# Water and Milk



## damagedgoods

Guys - I know the importance of fluids...

The question I have is: is it OK to drink Milk insted of water... I am drinking about 4lts of milk per day - some with Protein powder (5pints) the rest without... I nevwe feel thirsty - and I don't drink coffee or tea very often - but I may only have about 1pt of water per day.... is this OK.... if not how do you guys manage to drink so much - I seem to need to go to the batroom every 10mins!


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## Bengdogg

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## hackskii

Wow, that is too much milk.

The protein in milk, called casein, irritates many people's immune systems. This is the component of milk that stimulates mucus production. Casein is often associated with allergic conditions such as recurrent ear infections in early life, eczema, chronic bronchitis, asthma, and sinus conditions.

Most commercial milk also contains residues from drugs, hormones, and chemicals used to keep modern dairy cows producing abundantly.

I would drink more water. 64 oz a day is what is recommended. Better to split that up too. Not guzzle.

If you just cant do it then thin out the milk with water and then you will get your fill.

You probably dont eat much do you? I know my daughter drinks lots of milk and juice and she eats like a bird. She wont drink water unless she see's me do it. She is 4.


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## Bengdogg

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## hackskii

Well lets just look at this. 2% milk the numbers would look like this:

over 2100 total Calories

Fat= 750 calories

Carbs= 220

protein= 170

I would rather you get your numbers from more food and less milk.

2100 calories is the standard for a normal person.

I would cut that into about 1/4 of what you are drinking and add some good quality fruits, vegtables and proteins. You just might notice a diffrence.

I have heard of people losing weight on just a milk diet alone. Now these are people that want to lose weight. The only drawback is constipation.

Sorry, just my 2 cents worth.


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## damagedgoods

I Appreciate the feedback...

My diet is normally as follows:

6am - 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

9.00am - 4 whole eggs (free range - got my own chickens  ) 3 peices of white bread and 1 pt of milk

11.00am 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

1.00pm 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

3.00pm 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

4.30pm Gym (on training days) - 1ltr of water

6.00pm 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk (sometimes I use n-large2)

7.00pm Dinner, this is normally somthing like quiche, or chicken and mixed veg and 1pt of milk

8.00pm 1pt water or squash (lime or elderflower)

9.30pm 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk then bed

If I have to go into london for work (about twice a week) then it looks like this:

6am - 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

7.30am - 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

9am - chicken strips (from the station - Deli Chic)

@11.30am - metrex bar or similar

1pm - lunch - M&S chicken, maybe a salad or other takeaway food or go for a curry.

3-pm protein bar

6.30 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk

7.30 Dinner, quiche, or chicken, pizza or whatever and mixed veg and 1pt of milk

8.00pm 1pt water or squash (lime or elderflower)

9.30pm 3scoops of Reflex Instant whey in 1pt of milk then bed

also take sea kelp, Alfalfa and a multivit (sanatogen gold)

I find that my skin is normaly pretty good except if I am taking tren and EQ then my back looks like an asteroid.... I do find it hard to eat much... I can eat a big breakfast...

fortuneatly I don't seem to have any alergic reactions to it... I also find it helps keep my hearburn under control.... as I have a hiatus hernia (5cms) and suffer from very bad reflux...

this is the first time I've sat down and written what I normally eat... and i can see some problems... need much more veg in there....


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## Bengdogg

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## Bengdogg

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## DB

all those shakes are good man but you need more solids, fruit and veg aswell for your digestive system, its all well and good havin all that protein but only if your body can process it. but sayin that i bet you need all that milk to help mend all ur broken bones! check out the injuries thread for his accidents!


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## Bengdogg

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## hackskii

I counted somewhere over 600 grams of protein.

Not only is that expensive but that is the most food I have ever seen anyone eat. You must be well over 6' and like 300 lbs. How could a guy eat that much? You must spend hundreds a week on food.

They have seen really good results in protein cycling, this is where you up your protein for a period of time then back it down. If your uptake of protein is alot for a long period of time then your metabolism using enzymes breaks it down really fast. In essence you are a protein burning furnice. Sounds good but that part is not actually good. Protein cycling is good to do but you are on a cycle right now and would wait till after the cycle. I will look around for that article by Bill Phyllips. It is a good article.

Other than that I would drop some of that milk for solid nutrients (fresh fruts and vege's).


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## damagedgoods

Guys - thx again for the feedback....

That Bill philips article would be really good to see, I have seen his website and loads of ads but on the whole I am suspicious of this type of thing as it seems that people liek us are always being conned by either supplement co.s or people with the greatest training system ever - 'get 20" arms in 21 days' bull**** that you see everywhere, I am sure that there are honest peopel out there selling good ideas - but it is hard to see the wood for the trees - so hackskii any info u think is worthwhile plse let me know!

....

I agree 600+g of protein would be pretty difficult to sonsume..... when I say 3 scoops of powder I mena the standardscoops found in the reflex product not the jumbo ones like in N-large2...

I get through 5lbs every two weeks - and it works out at approx 30grams per serving (not including the milk) I'd say I get approx 370g per day from milk and protein powder.... which is a lot more than I thought!

I currently am 230-235Lbs and u may have guessed it am bulking at the moment...  My cycle ends this week - I have started to load up on creatine (first time I've done this) and then I will be doing ECA for 2 weeks followed by Clen for 2 weeks over 8 weeks in total as well as clomid and will be having a couple of shots of HCG to help kick my system back to life... then I think it will be time to start a new stack - it will be abombs, decca and a test... followed by some winny...

am pretty happy with the progress I have made and have hit all the targets I had set for myself this year... after not training for 8 years I got back into things pretty well, then got injured by the wife's horse..... and lost quite a bit of my gains... but since end of july have put on 45lbs and have put gone from 300- 500lbs on my squat... (I only wish I could say the same thing about my bench!).....


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## robdog

well said about all the tossers trying to con bodybuilders out of there cash


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## hackskii

I will look for it.

Creatine I would start after your cycle.

I would not do any eca's or clen yet. You will lose some water and some weight. I would still lift kindof heavy and let your body come back slow without diet for a month or 2.

I am not sure a couple of shots of HCG will help. there is alot of schools of thought on that one but here is my 2 cents worth.

Wait 3 weeks after your last shot or when ever the half life of the AAS you are taking. Take the HCG every day @ 500-1000 IU's At the 500 it will last you 20 days with the 1000 it will last you 10 days. It will go bad if you dont use it so you might as well use it all. At day 4 of the HCG I would either take nolvadex or clomid for 14-30 days.

Honistly, my post cycle I did clomid alone and the nuts were small for months. So I decided to do the HCG @ 1000 for 10 days and took the clomid day 4 of the HCG shot.

Now depending on the day, my nuts are either still skinny or really fat, like they are trying to do something. Sex drive is up and not moody and feel good. I am actually up at the gym.


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## robin_3_16

post training take 100ml of milk and dilute with 100ml water

u got a small amount of protein straigh into the bloodstream, do this 3 or 4 times in the 1st 3 hours after training

apparentl;y is is really good for you


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## winger

Hey damaged, did you balls get smaller on your cycle? If they didn't you dont need to take the hcg. Hackskii is correct, the timing on the pct is really important. It depends on if the gear you were taking is fast acting or slow acting, eg how long it stays in the body. What did you take and for how long?

500 pound squat? We should be asking you for help!


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## robdog

how common is ball shrinkage with gear use


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## winger

It depends, how much and how long. Hell I suppose even which type you take too. Hcg real light dose will keep them going while on the gear.

They atraphy because they are no longer needed. You are getting the tes from another source.


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## damagedgoods

I did find a bit of a size reduction... thne again I have been on a LONG cycle started on decca (600mg/pw) and test enath (750mg/pw).. then switched after 10 weeks to eq (600mg/pw)and tren (75mg EOD) for another 10... I stopped making gains after the switch so it is the last time I am going to try doing a long one.. for the most part I've had no sides.. I had none with the first part, but have had the worse acne in my life since changing the stack.... I now understand why I didn't get any benift from the second part...

thx for the comment on the squat... I'm over in the USA this week. and the hotel gym is the mutt's... far better than the gym back home... Did a leg workout this morning and they have an a great leg press machine, it is an angeled one and it uses normal plates, rather than it's own weight stack.. was pleased as I got easily up to 540Lbs (6*45 on each side) and was getting out 10 reps all the way down to my chest..... In the past I never really did much leg work and have only really done so over the past 6 months... it seems that they take all that I can throw at them... I wish I could say the same about my bench or deadlift....

Next cycle - in a few months time will be abombs (I think, haven't decided yet) first 5 weeks, Decca, Test Cyp or Sust, followed by winny for a total of 12 weeks..

I am going to trim up a bit over the next 8 weeks, am going to do some clen to help burn the fat and hlep keep my gains and will cycle this with ECA every two weeks....


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## winger

damagedgoods, you are a stud. Damn that is allot of gear. This is just my opinion, but I think more shorter cycles is better. Only because the post cycle recovery is not as bad. There is a guy at work that looks great. He does 8 weeks on 4 weeks off. Now I know that is extreme, but he sure does look good. I saw pictures of him when he was young and he was a little guy. I know there is a sweet spot and I am sure it depends on the gear, but I think it is 10 weeks. Dont quote me on that. There are so many veriables.


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## damagedgoods

Winger - u crack me up...

I think in future I will just do 12on 8 off... I'd like to know how the pros do year long cycles as I find that I always get best gains in the first 8-10 weeks and then stabilise, perhaps upping dosage a little after 8 weeks would work... then again I thought u could max out receptor sites... ?


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## winger

> Originally posted by damagedgoods
> 
> *Winger - u crack me up...*
> 
> *
> *


I think when they get a little stale they switch gears. I also heard that they do a cycle, then after the cycle they lower the dose and take in about 200 a week till there next cycle. So really, they never go off. Heck all that gear they probably dont get off eather


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## OnePack

> Originally posted by hackskii
> 
> *Wow, that is too much milk. *
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> The protein in milk, called casein, irritates many people's immune systems. This is the component of milk that stimulates mucus production. Casein is often associated with allergic conditions such as recurrent ear infections in early life, eczema, chronic bronchitis, asthma, and sinus conditions. *
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> Most commercial milk also contains residues from drugs, hormones, and chemicals used to keep modern dairy cows producing abundantly. *
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> I would drink more water. 64 oz a day is what is recommended. Better to split that up too. Not guzzle.*
> 
> *
> If you just cant do it then thin out the milk with water and then you will get your fill. *
> 
> *
> You probably dont eat much do you? I know my daughter drinks lots of milk and juice and she eats like a bird. She wont drink water unless she see's me do it. She is 4. *


You can get "filtered" milk (which is branded Cravendale in the uk) which they claim to filter out the bacteria to make it taste better..in filtering it may also filter out the chemicals, residues from drugs, etc which you mention. But as for the casein in milk, you say early life" so does that mean unless we're still kids it won't affect us in terms of those conditions u mention?


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## robdog

i like cravendale. at first i thought it would be a con but it tastes more creamy and more flanorsome. i think you can keep it fpr longer to which makes up for the slight increase in price


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## robin_3_16

be careful though, those cows want it back!


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## damagedgoods

I like cravendale - but keeping it longer is never a problem in my house


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## hackskii

We (humans) are the only speces that drink milk after growing up. I think many people have problems with milk and I think this is for a reason. Kindof tells me that it might not be the best food for the diet in adults. My daughter 4 gets cronic ear infections and I totally suspect this can come from over consumption of milk. We stop producing the enzyme that breaks down the carbohydrate lactose. Children that breast feed have more robust immune systems than children raised on cows, goats milk. I think that if you have a problem breaking down the lactose than milk might not be for you. Is it a good source of calcium? Absolutly! Does it give me gas that people want to kill me? Absolutly! I can say that milk is not for me.

I think we are a lazy society (not calling anyone lazy here) and if it can come in a can or bottle or drive through then it has a market. I love to cook and I love to eat. I am the laziest cook and can cook a gang of food and this is prefered to the latter.

Fruits and vegetables should never be excluded from the diet and picking up a bag of chips is not considered a vegetable (potato).

Hydrogenated oils are another topic altogether and I wanted to stay on topic.

If my daughter (4 yrs.) drinks milk during her dinner she wont eat. The whole idea of eating is not just taste, it is sustainment. Ballanced diets yeild better gains in the gym and quality of life.

If you have to drink milk than I would say moderation is key.

Sorry for rambeling on.


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## winger

Not to contridict what hackskii just said because it would be false, but there is a milk diet that does work rather well. You can drink as much as you want and loose weight. It is rather complete. It does work for the calves. Not the the ones connected to the feet.  Lactose sugar is hard to digest. But I think it is hard to digest only because we cut way back as adults. I think if you drank milk as a kid with no problems and kept up with the milk intake it wouldn't be as bad. Dont get me wrong, if I am late on a meal I will drink some milk to get the intake going. I also add milk to my protein to get the whey and milk protein going. It is the cheap mans protein stack. But that is a different Opera!


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## damagedgoods

I've started trying to balance things out a big - I'm trying to drink more fruit juice now and am also adding fresh fruit to the whey shakes I have... I've always been keen on drinking milk and have done so since a kid - and strangly I find I get cravings for it!

off the subject a bit when I was in the USA last week the gym I was going to out there served Myoplex low carb - and I have to say it is a good tasting MRP... Living in the US is good if u r a bodybuilder with regard to food... it is very good value and I've never seen bigger portions, not used to seeing 12oz steaks as 'small'... I've never eaten so much steak in my life...


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## winger

Big portiions are correct. Did you notice how many overweight people there are?


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## damagedgoods

I know - I was sort of expecting it though - but not to that extent... the thing is I can see the brits going the same way....


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## winger

Even the young girls these days are wearing the short shirts with a tummy. That should never be. Heavy youth is just wrong. I think it is because there is so many foods that are quick and easy. Just open a bag and eat. All carbs. It's not like you are chewing some steak. The steak takes work to eat. It also dosn't spike insulin like the quick easy stuff.

Where did you stay? If any of you guys decide to go to Disneyland in California just let me no. I live 5 minutes from there.


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## damagedgoods

I was staying in a place called the House of Blues in Downtown Chicago - the gym there is part of a chian called "crunch".... I have to say that I was very impressed by the Gym, and from what I hear most of the gyms in the USA... it is a pity that it is taking so long to happen over here...

I know that you only need a few things to grow - (heay weights!) but having stuff like nice Leg Press machines where you can load on all the weight u want is sooo nice....

The Gym I use over here is just upgrading all the machines from old Cybex kit to new Technogym... Don't know what it is like but hope that the legpress is better then the one there at the mo...


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## winger

When I get my Protein Factory shirt I think I will take a picture of me wearing the shirt at my gym. http://lafitness.com/app/club/club?clubId=29&flow=0

Here is a crappy picture of my gym.


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## BSF James

Here's a pic of the free weights section of my gym - http://www.bodyshapers-fitness-centre.coms.ph/Assets/FreeWeights.jpg

Best gym I ever trained at (besides my own of course  ) was a gym on pismo beach in california right next to the kon tiki inn where I was staying.


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## robdog

both look good lads im jealous


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## winger

Damn, Silentbob I want my own gym also. Oh well a little bit to late now. At my gym they only showed the machines, probably because that is what draws the people. They dont want the serious sweaty body builders that wear tank tops to workout in. But they have allot of free weights and the bumbells go up to 125, maybe higher but I remember seeing the 125's. They have 3 benchs 2 incline, 1 decline, 2 squat racks. 2 smith machines, 2 leg press, 1 hack machine, and 4 dumbells of every weight up to 100. After that it is just a pair of db's.


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## BSF James

damaged goods

- just looked back to p1 and saw your diet - crikey that's a lot of instant whey. I hate the stuff. Thats one reflex product that makes me want to vomit. It may just be the choc flavour but I havent been brave enough to try a different one. I've had the same tub on my counter here for months - I keep trying to palm it off on the cutomers! Strange because I like instant mass.

winger

- its never too late! This gym was originally set up by two guys who were retiring and didn't want to stop working when they left their regular jobs. They were late 50s when they started it and in their 70s when they finally sold it to us.

My gym has 2 flat benches, 1 decline, 1 incline, 5 olympic bars, 1 power rack/squat rack, 1 smith machine, dumbbells up to 50kg (110lbs), 1000kg of oylmpic plates and loads of resistance machines. Our cardio section has two bikes, 1 treadmill, 1 rower and 1 stepper. We dont like cardio here! Its a fairly small gym but has everything you could reasonably want (besides dbells over 110lbs).


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## robin_3_16

if u don't mind me asking how much u selling your gym for?

you don't have to answer, i would just love to own one one day possibly! and purely wondered


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## winger

> Originally posted by silentbob
> 
> * We dont like cardio here! *


Silentbob that is funny, spoken like a true bodybuilder. Weight training is one of the best fat burners out there. Silentbob you are the man.


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## damagedgoods

Silentbob - your gym is very much like the one I used to work in - all you needed for building size and strength.,.. like it. BTW what powder do you use - I'm not a big fan of the reflex stuff - I have to add a spoon of nesquick or soem camp coffee to it to prevent me from throwing it back up... think I may switch to EAS simply whey as it tastes a bit better - a bit too sweet IMHO... I'd like to hear anyone esle's thought on this.....

BTW - Lorian if you are around, I ordered some stuff from you a while back and u kindly added the designer whey bars along with it... thx for that - the chocolate ones I find I can just about swallow - takes about 30mins.. but that Peaches and Lean - wow - how anyone can swallow that is beyond me... I needed a chisle to clean my teeth! and the taste  .... I don;t know i may of you eat may supplement bars but so far the best ones I've tried are the metrex ones, I've got a box of U-Turn and they are pretty good as well..


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## BSF James

> Originally posted by robin_3_16
> 
> *if u don't mind me asking how much u selling your gym for?*
> 
> *
> you don't have to answer, i would just love to own one one day possibly! and purely wondered *


The final price hasn't been set yet - there's a bit of haggling going on plus I dont know if the buyer would want it public knowledge how much he's paying. Our original asking price was £52k. I dont like to say too much because I dont want to jinx it - sales often fall through at a late stage with this kind of thing! The next few weeks are going to be a bit nerve wracking for the silent bob family!


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## BSF James

> Originally posted by damagedgoods
> 
> *Silentbob - your gym is very much like the one I used to work in - all you needed for building size and strength.,.. like it. BTW what powder do you use - I'm not a big fan of the reflex stuff - I have to add a spoon of nesquick or soem camp coffee to it to prevent me from throwing it back up... think I may switch to EAS simply whey as it tastes a bit better - a bit too sweet IMHO... I'd like to hear anyone esle's thought on this..... *


Yeah, the reflex is bad - I cant describe it adequately but it just tastes so 'malty' and powdery. I dont like eas simply whey either though. I had the vanilla and it was really bland. Strawberry and vanilla pure whey by prolab are just about my favourites at the moment -fantastic. If I was paying for my supplements though (rather than eating into my own profit!) I would probably use dymatize for the better value (bigger tub, £4 less- plus still tastes nice - bargain!).


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## hackskii

I use the eas advantage bars. But they are based on the 40-30-30 rule so they are 25 grams of protein and 220 caloiries. In a quick fix they satisfy for about 2 hrs then after that I am actually more hungry.


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## winger

I bought 6 lbs of 100% whey protein for $20.00. That is 91 servings for 20 dollars. This stuff tastes so good. It mixes well too. Here are the stats.

22 grams of protein

4 grams of carbs

I went and bought another one. I am not one of those protein shake guys, but in a pinch I can be.


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## robdog

thats a realy good price mate


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## BSF James

> Originally posted by winger
> 
> *I bought 6 lbs of 100% whey protein for $20.00. That is 91 servings for 20 dollars. This stuff tastes so good. It mixes well too. Here are the stats. *
> 
> *
> 22 grams of protein*
> 
> *
> 4 grams of carbs*
> 
> *
> I went and bought another one. I am not one of those protein shake guys, but in a pinch I can be. *


Is that the optimum nutrition one? I'm looking at stocking their stuff soon. They aren't anywhere near as cheap over here - even at trade price. Trade price for 100% whey is more than that price in pounds! Retail price is £40 (about $55), although we'd sell it for around £30 ($45). Supps are much cheaper in the states, both for retail customers and trade/distributors like myself.


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## winger

No it is the Pro-Rated. If you look it up on the web I only see the 5 pound containers. Mine is the 6 pound container. I bought it from Costco. Its one of those membership clubs. They sell everything from food to appliances. The bevarian chocolate is the best tasting stuff. Oh yea the sweetened with splenda. I only use splenda. I have a buddy that works at Costco and when they put the protein on the shelf they missed marked it and it was going for $13.00 for 6 pounds. Needless to say he bought allot.


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## BSF James

Costco is great! I used to go to one in California whilst my folks lived over there. They have them in England now. They aren't as good over here but still fairly cheap.


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## winger

Great prices. I have taken electrical stuff back 2 years later and they credited me. I keep all receipts.


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## damagedgoods

Guys - Found this article - thought it might be of interested on the subject of milk:

-------------------------

Milk And Bodybuilding - Do They Mix?

This article is very dear to me. I've taken it upon myself to reinstate Milk as the greatest supplement ever. Lately milk often gets a bad wrap among bodybuilders for several reasons... none of which I fully understand. Some claim they get fat, others claim it is too expensive (???) and still others complain of gastro-intestinal disorders. But in my eyes anyone who is not lactose intolerant is selling his gains short if he is not supplementing with milk and a lot of it. I always drank milk, I like it, but I never fully realized its potential as a supplement until I started using it as the cornerstone of my diet and started growing beyond measure. I made the greatest gains of my life on milk, an unrivaled 35 pounds in ten months. If you were to ask me now what I thought was the supplement that gives you the best value for money, I'd say milk. Going back to the 1940's, you'll find that our heroes of yore such as Clancy Ross and John Grimek accredited much of their gains to milk. Clancy Ross even went as far as saying it was the best thing ever to get big. Many of us long for a return to healthy, natural bodybuilding, so why not start by consuming the same things they did?

You can get it at any store, it's reasonably cheap to use because it's 90 percent water, it easily replaces all the fattening cokes and sprites you gulp down, or the flat tasteless water you drink to try and meet you hydration demand. You can drink it in the morning, use it in your cereal, use it to water down your soup, but just as easily at night because it isn't heavy on the stomach and has a beneficial effect on your sleeping pattern.

Drinking anywhere from 1 to 2 gallons a day, depending on how much working out I have to do and taking my protein cycle into account, I use milk mainly for the protein content. A liter of milk (just under 1/3 of a gallon) contains 32 grams of protein coming from two main sources: casein and whey. These are without a doubt the two best proteins available, and in combination with egg protein, supply a complete amino acid spectrum. I don't have to sell bodybuilders on the benefits of whey I suppose. It's the most bio-available protein in the world. It's fast acting and supplies the aminos of the greatest importance to bodybuilders in large amounts. Casein on the other hand is a slower acting protein that contains other essential aminos that provide the base of your body's Amino Acid Pool. By having a mix of the two, the casein influences the whey to act slower and so doing stay active in the body longer and increasing the possibility of absorbing more of it. And because of the aminos present in casein, there is more of a chance that the whey will be stored in muscle-tissue.

If you calculate that 20 percent of milk protein is whey, then drinking 2 gallons supplies me with 30 grams of whey, which is how much most companies recommend you use post-workout. Now most bodybuilders get more protein from different sources, including powders, but getting in an extra serving free seems like a good deal. The total protein in 2 gallons is enough to cover the need of protein of any bodybuilder under 210 pounds. I like to be on the safe side and consume at least 30 to 50 percent more, but still, I couldn't go that high without milk.

Ask any nutrition expert, the best diet for bulking up is 50 percent carbs, 35 percent protein and 15 percent fats. Match that up with the content of semi-skimmed milk and you'll find that milk is the perfect nutrition. It could be the cheapest MRP there is. Per liter you get 440 calories, just below what most MRP's supply, giving you 48 grams of carbs, 32 grams of protein and 15 percent fats. Need more proof? What are most kids raised on in the early years of their life? Milk. You start out at a meager 8 pounds, and soon you grow out to a healthy toddler. If only you could keep growing like that, huh? Then why turn your back on the thing that did it? Cow's milk you say? Have you seen the size of the bovine stock? Those things are huge. Cows aren't entirely unlike bodybuilders, they used to be an example of health and then they started using steroids to get bigger. For a growing athlete, taking in as many calories as possible is essential, but you have to watch what you eat to. My milk intake supplies 1300 to 2600 calories a day, from one of the cleanest and purest sources left in a world of pre-packaging, diseases and genetically engineered food. That's anywhere from 60 to 90 percent of my calorie intake depending on the phase I'm in.

Calcium

What are the three most important minerals to a an athlete? Iron, Zinc and you guessed it, Calcium. That's the point of a sports nutritionist. Ask the body and it will say calcium, calcium and calcium. This is clear from the amount of calcium we need as opposed to other minerals and the priority it gets within our systems. If you ingest Calcium and Zinc and Iron (and I've seen one company dumb enough to combine them in one pill), the body will prioritize the calcium over the other two. Which is why sports nutritionists and most smart supplement companies advise athletes to take Iron and Zinc at a time when there is little or no calcium in the stomach. This goes for the Zinc containing supplement ZMA as well.

Calcium is known best of all as a promoter of healthy and strong bones. But it plays a critical role in performance as well. Too little calcium and you can't relax your muscles. Bad relaxation, makes for less potential energy and so on and ultimately for less than satisfactory contraction. Bad contraction equals bad workouts and no growth. Get the picture? By improving relaxation you avoid cramping, injury and twitching. Calcium is also very important in fat metabolization, so no cigar for the people who claim milk is fattening. It makes for less fat storage and better use of present macronutrients in the blood. Using the recommended FDA dosage has shown to decrease body-fat significantly in obese people. It's no secret that the RDV (recommended daily values) were established back in the 60's and 70's for a 2000 calorie diet. I don't know many bodybuilders that grow on a 2000 calorie diet. As a matter of fact I know very few who go below that when dieting. Also the amounts are outdated, so instead of the recommended 1000 mg you should be closer to 2000-2500 grams of calcium daily. Milk can help you get a large part of that. And it's safe to use on a diet too, because of the high calcium content and the not so fattening simple sugar lactose that makes up the carbohydrate portion of milk. And last but not least calcium lowers the blood pressure, may reduce stress and definitely improves the quality of sleep. If that doesn't sell you on milk, I don't know what will. But there is more...

Lactoferrin

It's a small peptide present in milk protein that is very expensive to filtrate and incredibly expensive if you plan to take in a certain amount of it. It's not at all a prominent part of milk, but as I'm fond of saying: every little bit helps. Its importance in immunity is clear, as it is highly present in mother's milk. I'm not going to expand too much on this subject as there are plenty of studies available on lactoferrin, and it's definitely not the most important fraction of milk, but I will say that it plays a key role in digestive functioning, immunity and in reducing cancer-risk. It's also disinfecting within the body and known as one of the greatest anti-oxidants since MSM.

Vitamin D

There is milk available with Vitamin D. Not many people know the relevance of Vitamin D and even less people supplement it, but Vitamin D is a classified steroid-hormone. The most versatile except for cholesterol. Vitamin D is mainly derived from radiation, such as sunlight. So if you are a beach bum chances are you don't need extra, but if you live in an area that gets pretty heavy winters, getting a little extra in this period may be wise. Nowadays the FDA recommends milk be enriched with Vitamin D to prevent bone diseases, but it's a highly anabolic hormone that may be of greater benefit than you think. The basic recommendation is 400 International Units, but as with Vitamin E, getting 800 or so makes more sense.

Well I don't think I need to say anymore do I? Trying to get as much milk as possible is good. Liquid protein if you will that allows you to sip in a few grams at any time during the day. For those of you who can bear it, drink it at room temperature, it's an excellent way of enabling yourself to chug down more of it easier. It doesn't keep as long, but even then it'll keep for three days after being opened and by then you should have chugged down three to six times that. If you are not fond of drinking milk but want part of the benefits, I think taking in a glass or three before bed will go a long way. If you want to be economic about your nutrition, milk should be your first priority. It will save a few bucks that could be used on other supplements or a weekend trip with your wife or girlfriend if you find they suffer under your hectic training regimen.

How to take in more milk:

1. Drink it whenever you feel like it

2. Take it with your cereal

3. Mix all your protein, MRP's or weight gainers in milk

4. If you water down soup use milk

5. Cookies and chocolate increase desire for milk

Which milk to use?

Well, semi-skimmed or 2 percent is ideal in most circumstances, because it's practically a meal. It's ideal to be used with meals or shakes, or as a meal by itself. If you are severely underweight take full fat milk. At more than 30 grams of fat per liter it supplies 600 or more calories, as a weight gainer it's definitely the way to go. And naturally if you are on a diet, take in skimmed milk.

One warning though, avoid UHT milk. The high temperature it undergoes destroys much of the nutrients and makes what remains less than bio available. Euperised milk is best. This process can be likened to cold-processing in supplements. A process used to guarantee the best quality with the highest amount of nutrients in supplements. Others are good too, but I estimate you need twice the amount of UHT as you would from other sorts.

I really hope if one of my articles enlightens you, it is this one. You won't believe the anabolic properties of plain milk until you try it. Let's face it, if you have to spend your money on things to improve your bad nutritional habits that leaves little else for products that could really help you grow. A good diet for growing should have milk, eggs, bread, spaghetti and if at all possible red meat. These are the basics, and except for the meat, economically responsible.

So listen to mama and drink your milk, and soon you'll be a really big boy

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## OnePack

good post!


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## Guest

Good post indeed, what did you say?


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## OnePack

what if u can't afford to have a drink? anyone tried drinking body fluids?


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## robin_3_16

u mean like **** and sweat, ur on ur own there


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## damagedgoods

now that sounds nasty.......


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## OnePack

what if u were on a desert or somewhere like that..and there were no shops arounds and u had ran out of water..


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## OnePack

well, could always try that evapouration thing where u gather moisture in a cup placed in a dug hole with a piece of plastic film or something over the hole.


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## harry-turner2

hi im 19.2 and i dont eat that much,you should have your shakes with water you are having to much fat bro you shoiuld start your day with say 4 weetbix 2 turkey breasts then have shake then solid meal then shake then solid meal then shake then solid meal then shake ,i have 8 meals aday i train 4 days aweek a bar for a meal is not good you need more bro ,hope this helps, keep training or go home.


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## robin_3_16

ur 19.2 what cuz?

could you post ur regular diet, i don't eat a great amount but when i do it only seems to go one place, my belly, and make that expand, even if i eat the right stuff, god damnit

some of these fellas are big


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## damagedgoods

Robin don't worry u will get your weigth up soon enough f u keep going the way u r.

I'd like to break the 18st barrier this year.....


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## robdog

youll do it robin


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## ellisrimmer

damagedgoods said:


> Guys - I know the importance of fluids...
> 
> The question I have is: is it OK to drink Milk insted of water... I am drinking about 4lts of milk per day - some with Protein powder (5pints) the rest without... I nevwe feel thirsty - and I don't drink coffee or tea very often - but I may only have about 1pt of water per day.... is this OK.... if not how do you guys manage to drink so much - I seem to need to go to the batroom every 10mins!


I guess it depends on your macros


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## Ultrasonic

Is there a competition for bumping the oldest thread you can find at the moment???


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## malalvma

11 yrs later...


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## lewdylewd

Sorry not read the whole thread this night have been dealt with but aswell as everything thats already been said about that diet your carbs are basically lactose (alot of it), white bread, and pastry.

Drop some of the milk for a proper meal meat and rice or something if this gets boring you like curry make a curry sauce full of veg, tomatoes etc ready made ones are likely to be full of sugar salt etc.

Swap the white bread for anything that isn't white bread.

Quiche might look like it has decent macros with all those eggs but have an omelette and swap the soggy pastry for a better carb or veg or whatever you like. Ive been eating roasted veg with everything lately.


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## Ultrasonic

> Sorry not read the whole thread this night have been dealt with but aswell as everything thats already been said about that diet your carbs are basically lactose (alot of it), white bread, and pastry.
> 
> Drop some of the milk for a proper meal meat and rice or something if this gets boring you like curry make a curry sauce full of veg, tomatoes etc ready made ones are likely to be full of sugar salt etc.
> 
> Swap the white bread for anything that isn't white bread.
> 
> Quiche might look like it has decent macros with all those eggs but have an omelette and swap the soggy pastry for a better carb or veg or whatever you like. Ive been eating roasted veg with everything lately.


Good of you to try and help, but check the date of the OP  .


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## lewdylewd

Ultrasonic said:


> Good of you to try and help, but check the date of the OP  .


Lol WTF this thread get dug up for?


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## Jordan08

Would be nostalgic for old members.lol


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