# Progressive overload - the key to muscle growth



## zoco (Nov 23, 2010)

This is maybe the most important aspect of the training.Drop the "pumping" and "burn" sets.

Progressive overload - the key to muscle growth


----------



## s&amp;ccoach (May 18, 2011)

zoco said:


> This is maybe the most important aspect of the training.Drop the "pumping" and "burn" sets.
> 
> Progressive overload - the key to muscle growth


Yes mate been using this for last month or so, and very impressed with the results. Got some advice from Incredible bulk on here and it seems to work.

My first exercise is normally compound or big exercise, and consists of 4 sets of 6 reps, then I do 2 other exercises but reps go up to 10 reps for 4 sets.

On the reps, try and squeeze out the exact amount so weights can go down through sets to get the reps in. But if a set is easy the weight will go up and more importantly increase the starting weight the following week.


----------



## Kev1980 (Jan 18, 2011)

I am going to give it a try... would you do this on all lifting exercises in your routine?


----------



## big steve (May 8, 2011)

makes sense really doesnt it


----------



## zoco (Nov 23, 2010)

Yes,except on arm exercises.I am just not a big fan of arm workouts, plus they get trained with the pushing and pulling movements


----------



## monkeybiker (Jul 21, 2010)

I thought it was common sense. Bigger muscle lift bigger weights. If you keep lifting the same weights then your body can already do that so has no reason to adapt.


----------



## ashie1986 (Feb 14, 2010)

this is how i train because its how i thought you should,

training with loads of reps per set isnt for a bodybuilder is it?

would be stupid staying on the same weight too


----------



## Guest (Jul 7, 2011)

This form of training is all ive ever done, i like to see the weight going up.


----------



## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

so the whole case of hypertrophy resulting from higher reps is wrong....ive always training up2 last onth with heaviest weight up2 3-6 reps, but changed to add in 8-15 reps on light days...would i better changing back


----------



## ashie1986 (Feb 14, 2010)

i always finish heavy as i can , been tought to train to failure on last 2 sets, or last set for some exercises, even if i can only push 4-6 reps out, and when i can manage 8 reps i up the weight again next time,

im not expert tho, just what i was tought when i fist joined and makes sense to me


----------



## SK-XO (Aug 6, 2009)

I've always done this. But for example I find this work well. This works an absolute treat for me, i'll do an example... inc db bench

set 1: weight I can do roughly 8-10 reps on

Set 2: weight I can roughly do 6-8 reps on

Set 3: Weight I can do roughly 3-5 reps on

Set 4: Roughly half of the heaviest set weight, performing a good 12 reps but slower and tighter contractions.

Each week I'll obviously work on increasing the weight. But find maximum work load stress with lighter workload stress works v well. This is what has brought my chest on leaps and bounds. And I do no more then say 10/12 sets for chest. It's all about mind muscle connection and imo if you work both aspects of muscle fibers fast/slow twitch and get that connection you'll grow.

Also I go to failure on more or less every set... thats how I get the growth in, and when doing 10 sets for chest it's fkn hard going, thats why I feel I need to do no more then 10/12 sets for chest as im absolutely burst after. Alough If one was doing 20-30 sets for chest I wouldn't recommend failure for every set, lot of strain on cns.


----------



## yannyboy (Jun 20, 2009)

Yes, but eventually strength will slow down to a point to where gains will be miniscule. I always train as heavy as possible and to failure but about 4 months ago strength and size slowed dramatically. I went from 500mg of test a week to 1g and guess what, size and strength went through the roof.

The point I am making is no matter how hard and heavy you train, eventually without increasing dosages you will plateau.


----------



## SK-XO (Aug 6, 2009)

yannyboy said:


> Yes, but eventually strength will slow down to a point to where gains will be miniscule. I always train as heavy as possible and to failure but about 4 months ago strength and size slowed dramatically. I went from 500mg of test a week to 1g and guess what, size and strength went through the roof.
> 
> The point I am making is no matter how hard and heavy you train, eventually without increasing dosages you will plateau.


Theres always ways to get round plateau's without "increasing dosages".


----------



## yannyboy (Jun 20, 2009)

Strength gains do not always mean size gains. Your tendons and joints will get stronger as well.

If somebody weighed 200lbs and benches say 300lb, if they put on another 10lbs of just fat, chances are they would be stronger, just through thicker joints etc.


----------



## Guest (Jul 7, 2011)

yannyboy said:


> Yes, but eventually strength will slow down to a point to where gains will be miniscule. I always train as heavy as possible and to failure but about 4 months ago strength and size slowed dramatically. I went from 500mg of test a week to 1g and guess what, size and strength went through the roof.
> 
> The point I am making is no matter how hard and heavy you train, eventually without increasing dosages you will plateau.


completely agree, at some point you will hit a Plateau and an increase in dosages and/or cals will be needed to get the body out of homeostasis. even a week or 2 off to let the cns recover will be beneficial


----------



## SK-XO (Aug 6, 2009)

yannyboy said:


> Strength gains do not always mean size gains. Your tendons and joints will get stronger as well.
> 
> If somebody weighed 200lbs and benches say 300lb, if they put on another 10lbs of just fat, chances are they would be stronger, just through thicker joints etc.


Yeah this is true, when I was a little bit "chubbyer" :lol: ! I was considerably stronger, but now that im a lot leaner I push a bit less weight. fat/water cushions the joints so more can be lifted imo and less chance of injury.


----------



## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

ive been training for just over a year, read every journal/thread/attachment i can find bb'ing, and have came up with the following conclusion

BodyBuilding is a mindfcuk


----------



## SK-XO (Aug 6, 2009)

barsnack said:


> ive been training for just over a year, read every journal/thread/attachment i can find bb'ing, and have came up with the following conclusion
> 
> BodyBuilding is a mindfcuk


To an extent.. you just have to decipher the bull****. And theres a lotaaaaa bull**** out there.


----------



## Rekless (May 5, 2009)

I always pyramid down, After a warm up, heaviest first then less heavy etc.

Why waste all your energy on lighter weights?


----------



## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Simple progressive overload is great and important, but without any variation it always ends in a plateau or at the very best a massive slowdown in growth and adaptation.

As a newb to training, the normal situation is that your total capacity for strength is limited by your neural efficiency - at this stage your muscles may be able to say use 100lbs for ten reps in a particular exercise but you probably only have the neural efficiency to be able to get the muscle to lift 60lbs for ten reps.

As you train however, your neural efficiency improves along with your muscles growing in response to the new stimulus (the new exercise), and for a while, as a newb, you get that wonderful phase of fast progression where both strength and size shoot up quickly. During this phase you also adapt the type x muscle fibres, the ones which are neither fast nor slow twitch but mimic the type of muscle fibre you do most activity for, and they develop fast from being small and thin to bigger and stronger. Standard progressive overload worls very well through this phase of training, possibly better than anything else.

then, once the type x fibres are all adapted and once your neural connections are efficient rather than inefficient, you enter the next phase of development - the rate of growth and adaptation slows down, but it still continues fairly consistently. No probs with mostly entirely relying on progressive overload here, although the rate of gain is nothing like as fast as in the early stages of training.

After a while though, muscle size and capability to generate force actually starts to exceed what your CNS/ neural network can generate, and it becomes almost impossible to be progressive anymore as your CNS becomes limiting... in other words, boom, you've hit a plateau, and training the same way won't fix it. Using 'shock' tactics like adding some negatives, forced reps, pump sets etc will help for a while, but this is self limiting and also increases likelyhood of burnout and overtraining.

The solution then has to be to change things, and ideally to periodise training. Be aware that the progressive 'overload' principal can be applied to things other than just loading - keeping weight used on an exercise the same you can be progressive by:

adding reps each session to each set

keeping reps per set the same but add extra sets

keeping reps and sets the same but decrease rest time between sets

increasing explosiveness/speed of the rep and doing more reps in the same period of time

Each one of these methods, if new to you and at the right intensity level will also result in adaptation and size gain, and you can and I think should incorperate one or more of them once you are past the first 6-12 moths of training. The best way to use these various forms of progression is to periodise them... I'd strongly suggest people research periodisation for training (conjugate periodisation, undulating periodisation and linear periodisation), as long term I'm convinced periodising leads to better growth for longer than just continually sticking with simple progressive overload.


----------



## monkeybiker (Jul 21, 2010)

barsnack said:


> ive been training for just over a year, read every journal/thread/attachment i can find bb'ing, and have came up with the following conclusion
> 
> BodyBuilding is a mindfcuk


It's actually quite simple but people try to make it seem complicated. The fitness industry use this to sell you stuff trying to blind you with science. It's kind of like the banking industry which could be simple but is purposely made complicated so they can screw you over with fees for the ''expert'' services. Cos there're all a bunch of cvnts:cursing:


----------



## monkeybiker (Jul 21, 2010)

Dtlv74 said:


> The solution then has to be to change things, and ideally to periodise training. Be aware that the progressive 'overload' principal can be applied to things other than just loading - keeping weight used on an exercise the same you can be progressive by:
> 
> adding reps each session to each set
> 
> ...


I always thought progressive overload included the methods you described. What it comes down to is you have to push yourself to do more than you have done in the past.


----------



## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

monkeybiker said:


> It's actually quite simple but people try to make it seem complicated. The fitness industry use this to sell you stuff trying to blind you with science. It's kind of like the banking industry which could be simple but is purposely made complicated so they can screw you over with fees for the ''expert'' services. Cos there're all a bunch of cvnts:cursing:


maybe it is simple but with all the conflicting methods people use to train and how people getting great results from just confuses me, thats why ive added in heavy and light sessions during week to see how that goes


----------

