# Keto and no carb up?



## silver (Feb 18, 2010)

Does anyone have any experience of going longer than 14 days without a card up on keto. Ive been thinking what effects going like 8 weeks without a carb up would have. I did read up on a study in the early stages of long term keto. These guys were ment to be going 7 months on a ketogenic diet, but I cant find the damn thing to find any update on the study.

Any one got anything on this??


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## jammie2013 (Nov 14, 2013)

Probably the Jacob Wilson study, didn't get published (methodology sucked in favour of keto dieting)

For what it's worth, I've done months of keto at a time, carb creep tends to occur and you lose the beneficial adaptations

Now I'm just keto on rest days, 1g CHO/lb/bw after training


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## Mildo (Feb 11, 2015)

Why do you mean by carb up? The Keto diet involves having less than 50g of carbs per day so that your body goes into ketosis. Though I think you may know that. But, still confused as to what you mean?


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## silver (Feb 18, 2010)

Bump


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## mattyhunt (Dec 12, 2013)

Did Keto for 6 months a while back. Went the first 4 weeks without any carb up periods to adapt to ketosis. I think the only effects of not having a carb up would just be the depleted glycogen affecting your lifting ability.


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## sledgehammer123 (Dec 14, 2013)

Im on Keto/Dave Palumbo diet right now. I went 4 weeks before a carb up. Im against them personally. It can lead to overeating of carbs and takes me too dam long to get back into ketosis, like 4 days. Your fat burning is optimal when your brain is using ketones for fuel.

Glad to see your OK BTW.


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

Cyclical ketogenic diet is just one variety, there is no need to carb up on a well rounded low-carb/ketogenic diet. Your muscle glycogen will replenish normally from phisiological fat, it will never reach same levels as you would do with carb loading, but no matter how much muscle glycogen you spend in one day, it will be restored within 24 hours, it will not reach the same level you would achieve with complex carbs, but it will be sufficient for all practical purposes.

I've been low-carbing for over a year and a half, typical daily carb intake 30-50g, and 'carbing up' happens exclusively at social meals, perhaps once in two months.

IMO, the best energy cheat you can get is coconut oil, 60% MCT, will fuel you up better than carbs, and you are next to guaranteed to be in ketosis, with higher carb treshold.


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## Guest (May 11, 2015)

You don't carb up or refeed on keto. Defeats the purpose.


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## DC1 (May 5, 2014)

As above there is no real need to carb upon Keto.

As long as weight loss continues, why stop it by refeeding to hope for a rebound in metabolism and the risk of a binge setting you back.


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## AJDBodybuilder (Mar 23, 2015)

keto diet = no carb up

cyclical keto diet = planned carb up

I've used the cyclical keto diet during my current contest prep and its worked great. I chose sat and sun as carb up and not only has it offered a psychological benefit, but it allowed me enjoy my weekends without being bound by diet. I believe this approach enables you to achieve your fat loss goals while maintaining optimum muscle mass.


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## Guest (May 14, 2015)

AJDBodybuilder said:


> keto diet = no carb up
> 
> cyclical keto diet = planned carb up
> 
> I've used the cyclical keto diet during my current contest prep and its worked great. I chose sat and sun as carb up and not only has it offered a psychological benefit, but it allowed me enjoy my weekends without being bound by diet. I believe this approach enables you to achieve your fat loss goals while maintaining optimum muscle mass.


The possible issue with cyclical keto is that some people wont burn through their glycogen and actually get back into ketosis by the time their higher carb days come around.

Awesome if you can but it's surely gotta take some trial and error to get your figures right and finding a balance between the length of time between having higher carb days, how many carbs are consumed and how quickly they are used.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

There are three main types of ketogenic diet - the cyclic ketogenic diet where you have a number of days of full keto and then a day of high carb/low fat to replenish glycogen stores, bump up thyroid levels and leptin, then repeat the cycle. Typically CK diets go 4-6 days keto then 1 day carb up and repeat. Best use of this type of diet is when cutting and training very hard.

The there's the targeted ketogenic diet where the aim is to maintain ketosis all the time and those 50gs of carbs daily are all consumed immediately pre- and post-workout, with almost no other carbs at all at other times. Again this diet is best used to support high intensity exercise.

Then there's flat keto where carbs are spread more equally through the day but aimed to be low enough never to leave ketosis. This typically works best when exercise is minimal or not very intense.


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## AJDBodybuilder (Mar 23, 2015)

I cant get into a decent state of keto on 50g carbs per day, I have to go below 15g...I experimented with 4 days very low or zero carb and 3 days reload (or carb up). I discovered that personally 3 days reload failed to drop any body fat the following week, starting the reload from Friday night through until sunday resulted in a circa 1lbs loss, whereas reloading on sat and sun only resulted in anything up to 3lbs weight loss the following week. That's as technical as I went. Carbs in week were indirect from fibrous veg and during weekend any source I like. I limit nothing during reload, 4 crumpets with butter and 2 choc pop tarts covered with peanut butter are a firm favourite breakfast before sat am weight training ;-) Having said that im 8 days out from comp so this weekend is gonna be ****e, no cheats for me boooooooooooooo!!


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## captain pancake (Jan 2, 2015)

Have a read of lyle mcdonalds ultimate diet 2, its basically carb cycling but the most effective form I've tried


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## LocoToro (Mar 4, 2014)

I've been also trying to get into Ketosis although I feel like sitting at 50g per day is more like LCHF than Keto.

But I have a question: I've read that the limit should be 50g per day/30 g per day and I've also read that you should not ingest more than 5g of carbs in any one sitting as this will limit the insulin response. Has anyone heard of this ?

On another note, those of you who are not carb loading try googling Fat Bombs for some Keto friendly treats!!


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

LocoToro said:


> I've been also trying to get into Ketosis although I feel like sitting at 50g per day is more like LCHF than Keto.
> 
> But I have a question: I've read that the limit should be *50g per day/30 g per day *and I've also read that you should not ingest more than 5g of carbs in any one sitting as this will limit the insulin response. Has anyone heard of this ?
> 
> On another note, those of you who are not carb loading try googling Fat Bombs for some Keto friendly treats!!


You must understand these ^^^ are guidelines. Everyone's level of carbs to get in ketosis will be different.

No direct carbs sources.

Use ketostix to test. Found in Boots.


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## DC1 (May 5, 2014)

50g per day will be too high for most to go into Keto IME.

You should aim for no more than 30g per day and less if you can manage.


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## LocoToro (Mar 4, 2014)

Dark sim said:


> You must understand these ^^^ are guidelines. Everyone's level of carbs to get in ketosis will be different.
> 
> No direct carbs sources.
> 
> Use ketostix to test. Found in Boots.


I did think that also. Any opinion on the 5g per sitting or is that broscience?


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## Dark sim (May 18, 2013)

LocoToro said:


> I did think that also. Any opinion on the 5g per sitting or is that broscience?


Haven't heard but is believable.


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## MPWFitness (Sep 22, 2014)

I seem to respond really well to the keto diet without any direct carb sources (basically some indirect carbs from greens, so at best 20g a day) and it worked for me. Last prep I tried refeeds/carb ups etc and frankly it messed everything up. Not just in terms of how I looked, but also mentally then I associated 'carbing up' with 'eating ****'. I had a quick turn around and weight to make for this show so 5 weeks I have zero carbed it and again I am back to leaning right out, I certainly won't be carbing up at all really. What I do have is a serving of say sweet potato once a week just to keep my leptin in check, but that was mainly on the advice of someone I trust. I guess it's pretty individualised, but that's my experience.


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