# do fat burners work?



## siggyn24 (Apr 26, 2011)

hi guys am thinking of getting some fat burners but not sure if they work and not sure which ones to go for?been told cla's are good,any [email protected] :confused1:


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Fat burners can help, but only as part of a calorie restricted diet and exercise routine... have seen many people over the years on forums looking to bulk up and over eat, but think that at the same time by adding a fat burning supplement they will also lean up at the same time. Never gonna happen, lol.

I would look at three over the counter fat burning supplements -

*Green Tea Extract (GTE)*

Works well to raise metabolic rate and is also a strong antioxidant that offers other health benefits. Ideally use a GTE that has caffiene.

*Conjugated Linoleic Acid (CLA)*

A fatty acid which stimulates lipolysis/fat burning. There are several isomers/types of CLA that occur in nature, and only one kind actually has fat burning capabilities... but some dodgy CLA supps use the wrong CLA isomers. You want one which specifically states that it uses the 'trans 10, cis 12' isomer.

*Acetyl L Carnitine (ALCAR)*

An acetyl amino acid which increases the enzymes which burn bodyfat rather than glycogen during exercise.

There are other good supps, but those in my view are the most effective over the counter, easily available, and not too expensive ones.


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## myles (Sep 27, 2006)

What is your opinion on Caffeine, Dtlv74?


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## Hera (May 6, 2011)

I use lean system 7. It's hard to tell how much of an affect they have but I certainly notice getting a lot hotter during workouts so I see that as a sign of boosted metabolism. Only issue now though is that if I don't take it I'm very tried! I've very quickly adapted to the caffeine.


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## myles (Sep 27, 2006)

How much Caffiene were you using? Or was it in the Lean System 7? I was using 400mg 3 times daily, and I was a little........skittish at times, shall we say!! Didnt stay on it because I had a heavy cold, and I seemed to suffer from shortness of breath, tight chest when spinning, couldnt be sure if that was the cold or the caffeine so I took steps. Plan to get back on it for 7 weeks now, when it is posted out to me.


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

I would agree with the above and add that, fat burners need to perform 3 roles (in my opinion) to be of any use in a dietary restriction phase:

1. Anorectic effect (appetite suppression), this will ultimately 'make or break' the diet, if you're not in a calorie deficit, you won't reduce bodyfat appreciably. Overeating through hunger, lowered carbohydrates etc will destroy any dietary/cardio efforts.

2. Reduce fatigue - it has been said before that 'a calorie deficit is a recovery deficit', the body will fight (through homeostasis) to reduce energy expenditure in a calorie deficit. if you're less active, you won't expend as much energy, slowing weight loss. Fat burners often contain stimulants (e.g. Caffeine, yohimbine, 1-3, dimethylalamine) that'll offset this effect. Stimulants also contribute to the appetite suppression.

3. Thermogenesis - if the compounds increase basal and/or indirectly affect metabolic rate (most do not), this can contribute to daily energy expenditure.

I would agree that tolerance to stimulants is built quickly, in which case using only in the last stages of a cutting phase is the best protocol.

My favourite compound is alpha yohimbine, it targets a2-receptors in adipose tissue (stubborn body fat), has less heart cardiovascular issues than other stimulants (raised blood pressure, tachycardia etc) and elevates mood through MAO inhibition (so you feel great  ).

Hope this helps.


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## Sionnach (Apr 19, 2010)

Get some DNP, you wont know what hit u!


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## Hera (May 6, 2011)

myles said:


> How much Caffiene were you using? Or was it in the Lean System 7? I was using 400mg 3 times daily, and I was a little........skittish at times, shall we say!! Didnt stay on it because I had a heavy cold, and I seemed to suffer from shortness of breath, tight chest when spinning, couldnt be sure if that was the cold or the caffeine so I took steps. Plan to get back on it for 7 weeks now, when it is posted out to me.


The caffeine is in the Lean System 7. I initially had 2 capsules in the morning and then upped it to 2 in the afternoon as well but am back to 2 again because I was getting headaches and attributed it to the caffeine. I've also tried thermabol but it didn't seem to have the same affect on me...yet it had more of an effect on my partner...I guess different things for different people.


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## robzombie (Dec 28, 2009)

rippedgreg said:


> Get some DNP, you wont know what hit u!


Is this stuff good then,it's a non stim product aswell.


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## md49vd (Apr 28, 2011)

what is the number 1 fat burner product on the market today?

and has anyone heard of G-Force Extreme Fat Burner? opinions?


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## Replicator (Apr 4, 2009)

yes

T3 and Clen together and thers is always EPH 25's

Rep


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

rippedgreg said:


> Get some DNP, you wont know what hit u!


You could also die quite easily  I'd stick with mild stuff first.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

myles said:


> What is your opinion on Caffeine, Dtlv74?


Personally I can't use it as I'm pretty sensitive and in doses required for fat burning it almost invariably gives me a migraine... but in general sense it's well regarded by many and I think pretty good if you don't get a bad reaction to it.

Certainly in trials it does increase fat oxidation during exercise, whilst at the same time not reducing glycogen metabolism. This suggests that caffiene pre exercise causes more calories to be burned during the session and those calories come from bodyfat which is all good


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

Dtlv74 said:


> Personally I can't use it as I'm pretty sensitive and in doses required for fat burning it almost invariably gives me a migraine... but in general sense it's well regarded by many and I think pretty good if you don't get a bad reaction to it.
> 
> Certainly in trials it does increase fat oxidation during exercise, whilst at the same time not reducing glycogen metabolism. This suggests that caffiene pre exercise causes more calories to be burned during the session and those calories come from bodyfat which is all good


Do you get the same effects with Alpha Yohimbine Dtlv74?


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## crashcusion (Feb 14, 2010)

a good eca stack is batter than any fat burner i haven't used fat burners but have used eca and the results speak for them selves


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

UKStrength said:


> Do you get the same effects with Alpha Yohimbine Dtlv74?


Am not super clued up on Yohimbine, but from what I understand it does increase lipolysis, although I'm not sure how glycogen metabolism is effected.

Yohimbine works differently to caffiene in that it primarily affects the alpha cell receptors that noradrenaline and adrenalin work on, whilst caffiene primarily raises those hormones but doesn't so much affect the receptors... this might mean that caffiene and yohimbine could stack well.


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

Dtlv74 said:


> Am not super clued up on Yohimbine, but from what I understand it does increase lipolysis, although I'm not sure how glycogen metabolism is effected.
> 
> Yohimbine works differently to caffiene in that it primarily affects the alpha cell receptors that noradrenaline and adrenalin work on, whilst caffiene primarily raises those hormones but doesn't so much affect the receptors... this might mean that caffiene and yohimbine could stack well.


That's a classic stack you've mentioned there, and you're completely correct in that the two are very synergistic.

I was more wondering how you, yourself tolerated it considering you don't react well to caffeine? The alpha isomer of yohimbine has all the benefits of yohimbine hcl (alpha adrenergic receptor agonism). However, it works more on dopaminergic upregulation through MAOI than norepinephrine, so mood enhancement and appetite suppression is far stronger than the original.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

UKStrength said:


> That's a classic stack you've mentioned there, and you're completely correct in that the two are very synergistic.
> 
> I was more wondering how you, yourself tolerated it considering you don't react well to caffeine? The alpha isomer of yohimbine has all the benefits of yohimbine hcl (alpha adrenergic receptor agonism). However, it works more on dopaminergic upregulation through MAOI than norepinephrine, so mood enhancement and appetite suppression is far stronger than the original.


Thanks that's good info. Have not actually tried or looked at many fat burners in great detail, but that's a stack I'd probably try if it came to it as the rationale seems pretty sound to me.

I like your three point approach to fat burning supp's mentioned a few posts up btw- mood enhancement/energy levels and appetite suppression are in some ways probably as important as the increased lipolytic effect in fat burner supp's, but are aspects that sometimes get overlooked.


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## Replicator (Apr 4, 2009)

crashcusion said:


> a good eca stack is batter than any fat burner i haven't used fat burners but have used eca and the results speak for them selves


EPH 25's is an ECA stack and what are they if not fat burners 

REP


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## RickMiller (Aug 21, 2009)

Dtlv74 said:


> Thanks that's good info. Have not actually tried or looked at many fat burners in great detail, but that's a stack I'd probably try if it came to it as the rationale seems pretty sound to me.
> 
> I like your three point approach to fat burning supp's mentioned a few posts up btw- mood enhancement/energy levels and appetite suppression are in some ways probably as important as the increased lipolytic effect in fat burner supp's, but are aspects that sometimes get overlooked.


No problem, hopefully it provides someone with food for thought.

It's a very effective stack that I've used many a time, I respond very poorly to 1-3, Dimethylalamine so Yohimbine is my stimulant of choice.


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