# Increasing bicep size - more sets or more patience needed?



## Moorey123

I've been training now for around 5 months and would like to get bigger biceps as I feel they are lagging behind a little. They are getting slowly stronger but at the minute I only do 2 warm up sets and 3 working sets.

Should I increase the working sets or be patient and keep doing what I'm doing?


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## justin case

chin ups, palms facing you....best bicep building exercise there is bar none..4x8 to failure a couple of times a week, and if your biceps don't grow I'll eat my hat.


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## HodgesoN

justin case said:


> chin ups, palms facing you....best bicep building exercise there is bar none..4x8 to failure a couple of times a week, and if your biceps don't grow I'll eat my hat.


bull shi t.


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## guvnor82

I find 3 to 5 sets plenty for bi's train then after back so there pretty fcut by then anyway.


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## Fatstuff

more patience, more food


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## HodgesoN

justin case said:


> chin ups, palms facing you....best bicep building exercise there is bar none..4x8 to failure a couple of times a week, and if your biceps don't grow I'll eat my hat.


What works best for you might not be the same for him, thats 1 exercise, how can you say his biceps will grow by telling him 1 exercise ?


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## Fatstuff

HodgesoN said:


> bull shi t.


care to add your input? as opposed to just slating his?


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## HodgesoN

i do at least 10 sets for biceps on arm day, usually 2 working sets, 5-6 different exercises, heavy weight, 8-10 reps.


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## Edinburgh

thinking out loud here, but what about doing bicep/tricep supersets ( 3 excersises always supersets) on the days you usually work biceps + triceps seperately

so you'll be hitting bi's + tri's twice a week (basaed on training monday, wednesday + friday)


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## shauny13

chuck in a couple of sets of preacher curls to failure, This should make em grow, as it will isolate them more.


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## justin case

HodgesoN said:


> What works best for you might not be the same for him, thats 1 exercise, how can you say his biceps will grow by telling him 1 exercise ?


well you advise him then, I'll just shut up....lol


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## HodgesoN

justin case said:


> well you advise him then, I'll just shut up....lol


no need mate, i wasnt havnt a dig at you, i was just saying my opinion.


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## justin case

http://www.real-weight-lifting.com/best-bicep-exercise.html


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## Sharp161

Bigger triceps = bigger biceps, smash some dips and close grip bench


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## Fatstuff

Sharp161 said:


> Bigger triceps = bigger biceps, smash some dips and close grip bench


bigger triceps = bigger triceps


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## HodgesoN

justin case said:


> http://www.real-weight-lifting.com/best-bicep-exercise.html


hes entitled too his opinion too lol, best exercise for my biceps with out doubt is heavy z bar curls.


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## Huntingground

I never work bis. Heavy BORs, pulldowns etc will work bis much better than curls etc


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## Dux

SuperTren straight into the bicep.

Works a treat


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## HodgesoN

Sharp161 said:


> Bigger triceps = bigger biceps, smash some dips and close grip bench


excuse me ?


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## TG123

Fatstuff said:


> more food


That's your answer for everything :whistling:


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## Hartman

Less sets, heavier weights - im you really want to smash them up, get somone to help you do some negatives at the end


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## eezy1

if u want bigger and better biceps give them more attention


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## faultline

How much are they lagging behind?

Might not be as out of proportion as you think, anyone remember notraps?

Post a pic up mate


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## saxondale

neither - more load


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## rectus

Be sure your routine is mainly compound stuff which will hit the biceps, then towards the end of your session do some light weight - perfectly controlled bicep curls where you really isolate the bicep. Don't bring your elbows forward at any point and go for a full range of motion with dumbbells. It feels good


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## mygym-mytemple

rectus said:


> Be sure your routine is mainly compound stuff which will hit the biceps, then towards the end of your session do some light weight - perfectly controlled bicep curls where you really isolate the bicep. Don't bring your elbows forward at any point and go for a full range of motion with dumbbells. It feels good


I've been doing this last few months.

Due to forearm pain i can't use the amount of weight i want on biceps but after heavy compound back moves and some biceps finishers my biceps have filled out better.


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## Cutandjacked

Hit triceps hard, they make up 2/3 of the upper arm mass. Hit heavy hammer and barbell curls for biceps, wouldn't waste your time with fancy machines or cables at this point. GET THEM GUNS GROWIN'!


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## Dh2909

IF ur Biceps are laggin id say best way is to prioratize em.. make them ur 1st training session of the week before u do anything else!

this way u get more focus and more of ur energy will go into building ur biceps

also change what ur doing! either reps sets weight or rest... give them a new stimulus


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## dtlv

Moorey123 said:


> I've been training now for around 5 months and would like to get bigger biceps as I feel they are lagging behind a little. They are getting slowly stronger but at the minute I only do 2 warm up sets and 3 working sets.
> 
> Should I increase the working sets or be patient and keep doing what I'm doing?


You don't mention the number of reps you normally do each set, and for me rep count seems very important for training arms - if training in the 6-10 rep range try dropping the load slightly and work up to 3 work sets of 12-15 reps (or even 20 reps), and be sure to take at least the last work set to concentric failure.

If you don't get on with or don't want to do higher reps then stick with sets of 6-10 but increase the number of sets/exercises.

In general just be patient though, especially at only 5 months of regular training.


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## HodgesoN

Huntingground said:


> I never work bis. Heavy BORs, pulldowns etc will work bis much better than curls etc


each to there own  lol


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## HodgesoN

Huntingground said:


> I never work bis. Heavy BORs, pulldowns etc will work bis much better than curls etc


do an arm workout with me and you wont be saying that haha


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## HodgesoN

Dux said:


> SuperTren straight into the bicep.
> 
> Works a treat


but site injections dont work a treat.


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## Huntingground

HodgesoN said:


> do an arm workout with me and you wont be saying that haha


Where are you based? I work out at Golds Gym, Camberley.


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## onthebuild

More load is not the answer IMO. See far too many people in the gym with terrible form, looking round like they're the billy big bo1lock's curling the heavy weights. Co-incidentally these are the ones with the sh1t biceps.

Get rid of the ego and lower the weight. Get a bench at just below the upright position, stay standign but rest your ar$e against it. Dangle the weight so your arm is straight, this is your starting position. Curl the weight up, moving ONLY at the elbow, your upper arm should not move from your side. See 90% of people moving their upper arm, bringing the front delts in. Ill include a video below.

To give you an idea of weight, I hammer curl the 22's and bicep curl the 12kgs. And I feel my biceps are one of my best assets.


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## HodgesoN

Huntingground said:


> Where are you based? I work out at Golds Gym, Camberley.


billingham, north east mate.


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## HodgesoN

onthebuild said:


> More load is not the answer IMO. See far too many people in the gym with terrible form, looking round like they're the billy big bo1lock's curling the heavy weights. Co-incidentally these are the ones with the sh1t biceps.
> 
> Get rid of the ego and lower the weight. Get a bench at just below the upright position, stay standign but rest your ar$e against it. Dangle the weight so your arm is straight, this is your starting position. Curl the weight up, moving ONLY at the elbow, your upper arm should not move from your side. See 90% of people moving their upper arm, bringing the front delts in. Ill include a video below.
> 
> To give you an idea of weight, I hammer curl the 22's and bicep curl the 12kgs. And I feel my biceps are one of my best assets.


not been a c unt but thats bull shi t, my gf curs 12kg with perfect form.


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## onthebuild

HodgesoN said:


> not been a c unt but thats bull shi t, my gf curs 12kg with perfect form.


Each to their own mate, my biceps are growing like nobody's business, so I'll stick with my girly, bullsh1t weight then.


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## HodgesoN

onthebuild said:


> Each to their own mate, my biceps are growing like nobody's business, so I'll stick with my girly, bullsh1t weight them.


i didnt say it was girly, i just stated its very light weight, im sure you can curly more than 12kg with the same form which means if you can your not putting your all into yor workouts.


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## saxondale

onthebuild said:


> More load is not the answer IMO. See far too many people in the gym with terrible form, looking round like they're the billy big bo1lock's curling the heavy weights. Co-incidentally these are the ones with the sh1t biceps.
> 
> Get rid of the ego and lower the weight. Get a bench at just below the upright position, stay standign but rest your ar$e against it. Dangle the weight so your arm is straight, this is your starting position. Curl the weight up, moving ONLY at the elbow, your upper arm should not move from your side. See 90% of people moving their upper arm, bringing the front delts in. Ill include a video below.
> 
> To give you an idea of weight, I hammer curl the 22's and bicep curl the 12kgs. And I feel my biceps are one of my best assets.


it went without saying that you train with the correct form but thanks for pointing the obvious out.


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## Cutandjacked

HodgesoN said:


> i didnt say it was girly, i just stated its very light weight, im sure you can curly more than 12kg with the same form which means if you can your not putting your all into yor workouts.


Agree with this tbh dude, you could probably go heavier. Ive been doing 40kg hammer curls ATM and nearly that with DB curls... U gotta go heavy if u wanna pack on size!


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## onthebuild

HodgesoN said:


> i didnt say it was girly, i just stated its very light weight, im sure you can curly more than 12kg with the same form which means if you can your not putting your all into yor workouts.


As stated I could lift heavier, but not with the same form. I do hammer curls first, then EZbar curls, then finally DB bicep curls like in the video to finish off. If you watched the video you will see kai greene curling 30lbs (13.6kg) and STRUGGLING to finish a set of 10. Dont get me wrong, he may do this after heavy sets of BB curls or whatever, but he's using this movement, form over weight to isolate the muscle and go to complete failure.

Now tell me again how your girlfriend uses 'perfect' form and and curls 12kg, whilst watching 2nd place Mr Olympia 2012 failing with 13.6kg.


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## Cutandjacked

Well Kai Greene aside, I think you've gotta work out what works best for you. I'm Natty and I've got 17" arms cold and I use a combo of strict and loose form. Preaching good form is all good and well, but you really have to overload the biceps to build big arms.


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## Cutandjacked

onthebuild said:


> As stated I could lift heavier, but not with the same form. I do hammer curls first, then EZbar curls, then finally DB bicep curls like in the video to finish off. If you watched the video you will see kai greene curling 30lbs (13.6kg) and STRUGGLING to finish a set of 10. Dont get me wrong, he may do this after heavy sets of BB curls or whatever, but he's using this movement, form over weight to isolate the muscle and go to complete failure.
> 
> Now tell me again how your girlfriend uses 'perfect' form and and curls 12kg, whilst watching 2nd place Mr Olympia 2012 failing with 13.6kg.


Kai also bench presses five plates a side, so he is very strong also.


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## Dux

HodgesoN said:


> but site injections dont work a treat.


Since when?


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## HodgesoN

onthebuild said:


> As stated I could lift heavier, but not with the same form. I do hammer curls first, then EZbar curls, then finally DB bicep curls like in the video to finish off. If you watched the video you will see kai greene curling 30lbs (13.6kg) and STRUGGLING to finish a set of 10. Dont get me wrong, he may do this after heavy sets of BB curls or whatever, but he's using this movement, form over weight to isolate the muscle and go to complete failure.
> 
> Now tell me again how your girlfriend uses 'perfect' form and and curls 12kg, whilst watching 2nd place Mr Olympia 2012 failing with 13.6kg.


my gf usses perfect with 12kg dumbbells  , i dont give a sh it what kai does or doesnt do and imo all these vids with kai using pussy weight is BULL SH IT, every video i watch of him training someone he does the same old sh it and its bollox imo, same as the pros and there steroid doses, they talk sh it, you will never hear the truth uness you know them personally and then sti might not get the truth from them, i wil never listen to any of the pros from any dvd EVER.


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## HodgesoN

Dux said:


> Since when?


are we talking aas or gregg valentino type shi t ?


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## Dux

Aas.

There's plenty of guys on here who have had success with it, myself included.


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## onthebuild

Cutandjacked said:


> Kai also bench presses five plates a side, so he is very strong also.


Does this not reinforce that if someone that strong uses a lighter weight, then people who are less strong should do the same? I see the likes of incrediblebulk in his journal curling 26kgs and look at the size of him. Then I see lads in the gym curling 30kgs doing nothing more than getting a pump in their lower back they're swinging about that much. Speaks volumes to me.



Cutandjacked said:


> Well Kai Greene aside, I think you've gotta work out what works best for you. I'm Natty and I've got 17" arms cold and I use a combo of strict and loose form. Preaching good form is all good and well, but you really have to overload the biceps to build big arms.


Definately do what works for you mate. As in my original post, I always say IMO, as I respect others, just seems to make sense to me when I get a much better pump and growth from lower weight with better form. I used to be one of the ones curling the big weights with terrible form, and it just didnt work for me.

Ohh and if your looking for a bicep-off ill have a go with my puny fvckers :beer:


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## saxondale

onthebuild said:


> Ohh and if your looking for a bicep-off ill have a go with my puny fvckers :beer:
> 
> View attachment 105033


classic overworked light loaded arms - size but not defined


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## onthebuild

saxondale said:


> classic overworked light loaded arms - size but not defined


People in glass houses.. :whistling:


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## Cutandjacked

onthebuild said:


> People in glass houses.. :whistling:


They are a fine pair of guns mate, don't worry about them!


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## countrybumpkin

As Fatstuff said. More food, more patience.

Also important, Do you train legs?

I see alot of different threads on all kinds of BBing forums similar to "I WANTZ BIG BICEPTZ" but for many of these guys thats the only muscle they train...

however, My routine looks something like this and seems to work well.

BB curls 3 sets, pyramaiding up in weight. Example : 40Kg for 15, 60 kg for 12 75kg for 5

Then I run the rack with preacher curls for like 4-5 sets.


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## HodgesoN

Dux said:


> Aas.
> 
> There's plenty of guys on here who have had success with it, myself included.


my personal opinion is your talking bollox mate, iv done site injections over the years and found no benefit froom jabbing my gluts, delts or what ever, its a myth in my eyes.


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## Ash1981

HodgesoN said:


> bull shi t.


Surely you mean bull shit


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## saxondale

onthebuild said:


> People in glass houses.. :whistling:


LOL yes,

I`m happy with the definition for my size, that is the look I`m after - I`m a small muscle guy, I gave up trying to get big years ago.

lifting small weights slowly is a waste of time.


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## HodgesoN

saxondale said:


> LOL yes,
> 
> I`m happy with the definition for my size, that is the look I`m after - I`m a small muscle guy, I gave up trying to get big years ago.
> 
> lifting small weights slowly is a waste of time.


for fitness it is prefect.


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## Dux

HodgesoN said:


> my personal opinion is your talking bollox mate, iv done site injections over the years and found no benefit froom jabbing my gluts, delts or what ever, its a myth in my eyes.


 Thanks for your input


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## onthebuild

saxondale said:


> LOL yes,
> 
> I`m happy with the definition for my size, that is the look I`m after - I`m a small muscle guy, I gave up trying to get big years ago.
> 
> lifting small weights slowly is a waste of time.


So what you're saying is you arent trying to get big or defined? And im the one wasting my time? :lol:


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## saxondale

HodgesoN said:


> for fitness it is prefect.


agree totally, so is jogging.


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## HJL

saxondale said:


> classic overworked light loaded arms- size but not defined


elaborate please mate. what the fook is ' overworked light loaded arms' and how does that lead to size but no definition?


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## saxondale

onthebuild said:


> So what you're saying is you arent trying to get big or defined? And im the one wasting my time? :lol:


you do seem to have a problem reading my posts, dont worry about it - some of us are quite happy to be simply well defined, that is where my diet and training is.

none of which has anything to do with the OP`s question how to gain size ......... more load required.


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## onthebuild

saxondale said:


> you do seem to have a problem reading my posts, dont worry about it - some of us are quite happy to be simply well defined, that is where my diet and training is.
> 
> none of which has anything to do with the OP`s question how to gain size ......... more load required.


Ahh I understand, it just seems that you arent well defined at all. :confused1:


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## Cutandjacked

There is no way to increase definition but then lower your bf%.


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## countrybumpkin

On the topic of site injecting into a muscle to make it bigger. I believe it to be true, since injecting biceps, triceps and delts more often, they have improved at quite a fast rate. HOWEVER, I do NOT believe its the AAS having a localised effect, I think injecting mls into a muscle on a weekly biceps will help stretch the muscle fascia and induce growth that way. I May be completely wrong so don't quote me on that, but thats my theory on the matter...


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## biglbs

When you have done all this pm me and i will tell you which one works,,,,,pmsl


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## HodgesoN

countrybumpkin said:


> On the topic of site injecting into a muscle to make it bigger. I believe it to be true, since injecting biceps, triceps and delts more often, they have improved at quite a fast rate. HOWEVER, I do NOT believe its the AAS having a localised effect, I think injecting mls into a muscle on a weekly biceps will help stretch the muscle fascia and induce growth that way. I May be completely wrong so don't quote me on that, but thats my theory on the matter...


aas is not a site injecting oil.


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## onthebuild

biglbs said:


> When you have done all this pm me and i will tell you which one works,,,,,pmsl


Can I just pm you anyway :wub:


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## biglbs

onthebuild said:


> Can I just pm you anyway :wub:


Only nude pmsl or in spandex


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## vandangos

just concentrate on your back exercises..... I didn't train bi's in isolation for over a year and they got to a decent size.

iv never seen someone stack the lat pull down without decent bi's.


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## Guest

The guy who come 2nd in Mr Olympia must be wrong then?? Maybe if he came to you for advice he could have won eh....


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## Robbie

saxondale said:


> classic overworked light loaded arms - size but not defined


Eh? Surely definition comes from diet??


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## countrybumpkin

HodgesoN said:


> aas is not a site injecting oil.


Yes i know... I never said it was. But what I am saying, is that injecting an oil very frequently into a small muscle WILL stretch it somewhat, possibly inducing growth through fascia stretching.


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## LutherLee

Your bi's are hard to grow coz you use them all the time imo. I do 3 heavy sets each of bi curls, hammers and preacher. If you think they're lagging then work extra hard on them. P.s my guns are over 18 inches


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## Pancake'

Apply progressive overload, have some compound lifts for your biceps to name 2 would be pull ups and bent rows also apply direct arm work such as curls and keep increasing the weight staying in a 6 - 12 rep range when training biceps i like to train with a dropset fashion maybe u could do supersets? but i prefer to dropset it's what i respond to i would say myself that arms respond well to constant tension maybe u could train them in a fashion to mike mentzer with his hit googles your freind however u just have to find what you will respond to and mix it up ever so often try doing 3 sets of pull ups then instantly jumping into barbell curls also don't forget to STRETCH


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## onthebuild

countrybumpkin said:


> Yes i know... I never said it was. But what I am saying, is that injecting an oil very frequently into a small muscleWILL stretch it somewhat, possibly inducing growth through fascia stretching.


Heard of this also, possibly weeman who was advocating it, although im not certain.


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## Cutandjacked

Light loaded arms lol... At the end of the day everyone has different body and indeed bicep composition, some with peaks or longer biceps. It's about playing to your strengths and working with what you've got. For me hammer curls are no1, heavy sets, lighter sets, FST-7, drop sets, up and down the rack, rest pause.... There's a multitude of techniques u can employ the build up your biceps. No point wasting your time doing one handed cable curls if u have no mass. I'd just kill hammer, dumbbell and barbell curls till you've built up sufficient mass, then move onto more isolatory movements. Hope this helps


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## saxondale

I`m need to apologise, I posted without thinking and said what I didn`t mean to and didn`t say what I meant to,

if I have upset anyone I apologise whole heartedly and will think harder before commenting in future.

sorry guys, not the impression I wanted to make


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## Heath

I read first page and it was painful lol.

Has Mark Fattoe really brainwashed people into thinking 4x8 chins = gunz??


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## alan_wilson

My arms are my good point..for some reason they grow quicker than other body parts.

I do.

3x8 preacher curls (not including one warm up set)

3x10 weighted chins

3x8 Seated incline db bicep curls

3x12 db hammers.

It may seem alot, but works a treat for me, and I've got good results from it.

If I do biceps after a back workout I just leave out chins, as with back I do pull ups...


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## Moorey123

Wow I wasn't expecting quite a as many responses but it's got me thinking. Thanks alot for all your opinions and techniques advised. To answer a few questions I have been doing 3 x 8 for DB curls and 2 x 8 for Barbell curls following the principles of HIT advised by Mike Mentzer and Dorrian Yates.

Despite not working at a high volume I am seeing strength gains but I have upped the weight so that I can only get to 6 reps per working set. Only tried this for a week so wont know results for a while. I'm trying to keep things simple so that I can stay motivated and by this I just mean upping the weight once I can do 8 reps comfortably to a weight where I fail on 6 reps. Out of interest how long have you lot been training before you and others started to notice you were lifting weights regularly?


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## justin case

just try a few close grip chin ups and see how your biceps respond, i think you will be pleasantly surprised....just try it.


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## oldskoolcool

Want bigger arms? Eat and rest them more they grow when their resting, my arms are over 18" and i never train them directly rows, pull up's, presses, dips are all good for hitting them.


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## Guest

Genetically my arms are week.

I have religiously front/back squat, deadlift, bench an ohp for years.

Currently can close grip 110kg for reps also.

Tried supersets, giving them their own day, high reps, low reps you name it.

I've faced facts and realise they will always grow slower than other bodyparts.


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## trainiac

I think you hit it. Genetics of specific body parts is a big factor. Nevertheless, your biceps can grow - how much and how fast is the question. I would definitely be sure to include hammer curls. The brachialis muscle extends under the bicep, so as it develops, your biceps should push up and out.


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## vandangos

Tri's are 2/3 of your arm....Want big arms? hit triceps hard.


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## gringo

Someone at T-Nation actually measured muscle activity during different exercises:

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/inside_the_muscles_best_back_and_biceps_exercises

No surprise that weighted chins (underhand & parallel grip) came out top.

You get to energise your entire pulling chain, you put a lot more load on the arms than any curl,

and you get good resistance through the whole range of motion.

Of course people are different - mix of muscle fibres bla bla bla but I've seen several training partners

and gym buddies start to put some beef on their arms from chinning heavy.


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## Cutandjacked

Weighted chins could certainly help the biceps grow, but wouldn't rely on them. Variation is the key, change things up so you training doesn't become stagnant and unproductive. By the same token, don't try and reinvent the wheel. Old skool mass builders such as barbell and DB curl are time tested and beat standing one legged on a Swiss ball doing a reverse cable preacher curl... You get the point lol. Keep it heavy, keep tension on the bicep. As Arnie said think about the biceps as mountains not pieces of flesh and there's no end to how much they could grow. Genetics play a factor, but don't sell yourself short in the arm department using that as an excuse. remember to turn beast mode ON!


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