# Cutting Stack - My Proposal



## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

Hi all,

I've recently been thinking of putting together a cutting stack. I've pm'd a few of the more experienced members here

who have given me their input and so far I have come up with the following but I have a few concerns that I'll address shortly.

*The Intended Cycle*

Weeks 1,2 - Clen, Yohimbine, Dexaprine, Enalapril

Weeks 3,4 - ECA, Yohimbine, Dexaprine, Enalapril

Weeks 5,6,7,8 - Clean

And then repeat.

The Clen I'm planning on starting at 80mcg and then uping it by 40mcg on Mondays and Thursdays. This means for the last 4 days

in the 2nd week I'll be doing 200mcg.

The ECA stack will be homemade using ChestEze, Caffeine and Aspirin. I'll be using 1 ChestEze, 3 Pro Plus and 1 Aspirin three times per day.

The first dose will be in the morning, the second dose 4 hours later and the third dose another 4 hours later.

*The Concerns*

Now my first concern is that can Yohimbine be stacked with ECA safely? I'm also playing with the idea of using Rauwolscine (Alpha-T2) instead

as I've read it's basically Yohimbine without all the nasties. In all fairness I've used Yohimbine before and felt no side effects what so ever.

My second concern which is the bigger one is that can Dexaprine be stacked with ECA? Both are stimulants and from what I've heard Dexaprine

is pretty strong so the last thing I want is a heart attack lol :lol:


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Web have already chatted about this at length. :lol: However this is a new combination of compounds...

My main concern is that you don't really need the yohimbine and dexaprine at the same time, you can only have a certain number of receptors you can hit, and you are likely to overstimulate them and shut them down earlier, or just not get value for money as the additional compounds may not give you anything extra.

Even swapping yohimbine for rauwolscine will only reduce the side effects, not mean you necessarily get more bang for your buck.

If you want to hit both alpha and beta receptors at the same time then I would run either the yohimbine or the dexaprine. In my opinion no need for both. My personal choice would be the dexaprine.

Good luck and let us know how it all goes.

:thumb:


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

DiggyV said:


> Web have already chatted about this at length. :lol: However this is a new combination of compounds...
> 
> My main concern is that you don't really need the yohimbine and dexaprine at the same time, you can only have a certain number of receptors you can hit, and you are likely to overstimulate them and shut them down earlier, or just not get value for money as the additional compounds may not give you anything extra.
> 
> ...


I just cant't seem to make up my mind Diggy LOL. This must be the 4th or 5th time I've gone back and fourth and and changed this stack LOL.

Does Yohimbine and Dexaprine hit the same receptors mate? I thought they worked differently hence why a lot of people stack Alpha-T2 with Dex.

I take it running Yohimbine or Dex with ECA is fine as well mate and won't induce death :lol:


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Contest said:


> I just cant't seem to make up my mind Diggy LOL. This must be the 4th or 5th time I've gone back and fourth and and changed this stack LOL.
> 
> Does Yohimbine and Dexaprine hit the same receptors mate? I thought they worked differently hence why a lot of people stack Alpha-T2 with Dex.
> 
> I take it running Yohimbine or Dex with ECA is fine as well mate and won't induce death :lol:


Yes they both hit the same receptors. Have Pm'd you a reply to yours again :lol:

The reason that people, including me, have run Rauwolscine (the main ingredient in Alpha-T2) is that it is more targetted than Yohimbine, has a better IC50 value (ie weight for weight more efficient at binding to the A2 receptor than Yoh), and has fewer sides aprticularly around teh anxiety. However as Eph hits both the Beta and Alpha receptors, and Yoh/Rauwolscine hits alphas, as does the 1,3 DMMA in Dex and it will either over stimulate you or you may not get the full effects of both (sort of 1+2+2=3), and you will be just wasting money. As an aside: on Dex it is labelled 1,3 DiMethylPhenylAmine - which doesn't exist - speaking with iForce is it actually 1,3 DMAA just mislabelled.

Running them side by side should be alright, but I would check it by ramping up the Dex slowly and see how you react. You'll probably be shaking like a sh*tting dog, and if you aren't you are either very stim tolerant, or something is under-dosed.

Have fun. :thumb:


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

DiggyV said:


> Yes they both hit the same receptors. Have Pm'd you a reply to yours again :lol:
> 
> The reason that people, including me, have run Rauwolscine (the main ingredient in Alpha-T2) is that it is more targetted than Yohimbine, has a better IC50 value (ie weight for weight more efficient at binding to the A2 receptor than Yoh), and has fewer sides aprticularly around teh anxiety. However as Eph hits both the Beta and Alpha receptors, and Yoh/Rauwolscine hits alphas, as does the 1,3 DMMA in Dex and it will either over stimulate you or you may not get the full effects of both (sort of 1+2+2=3), and you will be just wasting money. As an aside: on Dex it is labelled 1,3 DiMethylPhenylAmine - which doesn't exist - speaking with iForce is it actually 1,3 DMAA just mislabelled.
> 
> ...


Cheers for the helpful reply Diggy 

Is over-stimulation really that much of a problem though mate. As ECA takes a shotgun approach as in by which I mean it hits quite a few receptors in a general sense, I thought stacking

it with Rauwolscine and Dex wouldn't pose too much of a problem?

If over-stimulation is indeed a problem though, would it be viable to do the following in your opinion...

Weeks 1,2 - Clen, Alpha-T2, Dexaprine, Enalapril

Weeks 3,4 - ECA, Alpha-T2, Enalapril

Weeks 5,6,7,8 - Clean

Also, would you say running 2 tabs of Dex is overkill? I was thinking one in the morning on an empty stomach at roughly 9am and the other 6 hours later at 5pm?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Contest said:


> Cheers for the helpful reply Diggy
> 
> Is over-stimulation really that much of a problem though mate. As ECA takes a shotgun approach as in by which I mean it hits quite a few receptors in a general sense, I thought stacking
> 
> ...


Its just that more may not actually mean more, and you may just be wasting money for no additional benefit.

As far as 2 tabs of Dex is concerned, given that for me it had a half life of. 8-9 hours then assuming you take 1 at 7am and 1 at 3pm (and I wouldn't want to take one later than 3 as sleep was a problem if I did) then calculating back on half life the second tablet would effectively give you 1.6 tablets running around your system. My experience was that at 1.5 tablets my resting heart rate some 2 hours after taking them, was 150! I really wouldn't want clen and yohimbine or even rauwolscine in the mix at that point as well. :lol:


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

DiggyV said:


> Its just that more may not actually mean more, and you may just be wasting money for no additional benefit.
> 
> As far as 2 tabs of Dex is concerned, given that for me it had a half life of. 8-9 hours then assuming you take 1 at 7am and 1 at 3pm (and I wouldn't want to take one later than 3 as sleep was a problem if I did) then calculating back on half life the second tablet would effectively give you 1.6 tablets running around your system. My experience was that at 1.5 tablets my resting heart rate some 2 hours after taking them, was 150! I really wouldn't want clen and yohimbine or even rauwolscine in the mix at that point as well. :lol:


LOL I've got a feeling I'm going to overdose on stimulants when this cycle starts :lol:

How would you compare ECA to Dexaprine then mate? Which in your opinion is more effective?

What would you say to this cycle then....

Weeks 1,2 - Clen, Alpha-T2, Dexaprine, Enalapril

Weeks 3,4 - Alpha-T2, Dexaprine, Enalapril

Weeks 5,6,7,8 - Clean

That way the Clen hit's the Beta-2 receptors for 2 weeks and the Alpha-T2 and Dexaprine can hit the Alpha's for 4 weeks.

Trying to build the perfect stack is giving me a headache now LOL.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Contest said:


> LOL I've got a feeling I'm going to overdose on stimulants when this cycle starts :lol:
> 
> How would you compare ECA to Dexaprine then mate? Which in your opinion is more effective?
> 
> ...


I still get the feeling that you are going to ve over stimmed! :lol:

I know you want to lose the weight, but if I remember rightly it is about 2% body fat we are talking about, so why not spend a little longer at it. The critical part will be how you react to the Dex. If you react like I did, then personally I wouldn't want Clen on my hands as well. If it was me, and when I started down tis route I had a hell of a lot more than 2% to lose (I am at 16% lost and counting right now  ), then I would run as follows:

Week 1,2: Clen, Alpha-T2

Week 3,4: AlphaT-2, Dex

Week 5,6: Dex

Week 7,8,9,10: break and relax, and stop shaking :lol:

Yes, this will give you 6 weeks on the alpha stims, but this is how I ran them and got the best results to date.

Hope this helps, but somehow I doubt it. PMSL


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

Even by dropping the ECA you think I'll be over-stimulated LMAO :lol:

I've never really been prone to stimulants mate. I've taken NO-Xplode, Jack3d, currently taking Yohimbine and it does nothing to me LOL. I drink double Espresso once or twice

a week and that does bugger all as well. I know Dexaprine is supposed to be on a completely different level but I've got a feeling it'll just give me a mild buzz :tongue:

If we take stimulation out of the question, do you think my previous cycle will be ok or will over-saturation still be problem?

Currently on 160mcg of Clen and 20mg of Yohimbine as well and the only sides I'm getting are cramps in my feet and hips LOL. No shaking or anything like that.

I like your 6 week cycle but I'd rather do 4 weeks on and 4 weeks off mate just to keep things simple.

Your post did indeed help mate LOL :thumb:


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

f**K me Contest.. you must under 2% by now... never met anyone take more stims...

personally.... DNP+T3.... and Eph just to get the energy to move.... LOL nothing beats DNP for fat loss.. and I mean F**King nothing...

to much dicking around here with compound that all affect BP and HR far to much..... for so little pay off...


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## L00NEY (Feb 22, 2010)

ausbuilt said:


> f**K me Contest.. you must under 2% by now... never met anyone take more stims...
> 
> personally.... DNP+T3.... and Eph just to get the energy to move.... LOL nothing beats DNP for fat loss.. and I mean F**King nothing...
> 
> to much dicking around here with compound that all affect BP and HR far to much..... for so little pay off...


pretty much sums it up .. to the OP make sure you get some eph + caffeine down you because dnp without it is bloody awful as its an energy zapper


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

ausbuilt said:


> f**K me Contest.. you must under 2% by now... never met anyone take more stims...
> 
> personally.... DNP+T3.... and Eph just to get the energy to move.... LOL nothing beats DNP for fat loss.. and I mean F**King nothing...
> 
> to much dicking around here with compound that all affect BP and HR far to much..... for so little pay off...


LOL You'd think so mate. I'm only on T3, Clen and Yohimbine at the moment :whistling:

That proposal I'm suggesting above is something I want to do in the middle of my blast just to stay consistantly lean through the year.

It's funny you mention DNP mate. After our convo last night I was considoring it and doing some further reading about the compound. I want to run it but

I can't get over the adverse effects of muscle flatness and water retention. It's supposed to be very pronounced and I don't really want to be looking like

sh1t for a couple of weeks. That'll just depress me :lol:

I have to say though DNP is tempting me hard. How would the results vary if I ran it for 200mg for 4 weeks, compared to 400mg for 2 weeks?


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

Contest said:


> That proposal I'm suggesting above is something I want to do in the middle of my blast just to stay consistantly lean through the year.
> 
> counterproductive.. blast is for mass.. really pulling the body in two different ways this way..
> 
> ...


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## Fatstuff (Mar 2, 2010)

Contest, dnp sides are minimal with 200mg a day and low carbs, if ur worried about the flatness as opposed to all the jittery heart rate sh1t on ur stims lol, ur daft - dnp is an amazing compound and i will always run it at a low dose as i hate sides. I will use it again when i got a little room in the budget for it.


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

Damn, I thought I had my stack all sorted but you guys have confused me again now LOL.

I agree that DNP would be the best compound to run for what I want and maybe it might just

be worth looking like **** for a few weeks as the end result makes it worth it like Aus mentioned 

Is the bloating and flatness as bad on 200mg compared to running it at higher doses?

*Edit:*

This is what my stimulant cutting cycle looks like at the moment. It's been modified after talking to Aus and Diggy :thumb:

Week 1,2: Clen, Alpha-T2, Dex

Week 3,4: Alpha-T2, Dex

Week 5,6: ECA

Week 7,8,9,10 - Clean

And then repeat.


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## Fatstuff (Mar 2, 2010)

lol, its a nothing side effect, stop thinkin about it - if u have got muscles big enough for it to be noticeable, then u will still look better than 90% of the population, even when flat


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

The only the reason I think about it is because the way people describe it is literally like you deflate completely and don't even look like you workout :lol:

What is it with DNP that causes this water retention and muscle flatness?

Can never seem to find decent logs with before, during and after pictures either which doesn't help.


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## kreig (May 12, 2008)

Contest said:


> The only the reason I think about it is because the way people describe it is literally like you deflate completely and don't even look like you workout :lol:
> 
> What is it with DNP that causes this water retention and muscle flatness?
> 
> Can never seem to find decent logs with before, during and after pictures either which doesn't help.


The muscle flatness is caused by the fact DNP just chews up glycogen so your muscles are pretty much constantly empty.


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

blitz2163 said:


> The muscle flatness is caused by the fact DNP just chews up glycogen so your muscles are pretty much constantly empty.


Does muscle flatness just literally mean they appear smaller in size?


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