# safe 1st time steroid,anavar???



## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

what would be a good steroid to begin? i dnt like needles,and i dont want to bloat out and have water retention.id like a little mass and to harden them up,ive heard anavar is ok for this? any suggestions??


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## The Oak 2009 (Sep 14, 2009)

Dbol IMO is the way to go for an oral only cycle. 6 weeks you should be able to put on a bit of mass. Water bloat is regulated by your diet.


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

dianobol imo?? how much mg should i take per day?will it make me look rounded??


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## don1 (Jul 9, 2009)

30mg a day is good, over this you will bloat etc, also use nova to stop gyno on cycle,


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## don1 (Jul 9, 2009)

Anavar use 80-100mg a day for 8 weeks, no sides no gyno, this would be your best option nice strength and shape gains


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

as far as anavar is concerned,i think they are in 10mg firm at most? i hear there expensive too.so this will give me better shape? will it shut down my natural hpta?? as i want them to be natural and at a reasonably high level after?


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## cellmore (Aug 26, 2008)

I used to think dbol was best for a maiden cycle but I now think anavar would be even better. As Don1 says you will get gains in strength and hardness and no side effects. If you want to bulk and gain strength then go the dbol route.


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

interesting..and my liver will still be fine lol no pct or anything on var??


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## thecoms (Nov 1, 2010)

winnie is nice too


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## [email protected] (Mar 15, 2008)

You will need Pct after any steriod cycle!


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

pct with var?? what kind? i thought var doesnt aromatize?


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

winstrol? is that oral??


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## THE COLONEL (Mar 25, 2009)

i think anything over 50 mg a day for var requires a PCT anything under that i wouldnt bother i dont and didnt have any problems


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## Doink (Sep 21, 2010)

if you don't want bloat the don't go for dbol, it's part and parcel.

My advice is to man up and run 500mg test, injectable for 10 weeks the gains from this would be streets ahead of anything you'd get from the Var.

Plus there's the other side, A good run on Var would be 80mg ED for 8-10 weeks and it's going to set you back a good few quid.

2 choices, Man up and save yourself some money or pay through the nose to be a fanny...


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## Guest (Dec 17, 2010)

I'd go with 60mg Var 6-8 weeks.

I don't see why you'd run ''80mg 8-10'' weeks for a first cycle tbh but it seems common on this forum, recommending high doses for newbies.

Start off small and see how it goes. It's when you start upping the doses etc you see a lot more side effects. A lot of the gains from Dianabol will be bloat/water. Seen as you want a little extra size & your muscles to harden up, Var would be good.


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## Paul85 (Mar 1, 2010)

*Tbol* have a nosey at the log posted on here for abit more info and what to expect http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/steroid-testosterone-information/109954-first-ever-cycle-tbol-only-pics.html


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

deeconfrost said:


> pct with var?? what kind? i thought var doesnt aromatize?


still mean it doesnt have any affect on the HPTA though to some degree.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

50mg Var gave me crazy shin pumps if i even walked quickly so cardio was a no go while on it, that was my furst course at 50mg a day for 8 weeks with Prochem 50mg tabs.

I really liked Dbol, which was my second course, ran that at 35mg a day for 7 weeks and got some decent gains. Didn't really see much off the Anavar so if i did it again i'd up the dose i think, it's about 3 times more expensive too so worth considering.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

deeconfrost said:


> pct with var?? what kind? i thought var doesnt aromatize?


Whats that got to do with not running PCT?


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

dan-cov-boxer said:


> I'd go with 60mg Var 6-8 weeks.
> 
> *I don't see why you'd run ''80mg 8-10'' weeks for a first cycle tbh but it seems common on this forum, recommending high doses for newbies.*
> 
> Start off small and see how it goes. It's when you start upping the doses etc you see a lot more side effects. A lot of the gains from Dianabol will be bloat/water. Seen as you want a little extra size & your muscles to harden up, Var would be good.


Lol, since when has 80mg of var been a high dose. Make the most of your 1st cycle OP and don't mess about with girly doses of var.


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

thanks dan,so what sides from var?? and will it shut my natural test down?


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Just my opinion but in terms of bang for your buck i'd go with dbol.

Var is good but very costly to run at a decent dose.

Embrace the bloat. It's only for 8 weeks. Make the most of it. Good weather for a winter bulk.


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## Ash1981 (Jun 16, 2009)

is 75mg ed of var good enough for a first cycle with decent results?


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

but peeps say dianobol you lose it after having it??


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## Ash1981 (Jun 16, 2009)

i think it depends on diet and post cycle training/pct.

but you will lose some weight due to water retention/bloat

for lean gains its got to be var or tbol

from what ive researched.

im natty


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

deeconfrost said:


> but peeps say dianobol you lose it after having it??


They will do because of 2 reasons

1. theyve never run dbol

2. pizza 6 days a week, 10 cans of stella and hydroganated fats or french fries doesnt build muscle or keep any gains.


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

lol,ok so var is ok at say 40.60 mg a day???? will i still be able to secrete growth from pituirity gland while on this?


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

deeconfrost said:


> lol,ok so var is ok at say 40.60 mg a day???? will i still be able to secrete growth from pituirity gland while on this?


Ive only run tbol never var, however....I would never run var or tbol at such a sh1t dose as 40mg, but not saying you cant.

Why dont you just run a dose that will actually achieve a noticable result.


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## gaz_0001 (Jul 6, 2010)

Have done Var, Tbol, Dbol & Test.

All with a lean gain fat loss diet.

Would recommend Test as best @ 500mg EW.

If Oral only Var & Tbol are both solid @ 60 - 100mg ED. I know Var is expensive, so you could try 40mg Var ED with 60mg Tbol ED. Have done that same cycle for 8wks. Was awsome, gained more strength and muscle than the current Test cycle (although im only on wk 6 at the mo). I feel like the Test helps to shred fat though, didnt get that with the Orals.

Anavar also makes you incredibly pumped & vascular.... you get used to this over the weeks, when you stop the cycle it goes :-(

Wouldnt touch Dbol again, its the cheapest for a reason. Over rated & overbloated after 4wks @ 30mg ED.


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## Doink (Sep 21, 2010)

What you'll come off with from Var at 40-60mg a day isn't worth the investment.... the sides of var are non existent IME so don't start bricking it about running a decent dose, If var sides are unbearable you might as well pack it in. I've only been up to 100mg but its not unusual to see it ran at twice that or more. It only gets interesting at 80+ imo.

If you're going to fvck about with the cycle and try and do it on the cheap then you're better off spend the money on whey... or run test @ 500mg for 10 weeks... you'll be glad you did it


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

deeconfrost said:


> thanks dan,so what sides from var?? and will it shut my natural test down?


Already answered this, yes.



deeconfrost said:


> but peeps say dianobol you lose it after having it??


Only true if you are a lazy git and don't eat or train properly anyway.



deeconfrost said:


> lol,ok so var is ok at say 40.60 mg a day???? will i still be able to secrete growth from pituirity gland while on this?


Already said, 80mg if you want to make at least reasonable gains. What do you mean still be able to secrete growth from your pituitary?, already said (again) PCT would be a good idea.


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## cellmore (Aug 26, 2008)

like Mars says, do a man-size dose of 80 mgs min. 100mgs works well for me mate.


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

ok soz,just trying to get an idea,i was initally hoping to do 1 cycle of var,hope to see some gains,even if minimal,perhaps hardened look of muscles?.then completely come off it?? would i lose what i achieved within that cycle? or will it be permanent gain,providing i still train of course


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## Conscript (Sep 5, 2010)

ash1981 said:


> is 75mg ed of var good enough for a first cycle with decent results?


100mg + ED is where the sweet spot for me was, but I wasn't natty when I first tried anavar, IMO 100mg ED var is not a high dose either 

Do you think you will ever move on to test??? If so I would run the test first, big dirty bulk style, then cut with the anavar....


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## ojaysmoke (Mar 27, 2010)

mate try a test-e cycle. needles aren't as bad as you think. i used to be really scared of needles, avoided blood tests, vaccines etc. but its not that bad as you think.


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## deeconfrost (Dec 15, 2010)

test,,,my balls will shrink no???


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## Conscript (Sep 5, 2010)

deeconfrost said:


> test,,,my balls will shrink no???


Very possible, use HCG to minimise testicular atrophy and make for more effective PCT/easier recovery...


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

deeconfrost said:


> ok soz,just trying to get an idea,i was initally hoping to do 1 cycle of var,hope to see some gains,even if minimal,perhaps hardened look of muscles?.then completely come off it?? would i lose what i achieved within that cycle? or will it be permanent gain,providing i still train of course


at 20mg day, you won't shut down your HPTA, and this is the dose that was used in studies that showed reduction in abdominal fat.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8574271

but truth is you wont see your muscles "harden" unless you're lean enough that there is no fat covering your muscle..

keeping gains are based on PCT (or through cycle HPTA therapy depending on your preference), maintaining training and clean eating.... irrespective of AAS used... as for bloat/water retention on d-bol etc, well welcome to bodybuilding- it just means you take an AI (anastrazole or letrozole) and you won't have any water retention.. acne? take finasteride...

but if you want to keep things simple, anavar at 80-100mg will give some results, particularly strength. However, don't be fooled by the hype- anavar is a low toxicity oral, once your dosage goes up, its no longer as "safe" and in fact you are better of taking 100mg of test prop as an example, in terms of liver toxicity.

I think you need to read up some more of the stickies. Choosing an oral has its uses, "safety" is not one of them... and once you're over 20mg/day anavar, you'll affect your HPTA, so then why not use an injectable test? (along with an AI and finasteride).


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