# Difficulties finding my correct macros!



## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

Hello, nice to meet you all and to become part of this forum!

I've been training for some years now but I've decided to retransform my body again and to move some levels up: gain a more muscle and get leaner.

I am 31 years old and 6 feet tall (183 cm) and weight 196.2 pounds (89 kg). I work as an architect (quite sedentary job) and I workout for 4-5 times. I've been doing that for the last 3 years and I am all natural. I´ve attached a pic of me taken today.

I've been in a bulking regime for almost one year, tracking my calories but never concerned with my weight, whenever I stopped seeing results I increased my calories bit by bit.

Few months ago I decided to track everything as much as I can and I did my meal chart, a weight chart, calculated my macros and my current macro split etc. So I decided to find my maintenance caloric intake: I weighted my self weekly to see when my weight stabilized and from that moment it took me 5 weeks as you can see in the weight chart I've attached.

With all this info I started to get confused:

According to my calculations I am eating 5628 Calories daily:

Prot: 384,85 grms - 27.35 % 
Carbs: 714,714 grms - 50.79 % 
Fat: 130,20 grms - 20.82 %

This is what I've been eating for several months from now. So from all this data 5628 calories is my maintenance.

What I don't understand is when I use any calorie calculator from the web to calculate my macros the results are way under 5628 Cals. I even see some guys on the web like Steve Cook and others and they eat less than I do and they are heavier than me (just to give an example). Is it normal for a 31 year old guy with 196.2 pounds eating 5628 Cals daily? For maintenance???

I also look at my macros split and it's not even near the recommended 40/40/20 and i also have doubts here:
- For example I weight 196.2 pounds that means that if I want to eat 2 grms of protein per body weight I should be eating 392,4 grms according to my weight. But If I want to level my actual 27,35% to 40 % my protein intake would overpass 2 grms per body weight. I this ok at all?

I feel lost and I see so many stuff on the web that I don't know what to follow or what to change. If there's any one with knowledge and experience (perhaps a forum moderator could help me or anyone that understands this better than I do)

Thanks in advance if someone can correct me and see what is going on. Thank you!

View attachment Weight.pdf


View attachment Meal Plan.pdf


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

When you bulk for a long time your body gradually adapts to the increased calories meaning you need to gradually keep increasing calories to keep gaining.

Looks like what you've been doing has been working just fine going by your picture.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Oh, and macro splits have never made sense to me. As you say protein requirements tend to scale with body weight so it makes sense to set this first and then split the remaining calories between carbs and fats, in a way that is largely down to personal preference.

You are natty or assisted? You're likely eating far more protein than you'd need natty, and quite likely even if you're assisted.


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

4Quarium said:


> I also look at my macros split and it's not even near the recommended 40/40/20 and i also have doubts here:


 40:40:20 is just bro science imo.

Can't see how at under 90kg you're packing away that many cals... you'd be fat as f**k after a month


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

In fact just had a gander at your meal plan...

Two mistakes jump out at me straight away. No way can 20g of nuts be 185 cals... it's impossible for any food to be that calorie dense... even pure fat..

Rice. you're using uncooked weight for the cals... but if you're eating 180g of uncooked rice 3 times a day then hats off to you fella lol

You also really packing away 6 slices of bread for breakfast?


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

Maintaining on 5k, at your weight and lbm, no way.

Cooked weight and dry weight make hell of a difference.

The rice is cooked weight that changes carbs intake a lot.

How can you have 20g of peanut butter, which contains more than 20g fat?

Scrap the calculator. Work out each food source individually, using macros from supermarket websites.


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## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> When you bulk for a long time your body gradually adapts to the increased calories meaning you need to gradually keep increasing calories to keep gaining.
> 
> Looks like what you've been doing has been working just fine going by your picture.


 Hey Ultrasonic! thx for your answer. Yes I have to increase my calories and will do it next week. just have to figure out what my current maintenance really is. Thx for your compliment, I've been very demotivated for the last 2 years and I want to get myself together again and I think that dedicated myself to this will help me!



Ultrasonic said:


> Oh, and macro splits have never made sense to me. As you say protein requirements tend to scale with body weight so it makes sense to set this first and then split the remaining calories between carbs and fats, in a way that is largely down to personal preference.
> 
> You are natty or assisted? You're likely eating far more protein than you'd need natty, and quite likely even if you're assisted.


 What do you mean by assisted? If I take steroids? No. I'm natural and plan to continue natural.



2004mark said:


> 40:40:20 is just bro science imo.
> 
> Can't see how at under 90kg you're packing away that many cals... you'd be fat as f**k after a month


 Hey 2004mark! You are right I am counting my cals incorrectly! Thx for clearing me out, I never thought about the caloric difference between cooked and uncooked food! So I now know that's a difference not just in rice but also in pasta and other stuff. Does meat and fish also suffer caloric difference when cooked? do you use any reliable food nutrient source on the web?

Yes I do take 6 slices. Do you think it is too much for breakfast? Any more tips so I can improve my diet?



Dark sim said:


> Maintaining on 5k, at your weight and lbm, no way.
> 
> Cooked weight and dry weight make hell of a difference.
> 
> ...


 Hey Dark thx for your answer. The caloric values to be considered must be from cooked rice, pasta, oats, chicken, fish, etc?

I'm starting to count my calories again because I was using the wrong caloric values and as soon as I get them I'll post them here. I will also start to check my body fat every month or so to have as more control as I can. My scale calculates bf%, I know it's not precise but I can have a reference value.

I will start to do 2 20min cardio session weekly. I haven't been doing cardio for more than one year and I miss it. Unfortunately my time is too short. I had a great aerobic condition but not anymore and I need to improve it, my breathing, my mind, my sleep, etc. How much do you guys sleep? I heard that ZMA helps sleeping. Is it true? If it is and ok to take it I'll might consider to take it because lots of times I can't get enough sleep. I wake up every day at 7:20 am and sometimes I go to bed at 11:00 pm and only fall a sleep after 02:00 am. I've been sleeping badly since my architecture degree and I am tryin' to correct this problem too!

I took this week to rest, and maybe the next one too because I am in vacation period and too tired . I have been following my meal plan but not eating my post-workout meal. Everything else I take it down.

I am thinking on buying a blender. I had one but I broke it one day. I used to do my own peanut butter there and it was really cool. Which ones are the most appropriate for bodybuilders? Like easy to clean and making shakes, etc?

Today is Saturday and it's my cheat meal day. Every Saturday I eat a pizza or stuff like that after working out. I didn't train this week at all but I think I'll go to burger king later.

I hope all you guys are ok and enjoying the weekend.

Peace and Love

4Quarium


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

4Quarium said:


> What do you mean by assisted? If I take steroids? No. I'm natural and plan to continue natural.


 Yes, that's what I meant  . In that case you're eating twice as much protein as is likely to be useful to you, and so at the very least you could save yourself a fair amount of money! If you dropped to 200g per day I'd wager you'd notice no difference whatsoever in terms of muscle gain. (In case you're interested, here's one fairly recent review of suggesting up to 1.6 g per kg bodyweight being useful:

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Stuart_Phillips/publication/232737390_Dietary_protein_requirements_and_adaptive_advantages_in_athletes/links/0912f50978f367bb82000000.pdf )



> Does meat and fish also suffer caloric difference when cooked? do you use any reliable food nutrient source on the web?


 Yes, the nutritional data for everything changes as it's cooked, due to either gaining water (e.g. rice) or losing water or fat (e.g. cooked meat). Just look on the labels for all the foods you buy for nutritional data. (For anything without a label I'd suggest this site: http://nutritiondata.self.com/ )



> I heard that ZMA helps sleeping. Is it true? If it is and ok to take it I'll might consider to take it because lots of times I can't get enough sleep. I wake up every day at 7:20 am and sometimes I go to bed at 11:00 pm and only fall a sleep after 02:00 am. I've been sleeping badly since my architecture degree and I am tryin' to correct this problem too!


 Caffeine is the most obvious thing to watch out for. Don't drink loads, and particularly don't drink it in the evenings. Watch out for pre-workouts containing caffeine if you train in the evenings too.

Yes, ZMA can help with sleep quality. It's the magnesium that helps, so another option is a magnesium supplement before bed, just not magnesium oxide as it's poorly absorbed.


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## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> Yes, that's what I meant  . In that case you're eating twice as much protein as is likely to be useful to you, and so at the very least you could save yourself a fair amount of money! If you dropped to 200g per day I'd wager you'd notice no difference whatsoever in terms of muscle gain. (In case you're interested, here's one fairly recent review of suggesting up to 1.6 g per kg bodyweight being useful:
> 
> https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Stuart_Phillips/publication/232737390_Dietary_protein_requirements_and_adaptive_advantages_in_athletes/links/0912f50978f367bb82000000.pdf )
> 
> ...


 Eheh no UltraSonic, like I said I'm natural. I read that Pdf as much as I could and I learned new stuff thanks! I counted my macros again and design a new meal chart so all you guys can see and give your opinions:

As I was taking in consideration calories os raw food, I changed all my approach in counting calories so I used the caloric info of cooked rice, grilled fish and meat etc and the results gave the following numbers as you can see in my current meal plan for my maintenance with cals and macros. Do you think I should continue to count calories from cooked or uncooked food? I have a friend saying that calories must be counted from raw food. What do you think it's best?

3976 cals with the this macro split: PROT 28.53% CARBS 51.41% FAT 20.04%

So I would like to continue bulking for one more year maybe and I decided to increase my cals for 10% (hope it is not too much) and I made a new chart for this desired intake as you can see bellow.

I didn't train last week at all and I feel good and fresh to start everything from now on, more motivated. After weighing myself this monday I was with 89.5 Kg and my bodyfat % is at 19.6%.

Sometimes I drink like 3-4 expressos throughout the day but my average is 3. 2 in the morning and 1 after lunch. But I am planning to buy a pre-workout. If it was you which one would you buy? Jack3d or No-xplode? I am also planing to buy those ZMA to improve my sleep.

By the way Ultrasonic, is that any chart with the optimal nutrient intake throughout the day? For ex. for breakfast eat 15% protein, 20% fat etc. because I'm not sure if I am eating the correct amount of nutrients in the correct meals. For instance after my workout I eat my shake, jam, rice cakes etc so would it be ideal to eat more carbs after that meal or is it enough to reestablish my muscles. I ask this because I have to eat one more meal before bed and it has 180 grams of rice and eating that amount of carbs before bed might not be good even in a bulking phase.

Thx for your feedback and hope you are ok.

Peace and Love 4Quarium

View attachment Current Meal Plan with Cals and Macros.pdf


View attachment Meal Plan for desired 4400 Kcals intake.pdf


View attachment Weight 22:08.pdf


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

There is no such thing as perfect macros per day, let alone per meal. Total calories is the most important thing to get right. Eat enough protein concentrate them split the remaining calories between carbs and fats. What this split is isn't critical and can vary day to day. I'd probably keep fat as at least 20% of total calories, but beyond that merriment do bit. Some find higher carbs help gym performance whilst others find carbs bloat them and so prefer a higher fat diet. It is calories that will determine weight/fat gain though.

The fat gain as the guide to adjust calories. If you're gaining more than a little fat you are eating too much.

For most foods it is easier and more accurate to use raw weights. The exception is foods that lose fat when they are cooked, like sausages for example.

I would advise you to save your money and not buy a pre workout. An espresso before training may help though. Just don't have caffeine in the evening.


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

I don't understand how people get in a tangle over this.

You should count the food as per the nutritional info you have. The most reliable will be the packet of the food... so if cooking meals from fresh this will generally be uncooked values. But if you buy some cooked salmon for instance then the macros on the packet will reflect the fact it's cooked. Simple.

Agree with @Ultrasonic about pre workout. If you don't use them then why start... can't miss something you've never had. I'd hate to feel like I need a pre workout to have a decent workout... so when you run out you'll have it in your head you're fighting an uphill battle. Music and looking at pretty ladies works fine for me.


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## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

Hello everyone!

It's been a while so it's about time to post an update!

I increased my cals 10% last weeks but i ma afraid it was too much. The weight increased a lil bit and I also had a minor shoulder injury last 2 weeks and that s**t happened while I was doing arm wrestling with my boss without warming up! That stopped my from working out for about a week.

Ok so lets go to business, here you have a pic of me taken yesterday. It was immediately after a small biceps, chest and forearms workout at home so I am pumped off course but I am sure I´ve put on some muscle. I've been doing a small rep range, from 6-2 reps per set so I can increase my strength and I notice some good results. Today I'll change to the normal range (12 reps, 1min rest) and within 4 weeks I'll start with drop sets.

Also have my weight chart and my fu**ing weight skyrocketed a bit 

Ok everyone, that's all for now jump in to the discussion and have your saying 

Peace and love

View attachment IMG_0418 2.JPG


View attachment weight.pdf


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## chasinggains (Sep 16, 2016)

I'd say 19% BF is a slightly high estimate based on the above photo?


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## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

chasinggains said:


> I'd say 19% BF is a slightly high estimate based on the above photo?


 Hey Chasinggains how are you?

I am sure that my body fat increased wether it is 19 % or not but do you think it is too high? I know it's not an accurate value but it's the value my scale shows!


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

4Quarium said:


> Hey Chasinggains how are you?
> 
> I am sure that my body fat increased wether it is 19 % or not but do you think it is too high? I know it's not an accurate value but it's the value my scale shows!


 Scales are hopeless at estimating body fat percentage, ignore any value it gives you. It's a totally irrelevant number anyway.


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## colarado red (Apr 10, 2014)

Totally agree with you on the scales more like bmi imo.


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## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> Scales are hopeless at estimating body fat percentage, ignore any value it gives you. It's a totally irrelevant number anyway.


 Hey Ultra  I know those values are just an estimate like I've said some post before.

A lil update now:

From all the setbacks I could have this one is really original: my gym was caught on fire and it was destroyed! There was a tire facility next to my gym and and a fire broke up there and destroyed and my gym was caught on this fire as you can see in the attachment. I am training at home with some dumbbells and a bar but I feel really sad and disappointed. My gym reopens only on the 1st of November and I have no clue of what to do by then.

I am also feeling a bit sad too because I feel I gained too much fat on the last weeks. I am start to considering to cut a bit in a near future but I am not surte yet.

Feeling sad, I wanted to do things better this time, doing the best I can with all the knowledge I have but things keep happening the same...

Peace and Love...

View attachment IMG_0428.PNG


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

It's only two weeks so that's hardly a major setback. I'd be tempted to give yourself two weeks off.


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## 4Quarium (Aug 15, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> It's only two weeks so that's hardly a major setback. I'd be tempted to give yourself two weeks off.


 I'll try to find some ways to workout because I haven't train properly since the beginning of the month due to my shoulder injury and if I take 2 more weeks off will be almost a month with proper training and I'm already feeling the fat coming in.

Do you have any tips so to adjust my diet so I can control my weight for the next 2 weeks?


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

4Quarium said:


> I'll try to find some ways to workout because I haven't train properly since the beginning of the month due to my shoulder injury and if I take 2 more weeks off will be almost a month with proper training and I'm already feeling the fat coming in.
> 
> Do you have any tips so to adjust my diet so I can control my weight for the next 2 weeks?


 Eat fewer calories.

People always seem to make this appear complicated but it really isn't. Eat more calories than your body uses and the excess is stored as body fat. Eat fewer calories than you uses and your body 'burns' body fat to make up the deficit, so you lose fat.

How much you need to reduce calories by depends on lots of factors, including how fast you were previously gaining weight, and how frequent and intense your workouts were.


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