# CKD help with foods please........



## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

After a whole weekend of bingeing on junk foods my weight has gained by 8lbs lol. I know most will be water/glycogen due to being depleted but i really want to try KETO.

I have researched the diet and know i need 2000 cal, 160g protein, 120g fat to get into CKD. Im 155lb lbm with 8-9%bf and want to chistle my mid section, lowers abbs have a little stubborn fat ect...

Only thing i need help with is foods really, and a little worried about is cholestrol and salt levels. Will high salt levels hold water retention/bloat if having sausage/bacon/cheese? or could i stick to a clean ckd eating slightly healthier foods.

Was thinking of foods like this

turkey/beef mince meat

chicken

salmon

tuna

pepporioni/salami

eggs

milk??

cheese

cream

quark??

evoo

peanut butter??

flax seed

fish oil

butter

These foods i'm unsure about onion/tomato/peppers/broccli/leaf salads? peanut butter/milk/soy milk/quark. Will these take you out of keto?

Any help would be great, will go and get my shopping list for the week once i get a few replys.

Thanks.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Diet wise i'm thinking of this

Breakfast

Scrambled egg, salmon, cheese or butter

Lunch

Tuna/mack/sardine salad with evoo or cheese. depending if i have tuna or mack/sard

dinner

chicken breast/turkey, evoo or low salt cheese

50g red pepper??

Pre-workout

shake, flaxseed oil or peanut butter?

pwo

extra lean mince beef/turkey to keep fat low or chicken breast, brocclie/red pepper

night snack

Sardine/mackeral or

ff cream, whey or milk/quark?

Not put my grams of food down yet as calorie count won't load on my comp this morning. Although protein will be 26g per 6 meals, and fat will be 24g per 4 meals and 12g fat for pre/post.

How that look guys? Are the peppers/ onion ok in small doses?


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> Diet wise i'm thinking of this
> 
> Breakfast
> 
> ...


I keep saying it, read the chapters on Ketosis & recomposition (carb-up) in the bible (written by the late, great GURU dan duchaine- lyle Mcdonald worked for him, but has since added no more accurate information):

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=UL2OARC8

if you can carb up on junk, your metabolism is exceptional, and you don't need CKD- Please read how precise the carb up is AND WHY- its all about insulin sensitivity (and NOT losing it).

As for foods- try any in your list, but in the end get a blood glucose meter- if you're BG reading is over 5.6 you CAN"T be in ketosis; if its under you COULD be in gluconeogenesis- metformin helps you through this stage in 24 hours, insulin added pushes you through in 6-8 hours..then you're in keto- but you can't get there if your proteins are higher than your fats.

Its all about the krebs cycle:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citric_acid_cycle

your body prefers:

glycolysis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycolysis

then, gluconeogenesis:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gluconeogenesis

finally into ketogenesis:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketogenesis

hope that adds some background, and shows you why fats are important...


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Alright mate here's a little info I haven't got time now but will pop back on later-

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/losing-weight/123981-fats-keto-diet.html

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/food-diet-nutrition-info/128819-ckd-cholestrol.html

And if you decide to use metformin-

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/supplementation-aas/124073-metformin.html

:thumbup1:


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Thanks ste and aus.

Read through the links, deffo a great help but seems a very complicated diet.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Ausbuilt.........

I will take the onions out the diet. What about the red peppers??

Also you said that protein needs to be lower than fat? The CKD link i found says to have 1g protein to every 1lb of lbm and the rest of the cals come from fat. So my protein is 155g, fat is 120g that comes to 2000 calories. That right?

Is creme fraiche, sour creme ok to use. They contain carbs?

Sorry for all the questions


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

If protein is higher than fat you won't get in to Keto though mate as the body will turn the protein in to glucose 'gluconeogenesis' for energy!


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

big ste said:


> If protein is higher than fat you won't get in to Keto though mate as the body will turn the protein in to glucose 'gluconeogenesis' for energy!


correct- although metformin does help push past this, it also doesn't fix a permanent bad choice of protein/fat ratio


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

In simple terms keep fats high- at lease 60% of the diet, moderate protein and trace carbs and you cant go wrong mate! :thumbup1:


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

So the link i used i incorrect then lol.

So i weigh 165lbs, 9%bf. How would i work out my protein/fat ratio. Should i still consume 2000 cal as thats 500 cal below maintaince?

Really want to try this diet lads. Seen blood glucose meters for ike £10 on ebay/amazon anygood..


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> Thanks ste and aus.
> 
> Read through the links, deffo a great help but seems a very complicated diet.no worse than carb cycling. Read the book link- it explains VERY well the uses and limitation of three main types of diet, including CKD..





s3_abv said:


> Ausbuilt.........
> 
> I will take the onions out the diet. What about the red peppers??check on-line. I generally dont, and stick to green fibrous carbs eg broccolli, cucumber, zucchini, lettuce, spinach etc carrots, corn and other "coloured" carbs tend to have more sugars in them as a rule of thumb- but check on an online diet website.
> 
> ...


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> In simple terms keep fats high- at lease 60% of the diet, moderate protein and trace carbs and you cant go wrong mate! :thumbup1:


Do you not need to be in a calorie deficit tho? eg....my maintiance is 2500cal, so 2000 to loose weight.


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> So the link i used i incorrect then lol like everything on the net, some links are better than others- the book download i posted is the bible...
> 
> So i weigh 165lbs, 9%bf. How would i work out my protein/fat ratio. Should i still consume 2000 cal as thats 500 cal below maintaince? you where close- there is no "perfect" formula. You set your protein at a level, and you need about 6% more fat, so drop a few grams of protein and replace with fats.. I recommend a few spoons of MCT Oil- converts to ketones the fastest of ANY oil, and the body can't store it as fat..
> 
> ...


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

s3_abv said:


> Do you not need to be in a calorie deficit tho? eg....my maintiance is 2500cal, so 2000 to loose weight.


Yes you still need to be below your maintenance Kcals mate!


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> Do you not need to be in a calorie deficit tho? eg....my maintiance is 2500cal, so 2000 to loose weight.


the magic of keto is, that when 1 of fat is converted to a ketone, 1.5cal is burned in the process, and the resulting ketone yields only 7.5cals... what this means is that if you need 900cals for energy (i.e 100g stored fat), your body needs to use 116.7g of fat to provide 900 cals as ketone energy... so even on maintenance cals, you lose weight slowly.... but, best to drop maintenance by 10% if natural, prob 20% if using AAS... and of course add cardio...

*download the book... have a break from posting here.. have a read... comeback in a couple of days.. all will be clearer*..


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Oops done my maths wrong lol.

650 cal from protein is 160g

1350 cal from fat is 150g fat. Not 120g lol.

So that gives me 24g protein each meal and 25g fat per meal. Should i lower my fat around/after my workouts or does it make no odds?

Right i can plan my meals out now! Any ideas ausbuilt, bet you have some lush meals lol.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

I downloaded the book lastnight from one of your links. Will have a good read through it later on, i just want to get the basics done now so i can buy my food before the shops shut lol.

Thanks again for the help mate, really appricate it!


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> Oops done my maths wrong lol.
> 
> 650 cal from protein is 160g
> 
> ...


 umm.. i have mayo with my veges.. you can deep fry, just dont use a batter with flour.. i just coat with eggs... sometimes this is how i do my vegies 

Other times i may have a beef tartare... add an egg and some olive oil... etc.. mmmm...

you can get creative- i just grab some meat often and salad/veg, and drink some MCT oil (its not bad!) out of a medicine measuring cup.. and get my fat out of the way, so don't have to worry so much about cooking it...

if i'm in a rush.. endless varieties of omlette are great..


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

ausbuilt said:


> umm.. i have mayo with my veges.. you can deep fry, just dont use a batter with flour.. i just coat with eggs... sometimes this is how i do my vegies
> 
> Other times i may have a beef tartare... add an egg and some olive oil... etc.. mmmm...
> 
> ...


Thanks mate.

I've just bought some mayo, ff double creme, ff whipping creme, full fat cheese spread, 2 blocks of chedder, 45 eggs and i got plenty of meats/fish at home ready.

For breakfast i had, 2 yolks, 4 whites, 25g slamon, 30g cheese all scrambled. Was well tasty and has kept hungar away nicley. Doing tuna/mayo/ melted cheese with salad now.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

How this diet look.......

breakfast

2 yolks, 4 whites, 25g slamon, 30g cheese all scrambled.

lunch

65g tuna, 15g mayo, 50g melted cheese with salad

Dinner

100g chicken, 100g broccli, 30g double cream, 30g cheese made into a cheese cream sauce.

pre-workout

30g whey, 20g flaxseed/coconut oil

pwo

100g chicken fried in 12g evoo, 100g broccoli, 50g soft cheese

Night snack

tin of sardines, 15g peanut butter or

30g whey, 50g double cream

I will be using beef/turkey mince aswell as chicken and all my meals consist of 25g fat, 25g protein.

Total of 150g pro, 150g fat, no more than 15g carbs, 2000cal.

Running out of ideas for foods/fat................


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Heres what fats I use on Keto mate-

Eggs 'whole'

Bacon

Butter

Olives

Olive oil 'shallow frying'

Extra virgin olive oil 'dressing'

Coconut oil

Coconut milk

Full fat whipped cream

Full fat mayo

Cheese 'any cheese apart from cottage cheese'

Sardines

Mackerel

Peanut butter

Brazil nuts

Macadamia nuts

Almonds

P.S The diet looks ok to me mate, but I would up the fat personally though just to make sure you get in to Ketosis!


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Here's another recent thread me and Ausbuilt posted on alot, might be worth a read mate-

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/food-diet-nutrition-info/134758-newbie-ckd-please-critique.html


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> Heres what fats I use on Keto mate-
> 
> Eggs 'whole'
> 
> ...


Thanks ste.

Will add another 100 cal of fat to it then mate, don't want to be too high on cals tho.

Is peanut butter a good choice for keto? I read that it can take people out of ketosis. Also does it concern you alot of taking whole eggs every day? I was thinking of adding some more whole eggs in but worried about high cholestrol.

Does it matter how much cheese i eat? will be eating about 100g a day!


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Peanut butter is a funny one, I'm alright on it myself if I don't go over 50g in one serving! But it does kick some people out of Ketosis though! That's where a blood glucose reader come in 'to see what works for you' As for cholestrol haven't you looked at the links I posted?! I think it's the second one! It about my blood test results while on Keto, check it out mate!


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> Here's another recent thread me and Ausbuilt posted on alot, might be worth a read mate-
> 
> http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/food-diet-nutrition-info/134758-newbie-ckd-please-critique.html


Cheers ste, good read that mate!

I understand now about the protein being low, i need to stop worrying about protein and concentrate on fats!

You seem very clued up on this and appricate the help from you and ausbuilt. ;0)

How long before you start to get bad breath? i swear my mouth tastes metalic and have smelly breath lol.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> Peanut butter is a funny one, I'm alright on it myself if I don't go over 50g in one serving! But it does kick some people out of Ketosis though! That's where a blood glucose reader come in 'to see what works for you' As for cholestrol haven't you looked at the links I posted?! I think it's the second one! It about my blood test results while on Keto, check it out mate!


Read it mate, thing is everybody is diffrent surely..............just wanted to make sure really. Will be eating more eggs yolks now!


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

s3_abv said:


> Read it mate, thing is everybody is diffrent surely..............just wanted to make sure really. Will be eating more eggs yolks now!


Yeah I know what you mean mate, I was worried at first about all the sat fats I was getting, then I started to worry about all the salt in the bacon and olives etc! But after getting those blood test results back I wasn't that bothered about any of it, but like you say everyone is different but it's not a long term thing mate so surely you can't do that much damage in afew month!


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Yeah suspose mate.

Omg just had a coffee with 50ml double cream, wow! Going to be eating alot of cream thats for sure.

So to get into ketosis faster, lower my protein slightly and raise fats slightly for a few days. Keep protein/fats about the same each meal gram/gram and only use foods with trace carbs. Simples....

I'm going to buy a glucose meter to monitor my foods for the first week or so too. Prob going to stay off PB untill i know i can use it!

That look right.


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

s3_abv said:


> Yeah suspose mate.
> 
> Omg just had a coffee with 50ml double cream, wow! Going to be eating alot of cream thats for sure.
> 
> ...


Yeah:thumbup1:

I would keep my fats slightly higher than protein through the whole diet myself though but defo don't go lower than 50/50 fats/protein!

Have you/are you considering metformin?! It's a great product mate and completely safe! It WILL get you in to Ketosis faster which mean more time burning fat in-between carb ups! Just a thought


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> Yeah:thumbup1:
> 
> I would keep my fats slightly higher than protein through the whole diet myself though but defo don't go lower than 50/50 fats/protein!
> 
> Have you/are you considering metformin?! It's a great product mate and completely safe! It WILL get you in to Ketosis faster which mean more time burning fat in-between carb ups! Just a thought


Will look into costs of that now mate!

Today i have eat 5 meals and i've felt really full all day, tbh i've really enjoyed eating cheese, cream and haven't had any craving for carbs. Just ate 4 eggs, 30ml cream, 30g cheese scrambled then a helping of salmon with 30g cream cheese.

Proberly exceeded my 150g fat but protein hasn't gone over 150g so it's all good for tonight. My comp won't upload calorie count so can't log my foods yet!


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

These are good to go mate!

http://www.unitedpharmacies.co.uk/product.php?productid=1287&cat=0&page=1


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Cheers mate.

Just read the thread on the metformin and couldn't quite understand when to take them. Is it best to take 1500mg during the carb up to get you into ketosis quicker? or do you just take them daily or when you have a high bg reading???

What sort of dosage would you take.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Another question lol.

I'm buying gona a Bayer Contour blood glucose monitor now with 25 strips, lancets. When they run out do i just buy the bayer contour strips?? i don't know what the lancets are or if the strips come with them lol


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

The way I did it was-

I would take x2 500mg tabs after my last carb meal on my carb up than another x1 500mg before bed and most of the time my BG was back under 5.6 the next morning! This should of pushed me straight through gluconeogenesis 'protein to glucose' in to ketogenesis 'fat to ketone bodies' Ketosis 

If I ever tried something new while on Keto and my BG went over 5.6 I would take x1 500mg tab! To get my BG back down, Although this didnt happen much :whistling:


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

s3_abv said:


> Another question lol.
> 
> I'm buying gona a Bayer Contour blood glucose monitor now with 25 strips, lancets. When they run out do i just buy the bayer contour strips?? i don't know what the lancets are or if the strips come with them lol


You'll have to buy the strips and lancers mate, the lancers are like tiny little pins in a cartage that go in to a pen which you use to pick your finger to make it bleed, then while the test strip is in the monitor/reader you touch the end of the test strip on to the blood Then after a second or two the monitor will beep and your reading with come up on the little screen!


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> The way I did it was-
> 
> I would take x2 500mg tabs after my last carb meal on my carb up than another x1 500mg before bed and most of the time my BG was back under 5.6 the next morning! This should of pushed me straight through gluconeogenesis 'protein to glucose' in to ketogenesis 'fat to ketone bodies' Ketosis
> 
> If I ever tried something new while on Keto and my BG went over 5.6 I would take x1 500mg tab! To get my BG back down, Although this didnt happen much :whistling:


Cheers mate thats made it clear. Will order those tomoz then to be safe and get me into keto after refeeds!

Been on here allday reading about ketosis lol. Should hopefully be in keto by tuesday!


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

big ste said:


> You'll have to buy the strips and lancers mate, the lancers are like tiny little pins in a cartage that go in to a pen which you use to pick your finger to make it bleed, then while the test strip is in the monitor/reader you touch the end of the test strip on to the blood Then after a second or two the monitor will beep and your reading with come up on the little screen!


Right so the lancers don't come with the strips then. I'm looking on ebay and they are cheaper on there but can't see the lancers lol


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

P.S

I've got the Accu-Chek monitor with the Accu-Chek multiclix lance pen though! Other models/brands might be different


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Here's what I've got-

http://www.accu-chek.co.uk/gb/products/metersystems/avivananobuyonlinetab.html


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Gone for the Bayer Contour mate. Hope my first reading is below 5.6! should have it tue/wed..............fingers crossed, all the help you've given me pays off lol


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## Don-karam (Mar 19, 2011)

One question mate, since your maintenance is 2500 calories and your deficit is 500, = 2000 calories daily, does that mean your not working out?


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> Cheers mate.
> 
> Just read the thread on the metformin and couldn't quite understand when to take them. Is it best to take 1500mg during the carb up to get you into ketosis quicker? or do you just take them daily or when you have a high bg reading???
> 
> What sort of dosage would you take.


Ok, depends on how long you carb-up for. If you're carbing up for 48 hours:

-assuming you start your refeed fri night, start with 500mg met after your last carb meal on sat night, then take 3 through the day (with meals) on Sunday, with the last one in the evening.

if carbing up for 24 hours:

-assuming you start carb up sat night, take 1x500 mg with the last carb meal of the day on sunday night, then 1x 500mg tab mon morning, and 1x 500mg tab Monday lunch.

during the week (keto)

-no need, you're not having carbs right? However, if you **** up, and your BG is over 5.6 after a meal, take 1x 500mg tab to drop you back down, and most likely stay in ketosis..

-there is no point in taking met with zero carb meals- being in a zero carb state makes you insulin sensitive anyway.



s3_abv said:


> Another question lol.
> 
> I'm buying gona a Bayer Contour blood glucose monitor now with 25 strips, lancets. When they run out do i just buy the bayer contour strips?? i don't know what the lancets are or if the strips come with them lol


you strips and lancets are both consumables- you will need to replenish both. The strips take a drop of your blood to use for blood glucose reading. The lancet is like pin in a cartridge thats put in a spring loaded pen device to quickly and easly pr**k your finger for the drop of blood. The BG meter comes with a manual that explains the process with pictures.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Don-karam said:


> One question mate, since your maintenance is 2500 calories and your deficit is 500, = 2000 calories daily, does that mean your not working out?


Yes mate i workout 4 times per week. Cardio 2-3 times per week. 500 deficit gives me few calories to go over if i slip up on a meal. Been on a 2000cal diet for 2 week now and feel fine.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

ausbuilt said:


> Ok, depends on how long you carb-up for. If you're carbing up for 48 hours:
> 
> -assuming you start your refeed fri night, start with 500mg met after your last carb meal on sat night, then take 3 through the day (with meals) on Sunday, with the last one in the evening.
> 
> ...


Sorted mate cheers!

The bayer contour i have bought comes with 25 strips and 25 lancets so should be good for a week. I'm going to be eating the same sort of food so hopeing i can stay in ketosis with the food i'm already using. If so will stick to the same'ish meals.

Is 6-7 week enough on this diet? I go egypt on the 30th june and don't think i could stick to the diet on hol lol. Could i take some metformin on hol and use throughout the 14 days to stay lean??

Ideas..............


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

I was advised to do at least 3 months to get the best out the diet but i can't see why though and can't remember where I read/was told now :confused1:

Firstly- Metformin is a POM 'prescription only medication' so you would probably need a letter off a doctor for it... My mums diabetic and she always gets a letter of her doctor for her Meds when going away eg- Metformin, insulin etc! I'm not sure if this is 100% necessary though!

Secondly- Metformin doesn't work like that mate, if you eat carb rich high Kcals food over your maintenance Kcals everyday while taking Metformin all the Metformin will do is store the excess Kcals as body fat as normal but at a faster rate!

Well at least that's my understanding of Metformin anyway, I could be wrong though:whistling:


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> The bayer contour i have bought comes with 25 strips and 25 lancets so should be good for a week. I'm going to be eating the same sort of food so hopeing i can stay in ketosis with the food i'm already using. If so will stick to the same'ish meals. yes, no need to measure when you've got a "proven" meal combo.
> 
> Is 6-7 week enough on this diet?depends how fat you are and how lean you want to be... so if you're at 10% it might get you to 8% and you'd look good. I go egypt on the 30th june and don't think i could stick to the diet on hol lol yeah just enjoy the hols, and get back to diet afterwards... Could i take some metformin on hol and use throughout the 14 days to stay lean?? helps to cover an "occasional" **** up when in keto.. but it doesn't cover 14 days :tongue:
> 
> Ideas..............


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

big ste said:


> I was advised to do at least 3 months to get the best out the diet but i can't see why though and can't remember where I read/was told now :confused1: 9-12 weeks (also in the bodyopus book link- up to 16 weeks.. depends on your initial condition
> 
> Firstly- Metformin is a POM 'prescription only medication' so you would probably need a letter off a doctor for it... My mums diabetic and she always gets a letter of her doctor for her Meds when going away eg- Metformin, insulin etc! I'm not sure if this is 100% necessary though! true of some POMS but most countries are fine with Met, as its a diabetic drug. Besides AAS are OTC in egypt, so no need to worry about going there!
> 
> ...


kind of true..metformin is works in quite a number of ways, not all of which are 100%^ known; but it does make your body more INSULIN SENSITIVE, so that when you eat a lot of carbs, you DON'T overproduce insulin, so you store less of the carbs as fat.. its marginal, but in long term use (years) 1500mg met/day is the same as having a 30% calorie deficiency according to the life extensionist forums.. but thats LONG TERM therapy..


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Cheers aus..........

I'm below 10% for sure, just got a littl fat on my lower abbs. I seem to hold fat well there lol. Does keto make you hold water due to high salt intake ect?

I've also left my whey shakes and peanut out my diet untill my bg monitor comes. Hopeing to be in keto today as i started sunday morning, been eating lots of cheese, cream, cream cheese, mayo, brie, chorizo, olive, flaxseed, pork scratchings, 100% coconut oil for fats and meat like mince/chicken/tuna/salmon...........


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> Cheers aus..........
> 
> I'm below 10% for sure, just got a littl fat on my lower abbs. I seem to hold fat well there lol. Does keto make you hold water due to high salt intake ect?
> 
> I've also left my whey shakes and peanut out my diet untill my bg monitor comes. Hopeing to be in keto today as i started sunday morning, been eating lots of cheese, cream, cream cheese, mayo, brie, chorizo, olive, flaxseed, pork scratchings, 100% coconut oil for fats and meat like mince/chicken/tuna/salmon...........


keto holds no water at all- in fact drops loads of water; if you bloat up during the re-feed, you've over carbed, and the water is not in the muscle cells, but subcutaneous .. if the carb up is done right- you're full and TIGHT..

I don't eat much processed meat on keto, so I don't get a high salt intake, but regardless, ketosis holds no water..


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

ausbuilt said:


> keto holds no water at all- in fact drops loads of water; if you bloat up during the re-feed, you've over carbed, and the water is not in the muscle cells, but subcutaneous .. if the carb up is done right- you're full and TIGHT..
> 
> I don't eat much processed meat on keto, so I don't get a high salt intake, but regardless, ketosis holds no water..


Cool, should get a nice dry lean look then.

I'm running out ideas for food lol. Cheese and lots of it! with cream, mayo ect.. haha.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

jim. said:


> Instead of starting a new thread do you guys think this sounds right? What I've had today.
> 
> 3 eggs, 3 bacon & 30g cheddar cooked in rapseed oil 5ml
> 
> ...


I know.................lets just hijack someones thread with my diet ffs!!


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## jim. (Jun 8, 2009)

Eh? You were after some ideas thought might help to bounce some around see what others think. I'll delete it if you want.


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

How vital is it to stay on my 2000cal per day?

I'm aiming for 25g protein and 25g fat per meal, 6 meals per day. So thats 600 cal from protein and 1350 cal from fat but obvioulsy it's not always going to be exact with measuring ect....so i could be a few hundred cals over mabye.

Is that going to make minimal diffrence? just want to make sure i do it right and want the best out of the diet thats all lol.

Also i'm having about 100ml double cream a day, that shouldn't throw me out of keto will it. It has about 2.6g of carbs per 100ml...........


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

jim. said:


> Eh? You were after some ideas thought might help to bounce some around see what others think. I'll delete it if you want.


Lol.

Well you started the post with (Instead of starting a new thread do you guys think this sounds right?) so that would suggest you were checking your diet out, and not posting ideas.


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## Vinney (Apr 27, 2011)

can you still grow on a diet this this ....appears great for cutting BF ... but will your muscles actually get bigger ???


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Vinney said:


> can you still grow on a diet this this ....appears great for cutting BF ... but will your muscles actually get bigger ???


No because it's purely for burning fat.


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

s3_abv said:


> How vital is it to stay on my 2000cal per day? not absolutely vital everyday- the keto process itself gives a 20% energy deficit (1g of fat, makes 1g of ketone, but a ktone only provides 7.5 cals, and the fat was 9 cals- you lose 1.5 cals in the conversion alone.. and a ketone can't convert back- what you don't use- you urinate out- which is what registers on keto stix.
> 
> I'm aiming for 25g protein and 25g fat per meal, 6 meals per day. So thats 600 cal from protein and 1350 cal from fat but obvioulsy it's not always going to be exact with measuring ect....so i could be a few hundred cals over mabye.
> 
> ...





Vinney said:


> can you still grow on a diet this this ....appears great for cutting BF ... but will your muscles actually get bigger ???


you can, if you set you cals about 20% above mainteance (see above reason) and use the 48 hour carb-up on the weekend and:

-eat carbs every 2 hours (see the book links i've posted)

-add 2g of creatine to each carb meal

-add 10mg d-bol to each meal as well

the above gives you amazing "rebound" and fullness..

you will put muscle on, and not much fat at all... but frankly, i'd rather just bulk up normally and leave keto to dieting... i crave normal food! LOL


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Great post ausbuilt.

Nice to know that i do have an 20% deficit if i stick to cals! Wouldn't mind trying the d-bol and creatine combo on my next keto cycle!!

Reps


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## Vinney (Apr 27, 2011)

am giving this a shot from monday..... i'll post my log 

how you getting on ?


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Vinney said:


> am giving this a shot from monday..... i'll post my log
> 
> how you getting on ?


Going good mate thanks. My log is on the loosing weight section (guess my bf% thread with pic's)

Really feel at home on it, no cravings, enjoy the food, strength has gone up. Gone from 6 reps on 40's on incline chest to 4 reps on 45's incline dumbells. Really please with my progress too, gave up the second day of my carb up today to do keto as i prefer eating fats instead of carbs lol.

Now thats commitment haha.


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## SoulXedge (Mar 15, 2010)

the mrs just got me 5kg of minced beef problem is per 100g

cal - 190

pro- 31.1

carb-0.3

fat - 7.2

what can i add apart from EVOO to boost my fats up!!!


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

make them into burgers by adding 1 egg yolk/mustard/tsp evoo/pepper. Serve with melted cheese/mayo and lettuce/celery.

Or just add some oil to your mince!!


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## SoulXedge (Mar 15, 2010)

just sticking with 60g cheese 50g mince teaspoon EVOO for my meals, might chance it up a bit and have the 100g mince and 2 table spoon EVOO

just need stuff quick and simple for the next few days with the mince as i am working!

cheers for the imput S3_abv


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## s3_abv (Feb 10, 2010)

Not really into mince on keto mate.

I prefer things like, tuna/cheese/mayo, egg/mayo, chicken/bacon/mayo, chicken/cheese/evoo, salmon/egg, prawn/egg/mayo with salad or broccli for simple meals for work.


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