# Excited about a no deal Brexit



## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

I really hope we leave without a deal. Well there isn't enough time to sort a deal now anyway so it's the only possible outcome unless Soros has managed to pay off all of parliament.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

UK yellow vest are a fu**ing joke :thumb


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

I last time i felt 'excited' was when i got a Mr Frosty for Christmas 1987.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Live footage of UK leaving Europe


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Frandeman said:


> Live footage of UK leaving Europe


 Depressingly accurate.


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## Endomorph84 (Jan 21, 2016)

MFM said:


> I really hope we leave without a deal. Well there isn't enough time to sort a deal now anyway so it's the only possible outcome unless Soros has managed to pay off all of parliament.


 What prospects of a no deal excites you mate? genuine question.


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## 75013 (Feb 22, 2017)

Endomorph84 said:


> What prospects of a no deal excites you mate? genuine question.


 The act of self harm gets me really hard tbh


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

won't happen, they will extend the process or cave in.
They haven't a full nut sack between the lot of them . Weak as piss politicians. If they announced early on they would go for a no deal at the start if nothing better on the table, and had the balls to carry it through, Britain would be in a much better place

But the state of parliament are like many people in Britain, fu**ing weak. Having hissy fits over everything and zero courage.

On the 9th of Dec Theresa May warned of the dangers of "unchartered waters" by not accepting her deal i.e. a no deal Brexit . Thats says it all. The very foundation and backbone of Britain was forged by exploring""uncharted waters"


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Endomorph84 said:


> What prospects of a no deal excites you mate? genuine question.


 Because any deal with the EU would benefit them far more than us, especially as 'negotiated' by May the remainer. I understand that the EU can't make it seem easy to leave, otherwise others will follow suit and the EU would implode in no time. So the only real alternative is to leave without any deal so we can be free for the EU and its laws in its entirety.

Sure it might take a while before things have settled down and it probably won't be smooth sailing for everyone, but in the long run how can it not be a good thing to be rid of the EU dictatorship.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

JohhnyC said:


> won't happen, they will extend the process or cave it.
> They haven't a full nut sack between the lot of them . Weak as piss politicians. If they announced early on they would go for a no deal at the start if nothing better on the table, and had the balls to carry it through, Britain would be in a much better place
> 
> But the state of parliament are like many people in Britain, fu**ing weak. Having hissy fits over everything and zero courage.
> ...


 The difficulty here is not so much that a no deal Brexit is 'uncharted waters' but rather willfully choosing an option that many genuinely believe will do significant and lasting economic damage to the UK, as well as putting the very existence of the UK at threat (re. Scotland and Northern Ireland). For people who believe this, opposing the no deal scenario is what anyone should do, with by contrast it actually being 'weak' to just go along with it.

The current mess in parliament is primarily because there is no majority for any achievable outcome, as I strongly suspect there wouldn't be amongst the electorate either.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

JohhnyC said:


> won't happen, they will extend the process or cave in.
> They haven't a full nut sack between the lot of them . Weak as piss politicians. If they announced early on they would go for a no deal at the start if nothing better on the table, and had the balls to carry it through, Britain would be in a much better place
> 
> But the state of parliament are like many people in Britain, fu**ing weak. Having hissy fits over everything and zero courage.
> ...


 Agree, Britain should of played hard ball with the EU and called their bluff.....instead they behaved like a little lost child in a large city.


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## Fletch68 (Mar 17, 2013)

Ultrasonic said:


> The difficulty here is not so much that a no deal Brexit is 'uncharted waters' but rather willfully choosing an option that many genuinely believe will do significant and lasting economic damage to the UK, as well as putting the very existence of the UK at threat (re. Scotland and Northern Ireland). For people who believe this, opposing the no deal scenario is what anyone should do, with by contrast it actually being 'weak' to just go along with it.
> 
> The current mess in parliament is primarily because there is no majority for any achievable outcome, as I strongly suspect there wouldn't be amongst the electorate either.


 I'm currently sitting here awaiting the next referendum. In which i will vote exactly the same way as last time. Leave.


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

MFM said:


> Because any deal with the EU would benefit them far more than us, especially as 'negotiated' by May the remainer. I understand that the EU can't make it seem easy to leave, otherwise others will follow suit and the EU would implode in no time. So the only real alternative is to leave without any deal so we can be *free for the EU and its laws in its entirety. *
> 
> Sure it might take a while before things have settled down and it probably won't be smooth sailing for everyone, but in the long run how can it not be a good thing to be rid of the EU dictatorship.


 Which laws, do you want to get rid of?


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

Denied said:


> Which laws, do you want to get rid of?


 Once we get our straight bananas back Brexit will have been delivered in full.


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## spod (Mar 25, 2010)

Endomorph84 said:


> What prospects of a no deal excites you mate? genuine question.


 I'm truly excited by a no deal Brexit, mate...not that i think it'll happen, but if it does, here's why:

The only way to engineer a totally positive trading outcome is to state in no uncertain terms that the UK intends to leave the Customs Union and Single Market. This, we were told by all sides in the referendum debate, would be the consequence of a vote to leave the EU. This would be a kind of default position in the event that a good trade agreement couldn't be worked out between us and the EU in the two years following the triggering of Article 50.

If this had been made crystal clear by the government back in March 2017, we would, without a doubt, have achieved a mutually beneficial comprehensive trade deal by now. As it is, remain-supporting politicians have been more than happy to make a purposeful balls-up of the whole thing. Anybody serious about negotiating a sensible post-Brexit trade deal (Davis, Raab, et al.) has been ignored, isolated and ultimately sidelined by the political establishment. They have manufactured a kind of chaos and have made a relatively straightforward negotiation seemingly impossible in an attempt to make the voting public change their mind and re-think leaving the EU. It's a cynical and thoroughly anti-democratic ploy IMO, and it should fool nobody with half a brain.

We should make it clear that we intend to leave the EU on 29th March this year, out of the Customs Union and Single Market, and trading with the EU on WTO rules until such a time as a free trade agreement is reached...one that does not involve us paying a massive 'divorce fee' or restricts us from entering into free trade agreements with countries around the globe. We should offer to adopt only those EU standards and regulations necessary to facilitate trade but insist that UK law is made by UK lawmakers and UK politics is driven by UK politicians. We should guarantee the status of foreign nationals living and legally working in the UK and continue to work in partnership with security services Europe-wide. If we did this, a deal would most certainly be reached by the end of the year.

There are many people both within and outside the UK who don't want a good trade deal with the EU. They say they do but really they just want to stifle the democratic will of the people and overturn Brexit. The only way to achieve a good trade deal is to leave without one. Necessity is the mother of invention, and only when it dawns on the EU that 'no deal' is truly on the cards will they enter into trade negotiations with any real degree of sincerity whatsoever.


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## Endomorph84 (Jan 21, 2016)

spod said:


> The only way to achieve a good trade deal is to leave without one.


 :beer:


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Frandeman said:


> UK yellow vest are a fu**ing joke :thumb


 Said the french bloke living in England... :whistling:


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## Big Ian (Jul 19, 2005)

jjtreml said:


> I last time i felt 'excited' was when i got a Mr Frosty for Christmas 1987.


 Youuuuuu spoilt bastard!!! I always wanted one of them! Bet it was actually pretty sh1t in reality wasn't it!? Please say yes :tongue:


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

Denied said:


> Which laws, do you want to get rid of?


 Who are you, James O'Brien? :lol:


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

MFM said:


> Denied said:
> 
> 
> > Which laws, do you want to get rid of?
> ...


 Everything set by the ECJ


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## Gary29 (Aug 21, 2011)

Big Ian said:


> Youuuuuu spoilt bastard!!! I always wanted one of them! Bet it was actually pretty sh1t in reality wasn't it!? Please say yes :tongue:


 Exactly! Always wanted one of these, my dad just scraped out the ice from the freezer for us and told us to drink it quick before it melts and to call him 'Mr Frosty' instead, times were tough back then.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Gary29 said:


> Exactly! Always wanted one of these, my dad just scraped out the ice from the freezer for us and told us to drink it quick before it melts and to call him 'Mr Frosty' instead, times were tough back then.





Big Ian said:


> Youuuuuu spoilt bastard!!! I always wanted one of them! Bet it was actually pretty sh1t in reality wasn't it!? Please say yes :tongue:


 It was a load of tosh to be honest lol


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## unclezillion (Sep 17, 2017)

JohhnyC said:


> Everything set by the ECJ


 so you basically want to give up all your human rights! u got them from the EU not the UK


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

Ultrasonic said:


> The difficulty here is not so much that a no deal Brexit is 'uncharted waters' but rather willfully choosing an option that many genuinely believe will do significant and lasting economic damage to the UK, as well as putting the very existence of the UK at threat (re. Scotland and Northern Ireland). For people who believe this, opposing the no deal scenario is what anyone should do, with by contrast it actually being 'weak' to just go along with it.
> 
> The current mess in parliament is primarily because there is no majority for any achievable outcome, as I strongly suspect there wouldn't be amongst the electorate either.


 The people were told before the last referendum by the vast majority of economic experts and business leaders that any brexit would do significant damage to the UK. but the people still went ahead and voted for it.

There are only currently 3 definite "achievable outcomes". No deal brexit, the negotiated deal, or remain as before. At this stage it needs to go back to the people. The MPs that are supposed to represent us have proved that between them they are not capable of delivering on the result of the last referendum.

If there is another referendum there does not need to be a majority for any of the 3 options. Whichever gets the most votes will have the strongest public mandate of the available choices, and as such in the interests of democracy would be the correct path to take.

In the last 2 out 3 general elections there has not been a majority public vote for any party but it has been accepted that the party with the most votes has the strongest public mandate to form a government. Achieving a majority in a 3 option referendum would not be a necessity.


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## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

Brexit is the least exciting thing in the world.


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## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

unclezillion said:


> so you basically want to give up all your human rights! u got them from the EU not the UK


 It's true. Before the EU, children were beaten by in public for stealing loaves of bread. Thank God for the EU.


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## Jack of blades (Apr 2, 2017)

I want UK to be out of EU so does that mean I want the deal to happen or not?


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## Gary29 (Aug 21, 2011)

Jack of blades said:


> I want UK to be out of EU so does that mean I want the deal to happen or not?


 Think of it like this;

Half the people wanted sweet, the other half wanted savoury. Theresa May is therefore trying to serve us a bacon trifle, which no one at all wants, so we are all going to end up going hungry with nothing for dessert instead.


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## simonboyle (Aug 5, 2013)

I'm more interested in who will be next now.

People still think we are the only country that wanted to leave.

Poland

Hungary

Sweden

Are the favourites to have a referendum next.

Czech and Estonia too.

And if Greece finally gets booted out too.

Interesting times.


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## Jack of blades (Apr 2, 2017)

Gary29 said:


> Think of it like this;
> 
> Half the people wanted sweet, the other half wanted savoury. Theresa May is therefore trying to serve us a bacon trifle, which no one at all wants, so we are all going to end up going hungry with nothing for dessert instead.


 Now I'm more confused


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

JohhnyC said:


> Everything set by the ECJ


 I don't wish to get too involved in this as I don't know enough to argue points but I think this is inaccurate.

As far as I am aware the ECJ's role is "Ensuring EU law is interpreted and applied the same in every EU country; ensuring countries and EU institutions abide by EU law."

https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodies/court-justice_en

'EU laws' passed to member states isn't as most think, it is actually directives (lowest standard expected) of which the member states adopt or have existing laws to a higher level to work with. Countries don't have to do these things but if they choose not to, there could be consequences. I think the best example I can bit like a company choosing not to work using ACOPS (lowest standard acceptable) under H&S law, that's fine but if an accident occurs then the company is liable until they show that their practice went above and beyond the practice of the relevant ACOPS.

How does a thick f'k like me know this? I got a distinction in H&S and Merit in Law and Contract. If it was important information I needed to know for a job I'd be forgotten it. Haha.

There are others more knowledgeable than me on here regarding this stuff so I do stand to be corrected if I've written something wrongly. :thumbup1:


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

The-Real-Deal said:


> Said the french bloke living in England... :whistling:


 It is one thing to troll or insult people on the internet but to insinuate they are French, thats too far below the belt. A gentleman should know better.


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

simonboyle said:


> I'm more interested in who will be next now.
> 
> People still think we are the only country that wanted to leave.
> 
> ...


 Well... that was before your countries Brexit adventure started, now just the chemtrails, anti-vaccination and flat earth people want out of the EU. For the rest, there is a general feeling of relief for not being British.

Here is a song that sums it up:


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## MM84 (Jun 8, 2017)

EpicSquats said:


> Brexit is the least exciting thing in the world.


 A close second to @unclezillion's post !!!


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Gary29 said:


> Think of it like this;
> 
> Half the people were getting the dough, the other half was left with the s**t. Theresa May is therefore trying to keep everyone happy so will give everyone a s**t sandwich which no one wants.


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## Clubber Lang (Nov 4, 2009)

Mays deal is shite. Still gives EU too many powers and non back to us.

No Deal and go onto WTO rules!!

if Brexit gets put back to stopped then democracy has failed, 650 MPs basically telling 17+ million people your wrong, so we now live under a dictatorship.

if Brexit doesnt happen i will never vote again. Whats the point. BS.


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## simonboyle (Aug 5, 2013)

Goranchero said:


> Well... that was before your countries Brexit adventure started, now just the chemtrails, anti-vaccination and flat earth people want out of the EU. For the rest, there is a general feeling of relief for not being British.
> 
> Here is a song that sums it up:


 I have no idea what your post is about.


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

EpicSquats said:


> Brexit is the least exciting thing in the world.


 Brexit, the only thing that can be terrifying and boring, at the same time.


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

JohhnyC said:


> Everything set by the ECJ


 So you want to work more hours, have less holiday and less time between working days? Have less consumer rights, 1 year warranty on electrical goods rather than 2 etc

Seems a bit odd to me...


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## monkeybiker (Jul 21, 2010)

Gary29 said:


> Think of it like this;
> 
> Half the people wanted sweet, the other half wanted savoury. Theresa May is therefore trying to serve us a bacon trifle, which no one at all wants, so we are all going to end up going hungry with nothing for dessert instead.


 That's where your wrong


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

Denied said:


> So you want to work more hours, have less holiday and less time between working days? Have less consumer rights, 1 year warranty on electrical goods rather than 2 etc
> 
> Seems a bit odd to me...


 Everyone wants to work less hours and have more paid holidays etc but there comes a point where if you force employers to give too much they end up having to scale back or go out of business altogether and then people lose jobs.

So there has to be a balance. The question is why would you want Brussels to decide on that balance instead of it being decided in the UK?

The problem is, MPs on both sides do not give a flying sht about public will. On one side you have the hard brexiteers who are intent on derailing any deal because they won't be happy unless the UK severs all economic and political ties with Europe. When in reality the leave voters (on the whole) were not against the economic union or trading arrangements. They were against the political sprawl of the EU. The EU's continued encroachment on UK sovereignty. The main issues IMO(and as many polls showed) for leave voters was taking back control of borders and law making.

On the other side you have the MPs that never accepted the leave result and have done everything they can to hinder the process or push for nonsense like a Norway + deal which is basically staying in the EU with no voice. Then you have to consider that most of this group are made up of Labour MPs that also see the failure of the process as a great opportunity for them to force a general election and get themselves back into power. Even though more Labour constituencies voted for Brexit than Tory.

It's clear that on this issue, as a whole the current bunch of MPs are not capable of representing the views of the public and their own agendas are their main if not only concern. If/when this deal is voted down, It will be a travesty for democracy if there is not another referendum. And it has to include the deal that the public has spent £10s of millions negotiating.


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## Gary29 (Aug 21, 2011)

monkeybiker said:


> That's where your wrong


 No one likes that bald headed c**t Heston, so my point still stands.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Clubber Lang said:


> Mays deal is shite. Still gives EU too many powers and non back to us.
> 
> No Deal and go onto WTO rules!!
> 
> ...


 Agree, although i still honestly believe that the UK should of called the EU's bluff and played the game better. May and her MP's shouldn't of gone into the negotiations with the negative and beaten before it has even started attitude. Had they gone in more positive, confident and head strong they probably wouldn't be in half of this mess that they currently find themselves in. May is weak and an unfit 'leader'


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

jjtreml said:


> Agree, although i still honestly believe that the UK should of called the EU's bluff and played the game better. May and her MP's shouldn't of gone into the negotiations with the negative and beaten before it has even started attitude. Had they gone in more positive, confident and head strong they probably wouldn't be in half of this mess that they currently find themselves in.


 The remoaners should also have kept their traps shut and got behind what the majority(who voted) had voted for. When the opponents see the divide caused, they know they have leverage.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> The remoaners should also have kept their traps shut and got behind what the majority(who voted) had voted for. When the opponents see the divide caused, they know they have leverage.


 Exactly, the remainers were extremely naive. They had no respect for the result and what the majority voted for.


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## Krk (Sep 24, 2017)

No deal is nowhere near as bad as some say.

There is nothing we buy from Europe that we can't buy elsewhere.

The EU rips off every citizen. Wetherspoons buy champagne and jagermeister from the US because it's cheaper even with the ridiculous import duty. How is that possible? Because the EU tax the s**t out of us on everything from oranges to a new car.

Its becoming a unelected superstate that has more in common with the former ussr than the free trade area it was set up to be.

Germany benefit from a undervalued currency that makes them maximum profits on the cars they export, and allow Lidl and Aldi to undercut uk companies. While Greece, Spain and Italy struggle to sell their overpriced produce due to a artificially overvalued currency. Their once cheap oranges, tomato's etc are no longer cheap.

The money we have sent to Poland to help build their manufacturing infrastructure. Lead to Cadbury's closing in the uk and relocating to Poland. Our tax payers money built factories to take uk jobs.

No deal suits me fine. Even though it will cost me time and money.


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## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

Endomorph84 said:


> What prospects of a no deal excites you mate? genuine question.


 probably food shortage and inability to exit the country


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## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

jjtreml said:


> Exactly, the remainers were extremely naive. They had no respect for the result and what the majority voted for.


 What if the majority want something else now, would you respect that?

genuine question not trying to start an argument.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Lifesizepenguin said:


> What if the majority want something else now, would you respect that?
> 
> genuine question not trying to start an argument.


 Yeah fair point mate,

Like i said back in 2016, one chance one vote. Otherwise we are going around in circles if this drags on.

The majority won in 2016...get on with it and get us out. If that means no deal then bring it on.


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## Endomorph84 (Jan 21, 2016)

Lifesizepenguin said:


> probably food shortage and inability to exit the country


 I have booked a week in Nice, France in July. Hope I can go - Sacré bleu!


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Get the f**k out... :thumb


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Lifesizepenguin said:


> What if the majority want something else now, would you respect that?
> 
> genuine question not trying to start an argument.


 That is irrelevant as the vote was what it was. Had the result been to remain originally I'd expect the leave camp to respect the result. If the majority has since changed their mind, IMO that is unlucky just as it would be in a regular vote system.

Whichever way it went, I wasn't too bothered but the way it is turning out is pathetic and makes me feel like I'm on the 'leave' side but largely not too bothered either way.


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

BLUE(UK) said:


> If the majority has since changed their mind, IMO that is unlucky just as it would be in a regular vote system.


 But at least the will of the people is re-tested every 4 years in terms of regular votes (elections). To be stuck with something the majority no longer want is a very far, far cry from democracy.


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## empzb (Jan 8, 2006)

jjtreml said:


> Yeah fair point mate,
> 
> Like i said back in 2016, one chance one vote. Otherwise we are going around in circles if this drags on.
> 
> The majority won in 2016...get on with it and get us out. If that means no deal then bring it on.


 With Mays deal we are leaving.

Problem with leave was it was too vague and the bs couldn't be split from the truth.


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## empzb (Jan 8, 2006)

Clubber Lang said:


> Mays deal is shite. Still gives EU too many powers and non back to us.
> 
> No Deal and go onto WTO rules!!
> 
> ...


 We could only go on generic Wtos as our own proposed tariffs have been rejected by some of our key 'allies' for not giving enough. If that happens lots of business is screwed, along with general public.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Kazza61 said:


> But at least the will of the people is re-tested every 4 years in terms of regular votes (elections). To be stuck with something the majority no longer want is a very far, far cry from democracy.


 But they wanted it at the time.

Some things you can't opt in and out like a yo-yo unfortunately.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

empzb said:


> We could only go on generic Wtos as our own proposed tariffs have been rejected by some of our key 'allies' for not giving enough. If that happens lots of *business is screwed,* along with general public.


 Good i really hate my job


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## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> Depressingly accurate.


 "Leaving the EU is going to be great for our business"

Said no UK buisnessman ever.


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## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

Krk said:


> No deal is nowhere near as bad as some say.
> 
> There is nothing we buy from Europe that we can't buy elsewhere.


 Ahhh hello UK. I see you come to China to buy our steel. What's that you say? You're no longer part of the EU? Well then UK, this is great news for you. We shall give you cheaper steel than we give to the EU. Why such a generous offer? It's because you are hugely important country UK. You are so large and powerful, and you export so much. We in China are keen to make less profit on steel, and you sell us so many goods and services, far more than the EU does. So we shall generously sell you our steel at a cheaper price.


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## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> That is irrelevant as the vote was what it was. Had the result been to remain originally I'd expect the leave camp to respect the result. If the majority has since changed their mind, IMO that is unlucky just as it would be in a regular vote system.
> 
> Whichever way it went, I wasn't too bothered but the way it is turning out is pathetic and makes me feel like I'm on the 'leave' side but largely not too bothered either way.


 its become obvious to me there shouldnt have been a vote in the first place. it's not for people to decide but the govt. however we should decide who the govt is.

i was largely with leave initially because i dont think the EU should have changed the terms of our membership from purely free trade without us having a say. however, since seeing our govt cant lead a moth to a fu**ing flame i think the UK would be better off staying.

they are a fu**ing shambles.


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## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

Kazza61 said:


> But at least the will of the people is re-tested every 4 years in terms of regular votes (elections). To be stuck with something the majority no longer want is a very far, far cry from democracy.


 this is a fair point.


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## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> But they wanted it at the time.
> 
> Some things you can't opt in and out like a yo-yo unfortunately.


 which is the reason why it shouldn't have been offered in the first place.

if we cant be trusted to eat drink do and say what we want without being nannied by the state why should we be trusted with extremely complex political agreements?


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## Archaic (Mar 8, 2010)

It's not a No Deal, it's a sh1t deal that the PM has proposed - And we'll leave on a WTO deal, which every Country in the World outside of the EU operates.... It's all Scaremongering nonsense!

She needs to resign.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

jwbs said:


> Ahhh hello UK. I see you come to China to buy our steel. What's that you say? You're no longer part of the EU? Well then UK, this is great news for you. We shall give you cheaper steel than we give to the EU. Why such a generous offer? It's because you are hugely important country UK. You are so large and powerful, and you export so much. We in China are keen to make less profit on steel, and you sell us so many goods and services, far more than the EU does. So we shall generously sell you our steel at a cheaper price.


 Fine, we shall boycott their takeaways then. Prefer a curry anyway


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

MickeyE said:


> Everyone wants to work less hours and have more paid holidays etc but there comes a point where if you force employers to give too much they end up having to scale back or go out of business altogether and then people lose jobs.
> 
> So there has to be a balance. The question is why would you want Brussels to decide on that balance instead of it being decided in the UK?
> 
> ...


 That maybe the case, but I think the business owners still have the upper hand, with the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer, so I'll take the EU rules on this, as there much more in our favor.

Could you trust either side of our government to make employment laws at the moment, one side would have us all working minimum wage to make money for the rich, the other side would have us working 2 day weeks and all getting paid 100k a year, living off borrowed money.


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## spod (Mar 25, 2010)

Kazza61 said:


> To be stuck with something the majority no longer want is a very far, far cry from democracy.


 ....which is what Farage has been saying for the past 2 decades.

At least the people have finally had their say on it and voted to leave.

Democracy in action! :thumb


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

Looks like staying in or WTO 202-432

And Comrade Corbyn, using it for his own personal gain agian.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Kazza61 said:


> But at least the will of the people is re-tested every 4 years in terms of regular votes (elections). To be stuck with something the majority no longer want is a very far, far cry from democracy.


 Just to expand on this, are you saying that the EU is far from democracy given there isn't a periodical vote as to whether we want to be in or out?



Lifesizepenguin said:


> its become obvious to me there shouldnt have been a vote in the first place. it's not for people to decide but the govt. however we should decide who the govt is.
> 
> i was largely with leave initially because i dont think the EU should have changed the terms of our membership from purely free trade without us having a say. however, since seeing our govt cant lead a moth to a fu**ing flame i think the UK would be better off staying.
> 
> they are a fu**ing shambles.


 So you say that the govt couldn't lead a moth to a flame yet they should decide whether we are in or out?

I think that the whole issue proves that they all talk a load of boolocks and then deal with it later.


----------



## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

I don't remember if you guys asked to vote about entering the EU?


----------



## spod (Mar 25, 2010)

anna1 said:


> I don't remember if you guys asked to vote about entering the EU?


 We didn't.

We voted to join the EEC - a purely economic union.

Little by little, our corrupt political class have frittered away UK sovereignty. This is the last chance we'll have to get it back.


----------



## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

spod said:


> We didn't.
> 
> We voted to join the EEC - a purely economic union.
> 
> Little by little, our corrupt political class have frittered away UK sovereignty. This is the last chance we'll have to get it back.


 It was never purely economic and it was clear from the beginning

even that failed though

at least you never converted to euros .


----------



## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

anna1 said:


> It was never purely economic and it was clear from the beginning
> 
> even that failed though
> 
> at least you never converted to euros .


 Everything was better before fu**ing Euro


----------



## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

Frandeman said:


> Everything was better before fu**ing Euro


 We lived like kings in Greece on cheap drachma lol

2 days after euro introduction everything was 3 times more expensive

biggest scam of the century


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Out with no deal is the only way... f**k em. Being ruled by foreign EU bureaucrats from a different land is just madness. Many many people gave their lives to protect our country, our way of life, democracy and freedoms in WW2. They could not do it then by force so they now try through the stealth of politics. The people has spoken... Lets get the f**k out of Dodge before its to late and were fighting against the Ruskies as part of the EU army...!!! FFS I mean an EU armed force.. Alarm bells should be ringing people history is repeating its self. The UK will leave, some s**t will happen and the EU will oppress nation states or f**k the Ruskies off and war WILL break out. The UK and US will intervene once again and crush the dictatorship thus liberating all of Europe from its grasp.

Who do you think you are kidding Mr Juncker?


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Britain is called great for a reason. As an island nation we the Brits have thwarted many an invasion since records began. There is a certain pig pigheadedness and strong sense of f**k YOU buried deep within our souls, our culture and a warrior mind set ingrained in our DNA.. In short were the people are hard as f**k and will only take so much. I would rather live off nothing more than rabbit meat and starve than bow down to the EU bureaucrats who dictate to what we can have or cant have. They are even trying to control us as we leave. f**k em. someone in our government needs to grow a pair and play hard ball with these EU lot.

Are we being invaded through stealth with the free movement of people? Are we in the early stages of the great replacement ...? 

@Ken Hutchinson I know how you do like the conspiracy theories


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

The-Real-Deal said:


> Britain is called great for a reason.


 Yes, its great as in big, as apposed to little Britain aka Ireland.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Denied said:


> Yes, its great as in big, as apposed to little Britain aka Ireland.


 But Britain is only Ikle in terms of size... !


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

The-Real-Deal said:


> But Britain is only Ikle in terms of size... !


 But its bigger than, Ireland that was known as little Britain and probably the largest island the romans, who named it big and little Britain had come across.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

The uk fits 40 times inside the US. they have 11 states bigger than the uk..

France is 3 x larger than the uk with a similar size population yet Calais is bursting with migrants trying to reach our shores... Go figure.


----------



## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Denied said:


> But its bigger than, Ireland that was known as little Britain and probably the largest island the romans, who named it big and little Britain had come across.


 Yeah, the barbarians were kicking the Romans arse's on many fronts so the were recalled to Rome.


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## superpube (Feb 18, 2015)

The-Real-Deal said:


> Out with no deal is the only way... f**k em. Being ruled by foreign EU bureaucrats from a different land is just madness. Many many people gave their lives to protect our country, our way of life, democracy and freedoms in WW2. They could not do it then by force so they now try through the stealth of politics. The people has spoken... Lets get the f**k out of Dodge before its to late and were *fighting against the Ruskies as part of the EU army...!!! FFS I mean an EU armed force.. Alarm bells should be ringing people history is repeating its self. The UK will leave, some s**t will happen and the EU will oppress nation states or f**k the Ruskies off and war WILL break out. *The UK and US will intervene once again and crush the dictatorship thus liberating all of Europe from its grasp.
> 
> Who do you think you are kidding Mr Juncker?


 I have literally foreseen this happening in a (bad) trip. US was bankrupt so couldn't/wouldn't help us.

Didn't end well.. That's partly why I voted leave.

Seen Threads? That was nicer than this turned out.


----------



## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

Look at all the EU leaders expressing concern and regret at the failed brexit vote.

IN OTHER WORDS THEY ARE SHITTING IT AND A FAT RECESSION ACROSS THE EU IS SLIDING UNDER THE DOOR, thereby causing already bankrupt and semi bankrupt economies to drag France and Germany down

We will end up with a good situation don't worry


----------



## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

superpube said:


> I have literally foreseen this happening in a (bad) trip. US was bankrupt so couldn't/wouldn't help us.
> 
> Didn't end well.. That's partly why I voted leave.
> 
> Seen Threads? That was nicer than this turned out.


 Yeah mate its only speculation with a little bit of poetic licence thrown in


----------



## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

spod said:


> We didn't.
> 
> We voted to join the EEC - a purely economic union.
> 
> Little by little, our corrupt political class have frittered away UK sovereignty. This is the last chance we'll have to get it back.


 What sovereignty have we lost exactly? I see this argument all the time "We need our sovereignty back!" as if we're living under Sharia law or something. Which laws foisted onto us by the EU would you have reversed and more importantly which do you think the public as a whole would want reversed?


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

jwbs said:


> Ahhh hello UK. I see you come to China to buy our steel. What's that you say? You're no longer part of the EU? Well then UK, this is great news for you. We shall give you cheaper steel than we give to the EU. Why such a generous offer? It's because you are hugely important country UK. You are so large and powerful, and you export so much. We in China are keen to make less profit on steel, and you sell us so many goods and services, far more than the EU does. So we shall generously sell you our steel at a cheaper price.


 This is very true. It was always a hard brexiteer pipe dream that the UK on it's own will be able to strike better trade deals than the EU. The UK has way less purchasing power than the EU as a block, and a way smaller consumer market. There may be some niche areas where better deals may be possible, but on the whole independent trade deals will be worse.

The big players like China and the US are not going to piss off a bigger trading partner(the EU) by giving a smaller partner(the UK) better deals across the board. That is surely just common sense.


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

jwbs said:


> What sovereignty have we lost exactly? I see this argument all the time "We need our sovereignty back!" as if we're living under Sharia law or something. Which laws foisted onto us by the EU would you have reversed and more importantly which do you think the public as a whole would want reversed?


 Well probably the biggest one was taking (partial) control of UK borders. Forcing the UK to accept uncontrolled immigration from Europe. That has to be considered quite an encroachment on sovereignty.

I voted remain because I believed the pros of free trade outweighed the negatives of EU political sprawl. But TBH I think the current deal and political framework goes a long way in curtailing EU political governance while also allowing free trade to continue. And at this point I just want to see democracy upheld. Regardless of the consequences.


----------



## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

MM84 said:


> A close second to @unclezillion's post !!!


 Please don't compare me to that mentalist. Look at his posts. He's nuttier than squirrel s**t.


----------



## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

The-Real-Deal said:


> The uk fits 40 times inside the US. they have 11 states bigger than the uk..
> 
> France is 3 x larger than the uk with a similar size population yet Calais is bursting with migrants trying to reach our shores... Go figure.


 Even migrants don't want to live with the French. Thank God for the channel I say.


----------



## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

MickeyE said:


> The big players like China and the US are not going to piss off a bigger trading partner(the EU) by giving a smaller partner(the UK) better deals across the board. That is surely just common sense.


 China would like to prize us away from the US and would offer us a good deal.

In fact Russia would like to court us for those same reasons

And have you seen how many f**ks trump has given about ruffling feathers in the EU over cars and China over trade

There are always countries willing to make deals


----------



## arbffgadm100 (Jun 3, 2016)

Fu**ing hell. Biggest collection of cu**s with an IQ under 70 I've ever seen posting in one thread on the internet.

Some of you guys are literally morons and the reason this country is f**ked isn't because of some ideological bullshit about the evil ambitions of a corrupt ruling class. It's because you're fu**ing stupid. You vote with extreme predjuice on issues you haven't first fu**ing clue about, because you're too fu**ing lazy to do your homework and thus are completely uneducated on the majority of issues.... and then you complain when politicians have to clear up your fu**ing mess.

No deal at all would be a total, unmitigated disaster.


----------



## vetran (Oct 17, 2009)

Even De gea Carnt save May now


----------



## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

arbffgadm100 said:


> Fu**ing hell. Biggest collection of cu**s with an IQ under 70 I've ever seen posting in one thread on the internet.
> 
> Some of you guys are literally morons and the reason this country is f**ked isn't because of some ideological bullshit about the evil ambitions of a corrupt ruling classs. It's because you're fu**ing stupid. You vote with extreme predjuice on issues you haven't first fu**ing clue about, because you're too fu**ing lazy to do your homework and thus are completely uneducated on the majority of issues.... and then you complain when politicians have to clear up your fu**ing mess.
> 
> No deal at all would be a total, unmitigated disaster.


 Hey, don't be so angry, you may have been turned down for gender reassignment this time, but don't worry my higher rate of tax will pay for the next one.

:whistling:


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

GTT said:


> China would like to prize us away from the US and would offer us a good deal.
> 
> In fact Russia would like to court us for those same reasons
> 
> ...


 The UK makes up around 17% of EU economic output. The EU is China's biggest trading partner.

Think of like this. if you owned a business and your biggest customer had some internal wranglings and a couple of it's directors decided to go off and form their own company. The new company was approx 6 x smaller than your original customer...Would you risk p1ssing off your best customer by giving this new company a better deal than they get?

The US would pretty much be the same as above.

I'm not saying no countries will "make deals" with the UK, trade will continue. But it's just a fantasy that somehow as a much smaller economic entity we are all of a sudden going to able to strike better trade deals than the EU.


----------



## vetran (Oct 17, 2009)

Am I missing the point here ? I thought the majority of the country voted out so as to get rid of the migrants ,fck the trade deals lets get the No 1 priority job done first :thumbup1:


----------



## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

MickeyE said:


> Well probably the biggest one was taking (partial) control of UK borders. Forcing the UK to accept uncontrolled immigration from Europe. That has to be considered quite an encroachment on sovereignty.
> 
> I voted remain because I believed the pros of free trade outweighed the negatives of EU political sprawl. But TBH I think the current deal and political framework goes a long way in curtailing EU political governance while also allowing free trade to continue. And at this point I just want to see democracy upheld. Regardless of the consequences.


 Thing is though, is European migration really that big of a problem for us? I'd say probably not. We have far too much immigration sure, but it's a combination of EU migration (easily integrated) and then the rest is from the middle east and Africa. I think the second category has a far greater negative effect on our infrastructure and society in general. And let's be honest, leaving the EU will do sod all to curb immigration. They (the politicians) know we're sick of it (I think a recent poll said that 80+% want a substantial decrease in immigration) - if they were so keen to do our will and drastically slow the pace of immigration, what exactly is stopping them from reducing non-EU immigration? There must be a reason (or several), and they won't say. My guess is that they just can't stop it. In the short term it would be quite expensive and difficult, and that's all they give a toss about. They don't care what our country will look like in 30 years because they'll be off enjoying their fat pensions and benefiting from the flood of cheap labour.


----------



## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

vetran said:


> Am I missing the point here ? I thought the majority of the country voted out so as to get rid of the migrants ,fck the trade deals lets get the No 1 job done first :thumbup1:


 That's why most people voted to leave. Do you think that leaving the EU will reduce immigration though? I don't. They already know it's too high (for us, the British population). They've known for years, yet they do nothing about it, leading to this, which will also not help the issue.


----------



## unclezillion (Sep 17, 2017)

jwbs said:


> That's why most people voted to leave. Do you think that leaving the EU will reduce immigration though? I don't. They already know it's too high (for us, the British population). They've known for years, yet they do nothing about it, leading to this, which will also not help the issue.


 its very simple if there are no jobs there will be no migrants.

Britain has had waves of immigration over the centuries and the majority of the British people have foreign DNA. .

See here


----------



## empzb (Jan 8, 2006)

MickeyE said:


> Well probably the biggest one was taking (partial) control of UK borders. Forcing the UK to accept uncontrolled immigration from Europe. That has to be considered quite an encroachment on sovereignty.
> 
> I voted remain because I believed the pros of free trade outweighed the negatives of EU political sprawl. But TBH I think the current deal and political framework goes a long way in curtailing EU political governance while also allowing free trade to continue. And at this point I just want to see democracy upheld. Regardless of the consequences.


 Except under EU law we have control and could deport people who hadn't found work after a certain period of time. May hasn't.

And you think if we have a decent trade deal with China or India they won't want immigration laws relaxed? That'll be even worse.

The issue with democracy on this scale is.

1. Leavers were too broadly scoped. Told too many false promises. Did you vote for hard borders everywhere? What about NI? Did you just want to stop freedom of movement? Did you want EEA style? What about Scotland and NI voting for in? Even so while part of UK? Was it just for 350m a month for the NHS?

2. The vote was 'close' so while democratically we should uphold the vote, there will still be at least 16m unhappy people (probably more now voting ages come around / more people see the s**t storm we have in power and understand the options available etc)

As bad as it was, Mays deal was the best compromise for all, but leavers think we could get a better one (why would they want a deal at all if they were solely wanting to attempt wto approach?) and remainers agree it's worse in every way we have now.


----------



## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Just to expand on this, are you saying that the EU is far from democracy given there isn't a periodical vote as to whether we want to be in or out?
> 
> So you say that the govt couldn't lead a moth to a flame yet they should decide whether we are in or out?
> 
> I think that the whole issue proves that they all talk a load of boolocks and then deal with it later.


 I mean that its a governmental decision. not that our govt is in any competent


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## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

unclezillion said:


> its very simple if there are no jobs there will be no migrants.
> 
> Britain has had waves of immigration over the centuries and the majority of the British people have foreign DNA. .
> 
> See here


 Well, possibly that's the most absurdly simple analysis of immigration I've ever seen. Yes Britain has had waves of immigration over the centuries, millenia even, and of course we all have DNA from people from various parts of the world. There has never been such a sustained period of immigration that we've had over the past 30 years though. "About 70% of the population increase between the 2001 and 2011 censuses was due to foreign-born immigration. 7.5 million people (11.9% of the population at the time)" (Wikipedia). A 12% increase in population over 10 years, mainly from immigration. That's amazing.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Finding it funny, a country with a history of colonizing other countries is unable to uncolonize itself.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

unclezillion said:


> its very simple if there are no jobs there will be no migrants.
> 
> Britain has had waves of immigration over the centuries and the majority of the British people have foreign DNA. .
> 
> See here


 Are there any countries whose population doesn't contain 'foreign DNA'?


----------



## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

Jordan08 said:


> Finding it funny, a country with a history of colonizing other countries is unable to uncolonize itself.


 Oh I think the countries population could comfortably do it , it the s**t house politicians that are at fault .


----------



## D 4 Damage (Dec 14, 2017)

arbffgadm100 said:


> Fu**ing hell. Biggest collection of cu**s with an IQ under 70 I've ever seen posting in one thread on the internet.
> 
> Some of you guys are literally morons and the reason this country is f**ked isn't because of some ideological bullshit about the evil ambitions of a corrupt ruling class. It's because you're fu**ing stupid. You vote with extreme predjuice on issues you haven't first fu**ing clue about, because you're too fu**ing lazy to do your homework and thus are completely uneducated on the majority of issues.... and then you complain when politicians have to clear up your fu**ing mess.
> 
> No deal at all would be a total, unmitigated disaster.


 Pritty heavey period this month then? Yeah?


----------



## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Old n fat said:


> Oh I think the countries population could comfortably do it , it the s**t house positions that are at fault .


 Countries Population can never do it. No matter which period which country. It's all lies in the hands of powerful and corrupts.


----------



## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

Jordan08 said:


> Countries Population can never do it. No matter which period which country. It's all lies in the hands of powerful and corrupts.


 The french did it !


----------



## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Old n fat said:


> The french did it !


 Yup. Did it. Resulted in a chaos of a decade at that time. Imagine now when the economies are too dynamic. It might push the country way back.


----------



## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

D 4 Damage said:


> Pritty heavey period this month then? Yeah?


 You have to admit it's a well thought out and structured counter argument to a no deal Brexit. You could see he mulled over it for a long time


----------



## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

arbffgadm100 said:


> Fu**ing hell. Biggest collection of cu**s with an IQ under 70 I've ever seen posting in one thread on the internet.
> 
> Some of you guys are literally morons and the reason this country is f**ked isn't because of some ideological bullshit about the evil ambitions of a corrupt ruling class. It's because you're fu**ing stupid. You vote with extreme predjuice on issues you haven't first fu**ing clue about, because you're too fu**ing lazy to do your homework and thus are completely uneducated on the majority of issues.... and then you complain when politicians have to clear up your fu**ing mess.
> 
> No deal at all would be a total, unmitigated disaster.


 Typical response from a whiny whinging remoaner who didn't get his way. Don't worry mate, you have plenty of time to relocate to an EU country if you love them so much. Britain will be better off without you. :thumb


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

jwbs said:


> Thing is though, is European migration really that big of a problem for us? I'd say probably not. We have far too much immigration sure, but it's a combination of EU migration (easily integrated) and then the rest is from the middle east and Africa. I think the second category has a far greater negative effect on our infrastructure and society in general. And let's be honest, leaving the EU will do sod all to curb immigration. They (the politicians) know we're sick of it (I think a recent poll said that 80+% want a substantial decrease in immigration) - if they were so keen to do our will and drastically slow the pace of immigration, what exactly is stopping them from reducing non-EU immigration? There must be a reason (or several), and they won't say. My guess is that they just can't stop it. In the short term it would be quite expensive and difficult, and that's all they give a toss about. They don't care what our country will look like in 30 years because they'll be off enjoying their fat pensions and benefiting from the flood of cheap labour.


 I'm not against any immigration. I'm a 2nd generation immigrant myself, my dad was born in the West Indies. But I think it is preferable for any nation to be able decide it's own immigration policy. So you can plan what resources are going to be needed in terms of school places, healthcare, housing etc.

So the EU forcing each country to open it's borders to all other member states IMO is a clear erosion of sovereignty . lol I'm sounding like a right wing nut now!

But as I said previously, I voted remain because from what the EU were saying pre referendum, they would not allow free trade to continue without freedom of movement.

But I believe the deal on the table will continue free trade and allow the UK to take back control of immigration.


----------



## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

Jordan08 said:


> Yup. Did it. Resulted in a chaos of a decade at that time. Imagine now when the economies are too dynamic. It might push the country way back.


 Low life like us won't feel anything good from this for a decade . Even if it turns out to be the best thing the uk ever did . It takes a long time for anything to filter down to us at the bottom after all this is Brittan ..

I'm fluid enough (by choice) to evolve with this situation. My mrs is Czech so it's been a black cloud at times she has been invited by the government to become a citizen but hasn't yet done that . You just have to make a choice on how much you are willing for this to take from you .


----------



## D 4 Damage (Dec 14, 2017)

JohhnyC said:


> You have to admit it's a well thought out and structured counter argument to a no deal Brexit. You could see he mulled over it for a long time


 Yeah, not just the same old people that disagree with me are all stupid and prejudice rant


----------



## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

MickeyE said:


> I'm not against immigration. I'm a 2nd generation immigrant myself, my dad was born in the West Indies. But I think it is preferable for any nation to be able decide it's own immigration policy. So you can plan what resources are going to be needed in terms of school places, healthcare, housing etc.
> 
> So the EU forcing each country to open it's borders to all other member states IMO is a clear erosion of sovereignty . lol I'm sounding like a right wing nut now!
> 
> ...


 This idea doesn't take into account all of the non-Eu immigration though. Like yourself I'm not anti-immigration. I do think that the current levels of immigration aren't good though, and someone that is anti-EU can say that the EU is forcing this on us, but IMO this is clearly not the case when you look at how much immigration comes from non-EU countries. As you say, a country should be able to maintain the integrity of its borders, so given the fact that the majority of the population objects to the amount of immigration (EU and non-EU), and the government seems to be unwilling or unable to reduce the level of non-EU immigration (I don't think we're obliged by EU common border policy to accept immigrants from Bangladesh for example), I can't see how the EU are responsible for the huge levels of immigration into this country.


----------



## dann19900 (Dec 29, 2012)

Can't wait personally, I doubt it will be good for our economy in the short term (maybe never) but it will be just as bad for the big EU countries, they should of offered us a better deal.
Germany & France's GDP will take a hit as soon as we leave, they'll fail on all of their promises regarding cutting deficits etc. Ireland will also take a big hit and come crying for another bailout in the next year or 2 and the big EU countries will have to pay much more without us contributing.


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

empzb said:


> Except under EU law we have control and could deport people who hadn't found work after a certain period of time. May hasn't.
> 
> And you think if we have a decent trade deal with China or India they won't want immigration laws relaxed? That'll be even worse.
> 
> ...


 I don't believe EU nationals can currently be removed if they don't find work. AFAIA they have the same rights as UK nationals in terms of NHS access, school places etc. I believe there are some limitations on out of work benefits they can get, but I'm pretty certain they can't be removed for not finding work.

Either way, to me it's common sense that if you can, you decide your own policy and make your own plans for immigration.

IMO May's deal really is not bad. It's just been battered down by MPs from both extremes and by the media and IMO the sheeple in general are just going along with this narrative "it's a terrible deal" without really bothering to look into it in any detail.

It's not just leave MPs that are saying it's a bad deal it's all the Labour MP (remainers) too. On the hard brexit side, the MPs are saying the Ireland backstop agreement locks the UK into a customs union indefinitely. Then you have Labour MPs saying they don't like the deal because it takes us out of the customs union.... The SNP don't really want to be part of the UK anyway, so obviously they're not going to vote for any type of brexit. So it's a clusterfuk of contradiction and different agendas why both sides are against it.

The deal allows the UK to end uncontrolled freedom of movement, curtails EU power over UK legislation, takes us out of the common fisheries(which was another big issue for leave voters), and allows free trade to continue.


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## ILLBehaviour (Dec 20, 2014)

#excited


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## Cypionate (Jan 17, 2016)

ILLBehaviour said:


> #excited


 #veryexcited


----------



## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Are there any countries whose population doesn't contain 'foreign DNA'?


 These guys?


----------



## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Goranchero said:


> These guys?


 Give theem 5yrs and their groups will have some.


----------



## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

arbffgadm100 said:


> Fu**ing hell. Biggest collection of cu**s with an IQ under 70 I've ever seen posting in one thread on the internet.
> 
> Some of you guys are literally morons and the reason this country is f**ked isn't because of some ideological bullshit about the evil ambitions of a corrupt ruling class. It's because you're fu**ing stupid. You vote with extreme predjuice on issues you haven't first fu**ing clue about, because you're too fu**ing lazy to do your homework and thus are completely uneducated on the majority of issues.... and then you complain when politicians have to clear up your fu**ing mess.
> 
> No deal at all would be a total, unmitigated disaster.


 I have read some guff in my time but this post took it to another level, Jesus wept.


----------



## Archaic (Mar 8, 2010)

I don't think many people in this Country wants this bollox to go on for another 2yrs tbh.... Do another referendum and get the same result, then what? We do the best out of 5 until get the bloody remain vote they want??? It's already been decided, and we're looking like idiots on the World stage thanks to the incompetence of the current PM/Cabinet in power.

Nobody want Corbyn as PM either. Not even most of his own party, and Me included. I'm a Labour voter!

May needs to resign, it's the only way forward IMO. Should have resigned after those stupid embarrassing Cringing dance moves last year.


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## unclezillion (Sep 17, 2017)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Are there any countries whose population doesn't contain 'foreign DNA'?


 i guess the first humans had no foreign DNA  10% of Brits have viking DNA for instance, 20% plus have German (anglo saxon) etc etc


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## Fletch68 (Mar 17, 2013)

vetran said:


> Am I missing the point here ? I thought the majority of the country voted out so as to get rid of the migrants ,fck the trade deals lets get the No 1 priority job done first :thumbup1:


 If that was the case they mistakenly voted then. Mass immigration into the UK will happen with or without any Brexit deal. And it will continue to happen because no government will send them back or even decrease numbers. Apparently no English people are willing to do certain jobs that pay a certain amount. Factory jobs, cleaning jobs and labouring work etc etc. Tens of thousands of Romanians will be entertaining the UK every month of 2019.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

arbffgadm100 said:


> Fu**ing hell. Biggest collection of cu**s with an IQ under 70 I've ever seen posting in one thread on the internet.
> 
> Some of you guys are literally morons and the reason this country is f**ked isn't because of some ideological bullshit about the evil ambitions of a corrupt ruling class. It's because you're fu**ing stupid. You vote with extreme predjuice on issues you haven't first fu**ing clue about, because you're too fu**ing lazy to do your homework and thus are completely uneducated on the majority of issues.... and then you complain when politicians have to clear up your fu**ing mess.
> 
> *No deal at all would be a total, unmitigated disaster.*


 Pussy remoaner ****tard


----------



## Krk (Sep 24, 2017)

jwbs said:


> Ahhh hello UK. I see you come to China to buy our steel. What's that you say? You're no longer part of the EU? Well then UK, this is great news for you. We shall give you cheaper steel than we give to the EU. Why such a generous offer? It's because you are hugely important country UK. You are so large and powerful, and you export so much. We in China are keen to make less profit on steel, and you sell us so many goods and services, far more than the EU does. So we shall generously sell you our steel at a cheaper price.


 Countries that export are not important to China. The 5th largest economy in the world which IMPORTS everything is a hugely attractive trading partner.

China don't want to buy goods. They keep their currency low so they can export. That is why their steel is cheap. EU tarrifs make it expensive.

Nowhere near as much of a smart ass as you think your are. Your post is nonsense.


----------



## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)




----------



## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

Krk said:


> Countries that export are not important to China. The 5th largest economy in the world which IMPORTS everything is a hugely attractive trading partner.
> 
> China don't want to buy goods. They keep their currency low so they can export. That is why their steel is cheap. EU tarrifs make it expensive.
> 
> Nowhere near as much of a smart ass as you think your are. Your post is nonsense.


 You know the nominal value of currencies don't matter right? It's the relative value. And considering that our currency has tanked and will drop further as a result of leaving the strongest trading block in the world, and that China index' its currency vs the Dollar it really doesn't matter what the Sterling is worth vs the Yen. And as a net importer, our currency relative to the Dollar is quite important, so as it further devalues we will be worse off. I'm glad you're optimistic about it all but I'm still not sure why you would be.


----------



## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

jwbs said:


> You know the nominal value of currencies don't matter right? It's the relative value. And considering that our currency has tanked and will drop further as a result of leaving the strongest trading block in the world, and that China index' its currency vs the Dollar it really doesn't matter what the Sterling is worth vs the Yen. And as a net importer, our currency relative to the Dollar is quite important, so as it further devalues we will be worse off. I'm glad you're optimistic about it all but I'm still not sure why you would be.


 Stop being a gaylord, our currency will go up v the euro after the initial wobble is over.


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

Krk said:


> Countries that export are not important to China. The 5th largest economy in the world which IMPORTS everything is a hugely attractive trading partner.
> 
> *China don't want to buy goods.* They keep their currency low so they can export. That is why their steel is cheap. EU tarrifs make it expensive.
> 
> Nowhere near as much of a smart ass as you think your are. Your post is nonsense.


 China is the 2nd biggest importing nation in the world behind the US.


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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

MickeyE said:


> China is the 2nd biggest importing nation in the world behind the US.


 But they are the biggest nation in the world, so not surprising they are by proxy the biggest of a lot of things


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## SG83 (Mar 16, 2016)

MickeyE said:


> I don't believe EU nationals can currently be removed if they don't find work. AFAIA they have the same rights as UK nationals in terms of NHS access, school places etc. I believe there are some limitations on out of work benefits they can get, but I'm pretty certain they can't be removed for not finding work.


 You are wrong I'm afraid. EU citizens have 3 months to find a job. if they do not, they can be removed. Other EU countries excercise that law, UK seems not to


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

GTT said:


> But they are the biggest nation in the world, so not surprising they are by proxy the biggest of a lot of things


 Yes of course. But that doesn't change the fact that they're a huge player in terms of imports as well as exports


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

SG83 said:


> You are wrong I'm afraid. EU citizens have 3 months to find a job. if they do not, they can be removed. Other EU countries excercise that law, UK seems not to


 Yeh I wasn't 100% sure about. Found this

"Existing EU rules allow states to deport citizens from other EU countries if they have become a burden on the welfare system of the state.* UK law suggests this occurs after six months of unsuccessfully looking for work*, but it is not clear how many people have been removed from the UK on this basis. The UK will have no additional powers in this area as a result of David Cameron's EU deal in February."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36449974

TBH it really makes no difference to the point of my original post.


----------



## unclezillion (Sep 17, 2017)

Krk said:


> Countries that export are not important to China. The 5th largest economy in the world which IMPORTS everything is a hugely attractive trading partner.
> 
> China don't want to buy goods. They keep their currency low so they can export. That is why their steel is cheap. EU tarrifs make it expensive.
> 
> Nowhere near as much of a smart ass as you think your are. Your post is nonsense.


 The EU wanted to put tarrifs on Chinese steel, however, it was vetoed bu the UK tories and as a result more UK factories producing steel closed.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

MickeyE said:


> The people were told before the last referendum by the vast majority of economic experts and business leaders that any brexit would do significant damage to the UK. but the people still went ahead and voted for it.


 Note that my comment you quoted was specifically in relation to a no-deal Brexit, whilst the pre-referendum predictions you can argue people decided was worth the trade-off were for leaving with some form of deal. These situations and therefore forecasts are very different.


----------



## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

GTT said:


> Stop being a gaylord, our currency will go up v the euro after the initial wobble is over.


 No need to be insulting mate. And I'm not talking about Euro vs Pound. You don't think the Euro is taking a hit from this? (clue - it is). Look at Dollar vs Pound. "It will be fine" doesn't cut it for me tbh.


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

Labour's position on this is now farcical. Labour MPs voted down May's deal and now Corbyn won't meet May to discuss Labour's alternative proposals unless " NO deal" is taken off the table.

Corbyn has maintained all along that he could negotiate a better brexit deal. How can you do that if you take no deal off the table.

The EU then know if they don't offer you a decent deal you won't leave.

If it was ever in doubt before, Labour has no intention of following through on the result of the referendum.

And no doubt all the morons in the Labour strongholds that voted to leave, will still vote Labour at the next general election.


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## Ken Hutchinson (May 29, 2009)

The-Real-Deal said:


> Britain is called great for a reason. As an island nation we the Brits have thwarted many an invasion since records began. There is a certain pig pigheadedness and strong sense of f**k YOU buried deep within our souls, our culture and a warrior mind set ingrained in our DNA.. In short were the people are hard as f**k and will only take so much. I would rather live off nothing more than rabbit meat and starve than bow down to the EU bureaucrats who dictate to what we can have or cant have. They are even trying to control us as we leave. f**k em. someone in our government needs to grow a pair and play hard ball with these EU lot.
> 
> Are we being invaded through stealth with the free movement of people? Are we in the early stages of the great replacement ...?
> 
> @Ken Hutchinson I know how you do like the conspiracy theories


 I try and keep out of all the conspiracy stuff these days, because people think you are mad, May was told by her masters to have an election two years ago, to achieve exactly what it has done, why would you risk an election when she had a massive majority, they have been fudging about hoping someway it all gets cancelled, all this sh1t about a peoples vote, we the people had our vote, and it was to leave, this so-called movement about a peoples vote is being put together by very rich men who are not happy with the way we voted, they think that by calling it the peoples vote all the usual plebs with get involved..


----------



## TURBS (Oct 21, 2013)

MickeyE said:


> Labour's position on this is now farcical. Labour MPs voted down May's deal and now Corbyn won't meet May to discuss Labour's alternative proposals unless " NO deal" is taken off the table.
> 
> Corbyn has maintained all along that he could negotiate a better brexit deal. How can you do that if you take no deal off the table.
> 
> ...


 Bit like a new girlfriend saying I have a really fit body under these sweats, I'm an animal in bed and will do whatever you want... but you can't even kiss me until you leave your wife


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

TERBO said:


> Bit like a new girlfriend saying I have a really fit body under these sweats, I'm an animal in bed and will do whatever you want... but you can't even kiss me until you leave your wife


 What about the gays??


----------



## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

jjtreml said:


> What about the gays??


 Jesus loves you :thumb


----------



## Tomahawk (Dec 24, 2014)

JohhnyC said:


> On the 9th of Dec Theresa May warned of the dangers of "unchartered waters" by not accepting her deal i.e. a no deal Brexit . Thats says it all. The very foundation and backbone of Britain was forged by exploring""uncharted waters"


 The foundation of backbone of Britain was imperialisation and corruption, collecting wealth and influence. Without that, the UK is just a developing nation. In 25-50 years it will be one of the worst slums in the world.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Frandeman said:


> Jesus loves you :thumb


 Are you trying to say that jesus was a homosexual? Thats offensive and wrong


----------



## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

I'm saddened by the absolute lack of vision and balls, good job there was just enough of us left to bring about brexit, for everyone else just f**k of to France it suits you better


----------



## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

Ken Hutchinson said:


> I try and keep out of all the conspiracy stuff these days, because people think you are mad, May was told by her masters to have an election two years ago, to achieve exactly what it has done, why would you risk an election when she had a massive majority, they have been fudging about hoping someway it all gets cancelled, all this sh1t about a peoples vote, we the people had our vote, and it was to leave, this so-called movement about a peoples vote is being put together by very rich men who are not happy with the way we voted, they think that by calling it the peoples vote all the usual plebs with get involved..


 May didn't have a massive majority, it was Cameron's and it was only a 12 seat majority, not very big. There's always an argument when any government appoints a new leader without a general election, that the new leader doesn't really have a public mandate. The reason why the Tories called another general election after May was appointed was so that she'd have a strong public mandate of her own going into negotiations with the EU.

Following the referendum and seeing as the Tories were the party most committed to delivering brexit, the Tories didn't think for a second that they wouldn't end up winning by a majority. There you go, never count on the electorate to do anything predictable.


----------



## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

MickeyE said:


> May didn't have a massive majority, it was Cameron's and it was only a 12 seat majority, not very big. There's always an argument when any government appoints a new leader without a general election, that the new leader doesn't really have a public mandate. The reason why the Tories called another general election after May was appointed was so that she'd have a strong public mandate of her own going into negotiations with the EU.
> 
> Following the referendum and seeing as the Tories were the party most committed to delivering brexit, the Tories didn't think for a second that they wouldn't end up winning by a majority. There you go, never count on the electorate to do anything predictable.


 She's a great dancer though.


----------



## MarkyMark (Jul 14, 2015)

Ken Hutchinson said:


> I try and keep out of all the conspiracy stuff these days, because people think you are mad, May was told by her masters to have an election two years ago, to achieve exactly what it has done, why would you risk an election when she had a massive majority, they have been fudging about hoping someway it all gets cancelled, all this sh1t about a peoples vote, we the people had our vote, and it was to leave, this so-called movement about a peoples vote is being put together by very rich men who are not happy with the way we voted, they think that by calling it the peoples vote all the usual plebs with get involved..


 I mostly agree with this but on the contrary the campaigns building up to the referendum made a considerable portion of "the people" vote leave when a whole lot of it was hogwash and the MPs knew this.

With that said all MPs do is lie so its just another day at the office i guess.


----------



## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)




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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

EpicSquats said:


> She's a great dancer though.


 May has praying mantis arms, the longest arms I've ever seen

I do worry if the UK faced a huge war requiring conscription, how many people would try and dive away from it


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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

I've never been involved in a protest or indeed a riot.

But I really beleive if somehow this referendum gets recast or overturned I would take to the street with a balaclava on


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

GTT said:


> I've never been involved in a protest or indeed a riot.
> 
> But I really beleive if somehow this referendum gets recast or overturned I would take to the street with a balaclava on


 You won't, people in the UK just love to bitch and moan all day long but no one will bother 'taking to the streets' and protesting in full force, maybe a couple hundred here and there but not enough to concern the establishment.

If the people actually felt that strongly about brexit we would of seen rioting/strikes and mass protesting by now.


----------



## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

jjtreml said:


> You won't, people in the UK just love to bitch and moan all day long but no one will bother 'taking to the streets' and protesting in full force, maybe a couple hundred here and there but not enough to concern the establishment.
> 
> If the people actually felt that strongly about brexit we would of seen rioting/strikes and mass protesting by now.


 'Normal people' are more worried about ensuring their mortgage payments are met than going out protesting.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> 'Normal people' are more worried about ensuring their mortgage payments are met than going out protesting.


 Exactly, people don't have the time or energy to bother.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

jjtreml said:


> Exactly, people don't have the time or energy to bother.


 And that is why Maggie Thatcher brought in 'Right to Buy' amongst many other things that keeps order in society. :thumbup1:


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> And that is why Maggie Thatcher brought in 'Right to Buy' amongst many other things that keeps order in society. :thumbup1:


 She also tried to introduce the poll tax, which finished her off politically. Now they were real riots!!

Blair and Thatcher both tried to cling onto power for far too long.


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## jwbs (Oct 1, 2014)

jjtreml said:


> She also tried to introduce the poll tax, which finished her off politically. Now they were real riots!!
> 
> Blair and Thatcher both tried to cling onto power for far too long.


 I disagree a bit here. Blair could have carried on (it was only Brown that ballsed it all up for Labour, Blair would have had another term, had he wanted it). Look at Merkel for a first minister that grossly outstayed her welcome. I was quite shocked when I heard that she'd finally given up the ghost - 5 years too late. Blair's exit was drastically different to Maggie. Her own party gave her the boot, never mind the electorate at large.


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## Fletch68 (Mar 17, 2013)

There will be another referendum but this time the result will go in the other direction but will that be the end of it? I'm still voting the same way and am getting heartily fed up with all this bulls**t in parliament. It looks like they are going to turn democracy on its head by looking to remain. I don't effing want to remain and the vote was to leave.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

I see my mate Nige has started his own party, The New Brexit Party. Now there's someone to vote for if they keep on playing silly buggers and a general election is called.


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## TURBS (Oct 21, 2013)

MFM said:


> I see my mate Nige has started his own party, The New Brexit Party. Now there's someone to vote for if they keep on playing silly buggers and a general election is called.


 I'm in and following


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

MFM said:


> I see my mate Nige has started his own party, The New Brexit Party. Now there's someone to vote for if they keep on playing silly buggers and a general election is called.


 Its Controlled 'opposition'

Don't be fooled by this, its all a rigged game to give the people the illusion of choice/democracy.

Voting is and has always been a complete waste of time.


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

jjtreml said:


> Voting is and has always been a complete waste of time.


 Tell that to the Americans who voted Trump in. :lol:


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

MFM said:


> Tell that to the Americans who voted Trump in. :lol:


 Trump/clinton, may/corbyn.....same sh*t, different ar$ehole.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Brexit is a f*cking mess. Remain and half the people feel betrayed, leave with or without a deal and half the people feel betrayed.

One of the big issues with the whole thing I think is that the UK was prepared to make a massive constitutional change on a vote with just a few percentage points difference between yes and no.

Almost every democracy around the world will not make any major constitutional changes without a two thirds majority, usually both in the popular vote and in the different houses of parliament/representation. This is, I think, a sensible safeguard against massively impactful decisions being made with a too slender majority which can easily simply be a reflection of fickleness at the time that is later regretted. It also ensures that if a decision is supported it will have a majority of people working together in unison to make it happen.

Tbh I'm happy to not be living there any more to hear it all and am glad to be here in the US where the government is boring and quiet, everyone agrees on everything, and there is no controversy on anything....


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

dtlv said:


> Brexit is a f*cking mess. Remain and half the people feel betrayed, leave with or without a deal and half the people feel betrayed.
> 
> One of the big issues with the whole thing I think is that the UK was prepared to make a massive constitutional change on a vote with just a few percentage points difference between yes and no.
> 
> ...


 Well there is also a very strong argument that the UK being taken into a political union with the EU was a "massive constitutional change" and there was absolutely zero public consultation over that, (never mind a slim majority vote). The UK voted in 1975 to join an economic union with Europe not a political one. Since then the EU(as a body) has slowly wrestled away more and more legislative and political power from member states, to the point where member states cannot even decide their own immigration policies anymore. And I say that as someone who voted remain.

If there's one thing I've learned from this whole Brexit affair, it's that very few people actually give a flying fk about democracy, they all just want their own way and to fk with any democratic process.

Also , US politics is far from being "boring and quiet" . Hasn't the government been shut down there for the last few weeks due to the ongoing saga of Trump's great border wall?

The arrival of Trump has highlighted huge political and social division in the US which is far more deep rooted and difficult to solve than anything we're currently seeing in the UK with Brexit.


----------



## Baz-- (Jul 16, 2018)

The British government aren't fit for purpose. I think I would rather have eu holding there hand.

Briton could potentially do great on its own bit not with the current bunch of politicians.

Personally I don't care either way as I no longer live there.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Old man trapped in a young boys body sums up the mass exodus from Britain because of brexit lol.....


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## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

BLUE(UK) said:


> 'Normal people' are more worried about ensuring their mortgage payments are met than going out protesting.


 Exactly!

what will we be worth at the end of any process, how long will that last , good or bad .

If you ask me it's already begun . We did £28 in Asda last night , no expensive items , just healthy food and cordial . It's not sustainable, even if you can afford that you getting mediocre at best products .

Ive said it 400 times , regardless if this is good or bad for the uk , stay or leave , we are in for a financial kicking. It will be 10 years before any positives filter down to normal People's homes/lives .

the uk people face being the next big migrant population , I don't think thats an exaggeration either . Im not going to pay over the odds to live here for almost nothing in return , I could live in a warmer non eu country with a much better quality of life for lots less money.

I bet eu countries will still want us . Il move on to annas sofa for a couple of years get a tan.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Old n fat said:


> Exactly!
> 
> what will we be worth at the end of any process, how long will that last , good or bad .
> 
> ...


 What's that based on?...

Genuinely interested, i agree with the rest of your comments though.


----------



## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

jjtreml said:


> What's that based on?...
> 
> Genuinely interested, i agree with the rest of your comments though.


 Government will siphon tax off us as fast as we make it. Legislators will be flat out making all new rules and regs , that will take ten years and the government will charge us for every page of that . Businesses will want to secure investment so not going to look to spend it on wages unless absolutely have to . In short your going to get less and told it's more for a long old time .

"Because that's what success requires" it will be some rancid lazy politicians who at best does 3 hour actual work a day and gets a blowjob for lunch telling you this . So you will be skint , unable to afford food , freezing your bum off , trying not to hate yourself for not making a better life for your kids . And I stick by it , in or out this s**t is happening, there are real issues with our European future .

Here is an example of how they ignore logic to create tax revenue any why I feel so strongly we are in trouble with our own political parties (this will directly effect some homes) as a carbon emission reduction method the uk government is looking to add tax to households with solid fuel fires ...

So now they want you to pay extra for a fu**ing fire in your home ! No mention of banning plastic bags , taxing supermarkets for packing waist or putting a comity togeather to focus on India , Russia and worst of all china's outrageous pollution of earth.

They are going to smoke screen us into submission, worse part is they don't yet know what they need or want , we are in limbo and have been 2 years already , another 8 will fly by.

its time to drop the "them and us" standpoint because working class, middle class and upper class are all about to get shafted. We are a country and need each other . The politicians serve themselves and they don't like hardship . So its down to us to bare it . I want to thrive not exist .


----------



## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Old n fat said:


> Government will siphon tax off us as fast as we make it. Legislators will be flat out making all new rules and regs , that will take ten years and the government will charge us for every page of that . Businesses will want to secure investment so not going to look to spend it on wages unless absolutely have to . In short your going to get less and told it's more for a long old time .
> 
> "Because that's what success requires" it will be some rancid lazy politicians who at best does 3 hour actual work a day and gets a blowjob for lunch telling you this . So you will be skint , unable to afford food , freezing your bum off , trying not to hate yourself for not making a better life for your kids . And I stick by it , in or out this s**t is happening, there are real issues with our European future .
> 
> ...


 Agree, but this will never ever happen.

The poor always get shafted by the rich, always have always will.

Do you honestly believe that the 'upper class'.....'elites' the '1%' whatever you wanna call them are going to relinquish control,power and money and spread their wealth?

Not in a million years.

How many people in need from the uk or any other country do you see living in Buck house? ZERO....


----------



## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

jjtreml said:


> Agree, but this will never ever happen.
> 
> The poor always get shafted by the rich, always have always will.
> 
> ...


 Im not sure that's what I meant .

Umm example .

Dyson the second largest land owner in the uk announced yesterday he is relocating abroad . its already begun .

Your aware of the term old money and new money. Old = the royals. new = bill gates . Bill gate has more power than the queen of England . Probably a lot more power than some small parts of the uk (wales maybe) by power I mean financial power .


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## Matt6210 (Feb 15, 2018)

Old n fat said:


> Im not sure that's what I meant .
> 
> Umm example .
> 
> ...


 But how much can he bench?

exactly....

0 power


----------



## Frank bull (Dec 20, 2016)

No deal for me , we are the fifth largest economy in the world I'm pretty sure we can work with over 150 countries,

The e u and remainers think we will go under when we leave but I think it's the e u heading over the cliff , who's going to pay the short fall we leave ?

The French and German people want out that why the yellow vest are marching mind you if you watch BBC news you wouldn't know anything about that .


----------



## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

simonboyle said:


> I'm more interested in who will be next now.
> 
> People still think we are the only country that wanted to leave.
> 
> ...


 I want to stay in the EU. I want to move freely around Europe and have European migrants living here.


----------



## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

Matt6210 said:


> But how much can he bench?
> 
> exactly....
> 
> 0 power


 To be fair he could definitely bum you if he wanted to show domination. He'd offer a price and keep upping it til you dropped your drawers.


----------



## Matt6210 (Feb 15, 2018)

EpicSquats said:


> To be fair he could definitely bum you if he wanted to show domination. He'd offer a price and keep upping it til you dropped your drawers.


 I'd do it for a copy of windows 95 bro


----------



## simonboyle (Aug 5, 2013)

EpicSquats said:


> I want to stay in the EU. I want to move freely around Europe and have European migrants living here.


 Why'd you quote me there buddy?

And that can still happen.

Want exactly difficult before we joined the EU.

Plus you don't exactly move freely. Airport and and port travel still require you to queue and prove you're an EU citizen


----------



## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

simonboyle said:


> Why'd you quote me there buddy?
> 
> And that can still happen.
> 
> ...


 Because I don't want the countries you listed to leave the EU, because then the EU breaks up and I can't move as freely around the EU. Also, if the EU breaks up I can't go and live in other European countries or work there as easily.


----------



## simonboyle (Aug 5, 2013)

EpicSquats said:


> Because I don't want the countries you listed to leave the EU, because then the EU breaks up and I can't move as freely around the EU. Also, if the EU breaks up I can't go and live in other European countries or work there as easily.


 As it stands just now.

Maybe.

Things change.

Freedom of movement was something out in place fairly recently.

All these countries can still agree to do these things with or without the EU.

It isn't EU dependent.

Again, things change.


----------



## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

MickeyE said:


> Well there is also a very strong argument that the UK being taken into a political union with the EU was a "massive constitutional change" and there was absolutely zero public consultation over that, (never mind a slim majority vote). The UK voted in 1975 to join an economic union with Europe not a political one. Since then the EU(as a body) has slowly wrestled away more and more legislative and political power from member states, to the point where member states cannot even decide their own immigration policies anymore. And I say that as someone who voted remain.
> 
> If there's one thing I've learned from this whole Brexit affair, it's that very few people actually give a flying fk about democracy, they all just want their own way and to fk with any democratic process.
> 
> ...


 I was being sarcastic about US politics... is just as crazy here, and just as controversial.

Yep, joining the EU was un democratic. But one could argue that leaving is actually undemocratic too - or at least not representational in that, at the time of the referendum, the population of the UK was 66 million. Of that number, 42 million were entitled to vote on the question, of which 33 million did, and 17 million voted to leave. That's 17million who voted to leave and 49 million who couldn't vote, didn't vote (so presumably didn't feel strongly enough about leaving), and who voted against.

I'm not pointing this out to be anti-brexit, rather I'm pointing this out to demonstrate that the whole process was never handled in a way that was going to leave the vast majority of people satisfied with the process and it's legitimacy. This is the fault of the UK, not the EU, and leaving just puts the UK further into the hands of people who can't do a good job and without any checks and balances against them from the EU.

The whole "taking back control" slogan was a misrepresentation IMO in that the people who will get back most control from brexit, in it's current form, are not the general public but the most self interested politicians and non-elected lobbyists who have fcuked things up more than anyone else but researched their target demographics and catchphrases well enough to blame shift. I'm not necessarily against leaving, but I don't see the current crop of politicians and law makers in the UK as either trustworthy enough nor competent enough to handle it - waiting later and doing a better job of it, both in how the decision was put to the country and the development of a clear post-exit plan prior to even asking the question, would have been a far better way to do it - and backing off from the current situation and deferring to a more unifying decision making process and post-exit plan a few years in the future would be something that I can't really see a rational argument against, only an emotional one.


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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)




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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Ibiza holiday booked :thumb


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

Frandeman said:


> Ibiza holiday booked :thumb


 I want to do this (Ibiza) The mrs wants to go somewhere "cultural". Either way, kids are staying at home with gran. Might see you there but doubt it because the wife usually (well always to date) gets the final say.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Sasnak said:


> I want to do this (Ibiza) The mrs wants to go somewhere "cultural". Either way, kids are staying at home with gran. Might see you there but doubt it because the wife usually (well always to date) gets the final say.


 Morocco?


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Morocco?


 Possibly chalked up for a family holiday October half term. Looking at flying to Rabat for a few days.

The me and her only one is looking increasingly like Sorrento. Tbh I like the sound of that but I'll make out it's where she wants to go. Keep her happy.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Sasnak said:


> I want to do this (Ibiza) The mrs wants to go somewhere "cultural". Either way, kids are staying at home with gran. Might see you there but doubt it because the wife usually (well always to date) gets the final say.


 I will behave I promise :tongue10:


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

dtlv said:


> I was being sarcastic about US politics... is just as crazy here, and just as controversial.
> 
> Yep, joining the EU was un democratic. But one could argue that leaving is actually undemocratic too - or at least not representational in that, at the time of the referendum, the population of the UK was 66 million. Of that number, 42 million were entitled to vote on the question, of which 33 million did, and 17 million voted to leave. That's 17million who voted to leave and 49 million who couldn't vote, didn't vote (so presumably didn't feel strongly enough about leaving), and who voted against.
> 
> ...


 TBF there was actually a very high turnout for the EU referendum, a lot higher than in recent general elections. As for those that didn't vote you could just as easily say they didn't feel strongly enough about remaining to bother to vote. Most likely the majority didn't believe either outcome would really affect them.

As for making a "clear post exit plan" prior the referendum , due to the way the EU is structured that would have been pointless. You cannot start negotiating leave terms with the EU until you officially make a declaration to leave by triggering article 50. So you cannot make a plan for something that you do not know the details of until negotiated. This was stated countless time by the remain side of the campaign during the referendum build up.

I also don't really buy into this argument that for some reason we should have more trust in EU politicians than we should our own. At least the ones in UK parliament are more answerable to the UK public than those in Brussels.

As I said I voted remain because for me I thought staying in the free trade area was more important than the negative elements of the EU. But if there is way to stay in the economic union(or at least free trade) whilst also politically uncoupling from the EU, that would seem a good option to me. But at this point I just want to see democracy upheld, if that means another referendum or whatever else, I'm quite happy to see that.

Although I have feeling the hard Brexit side are eventually going to fall in line behind the current leave deal(maybe with slight amendments). As I think the penny is dropping that if they don't it's a very good chance there's going to be no Brexit at all.


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## BennyBlanco (Jul 4, 2018)

I'd love no deal Brexit or a Canada+ agreement, I can't see it happening though. The current Conservative party aren't fit for purpose, If nothing else, I hope if Brexit goes down in flames, that it forces the party to splinter and a real right wing conservative mainstream party forms. The only thing these prats currently conserve is themselves.

The whole of the West has stunted right due to economic conditions of the middle class from the 08 banking crisis, we've had french yellow vests rioting, poland/hungry/austria going full right wing, ditto Italy under Salvini and co., Germany's fastest growing party is now the AFD and the Chemnitz riots a few months back, as well as obviously Trump in the US and Brexit in the UK.

Being a moderate student of history, everytime we've had fiscal hardship and the people feel government isn't listening to them, it's led to a rise of fascism. Canceling Brexit outright may lead to real contempt and anger growing towards government officials so it will be interesting to see how this plays out.


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## Frank bull (Dec 20, 2016)

EpicSquats said:


> Because I don't want the countries you listed to leave the EU, because then the EU breaks up and I can't move as freely around the EU. Also, if the EU breaks up I can't go and live in other European countries or work there as easily.


 I go Malta bout 3 times a year, place is full of Serbs living and working there as far as I know Serbia isn't in the e u , I've also encountered Brazilian people jamaicans, Chinese people all living and working there , as far as I know non are in the e u .


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

Sasnak said:


> I want to do this (Ibiza) The mrs wants to go somewhere "cultural". Either way, kids are staying at home with gran. Might see you there but doubt it because the wife usually (well always to date) gets the final say.


 https://www.ibiza-spotlight.com/magazine/2015/04/feature-top-5-museums-ibiza

There. Culture.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

I voted for Brexit, and the whole thing has now just turned in to a farce!

Not living in the UK any more I have to actively look up UK news articles for it as the rest of the world doesn't give a fvck, they do think the whole situation is laughable though, the UK parliament are basically trying to derail the will of the people that they're supposed to be working for.

It's actually an embarrassing time to admit you're an Englishman.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Smitch said:


> I voted for Brexit, and the whole thing has now just turned in to a farce!
> 
> Not living in the UK any more I have to actively look up UK news articles for it as the rest of the world doesn't give a fvck, they do think the whole situation is laughable though, the UK parliament are basically trying to derail the will of the people that they're supposed to be working for.
> 
> It's actually an embarrassing time to admit you're an Englishman.


 Sad thing is, the politicians have undermined themselves to both the people they serve and those they're trying to negotiate with.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Sad thing is, the politicians have undermined themselves to both the people they serve and those they're trying to negotiate with.


 It annoys me from afar as they keep asking for a "peoples vote", which we already had nearlyb3 years ago! What if we still voted to leave, would they have a 3rd vote, then a 4th, what's the bloody difference?

They've had ages to negotiate a deal, just leave and take the WTO route, the UK is the world's 5rh largest economy, I'm sure it'll struggle through!


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Smitch said:


> It annoys me from afar as they keep asking for a "peoples vote", which we already had nearlyb3 years ago! What if we still voted to leave, would they have a 3rd vote, then a 4th, what's the bloody difference?
> 
> They've had ages to negotiate a deal, just leave and take the WTO route, the UK is the world's 5rh largest economy, I'm sure it'll struggle through!


 I've said it before, I didn't vote as I'm not too concerned if we're in or out but the reason I comment now is due to what has happened since the vote. I agree with you, this uncertainty is giving the EU the upper hand, like the govt are happy to follow through with it but are determined to ensure the people come out worse off by creating this uncertainty and dragging it out. It wouldn't surprise me if those in charge have put their money into euros and keep making the value of the pound drop with their silly nonsense ready for when they decide to cash in.

Cnuts the lot of them.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Goranchero said:


> https://www.ibiza-spotlight.com/magazine/2015/04/feature-top-5-museums-ibiza
> 
> There. Culture.


 Ain't going near that


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> It wouldn't surprise me if those in charge have put their money into euros and keep making the value of the pound drop with their silly nonsense ready for when they decide to cash in.


 Erm, no need to be surprised. That's exactly what Jacob Rees-Mong has done.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Sasnak said:


> Erm, no need to be surprised. That's exactly what Jacob Rees-Mong has done.


 Probably just one in a long line of cnuts.


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Probably just one in a long line of cnuts.


 He's the worst. As an MP he goes on about how brexit will be good for the uk. When he knocks off from his job as an MP and toddles off to his weekend job as a hedge fund manager he tells investors to keep their money out of the uk because brexit is going to fcuk the country up.

He is what is traditionally known as a shyster.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Sasnak said:


> He's the worst. As an MP he goes on about how brexit will be good for the uk. When he knocks off from his job as an MP and toddles off to his weekend job as a hedge fund manager he tells investors to keep their money out of the uk because brexit is going to fcuk the country up.
> 
> He is what is traditionally known as a shyster.


 I didn't think they bother 'knocking off', surely he just does his weekend job during the week like the rest of them? The weekends are for meating up with @Frandeman and his fellow trademen.

I don't really follow politics due to skewed media reporting which results in me not following the usual media news as most things just wind me the f'k up!!


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

Smitch said:


> It annoys me from afar as they keep asking for a "peoples vote", which we already had nearlyb3 years ago! What if we still voted to leave, would they have a 3rd vote, then a 4th, what's the bloody difference?
> 
> They've had ages to negotiate a deal, just leave and take the WTO route, the UK is the world's 5rh largest economy, I'm sure it'll struggle through!


 It's easy for people who don't feel it directly affects them to say "just leave on WTO terms". The problem is there are roughly 3 million UK jobs connected to trade with the EU. More than 50% of all UK trade is done with EU nations. Take the car industry for instance, there is a good number of foreign companies that have bases in the UK exporting cars/parts from the UK into Europe ,currently that trade is tariff free, under WTO rules there would be 10% tax added to the price of car transactions going either way.

 What ever anyone says, moving to WTO terms is going to hit jobs and the wider economy. Sure the UK will "struggle through" and in 10 or 15 years things may be fine but what's the point of going through that hardship if there's any chance at all of a deal being done that allows free trade to continue.

Trade deals can take years to negotiate, so 2 years from triggering article 50 (3 from referendum) is really not that excessive when you consider the magnitude of the situation. I don't think it's the time frame that most people are p1ssed off with. It's the shambles in parliament with MPs more interested in furthering their own/own party's agenda and not making any attempt to work together to deliver on the result of the referendum.


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

Sasnak said:


> He's the worst. As an MP he goes on about how brexit will be good for the uk. When he knocks off from his job as an MP and toddles off to his weekend job as a hedge fund manager he tells i*nvestors to keep their money out of the uk because brexit is going to fcuk the country up. *
> 
> He is what is traditionally known as a shyster.


 Quote when he has he said this?



Sasnak said:


> Erm, no need to be surprised. That's exactly what Jacob Rees-Mong has done.


 *No, he has not done that*. You don't understand hedge funds mates.

1. He cannot by the very nature of a hedge fund advertise or give public advice, its UK FSA rules

2. He is a manager and needs to respond to client requests, interests and their specific location. Hedge funds constantly open and close around the world due to client bases, taxes and currency requirements . UK hedge funds have been doing this for decades before Brexit

3. No one has idea what he does with his own investments as its a private investment so doesn't need to be reported publicly. In any case you don't even need to set up a hedge fund to do it. The point of it is for other people's money


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

I don't want to enter into an argument or debate about it which is why I generally steer clear of brexit threads. Reed-Mogg clearly champions brexit, yet his investment firm warns about potential damage caused by hard brexit and this has been widely reported in the media along with details of a fund he has set up in Ireland. I stand by my assertion that he tells the electorate brexit is good but his investors that it is bad. Either way, hedge funds will make money out of chaos.


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## SG83 (Mar 16, 2016)

simonboyle said:


> Why'd you quote me there buddy?
> 
> And that can still happen.
> 
> ...


 Before UK has joined ECC one needed a visa for work. Now one doesn't need it- you can just pack and simply go to any EU country and start working there as you were a native.
Because UK isn't (and never was) in the Schangen area one needs to use the passport while crossing the border (other countries dont have to as they have proper ID Card systems in use). And since 9/11 security measures on the airport are higher.



Smitch said:


> I voted for Brexit, and the whole thing has now just turned in to a farce!
> 
> Not living in the UK any more I have to actively look up UK news articles for it as the rest of the world doesn't give a fvck, they do think the whole situation is laughable though, the UK parliament are basically trying to derail the will of the people that they're supposed to be working for.
> 
> It's actually an embarrassing time to admit you're an Englishman.


 Nice. Voting 'Leave' and than leaving country (assuming you were actually living in the uk during the referendum) is kind of farting in the room and leaving. Actually not farting but shitting and leaving big massive pile of poo for others to clean.


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## simonboyle (Aug 5, 2013)

SG83 said:


> Before UK has joined ECC one needed a visa for work. Now one doesn't need it- you can just pack and simply go to any EU country and start working there as you were a native.
> Because UK isn't (and never was) in the Schangen area one needs to use the passport while crossing the border (other countries dont have to as they have proper ID Card systems in use). And since 9/11 security measures on the airport are higher.
> 
> Nice. Voting 'Leave' and than leaving country (assuming you were actually living in the uk during the referendum) is kind of farting in the room and leaving. Actually not farting but shitting and leaving big massive pile of poo for others to clean.


 I am aware. The fact still stands that you still don't have real "freedom of.movement" regardless of the reason. EU residents still need to go through the same process and show ID cards so the "no passport" 'benefit' isn't really a thing.

And yeah the visa issue is what it is.


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## simonboyle (Aug 5, 2013)

And people can vote how they like.

This is the real issue, judgement of people because they have a different opinion to yours is petty and pathetic.

It's why there is no discourse here or anywhere in the west anymore.


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## Old n fat (Feb 1, 2014)

Im with treeeza on this


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

MickeyE said:


> It's easy for people who don't feel it directly affects them to say "just leave on WTO terms". The problem is there are roughly 3 million UK jobs connected to trade with the EU. More than 50% of all UK trade is done with EU nations. Take the car industry for instance, there is a good number of foreign companies that have bases in the UK exporting cars/parts from the UK into Europe ,currently that trade is tariff free, under WTO rules there would be 10% tax added to the price of car transactions going either way.
> 
> What ever anyone says, moving to WTO terms is going to hit jobs and the wider economy. Sure the UK will "struggle through" and in 10 or 15 years things may be fine but what's the point of going through that hardship if there's any chance at all of a deal being done that allows free trade to continue.
> 
> Trade deals can take years to negotiate, so 2 years from triggering article 50 (3 from referendum) is really not that excessive when you consider the magnitude of the situation. I don't think it's the time frame that most people are p1ssed off with. It's the shambles in parliament with MPs more interested in furthering their own/own party's agenda and not making any attempt to work together to deliver on the result of the referendum.


 Oh dear ...

The guy in Spain selling us his oranges tomatoes and onions worth millions per year to him ain't going to stop selling them to us as he will loss them millions. He will be as keen as us to keep the trade relationship as seamless as possible, this goes for everything bought and sold throughout Europe. The ports will not choke up simply because they don't choke up now. If the EU tries to impose restrictions lets see how many other countries jump ship allowing them to trade freely. May needs to grow a pair and drive for a NO Deal Brexit. The EU will crumble and cave. THEY will want a mutually beneficial deal.

We want to take back sovereignty, control our borders, make our own laws and strike new and lucrative trade deals with the rest of the world including Europe. This is not doom and gloom it is a time for global growth. Don't be limited and blinkered by thinking as a European.... Its time to think Globally.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Uk muscle has turned into facebook, everyone is now suddenly an expert in EVERYTHING


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

The-Real-Deal said:


> Oh dear ...
> 
> The guy in Spain selling us his oranges tomatoes and onions worth millions per year to him ain't going to stop selling them to us as he will loss them millions. He will be as keen as us to keep the trade relationship as seamless as possible, this goes for everything bought and sold throughout Europe. The ports will not choke up simply because they don't choke up now. If the EU tries to impose restrictions lets see how many other countries jump ship allowing them to trade freely. May needs to grow a pair and drive for a NO Deal Brexit. The EU will crumble and cave. THEY will want a mutually beneficial deal.
> 
> We want to take back sovereignty, control our borders, make our own laws and strike new and lucrative trade deals with the rest of the world including Europe. This is not doom and gloom it is a time for global growth. Don't be limited and blinkered by thinking as a European.... Its time to think Globally.


 Of course the guy in Spain selling oranges will want to continue selling to the UK but any UK business/consumer buying goods from abroad is bound by the tariffs/regulations of the UK. It's the law of the land. If there is a no deal Brexit it won't be a case of the EU trying to impose restrictions, we will simply be trading on WTO terms.

Re the ports getting backlogged. At present all goods coming from the EU do not require customs processing. On WTO terms everything coming from the EU will need go through customs checking. So when you consider more than half of all imports come from Europe, it's pretty obvious that the ports will slow down to some degree.

Oranges as an item of fruit would attract a 10.5% customs charge on top of the cost of the goods.

There's a chart in this link which shows some examples of WTO tariffs

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45112872


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## SG83 (Mar 16, 2016)

simonboyle said:


> I am aware. The fact still stands that you still don't have real "freedom of.movement" regardless of the reason. EU residents still need to go through the same process and show ID cards so the "no passport" 'benefit' isn't really a thing.
> 
> And yeah the visa issue is what it is.


 Don't confuse Schangen Area with Freedom of Movement of Labour.
First one means that there is no real physical border between two countries (like between Poland and Germany) (but you can still be stopped by the border agency and you have to show your ID), the other one means that one can work without any visa issues. UK was never in Schangen; the passport (or national ID) was always required to entry (although sometimes it wasn't checked especially on ferries).


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## spod (Mar 25, 2010)

MickeyE said:


> Of course the guy in Spain selling oranges will want to continue selling to the UK but any UK business/consumer buying goods from abroad is bound by the tariffs/regulations of the UK. It's the law of the land. If there is a no deal Brexit it won't be a case of the EU trying to impose restrictions, we will simply be trading on WTO terms.
> 
> Re the ports getting backlogged. At present all goods coming from the EU do not require customs processing. On WTO terms everything coming from the EU will need go through customs checking. So when you consider more than half of all imports come from Europe, it's pretty obvious that the ports will slow down to some degree.
> 
> ...


 Not disagreeing with anything you say but don't you think the impact of a no deal brexit on the logistics of imported goods has been overstated? The media tells us that the whole of Kent will be turned into a lorry park due to customs checks. How can this be true??

Around 55% of UK imports by weight come from the EU. That leaves 45% that arrive from the rest of the world under WTO rules but we never hear of major traffic problems near Portsmouth or Felixtowe.

If we can miraculously import millions of tonnes of goods under WTO rules from other countries without any major issues, why is it beyond the wit of man to do exactly the same with EU countries post-brexit??

As for oranges, i firmly believe the UK public (whether they support brexit or not) will be quite prepared to buy South African or Egyptian oranges in future. They are already on the shelves in British supermarkets and the supply chains already exist. While we are in the EU, bilateral trade deals with the likes of South Africa and Egypt are not possible. Surely there has never been a better time to negotiate such deals???


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## MickeyE (Sep 17, 2015)

spod said:


> Not disagreeing with anything you say but don't you think the impact of a no deal brexit on the logistics of imported goods has been overstated? The media tells us that the whole of Kent will be turned into a lorry park due to customs checks. How can this be true??
> 
> Around 55% of UK imports by weight come from the EU. That leaves 45% that arrive from the rest of the world under WTO rules but we never hear of major traffic problems near Portsmouth or Felixtowe.
> 
> ...


 TBH I have no idea how badly the ports will be affected. But if at present less than half of all imports need to go through customs and then you change that to all imports need customs processing, to me it's just common sense that more man hours will be needed, to some extent.

I was just really trying to debunk Natty Steve's myth, that even if we leave with no deal nothing will change with trade across the channel because business's on both sides don't want it to. Unfortunately that's not the case.

I think 85% of all vegetables at present are imported from the EU , I think may be less for fruit, probably quite a bit may already come from the countries you mention. But if it was more cost effective to import what we currently do from he EU from other places, surely we'd be doing it already.

I also believe it's a myth that on our own we can make better trade deals. The EU has 6 times the purchasing power as a block than the UK, and trades with literally every country we will want to in the future. Why are any of these countries going to p1ss of one of, if not their biggest customer by giving a much smaller economic entity (the UK) a better deal than they get?

I personally think a no deal will be bad for the economy and employment. But as I've said earlier in the thread, if there's more people in the country that would prefer no deal than the offered deal or staying in the EU. I will be more than happy to see that happen. It's supposed to be a democracy after all.


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

Isn't it amazing how all the commonwealth countries managed to break free of the Britain without deals or tangible ties. They all just wanted their own sovereignty and just did it

Yet many Britains and politicians have to hang on to their EU mama's apron strings like scared little kids afraid to venture out into the big bad world alone.


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

I'm pretty sick of it all now. Everyone seems to be looking into their magic crystal balls and predicting/proclaiming a very uncertain future as fact.

Let's all just agree to come back in 12 months so that either the Remoaners or Brexshiters can point at the other and either say 'you fvcked our country' or 'neh, neh, neh, told you so'. End.


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## SG83 (Mar 16, 2016)

JohhnyC said:


> Isn't it amazing how all the commonwealth countries managed to break free of the Britain without deals or tangible ties. They all just wanted their own sovereignty and just did it
> 
> Yet many Britains and politicians have to hang on to their EU mama's apron strings like scared little kids afraid to venture out into the big bad world alone.


 we are comparing kind of apples and oranges, aren't we?


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

SG83 said:


> we are comparing kind of apples and oranges, aren't we?


 I think you'll find the bigger Brexshit issue was bananas!


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

SG83 said:


> we are comparing kind of apples and oranges, aren't we?


 Not in terms of a country wanting to be fully sovereign and self governing, no it's the same.

Since the days of the EEC to EC to EU , it has been merging onto a united States of Europe. That is undeniable especially with the new proposals such as an EU army.

The country voted out plain and simple , just get on with it.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

SG83 said:


> Before UK has joined ECC one needed a visa for work. Now one doesn't need it- you can just pack and simply go to any EU country and start working there as you were a native.
> Because UK isn't (and never was) in the Schangen area one needs to use the passport while crossing the border (other countries dont have to as they have proper ID Card systems in use). And since 9/11 security measures on the airport are higher.
> 
> *Nice. Voting 'Leave' and than leaving country (assuming you were actually living in the uk during the referendum) is kind of farting in the room and leaving. Actually not farting but shitting and leaving big massive pile of poo for others to clean.*


 I still have property in the UK and family, friends etc, i just believe that it's best for the UK.

We didn't all agree on that clearly, and that's cool, nobody knows how it's all gonna work out til it happens so let's all just sit tight and see.


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## trey1 (Aug 10, 2015)

@LeeDaLifter

whats ur view of brexit m8?

be good to hear the thoughts of an esteemed member of British public

maybe do a video explaining ur view?

cheers pal


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

trey1 said:


> @LeeDaLifter
> 
> whats ur view of brexit m8?
> 
> ...


 You're naively making the assumption that he knows what brexit actually is.


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## trey1 (Aug 10, 2015)

jjtreml said:


> You're naively making the assumption that he knows what brexit actually is.


 sure he posted about it before saying it was breakfast then exit lol


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## trey1 (Aug 10, 2015)

@LeeDaLifter


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## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

So are you guys leaving or not ?

still confused about it

x


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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

anna1 said:


> So are you guys leaving or not ?
> 
> still confused about it
> 
> x


 Pretty sure if we don't there are going to be some epic riots

And the discontent will fan the flames of a new far right government.


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## TURBS (Oct 21, 2013)

anna1 said:


> So are you guys leaving or not ?
> 
> still confused about it
> 
> x


 It's like Noel Edmonds on Deal or No Deal... we're definitely leaving but still fannying about choosing a box


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

GTT said:


> Pretty sure if we don't there are going to be some epic riots
> 
> And the discontent will fan the flames of a new far right government.


 UK yellow vests are a fu**ing joke


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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

Frandeman said:


> UK yellow vests are a fu**ing joke


 I'd make a comment about Spain, but all that comes to mind of note about Spain is that our old people retire there.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

GTT said:


> I'd make a comment about Spain, but all that comes to mind of note about Spain is that our old people retire there.


 i just leave this here


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## TURBS (Oct 21, 2013)

Frandeman said:


> i just leave this here


 We'll do anything for a day off work


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## Fina (Dec 26, 2004)

I reckon they're gonna delay until July, and then probably delay until 2021. It's just going to drag on until each deadline looms.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

GTT said:


> Pretty sure if we don't there are going to be some epic riots
> 
> And the discontent will fan the flames of a new far right government.


 I very much doubt that many working men/women will be taking to the streets, the vast majority will be trying to get the overtime in to pay for their mortgages.



Frandeman said:


> i just leave this here


 Is this what you mean about yellow vests? Why the f'k they got them on?


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## 6083 (Jun 21, 2007)

BLUE(UK) said:


> I very much doubt that many working men/women will be taking to the streets, the vast majority will be trying to get the overtime in to pay for their mortgages.


 Only the feck in corbyn lovers will.

I'll be 'gan raj'


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## BennyBlanco (Jul 4, 2018)

Fina said:


> I reckon they're gonna delay until July, and then probably delay until 2021. It's just going to drag on until each deadline looms.


 They'll delay enough to schedule in a 2nd referendum probably in august.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Looks like no deal


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## MR RIGSBY (Jun 12, 2007)

Frandeman said:


> Looks like no deal
> 
> View attachment 169873


 On the basis they've just voted to take no deal off the table, it really doesn't


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

I'm totally switched off to it. As far as I understand it, most MPs don't actually want it so getting an approval on any deal is almost impossible. Now they've voted to block a no-deal that should in fact be a stale mate. Except the vote to block a no-deal has no legal standing. It's a fvck up. And all because less than a quarter of the population wanted it but not to give it to them is apparently undemocratic. Bollocks.


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

Not to nitpick, but postponing Brexit requires either revocation of intent to leave EU or consensus of all member states to prolong the current situation post March 29th.

...

Hold bloody second referendum, general elections and deport Farage and Rees Mug to Australia.


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## BennyBlanco (Jul 4, 2018)

Pathetic.


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

The ECJ have already ruled that Article 50 can be withdrawn at any point prior to the leave date. I reckon the request to extend it will be declined (which mps' will likely vote in favour of) and the end game is the withdrawal of Article 50 before the end of the month, no brexit and a third referendum on EU membership.


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## Gary29 (Aug 21, 2011)

I don't really care either way now, although it would be funny to see it go to another referendum and remain wins, all the butthurt brexiteers!


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

Gary29 said:


> I don't really care either way now, although it would be funny to see it go to another referendum and remain wins, all the butthurt brexiteers!


 Same here. I am a remainer but now idgaf anymore. If we have a third referendum I'm not voting. I've decided at 45 that my days of voting on political issues or for a party are over.


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## Archaic (Mar 8, 2010)

Yes, it is a shambles and we look weak on the World stage.

The WTO was the strongest weapon the UK had to secure a decent deal with the EU whilst negotiating leaving, it would have hurt them too.

Why the hell rule that off the table before leaving, before any final deal??

Obviously to delay.. To force a second referendum.. At the cost of 1 £Billion per month to the UK Tax payer.

It's a dangerous card to play.

I'm a Labour supporter. But, Corbyn is a joke. The PM needs to step down, admit defeat, appoint somebody in the Conservative party to take us through this mess.


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

Archaic said:


> Yes, it is a shambles and we look weak on the World stage.
> 
> The WTO was the strongest weapon the UK had to secure a decent deal with the EU whilst negotiating leaving, it would have hurt them too.
> 
> Why the hell rule that off the table before leaving, before any final deal??


 agree weak as f**k. Dumbest decision taken by parliament so far. Can't believe how weak politicians are these days. Telling EU we are not prepared to walk away with a deal is being idiotic.

UK had already bend over with the promise of all cash upfront and zero in return . Now they just handed them the lube and reckon it's the best strategy so it won't hurt as much.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

C'mon people, wake up ffs.

Brexit was never going to happen, its just another divide and conquer / distraction tactic the elites constantly use.

The fact that people actually still bother to vote, thinking their vote means something is hilarious.


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## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

Watched that movie Brexit .

Is there any possibility they manage to prove the " leave" side broke electroral laws and referendum is annulled?

Bit far fetched but it looks like there have been efforts


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

They lied about Afghanistan

They lied about Libia

They lied about Siria

They lied about Russia

Wtf trust those cu**s


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

anna1 said:


> Watched that movie Brexit .
> 
> Is there any possibility they manage to prove the " leave" side broke electroral laws and referendum is annulled?
> 
> Bit far fetched but it looks like there have been efforts


 No, think they've already proved they broke the rules.


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## Gary29 (Aug 21, 2011)

anna1 said:


> Watched that movie Brexit .


 Weird, I watched a movie called 'Hard Brexit' it was VERY entertaining actually, politics didn't rank highly on the agenda, although a few people definitely got shafted.


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

Frandeman said:


> They lied about Libia
> 
> They lied about Siria
> 
> Wtf trust those cu**s


 Purhapz peepul who now how two spel those ****rys?


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

Kazza61 said:


> Purhapz peepul who now how two spel those ****rys?


 It's right in Spanglish :thumb


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## BennyBlanco (Jul 4, 2018)

Just utterly predictable, the whole series of events this week, they were never going to honor the result at least now it clears up the remaining vestige of doubt that we live in an oligrachy posing as a democracy.


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## Fletch68 (Mar 17, 2013)

All that will happen is a continual vote against any Theresa May deal. There will then be another lengthy delay in which there may be a change of leadership or a general election. Which will no doubt bring about another referendum but this time the result will go in favour of remain. Job done.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Fletch68 said:


> All that will happen is a continual vote against any Theresa May deal. There will then be another lengthy delay in which there may be a change of leadership or a general election. Which will no doubt bring about another referendum but this time the result will go in favour of remain. Job done.


 So basically voting is a complete waste of time....

Damn, who knew?


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

We meant to be together


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

We can still crash out with no deal on the 29th... There will be no third meaningful vote if nothing changes on Thursday when we go back to the EU as "THE DEAL" has already been rejected in parliament. The EU need to tell us to F off and deny the extension then we are out.... Yipeeeeeeee..


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## JohhnyC (Mar 16, 2015)

The-Real-Deal said:


> We can still crash out with no deal on the 29th... There will be no third meaningful vote if nothing changes on Thursday when we go back to the EU as "THE DEAL" has already been rejected in parliament. The EU need to tell us to F off and deny the extension then we are out.... Yipeeeeeeee..


 Although I'd like it, I can't see it happening though. I think the EU will grant a long extension which will eventually lead to brexit fizzle out.

The EU have a lot to lose if Britain walk away cleanly and become a much more successful economy than Europe , starting making deals around the world , self governing, putting a stop to rampant immigration. This will be a clear signal for others countries to follow suit.

Lot easier to jump into a pool once you see someone else doing it before you and come away OK.

I hope I'm wrong though and they vote down any extension


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

JohhnyC said:


> Although I'd like it, I can't see it happening though. I think the EU will grant a long extension which will eventually lead to brexit fizzle out.
> 
> The EU have a lot to lose if Britain walk away cleanly and become a much more successful economy than Europe , starting making deals around the world , self governing, putting a stop to rampant immigration. This will be a clear signal for others countries to follow suit.
> 
> ...


 Democracy is being betrayed.


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

The-Real-Deal said:


> . The EU need to tell us to F off and deny the extension then we are out.... Yipeeeeeeee..


 Can you explain your glee - in what practical ways do you think your day to day life will actually be different once we leave the EU?


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

Kazza61 said:


> Can you explain your glee - in what practical ways do you think your day to day life will actually be different once we leave the EU?


 I'd also like to know this. 1001 days since the vote and I've not yet been told anything about leaving the eu that will actually improve my life. With that said I've not seen anything that will necessarily make my life worse apart from not being able to travel in the eu safe in the knowledge that I'd get treated if I was ill but that's not the end of the world I guess. I do believe the nation will be poorer but I suppose until that actually happens it's not relevant.

Leaving the eu, what's in it for me?


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

Sasnak said:


> I'd also like to know this. 1001 days since the vote and I've not yet been told anything about leaving the eu that will actually improve my life. With that said I've not seen anything that will necessarily make my life worse apart from not being able to travel in the eu safe in the knowledge that I'd get treated if I was ill but that's not the end of the world I guess. I do believe the nation will be poorer but I suppose until that actually happens it's not relevant.
> 
> Leaving the eu, what's in it for me?


 Had folk STFU and supported what the majority (of those who voted) had voted for, we's all know what is in it for us as we'd more than likely been out for a while.

Either way, in or out, the general public will be getting screwed at any opportunity.


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## Frandeman (Mar 24, 2014)

The French know how to do a fu**ing riot... Here f**k all happening.


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

Kazza61 said:


> Can you explain your glee - in what practical ways do you think your day to day life will actually be different once we leave the EU?


 Longer hours, less pay, less holidays, because your poor pay, will be Even less, when you convert it into any other currency.

On the plus side. I'll be able to give up my job in IT and go work for minimum wage in a factory, as apparently we'll be bringing back manufacturing to the UK.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

Brexit won't happen now, the majority of the people in the UK are done for by wanting to remain, nothing but brain dead zombie idiots who believe the lies their fed by the main stream media.

No one will 'rise up' and 'fight the system' Too little, too late im affraid.

The writing was on the wall when blair entered our nation in an illegal war, slaughtered millions of innocents and is still walking around scot-free and nothing happened to that blood thirsty piece of vermin.

Bitch and moan all you want, it'll never change now unfortunately.

Justice and democracy are DEAD.

The whole brexit debacle/ Iraq war prove this.


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

Denied said:


> Longer hours, less pay, less holidays, because your poor pay, will be Even less, when you convert it into any other currency.
> 
> On the plus side. I'll be able to give up my job in IT and go work for minimum wage in a factory, as apparently we'll be bringing back manufacturing to the UK.


 Just don't ask for a second serving of porridge.

I think Fatty Steve is all about the joys of working on a fishing boat and being up to his neck in cod intestines than wasting away in some corporate office in London City and throwing away cash on prostitutes and coke every weekend.


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

I thought Brexshitters were saying a no deal Brexshit would be a good thing? If that's so, why is the government putting troops on standby in case we get one?? To hand out champagne at the street parties perhaps?

http://news.sky.com/story/brexit-military-steps-up-preparations-in-case-of-no-deal-11671941


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

Kazza61 said:


> I thought Brexshitters were saying a no deal Brexshit would be a good thing?


 Fine, if that's what they think, but I'd respectfully refer them to my question. What would be good about a no deal brexit?

Anyone?


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## TURBS (Oct 21, 2013)

Sasnak said:


> What would be good about a no deal brexit?
> 
> Anyone?


 A no-deal Brexit would save Britain the £39 billion (€43 billion) that the prime minister has agreed to pay the EU.


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## Baz-- (Jul 16, 2018)




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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Kazza61 said:


> Can you explain your glee - in what practical ways do you think your day to day life will actually be different once we leave the EU?


 Happy I wont have to listen to any more brexit s**t


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

TERBO said:


> A no-deal Brexit would save Britain the £39 billion (€43 billion) that the prime minister has agreed to pay the EU.


 Presume that's the figure under Mays deal. This is where I get confused. We currently get a massive rebate so I assume we won't get this in the future and we'll lose out on trade. For me from what I can glean we either go no deal or stay as we are.


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## Denied (Sep 25, 2008)

Sasnak said:


> Presume that's the figure under Mays deal. This is where I get confused. We currently get a massive rebate so I assume we won't get this in the future and we'll lose out on trade. For me from what I can glean we either go no deal or stay as we are.


 The idea is, that getting a deal would pay for itself, with extra trade with the EU but the problem is, May's deal, doesn't guarantee anything after a 2 year transition period.


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

TERBO said:


> A no-deal Brexit would save Britain the £39 billion (€43 billion) that the prime minister has agreed to pay the EU.


 Soft, hard, deal no-deal you still have to pay that as part of obligations from previous contracts. UK will not default on its international obligations.

Simply put... hard brexit is about not having the cake and not eating it.


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## BennyBlanco (Jul 4, 2018)

No, there's no body of justice that would deem us legally obligated to pay the 39billion, thats our trump card in negotiations and we shouldn't surrender it.
Brexit is about honoring democracy, the soverignty of our people to make and decide our own future and a clear decisive victory over the neoliberal globalist elite who've dominated the west for the past 50 odd years.
If we have to take a short term hit to the economy then so be it, myself and 17.5million others will endure it to see Britain free from these c*nts control.


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)




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## Archaic (Mar 8, 2010)

I've gave up following the nonsense. It's a shambles.

I do know though we have to pay the EU £1 Billion per month, every month, for however long the delay .


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