get really picky that could be argued!

Personally i don't eat or have a shake within 1 hour of bed as i find sleep is better when you don't have a load of new food to digest.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

bayman said:


> If you're referring to me, then if by questioning statements by others is seen as unhelpful, I won't bother in future. I only have the OP's best interests in mind.
> 
> There's droves of misinformation in the BB'ing world, and some people on this forum seem keen to perpetuate it, especially where diet is concerned. So if the odd newb gets better information than the standard "eat 6 meals per day" "no carbs before bed" rubbish, or is forced to question these oft held bodubuilding dogma's and the "science" behind them, then I think he'll be better off in the long run for it.
> 
> Whether that's constructive or not is open for debate, and after all, *this is a FORUM*.


Correct :lol: .


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## thereisnoexit (Aug 26, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> LMAO, well yeah if you want to get really picky that could be argued!
> 
> Personally i don't eat or have a shake within 1 hour of bed as i find sleep is better when you don't have a load of new food to digest.


Personally I just chuck it all down there.. if my stomachs havin it I'm giving it


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## PHMG (Jun 15, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> LMAO, well yeah if you want to get really picky that could be argued!
> 
> Personally i don't eat or have a shake within 1 hour of bed as i find sleep is better when you don't have a load of new food to digest.


lol, i literally eat my cottage cheese and nuts then instantly lay my head down and am asleep in about two mins. Pi.sses the mrs' of cos she can count when i will start snoring!


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

total waist of bandwidth


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

hilly said:


> total waist of bandwidth


Good thing you made this valuable post to save some bandwidth....oh wait LOL


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Bayman; you have a strange attitude about you. I still fail to see how wheetabix prior to bed with nothing else is a good idea but yes in theory carbs before bed are fine.......HAPPY?


Just to clarify, nowhere did I say weetabix pre bed was good / optimal though...

I was just stating that carbs before bed are not a ticket to automatic fatness, and as you yourself pointed out can help with sleep etc.

I'm just sick of hearing "taper your carbs before bed", "only eat protein only pre bed" Completely unnecessary pedantry.

FWIW I think your advice is very solid and a breath of fresh air compared to most of the BB community. Often points don't get conveyed very well over the internet, and I suspect if we were talking about this in person we'd agree on more things than we don't.

Happy!?!


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

bayman said:


> Just to clarify, nowhere did I say weetabix pre bed was good / optimal though...
> 
> I was just stating that carbs before bed are not a ticket to automatic fatness, and as you yourself pointed out can help with sleep etc.
> 
> ...


I am always happy bro, love life 

[/QUOTE]


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

lmao that was the point


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

there is also the train of thought that eating straight before bed anything but pure protein will blunt ure natural gh release. as con i try to neat eat within an hour of sleeping.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

hilly said:


> there is also the train of thought that eating straight before bed anything but pure protein will blunt ure natural gh release. as con i try to neat eat within an hour of sleeping.


Then some of us shoot entire amps of growth hormone and don't care about natural release:whistling: :confused1:


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

Ah well count yourself lucky though op, least people actually answer your threads because it was a question that people could actually b1tch about maybe i should think about that before I start my own threads next time, there to simple to answer and thats a big problem. 

No fcker ever got fat from eating good complex carbs beore bedtime either, I find i sleep better with carbs before bed.


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

Lois_Lane said:


> Then some of us shoot entire amps of growth hormone and don't care about natural release:whistling: :confused1:


a huge 1 iu for me currently


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

hilly said:


> a huge 1 iu for me currently


I wouldn't waste pinning my self for 1iu


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

its part of a few shot in thru the day - did i miss that bit out


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## cecil_sensation (Jan 26, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> P1ss poor diet and attitude!


x2 on that con


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