# Do compounds really increase test?



## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

This came up in another thread but it has left me puzzled.

I have heard said a few times that compound lifts increase testosterone. Do they really and is it by a significant enough amout to be worth discussing?


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## Conscript (Sep 5, 2010)

Well there is a documentary called "the science of steroids" by natgeo, the scientists were saying that when you work out your natural test levels deplete to that of a castrated man and cortisol levels soar (a catabolic steroid) which is why a natty can only be so big and so ripped, but obliviously test levels will raise back to a normal or a slightly elevated levels, but not much to write home about...


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## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

i sometimes get a boner on squats day. honestly.

dont know if its relevant or not tho


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## Fullsquat (Apr 16, 2011)

Big heavy lifts increase natural GH production somewhat yes.

So I should expect they will help slightly with test levels too.


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

Cheers G.

eew squat boner...

Were did you hear about the gh boost fullsquat?


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## bayman (Feb 27, 2010)

Even if they do, extra endogenous test is likely to make sod all difference. You'd just have extra aromatisation to compensate.


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## Andrewgenic (Jul 5, 2010)

a.notherguy said:


> i sometimes get a boner on squats day. honestly.
> 
> dont know if its relevant or not tho


This happened to me last friday, made squats uncomfortable tbh. Does get in the way of your focus when your training and you just cannot get filth out of your mind!


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## paul81 (Jun 3, 2010)

a.notherguy said:


> i sometimes get a boner on squats day. honestly.
> 
> dont know if its relevant or not tho


i lol'd and felt sorry for your spotter, that awkward moment you turn around to him after a set......

'yeah baby, that felt good'

'yeah, i can tell :/ '


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## Fullsquat (Apr 16, 2011)

Jalapa said:


> Were did you hear about the gh boost fullsquat?


Read about it numerous times mate. It'll only be minimal but every little helps.

In the case of test baymans right though, it won't make any difference imo


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## Fullsquat (Apr 16, 2011)

paul81 said:


> i lol'd and felt sorry for your spotter, that awkward moment you turn around to him after a set......
> 
> 'yeah baby, that felt good'
> 
> 'yeah, i can tell :/ '


I disagree, I'd be happy if I were his spotter. Somwhere to hang my top while I squatted


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

SO from now on can we say that compounds increasing test is a load of balls?


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## Fullsquat (Apr 16, 2011)

Jalapa said:


> SO from now on can we say that compounds increasing test is a load of balls?


I've never even heard that said.

But like I've said I've heard numerous times that big heavy lifts release no natural GH. Which is a good thing at any amount


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

Yea Im going to need facts on that one fullsquat. Not that Im doubting you read it I just need evidence because I'm inclined to think that the increase in GH is also balls unless someone can produce a research paper.


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## the_almighty (Oct 10, 2009)

Big compound lifts cause the most muscle trauma and in turn the body releases GH to repair the muscles and that is what they mean when GH is released from compounds


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

Thanks almighty. But Im a grumpy old cynic. No offense but until your name is Dr the_almight I want citations. Until then the only thing my body is going to release after squats is wind.


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## PumpingIron (Feb 7, 2011)

Not sure if it's just me, but i'm 20 and started doing some heavy squats ( for me ) over a couple of months and i've grew about an inch in height. Maybe it's just my age, but it seemed quite dramatic.


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## Fatstuff (Mar 2, 2010)

lol, as long as u dont get a boner while spotting someon on the bench- being teabagged by someone with an erection cant be fun


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## Fullsquat (Apr 16, 2011)

fatmanstan! said:


> lol, as long as u dont get a boner while spotting someon on the bench- being teabagged by someone with an erection cant be fun


Some guys on here would love that!


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Jalapa said:


> Yea Im going to need facts on that one fullsquat. Not that Im doubting you read it I just need evidence because I'm inclined to think that the increase in GH is also balls unless someone can produce a research paper.


Are you refering to vascular occlusion excersise? this was shown in one study to increase plasma GH levels by 290 times above resting levels, however there have been studies done using high intensity excersise and no increase in GH plasma levels was observed with or without vascular occlusion.


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

Thanks for bringing this back on course mars. You got a link to that study? Sorry to keep demanding links to studies papers etc, but I just think it would be useful to nut this one out wth some evidence.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

Here's one of the links.

http://jap.physiology.org/content/88/1/61.short


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

Top! Thanks Mars. I'll give that a read now.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

There is still debate on weather strength training increases testosterone levels, some studies say yes (Marin et al) but levels return to normal baseline within 10-20mins and some studies that say there is no increase (Wheeler et al) so basically the jury is out.

I will try and find these but it may take some time.


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## Fullsquat (Apr 16, 2011)

Interesting debate, but whether it does or not will make no difference really will it? If it does it does if it doesn't it doesn't.

Always good to know the facts but in this case I don't think it'll make a difference to how we train.


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## cwoody123 (Feb 13, 2007)

I doubt their is any release of LH to be honest. certinaly heard the GH hormone theory though.

You have to remeber it is Albumin and SHBG which regulate testosterone's free form activity. so for instance even say it did raise your test levels by a couple of nmol the body's negative feed back system will just make more of these hormones to compensate for any extra test which means Serum Test will be higher but free Test will remain normal.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

There's not much difference between compound and isolation exercises in hormonal response, although the more muscle you work over a session the greater the hormonal response normally is.

Something that influences the HGH and cortisol response to a workout more than the exercise selection is training volume and intensity - in quite a few studies both those hormones are shown to be significantly higher after using a higher number of sets, or after doing forced reps after normal failure. Training closer to the point of failure shows greater increases HGH and cortisol, but doesn't appear to affect test significantly.


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## Andrew Jacks (Sep 29, 2010)

Jalapa said:


> This came up in another thread but it has left me puzzled.
> 
> I have heard said a few times that compound lifts increase testosterone. Do they really and is it by a significant enough amout to be worth discussing?


There is some science which shows shorter rest periods between sets increases serum test than pushing heavier weights, you want to check out a study by Kraemer but the differences is very minimal

Two groups were studied, one undertaking hypertrophy workout made of sets of 10 RM with a minute of rest between each sets. The other one was a strength training consisting of multiple sets of 5 RM with 3 minutes between each sets. Both group shown noteworthy increase in serum testosterone, the earlier showing a slightly higher increase.


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## 9inchesofheaven (Apr 8, 2011)

According to Research observed by Yarnell (2009: 25), "there are certain compound exercises that [...] increase testosterone and/or growth hormone more than other, less challenging movements. The squat is one such exercise."

Yarnell (2009: 25) goes on to say that, "Heavy lifts (75 to 80 per cent of one rep max) produces the greatest increase in testosterone levels."

*The Secrets of Age Defying Strength: And How to Obtain It.

Of course, you probably want primary sources, which I understand.


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## Jake_2792 (May 3, 2011)

Tribulus?


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## Jalapa (Mar 18, 2010)

Jake, i see you live in the north east so I will forgive you for saying that.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

The transient hormonal reponse to exercise is slightly misleading as something to actively seek I think - the elevations in test, GH and cortisol that come from training (and some exercises and styles of training more than others) are basically serving the purpose of limting catabolism and providing energy (by releasing fatty acids etc) to the muscle and vital organs up to the point that the body is fed - as soon as you take your PWO feed the surge in amino acids and energy causes levels of these hormones to drop, and this is actually when the balance of protein synthesis turns positive.

In other words, all that a higher hormonal response to big compound exercise means really is that those exercises are taxing enough to stimulate an immediate need for nutrients. The purpose of those elevated hormones at this point is merely to protect the body until this feed happens, and is very different to raised levels of those hormones that are long lasting and not transient.


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## kernowgee (Jan 30, 2011)

Jake_2792 said:


> Tribulus?


DAA and ZMA have it licked, better still lay off the porn and give the little chap a rest


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## BigAaronAlves (Mar 2, 2011)

a.notherguy said:


> i sometimes get a boner on squats day. honestly.
> 
> dont know if its relevant or not tho


My dick shrivels up bro, all the blood goes to my quadriceps. What you doing in the gym? ****ing!!!!!! LOL


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## Meanmuscle (Jun 29, 2011)

Anyone tried Tribulus?


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## MMAallday (Oct 17, 2011)

Is there anyone whos tried Tribulus as lots say its not worth the bother but i need that extra kick!


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## Driven Sports (Jul 15, 2011)

Mars said:


> There is still debate on weather strength training increases testosterone levels, some studies say yes (Marin et al) but levels return to normal baseline within 10-20mins and some studies that say there is no increase (Wheeler et al) so basically the jury is out.
> 
> I will try and find these but it may take some time.


The testosterone response seems to be more significant when the participants used in the study are untrained. When you use experienced resistance-trained athletes the effect is essentially not there (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18832756).

Some of this is discussed in these articles:

Part one: http://www.getds.com/20110509228/Blog/the-steroid-machinery-of-muscles-part-one

Part two: http://www.getds.com/20110510229/Blog/the-steroid-machinery-of-muscles-part-two


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## Driven Sports (Jul 15, 2011)

hardgaining said:


> Is there anyone whos tried Tribulus as lots say its not worth the bother but i need that extra kick!


It may give your libido a kick, but tribulus fails to show any consistent effect on actual testosterone levels in humans.


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