# DNP + Ketosis



## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

After having bulked, I am wondering whether trying DNP + ketosis. The increased energy expenditure plus muscle-sparing properties of ketosis (to an extent) appear to be a no-brainer. Don't think it can be that easy, however.

Has anyone tried a Dnp+keto or dnp+ water fast protocol?


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## superdrol (Aug 9, 2012)

Doesn't dnp need carbs to work?? Someone on here of late had dropped carbs low, ended up having hypos and generally feeling crap due to lack of carbs, possibly not the best idea if it does need carbs for its modus operandi


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Not last time I checked - short answer

Carb on DNP make the sweating horrific and hamper the actual fat loss - long answer

Problem is, last time I checked the schools of thought were still pretty much divided on this.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

I know nothing about DNP but keto isn't magically muscle sparing.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Ultrasonic said:


> I know nothing about DNP but keto isn't magically muscle sparing.


 No, of course. However, if compared to a standard low-calorie diet, ketosis is supposed to be more muscle-friendly.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Dark_Ansem said:


> No, of course. However, if compared to a standard low-calorie diet, ketosis is supposed to be more muscle-friendly.


 I would suggest the evidence doesn't really back this up.

Have a read through this series of articles when you have time:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/comparing-the-diets-part-1.html/


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## 66983 (May 30, 2016)

DNP plus any sort of water restriction is just down right dangerous.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Sparkey said:


> DNP plus any sort of water restriction is just down right dangerous.


 Water restriction? I didn't say that.

Water fast = water only "diet", ie fasting.


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## 66983 (May 30, 2016)

I've already got my DNP and T3 ready for my cut later this year and I certainly will be having complex carbs and plenty of fruit.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Sparkey said:


> I've already got my DNP and T3 ready for my cut later this year and I certainly will be having complex carbs and plenty of fruit.


 My problem is that I've only used DNP with carbs and I sweat horribly and tend to lose muscle.


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## Eddias (Dec 21, 2015)

everything I read Carbs and DNP = Major Heat and sweats, I get the idea of eating plenty of fruit, Veg and water as DNP seems to be harsh on the body.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Eddias said:


> everything I read Carbs and DNP = Major Heat and sweats, I get the idea of eating plenty of fruit, Veg and water as DNP seems to be harsh on the body.


 It is. Very harsh. Electrolytes are also required most of the time.


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## Quackerz (Dec 19, 2015)

Dark_Ansem said:


> After having bulked, I am wondering whether trying DNP + ketosis. The increased energy expenditure plus muscle-sparing properties of ketosis (to an extent) appear to be a no-brainer. Don't think it can be that easy, however.
> 
> Has anyone tried a Dnp+keto or dnp+ water fast protocol?


 DNP is not muscle wasting, no need for magic diets.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Quackerz said:


> DNP is not muscle wasting, no need for magic diets.


 I hardly define keto as magic.

And while DNP is not muscle wasting, it's not muscle sparing if used incorrectly.


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## Quackerz (Dec 19, 2015)

Dark_Ansem said:


> I hardly define keto as magic.
> 
> And while DNP is not muscle wasting, it's not muscle sparing if used incorrectly.


 Don't use it incorrectly then.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Quackerz said:


> Don't use it incorrectly then.


 Such wisdom.


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## Quackerz (Dec 19, 2015)

Dark_Ansem said:


> Such wisdom.


 People don't refer to me as 'the pearl' for no reason.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

More like "the oyster"


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dark_Ansem said:


> I hardly define keto as magic.
> 
> And while DNP is not muscle wasting, it's not muscle sparing if used incorrectly.


 DNP is muscle sparing, generally though.

As for whether a keto diet works or not, this is totally down to the individual. Some feel better with no carbs, some feel like s**t without them. I'm definitely the latter, can't be doing without carbs or I just feel like I'm going hypo all the time, I'd rather put up with a bit of heat after eating than feel like that. Also, fruit carbs (fructose) produce significantly less heat than normal carbs, since they're still used to top up liver glycogen rather than being wasted as heat.

As for a water fast on DNP - don't do that. You need electrolytes, vitamins and minerals on DNP because you sweat so much, just drinking water won't be enough to keep you hydrated. In fact, given the massive deficit that would be created by a water fast, I'd be much more inclined to just run T3 for metabolic stabilisation and a little boost, which will have you feeling MUCH better than a DNP cycle and you'll still get brilliant results - for example, if you ran, say, 50mcg of T3, your TDEE was bumped up to 3500, and you water fasted for 7 days, that's obviously a deficit of 3500 a day, meaning around 7lbs of fat loss per week if muscle is maintained with PEDs. That's ridiculous progress. Just to add, though, that maintaining muscle on a water fast is going to be incredibly difficult regardless of what you're taking. Taking amino acid supps will help, mind.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dark_Ansem said:


> My problem is that I've only used DNP with carbs and I sweat horribly and tend to lose muscle.


 Yeah, as I said above mate, it's not the carbs doing that. In fact, you'll be even flatter on no carbs at all. Taking T3 and clen with DNP can actually help maintain muscle as well (T3 really isn't as catabolic as people make out and basically isn't catabolic at all when you take it with AAS, in fact it's mildy anabolic in some cases).


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

I'mNotAPervert! said:


> DNP is muscle sparing, generally though.
> 
> As for whether a keto diet works or not, this is totally down to the individual. Some feel better with no carbs, some feel like s**t without them. I'm definitely the latter, can't be doing without carbs or I just feel like I'm going hypo all the time, I'd rather put up with a bit of heat after eating than feel like that. Also, fruit carbs (fructose) produce significantly less heat than normal carbs, since they're still used to top op liver glycogen rather than being wasted as heat.
> 
> As for a water fast, don't do that. You need electrolytes, vitamins and minerals on DNP because you sweat so much, just drinking water won't be enough to keep you hydrated. In fact, given the massive deficit that would be created by a water fast, I'd be much more inclined to just run T3 for metabolic stabilisation and a little boost, which will have you feeling MUCH better than a DNP cycle and you'll still get brilliant results - for example, if you ran, say, 50mcg of T3, your TDEE was bumped up to 3500, and you water fasted for 7 days, that's obviously a deficit of 3500 a day, meaning around 7lbs of fat loss per week if muscle is maintained with PEDs. That's ridiculous progress.


 Ah, this is the answer I was looking for.

I did a water fast for 4 days. I definitely don't enjoy it but I thought worse.

I'm not going to do a PED cycle while fasting - I also get your point of having to eat enough protein while on DNP.


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