# Lets have a little, fun debate about lifting fast or lifting slow



## Won (Jun 5, 2010)

for the following reasons, Im going to argue lifting fast is better.

Reason 1: When you lift fast you can use more weight : More weight is more muscles, more strength, stronger joints, stronger bones,


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## MillionG (Nov 17, 2009)

Won said:


> for the following reasons, Im going to argue lifting fast is better.
> 
> Reason 1: When you lift fast you can use more weight : *More weight is more muscles*, more strength, stronger joints, stronger bones,


as in, recruiting more muscles?

Or you grow more muscles from scratch?

:whistling:


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## sizar (Nov 13, 2008)

you will get flamed for this lol i ain't saying word


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## B-GJOE (May 7, 2009)

Won said:


> for the following reasons, Im going to argue lifting fast is better.
> 
> Reason 1: When you lift fast you can use more weight : More weight is more muscles, more strength, stronger joints, stronger bones,


FCUK OFF!!!

Lifting fast is like kicking a ball against a wall. The wall only serves as an object to transfer the energy in the ball from one direction to the other, it doesn't actually move the ball. Same with those fast lifters who use weights they can't handle, their joints are behaving like the wall, simply to convert the gravitational energy that is lowering the weight to momental energy to move it back up again.

Training slower ensures that the weight is being moved with muscular effort.


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## Won (Jun 5, 2010)

MillionG said:


> as in, recruiting more muscles?
> 
> Or you grow more muscles from scratch?
> 
> :whistling:


grow more muscles from scratch


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## B-GJOE (May 7, 2009)

Op

You obviously know what you're talking about.

Nice picture in your avvy btw!

Another faceless idiot!


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## MillionG (Nov 17, 2009)

B|GJOE said:


> Op
> 
> You obviously know what you're talking about.
> 
> ...


Says you... :tongue:










I'm just messing


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## ashie1986 (Feb 14, 2010)

lol

big joe had a facepik on here before im sure lol

but surely the OP is messing


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## B-GJOE (May 7, 2009)

I got a face, but it aint pretty


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## big silver back (Jan 17, 2009)

slow and strict all the way for me :thumb:


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## big silver back (Jan 17, 2009)

B|GJOE said:


> I got a face, but it aint pretty


Looking incredable by the way!!!! mg:


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

i think it depends on the individual,if you watch branch warren

training his reps are really fast.


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## TinyGuy (Dec 7, 2009)

nice one joe, have u got ne pics of u when u were big, and what did you do to get fitted with an ankle tag??

lol, jokes ^^

u look ****ing awesome bro 

Lets not forget, as bad for me as having no avvy at all, having an obscure avvy of someone else!!! I just assumed as its a muscle building forum, everyone would have a pic of themselves if any.

P.S. yes that is my girly back in my avvy. lol


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## doylejlw (Feb 14, 2010)

nice and controlled is how i lift, the amount of wolly's you get down my gym just going as heavy as they can but normally are ones in worst shape but yet they still never realise why.


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## bigbear21 (Oct 11, 2009)

IMO slow and controlled with a hard contraction will recruit the most muscle fibre explosive training actually transfers the load to the skeleton. hence olympic lifters tend to carry less muscle mass than their bb counterparts strongest man style guys carry size due to their mix of training on a side note constant tension will increase the chances of a intramuscular tear whilst explosive runs the risk of an attachment tear


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## nagasis (Sep 26, 2009)

well i lift slow cos its fcukin heavy. Fast negatives cos its fcukin heavy. :laugh:

ok i'll get me coat


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## B-GJOE (May 7, 2009)

nagasis said:


> well i lift slow cos its fcukin heavy. Fast negatives cos its fcukin heavy. :laugh:
> 
> ok i'll get me coat


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## Glassback (Jun 18, 2010)

I lift controlled and deliberatley but also employ explosive training but not so much with barebells etc but with logs and rope work - so both for me.

But got to go with general concensus, seeing someone throw around a too heavier weight uncontrollably is like watching a stand-up Dwarf. Its not big and its not funny.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

B|GJOE said:


> FCUK OFF!!!
> 
> Lifting fast is like kicking a ball against a wall. The wall only serves as an object to transfer the energy in the ball from one direction to the other, it doesn't actually move the ball. Same with those fast lifters who use weights they can't handle, their joints are behaving like the wall, simply to convert the gravitational energy that is lowering the weight to momental energy to move it back up again.
> 
> Training slower ensures that the weight is being moved with muscular effort.


Perfect answer. I hate it when i see people using really fast reps with a weight they otherwise wouldnt be able to lift. Faster on incline, slow declines for me.


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

MillionG said:


> Says you... :tongue:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I knew someone would do that!

Slow release, fast contraction. That's what I do on most exercises. Don't see the point in swinging stuff about if you can't control it.


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

B|GJOE said:


> FCUK OFF!!!
> 
> Lifting fast is like kicking a ball against a wall. The wall only serves as an object to transfer the energy in the ball from one direction to the other, it doesn't actually move the ball. Same with those fast lifters who use weights they can't handle, their joints are behaving like the wall, simply to convert the gravitational energy that is lowering the weight to momental energy to move it back up again.
> 
> Training slower ensures that the weight is being moved with muscular effort.


Saying that, using momentum can allow far more weight than usual to be lifted, thus overloading muscles more

Powerlifters need to use this technique to "explode" weight from the stationary,

More weight lifted, but I would suggest similar stress as greater weight negates then controlled movements

Plus then you have the CNS stress with exposive power

Sprinters for example use explosive power in training and they are pretty stacked

TBH arguments for both cases

For me depends on exercise, Deadlifts I will explode off floor using as much momentum as poss

But isolation ie preacher curls would lend themselves IMO to a slow controlled rep


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

tom0311 said:


> I knew someone would do that!
> 
> Slow release, fast contraction. That's what I do on most exercises. Don't see the point in swinging stuff about if you can't control it.


Why does everything have to become right or wrong??

It is a grey area

Strong men have to become adept at using momentum and swinging in order to be competitive

So as you can see no point, every one else who does is wrong???

I would suggest form your avi alone that perhaps you might like to try some explosive movements and see how you fair


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## Irish Beast (Jun 16, 2009)

Won said:


> for the following reasons, Im going to argue lifting fast is better.
> 
> Reason 1: When you lift fast you can use more weight : More weight is more muscles, more strength, stronger joints, stronger bones,


Do you know Daz Green?


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## glen danbury (May 23, 2006)

Both

when lifting slow the benefit is that the final portion of the rep is typically loaded - fats explosive reps are often unloaded in the final 50% due to momentum

however less weight is lifted, less explsoive strength is developed and to a degree lifitng lsow can lead to a lower failure point due top this decreased load

when you lift any weight that is below 85% of your 1RM typically only a proportion of your muscle fibers are recruited (enough to generate the force required to overcome the object and cause movement) - as such you get something termed 'muscle wisdom' where your nervous system will alternate between fibers in order to delay fatigue - as such alot of fibers will get rest and unless a muscle is fatigue typically its stated its not trained

lifting heavy weight as fats as possible (often slow due to the weight being heavy) will recruit as many fibers as possible

thats why i think heavy weight for multiple low rep sets is best for growth - ties in well with the energetic hypothesis of muscle growth as well


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## B-GJOE (May 7, 2009)

Explosive lifts, controlled negatives..............


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

jw007 said:


> Why does everything have to become right or wrong??
> 
> It is a grey area
> 
> ...


That's because they're strong men though isn't it? I never said it was wrong, but for the average Joe who just wants to build muscle and get a bit of bulk there's no point going in swinging stuff about with **** form is there? There's plenty of threads on this forum talking about how important form is, so why is my comment any different?

Regarding myself, I may not be very big but my lifts are pretty good. As long as I'm getting stronger I don't really mind. What did you mean by more explosive movements?


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## glen danbury (May 23, 2006)

tom0311 said:


> That's because they're strong men though isn't it? I never said it was wrong, but for the average Joe who just wants to build muscle and get a bit of bulk there's no point going in* swinging stuff about with **** form *is there? There's plenty of threads on this forum talking about how important form is, so why is my comment any different?
> 
> Regarding myself, I may not be very big but my lifts are pretty good. As long as I'm getting stronger I don't really mind. What did you mean by more explosive movements?


just becasue you are explosive ona rep doesnt mean you are swinging it about or using bad form - you can have a very explosive yet controlled precise rep


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

glen danbury said:


> just becasue you are explosive ona rep doesnt mean you are swinging it about or using bad form - you can have a very explosive yet controlled precise rep


Yes I know, but I specifically said swinging not just a fast/explosive rep.

I already said on my first post in this thread that I go slow on the negative and explosive on the contraction, so clearly I am not saying ALL explosive reps are pointless.


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

glen danbury said:


> just becasue you are explosive ona rep doesnt mean you are swinging it about or using bad form - you can have a very explosive yet controlled precise rep


Beat me to it

Fast reps does not = sh1t form

Besides there is also an argument for some exercise to be prefromed with "cheat form" on occasion, cheat curls spring to mind

It is wrong to dismiss any kind of training

TBH, in real life application, cheat form is preferable

Removal men for instance need to be able to "juggle weights" around

doing a slow controlled rep would not help their job

Dismissing any kind of training concept is wrong, especially as no one style suits all

Bertil fox if ever seen his vids, had the most appalling (you would consider) form

But didnt hold him back any.................


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Both styles of lifting work. Whether lifting fast or slow, whether lifting at a speed which is constant or one that causes the bar to accelerate, the energy that causes the weight to move only comes from the same place each time - your muscles.

Do what ever style you find easiest to sustain the most work with at a decent intensity.


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

tom0311 said:


> *Yes I know, but I specifically said swinging not just a fast/explosive rep.*
> 
> I already said on my first post in this thread that I go slow on the negative and explosive on the contraction, so clearly I am not saying ALL explosive reps are pointless.


A swinging curl is called a Brunch curl or similar,

Magnus samualsson uses these and hes got huge guns


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

Check my post on the bottom of the last page, I said I use explosive reps myself - but I don't see the point in swinging and using sh!t form for the average Joe. That is my opinion and I know that a lot of people on here also agree with it. How often do you see people say "make sure your form is good" on this site? I wasn't the only person with this opinion on this thread either.

There is definitely a place for cheat exercises, and I agree with you about real life. I've had to do a lot of stuff like that as well and it's nothing like a slow controlled rep lol, nothing in real life has the stable centre of gravity like a dumbbell so you end up swinging and swaying about with things all the time.

EDIT: just seen your post on Magnus, think I've watched that vid before and can remember it well. As above there is definitely a place for cheat exercises - but good form is still important a lot of the time! Surely there aren't all these posts about good form for nothing?


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## craftybutcher (Aug 10, 2009)

chilisi said:


> Lift weights like your making love to a woman..


While she is out for the count on Rohypnol?


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## Danlite (May 7, 2011)

just saying but it looks like all the massive people are saying slow/controlled, i'd go by what they say!


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## SK-XO (Aug 6, 2009)

So analyse this, why is it that branch, cutler and flex lewis use v fast & usually short movements? I know it "Must work for them" but what is it? seems everyone will go with the grain and say yeah you shouldn't cheat and shouldn't go fast etc but then the pro's do. I know they may be the pro's but genuinly interested.


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## musio (Jan 25, 2008)

more important that the speed is how much you lift in relation to you 1RM. You can only go fast with a really heavy weight! When you're moving up though the weights, it will be slower lifts at first until your muscle fibers rip, grown and become accustomed to the weight. Then you'll be lifting that same weight a little faster.

If you ask me, in this process of progression, there is a cycle from slow to fast. The important point is you keep going though these cycles and progressing.


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## IrishRaver (Feb 4, 2010)

Lift the weight up at a normal speed but control the negative. Squeeze and slight pause at the top.


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## IrishRaver (Feb 4, 2010)

SK-XO said:


> So analyse this, why is it that branch, cutler and flex lewis use v fast & usually short movements? I know it "Must work for them" but what is it? seems everyone will go with the grain and say yeah you shouldn't cheat and shouldn't go fast etc but then the pro's do. I know they may be the pro's but genuinly interested.


Isn't it something to do with their muscle twitch fibres in their genetic structure?

Some benefit more from full ROM, some don't from the constant muscle contraction...


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## sully807 (Jul 28, 2010)

explosive positive, slow controlled negative


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## massiccio (Nov 17, 2010)

There is space for all the above , at the right place and time.

Exsplosive positive recruit most fibers. Slow negative break down the muscle a lot.

A beginner /intermediate has different requirements than an advanced athlete.


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## Breda (May 2, 2011)

Speed Reps for Mass http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/site/speed-reps-for-mass/


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## immy (Apr 18, 2010)

all depends on the exercise i try and always go slow on the negative and explode on the lift treat it like a spring


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