# Log attempt n



## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

I've tried this countless times, but never really stuck to it - but really got to get my act together. I'm sick of being the age I am and looking the way I do.

So, background: I'm 31, 13.5 stone, training 7 years. Trying to loose a bit of my gut then plan to bulk up. Have two injuries - lower back (now mostly under control) and neck (only recently stopped giving me bother after injuring it doing military presses last June).

I'm currently following this diet:

Protein : 285 g

Carbs: 100/70g (training/non-training)

Calories : 2850

And my routine looks like this:

Monday: weights (8 reps, 4 sets)

Tuesday: HIIT 10 mins

Wednesday: weights (12 reps, 3 sets)

Thursday: HIIT 15 mins

Friday: circuits - as many reps as possible in 4 exercises x 3

Saturday: HIIT 20 mins

I've lost 1 stone on this (since August) then I stopped the intensity as my neck started getting sore again. Hopefully the fact that it hasn't given me much bother since December is a good sign I won't be hindered by it.

Haven't been to the gym in the past week due to a cold; but going to get back on this tomorrow. Last time I was in the gym I was pushing the same weights I was before my injury - and I'm 1 stone lighter now.

There's some pics in my profile - will take some new ones to mark the start of this log.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

hey dude have you tried seated military press might be a bit safer for you.


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## Guest (Feb 17, 2008)

can u tell us more about your injuries?


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

crazycal1 -

I dunno about seated; I've avoided seated presses as I thought it would be putting too much pressure on my lower back and therefore bad for my other injury! Maybe this is not true though? I've started overhead pressing with dumbbells again - just light though, 2 x 10kgs - so far it's going OK.

scottswald -

yes I can. Lower back injury was 5 years ago. I was deadlifting, didn't know the right form, trying to lift too much and had just spent the morning moving PCs up and down floors at work. I just felt a twinge, but a week later it was very sore. It flared up every 6 months or so, went to the physio for a month or two (luckily work pay for my Bupa membership...) and it went away. But as I said, after trying to get back into my old routine it just came back every 6 months. So I read this article on T-nation.com about how to train if you sit at a computer all day. As a result, I changed my routine - I don't back squat or deadlift with a barbell; I do front squats and single legged deads with dumbbells. I also added rack pulls to my routine - great for getting me to bend at the waist only during day-to-day activity.

Neck injury was last year. I was doing military presses - my normal weight, only I hadn't been training that much in 6 months. On my second set, I suddenly felt weaker on one side. Didn't think anything of it and ploughed on into a third set. Came home later and got into bed and felt pain and extreme tightness in my upper back, on the left. This lasted about a week but must have pulled something in my neck as thats what left me with the neck injury. It sounds more painful that it is. But I was really worried about it. It's been on and off since and I can't work out why - could be just that I'm using my neck all the time (whereas with my lower back, I could at least rest it).

I consider my lower back injury "under control" in that I know what to avoid and the warning signs of it flaring up again. But I'm not that confident with my neck. It hasn't given me much bother so far this year, which is good - but I don't know why. I would prefer to understand why first and I'd have more confidence to hit heavier weights in the gym.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

seated press defo takes the stress of your back.

its also worth remembering that its hard to progress on lots of exercises at once-in fact you cant for long..

so i reckon(and its what i`m currently doing)is to just do presses at a maintainance level as you are.

keep it light for a few months with highish reps and see where you can go from there...do you do any stretching cos it`ll help injury proof your back no end.

are one legged deads exactley what they sound to be?

to me they sound as if they`d twist my back,but hey if they work for you...

i guess you could class my partial deads as rack pulls and i reckon theyre great for strenghtening the lower back too.

lets hope you have a good training cycle mate!


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Yeah - I'm stretching my back at least once a day and always before and after workouts. Also find that some work with a foam roller is helping.

Neck stretches are a different thing though - I think the ones my physio gave me made it worse. Perhaps I was just doing them too often.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

coolio!

thats possible mate-

i also gotta say ive been given awful advice by alsorts of experts in the past so i`d just go with what feels ok and see what you can learn yourself.

ive had neck probs before and stretching beyond the tight point did no good for me.


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## CMinOZ (Apr 13, 2007)

BigAndyJ

Good luck with the log mate, it'll help keep you honest and get you in the gym when you're supposed to!!!

CMinOZ


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Thanks for the encouragement CMinOZ.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Right, got back to the gym tonight. Got a good pump in my back, shoulders and biceps. This is what I did - all 8x4:

front squat 40 kg

reverse ab crunch

front dumbbell rotations 2x8kg

bicep curls 2x12kg

split squats with rear leg on bench (bodyweight only)

single leg deads 2x8kg

dumbbell shoulder press (palms forward) 2x10kg

one armed dumbbell rows 1x10kg

And this is what I ate today:

Porridge, 50g protein shake, coffee (breakfast)

Orange juice, half a carton of lentil soup, packet of ham, small cube of cheese, coffee (lunch)

30g protein shake (afternoon snack)

Chicken curry (1.5 chicken breasts, low-fat recpie), brocolli, coffee, er 1 chocolate bar (at least I'm being honest) (dinner)

50g protein shake (post-workout)

50g protein shake (pre-bed)

Wasn't at all strict with my diet today, as you can see... Will need to sort it out this week.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Just 12 mins of HIIT - 30s sprint, 90s walk - tonight.

Diet pretty much the same as yesterday - only without the chocolate.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

good one bud i nearly posted up the suggestion of a walk while you were ill.


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## Pikey1466867920 (Apr 24, 2004)

100gram of carbs per day and dropped a stone since August, are you sure about that 100gram - I think I'd have waisted away by now? Try half an hour walking a day great for burning fat in my opinion better than HIT

Good idea on the journal mate, I ought to get more serious about mine again


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Pikey - I haven't been on that literally since August. It's been on and off, when I get into my training.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Right, well talk about jinxing yourself...

Contrary to what I said in my first post - it seems I haven't got my lower back problem under control...

After my HIIT on Tuesday, I felt very slightly tight in my lower back on Wednesday so I didn't go to the gym - nothing unusual though. On Thursday I felt fine. Did my warm up (a 3 min walk and some stretching) then went to the rack to do rack pulls. I had loaded the bar with 2 x10kg and was setting up the plastic step-up thing when I stood up and got a shooting pain horizontally across the middle of my back. I haven't had that for well over a year now. So stupid me ignores it - does one set of rack pulls - then decides to do some HIIT instead. Felt fine during that, went home - went to shave and bang comes the shooting back pain again. So I took some ibuprofen and spent the rest of the evening on my side in bed with an ice pack.

Next morning I was getting ready to go to work and putting my socks on and back came the shooting pain. So I took the day off and spent it lying down.

Have more or less spent the weekend lying down too. Haven't had any re-occurrence of the pain (then again I got the wife to put my socks on LOL). I don't feel any other pain (well my neck ain't so great either - just a dull ache though).

I've got an appointment with the doctor tomorrow first thing. Dunno if they'll refer me to a physio or not.

Its pissed me off - I thought I knew all the warning signs, but I don't think I got any this time.

So I think I'll be off the weights for at least a month (if my memory serves me well)...


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

Andy mate you could very well have Sciatica.A mate of mine who's a trucker has it bad.It was brought on following a car crash which compressed his lower back.And every time he engages lower back muscles in the gym,shooting pain's run accross his back and down his left leg.Hopefully the doc pinpoint's this and you can get sorted out.

Sciatica - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Pikey1466867920 (Apr 24, 2004)

Life conspires against us at times, sorry to hear about your back mate. when you're back's upto it try some brisk walking its a good fat burner I was an hour each day from about eight weeks out from a show. A much less joint impact than any HIT work.


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## FAT BOY (Dec 19, 2005)

as hard as it is m8 you have to think positive try to keep your food intake clean . oh and listen to your body next time lol


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Gazz - think you could be right about the sciatica - had it all week. Not really sore - just very unconfortable at times.

Fat boy - I have been listening to my body, this just came out of nowhere.

Anyways, a week later and I think this might just have been a passing pull. At least that's what the doctor said. Apart from the sciatica I haven't had any pain at all since the weekend. Have had some tightness in my lower back so going to start stretching it a couple of times a day and head to the gym tomorrow. Will just stick to cardio and stretching for the first week though, see how it goes.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

you ever tried accupressure/triggerpoint thereapy for you back-

it loosens mine off a treat(for a while lol) in conjunction with stretching.

doctors and backs......:jerkit:


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Couldn't handle acupuncture! LOL

Well, been at the gym three times now since - for just a light sprints.

Plan is to start back into my old routine next time - but light weights and light sprints only though. Should be back on Thursday.


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

BigAndyJ said:


> Couldn't handle acupuncture! LOL
> 
> Well, been at the gym three times now since - for just a light sprints.
> 
> Plan is to start back into my old routine next time - but light weights and light sprints only though. Should be back on Thursday.


Don't rush yourself though,easy does it.Avoid any quick jerks of your lower back and try avoid doing anything that puts exessive pressure on the Sciatic.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Well, went back this evening.

Feel fine.

Took it easy of course. 5 min warm up, some stretching. Then front squats with just 10kgs, reverse crunches, incline bench (2x10kg), bicep curls (2x10kg), dumbbell shoulder presses (2x8kg), bent over one arm rows (2x7kg).

Skipped the Hungarian split squats and single legged deads in my routine - just to take it easy.

So if I can keep this up for a week, hopefully it means my recent back bout was just a blip.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Back again today - feeling like the smallest guy there...

Did the following - everything 12 reps, 3 sets; also every 2 exercises are paired so I do one set of the first exercise, then rest, then do first set of the second, rest, then second set of the first exercise, rest, second set of the second exercise, rest,...

rack pulls - 20kg (no back pain this time!)

sit ups

steps ups - 2 x12kg

hammer curls - 2 x 12kg

db shoulder external rotation - 2 x 8kg

db pullovers - 12kg

db flyes 2 x 10 kg

calf raises

Usually its step ups paired with cable rows, but I felt an odd twinge-like thing on my lower back on the left, on the first set, so decided to swap these for hammer curls. Trying to get some size on my biceps as they're not much bigger than my forearms. Other than that, it was a full normal workout, just going a bit easy on the upper body exercises.

Ok, now for diet - please, all comments on this welcome as I think my diet's probably shite...

Breakfast - porridge, protein shake (40g), coffee

Lunch - chicken soup, packet of ham, coffee

Afternoon - protein shake (40g)

Dinner - steak, veg, coffee

Post workout - protein shake (40g)

Pre-bed - protein shake (40g)


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

Ok, now for diet - please, all comments on this welcome as I think my diet's probably shite...

Breakfast - porridge, protein shake (40g), coffee

Lunch - chicken soup, packet of ham, coffee

Afternoon - protein shake (40g)

Dinner - steak, veg, coffee

Post workout - protein shake (40g)

Pre-bed - protein shake (40g)

Jesus man you like your coffee!Mind you so do i.Lunch i would have to poke a stick at.A chicken breast instead of chicken soup IMO.With a green vegetable.I think it might be in your best interest to invest in a back support.Just as a preventative meassure.A way to help you build your biceps without putting exessive amounts of pressure on your ****y back could be preecher curls on a swiss ball.You can do these either one handed or both hands on the cable machine or use dumbbells if you feel stable enough.

Sorry for the cheesy vids:

YouTube - Exercise of the Day: Preacher Ball Bicep Curl


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Yeah - bought myself a nice espresso maker the other week.

The way I do lunch is I take the soup as veg/carbs with protein in the form of ham or chicken. Do you think I should just ditch the soup and eat more chicken?

What's the benefit of those preacher curl methods to just doing them on the preacher curl pad?


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

BigAndyJ said:


> Yeah - bought myself a nice espresso maker the other week.
> 
> The way I do lunch is I take the soup as veg/carbs with protein in the form of ham or chicken. Do you think I should just ditch the soup and eat more chicken?
> 
> What's the benefit of those preacher curl methods to just doing them on the preacher curl pad?


Are you having soup for any particular reason other than that.Coming from a muscle building perspective i'd have a chicken breast but that said you are getting a fair amount of protein from your shakes so if its working for you then stay with it.How many sugars are you putting in those coffees?

Preechers on a ball allow you to do the exersice on your knees with minimal back pressure.If you dont suffer on the preecher pad then its fine at least you've got an alternative if you have any problems and need to switch.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Coffee's are sugar free - just some semi skimmed milk. The soup was just for some carbs. Dunno if its all working for me yet - haven't really stuck to the diet with training for a while now. We'll see...

Think I'll give those preacher curls a go - if they built your arms then then got to be good. What do you do for triceps?


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

BigAndyJ said:


> What do you do for triceps?


Skull crushers,rope pull downs,weighted dips.single underhand cable pull downs.If you want the appearance of bigger upper arms you should concentrate on you tri's as they are of course the bigger of the two upper arm muscles.Straight bar preachers give a nice peak to your bicep and use an EZ curl bar to work and build the inner and outer heads.Standing overheads are a fave of mine too.

YouTube - Overhead Cable Curl


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Yeah - but biceps look better in a t-shirt LOL.

My arms are weird - both the same size, with biceps different sizes and triceps different sizes: bicep smaller on the right, but tricep makes up for it. Vice versa on the other arm.

Haven't done much tricep training in ages though.

Yours look sick in that photo Gazz - really impressive.


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## Nath1466867935 (Sep 4, 2007)

Hello Andy mate, just having a quick read. I hate doing biceps so tend to neglect them, its getting to the point now where i'm gonna have to do some work on them because they look stupid. I have been doing platoon 21's which seem to hammer them,

Can't find a video unfortunately, but basically u do 7 partial curls from extended to about 45 degrees, u then do 7 from 45 degrees to 180, and then 7 full curls. I do them leaning against a wall to prevent cheating, this prob also takes the strain of the lower back, suck it and see!


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## Nath1466867935 (Sep 4, 2007)

From bodybuilding.com

*The Platoon System*

*A*s we discussed in the previous paragraph, there is a bottom half and a top half to a rep. The Platoon system seeks to incorporate them both for maximum effect. What you usually do is 7 reps of the bottom half (stretch point to midway) followed by 7 reps of the top half (midway to contraction) and after that you move on to 7 reps of the full exercise. Naturally these can also be in increments of 8 or 6 if that works out better for you. But they were normally used in 7's, and mostly in biceps curls. That particular exercise was dubbed 21's because of it, and the name got adopted as a synonym for the Platoon System. The downside to this was, since it was only employed for barbell curls, that everyone thought it was a biceps exercise, when in effect you could do it on virtually any exercise including bench presses, squats, military presses and French presses, as well as a whole host of others. Which is the only reason I mention it here. You too may have forgotten this, or may have never known it. Anyway, when attempting to do a Platoon set, use about 50 percent of weight, because these things are extremely heavy and hard. Do three or four platoon sets at the end of a workout to carve striations or do them first thing, because nothing gets a pump going like platoons. One warning: Do not rely on Platoon sets as your primary mass-builder. Because of the high number of reps it needs you may be disappointed with the result.


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## Nath1466867935 (Sep 4, 2007)

as u can see from this vid, the dude uses a swing, if u have ur back against a wall u cannot use this swing. HUZZAH!!!!


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

You don't wanna be swinging 21's with your back probs Andy Defo against the wall or with that nice wide leather suppoprt belt i know you're gonna buy!:becky:

Its alright for Nath,he's got a back like an Afghan Donkey!


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## Nath1466867935 (Sep 4, 2007)

Gazz said:


> You don't wanna be swinging 21's with your back probs Andy Defo against the wall or with that nice wide leather suppoprt belt i know you're gonna buy!:becky:
> 
> Its alright for Nath,he's got a back like an Afghan Donkey!


He's right, my back is overworked, hairy and stinks.


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

Nath said:


> He's right, my back is overworked, hairy and stinks.


You... Overworked...? I thought you were a teacher who's alarm clock time hadn't been altered since the old queen died...? :becky:


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## Nath1466867935 (Sep 4, 2007)

Tall said:


> You... Overworked...? I thought you were a teacher who's alarm clock time hadn't been altered since the old queen died...? :becky:


Yep, I guess thats pretty accurate, more like a happy hippo than a afghan donkey! :high5:


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Well, was all set yesterday to write how I had a great week at the gym - feeling strong and injury free, when walking around town yesterday, I started to get sore at the bottom of my back by my left hand side... By evening time I couldn't lean on my left leg...

Bit better this morning, but disillusioned cause I don't know what caused it...


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Well, after two weeks I'm left with a pain down my left leg. I took a week off work - it took a few days to walk again and the rest of the week for pain with movement to subside.

Obviously I haven't been training - just doing 30 minute walks every day and trying to watch what I eat...

Seeing the physio - tried to find one who knew about weight training (preferably one who'd coached professional athletes, like a rugby team or something) but couldn't find one.

How long do you guys think I should leave it before training again? I plan on only doing upper body exercises like pull ups, dips, bench, cable rows, bicep curls, etc...


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

BigAndyJ said:


> Well, after two weeks I'm left with a pain down my left leg. I took a week off work - it took a few days to walk again and the rest of the week for pain with movement to subside.
> 
> Obviously I haven't been training - just doing 30 minute walks every day and trying to watch what I eat...
> 
> ...


What has your doctor said about your condition Andy?I know we usually get better advise from a tree stump these days but he/she should of at least prescribed you some kind of anti-inflammatory,Ibuprofen,Naproxen or COX-2 inhibitors.

Keep searchig for a good physio.They dont necessarily have to be ex sport Physio's they should all understand the fundamental methods of treating Sciatica.Resting is the conservative method of treatment until you are pain free but im more of a believer in exercising in these cases.

When the sciatica pain is at its worst,you may need to rest for a day or two,but resting for longer periods of time is usually not advisable.In fact,inactivity will usually make the sciatic pain worse.This is because regular movement and exercise is necessary to nourish the various structures in the low back and encourage the strength needed to support the low back.Im trying to find this page on Sciatica exercises,i'll come back when ive found it.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Yeah - the doctor got me on Arcoxia (60mg, 1 a day).

Doctor and physio both said its a "disc problem". Went for an xray but results aren't due to next week. They told me the xray probably wouldn't show much thought, unless its really bad.

The physios I've been to just aren't that knowledgeable about training. I would love to be able to find one that knew about weight training and could give me advise on what to do and what to avoid in the gym as well as treat me.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

> The physios I've been to just aren't that knowledgeable about training. I would love to be able to find one that knew about weight training and could give me advise on what to do and what to avoid in the gym as well as treat me.


been there.


> Doctor and physio both said its a "disc problem". Went for an xray but results aren't due to next week. They told me the xray probably wouldn't show much thought, unless its really bad.


dont waste years like me.

get an MRI!!!!!!!!

INSIST.

chins,(or pulldowns-no rows)bench press,seated mili press-pre-exhaust of neccessary,bicep curls lying down on a low pulley.dips or anything laying down for tri`s and of course my all time no.1 fave to work the legs-partials with a trap bar(this way you lean forward minimally or BW squats done with a ROM that doesnt aggravate9i`ve even found using a wide ROM on a leg press to cause pain afterwards.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Yeah my boss suggested an MRI - are they better than xrays?

What did yours show?


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

yup theyre much better than xrays.

as too what it showed, not sure what the diff was but it finally got the docs to take me seriously and that it wasnt going to go away...


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

BigAndyJ said:


> Yeah - the doctor got me on Arcoxia (60mg, 1 a day).
> 
> Doctor and physio both said its a "disc problem". Went for an xray but results aren't due to next week. They told me the xray probably wouldn't show much thought, unless its really bad.
> 
> The physios I've been to just aren't that knowledgeable about training. I would love to be able to find one that knew about weight training and could give me advise on what to do and what to avoid in the gym as well as treat me.


They are in no position to speculate on the out come of an x-ray they havent even seen yet,thats a pretty unacceptable statement to make so i would let that go over your head.A disc problem would require an operation in the long run i think.


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

So I'm still out of the gym - my pain went away and I felt great for about 3 days, but then it came back.

It's getting slightly better though. But I reckon it'll at least be another month before I would entertain going back to the gym.

My phsyio's got me using ice packs. I thought ice packs were only for when you first get an injury though?


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## gentlegiant (Mar 23, 2007)

BigAndyJ said:


> My phsyio's got me using ice packs. I thought ice packs were only for when you first get an injury though?


No mate,ice is one of the easiest tool's to use in any type of injury rehabilitation.It's inexpensive and very effective at reducing swelling and inflamation.Hence why you see alot of footabller's and rugby player's etc sitting on the bench with ice pack's on if they pick up a niggle during a game.Back in my boxing day's our trainer Pat used to make us stick both hands in buckets of ice or we'd wake the next day with swelling on the backs of our hands and around the wrist's from the exessive impact of punching.It'll be an invaluable tool with regards to your Sciatica,if you owned a long chest freezer i would seriously recommend laying in it for 20 minutes a day,no joke mate.It will work wonder's.


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## Guest (May 10, 2008)

BigAndyJ said:


> So I'm still out of the gym - my pain went away and I felt great for about 3 days, but then it came back.


do you know why this happened?


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Nah, still not really sure this time scottswald. Usually I can pin point something, but not really...

So physio has me swimming. Kind of sucks but at least its something. Pain is on an off - a lot better though this past two weeks. For a while it really wasnt budging.

Toying with the idea of doing some weights - pull ups, chins, bicep work, maybe some shoulder work. What do you guys thing?


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

How come there are no physio's like this near me?!

YouTube - Interview with Dr. Scott Paxton


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## BigAndyJ (Mar 26, 2009)

Well, this is my diet currently

*breakfast*

porridge

20g protein shake

*Lunch*

Packet of ham

Small cube of cheese

*Mid afternoon*

25g protein shake

*Dinner*

Chicken + some sauce with veg

*9pm*

25g protein shake

My strategy at the moment is to try an loose a bit of bodyfat while retain muscle while getting back into training.

Currently I'm swimming and/walking most nights; still haven't touched a weight. Hoping maybe next week to start some pull ups and chins but will see how it goes.


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