# Muffin Tops...



## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Hey y'all,

I've been partaking in the Kris Gethin 12 week daily trainer (Don't know if you heard of it) and basically, i'm not seeing the results i want. I've been at it for 6 weeks and it's time for a change. I was consuming way too much carbs on this program and training was all scattered, so i want a fixed routine with a clean diet to boot. What i hate at the moment, is my muffin tops, and a little bit of a tyre on my lower abs. It's not too drastic, but if i was to wear a tight shirt or something, it would be visible.

Basically, i'm just seeking some advice as to whether you think this diet sounds ok. I'm in the habit of eating clean, but i do struggle on weekends, so any tips to stay motivated or any good simple meal ideas would be great 

Anyway, here goes:

Breakfast (8:00am) - 1 Wholewheat bagel and 2 egg whites

Snack (10:30am) - 2 scoops of Gaspari MyoFusion with 400ml of water (50g protein, 10g carbs)

Lunch (12:00pm or 1:00pm, depending on my lunch rota at work) - 200g cooked chicken breast and 60g brown rice

Snack (3:30pm/4:00pm) - 1 tin of tuna in either sunflower oil or brine and salad (bagged salad or shreds of fresh lettuce and carrot)

Pre-workout (5:45pm) - Nutrex Hemo-Rage Black (1 scoop)

Post-workout (7:30ish) - 2 scoops of Gaspari MyoFusion, 2 scoops of CNP Pro Fuel and 5g of Glutamine (50g protein, 57.5g carbs, 5g glutamine)

Dinner (9:00pm/9:30pm) - Either chicken, steak, mince meat, fish and veg such as brocolli, peas or cauliflower

So what do you think guys? I also take Multi-vitamins, EFA's, glucosamine and BCAA's (SciVation XTEND)

Not fully sussed how i'm gonna go about hitting the weights just yet, but does the diet sound like a good start? At least 25 minutes hill walking/lay-z bike/cross trainer after every weights session also 

Thanks in advance! 

Alex

WHOOPS! Forgot to add, i also play 5 a side football every Tuesday evening


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## Phenix (May 12, 2012)

hi bud nice of you to join the forum I don't know much but I am sure some one will get back to you bud cheers


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## justheretosnoop (Jun 15, 2012)

How much do you weigh and what's your bf give or take?

I'd get out of the mindset of calling any of them snacks. They're not snacks, they're full on meals and should contain pretty much the same nutritional values from dawn till dusk.

Can't remember them all now (on Tapatalk so cant see the op when replying) but meal 1 needs more protein, meals 2 & 4 some clean carbs.

Welcome to the board btw dude!!


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Dorsey said:


> How much do you weigh and what's your bf give or take?
> 
> I'd get out of the mindset of calling any of them snacks. They're not snacks, they're full on meals and should contain pretty much the same nutritional values from dawn till dusk.
> 
> ...


Cheers guys! 

Yeah i guess, just thought snack was easier to type  ha ha.

As for clean carbs though, i'm trying to keep as low as possible, because at the moment, instead of tuna and salad, i'm eating tuna and wholewheat pasta, but nothing is shifting, and as for my protein shake, there are 10g of carbs in that, unsure as to whether they are clean or not?

I'm just fed up of not seeing results, i eat better than any of my friends, train a lot harder and do a lot more research, yet they are all much more defined than me and some even bigger than me. The only thing i can put that against is that i started the gym fat and they started thin.


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## justheretosnoop (Jun 15, 2012)

You lifting 4-5 times a week??


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Dorsey said:


> You lifting 4-5 times a week??


Yeah, pretty much. My body copes quite well with it to be fair, and a lot of programs use this method too


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

have a look at my stickeyd thread in the beginners section mate for some ideas on training.


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

TheCrazyCal said:


> have a look at my stickeyd thread in the beginners section mate for some ideas on training.


Hey TheCrazyCal,

I wouldn't class myself as a beginner really, i've been training for a while and do have a reasonable amount of knowledge. However, you probably know a lot more than i do so i'll check it out, thanks


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## AChappell (Jun 1, 2011)

AlexanderBurton said:


> Hey y'all,
> 
> I've been partaking in the Kris Gethin 12 week daily trainer (Don't know if you heard of it) and basically, i'm not seeing the results i want. I've been at it for 6 weeks and it's time for a change. I was consuming way too much carbs on this program and training was all scattered, so i want a fixed routine with a clean diet to boot. What i hate at the moment, is my muffin tops, and a little bit of a tyre on my lower abs. It's not too drastic, but if i was to wear a tight shirt or something, it would be visible.
> 
> ...


No offense Alex but this diet is retarded! I don't know what you've been researching but internet articles just won't cut the muster, you've very much gone down the keto/palumbo/atkins/caveman/polquin diet approach of eating a ton of protein with very little carbs. It looks to me like you've taken the diet plan proposed by Kris and decided to adapt it by taking out whatever little carbs where in it to start with. Time to start reading proper books on nutrition and metabolism, or better yet have a look at my article "high protein diets a poor fit for the natural bodybuilder" in the natural bodybuilding section, I'm currently working on the second part of the article on diet design.

A few things to start with: your goal is to lose the muffin top.

If you want to achieve that goal you have to consider what I call the bodybuilding triad. Rest and Recuperation-Nutrition and Supplementation-Goal Specific Training.

Now you might do alright if you train hard and sleep/rest ok but if you half ass your diet like you do at the weekends then the results will never be as good as if you gave it 100% in all three areas. Results will be slower, you might lose motivation and before you know it your missing workouts and meals. So focus is vital, write your goal out, stick it on the fridge and maybe give yourself a self audit and decide why you want to achieve that goal and how your going to get there, and what steps you'll take that will help.

Also be sure to track your progress, weigh yourself once a week and take photographs and tape measurements every 4 weeks. Losing inches and tracking progress is a great motivator.

Now about the diet, football is such a diverse activity in terms of energy systems utilized. Sometimes your sprinting, or jogging at other times your stationary only to be called into action, so a diet devoid of carbs makes no sense and the same is true for weight training so add some. Secondly consider this: on that current regime if you hit a wall at 6 weeks into your diet and you stop losing weight, what are you going to do cut more carbs? So at least have some you can subtract in this scenario.

I've highlighted a few things in your diet, you've not given us an idea of how much you weigh so I'll just put in what I would expect a 80kg trainer to eat to reach their goal any questions then fire them into my Q and A section on the forum.

gd luck!


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

AChappell said:


> No offense Alex but this diet is retarded! I don't know what you've been researching but internet articles just won't cut the muster, you've very much gone down the keto/palumbo/atkins/caveman/polquin diet approach of eating a ton of protein with very little carbs. It looks to me like you've taken the diet plan proposed by Kris and decided to adapt it by taking out whatever little carbs where in it to start with. Time to start reading proper books on nutrition and metabolism, or better yet have a look at my article "high protein diets a poor fit for the natural bodybuilder" in the natural bodybuilding section, I'm currently working on the second part of the article on diet design.
> 
> A few things to start with: your goal is to lose the muffin top.
> 
> ...


Hi mate,

As much as i appreciate your advice, i can't stress enough that i am not a beginner.

The reason i have cut my diet down to that is because i have been eating more carbs for 6 weeks, gradually dropping each week and my fat is going no where. I used to completely neglect carbs, so then when i started eating them again, my body didn't like it, and just made me look worse if anything. I know everyone says to eat more carbs etc, but when my plan is to lose fat, and the carbs im already eating arent doing that, why should i add more?

Plus, it's not that easy for me to eat all that you have suggested, i have to adapt my diet around my work, so at 4:00pm, i can't just have a full on sit down meal.

It just annoys me because everything i look up or different forums i seek advice on, i get so many conflicting answers. It's all well and good eating carbs if i'm starting from scratch, then i can drop them, but the fact i'm 6 weeks into just a bit more carb heavy version of the diet above, i feel i need to drop them. I'll never shed the fat if i'm eating all those carbs. i weigh 181lbs and probably have about anywhere between 20-30% body fat on me, which i need to shift. Then when i've lost the fat, i can see where i need to develop and start to add carbs back into it.


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## EXTREME (Aug 5, 2005)

Alex, you keep saying you're not a beginner, but you've gone on to say "everything i look up or different forums i seek advice on, i get so many conflicting answers", is that how you do research? Ask on a forum?

If it is, you are a beginner, asking for advice on forums will get you peoples opinions, it's highly unlikely you'll get much else because most of the people who really know about diet will charge you for advice.

You need to learn about the food groups, you're own body and how it reacts to certain aspects of a diet, for example some people respond well to a low carb diet and others don't. The only way to find out is to try.

There is a book called "Sliced" by Negrita Jade, it's pretty cheap and available through Amazon, I learned more about dieting from that book than I did anywhere else.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

alex stick some pics up mate..

if your 20%+ on bf you sound like youre getting something way wrong.

you should be able to drop weight without doing anythng fancy at all.


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## justheretosnoop (Jun 15, 2012)

^^^ Agreed. It's not overly difficult to drop to around 15ish providing diet/training are even semi-correct.


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## AChappell (Jun 1, 2011)

Alex at 181lbs and with 20 - 30% bodyfat your clearly a beginner and by the sounds of things. If you just train longer then you'll probably find you'll lose weight. Now I've gave you some advice and trust me it's good advice, and Extreme has followed it up with some good advice, but don't go from forum to forum until you get the answer's you want.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

alex, andy came second at the amateur Olympia, he knows his shizzle..

n im gonna be buying the book extreme recommended, as i am truly a beginner when it comes to real dieting..


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

yup got mine for a tenner too, pricey brand new tho..jesus!


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## MichelleD (Dec 9, 2011)

fleg said:


> Extreme thanks for recommendation just ordered...


Where from? I've looked but I can only find it in the USA...


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

amazon which means it`ll be shipped from usa..


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## MichelleD (Dec 9, 2011)

fleg said:


> £50 new!!!
> 
> Here M..
> 
> ...


Thank you :thumb


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## MichelleD (Dec 9, 2011)

Phew, just ordered it... £7.02 but won't arrive till the end of April


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Hey guys,

Just back to the topic in question. It's what i think will work for me. I am trying to lose body fat and get lean, not bulk.

Here are some photos of me to give you an idea. I'm 181lbs, 5ft11, 36inch waist. Anything else you need to know, please ask 

View attachment 3140
View attachment 3139


I only say 20-30% body fat because i have no idea, and the podgiest part of me is my lower back, eg-muffin tops! I want to bring my back out (get my wings) to create a nice V taper, i want to get rid of the fat from my lower chest and get defined pecs, increase my arm size and have some defined abs. After i'm defined and can see what i have, then maybe i can bulk. I want to stay a similar size to these photos, but i just want to lose fat, and not have to buy an entire new wardrobe. I like my shirts to fit tight around my arms, so i don't want my arms to lose size.

I really do appreciate all your diet advice and i respect that you are all tried and tested at very high levels, it's just that i think it won't work for me. I'm eating less carbs than you guys suggested and the fat isn't shifting, if anything, i'm losing more and more definition as the weeks go on, apart from on my arms, and that still isn't great.

And if my diet is retarded, does that make kris gethin's diet retarted? Mine is based on that, but granted he does eat a lot more than me. He is a lot bigger and immediately has more appetite, and his job is with bodybuildig.com, so he can do what he wants, when he wants, eat how he wants etc. In my opinion, he has it easy. He eats a fist sized portion of protein and a cup of carbs per meal, and he has around 7-8 meals a day. I can't find the time to eat like this, or even afford to eat like this.

Also, with the pre workout drink, i am not taking this to make me more muscular, i know that isn't its purpose. I use it as a stimulant to give me more energy in the gym because i am low on carbs.

Tonight i trained chest, and because my diet was slagged off and i just felt like i wasn't doing anything right with the way i eat or train, it was a s**t session.

No matter what i try, i feel like i won't get the results i want. I know rome wasn't built in a day, and a couple of years ago, i did weigh 17stone! But since then, with all the weight training i've done, you'd have thought i'd see some definition by now.

So is it a case of that diet you suggested will work for everybody? Or it's what worked for you? Because i can not see that in-taking more carbs than i already am will help me lose fat?

Thanks in advance


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

fair play for putting pics up fella, id guess you was about 16-18% but others will have a better idea.

how much cardio are you doing and whats your training routine like? This is just as important as diet

Iv lost fat while uping carbs, dont think carbs need to be the devil! excessive carbs yes but they are just as important and protein and fats.


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

SX Dave said:


> fair play for putting pics up fella, id guess you was about 16-18% but others will have a better idea.
> 
> how much cardio are you doing and whats your training routine like? This is just as important as diet
> 
> Iv lost fat while uping carbs, dont think carbs need to be the devil! excessive carbs yes but they are just as important and protein and fats.


Cheers mate, i couldn't really get a good light so you can see the crevises etc but you get the jist 

Like i say, i was doing the Gethin thing, but now i'll probably train something like this.

Sunday - Back and Bis

Monday - Chest and Tris

Tuesdays - Football (count this as a rest day because it's only cardio)

Wednesday - Legs

Thursday - Shoulders

Friday - Calves and Abs

Saturday - Rest

Was thinking of maybe training Shoulders, Calves and Abs all together and have friday as a wild card day where i work on my lagging body parts, but i don't think there's much point in this because at the moment, due to lack of definition, i can't really see what's lagging, apart from my back, but to train that on Friday then again on sunday is just daft!  Or maybe even make Weds a rest day, shift legs to thurs and train shoulds, calves and abs on a friday?

I know carbs aren't the devil, and i've been told not to be a carbophobe, but like i say, my diet before this one was literally 0 carb, so when i started eating them, my body was like WTF, and just started storing them  Which is why i think i need to lean up before adding them to get size  Make sense?

Cheers


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

i think theres also a problem with your routine matey..

have another look at my beginners routine and see how i focus on deads n squats.

you`ll only get bigger if you bulk..


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

fair enough if you want to lean up before gaining size everyone has their own goals.

Id say you need more rest days and add in some cardio to help drop the fat. This will make a massive difference. Id look at Cals 2 day split or a simple 3 day split alongside some cardio and a basic diet will work wonders. How many working sets are you doing for each group and are you doing the big compounds?


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

SX Dave said:


> fair enough if you want to lean up before gaining size everyone has their own goals.
> 
> Id say you need more rest days and add in some cardio to help drop the fat. This will make a massive difference. Id look at Cals 2 day split or a simple 3 day split alongside some cardio and a basic diet will work wonders. How many working sets are you doing for each group and are you doing the big compounds?


How come TheCrazyCals thing would be best for me? Could you please explain some of the science behind it? This isn't me slagging it off or saying i want facts now! lol, i'm just very intrigued as to how and why it was structured  Why is rest beneficial for fat loss? I thought that routine was ok if i'd add another rest day in and train shoulders, calves and abs together?

I forgot to add, i do at least 20 minutes cardio after every weights session, keeping my heart rate as close to 130 as possible, be it the lay-z bike, treadmill, cross trainer etc



> i think theres also a problem with your routine matey..
> 
> have another look at my beginners routine and see how i focus on deads n squats.
> 
> you`ll only get bigger if you bulk..


That's the thing though, i'm not trying to bulk at the moment, i'm just trying to maintain every bit of muscle that i have there, and surely if im doing resistance training, then that will preserve that muscle? correct?

I also do squats when i train legs, and deadlifts when i train back.

Thanks


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

i focus on deads and squats thats it..


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

AlexanderBurton said:


> How come TheCrazyCals thing would be best for me? Could you please explain some of the science behind it?It allows for enough rest to recover and lift progression, it would also free up more time for cardio imo This isn't me slagging it off or saying i want facts now! lol, i'm just very intrigued as to how and why it was structured  Why is rest beneficial for fat loss?Rest allows muscle to grow, more muscle make the matobolisum higher thus burning more cals I thought that routine was ok if i'd add another rest day in and train shoulders, calves and abs together?why not train calves on a legs day, shoulders on a chest day and allow for another days rest?
> 
> I forgot to add, i do at least 20 minutes cardio after every weights session, keeping my heart rate as close to 130 as possible, be it the lay-z bike, treadmill, cross trainer etc
> 
> ...


How many calories are you consuming a day? have you worked out macros? Id make everything as simple as possible if i was you. Basic abbriviated training along with some cardio and a clean well balanced diet.


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## AChappell (Jun 1, 2011)

AlexanderBurton said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Just back to the topic in question. It's what i think will work for me. I am trying to lose body fat and get lean, not bulk.
> 
> ...


At a guess looking at your photo's I'd say your sitting around 18 - 20% BF so not quite as high as 30% so to come down from 17stone your BF was obviously a lot higher, so you've done well to lose that much weight, but your physique still resembles that of a relative beginner, rather than that of a bodybuilder or fitness trainer as do your goals. Now there's nothing wrong with that since we all have to start somewhere, while seeing your bodyshape transform as you pack on muscle mass is one of the most exciting times in any trainer. To get past the stage your at just now be it beginner or intermediate or whatever you'd refer to yourself as you really need to start addressing the flaws in your training like some of the guys have pointed out and the flaws in your diet like a few of the other members including me have pointed out. Otherwise your progress will be slow and you'll end up looking the same in 6 months time and nobody wants to be that guy in the gym.

So if your goal is to try and stay a similar size as in your photo, while being sliced you need to be realistic, if your 18% BF then you need to try and replace that fat with around 10% muscle to stay a similar weight at least or size. So if you weigh around 80kg then that's 8kilo of muscle you need to try and add which would be no mean feat by anyone's standards and I'd be happy if a beginner made that sort of progress in a year unassisted. So to echo your sentiments Rome wasn't built in a day. My advice to you would be to put this cut your doing on hold since you've lost a ton of weight now, and instead of attempting some sort of bulking phase just increase your calories and focus on building your physique and trying to add that muscle. And Kris Gethin's diet isn't retard, your's is an adulterated version that makes little sense, apart from if you wanted to starve yourself thin. So don't confuse weight loss with fat loss, I know dietitians who wouldn't even recommend such a diet to BMI >50 patients, for fear of them losing precious muscle mass like Cal points out. Nor would I ever put any of my own clients on such a program for the same reason.

It's a shame that you couldn't train properly but the initial comments where supposed to be tongue and cheek your new so I doubt you've ever read any of my posts and I know how emotional someone can get on a low carb plan.

Now you've stated already that you don't think eating carbs will work but you don't know unless you try, adjusting your ratios will be the important factor if you want to implement such a plan while keeping the calories the same. And since you asked I've used multiple approaches for myself when dieting, this one works best for me and for the majority of people I've worked with and trained and not to mention the multiple natural bodybuilders I know and friends. This should be your first approach which can then easily be altered after. If your curious about the science then I have multiple threads on my section of the forum.


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## philb125 (Mar 24, 2012)

Found this a really good read so thanks for all the posters. I like Alex, have similar aims and did have similar mindsets. Just finished a month low carb diet before now trying to add back carbs all be it sensible and not excessive. It's nice to be reassured that they are not the devil as after cutting for a month you kind of switch to that belief.

Anyhow, I'm about to change my routines to be more like cals three day split after fleg helped on my post. I look forward to giving it a try despite fact goes against my previous experience and I am quite looking forward to the change! If nothing else it will certainly freshen up next few months training!

Alex, maybe might be worth giving it a go, it may shock you, and in 6-12 months you'll be dishing out similar advice to others. Firm believer of if you keep doing the same things you'll keep getting same results. If you not happy with results change up what you are doing.....

Any how, great thread. Really interesting. Thanks all!!


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Hey folks, sorry i haven't replied in a while.

Basically, all it comes down to, is that i hate my muffin tops, and if i increase calories or carbs to bulk, then surely they won't decrease in size and only grow? The pictures i posted make me look a lot better than i actually do in my opinion, and i just feel really thick around the trunk, and i know i am, but it seems to be going nowhere.

In regards to the diet i posted, i was eating 60g (uncooked) whole wheat pasta with my tuna originally, and nothing was shifting, which is why i replaced it for salad. However, after working out all my macros, i have found that i am consuming around 1983 calories, with carbs at 133.4g, protein at a whopping 278.76g (100g just from 2 shakes!) and around 36.2g of fat. My BMR suggests that i should be consuming around 1930, and i assume this is just for maintenance?! So i need to drop some calories. I just need some help in balancing this out, and it's hard because i don't have a lot of money to buy all the good food and stuff 

Another thing, is that i was taking my PW shake (50g protein, 50g carbs and 5g glutamine) IMMEDIATELY after weights, and then hitting cardio. I was told today that i should avoid my PW shake until after cardio, is this true? The guy who told me knows his stuff (His name is Dan Barry, you may have heard of him from some comps and stuff). He basically said that it's best to do cardio first because your glycogen levels are depleted, where as if you consume carbs and then do cardio, you're just working from those carbs.

So yeah, as always guys, your inputs would be greatly appreciated 

Thanks in advance


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Hey everyone!

I finally worked out the macros of what i'm eating, so i was wondering if you could tell me how this sounds to try and strip some fat. I know some people say i should be bulking and stuff, but i'd rather not have the fat there when i start to bulk, so i am just building muscle. Any advice would be great.

Here goes:

Breakfast (8:00am) - 4 egg whites and a toasted muffin - Cals:202, Carbs:27.3g, Protein:20.1g, Fat:1.4g

Meal 2 (10:30am) - 1 scoop Gaspari MyoFusion Protein Shake with 200ml water - Cals:150, Carbs:5g, Protein:25g, Fat:3g

Lunch (1:00pm) - 100g chicken breast and 50g brown rice - Cals:199.5, Carbs:11.8g, Protein:32.25g, Fat:2.3g

Meal 4 (4:00pm) - Tin of Tuna (130g drained) in sunflower oil and some shredded lettuce - Cals:266.1, Carbs:1g, Protein:32.5g, Fat:14.04g

Pre Workout (5:45pm) - 1 scoop Nutrex HEMO-RAGE Black Ultra Concentrate

Post Workout (7:30pm) - 2 scoops Gaspari Myofusion, 2 scoops CNP ProFuel and 5g glutamine with water - Cals:492, Carbs:60g, Protein:50.1g, Fat:6g

Dinner (9:30pm) - 100g chicken breast and 50g brown rice (may swap out rice for broccoli, depending on your suggestions) - Cals:199.5, Carbs:11.8g, Protein:32.25g, Fat:2.3g

TOTALS: Calories: 1499.1, Carbohydrates: 115.9g, Protein: 192.2g, Fat: 29.04g

I also take Multi-Vitamins, Scivation XTEND BCAA Powder and EFA's.

I will also be weight training and doing at least 25 minutes cardio with a heart rate around 130 after every weights session.

Feedback would be greatly appreciated guys, thanks in advance 

Remember, my goal is to lean up, then bulk  (That's if you think this is a good idea? Obviously summer is coming up so i don't want to look any doughier than i do now, and at least when i trim down, maybe i will bulk a bit better  )


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## MichelleD (Dec 9, 2011)

Hey. Based on that, you would be eating about 500 calories a day less than me and I'm 5'3" and 52kg. I am also working on getting leaner and I am able to do that by eating more than you! You're not eating enough which will just work against you.


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Well apparently, according to most websites, my BMR is around 1950, and I've been told a 500 calorie defecit will help lose fat?

I've just heard so much stuff, that my brain is fried? I thought that was a pretty solid diet. You're probably eating more because your metabolism is a lot faster. Correct?


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## MichelleD (Dec 9, 2011)

It is difficult when there is so much advice out there.

My metabolism is no different to anyone else's. I just have to look at a piece of cake and I gain weight! At the end of the day, you can give it a try and see what happens. If it doesn't work, you can always tweak the numbers...


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

you could say training is an art form rather than a pure science..


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## jordan_ (Mar 5, 2011)

MichelleD said:


> It is difficult when there is so much advice out there.
> 
> My metabolism is no different to anyone else's. I just have to look at a piece of cake and I gain weight! At the end of the day, you can give it a try and see what happens. If it doesn't work, you can always tweak the numbers...


Good advice


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

TheCrazyCal said:


> you could say training is an art form rather than a pure science..


I'm sorry Cal, I don't quite understand what you mean? Am I being thick? (probably! Ha ha)

So should I just try this diet then? If I eat like that and do cardio, will it aid fat loss, yes or no? If yes, then I will give it a whirl. Is there anything wrong with brown rice with my evening meal? Should I be eating anything else?

Thanks


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## jordan_ (Mar 5, 2011)

Brown rice is food for weight loss matey so I'd say stick with it


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## MichelleD (Dec 9, 2011)

From what I have been told and learnt along the way, if you try such a low calorie diet and then throw cardio in on top of that, you won't get the results you're after because you will have created such a deficit that your body will be unwilling to give up the fat (not very scientific, but that's how I understand it). I have also been there and done that :becky: Ultimately though, you are the person that has to put the time and effort in, so if that's what you want to try, then give it a fair go and see what happens.

As for the brown rice, if you like brown rice then there's nothing wrong with it, but basmati rice is a good alternative. There are plenty of opinions out there on whether you should eat carbs later on in the day, but if you work on keeping everything as simple as possible and just eat a moderate amount of clean carbs split out more or less equally throughout the day, you can't go wrong.


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

I'll just give it a go then 

Thanks guys


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

Basically I think by eating so little calories you are hindering fat loss as M has said. Eating more will help little and often. Without wafflin on basically what's been said on here already or is readily available to searsh on here.

But by all means try its all a leaning curve. Gotta learn for yourself. I lit weight in more carbs than I used to eat its a balance


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

I'm just really confused now? If my BMR is 1950, then surely i have to eat less than that to lose weight?

Could someone please post an edited version of the diet i posted a few posts back then just to give me an idea what they'd do, because my brain is well and truly fried now. I don't know what to eat, when to eat it, whether to bulk, to cut. All i want to do is get rid of my bloody muffin tops! Is it really this hard  lol


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## webadmin1466867919 (Dec 1, 2006)

The amount I calories you take in doesn't necessary mean you'll gain or lose weight it is more down to the food your taking in. If you were to have 3000 calories of the right calories you can still lose weight or have 1700 of the wrong ones and put weight on.


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## yannyboy (Jun 20, 2009)

dj said:


> The amount I calories you take in doesn't necessary mean you'll gain or lose weight it is more down to the food your taking in. *If you were to have 3000 calories of the right calories you can still lose weight or have 1700 of the wrong ones and put weight on*.


Can I ask how you came to this assumption?


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## doggy (Mar 26, 2011)

ive read similar yanny. if everything you eat is low gi you wont get fat, thats what was said.


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

But didn't someone a while ago only eat junk food and sweets but kept to sensible calories and he maintained his weight? Think it was in the paper or on tv...


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

I got some more pics now to show you a bit better of what I look like. I'll post them in here later this evening. My current diet is around 1989 calories, 120g carbs, 278g Protein (I get 100g just from my 2 shakes) and around 40g fat.

I might maintain this for now because it does seem to dropping pound by pound on the scales. But it's just sometimes in the mirror I look good, and others I look terrible!


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Also, I think I have established some science between my BMR and my diet. The BMR I was given by the website is a big standard BMR, meaning that's would I'd burn off in a normal day, WITHOUT exercise. Therefore, I need to eat more because my actual BMR is probably higher, therefore I can eat more for energy and to fuel muscle growth and still promote fat loss. Am I correct in saying that? Or at least on the right lines?

I also went to order that 'Sliced' book yesterday, but it's £20 quid now, is it worth it? Can't find it anywhere other than amazon. Can you get good bodybuilding books in local libraries normally?


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## doggy (Mar 26, 2011)

SX Dave said:


> But didn't someone a while ago only eat junk food and sweets but kept to sensible calories and he maintained his weight? Think it was in the paper or on tv...


 i would love to see that, they must have ate once per day.


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## doggy (Mar 26, 2011)

alex my bmr is higher than yours, and i'm 42. i dont count calories, but if i was to guess it would be close to 3000 per day. i dont work out macros, i just eat healthy. ive got kids so i have the odd bit of cake or chocolate. i dont exercise everday and to be honest its pretty sporadic. i dont drink, smoke or do drugs. i try and get as much sleep as possible. my weight sits steady. if i wanted to lose weight i would be more critical of my macros and i would do a lot more cardio.


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## SX Dave (Jun 14, 2007)

Makes sense Alex, with exercise etc the deficit of cals would be too great. If the 1950cals intake is allowing steady slow fat loss then stick with it! (to quick weight loss will be muscle too)

Glad it making a bit more sense to you. It. Takes time to understand, time to implement the changes and most importantly time to see results!

See how it goes and adjust accordingly given time.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

what i mean is it aint as simple as doing a calculation to know what cals youre on or need, its hard to factor things like life stress and training intensity.

you can copy any number of productive routines but still not get anywhere..

its down to the interpretation of the science that makes it work..

its very common on training forums..people want 1+1 to = 2

it is that simple, but for some reason so many get it wrong.

so reading all the sciencey articles in the world aint the answer.. its understanding them when you put them into practise..

anyone can spout it all off in a thread..


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

Thanks guys, i'll probably just continue with my current diet then  See how it goes i guess. I just want the weight to come off so then i can do a nice bulk cause i do really want to start building muscle onto my frame 

There is a thread on the forum about a basic cutting diet, but the times are CRAZY! Surely no one eats like that, especially if adequate rest is a must.

I was just wondering, would anyone be so kind to post just rough diet plans for a cut and a bulk, including the best types of foods to eat, when to eat and how much of what to eat.

I appreciate this might take some time, and if no one can do it then that's ok, but it would really help me understand the basics a lot more. Just use my diet plan i posted as a base and tweek that maybe?

When is it best to start a bulk? Because is it a good idea to start one just as its about to be shirt off weather? I'm just a bit worried that when i bulk, it will pile on as fat, so i absoultely have to get this spot on, so any help would be key.

Thanks guys and girls


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

read other peoples diet threads..

i heavily suggest you start my beginners routine too, or at least understand the principles of it.. :wink:


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

TheCrazyCal said:


> read other peoples diet threads..
> 
> i heavily suggest you start my beginners routine too, or at least understand the principles of it.. :wink:


Yeah man, I was reading up on it, I'm just quite confused as to when and how you do it? And doesn't a woout like that and cardio take forever? I think I am more than competent for training certain body parts on certain days, just need to implicate a bit more rest and tailor my routine properly  I have started incorporating squats and deads into my workouts, and boy am I sore the next day! Ha ha


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

2x a week for 2-3 sets each exercise.

youre thinking too much already dude..

construct your own diet and it `ll get tweaked, that way we get to see what you know, not just what youre repeating..

you dont need to know much to grow just to understand what you do.. :wink:


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## doggy (Mar 26, 2011)

take cals advice and keep things simple


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## AlexanderBurton1466867956 (Feb 7, 2009)

I'll post up some photos later and the diet I'm currently eating, then you can hit me up about what you think of it


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