# What's your 'natty' story?



## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

For those who've perhaps been tempted by Performance Enhancing Drugs (PEDs) or competed in a sport/discipline where usage was rife (as I did)...

What keeps you natural?

For me it when I sparred against guys using PEDs, it was the persistent defiance that I could beat them and know that I did it without resorting to substance usage. Also the challenge of not using a 'crutch' (in my opinion, nothing against guys/gals who choose to use PEDs) to meet my goals is far more intrinsically rewarding.

So what's yours?

Health?

Proving a point/Defiance?

Looking to or currently compete in natural federation?

Prefer the challenge?

I don't want to turn this into a 'what is natural' debate (it's been done to death frankly) so natural for the purposes of this discussion, would be against use of anything currently banned on the WADA/IOC doping list.


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

RickMiller said:


> For those who've perhaps been tempted by Performance Enhancing Drugs (PEDs) or competed in a sport/discipline where usage was rife (as I did)...
> 
> What keeps you natural?
> 
> ...


Come on now, seriously?


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Come on now, seriously?


Seriously mate, there's no drug testing in Karate. Loads of guys were on enough gear to start a drug trafficking cartel  Mainly highly androgenic stuff.


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

I meant the "roided up to the gills" bit.

A bit much?


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> I meant the "roided up to the gills" bit.
> 
> A bit much?


Figure of speech mate  I'll edit it so as not to offend anyone.


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## paul81 (Jun 3, 2010)

my reason is i dont fancy spending silly amounts of money on them, lol.

plus interested to see what size/weight i can get up naturally


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

No probs.

Didn't offend me as such, just seemed a little unnecessary.


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## steviethe spark (Oct 17, 2010)

For me its just staying healthy .dont see the point useing unless ur competeing .just what i think.


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

paul81 said:


> my reason is i dont fancy spending silly amounts of money on them, lol.
> 
> plus interested to see what size/weight i can get up naturally


Agreed. Some would argue that PEDs are cheaper....

Your second point is definitely true  I don't think many even come close to their prospective genetic maximum for muscle mass before using PEDs.


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## paul81 (Jun 3, 2010)

steviethe spark said:


> For me its just staying healthy .*dont see the point useing unless ur competeing* .just what i think.


this is a very valid point. something i also agree with


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

steviethe spark said:


> For me its just staying healthy .dont see the point useing unless ur competeing .just what i think.


Agree entirely. I think one's perspective on their training also plays a large role.

Not that this doesn't apply to those that use PEDs, but from speaking to a lot of natural trainers, many view their training as a long term 'investment' in their health alongside any gains in muscle mass. Therefore, to the one's I've spoken to, the use of PEDs doesn't really fit into that equation.

Now of course you open the floodgates to the another debate on prolific use vs. recreational....


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## Malibu (May 13, 2010)

Im very vain, and steriods help keep muscle mass at a certain level, if i used supps for the same job id be spending atleast 5x more


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

i stayed "natty" for 12 years, slogging my nuts off in the gym because i wanted to experience what being a normal lad that went to the gym a bit looked like.....then i went on gear for 3 years to bang on 5 stone of muscle......

Can any of you "natty's" guess which i prefer?


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## xpower (Jul 28, 2009)

Natty for years when younger & training hard.

lost the plot gave it all up.

Now not so natty going on 40 & looking better than ever.


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## xpower (Jul 28, 2009)

Uriel said:


> Can any of you "natty's" guess which i prefer?


Rimming?


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## Wardy211436114751 (Jan 24, 2011)

I've been training for around 10 months gone from 11.5 st to 13st and got alot stronger along the way. For me personally I may reassess after another 2 or 3 years but I like lifting natural I like the steady progress and knowing where you are. I also think if I did a cycle then I would definitely become hooked would probably end up doing too many or not having any rest between cycles stupid stuff like that. My dad is also an ex drug-free powerlifter and I just recently had my first comp in the drug frees and believe me the size and strength of some of these guys naturally is enough inspiration for me to stay natty.

Main reason for me though is the sides, the cost, not being anywhere near my natural strength/size limit and morally because my dad would never come watch me lift if I was on steroids.


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Fisting?


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Wardy21 said:


> I've been training for around 10 months gone from 11.5 st to 13st and got alot stronger along the way. For me personally I may reassess after another 2 or 3 years but I like lifting natural I like the steady progress and knowing where you are. I also think if I did a cycle then I would definitely become hooked would probably end up doing too many or not having any rest between cycles stupid stuff like that. My dad is also an ex drug-free powerlifter and I just recently had my first comp in the drug frees and believe me the size and strength of some of these guys naturally is enough inspiration for me to stay natty.
> 
> Main reason for me though is the sides, the cost, not being anywhere near my natural strength/size limit and morally because my dad would never come watch me lift if I was on steroids.


Do you honestly believe they are natty though?


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

xpower said:


> Rimming?


i do like to gently move my tounge around a nice tight @rsehole - lush


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## Wardy211436114751 (Jan 24, 2011)

Uriel said:


> i stayed "natty" for 12 years, slogging my nuts off in the gym because i wanted to experience what being a normal lad that went to the gym a bit looked like.....then i went on gear for 3 years to bang on 5 stone of muscle......
> 
> Can any of you "natty's" guess which i prefer?


I think your natural base would have set you up well for this and has prob helped you be able to keep training hard and avoid injury after all these years.


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

NoGutsNoGlory said:



> Fisting?


yes but so long as its christmas fisting - it is better to give than to receive lol


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

Wardy21 said:


> I think your natural base would have set you up well for this and has prob helped you be able to keep training hard and avoid injury after all these years.


yes mate - that might be true - i'm only farking around - i love training natural or assisted


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## Wardy211436114751 (Jan 24, 2011)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Do you honestly believe they are natty though?


Yeah ofcourse from seeing alot of users I can tell pretty well by now what a user looks like. And just from chatting to these guys they are honest genuine blokes if they were bang on gear there'd be plenty of other federations to compete in. These kinda comments annoy me tbh. Also every record breaker and top blokes competing in the comps get tested anyway but its more of a moral thing. My dad lifted natural all his life and tbh his diet wasn't great and training styles pretty old school he worked up to a 290kg deadlift in the 90kg class most people would only dream about lifting that even some assisted blokes...


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Uriel said:


> yes but so long as its christmas fisting - it is better to give than to receive lol


Just remembered something I saw in the AL.

:SHUDDER:


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Fisting?


Munging


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Just remembered something I saw in the AL.
> 
> :SHUDDER:


oh heck....jammuck or somthing was his UN.................half man - half bumhole lol


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Wardy21 said:


> Yeah ofcourse from seeing alot of users I can tell pretty well by now what a user looks like. And just from chatting to these guys they are honest genuine blokes if they were bang on gear there'd be plenty of other federations to compete in. These kinda comments annoy me tbh. Also every record breaker and top blokes competing in the comps get tested anyway but its more of a moral thing. My dad lifted natural all his life and tbh his diet wasn't great and training styles pretty old school he worked up to a 290kg deadlift in the 90kg class most people would only dream about lifting that even some assisted blokes...


Didn't mean to offend you.

It's just i'm very skeptical of natural competitions.

Who's to say someone hasn't been bashing the gear in for 5 years then taken a 6 month break and entered a natty comp?


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Just remembered something I saw in the AL.
> 
> :SHUDDER:


you couldnt rim him....it would dry your tongue half way round the racetrack sized sphincter and youd stick


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Uriel said:


> oh heck....jammuck or somthing was his UN.................half man - half bumhole lol


Up to the elbow if I remember right?

:surrender:


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Up to the elbow if I remember right?
> 
> :surrender:


clavical


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## xpower (Jul 28, 2009)

Anyway.....

Natty stories lol(no fisting please lol)


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## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

I started training for fun. About the same time I got together with a lass who was very anti roids and believed all the media hype. When I started to take it seriously she asked me to promise I wouldn't juice... Which I did cos tbh I had no intention of juicing. ended up marrying her which made me natty for life...... It should of  now, however, I'm going through a divorce and have lost over a stone and half over the last 6 months and now I can juice without bteakin a promise it is becomming very tempting tho I am more likely to.dabble with ph's first if I do go over to the dark side


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## Uriel (Oct 14, 2008)

xpower said:


> Anyway.....
> 
> Natty stories lol(no fisting please lol)


or indeed - rimming, cottaging, tromboning, space docking, mooning or spooning x


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

My work here is done


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## Wardy211436114751 (Jan 24, 2011)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Didn't mean to offend you.
> 
> It's just i'm very skeptical of natural competitions.
> 
> Who's to say someone hasn't been bashing the gear in for 5 years then taken a 6 month break and entered a natty comp?


No problem mate. Sure thats a possibility but I've also heard once you start gear you pretty much don't stop unless you have to! Not saying I agree with that either and I would like to think it doesn't go on or atleast is very rare but even then its different to being red-eyed and peaked right up for your comp at the end of a monstrous cycle like the guys you see in the un-tested feds...


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

Wardy21 said:


> No problem mate. Sure thats a possibility but I've also heard once you start gear you pretty much don't stop unless you have to! Not saying I agree with that either and I would like to think it doesn't go on or atleast is very rare but even then its different to being red-eyed and peaked right up for your comp at the end of a monstrous cycle like the guys you see in the un-tested feds...


I believe in this too.

Some would argue it 'levels the playing field' but you have to believe in the systems they're using to test, otherwise you could argue all day whether a winner cheated or not.

UK bodybuilding is pretty strict to be honest (drug test and polygraph).


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## maxie (Jan 31, 2011)

I was natural for ten years but there came atime when you think youre getting nowhere

So i had a couple of goes on gear but didnt want to spend the rest of my life sticking needles in my ****.

That was 15 years ago and not been back on them,ive just had to face the fact im never gonna be big,big.240 was my biggest natural.

So what has kept me natural was i didnt want to carry on using,simple as that.

I would have loved them big traps/delts only gear users seem to get though:cool:


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

maxie said:


> I was natural for ten years but there came atime when you think youre getting nowhere
> 
> So i had a couple of goes on gear but didnt want to spend the rest of my life sticking needles in my ****.
> 
> ...


Thanks for contributing  seems like you've come full circle in many ways. Did you feel you'd reached your potential and that PEDs were the only way to progress? If you had your time again, would you have stayed natural?


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## maxie (Jan 31, 2011)

The thing then was there was no internet available then with good information on training,food.All i had was the mags and they publish a total load of rubbish info with only a very little sensible info.The gym i used wasnt up to much instruction wise either.

I knew i hadnt reached my potential but i was stumped for how to keep going onwards.

I think now food and proper training for me,would have kept me growing without the gear as when i came back i blasted up to 240 natural,i was stronger as well.

But i dont regret using the gear,im just pleased i was cautious and backed off.

Ive had a couple of breaks off training for 3-4 years and the good thing of doing a lot of heavy natural training is you dont lose all of your muscle,and you can get what you lost back fairly quick.


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

Muscle memory's a marvellous thing


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## Greenspin (Dec 27, 2010)

For me, though I am still relatively young, steroids simply don't fit into any of the reasons I train... I don't have the desire to use them and they might as well not exist to me. I am not anti steroids, I just have no reason to take them.

(I know that people could argue through their teeth that they (AAS) have everything to do with why I train etc etc blah blah. But the point I am making is that to me they don't fit into my life. So their mere existence does not make them relative to me personally)

I would also like to add, I am in no way anti steroid (PH, and etc). I don't judge people for using them. I don't see people use use them as 'users'. I really don't care 

(Well I care for most, but if they make an informed decision, then that is exactly that, there decision)


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## Barker (Oct 1, 2009)

Was just about to make a thread similar myself.

Getting pretty woumd up recently. I train very hard, i eat pretty damn well, amd i get reasonable amounts of sleep. I very rarely drink and i never do drugs. And im making fvck all progress. Its at this point when i can truely blame sh1tty genetics.

Then on the other hand theres guys that know sweet fvck all about training/nutrition, go out on this **** all the time, sniff gram upon gram of mkat/ket whatever and grow like mad!

Its realy getting me down. Im 18 and im not living life how most do, im always turning down invites to parties or nights out on the town because 'its legs night' or i just dont want to drink because i need every benefit i can to grow!

Im trying to stay natty because i want to compete naturally just to say i put all my hard work in without juicing (yes juicing is a short cut, and no you dont have to work as hard before anyone tries to tell me different), but sometimes i just feel like i cant do it!

Im getting annoyed just writing this honestly everything goes wrong for me, i find one thing i love and its training and im genetically sh!te at it!!!!

Really dont want to let myself down by joining the dark side before ive competed but it just seems far too hard.


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

Barker said:


> Was just about to make a thread similar myself.
> 
> Getting pretty woumd up recently. I train very hard, i eat pretty damn well, amd i get reasonable amounts of sleep. I very rarely drink and i never do drugs. And im making fvck all progress. Its at this point when i can truely blame sh1tty genetics.
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear that mate  it is truly frustrating when you feel you're not making any progress.

I think it's a admirable quality that you're still on the natural path, chances are whilst the PEDs would make it much easier to grow, you'd experience the same difficulties off-cycle to maintain gains but obviously with a compromised endocrine system.

With that in mind, whilst it's clearly an uphill battle, I'd recommend you stay the natural course until you've figured out what it is that's stopping the growth.

Have you thought about investing in professional support? If I had my time again; it's probably the first thing I would have done as a trainee.


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## kev1 (Nov 11, 2010)

ive been training naturally for 12 years! im 27 and and train 6 days a week every body part individually!

i was fortunate when i started training to have good strength so competed in bdfpa (british drug free powerlifting) my strongest lift was bench which i concentrated on in comps.

after setting a southwest and national record got invited to lift for england in italy, won the europeans and world championships and set a world record.

even tho i i was a powerlifter i prefered bodybuilding so always trained like one so now my aim is to loose another stone and a half and do my first natgty comp 

loosing the last bits of fat is going to be hard!!!!! so think its time to speak to a natural pro to really get help as i hold alot of muscle through years of training hard and heavy! and no i can do well if i can get in the condition needed!

never give up we train for health and well being!


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## HJL (Apr 26, 2009)

Barker said:


> Its realy getting me down. Im 18 and im not living life how most do, im always turning down invites to parties or nights out on the town because 'its legs night' or i just dont want to drink because i need every benefit i can to grow!


mate your only young once. not goign to parties or nights out because its legs night? thats (IM0) a huge sacrifice for massive muscles by the time your 23. But then again, i love parties and booze. i wouldnt dream of not goign out due to having to train. training fits around my life, not the other way round!

and the sides of gear, and head****s of pct. the scare of never getting natty test back and sex drive.


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## maxie (Jan 31, 2011)

HJL said:


> mate your only young once. not goign to parties or nights out because its legs night? thats (IM0) a huge sacrifice for massive muscles by the time your 23. But then again, i love parties and booze. i wouldnt dream of not goign out due to having to train. training fits around my life, not the other way round!
> 
> and the sides of gear, and head****s of pct. the scare of never getting natty test back and sex drive.


I agree with this 100% maye youre trying too hard and the extra rest will be the thing that starts you growing.Some people can only grow off a small amount of training,me included and i think my genetics arent too bad for bodybuilding.When i was younger i would have loved to train every day but i can not do it.

Youre too young to be putting all your time into the weights get yourself out on the lash and pull a few birds and enjoy yourself.


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## Dazza (Aug 7, 2010)

My main reason, hassle to find a source i'll do it online at some point, start off with a small order just to see if they're legit.

Plus there's the financial reasons, i have too much on atm plus a cycle isn't that expensive, unless you start buying things like adex which cost a packet.

Plus id like to see how far i can go. As a natty it takes more control on diet and training to get results, by doing this im hoping that when i do hit the peds i'll sky rocket.

Currently 235lbs and doing alright, but im getting the feeling im close to my natural limit, gains have slowed right down so now im focusing on maintaining if not gain a fraction, whilst trying to lean out a bit to make the diet a bit easier.

We shall see, can't wait for when christmas is out of the way, it'll be like unwrapping a christmas present, just to see what's underneath.


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## Readyandwaiting (Mar 20, 2011)

It could be very costly, depends how bad you want it.

If you start making excuses saying that it is too costly etc... then you don't want to take them bad enough.

Anyway the bigger you get the more calories you will need and the more food you will eat.


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## Danjal (Aug 4, 2009)

I'm a newbie, only been going a couple of years and I don't think I am anywhere near my natural limit yet. If/when I reach that limit I will see what my situation is and make an informed decision from there.


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## Barker (Oct 1, 2009)

Funny when people say im to you, what about half the pros? Or that foreign guy that was huge at 18, they all took it seriously from a young age. I want to compete as young as possible.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

For me it's never been a serious consideration... the only time I ever did think about using AAS was when spending a lot of time researching and studying human physiology and out of total curiosity I thought about some self experimentation. It was more about curiosity than getting big! I used to think also that maybe when I hit my late 40's I might consider some form of TRT... I reserve the right to still look at this when I get there, but right now my feeling is that I'm happy to age the way nature intended.

Exercise, diet and health for me are things that go hand in hand - I train because I think it increases my body's health, improves my physical capability in many areas, makes me look better (yep, definitely some vanity in there) and also has some definite psychological benefits. Beyond that though I have no aspiration either to look like a pro bodybuilder, or to live the highly regimented lifestyle needed to maintain that kind of physique, especially when this also involves taking PEDs, and then also a range of other medications to deal with unhealthy side effects.

I have absolutely nothing against people who do chose to use AAS for bodybuilding, although do have big issues with the use of synthol and implants in competetive bodybuilding, and also non disclosure of AAS use. I also think there's a constant need for caution when AAS users give training and diet advice based upon their experiences doing something that coincide with their PED use... this can, and often does, result in inappropriate advice given to newbs and naturals.

In other sports, especially one-on-one sports such as athletics, I can understand the temptation but do see it as unfair... unless competition is seperated into PED users and non PED users - and if that were to happen I would like to see the media coverage and the big financial rewards go to the non users rather than the users.


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## NovemberDelta (Apr 17, 2011)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Didn't mean to offend you.
> 
> It's just i'm very skeptical of natural competitions.
> 
> Who's to say someone hasn't been bashing the gear in for 5 years then taken a 6 month break and entered a natty comp?


To be honest mate I agree with you. I've competed a bit in natty comps, and I am 100% sure that plenty of the guys competing have been firing in the peds. It's all just a game, can you ensure the drugs are out, will you be tested? In my personal opinion and experience there is no such thing as a natty comp in strength or BBing.


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## maxie (Jan 31, 2011)

Barker said:


> Funny when people say im to you, what about half the pros? Or that foreign guy that was huge at 18, they all took it seriously from a young age. I want to compete as young as possible.


It seems your super keen ive been there myself except i was older than you.

Your a bit young for the gear yet,have you tried short hard routines on a m/w/f split,legs/ back /bis.ch/delt/tris dont do too much let your body recover.If you blast it with the least volume you can get away with ,let it recover and grow,then blast it four days later,let it recover and grow.A quick turnaround more growing sessions in a year.Pick the big exercises and work on getting your weights up.

Diet wise dont be too strict,olive oil in shakes,mince from a good butcher is cheap,you can always take a bit of the fat out of it.Chicken leg quarters are cheap and a bit more fat in them.Blast the protein and give your body no reason not to grow.Dont be afraid to put a bit of bodyfat on.

Sorry to go off topic :wacko:


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

niall01 said:


> To be honest mate I agree with you. I've competed a bit in natty comps, and I am 100% sure that plenty of the guys competing have been firing in the peds. It's all just a game, can you ensure the drugs are out, will you be tested? In my personal opinion and experience there is no such thing as a natty comp in strength or BBing.


It's getting harder and harder to cheat as I would agree, this was rife even just a few years ago.

Federations such as the NPA, BNBF or DFBA are seriously cracking down on those who try to beat the system, be this by random testing in the offseason and on the day of the show (and charging competitors for the privelege) and polygraphing (albeit not a reliable method) the finalists of any regional event.


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## Glassback (Jun 18, 2010)

NoGutsNoGlory said:


> Do you honestly believe they are natty though?


I knew this comment was coming from you before I read it...... Relentless and pointless.

I believe testing now keepsnthe natural competitions clear of PEDs etc.

My story is never wanted to be "big" it was all about fitness and strength but in a different way to lifting weights.

Fast forward to post back break and I couldn't take them now as I take Med that lower my immune system so it's a big NO NO.

I do think that if I didn't take the meds I take for my back that I would certainly consider something.


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## GreedyBen (Mar 8, 2011)

I mainly go to the gym to keep fit and look good (or try to).

I've been weight training on and off since I was 14 or so, did a bit of boxing in my ealy 20's, now just trying to slow the onset of middle age spread.

I never really got my diet right or even ate well before so no wonder I never got any significant results. Even when I boxed I couldn't get my weight down enough so had to compete at light middle (74kg) instead of welter weight (70kg) and at 5'7 that wasn't too clever!

I'm eating a bit better now and seeing the results, but holidays and stuff get in the way and ruin them just as quick!

I'm know a few people that use or have used peds/gear in the past and they have not kept their gains or got much in the way of results and are no bigger or stronger than me so I don't really see the point. They are probably about as disciplined as me and thats why it hasn't worked for them and I'd probably be the same. Also I couldn't justify the outlay at present and theres also work/legal side of things to worry about.

I intend on researching hgh further for when I start getting wrinkly though!

I am never going to compete or anything I just enjoy feeling fit and strong(ish).


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## Wardy211436114751 (Jan 24, 2011)

niall01 said:


> To be honest mate I agree with you. I've competed a bit in natty comps, and I am 100% sure that plenty of the guys competing have been firing in the peds. It's all just a game, can you ensure the drugs are out, will you be tested? In my personal opinion and experience there is no such thing as a natty comp in strength or BBing.


But from a moral POV I wouldn't enter a drug free comp if I was using it defeats the object. The guys I met at my comp all seemed like decent genuine blokes that wouldn't be trying to get prestige from lifting illegally. Also just looking at them they didn't look like they were using as after a while you get pretty good at spotting someone on PEDS. I've got nothing against people that do choose to use cause damn it is tempting to me also but if I did use I would go up against other people that used.

Don't wanna turn this into a natty or not natty debate and not a roid bashin thread either as I agree with dtlv is saying. Interested to know other peoples reasons for staying natty and how far they've come. I personally haven't ruled out using them myself in the future but plenty of time to carry on training while I consider


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## immy (Apr 18, 2010)

My story for staying natural and I aim to stay natural for life i used to play a lot of sport during my school days rugby and football and was always in athletic shape abs and the lot but when I went to college & uni all the sports stopped and i just kept eating what ever i wanted fast food, sweets etc but weight was starting to be put on the wrong area i joined a gym but all i did was cardio for around 1 year i went from 14stone to around 10.5 but I lost muscle due to not knowing about nutrition and when i looked in the mirror i didn't like what I saw and then decided something had to be done as i didn't want to be a 10stone boy (i have long arms so they looked really skinny and i just felt weak mentally after looking at myself in the mirror).

I started lifting weights correctly around 1 year and 9 months ago and have loved every minute of it but during that time my foods were still the same i.e only eating 3 times a day and still snacking etc but making good gains and feeling really good about myself and recently have got myself a structured diet and I'm reading more and more about nutrition, supplementation and hassling Rick for any advice I can get :thumb: .

What also makes me want to stay natural is realising that people who use enhancements are not always guaranteed to be strong even though they may look it as I have seen with my own eyes a guy in my old gym who had been using gear and has admitted to it but was struggling with 10kg on front raises making loads of noise even though he looked like he should be doing them for a warm up, and i was making gains and getter stronger stronger even with a ****ty diet but now with a good diet in place i can only make better gains and get stronger and remain healthy and keep training for as long as possible.

And also seeing the older guys who have been natural for 30+ years i.e the power lifters and guys who were in to body building still training and then speaking to guys who have used gear and their health issues tendons giving out etc and seeing a 70 year old who has abs that makes most of the t-shirt trainers jealous has been training for 50 years is also inspiring to stay natural.


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## laurie g (Nov 28, 2008)

hmmm well- i roid because i compete- but i have long spells with no PEDs, no creatine only protein and a huge offseason diet. I actually enjoy being drug free- seriously. The feeling of doing it clean, and a natural strength is as the OP pointed out extremely rewarding, ok so i have used them in the past- but once they have completely left the system i would class my self as being natural at that point. It is also nice to not have a sore **** all the time and worrying about infections etc. I have never done huge cycles- dont see the point. I have my next cycle in the cubboard at home- 500mg of test 400 and 500mg of tren per week thats my next cycle- but the truth is cant be ****d to start it. Im 19stone at the mo- training intensivly, still pulling a 260kg dead for a couple, shoulder pressing 53kg for 3 of 10 so am quite happy.


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## Guest (Oct 9, 2011)

Barker said:


> Was just about to make a thread similar myself.
> 
> Getting pretty woumd up recently. I train very hard, i eat pretty damn well, amd i get reasonable amounts of sleep. I very rarely drink and i never do drugs. And im making fvck all progress. Its at this point when i can truely blame sh1tty genetics.
> 
> ...


What you need is a couple of weeks away from the gym. Reintroduce yourself to a social life and have some fun. There is no point being fit but sad. Because when you get the body you want you may still feel sad.

Its like the really fat guy always saying when he is thin he will be happy but when he is he is not.


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## Grantewhite (Oct 15, 2010)

i was a fatty of nearly 21 stone all my friends trained and dabble in steriod use i got jelouse so lost all the weight and over the space of 18 months have lost 8 stone of fat put on nearly 2 stone of muscle and have a more rounded figure than all of them from just sheere determination , that and livers are hard to come by and im a scared of injections lol


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