# steriods or lose weight first??



## liquidcars (Sep 25, 2008)

just decided to start training properly and bulk up as opposed to little excercise (once or twice a week playing rugby ) i am unsure which way round to do it.

i am 6ft 4 and 17 stone with a big frame and broad shoulders. i am not fat but have a beer gut which i really want to get rid of

i have just bought a month course of 300mg deca and sustinol and i have the cycle worked out from a thread i have seen on here

obviously that will help me bulk up the parts that i want like triceps, biceps,shoulders and chest but what i wanted to know is...........

would it be better to trim down first and lose the beer gut by doing lots of cardio and then start the steriods or start the steriods and do the cardio at the same time

any advice would be appreciated


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

I, personally would cut first and get rid of the gut and then look at bulking after cleanly.

I am sure others will be along to offer better advice shortly.

Also, are steroids right for you, have you done any cycle's before in the past, what is your training experience (none by reading your thread) and what is your current diet like.

Pics would be good to give a better answer.


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## liquidcars (Sep 25, 2008)

well i used to train about 3 times a week but that was 12 months ago when i stopped due to not having the time but now i have the time and determination as i am turning into a porker!!! and i havent really taken steriods before. diet however is kind of bad as i start the day really well with branflakes for breakfast the a couple of effadrine and black coffee then chicken on wholemeal barm and eat really well till about 10pm then tend to eat rubbish like fish finger butties, garlic bread with cheese etc


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## cosa (Sep 8, 2008)

aup mate if i was you id go for building first you aint that fat mate and if your takeing the gear youll soon start to take a nice shape even more so with the time of year start building now gettin near the size you wont and start ripping down towards next summer and im sure youll be a happy man


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## Madeira Jon (Jan 11, 2008)

I would agree with KIEREN. The only way to get rid of excess fat is diet and excercise, especially cardio AFTER the WOs as this is when your body has used up its glycogen and starts burning the fat. Then it is generally stated that the body doesnt start using the fat until about 20 minutes of treadmill "powerwalking", (not jogging)

You can get a rough estimate of the daily calories you need to maintain your current weight by multiplying you weight in pounds by 14 (note this is not a scientific assessment but an estimate); anymore and you will put on the fat,and of course less and you will start to lose it. However you must balance this with the fact that you need carbs to fuel your exercise. Reduce the carbs too much and your body will run into ketosis. Start on equal carbs and protein diet.

BTW you don't seem to have a "beer belly"! Maybe a layer of surplus fat, but not a beer belly! (GRIN)

You may be interested here, this is a carb counter:-

http://www.carbohydrate-counter.org/

And this will help to determine calories:-

http://www.weightlossresources.co.uk/calories/calorie_counter.htm

Finally I don't think you're quite ready for steroids yet, have you planned your PCT for example?

Good luck.


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## Baggers (May 31, 2008)

Hi mate,

Im no expert here either but if and when you start the cycle you will have to seriously sort the diet out. There are some great threads on here that will help you with that.

In my opinion I would get some quality training under your belt before even considering gear. I have read of a lot of people turning straight to gear as a panacea but it never works. Why not work hard for a few months and put the diet straight, then when you have a solid base developing, start a cycle that will suit you,

Also, you have posted what cycle you intend to do but no mention of PCT. If you are going to get the best gains and more importantly, keep them, you will need to get this right.


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## liquidcars (Sep 25, 2008)

Madeira Jon said:


> Finally I don't think you're quite ready for steroids yet, have you planned your PCT for example?
> 
> Good luck.


yeah i had thought of that and i was talking to a lad that i used to go to the gym with and he has used steriods for a few years and he said that the best one to use would be Clomid with the stach that i am taking (deca and sus)

but i am unsure when i am meant to start taking them. i was planning on doing an 8 week cycle but i am unsure if that would be too long for my first cycle


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## liquidcars (Sep 25, 2008)

Baggers said:


> Hi mate,
> 
> Im no expert here either but if and when you start the cycle you will have to seriously sort the diet out. There are some great threads on here that will help you with that.
> 
> ...


as i said earlier in the thread i used to work out 3 times a week but had to stop due to work commitments and obviously lost all the definition i had before due to not excercising. so in a way i am no stranger to the gym but never really was into the "roid" thing as i never wanted to be bigger than i was it was more toning that i went for. but now my goals have changed and now i am wanting to bulk up.


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## Baggers (May 31, 2008)

Yes but perhaps the way to do that as a good start would be to get the diet right with all the macros you need for your body to make the best gains and then when you have that in order, start a cycle and PCT to get even better gains.

I was in the same boat and was toying with gear but after reading through some really lengthy and informative posts, I found that the time wasnt right. The general consensus is to put the hours in at the gym, get the diet nailed, and then consider the gear.

Just my opinion mate


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## liquidcars (Sep 25, 2008)

thanks mate, i will probably leave the roids and do a few months more jitting the gym hard. the gym work wont be a problem but the diet can be a pain as a am a sucker for a garlic bread with cheese and donner kebab!!!

just out of interest though for when i am ready for taking them, when would be the best time to start the PCT if i am using a deca/ sus stack and clomid for pct


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## Baggers (May 31, 2008)

Have a look at Hacksii's "understanding PCT" thread mate. Quite a long thread but well written and its all in there.

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/steroid-testosterone-information/17336-understanding-pct.html

For the record - Doners are for winners, I love them too


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## guinness (Jul 14, 2008)

you havea lot of work to do on both your diet and your training. The gear will help you but only if the other two and fixed first and you are consistent with them. IMO you should clean up you diet and stick to it while being consistent with your training and cardio. This will allow you to lose the fat and for your body to adat to heavier training. After that and onlyif you are able to stick to it should you consider a cycle. View the gear as something which will enable you to reach further once your are already stretched not as a magic potion.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

liquidcars said:


> well i used to train about 3 times a week but that was 12 months ago when i stopped due to not having the time but now i have the time and determination as i am turning into a porker!!! and i havent really taken steriods before. diet however is kind of bad as i start the day really well with branflakes for breakfast the a couple of effadrine and black coffee then chicken on wholemeal barm and eat really well till about 10pm then tend to eat rubbish like fish finger butties, garlic bread with cheese etc


That is not eating well at all mate!

Can you post your diet in the format for a typical day:

7.00 - oats

9.00 - protein shake...

................. etc.


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## albie (Mar 16, 2007)

if i was in your position, first i would get my diet and training sorted sorted. I would train without using AAS until i reached a point where gains came to a stop even with alterations to training routines.

From my own experience the part i struggle with is maintaining a constant diet,whether its a bulking or cutting diet. Also using AAS before 'natural' limits are reached was,for me the wrong way to go.

There's loads of information on this forum regarding diet and training routines.

I'm not saying dont use AAS, i just think you will get better results by reaching a natural limit, with correct diet and training - then use AAS,should you feel the need.

If you decide to use AAS, your diet and training being correct are as important as the compounds you choose to use.

Also clomid alone as pct,from what i have learnt on this site,wont work.


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## sonofwacky (Apr 22, 2008)

kieren u aint got a gut m8 trust me


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## Littleluke (Nov 21, 2005)

Hello mate.. To be perfectly honest you are too fat. And you really need to focus more on your diet and training intensity. No-one from here can monitor your training but we can certainly ensure your diet is in order. As for steroids.. You don't have a very good muscle base to begin them. I think sorting your diet will encourage the gains you are expecting to see anyhow.


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## Scrappy (May 5, 2008)

alright mate, similar to whats posted really, altho u can get good results for using gear, it wont work no were near as well if you diet and training is not 100%, this could take some people 6mnth to a year of hard training and disipline with a diet and then perhaps use gearto go to the next level. souns to me like u wanna get buff quick which alot ov us do, but it really wudnt be worth the money if everything else is off par.


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## liquidcars (Sep 25, 2008)

kieren1234 said:


> That is not eating well at all mate!
> 
> Can you post your diet in the format for a typical day:
> 
> ...


7.30 bowl of branflakes with semi skimmed milk

9.00 2 effedrine and cup of black coffee

10.30 chicken on wholemeal barm

1pm Turkey salad on wholemeal bread and low fat yoghurt

3pm banana and protein shake

6pm chicken dinner with veg

8pm protein shake

then it goes downhill at 10pm ish with garlic bread and cheese, kebab, burger, wagon wheels, chocolate etc but thats not every night thats about 3/4 times a week


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## irwit (Mar 29, 2007)

AWFUL DIET !!!

Why waste your money time and health with steroids ? They wont burn fat or give you the building blocks to build muscle ?

Get the foundations correct first, good diet witha good solid routine. These 2 alone wiill completely tranform your body ina few months. Id put money that if you stuck to a good push pull legs routine with a decent diet and some cardio in 6 months you wouldnt touch steroids because youd look exactly how you want to. You have a really good frame to work with so I would suggest using it.


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## Alex Redford (Sep 9, 2008)

liquidcars said:


> 7.30 bowl of branflakes with semi skimmed milk
> 
> 9.00 2 effedrine and cup of black coffee
> 
> ...


as you said your looking to bulk up, im no expert in this at all but thats also the same goal i am aiming for , have a look on my thread in the welcome lounge as that has a high carb diet on it which was made by a bodybuilder for me so maybe you could take a feal meal plans off there, it could also be worth putting the gear to one side and getting a good base to work on , i do not no anything about gear but from wha ti do know i would not take it untill you have the main ingredient of getting big which is your diet sorted.

Regards,

ALex check out my thread some good info on ther.


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## willsey4 (Apr 21, 2008)

Mate, sort your diet out first and add cardio in with your weights. Once you get down to a reasonable bofy fat %, say under 15% then you can adjust your diet and training slightly to your main focus is to bulk up.

Re your diet, have a strict diet Mon to Sat then use Sun as a cheat day where you eat what you want.


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## paulo (Feb 17, 2007)

incorporate loads of walking-30 -40 mins a day ideally,that way youll burn off loads of extra cals and dont get all sweaty and have to jog/run,will definetly work in conjunction with dietry changes, wont hurt joints either as jogging may.

its a great destressor if youve had a ****ty day at work or good start if have time a.m


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## Damo j (Mar 26, 2008)

I think if you have the gear already you are most likely to use it. So just bulk up now with correct diet. To be honest i think you are too fat but i started when i had a gut and now its almost gone, i was doing test, tren and now on pct. I will soon do a eca with lots of cardio to see how effective my last course was.

By the way the lads are right about shifting the weight but when you have that gear sitting there its like the devil on your shoulder that why i said the above.


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