# Carb cycling - ratio's for low/high days



## BennyC (Mar 18, 2010)

Hi,

I've ready through the sticky and actually have experience of carb cycling without realising it, I did so when I first used IF about 3 years ago. More recently I've tried CBL and CNS though with CNS seem to be hitting a plateau, that said I'm sure I could get more cardio in however my recovery on CNS is terrible and I don't think it's working particularly well. My fats could be slightly higher but the macro's are give or take where they should be.

Currently 5'10", 86KG at about 14% (down from 92KG at 16/17% going by the eye). I've been reloading once every 5/7 days for the last 3 weeks (with 4 weeks of CBL before that) with circa 400g of carbs which I've found to be slightly too high. I think I will ditch this in favour of cycling as I feel it's more more practical and livable for me. Not that I've struggled with food cravings but my training has had to be knocked down a few pegs.

No carb days don't really bother me at all and I manage quite well without them. I couldn't find a recommendation for the amount of grams of carbs to consume?

Would 100-150g (50g dextrose PWO with couscous/sweet potato with main meal) on low days and 250-300g (50-100g dextrose PWO, couscous/rice/pasta with main meal and maybe the occasional cheat item as a dessert) on high days sound like a good ratio?

Mon/Weds/Fri are training days

Mon - High

Tues - none

Weds - Low

Thurs - none

Fri - low

Sat - none

Sun - none

Thoughts welcomed!

Ben


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## Justin Cider (Jul 18, 2010)

Pscarb got a good article in a section here somewhere,

High days are 1-1.5g lb/bw

Low is 0.75-1 lb b/w

Fats at 40-50g ed

Protein at 1.5g lb/bw


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## Justin Cider (Jul 18, 2010)

It was 2 hi days / 3 low / 2 none... Hi days on big workout days


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## BennyC (Mar 18, 2010)

Thanks, will have a read.

Have tweaked my diet to look like this macro/cals wise, will post up the actual foods this evening:

Protein/fats/carbs/cals/ratio

*No Carb (trace veg):*

*
*

*
200/115/54 - 1785 - 54/32/13*

*Low Carb*

*
(same trace carbs apply)*

*
*

*
222/131/167 - 2400 - 43/25/32*

*High Carb (same trace carbs apply)*

*
*

*
230/136/282 - 2900 - 35/21/44 *


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## Justin Cider (Jul 18, 2010)

BennyC said:


> Thanks, will have a read.
> 
> Have tweaked my diet to look like this macro/cals wise, will post up the actual foods this evening:
> 
> ...


Looking good.

From what I made of the post, I made a little "cheat sheet" to keep on my computer.

Here it is.

*CARB CYCLING*

*High carb 1.75g/lb bodyweight*

*
Low carb 0.75g - 1g/lb bodyweight*

*
No carb NONE apart from fibrous veg*

*
*

*
Protein always at 1.5g/lb bodyweight*

*
Fat  always at 40g-50g per day*

*Monday: > High carb > Quads & Calfs*

*Tuesday: > Low carb > Chest & Triceps*

*Wednesday: > No carb > Cardio*

*Thursday: > High carb > Back, Traps & Biceps*

*Friday: > Low carb > Hams & Delts*

*Saturday: > No carbs > Cardio*

*Sunday: > Low carb > Cardio*

*Carb Sources (PWO Only)*

*Dextrose*

*
Maltodextrin*

*
*

*
**Carb Sources (Staple)*

*
*

*
Oats*

*
Muesli*

*
Basmati Wholegrain Rice*

*
Wholemeal Pasta*

*
Sweet potatoes*

*
Yams*

*
Wholegrain breads*

*
New boiled potatoes*

*
*

*
(All fibrous veg, as used daily regardless of high, low or no carb structure)*

*Protein*

*Lean red cuts of meat*

*
Chicken breast, skinless & boneless*

*
Tuna (Drained from brine or olive oil)*

*
Eggs, wholes & whites*

*
Protein powders (Whey, blends, egg white)*

*
Lean pork*

*
Bacon back*

*
Low fat cottage cheese*

*
Quark*

*
Fish (also covered in fats)*

*
Turkey*

*Fats*

*
*

*
Fish oils*

*
Oily fish*

*
Flaxseeds (ground/milled)*

*
Flax oil*

*
3/6/9 oil*

*
Mixed nuts (Ideally lower sodium nuts)*

*
Mixed seeds*

*
Olives*

*
Olive oil*

*
Avocados*

*
Nut oils*

*
Seed oils*

*
(Naturally occurring animal & dairy fats in small quantities)*

*Fibrous veg to accompany meals*

*Spinach*

*
Onions*

*
Brocolli*

*
Celery*

*
Cabbage*

*
Sprouts*

*
Tomatoes*

*
Mushrooms*

*
Lettuce*

*
Cucumber*

*
Green beans*

*
Capsicum*


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## BennyC (Mar 18, 2010)

Cheers, I can trim a bit off in certain places if need be.

Think I'll struggle to get in 1.5g/lb for protein and stay within the calorie requirement. I've found I do well on 1g/lb but we're all different so will tweak as I go.

Will treat tonight as my high day (and last CBL style so it might get a bit filthy!) and go from there. I'll try sticking to 1 high day initially and see how I get on.

I presume the protocol when trying to add mass rather than cut fat would be to obviously ditch cardio but still cycle carbs but perhaps remove the no carb days and replace with low carb and maybe turn all workout days to high carb? so it's be low carb most days except for training which would be high.


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## Justin Cider (Jul 18, 2010)

BennyC said:


> Cheers, I can trim a bit off in certain places if need be.
> 
> Think I'll struggle to get in 1.5g/lb for protein and stay within the calorie requirement. I've found I do well on 1g/lb but we're all different so will tweak as I go.
> 
> ...


If you find it easier and gain well on 1g/lb bw, go for for that and adjust as necessary innit.

Could still do cardio, just gotta adjust macros to what you are doing, as need to be in excess to gain rather than defecit,


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## BennyC (Mar 18, 2010)

As it stands, could probably drop protein slightly and increase fats if necessary on no carb days.

Yellow lines represent an average of the options above.


































I've not accounted for things like ketchup/bbq sauce or any ready mix sauces that might be used.

On high days the extra will most likely be clean, probably just larger quantities of what's already there but dirty options occasionally.


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## Justin Cider (Jul 18, 2010)

BennyC said:


> As it stands, could probably drop protein slightly and increase fats if necessary on no carb days.
> 
> Yellow lines represent an average of the options above.
> 
> ...


As it looks, your eating a 1kg of meat at dinner!?


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

BennyC said:


> Hi,
> 
> I've ready through the sticky and actually have experience of carb cycling without realising it, I did so when I first used IF about 3 years ago. More recently I've tried CBL and CNS though with CNS seem to be hitting a plateau, that said I'm sure I could get more cardio in however my recovery on CNS is terrible and I don't think it's working particularly well. My fats could be slightly higher but the macro's are give or take where they should be.
> 
> ...


Not a million miles away from what I do except my high days are much higher. At least an extra 200g.

Sod powdered sugar in a shake. Enjoy the high days. Sweets, cake, wine, beer. It's all good. I've tried and tested it. With all the no carb and low cal days there is no way it can end up as fat.


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## BennyC (Mar 18, 2010)

Justin Cider said:


> As it looks, your eating a 1kg of meat at dinner!?





BennyC said:


> Yellow lines represent an average of the options above.


Nope, they're options that change/ are cycled daily, hence the yellow line representing average macro's 



simonthepieman said:


> Not a million miles away from what I do except my high days are much higher. At least an extra 200g.
> 
> Sod powdered sugar in a shake. Enjoy the high days. Sweets, cake, wine, beer. It's all good. I've tried and tested it. With all the no carb and low cal days there is no way it can end up as fat.


That's good news I can get a bit filthy on the high days. Home made banana cake with buttercream icing, custard & icecream hits the spot!


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

BennyC said:


> Nope, they're options that change/ are cycled daily, hence the yellow line representing average macro's
> 
> That's good news I can get a bit filthy on the high days. Home made banana cake with buttercream icing, custard & icecream hits the spot!


That sounds lush. Would go lovely with a nice coffee.


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