# Please advise on diet



## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Ok i needed a whole new diet due to boredom and lack of results lately. The diet below is a combination of other links i have read on uk muscle so would appreciate any advice regarding changing things or adding things and most of all the amounts i should eat of each..........

MY AIM FOR 7 WEEKS IS LOOSE B/F BUT KEEP THE GAINS I MADE AFTER CYCLE

BREAKFAST protein shake blendid with oatmeal

MEAL 1 6 boiled eggs/ bannana

MEAL 2 tin of tuna/ salad / low fat salad cream / apple

MEAL 3 chicken with rice or potatoes

MEAL 4 wholemeal roll/ ham/ coleslaw/ orange

TRAINING FOLLOW BY PROTEIN SHAKE

MEAL 5 chicken/ rice or potatoes/ broccali

Im looking to start diet tommorrow.......

ONE OTHER THING ? what do you class as good fats

CHEERS


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

My current weight is 205lbs standing 5ft 8


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## Bigdav (May 24, 2005)

i'd alter the carbs a little mate. Good sources but id try and eat the majority of them by meal 3.the later you eat carbs the more likley theyre gonna go on as fat. Id have meal 5 as chicken with the broccolli(and lots of it,i just love the stuff) and have a casein or whey shake before hittin the sack.

as for fats, itend to eat a lot of nuts and seeds as snacks, omegas in pill form and thats about it


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Cheers, i wasnt sure about the carbs that late either but just found it on another link but every thing you say sounds good. Any idea of amount in chicken total daily intake...and do i keep the rice or potatoes to a minimum amount, enough to be full after meal lets say


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## powerU (Oct 22, 2003)

If you're cutting don't bother with nuts - good fats but loads of calories.

Try an oily fish like salmon, trout or mackeral, or dress your salad with a small amout of extra virgin olive oil. Get munching on those fish oil tabs too.

Try to take in protein/carbs/good fats with every meal in roughly 40/30/30 ratio.


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## Bigdav (May 24, 2005)

it tends to be persoanl choice on that but i find 2 chicken breasts more than enough, and as for the carbs id just eat a set amount, 150 g of cooked rice has 45 g of carbs, so work out how many carbs your wanting to eat through the day and split them between your 3 early meals

check here, i got this on a link here somewhere and im finding it really usefull

http://www.nutritiondata.com/index.html


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## Bigdav (May 24, 2005)

Bigdav said:


> it tends to be persoanl choice on that but i find 2 chicken breasts more than enough, and as for the carbs id just eat a set amount, 150 g of cooked rice has 45 g of carbs, so work out how many carbs your wanting to eat through the day and split them between your 3 early meals
> 
> check here, i got this on a link here somewhere and im finding it really usefull
> 
> http://www.nutritiondata.com/index.html


whoops sorry meant to say 2 breasts per meal, think it works out at around 80g of protein


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

TYSON i thought you had all these questions answered in the past mate....

go to Fitday.com registration is free enter in what you eat by weight and it will give you your totals.

your weight is 205lbs so i would aim for:

1.25g protein per lb of BW

1g carbs per lb BW

.5g of good fats per lb BW

i agree with BigDav aswell you need to be eating all your carbs earlier in the day...


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Not too bad Tyson but you need good fats in there.

I would drop the non fat salad dressing as they just use carbs instead of fat.

Id also toss some fish oils in there for some good fat and eat them with each of those meals.

Dieting?

Try berries instead for meal 4

Cut back on the rice and potato and stick with vegetables.


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

have you tried the pizza diet yet?


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## Pete1436114491 (Nov 3, 2003)

I heard of a diet recently called Diatia I think, try it, it might work.


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Been doing it for 5 months and have had enough and need a change......works well but ive just gone off it to be honest


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Pscarb said:


> TYSON i thought you had all these questions answered in the past mate....


Yes, i finally was introduced to diata, but as i said ive been on it for 5 months and have had enough literally, when i go to eat a meal i want to throw up......so need some variety in the diet..


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Is this better ? ive moved the carbs to earlier

1/ protein and oats shake

2/ 6 boiled eggs/bannana

3/ tin tuna/rice/apple

4/ 2 chicken breast/rice

5/ wholemeal roll/ ham/colslaw/orange

protein shake after training

6/ 2 chicken breast/salad

and i will add some almonds during the day, would a handfull be the right amount


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

tyson I'm making a new alternative food list and substitute list for the diatia soon, plus a series of small alternative recipe books that work with it as well. Get back to me in a week or two when we release all the new stuff.

oh by the way, in a couple weeks the whole regimen x series will become one book, so those who want or need the other books seperate now is the time to do it.

cheers


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

TYSON said:


> Is this better ? ive moved the carbs to earlier
> 
> 1/ protein and oats shake
> 
> ...


No it is not better.


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Well thats short and to the point......what do you suggest then....


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Ok swap the bread for a vegetable.

Drop the rice meal 3

Add fish oils and apple pectin to each meal, so you get your fats in the right range and your EFA's will be good and you will have more fiber in your diet also lowering the GI of the carb meals.

Bannana is kindof high in the GI so you can have berries there instead.

Bread is high in the GI so you can supplement with a fruit in the morning or a vegetable in the afternoon/evening.

Choose better carbs and up the fats.

Meals 1,3,4,5,6 need fat in them to help supress insulin.

Add some butter to meal 1 with oats.

Go with the suggestions and if you dont lose them modify, if you loose too fast, then again modify.

It is just too much rice and bread for me when looking to diet. Those are both kindof high in the GI and there are better carbohydrates that have better nutrititional value then breads and rice. I would cut back on those myself.


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

or just eat pizza


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

ChefX said:


> or just eat pizza


  :axe: mg:


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

I think that all though funny these last few post's are not helping Tyson one bit...

Now i think the reason you are not getting 100% help here mate is that you seem a bit skittish when it comes to dieting by this i mean you do one thing then change because you are not getting the results but you are changing only after a few months.....

so if you really want to lose weight try this diet:

Meal 1:50 Oats blended in with 2scoops whey protein and 1 tbsp of Natural PB

Meal 2:1 MRP drink

Meal 3:1 tin tuna, 50g (dry weight) of rice 1tbsp Olive Oil or you can use the Hellmans Extra Light Mayo

Meal 4:200g Chicken Breast, 50g (dry weight) of rice 1tbsp Olive Oil

Meal 5:2 scoops Protein shake preferably a blend and not Isolate

Meal 6:2 scoops Isolate + 40g simple sugers something like carbo force + 5g Glutimine

Meal 7:200g of either chicken,Lean steak, Turkey, Salmon and salad and veg

drink 4L per day of water


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Thats more like it, someone who actaully answer the question in plain english. Cheers psc

Two questions......what is MRP and Natural PB


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

Paul, it is because he has diets already that worked, but he wants something different.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

ChefX i can understand where your coming from mate but Tyson is obvouisly unhappy with doing the Diata and wants a change so why are we taking the pi$$ and not helping him as we all know mate not one diet fits all.....

Tyson..

Mrp's are meal replacement drinks they are conveniant and very good and before all you guys start preaching to me about solid food is better i have built a decent physique with them and i have also dieted for comp's with them so as long as you choose the right ones then they can help with dieting....

Natural PB is natural peanut butter the type you find in health food shops where the ingrediants are just peanuts all the ones you see in the major chops have a load of additives added.


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

Sorry Paul, I didn't post my entire comment here because I was trying to be nice and PC. No worries.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Too many powders and shakes.

Whole foods are better!

Now the above statement I would love for someone to prove me wrong! Anybody!!!

Those cheap highly processed carbs are junk for your health and body.

Now Paul we cant use you for the norm on dieting as I have seen your drug stacks and if a guy is natural then all the above you suggest does not apply.

He is not getting enough good fats in that diet.

He is also not getting enough good fiber in that diet.

He is not getting the minerals that are necessary for good bodily functions.

He is not getting any good intestinal flora support.

And if he is doing alot of cardio and sweating alot then that much water he can lose electrolytes.

His diet needs improvement and so does your......Need any help Boys?


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

hackskii said:


> Too many powders and shakes.
> 
> Whole foods are better!
> 
> ...


 

I didn't start this! hahahahahahahahaha

Its about optimizing the diet via foods, not just getting by IMO


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## Captain Hero (Jun 13, 2004)

i like how this thread is turning out. Keep going lads :beer1:


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

hackskii said:


> Too many powders and shakes.
> 
> Whole foods are better!
> 
> ...


how do my drug stacks compensate for EFA's or Fiber or even minerals....

why can you not use me as the norm as diet is diet to be honest seeing as you opened the door with my "drug Stacks" i could diet alot more sloppy but i don't the fact is you can diet and bulk using both whey protein and MRP's now i never said this was better than whole foods i said you can diet and diet effectivly using WHey shakes nad MRP's i have done this time and time again......like i have just pointed out in another thread AAS don't cut you up without a decent diet and i have dieted the whole 12 weeks for a show and won that show using 2 MRP's a day due to work commitments.....

now seeing as you have set the challenge to prove you wrong on the whole food thing and i have admitted that you are correct there is no substitute for real food but please prove me wrong by showing me proof that says you cannot diet using MRP's/Shakes.....

As i am writing this it has got me thinking that the statement you have made about my "Drug Stacks" this statement is giving me the thinking that you believe i can only diet and succeed in what i do because of drugs i have dedicated most of the last 2yrs trying to change the opinions of the general public who believe that it is all about drugs in this sport so your statement as left me dumbstruck and slightly suprised that you have said this......


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## DB (Oct 31, 2003)

i hate to bring this old chestnut up again but real food isnt always available for em so recently i have been leaning towards shakes a fair bit and gettin good results to be honest


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Well, the fact that AAS will help with postive nitrogen ballance then you the natural bodybuilder is left with an unfair advantage right?

Dude, I have seen you drug stacks.

How can a nautral guy compete with the likes of drugs like T-3, clenbuterol, ECA's, DNP, etc using AAS to keep out of catabolism?

You can diet using your lazy approach but your diet is not healthy and if you dont believe me, submit your diet to lets say a magazine like Men's Health.

It would never get published EVER. Why? Because it is just that, not healthy.

You could diet on your diet but it would require alot of supplementation with EFA's, Fiber, and a host of other things.

I dont think you actually understand the whole idea of the dieting thing.

When dieting (restricting calories) one can be left with a defecit of nutrients. Adding powders, MRE's and such are not doing the job of whole foods.

Not to mention, you actually dont know what is in those foods like hydrogenated oils among other things.

I could list a host of deficiencies with your diet.

It is not healthy and giving out advice like the advice you gave using yourself as an example is wrong.

Many of the guys on the Stage are walking Death. You can endorse this kindof philosophy if you want but I dont and wont.

I have lost 20 lbs in about 8 weeks and never touched one time a MRE or Shake.

If you take your time to chew and pulverize your food with your own teeth you will be better off.

Making a diet of protein shakes, MRE's and that other trash you take is a joke. To give out that kindof advice is wrong IMHO.

I wont do the Drug Stack comment as I know you will already be offended and this would be overkill.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

DB said:


> i hate to bring this old chestnut up again but real food isnt always available for em so recently i have been leaning towards shakes a fair bit and gettin good results to be honest


Granted but you dont design someones diet around this type of eating.

There are much better selections of food. Not only that food tasts good.


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## DB (Oct 31, 2003)

hackskii said:


> Granted but you dont design someones diet around this type of eating.
> 
> There are much better selections of food. Not only that food tasts good.


yeah true man..just my experiences awith shakes at the mo..if i have a shake i supllement wiht fish oils vit and minerals tho so its beter than nothing if caught in a rut :beer1:


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

HacksKii, you have some great knowledge about diet ect: i wished i knew half what you did. But i was asking for a example of a days diet rather than all the scientific words and thats what PSCARB did. I wouldnt know if its a good diet or bad but considering i do find it hard to eat the amount of food i need then maybe its a good option with the drinks.

I would be gratefull if you could post up a days eating plan just as a guide line to see the difference.

CHEERS


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

hackskii said:


> Well, the fact that AAS will help with postive nitrogen ballance then you the natural bodybuilder is left with an unfair advantage right?
> 
> Dude, I have seen you drug stacks.
> 
> ...


well now you have not only insulted me but ****ed me off as well who are you to tell me my diet is unhealthy i have constant blood screens and checkup by my doc and i have never never been told that i am deficiant in any way....

my diet is full of EFA's fiber and minerals...

the fact you have told me that i don't understand how to diet makes me laugh why are you such an expert you preach about EFA's and low carbs and whole foods but i didnt see you give any constructive advice to tyson about his diet apart from a small minded comment.

how is my diet full of trash ????

this is my diet

Meal 1:

100g oats

1 banana

handful raisins

1 bagel

2 scoops whey

Meal 2:

Pro-MR MRP

1 x Bagel + Nat PB

Meal 3:

3 chicken breast's in tortilla rolls wholemeal

Guacamoly

Meal 4:

3 chicken breast's in pitta + cheese

1 banana

Meal 5WO

shake containing-

60g simple carbs

50g Whey

20g Glutimine

10g Creatine

Meal 6:

2-3 chicken breast's

oven chips

Meal 7:

2 scoops Pro-Peptide

i also take 12 caps of fish oils per day along with multi vits and other normal vits....

now explain to me why this is full of trash i might take drugs but i don't take all of the ones you have mentioned all of the time....

and i have said on many occasions that drugs don't make a diet nutrition does from food and supplements...

but the fact of all this is that you are comparing my approach to a natural guys approach and unless i am mistaken Tyson is not natural and he has used Clen/ECA/DNP and AAS so i don't see where you are coming from.....

now i will say it again because i feel you are hard of hearing to lose weight you need a decent diet not drugs....

now you are saying that by taking shakes and MRP's your cannot diet be healthy so for all of those althetes out there that diet for shows both natural and Non-Natural who have used both shakes and MRP's are you saying they are lazy and do not understand how to diet....

well lets see your advice to Tyson on his diet and maybe lets see both your daily diet and maybe a picture just to show me what a totaly healyhy guy looks like because by your opinion i am not healthy and do not know how to diet...

maybe we should ask Laren to answer this question as i have been helping her on her quest to lose some weight i don't believe but i maybe wrong that she uses all of these nasty drugs that you speak about but i do belive that she has made some good progress.

so am i led to believe that you your self are natural?????


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Well i have to say the diet looks ok to me m8 but i really wouldnt know any way, allways gratefull for your advice.....And your right im not a natural bodybuilder.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Your diet contains too much bread for one.

Too few vegetables number two.

Not enough fiber number three.

Change to diffrent fruits to get a more rounded approach to your vitamins and minerals number four.

Just to name a few.

Dude, I wasnt picking on you but I will say this.

*If you did not take all the drugs you take you never would have been on the stage.*

*
*

I remember an old post that you stated that when you started to lift you started gear.

I have been lifting and doing dieting (experimenting), and using herbs for 28 years.

I have many resources I draw from.

I can tell you that you dont have the experiance nor the knowledge I have regarding the above matter.

This basicly started when Winger posted about Roid Devil's post on eating too much bread, too many potatoe's and you asked him if he was joking.

That was an insult at winger and he was actually right.

I agree with Winger too on this matter.

I am not the only one who disagree's with you.

He also has more knowledge on diets than you too (as obvious to your post).

That comment was like telling your teacher that they are wrong.

I have given tyson advice on diet and he just changes things around.

But your advice is not sound for tyson and I will elaborate some.

First of all there is a big diffrence from losing 10-15 lbs and lets say 50-60 lbs of fat. That diet you gave out would work but by the time this person lost the 50 lbs of bodyweight this could take like 20-30 weeks or about a half a year.

In this amount of time some health issues could arise.

Remember the Pre-Digested liquid diet in the 70's?

Worked really well but the problem was people were dropping dead. That was over 30 years ago, I remember it like it was yesterday.

Does this approach seem sound to you at this given situation?

Answer=*NO*

I know you got upset with me.

I would have gotten upset too.

But I have to correct when the information is bad.....Respect the fact that I will not hold back when I feel the need to correct.

I can feel you passon twards this subject but I think you need a more open mind twards dieting than powders, shakes, and MRE's.

I was just saying that your diet is not healthy, or can be improved apon and that style of approach to dieting is lazy. I still think so.

Getting caught up in this I dont feel like cooking or prepairing food and or I dont have time to cook is lazy eating and can have health conciquences.

Life is about choices.

This is a longetivity game.

You want pictures?

Can you look at someone and see if they are healthy?

That is a good one.

Because you look better than me (age factor here and drug factor) does this give you more credibility?

I see alot of ego and maybe some of this is caused from androgens.

Its cool, I aint mad at you.

I could easily improve your diet if you want me too.

But you need to remember again Start listening, there are conditions that people have (about 1/3 of the people) that have a problem with insulin.

For a diabetic, your diet would require more insulin for that poor person.

Some people are insulin resistant and some are insulin sensitive.

Does your diet accomidate for that?

NOPE!

You could be thinking you are helping someone and just helping them to the grave.

This is why I am setting the record strait.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

mmmmm so you can look at my diet and say to me that i am not healthy well let me see for the last 20 weeks i have not eaten bread and i have had veg with 4 out of 6 meals so does that mean that i am now unhealthy because for the last 10 days i have eaten bread and taken a break from veg...

now i have never said i am the now all to diets but i am mature enough to admit that there is more than one way to diet...

now you say that there are many that disagree with my approach to dieting that may be and that is their choice but i go by acheivements and what have you acheived........???

now you make this point..."If you did not take all the drugs you take you never would have been on the stage"

well in the 8 yrs between 1992 and 2000 i not only competed 7 times and won 4 of these shows but i did this without any drugs as i was in the royal navy at the time and it was illegal and not worth my job not only that but i recovered from a very serouise back injury and still went on to win a show drug free...

now i won these shows because i had the dedication and focus and diet knowhow to succeed....and any one who knows me will vouch for this....

now what have you acheived drug free ?????

now age and your ignorant i know best attitude aside the fact is that most guys/girls in the bodybuilding game use MRP's and Shakes to acheive their goals and they are healthy individuals Rob Hope the current natural Mr world/Universe advocates using shakes and MRP's in his diet....

now although you cannot tell if someone is healthy inside by the look of them from the outside i have said i get my bloods done on regular basis plus constant check ups from my DR and she has given me a clean bill of health....now i post my pictures up for all to see both in the off season and contest i do not go obesly overweight so in the off season i am still healthy i do not drink smoke or take party drugs can you say the same????

now are you natural???

post up a picture as although i agree you cannot determine a persons inner health from a picture i would like to see a picture of the person that preaches to me that i am a lazy drug addicted bodybuilder who wouldnt know a healthy diet if it bit me in the a$$ just so i have an understanding of what i need aim for......

so where is your advice to Tyson ???

i must go now as i need to tell all of the people i have given advice to in the past that they are going to an early grave...

now just to set the record straight this is not an ego thing and yes i do look better than you but you made this personel by bringing up the drug issue when all i was doing was giving advice to tyson the mature thing to do would of been to just disagree and give Tyson your version of a diet he should follow but no you had to get personel so this is not an ego thing on my part i think it is a ego thing on your part as you are trying to justify your approach to dieting and dont make your age an excuse......

now answer the question are you natural and by that i mean natural for life if you are then i will have atleast some respect for you but if you are not then as far as i am concerned this discussion ends as you cannot preach to someone about drugs when you have used yourself no matter the amount.....


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## robdog (Dec 2, 2003)

TBH i am hoping that this doesnt get to personal because i have a great deal of respect for both Hack and Paul.

All i can say on the subject is that Paul has helped me alot with my diet and what he has told me and what Jimmy has told me for that matter sometimes goes against some of the set in stone rules people think apply to dieting bit it works and at the end of the day for me thats the main thing.

Now lately with help from Paul and James again i have gained alot of weight but people still think im leaner. Yes i take alot of bodybuilding drugs but i dont think if i eat crap all day i would get half the results i have.

I dont eat as much solid food as i did because my appetite is very low and im finding it hard to get it down so i use weight gain/MRP etc.

Im not saying this way is better or any healthier but im saying its conveniant and more importantly works for me. I know Paul is a very bust guy living out of a suitcase alot of the time and need MRP to get by.

Thats my take on just a bit of whats been said tonight and maybe tempers are running high and when tempers run high things get said that are not always meant.


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

I'll stand by one thing, MRP's are a joke and always will be. BUT sometimes when people sacrafice they have no choice. But in no way is it as good as real food. Still, it is better than No food.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

*Hey lighten up dude.*

You asked me this "how is my diet full of trash ????"

I just answered your question to the diet you posted.

I didnt say it was unhealthy.

It takes years of abuse to ones body to manifest health issues.

I responded with an answer that actually improved your diet.

Don't ask the questions if you dont like the correct answer.

Here is some information about your breads in your diet.

Glucose is found in grains, pasta, bread, starches, other stuff too but I will focus on your bread.

While simple sugars are rapidly absorbed by the liver, only glucose can be released directly into the bloodstream. This is why glucose-rich carbohydrates like breads and pasta sprint from the liver back into the bloodstream, while galactose and fructose, which must first be converted to glucose in the liver, enter the bloodstream at a slower rate.

For fructose especially this is a very slow process.

So beings that breads and pasta raise blood sugars and therefor spike insulin (insulin is a storage hormone), this makes for a *BAD* selection when dieting.

Even worse for people with insulin resistance.

This happens to be a open forum and you seem more interested in insulting me than arguing the facts about your diet, and or Tysons diet.

Tyson would have had great results on Chef's diet if he only followed it and not modified it (maybe he should ask for some more chemical alternitives from you like DNP, remember?).

Do you agree that the additions to your diet are better?

If not then explain why.

Can you do this?

I cant wait for this answer maybe I will learn something about how bread is anabolic or something like that.

*YOUR ADVICE ON THE DIET TO TYSON IS CRAP!*

I still stand by that.

Your look at me, see the results on my diet (you can do this too) and useing gear at the same time is not fair. You got so defensive its like you want me to believe you dont use gear at all.

You take IGF-1, HGH, insulin, clenbuterol, T-3, anabolics, androgenics, DNP and a host of other stuff is no excuse for a lazy low nutritional diet.

Might work for you but not everybody.

If I took as much gear as you I would die.

Sure I have used gear. I never said I was natural. I never used my age as an excuse. I am fully aware of the long term side effects from big gear users.

You got defensive and took offence when I said that you took alot of gear.

Is this some kindof mystery?

You only post your gear cycles up on Bikers board and I have read them.

Look I can tell you that if I wanted to have somebody design a cycle for me you woud be one of the first ones I would ask.

At the same token, If I wanted to design a eating plan that suited my needs I would not ask you, I would ask someone like Chef.

Oh, I am not dragging him in on this as I know the history too.

This started when you took a poke at winger on another thread.

So if you poke someone else dont be surprised if you get poked back.

But I can tell you I gave good evidence on my behalf on improving your diet and I know I am right and if you think I am wrong then this is your opinion.

See above on the question why I was wrong on your diet improvement

I never called your diet unhealthy.

I called your diet to Tyson unhealthy.

I never said all your gains were due to gear.

I will say alot of your gains are from gear/drugs.

You probably have good genetics too.

Remember this all started when you posted that crap diet to Tyson.

I dont have to agree with you because you are on stage.

I could personally care less.

I have had friends take gear in excess of over 10 years and they have health issues right now.

I would be willing to bet that if you take gear for that long in the doses you are taking then I could state some of your health issues later down the line.

Oh, sorry this comes from experiance and the experiance that you dont want to hear about from this old, drunk, druggie guy.

I have tried every recreational drug with the exception of herion.

I have abused Alcohol for years.

I have used many types of gear.

(************Insert insults here***************)

I have thick skin and your insults dont bother me.

You are upset that I improved on your diet and dont agree with your diet to Tyson at all what so ever, get over it. It is not a personal attack. Back up your diet with some kindof scientific rational instead of drug choices.

I have posted helps on diets to Tyson.

I will not post a diet for anybody but will give them advice to help their diets along.

Will they be better?---------------Probably...

Will they be perfect?--------------probably not.

I thnk that Tyson would be better off using a Ketogenic diet like Atkins to lose bodyfat than the diet you gave.

If you want me to explain why then I will post that information too.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

well seeing as your reply is full of contradictions then i now feel better about not only the choices i make but the advice i give....

you have used AAS and you have a drinking problem and you are preaching to me who does not drink or smoke and they are the biggest killers in this world today.....

and yes me and ChefX have had our diffrences in the past but i have full respect for Rob as he has his veiws but he also understands that not one diet fits all....

i am glad you are thick skinned as i am but if you actually took the time to read back on your post's you will understand why i got mad.

after all the preaching you have done to me about health and you yourself are probably will have more health problems either now or in the future because of the abuse you have put your body through in the past that is the biggest kettle calling the pot black statement i have ever heard...

i take advice from all and openly admit that my way is not the best way but it works i am healthy and my doc can prove it...

so get off your high horse and join the crowd again....

i didnt have a pop at Winger i disagreed with him you insulted me by calling my diet crap and bringing my AAS use into the argument when all you needed to do was say you disagreed with my advice.....

after what you have just said in your last post i have no respect for someone who does not practice a healthy lifestyle but preaches it to all.....


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## Great White (Apr 4, 2003)

Sorry, im closing this thread before it gets out of hand.

Im good friends with both of you so am not prepared to comment and risk another argument.

Please take it to email / PM if you want to carry on - Email me if any problems


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

For the record, I do not use drugs now and the extent of my drinking is 2 glasses of wine a night.

This was all done in youthfull experimenting.

I have much responsibility and dont want to throw my health or anyones away with poor adivce.

If I have to disagree with someone then I will state the reason why. This is in fairness for rebuttel.

I appoligise if I offended anyone on this thread, this was not my intention what so ever but just to correct what I felt was missinformation.

Sorry Paul, and Sorry Paul.


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## Great White (Apr 4, 2003)

Re-Opened as requesed by Tyson.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I worked with him some on his diet and he is nailing it down pretty damn good.

If he would like to post his new diet this would be good.

Or I can post it

It would be easier for his imput to leave it in here instead of PM's and that way others can see the diffrences in the changes and the explinations why.


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## crazycacti (Jun 20, 2004)

hackskii said:


> It would be easier for his imput to leave it in here instead of PM's and that way others can see the diffrences in the changes and the explinations why.


agreed - since that is really the essence of the board and what its all about


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

OMG I am lost for words for the first time!!!!

Hackskii- where has this all come from buddy?

you are jumping all over paul here and TBH I think you are over complicating things

I have a tremendous amount of respect for you here dude, as do I respect paul.

I followed Pauls entire diet from the begining and trust me, he was maticulouse throughout with a very well planned diet. Even when he went to my friend Harrold who is an IFBB pro, Harrold found no faults what so ever with his diet and due to this, he didnt even charge paul for coaching as there was nothing he could do to improve his aproach!!!

I saw with my own eyes the pain Paul went through to achieve his condition and trust me, even without drugs he would have been in top shape

The diet Paul offered tyson is pretty good

there are plenty of the necesary macro's and ample fibre....its not far off what I would advise

I am not a big fan of whey myself but there is no denying that it is very handy-even chefx uses whey in his diets

I dont use MRP's because they cost too much and i rather use whey/malto etc...I deffo dont think they are cheap rubbish (not the company i use anyway)

I agree with paul G...this thread should be closed!


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## samurai691436114498 (Jan 6, 2005)

Its been good reading, i think both of you have made good points and agree/disagree with both of you.

Both of you have give good advice and I respect you both


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## John (Jun 5, 2004)

from 2 guys who undoubtedly have lots of knowledge, but it was interesting to see the opinions come out, i think we would all almost agree that real whole food is better but sometimes its just not possible, whether its down to not enough prep time, or not enough time to actually eat it.

So there is definately a place for the shake and mrp, as said above what works for one will not always work for another, but in this sport/ hobby call it as you wish, its about learning from your mistakes, and taking advice from others to get the desired result.

Whether you want to admit it or not, i think most of us here judge by how we/others look, not many of us are doctors or surgeons, so we do it by our eyes. And as has been said on many threads / post drugs alone will not do it, diet and effort are required by the load, so no matter what an individual takes, i think we all know it takes more than that.

This sport we are involved in is judged by how we look on the outside, theres nothing given for having the best inside, so i think Paul has proven himself more than worthy on the outside front, other than a few points that were taken maybe out of context, i think this was a really good informative thread.

I think sometimes we can all over complicate things in here, to do with diets cycles, this was about Tyson, he was looking for a new diet, in plain english and when it was posted to him, i think he was happy, so surely if he gets the result he wants , it hasnt been all bad?

Good effort guys, and i also agree this should maybe get closed now, god knows if i had done it, i would have had cheater telling me to calm down ages age, just kidding mate .


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## shakey (Jun 8, 2004)

Well i have tried pscarbs diets-& without the high use of drugs-never touched slin or igf & he has never adviced me to!!

What i can say Tyson try it his way for 2-3 months as this wont damaged your Health long term!?!

This is pics following Pscarbs diets with ****e genetics:rolleyes:

b4 & after


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

I also have full respect for Hackskii and PSCARB who offered me alot of help over previous issues regarding gear. Ive decided to try both, each for 2-3 months that way i am leaving my options open but also even if one diet is better (healthier) than another this doesnt mean it would definatly work for me.

Hackskii diet does look alot healthier but as i do sturggle with eating the amount of food i need, PSCARBS diet may well suite me alot better so i will work on the trial and error approach and take it from their, if i diet hard then im hoping to have lost the rest of b/f over the next few months anyway so i wouldnt be using either diet indeffinatly so i dont think health would come into it.

Cheers to both you guys for advice and i hope this will settle down now and cheers to every one else who has added to the thread.

FIRST DIET I WILL BE TRYING

1/....................OATS/PROTEIN WHEY SHAKE/ MULTI VITAMIN/ OMEGA 3

2/....................6 BOILED EGGS/CUP OF STRAWBERRYS/OMEGA 3

3/....................TUNA/COLSAW/APPLE/OMEGA 3

4/....................200g CHICKEN BREAST/50g RICE/MIXED VEG/OMEGA 3

5/....................1/2 PACKET OF HAM/MIX VEG/COLSLAW/OMEGA 3

6/....................PROTEIN SHAKE AFTER TRAINING

7/....................CHICKEN BREAST/SALAD/COLSLAW/OMEGA 3

Ive only added colslaw to add a little flavour and texture but will be eating very small amounts of it, also may use apple pectine H & B do not list this so i will have to try and find it some where.

Im sure others will also say this is no good as we all have different views but i am trying to learn as diet is not my strong side of training.........


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Great 6 pack shakey, i hope to get their in the end


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## John (Jun 5, 2004)

this will all go away if it hasnt already, and try a bigger h & b , or just have them order it i got somw a while back, it was about £6. good luck with the diet.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Much Better Tyson.

I wanted to help you help yourself on your diet.

I dont really like the word diet, it is really more a way of life.

Can you get down in bodyfat and body weight using powders and MRE's, MRP's, sure.

But, they are expensive, not as healthy and you don't really know what you are putting in your body. You can do better with whole foods.

When I say better I mean, cheaper, healthier, better taste.

When these guys are going into contests they have to restrict much of their calories. I have a friend that competed and during his dieting he was miserable, no energy, took up smoking just to curb his hunger, pounded eph to have energy. He would also chew on raw ginsing root to help him along and drink just black coffee.

The amount of dedication was incredible and impressive.

I dont think you (tyson) are looking for a compatition diet, just a way to help yourself along eating to get your goals.

Once you get the idea that food is actually like a drug, you can do what ever you want by tweaking this or that.

It is a good thing learning how and what to eat and what to avoid.

You can have a cool little weight loss eating program and enjoy the food, and its nutrients.

Your diet does look better.

I know you have problems with certain foods so I wont correct any of this, other than lets say add some digestive enzymes and probiotics.

lactobacillus acidophilus is a great addition to ones diet and has many good health benefits including immune system support.

You can find this in plain yogurt.

1 cup contains

18 grams of carbs

11 grams of protein

8 grams of fat.................no trans fats

Toss 2 egg whites in that mix and the ratio is perfect.

If the taste bothers you then you can add stuff like a small amount of vanilla extract, stevia and you have gained nothing in calories but just added taste to this.

You also can make some tasty salad dressing from plain yogurt, toss in some seasonings add a little lemon juice and you have a healthy salad dressing which is good for you and tasts good.

One more thing, I dont want to overcomplicate things but packaged meats contain alot of nitrates and nitrites to kill bacteria and to give cured meat its pink color.

Nitrites can contribute to the formation of potentially dangerous carcinogens in the body, which in turn can result in malignant tumor growth over time.

But in moderation all things are acceptable.

Congratulations on making your diet, it's actually pretty good.


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Thats good to hear, got their in the end  . And your right im not after a phisique to enter competitions i just want to look better and feel healthier, I am honest enough to admit that i havent got the dedication some of you have with your diets but im working on it. Normally my diet is 6 days on and one off a week which works well for me


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

TYSON said:


> 1/....................OATS/PROTEIN WHEY SHAKE/ MULTI VITAMIN/ OMEGA 3
> 
> 2/....................6 BOILED EGGS/CUP OF STRAWBERRYS/OMEGA 3
> 
> ...


This isnt a bad diet at all tyson

I do feel however (coming from someone that has had loads of diet experience) that if you stay strict to this diet 7 days a week, your glycogen will deplete so much that you will be flagging considerably!

If i may suggest?

either

1 add more carbs and fats to each days total

2 add 2-3 cheat meals a week (any food you wish)

3 have 1 day a week where you eat as much junk as you can over a 2-3 hour period

Any of the above options may make the diet feel more managable


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Great advice jimmy but most people know i do have a cheat day a week but its good you picked up on that. sometimes i have two :crazy: As for adding the extra carbs, surely i will not loose weight buy doing this, remember im cutting but then again what do i know


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## JohnO (May 1, 2005)

Tyson, I will be interested in seeing if you also find this diet repetative. Do you plan to eat the same meals every day?

As you know I'm using the Diatia and find this version OK and I'm getting results. The bindge and perge version was the same food every day and after a month or two it did make you feel like you just couldn't eat it any more!

What sort of results do you expect from this deit and how are you planning to combat the repetative nature of the same food day in day out?


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

TYSON said:


> As for adding the extra carbs, surely i will not loose weight buy doing this, remember im cutting


As long as the cheat day is in place then no need for extra carbs.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Limiting the carbs some along with the lower GI of them he will control insulin and he will succeed with pretty much ease.

I dont think he will get glygogen depleted.

Oats, apple, rice, mixed vegetables, colslaw, strawberrys, I think he will be ok.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

*After reading this whole thread again I am convinced that I was way out of order.*

I was wrong in my approach, wrong on the information as well.

The diet Paul gave to Tyson was not going to kill him as it was suggested.

The diet Paul gave to Tyson is good.

I feel now I was a mad man on that thread.

After reading again, I did take it personal and for that I am sorry.

I apologise to the board for acting like that.

Paul, I am Sorry and I hope you forgive me and accept my apology, it is sincere.

You are a good guy and have achieved great things.

Again Sorry.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

HackSkii many thanks for your apology it takes a bigger man to openly admit he was wrong so i do accept your apology my friend....

as we all know things can get heated when debating on these boards..

...


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

this thread has highlighted one thing and that is there are many ways to acheive results in this game but the mindfeild is deciding which one is the best for you.

ChefX has his Diata

HackSkii has his Low carb High fat approach

I have a Carb Cycling approach

all have and do work but they need to be adhered to as both of the other members above will agree results will not appear overnight and sometimes it will take more than a few night to get that buff body......lol

Tyson....it can be sometimes difficult to decide on the correct diet but by sticking to one diet approach you will acheive what you have set your goals on.


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Cheers PSCARB, like i have said before m8, i allways welcome your help, you have helped me out alot in the past and been their if ive had a question......NICE ONE :beer:


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Actually my favorite way of eating is The Zone.

Chef's diatia is very close to this.

I find that the older I get my metabolism slows down and my responce to certain carbs needs to be limited.

Some nights I am not really hungry, but when I eat a carb, its all over with. Binge eating and I cant stop.

I dont buy candy, cookies, icecream for those reasons, even cerials. I will just go banannas on that food and then I cant sleep from being so full.

I do agree that not any one diet is the best aproach.

Trial and error is a good thing to consider when trying to learn how the body reacts to certain foods.

You could actually lose weight from any selection of food but this would be restrecting the calories.

They have a milk diet which works. All you do is drink milk all day long and only milk only.

Read that the calcium in it aids in lipogenesis.

So deficiencies in calcium can hinder lipogenesis when dieting.

Bummer is if you are deficient in calciferol (Vitamin D) you cant absorb calcium.

Man, I can really complicate things huh? 

Sorry.......


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## Captain Hero (Jun 13, 2004)

hackskii said:


> *After reading this whole thread again I am convinced that I was way out of order.*
> 
> I was wrong in my approach, wrong on the information as well.
> 
> ...


Top bloke Hackskii, few people ever admit they are wrong.


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

:withstupi In that case HACKSII which do you think is best for what im after, the one im on or PSCARB version.......


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Which ever one you choose.

They both will work..

I like the idea of all my macro's being in the same meal at pretty much the same ratio.

But look how you would feel if you made a diet that you could eat and live with and lose the weight you were looking for?

The sense of accomplishment is awesome.

But stick with it and dont forget to weigh yourself at the same time each week and take measurements to track your progress.

Taking a picture too (before and after) is helpfull to look at your success or failure.

Dont forget to chew your food really well.

Digestion starts in the mouth with saliva.

Chewing properly will result in better digestion, better absorption, and will aid in the swallowing process.

It is important to take your time and enjoy your food.

Not only that when you gulp (im not saying you do) down the stomach does not have the time to tell the brain that it has had enough food.

So chewing slowly and pulverising your food you will get the signal from the stomach to the brain and probably eat less food.

Anyway, either one will work, I like the idea of the lower GI carbs myself, but that is just me.

So what ever you decide stick with and keep us informed.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

hackskii said:


> But look how you would feel if you made a diet that you could eat and live with and lose the weight you were looking for?
> 
> The sense of accomplishment is awesome.
> 
> ...


couldnt agree more the sense of accomplishment when you acheive the weight or look you set out for is awesome. without a doubht the best thing about dieting....



hackskii said:


> Dont forget to chew your food really well.


yea you must of read the same book as my wife as she keeps telling me to chew my foods i do have a tendency to eat to fast but i have said when she starts gicing me a chew then i will chew my foods....lol

with regards to the calcium it is suggested that if you are avoiding dairy foods in your diet then you should get approx 1200mg a day from supps to assist with fatloss.....


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## Jimmy1 (Aug 14, 2003)

"There are many different roads to Rome" so the saying goes. People will always argue about diet/training/gear but in all honesty, there is no one way. An arguement over the GI of a carrot will always have differing views and I dont give a rats ar$ed how many there are. You see I have descovered that the secret to bb'ing is one thing....

CONSISTENCY!!!

I have tried every type of diet there is too, both bulking and cutting. Without consistency, there are no results. I feel that sometimes we need to use some of these short cuts (MRP's to mention but one) to keep consistent.

I advise many guys on there daily nutrition and I will use processed foods, crisps, bread...bla bla bla to keep them eating consistently. There are fantastic diets out there like diata and body opus etc, and if one can keep to them then great!(sport doc being a prime example with chefx's diet) Dont forget though, that there are people out there that need to go against the grain a little to keep enthused.

My dinner this evening was chicken kiev with suede, carrot and potato (mashed in butter) I even added a cheap granulated gravy! Afterwards I treated myself to cadburies chocolate fingers.

I ate every last mouthfull...nearly licked the plate but the mrs would kick my but if i had!

If I had chowed down on chicken and rice I would have got half way through it and left the rest cos it took me so long to eat that it had gone cold!....sound fammiliar??

The long and short of bb'ing is we have to eat. Without doing so, we will get no where.

I feel as a moderator here its my job to help members learn how to progress....if that means going against the grain then so be it....if we stuck to perfect healthy eating all the time then only 1 in 10 people would stick go through with it ....the rest would get pi$$ed off and, at worst, not eat.

So get those MRP's down ya, eat a burger now and again....grow! As long as you follow a well balanced diet the rest of the time, you wont go far wrong.


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## robdog (Dec 2, 2003)

Jimmy said:


> "There are many different roads to Rome" so the saying goes. People will always argue about diet/training/gear but in all honesty, there is no one way. An arguement over the GI of a carrot will always have differing views and I dont give a rats **** how many there are. You see I have descovered that the secret to bb'ing is one thing....
> 
> CONSISTENCY!!!
> 
> ...


Excellent post.

If people can live on dry chicken breast and rice for the rest of there life then more power to them. I cant and nealry gave up eating properly at all until Jimmy got me to change my views and now sometimes i eat clean sometimes i dont but im eating lots everyday and im growing.


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

Thanks for that, i started to think their was something wrong with me. i thought you all lived on these diets so strict that nothing else passed your lips....great to see some of you are human after all


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## Cookie (Sep 14, 2009)

> If I had chowed down on chicken and rice I would have got half way through it and left the rest cos it took me so long to eat that it had gone cold!....sound fammiliar??





> If people can live on dry chicken breast and rice for the rest of there life then more power to them.


NOTE

The following statements are not aimed as an attack on the two individuals quotes..these were just used to highlight a common way of thinking/myth.......

Why do people still think that to eat clean still means to eat "BORING"????????????????

For f\_/cks sake aint people heard of cookbooks???????????????? or even putting asmuch thought into their food preperation and how a dish looks as they do their gear/supps/training programs........

Example what happend to flavouring rice with spices/herbs lemon/lime juice?? all of which add next to no calories.....

Cooking/steaming meats/chicken inperticular wrapped in foil with some seasonal veggies and herbs and some white wine in the oven for 20 mins(the foil creates a pressure cooker enviroment)whats so hard about that???????????

I think people really need to learn how to cook first& foremost before getting into this game because there is no need whatsoever why people cannot eat clean "ALL THE TIME" and not have good/excellent tasting/appertising foods each and every meal....

I grow my own herbs in my backyard,each costing me about £1 per pot....and their fresh and ready to pick each and everytime I make a meal and about 100% cheaper than buying from the supermarket.........

C`MON guys just put a little bit of thought into it,it aint rocket science to make a meal taste good with out putting sh!te stuff on it.......

I tell everyone I help..."instead of buying more gear spend that money on a good cookbook and make bbing food more appealling and interesting" then you have no excuse to go off your diet cos "I was bored" " I couldnt face another chicken breast again"

Rant over,lol.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I agree cookie.

I grow tomatoes and I can say they taste so much better than store bought.

They smell diffrent too.

I have to keep my daughter away from them or they are all gone.

I have a lemon tree too.

I also have a plum tree.

My favorite of all is the avacado tree.............I cant eat them fast enough without them going bad......I have to give them away because they go bad.

Tree ripe fruits are so much better, so are the vegetables.

Oh the possoms and rats love them too......Grrrrr.


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## ChefX (Jan 10, 2005)

TYSON said:


> :withstupi In that case HACKSII which do you think is best for what im after, the one im on or PSCARB version.......


Oh oh i have to step in and answer this one! :bounce:

the answer is... the one you will follow!


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Damn Tyson, you could have been like 3-4 days into the diet already.

Just choose one and stick to it.

I am not a perfect eater.

But if I do slip up I can modify to accomidate.

Start Today and keep us informed on what is going on.

Start right now with this meal.

Funny thing is when we blow it, we are only next to the next meal to correct things. So if you blow a meal there is always the next meal to set things right.

It is not complicated (unless you listen to me), start and access.

If you don't lose then re-evaluate what you are doing but not after sticking to it.


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## winger (Jul 26, 2003)

ChefX said:


> Oh oh i have to step in and answer this one! :bounce:
> 
> the answer is... the one you will follow!


That is 100% :crazy:


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## TYSON (Aug 30, 2004)

hackskii said:


> Damn Tyson, you could have been like 3-4 days into the diet already.


I am on day 3, started on monday had to make an alteration so advise would be good.

I found i could not eat the ham on its own as i nearly puked.......so decided that i could possably put it into a wholemeal roll with salad. I know im not supposed to have bread but would this really make much difference if i stick to the rest of the diet ?

Also i thought if i do have to have a roll then why not put a tin of tuna in it instead of ham (more protein) and decided to not have the other tuna meal and replaced with chicken so diet im currently on is as follows : Is this ok as i struggle to eat plain tuna even with colslaw.....

PROTEIN & OAT SHAKE WITH MULTI VIT AND OMEGA 3

SIX SCRAMBLED EGGS / STRAWBERRYS AND OMEGA

200G CHICKEN / 50G RICE / COLESLAW / ORANGE AND OMEGA

TRAINING FOLLOWED BY PROTEIN SHAKE

200G CHICKEN / 2OZ BROCCALI / COLESLAW AND OMEGA

TUNA SALAD WHOLE MEAL ROLL / APPLE AND OMEGA

200G CHICKEN

Last meal about 10pm

i personally think this is ok but as i say any changes welcome

ARE THE CARBS AT THE RIGHT TIME OF DAY ?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I myself think the carbs would be enough.

Remember you are trying to control insulin.

All diets reduce carbohydrates when dieting.

Add apple pectin to that at about 6 a day with the big meals and this will help some with absorption slowing things down a bit so you wont feel hungrier later.

If you dont lose weight after a couple of weeks (which you should) then modify and drop the cals by 500 a day.

Weigh yourself and keep tabs on your progress.

Shoot for about 2-3 lbs at first then back off to about 2 lbs a week.

Any more than that you will have to add some food.

When you get down in weight then you can back things off to about a lb a week.


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