# UKBFF Finals - Score Sheets



## Incredible Bulk (Sep 19, 2007)

http://www.ukbff.co.uk/pdf/UK_BRITISH_FINALS_RESULTS_2009.pdf

Just for those who want to know how close they were to a higher placing etc


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## MissBC (Apr 29, 2008)

cool


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

it was close between Nana and Tony Bailey.....


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## Usual Suspect (Sep 4, 2009)

Sorry to sound a bit thick. But the lower the number the better? And how do they give the numbers out?


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## PRL (Jul 5, 2006)

Pscarb said:


> it was close between Nana and Tony Bailey.....


Very close. That under 80s class was awesome.


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## musclefox (Oct 21, 2008)

Some good results there especially middleweight class top 2..


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

please could some1 enlighten me,i have just seen the score sheets for the british finals and noticed that in the under 80kg class there was a tie for the 10th place spot,how can only 1 of those competitors go thou when they were both marked with 48 points,i cld understand if it was a 1 day event but these scores were given on the pre judging 1st day,surely both these competitors shld have both been given the chance to go on stage day 2 with a clean sheet to impress the judges as it as been said all competitors shld aim 2 peak for the finals on sunday,surely the audience cld have been told there was a tie therefore there was going to be 11 competitors instead of 10,seems very unfair to the competitor who had the same points on day 1 but didnt get his chance to prove his worth like the guy he tied with did???


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

i think they go on count back from the prejudging rounds not sure as i am not a judge....

Lee needs to contact the UKBFF and find this out for himself...

as for peaking for the sunday yes this is the best case but in a line up as tough as this one you really should aim to peak for the pre-judging then hold it for the sunday show.....this is one of the difficulties with the 2 day format...

Lee did look very good i had him in the top 10


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

me and the lads also thought he hed easily made the top 10 or even higher due to his conditioning shape and immense size,he looked much bigger than 80kg?thanks for your input paul,hope it hasnt put the lad off competing as we heard lots of ppl around the venue bringing his name up saying about the placing?


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## defdaz (Nov 11, 2007)

In the Masters over 50 yrs it looks as though the 4th place man got shafted as they added up Robert Turners points wrong (should have 40 points, not 30) ... ouch.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

hope Paul and John see this and lets the guy know so he can appeal


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

seems to me there have been quite a few c**k ups in this show,you wld think after all the hard work and sacrifice these lads make to do a 2 day show they wld make sure they get all the results right IMO?


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

Looking at my class it brings home how fierce the class was when you consider that last year's third place did not make the top ten. I can live with 9th place I guess.

I've now permanently hung up my trunks so this show was my last time on a BBing stage. Now I can let someone else step up & take the ''best abs on the circuit'' status :tongue:


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

the force said:


> seems to me there have been quite a few c**k ups in this show,you wld think after all the hard work and sacrifice these lads make to do a 2 day show they wld make sure they get all the results right IMO?


I think considering the task at hand, we should show a little more empathy for the time & effort the judges put in over the course of year. It's an incredibly demanding job & one I would not want to trade them for. Without them being willing to give up thier valuable time, there would be no sport at all. Of course there may be the odd error but lets keep it in perspective. If these errors are pointed out in a constructive way I'm sure they will happily rectify errors where they have occurred.

My wife has been an international athletics judge for years & the agro & disrespect she gets sometimes leaves her feeling she wants to quit. She does not though as she loves her sport so much that the odd comment will not get her down. She also competes at a world level so can see it from an athletes perspective too which is an advantage her fellow judges do not have & a lot of them sack it after a while.

in all my years of competing, I feel I have been, on the whole, judged fairly even if at the time I felt differently. This year i thought I might have cracked the top 6, but the judges can see things we can't & having seen some close up pics, they were bang on IMO.

I say well done to the judges for an incredibly difficult job well done. :beer:


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

im not disrespecting any of the judges but thinking of all the hard work and sacrifice yourself and other competitors put themselves thru to get to that level they need to in such a high quality comp,then you wld think it is judged fairly and spot on,this is jus my opinion as i no if i had been in the situation some of them were in after such wrong placings and mistakes then that wld make me want to give up the sport,im not saying the judges have a hard job but it is disheartening wen u get shafted?


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

Nine Pack said:


> I think considering the task at hand, we should show a little more empathy for the time & effort the judges put in over the course of year. It's an incredibly demanding job & one I would not want to trade them for. Without them being willing to give up thier valuable time, there would be no sport at all. Of course there may be the odd error but lets keep it in perspective. If these errors are pointed out in a constructive way I'm sure they will happily rectify errors where they have occurred.
> 
> My wife has been an international athletics judge for years & the agro & disrespect she gets sometimes leaves her feeling she wants to quit. She does not though as she loves her sport so much that the odd comment will not get her down. She also competes at a world level so can see it from an athletes perspective too which is an advantage her fellow judges do not have & a lot of them sack it after a while.
> 
> ...


 as i no ur a seaseaoned vetroen urself for many years how do u think the judges shld have dealt with the joint tied 10th place on pre judging day 1 between mark mcvitie and lee callaghan in the u80kg class who both got 48 points on day 1,in ur opinion do u think they should of both been put thru to day 2 on a clean sheet instead of just the 1 going thru and announcing to the audience they was a tie and thats why 11 men wld have beenon stage:confused1:??appreciate your time


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

the force said:


> im not disrespecting any of the judges but thinking of all the hard work and sacrifice yourself and other competitors put themselves thru to get to that level they need to in such a high quality comp,then you wld think it is judged fairly and spot on,this is jus my opinion as i no if i had been in the situation some of them were in after such wrong placings and mistakes then that wld make me want to give up the sport,im not saying the judges have a hard job but it is disheartening wen u get shafted?


Shafted? Do you honestly, truly believe the judges have any kind of agenda there to'shaft' anyone? What can they possibly gain from it? The job is hard enough without complicating the issue further with underhand decisions. If your mindset is such that you would give up a sport you love because of that then you are in it for the wrong reasons. BBing is a subjective sport (unlike a race where there is a clear winner) so if you get hung up an the opinion of a panel of judges, it will eventually destroy you if you are of weak constitution. I prefer to take comfort & reward in my year on year progression (my own personal improvements) as this is the real test. You are, or at least should be, competing against yourself all year whilst training, eating & growing. The bit on stage is merely showing what you have been up to, nothing more IMO.

Again, keep it in perspective. Consider how many athletes stood up in front of the judges this year compared to how many 'mistakes' were made. As a percentage, it's an infinitessimally small margin for error, well within acceptable limits in any other walk of life.


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

its alot more than jus getting up on stage to show wot u have been up 2 imo,u get on the stage the best u can be to win the show not just for fun,i wld assume ppl compete to better their previous placing and to be the best that they can be.and i do think they were some ppl shafted in the show as do many other who were in the audience jus like me,if it were me getting the mistake i know i wldnt be happy or take it as a small margin of error.ill leave it at that as we obviously do not agree on this,thanks for taking your time to reply.


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

Everyone has thier own reasons for competing, but using last years placing as a reference for this years is not necessarily accurate really unless the class is comprised of exactly the same guys as last year. That said, I understand how sore some folk can feel if they feel they have been misjudged, or even if you are supporting someone who is misjudged. I guess it's just my age & the fact that I am quite pholisophical (seasoned veteran that I am :tongue: , I don't mind. i'm 40 in 2 weeks so it's true!)

Try to remember however that the view the judges have is different to what we see in the audience. They have the best seats in the house & for good reason.

I suspect that the issue with Mark Mcvitie and Lee Callaghan was decided on some sort of 'count back' principle as they must have some criteria for seperating them in the end other than flipping a coin. If there truly was no way to split them on the Saturday (which I doubt but can't comment on without knowing the facts), then I agree they should have both gone up again & been judged together first of all to establish something before moving on to the final top ten. Perhaps we can get some feedback. I'll see if I can glean something from Bill & Wanda.


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

thanks paul for saying you will look in2 this for me,as a spectator and competitor this has given me some thought about entering the ukbff next year which were my origanal plans until seeing the judging and score sheets or do i stick with nabba?

didnt mean any offence calling u a seasoned veteran its because i know u have been in alot of comps and read your profile in the beef many times,it wld be great if u could get any feedback from bill and wanda and possibly john(hodgson),thanks again for your time,look forward from hearing from u.


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## steveg (Nov 24, 2006)

i believe, as paul has said, that they work on a "count back" method where they look at all judges scores, and its the competitor with the greater amount of higher placed scores would theoretically progress to the next round. That is my take on the method, but maybe Paul can find out the exact way its done.


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

I think you are right Steve. I'll be speaking to the UKBFF this week coming to find out thier take on it. And congrats on your placing bud, very well done indeed.

And no worries on the seasoned veteran thing The Force, I don't mind one bit. I'm 40 in two weeks so I've earned it


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## roy (Feb 8, 2009)

what are peoples thoughts on the placings on the over 40s classs!!! i have my thoughts was just interested to see how other people saw it!!!!!


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## Mike Gelsei (Mar 10, 2008)

It's the easiest thing in the world to do - sit back and be critical. The UKBFF British Finals was a great success - If people want to moan about how things are run then get involved and make a difference!


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

the force said:


> im not disrespecting any of the judges but thinking of all the hard work and sacrifice yourself and other competitors put themselves thru to get to that level they need to in such a high quality comp,then you wld think it is judged fairly and spot on,this is jus my opinion as i no if i had been in the situation some of them were in after such wrong placings and mistakes then that wld make me want to give up the sport,im not saying the judges have a hard job but it is disheartening wen u get shafted?


the problem is that this is an opinanated sport we as competitors will always have people in the audience who say we got shafted.....nothing has changed it is still down to the opinion of those sat in front of the stage.....i do believe that they have a count back function for this type of thing...maybe Lee or yourself should contact the UKBFF to find out what the deal is?

I heavily critisise the UKBFF for the way they treat the athletes but never the Judges as the majority of these people do a stearling job and they cannot please everyone all the time.....



Mike Gelsei said:


> It's the easiest thing in the world to do - sit back and be critical. The UKBFF British Finals was a great success - If people want to moan about how things are run then get involved and make a difference!


To be fair Mile not everyone wants to be involved they are happy being just a fan, why doesn't the UKBFF address these things by getting involved with the fans?? just a thought


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## the force (Oct 22, 2009)

jus read the thread bout the new ruling of the 2yr ban with the ukbff and the way the ukbff view competitiors who compete also with other feds,its now plain 2 see why the welsh lad (lee callaghan) in the under 80kg who tied 10th place 1st day didnt place.in the majority of ppls opinions in the venue he shld of easily got in the top 10 day 2 but didnt go thru to the 2nd day,now it looks like this was because he had competed in the nabba british finals this yr,maybe this is why he didnt get a fair look in and a deserved placing??


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

In have always said these restrictions placed on amateur athletes are IMO too much & that the sport would benefit as a whole from allowing all BBers to compete accross the feds with no penalties. I fail to see how any of the feds would lose out?

That said, I doubt very much that the UKBFF would retrospectively mark someone down for breaking a rule that did not exist at the time. They might not be thrilled about it behind closed doors but we will never truly know, & this should not affect placings.


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## Mike Gelsei (Mar 10, 2008)

the force said:


> jus read the thread bout the new ruling of the 2yr ban with the ukbff and the way the ukbff view competitiors who compete also with other feds,its now plain 2 see why the welsh lad (lee callaghan) in the under 80kg who tied 10th place 1st day didnt place.in the majority of ppls opinions in the venue he shld of easily got in the top 10 day 2 but didnt go thru to the 2nd day,now it looks like this was because he had competed in the nabba british finals this yr,maybe this is why he didnt get a fair look in and a deserved placing??


I can tell you with 100% certainty that this did not have any bearing whatsoever on the 80kg class or any other class for that matter. If an athlete is not happy with how they were placed in any contest appraoch the judges and ask.

My wife is always more than happy to give her reasons to any competitor for placing them where she did. She is always constructive - you may not agree with her but you will always get an honest answer. This goes for many, if not all, the judges in the UKBFF.


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## doggrapp lifter (Apr 16, 2009)

Hi,lee callaghan here,aint been on hear for some time,but one of the guys at my local cave (gym) said i should take a look at this thread.first off i was unaware i had tied with carl mcvitie on day one ! 48 points apparently.so that was a shock.especialy as all eyes were on me pumping up backstage,imo i was bang on couldnt even produce siliva weighed in at 80kg,and just took in some vitargo and apricots b,with clycerol,brown sugar,wine before pre-judging.im banging on now sorry.

anyhows,i know my coulour was fine etc,but reading another thread on here has made me question this a little further,i have no intention of causing an argument or anything ,but the thread im talking about mentions about swiching federations!this i was also shocked at.i love competing and i especialy love meeting new bodybuilders and their familys etc.

shouldnt i have gone thru to day two surly.! and id like to say to whomever the force is ,im flattered by your intrest in this issue.thanks guys hope you all enjoyed the weekend anyway.-lee.


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## Mike Gelsei (Mar 10, 2008)

Lee - don't be disheartened! I will ring you in next couple of days, you are a credit to bodybuilding in the UK and you have a great attitude. You will be back and you will do well!


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## doggrapp lifter (Apr 16, 2009)

ok thanks mike,look forword to speaking wiv you,had a great weekend all the same :beer: take care bro-lee


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## GBLiz (Jul 9, 2004)

i have to say, like ninepack i find it very hard to believe that a big conspriracy goes on behind the scenes, whereby all judges agree to mark someone lower for some petty reason.....usually when you see the scorecards things that you THOUGHT were a conspiracy actually make sense. Call me naive, plenty of people do LOL! I find it easier to compete believeing the judges actually do their jobs, than getting wrapped up in paranoia


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## Mike Gelsei (Mar 10, 2008)

GBLiz said:


> i have to say, like ninepack i find it very hard to believe that a big conspriracy goes on behind the scenes, whereby all judges agree to mark someone lower for some petty reason.....usually when you see the scorecards things that you THOUGHT were a conspiracy actually make sense. Call me naive, plenty of people do LOL! I find it easier to compete believeing the judges actually do their jobs, than getting wrapped up in paranoia


Well said Liz!


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## LeeB (Oct 5, 2011)

GBLiz said:


> i have to say, like ninepack i find it very hard to believe that a big conspriracy goes on behind the scenes, whereby all judges agree to mark someone lower for some petty reason.....usually when you see the scorecards things that you THOUGHT were a conspiracy actually make sense. Call me naive, plenty of people do LOL! I find it easier to compete believeing the judges actually do their jobs, than getting wrapped up in paranoia


the way i look at it is....

if you (or your mates) dont get the placing you think you/they should have got and can look at your physique and quite honestly 100% not see any weaknesses in balance/symmetry/shape/condition then you have a right to make a fuss... but if you can see any weakness whatsoever then so can the judges and they WILL pull you up on it... thats why they are there!


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## luke dutton (Feb 25, 2008)

am gutted i got disqualified from the brit finals.i did a nabba show unknown to me it would disqualify me.i won a place at the lemington spa show


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