# Gh protocol



## Hs1988 (Feb 20, 2014)

Hi, I am currently doing my research on hgh as I'm thinking about running it and one thing I can't seem to understand. Some people run it everyday as I thought is the way but some take weekends off and other I have seen run it only mon/wed/fri but at double the dose, what's the reasoning behind taking weekends off and running it mon/we'd/fri but at double the dose? And whats the difference results wise of running it these ways?


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Depends heavily on how long you plan to run it, there are medical studies out there that show that for the first 6 months treatment is slightly more effective for people who are dosed every day but that after 12 months it is more effective on people who are dosed Monday, Wednesday and Friday so you can see there is a tipping point. These studies are based on people with medical issues that require treatment though not healthy people trying to get ripped so it is subjective how relevant they are.

There is a lot of science behind it but after much reading on the subject I decided to run it for 6 months dosing Monday Wednesday and Friday due to the difference between the results of this and every day being minimal at my level and the convenience of only 3 pins per week. I pinned 4ius each time and found this gave no noticeable sides I just held muscle and dropped fat a bit better than normal and had better energy levels especially on dosing days as I worked out 30-60 minutes after pinning, I started mid way through an aas cycle at 210lb 15%bf so it helped the crash of this and me hold onto gains and then after the pct was over it helped me lean up to 196lb at 8% bf.

The dosage is based on body weight and there is actually a calculation I will try and dig out but it was roughly 1iu per 50lb you weigh to not over saturate your system, body weight is however not the only factor so in real medical situations blood serum tests are carried out regularly to get to the optimal dosage this calculation is just what they use as a starting point. This may or may not be practical for you, for me it wasn't so I based it on how I felt and the starting dosage felt ok to me, not very scientific I know but worked out ok.

Hope that helps mate.


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## Buzzz_ (Jan 13, 2013)

People think the larger pulsed doses of GH is more anabolic, I ran it at 8iu eod and was impressed after only 6 weeks


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## Hs1988 (Feb 20, 2014)

Roid-Rage said:


> Depends heavily on how long you plan to run it, there are medical studies out there that show that for the first 6 months treatment is slightly more effective for people who are dosed every day but that after 12 months it is more effective on people who are dosed Monday, Wednesday and Friday so you can see there is a tipping point. These studies are based on people with medical issues that require treatment though not healthy people trying to get ripped so it is subjective how relevant they are.
> 
> There is a lot of science behind it but after much reading on the subject I decided to run it for 6 months dosing Monday Wednesday and Friday due to the difference between the results of this and every day being minimal at my level and the convenience of only 3 pins per week. I pinned 4ius each time and found this gave no noticeable sides I just held muscle and dropped fat a bit better than normal and had better energy levels especially on dosing days as I worked out 30-60 minutes after pinning, I started mid way through an aas cycle at 210lb 15%bf so it helped the crash of this and me hold onto gains and then after the pct was over it helped me lean up to 196lb at 8% bf.
> 
> ...


Ahhh I see now the mon wed fri protocol and the reason behind it, this will be my first run with it I don't mind pinning as it will be subq so not really an issue of muscle groups so pin into etc, I also have a nagging shoulder issue I've not had checked out but it comes and goes and at the moment its present do you think maybe gh might be able to help that at all as I have read it may. If I was to run it mon to fri will taking the weekends off have a negative effect on results?


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## Hs1988 (Feb 20, 2014)

Buzzz_ said:


> People think the larger pulsed doses of GH is more anabolic, I ran it at 8iu eod and was impressed after only 6 weeks


Tbh I wasn't expecting much size wise from gh as I've came to expect not a lot from the research I've done so far, have you run other protocols that you have compared results to?


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## GMO (Jul 17, 2013)

id did 10 iu eod of nord for about 8 weeks with a bit ghrp6 on alterante days and went up a ring size! middle knuckles got slighlty thicker .id be very wary with using high dose of hgh, i stick to 2-4 ius ed (depending on brand) when i run it now

gains wise i lost a good bit of fat but got bloated to f''1ck, and felt sleepy all the time.. dont think i got much extra mass or strength from it.. nice addition to a cycle but dont expect wonders , even at higher doses..

hgh and slin on the other hand is supposed to be very effective .. not done myself but could be worth looking into


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## Hs1988 (Feb 20, 2014)

GMO said:


> id did 10 iu eod of nord for about 8 weeks with a bit ghrp6 on alterante days and went up a ring size! middle knuckles got slighlty thicker .id be very wary with using high dose of hgh, i stick to 2-4 ius ed (depending on brand) when i run it now
> 
> gains wise i lost a good bit of fat but got bloated to f''1ck, and felt sleepy all the time.. dont think i got much extra mass or strength from it.. nice addition to a cycle but dont expect wonders , even at higher doses..
> 
> hgh and slin on the other hand is supposed to be very effective .. not done myself but could be worth looking into


Slin is something I'd probably not dabble in like dnp I feel them two are best left to those competing as the dangours involved. What I'm looking at is 5iu a day 3iu first thing In the morning and 2iu before bed at night. It would be hyge I'll be using green or black tops. If black tops then 5iu a day of green tops 4iu a day just because how the vials are 8 and 10ius for ease, guessing there wouldn't be much difference between 4 and 5iu a day


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## Hs1988 (Feb 20, 2014)

One question if anyone can answe please. If I was to run 4 or 5iu from Monday to Friday and take the weekend off what difference in effectiveness would there be between taking the weekend off and running it through the weekend? For ease and costs I was thinking taking weekends off as others have also done it but wouldn't want to if it means less effectiveness.


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Buzzz_ said:


> People think the larger pulsed doses of GH is more anabolic, I ran it at 8iu eod and was impressed after only 6 weeks


I have heard this but never tried, I imagine quicker initial gains but probably not advisable to stay on as long would you say that is correct from your experience or do you feel with eod protocol that saturation would be avoided?



Hs1988 said:


> Ahhh I see now the mon wed fri protocol and the reason behind it, this will be my first run with it I don't mind pinning as it will be subq so not really an issue of muscle groups so pin into etc, I also have a nagging shoulder issue I've not had checked out but it comes and goes and at the moment its present do you think maybe gh might be able to help that at all as I have read it may. If I was to run it mon to fri will taking the weekends off have a negative effect on results?


My friend had good results with his shoulder injury and gh but it depends on what it is his was a muscle tear that attached the socket in place and under undue stress it would tear again so the gh helped to rebuild this more effectively he also used PEG MGF directly into the delt with his gh cycle.



GMO said:


> id did 10 iu eod of nord for about 8 weeks with a bit ghrp6 on alterante days and went up a ring size! middle knuckles got slighlty thicker .id be very wary with using high dose of hgh, i stick to 2-4 ius ed (depending on brand) when i run it now
> 
> gains wise i lost a good bit of fat but got bloated to f''1ck, and felt sleepy all the time.. dont think i got much extra mass or strength from it.. nice addition to a cycle but dont expect wonders , even at higher doses..
> 
> hgh and slin on the other hand is supposed to be very effective .. not done myself but could be worth looking into


I have heard this bloating is due to over saturation I found on 6iu mon - wed - fri I got a bit of bloat in the upper abdomen lowering to 4iu made this go and I didn't notice any gains decrease. As far as slin goes timing and diet has to be spot on for that to work, if you are dedicated it can produce big results if you aren't it can make you fat or screw you up.



Hs1988 said:


> One question if anyone can answe please. If I was to run 4 or 5iu from Monday to Friday and take the weekend off what difference in effectiveness would there be between taking the weekend off and running it through the weekend? For ease and costs I was thinking taking weekends off as others have also done it but wouldn't want to if it means less effectiveness.


taking the weekends off would have the same effect as the mon-wed-fri where it gives your body a chance to not get saturated so in short to start with ed would produce better results but with weekends off you would get results for longer and there would be a tipping point where you get better results with the rest, as far as cost though and gains ratio I would still recommend 4iu mon-wed-fri or eod if you can remember when to pin for as long as you can afford.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Roid-Rage said:


> I have heard this but never tried, I imagine quicker initial gains but probably not advisable to stay on as long would you say that is correct from your experience or do you feel with eod protocol that saturation would be avoided?





Roid-Rage said:


> I have heard this bloating is due to over saturation I found on 6iu mon - wed - fri I got a bit of bloat in the upper abdomen lowering to 4iu made this go and I didn't notice any gains decrease. As far as slin goes timing and diet has to be spot on for that to work, if you are dedicated it can produce big results if you aren't it can make you fat or screw you up.





Roid-Rage said:


> taking the weekends off would have the same effect as the mon-wed-fri where it gives your body a chance to not get saturated so in short to start with ed would produce better results but with weekends off you would get results for longer and there would be a tipping point where you get better results with the rest, as far as cost though and gains ratio I would still recommend 4iu mon-wed-fri or eod if you can remember when to pin for as long as you can afford.


could you explain this saturation point more please, you have mentioned it a lot just wondering what you mean....


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> could you explain this saturation point more please, you have mentioned it a lot just wondering what you mean....


I'm not going to pretend I fully understand it but from what I read there is a point of no benefit of going higher on doses of GH and in clinical trials they base this on body weight of the person but then adjust based on serum tests to find the right dosage for the patient. I believe this is also why a lot of long term aesthetic users find it beneficial to take weekends off or eod to avoid a build up if their dosages are slightly too high because as an aesthetic user they may not be having the continuous blood tests that a medical patient is. This is based on research on information sites and forums before I tried GH myself and there is a medical study (based on medical issues rather than BBers) that shows that in the first 6 months patients receiving ed injections had a slight increase in responsiveness to the treatment but in the second 6 months the patients receiving injections of the same amount but only m+w+f tipped this responsiveness into their favour showing in my mind diminishing benefits of ed use or higher dose over time.

Now in my actual experience I have found that 4iu m+w+f works well for me, 4iu ed or eod or m-f I have also run and notice no extra benefits to this protocol (note I probably didn't run ed long enough to see any diminishing results that may occur over time). I also found upping to 6iu didn't provide any obvious benefit but it did introduce the bloating side effect people talk about and as an educated guess I came to the conclusion that this may be caused by this over saturation mentioned on forums etc.

Feel free to correct where I am or may be wrong as I am sure your GH experience is far greater than my limited experience with it.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

there is no saturation point as you are interpreting, there is a limit to how much lipolysis (fatty acid release) that can be achieved over a period of time. ADDING more GH will do NOTHING to increase lipolysis beyond that threshold. GH that we inject is synthetic and will continue to give other benefits via conversion to IGF, although there will be a tipping point to side effects as in general doses will be far more than most can tolerate initially (hence the bloating, CTS etc)

there is a negative effect constant GH will have and this is down to its active life and what effect that has on the natural release, which will be suppressed/stopped when using synthetic, this is why EOD or E3D is better on the body when using higher doses in single shots, for example 7.5iu of pharma GH will be active for approx 12hrs giving very little time for natural to restart before the next hit......do this on a EOD or E3D and you have more time....

i use a M/W/F method when not dieting and find for me it is the best way to use synthetic GH when not dieting, when dieting i structure my use to best utilise fat loss so use it differently.


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## Lukehh (Nov 14, 2012)

Pscarb said:


> i use a M/W/F method when not dieting and find for me it is the best way to use synthetic GH when not dieting, when dieting i structure my use to best utilise fat loss so use it differently.


Ive seen you mention this a few times, how do you do it for maximum fat loss?!


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> there is no saturation point as you are interpreting, there is a limit to how much lipolysis (fatty acid release) that can be achieved over a period of time. ADDING more GH will do NOTHING to increase lipolysis beyond that threshold. GH that we inject is synthetic and will continue to give other benefits via conversion to IGF, although there will be a tipping point to side effects as in general doses will be far more than most can tolerate initially (hence the bloating, CTS etc)
> 
> there is a negative effect constant GH will have and this is down to its active life and what effect that has on the natural release, which will be suppressed/stopped when using synthetic, this is why EOD or E3D is better on the body when using higher doses in single shots, for example 7.5iu of pharma GH will be active for approx 12hrs giving very little time for natural to restart before the next hit......do this on a EOD or E3D and you have more time....
> 
> i use a M/W/F method when not dieting and find for me it is the best way to use synthetic GH when not dieting, when dieting i structure my use to best utilise fat loss so use it differently.


That makes sense so I had come to the correct conclusion on what works but was over simplifying several reasons behind that into one so you are running it normally Monday Wednesday and Friday but step it up when you are cutting to I assume multiple shots per day, makes sense and ar your level I can see why you would need to do that but at my level the basic Monday Wednesday and Friday is giving me what I need. Just out of interest is the 7.5 the dosage you are using when on mwf?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

The conclusion you came to read as if everything GH gives stops working at a certain point, this is not true (apologies if I read it wrong) fat loss has a limit to how much can be achieved in a certain timespan......other actions of GH will not suddenly stop (IGF-1 conversion etc)

It's nothing to do with mine or your level its to do with using the correct protocol for your goals.

I find when losing fat is not my primary goal then a single shot M/W/F has worked the best for me and is less hassle than every day shots.

When primary fat loss is my goal then I use it slightly different, I use it in a way that utilises pulsing and the effective use of the FFA's that GH releases.

I would normally use 6-8 iu of pharma on a M/W/F protocol & 4-6iu of pharma on a ed protocol


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## Smoog (Dec 29, 2012)

GMO said:


> id did 10 iu eod of nord for about 8 weeks with a bit ghrp6 on alterante days and went up a ring size!


Giving THAT one a go :laugh: Did you do EOD including the weekends?


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> The conclusion you came to read as if everything GH gives stops working at a certain point, this is not true (apologies if I read it wrong) fat loss has a limit to how much can be achieved in a certain timespan......other actions of GH will not suddenly stop (IGF-1 conversion etc)
> 
> It's nothing to do with mine or your level its to do with using the correct protocol for your goals.
> 
> ...


No problem I didn't mean the benefits stopped completely I was more talking along the line of diminished gains at a certain dosage and / or benefit to doing higher dosage or more frequency drops off at a certain point but yes you are correct this only applies depending on the persons goals.

Anyway good info as always (I have read this forum much longer than I have been a member) and you have furthered my understanding of something I am interested in.

Just one more question if I may do you work your dosages out on bodyweight x something etc or just found that dosage has always worked best. The reason I ask and why I mentioned about us being at different levels etc is the next time I plan to use gh is later this year to roll off a big aas cycle and I was planning on running 4iu m-w-f and was considering that this may be a little low if I put on good mass during my cycle.

Also a completely unrelated question while I have your attention if I may;the pinning frequency of different esters advised on this forum is different to many other forums as you probably know and this seems to be a lot to do with your sticky. Enanthate for instance once per week I know from other people that this works fine where as other sites say 2x per week minimum for this ester. My question however is around propionate because I plan on doing a cutting cycle soon using test and masteron, the masteron contains 150mg enanthate and 50mg propionate per ml is this going to be ok for a twice a week pin or do I need to make this more frequent? I was planning on running test e with it but if I need to up the frequency of jabs I might run sust with it instead.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

in my opinion 4iu eod or M/W/F will yield very little in the way of gains, there is a sticky in this section that shows 8iu M/W/F for 6 weeks gave approx 2kg lean tissue and a drop of approx 2%BF.........this was with trained athletes where everything else was on point.......

for me i use 6-8iu M/W/F i feel any less will not give me the results i require, but there is no formula for dose, it is like most things a trial and error procedure.

Prop is really EOD but can go to E3D with no real change in end results, i will say that the mix you have mentioned of 150Mast E with 50mg Test P is a stupid blend and i see no real point in it (if i read your post correctly) with any blend you need to be directed by the shortest ester......

i see no benefit in mixing long and short esters like this.....


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> in my opinion 4iu eod or M/W/F will yield very little in the way of gains, there is a sticky in this section that shows 8iu M/W/F for 6 weeks gave approx 2kg lean tissue and a drop of approx 2%BF.........this was with trained athletes where everything else was on point.......
> 
> for me i use 6-8iu M/W/F i feel any less will not give me the results i require, but there is no formula for dose, it is like most things a trial and error procedure.
> 
> ...


Cheers I will try and find that sticky may up my planned dosage of gh, that sounds like good gains for 6 weeks.

Ye it is a silly mix I would have just gone for E if they had it but it was this blend or 100mg / ml of prop so went for this one. E3D should be ok then thanks.


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> in my opinion 4iu eod or M/W/F will yield very little in the way of gains, there is a sticky in this section that shows 8iu M/W/F for 6 weeks gave approx 2kg lean tissue and a drop of approx 2%BF.........this was with trained athletes where everything else was on point.......
> 
> for me i use 6-8iu M/W/F i feel any less will not give me the results i require, but there is no formula for dose, it is like most things a trial and error procedure.
> 
> ...


One more question if you don't mind would you say 26 weeks m+w+f @6iu or 20 weeks m+w+f @8iu would yield best results or barely noticeable difference? I will be starting this towards the end of a cycle and using it throughout pct and 10 weeks after so the longer would start earlier rather than finish later.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Well I know nothing about you or your training, nutrition etc.....

But there would be a difference as you will be using GH for longer even if the dose is relatively the same, how much you will notice depends on many factors


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Fair enough I understand nutrition and training play a big role in everything just wondered if the general consensus is lower dose for longer duration or higher dose for shorter duration, I have 500ius to play with.


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## GMO (Jul 17, 2013)

Smoog said:


> Giving THAT one a go :laugh: Did you do EOD including the weekends?


yeah mate. got some good changes in body comp and it help greatly with my lower back issues .. but i was badly bloated and slept most of the day, 10iu in one shot taken on waking or if i woke up in early hours for a **** id take it then and go back to bed.. got some wicked dreams ans slept like log  , ran 100-125mcg ghrp6 3-4 x ed on non hgh days.


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## Smoog (Dec 29, 2012)

GMO said:


> yeah mate. got some good changes in body comp and it help greatly with my lower back issues .. but i was badly bloated and slept most of the day, 10iu in one shot taken on waking or if i woke up in early hours for a **** id take it then and go back to bed.. got some wicked dreams ans slept like log  , ran 100-125mcg ghrp6 3-4 x ed on non hgh days.


Did you not think about taking the stuff post workout? Gonna give it a go when I get funds together. My lower back has been so problematic lately so I'm so glad you've said that.


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## GMO (Jul 17, 2013)

Smoog said:


> Did you not think about taking the stuff post workout? Gonna give it a go when I get funds together. My lower back has been so problematic lately so I'm so glad you've said that.


i was toying with the idea but was told morning shots would be better so went with that. post work out could be worth a go mate. really made a difference to my back though! i have degenerative disks and find hgh very effective at slowing the effects and helping it them heal up when they have been stressed .

i only ran it as i was getting them cheap from a friend of friend who was getting them on script ,i was getting them for pennies till he found out how much they were really worth so made the most of it lol,


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

Im wondering the best time to inject. If I go M/W/F would post workout be best? or first thing in morning? last thing at night?

My goals from HGH are a little of everything. Any lean mass it can give or fat loss is a bonus.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

funkdocta said:


> Im wondering the best time to inject. If I go M/W/F would post workout be best? or first thing in morning? last thing at night?
> 
> My goals from HGH are a little of everything. Any lean mass it can give or fat loss is a bonus.


unless you are using GH to release FFa's to be utilised by cardio then any time is fine, there is no real best time per say, i get on better with before bed shots


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> unless you are using GH to release FFa's to be utilised by cardio then any time is fine, there is no real best time per say, i get on better with before bed shots


Slightly off topic but when you are on an AAS cycle do you mix your hcg with hgh or pin them separately? Reason I ask is I have taken your advice and decided to run 30 week of hygetropin m+w+f @ 8iu but its going to overlap with a cycle and there is so much conflicting information online about if you can mix them in the same pin or not, what are your thoughts on this?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Roid-Rage said:


> Slightly off topic but when you are on an AAS cycle do you mix your hcg with hgh or pin them separately? Reason I ask is I have taken your advice and decided to run 30 week of hygetropin m+w+f @ 8iu but its going to overlap with a cycle and there is so much conflicting information online about if you can mix them in the same pin or not, what are your thoughts on this?


no i don't GH is far to costly to mix with HCG on the chance it will not effect it


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## Roid-Rage (Nov 26, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> no i don't GH is far to costly to mix with HCG on the chance it will not effect it


Cheers makes sense


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