# Training and getting weaker?



## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Really brief or as short as I can make it:

Been training 9 months now and for the first 6 everything was going faster/better than expected, getting bigger/stronger went from 12 stone to 13 stone 10lbs, steady increase in what I could lift then it all stopped and I'm fighting to maintain anything I had in the way of gains. It's really depressing now, my bench went from 50kg on the bar to struggling 10 reps of 40kg, I'm kidding myself techniques better, lifting a little more precise but it's crap, I'm getting weaker.

Diet isn't brilliant but it's not that bad either, I'm aware and watch what I eat but sausage egg and chips a couple of times a week is the norm, saying that, grilled sausages, eggs done with no fat and oven chips and only a handful. I get my 200g plus of protein a day easily but if I was supposed to be eating 3000 cals a day I'm nearer 2000 cals, I also eat lots of fruit and nuts and them new quark yogurt things. I'm trying but I'm not massive like you guys.

I was training full body routine 3 nights a week but switched to PPL 4 nights a week to try and kick start things again, this was a couple of months ago but hasn't changed anything, I'm still treading water or slowing drowning depending on how you look at it. Training takes about an hour and I leave the gym knackered, I fight for every last rep working through the burn into failure before quitting, I'm not lazy but finding myself yawning all the way through??

So training hard

Diet not to bad and seems to have been ok for first six months.

Always tired.

Getting weaker and I swear fatter, do they call them love handles the fat that sticks out over the back of your hips [by the way I'm a guy]

Next birthday I'm 57, don't know whether that makes a difference, I don't smoke or drink.

Thanks for reading

Ssor.


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## Sasnak (Oct 11, 2016)

Rest is important. You need to eat in surplus to grow, a bit of fat gain is inevitable.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Are you losing weight? Are you now regularly eating less calories than when you were progressing well? When did you last have a week off?


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Sasnak said:


> Rest is important. You need to eat in surplus to grow, a bit of fat gain is inevitable.


 I train Monday Tuesday Thursday Friday so rest from training three days a week.

I have started to get a bit of fat on my back/hips so was assuming I might be eating surplus already, Also abs are getting harder to see.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Ultrasonic said:


> Are you losing weight? Are you know regularly eating less calories than when you were progressing well? When did you last have a week off?


 Been on 13 stone 10 for a couple of months now, not gone up or down.

My diet hasn't changed since I started training 9 months ago, I don't have a massive variety in my diet so it's probably been constant and similar right the way through. I don't get to eat right while at work so smuggle in a couple of protein bars for mid morning/afternoon snacks and I eat a pretty healthy lunch.

I do try and read up on things myself before asking and no I don't have six or seven meals a day, I think that would make me want to sleep all the time I wasn't eating :lol:

Everything's not perfect I get that, but things were working. This brick wall I've hit is depressing, I'm putting all the work in, I'm sitting here typing this with my back and shoulders aching from yesterday and yet gains are going south?

I'm 6'3" and look in better shape than the guys half my age I work with, I started getting a bit fatter so "in surplus" I thought but getting weaker and it's making no sense and why am I yawning all the time? I'm in bed most nights by 9pm!

Never missed any training so never had a week off.

Ssor


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

1691ssor said:


> Been on 13 stone 10 for a couple of months now, not gone up or down.
> 
> My diet hasn't changed since I started training 9 months ago, I don't have a massive variety in my diet so it's probably been constant and similar right the way through. I don't get to eat right while at work so smuggle in a couple of protein bars for mid morning/afternoon snacks and I eat a pretty healthy lunch.
> 
> ...


 My advice we would be to have a couple of weeks off. Then go back to your original training programme (3 nights not 4 etc) and see how you get on.

My questions were looking for changes rather than supposed perfection BTW.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Ultrasonic said:


> My advice we would be to have a couple of weeks off. Then go back to your original training programme (3 nights not 4 etc) and see how you get on.
> 
> My questions were looking for changes rather than supposed perfection BTW.


 Cheers mate


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## rsd147 (Nov 14, 2012)

I also think a lot of this is maybe down to your diet. You mentioned you 'assumed' you were in a surplus but you do not know for certain and the fact you have added in an extra day of activity means you may not be in a surplus.

I would recommend taking a week off to have a slight deload and then work back up through the weights on your original routine as it seemed to work for you and also assume you enjoyed.

Diet wise I would start tracking what you are eating and weighing yourself to see if you are slightly gaining etc. From there you should start seeing progress.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

rsd147 said:


> I also think a lot of this is maybe down to your diet. You mentioned you 'assumed' you were in a surplus but you do not know for certain and the fact you have added in an extra day of activity means you may not be in a surplus.
> 
> I would recommend taking a week off to have a slight deload and then work back up through the weights on your original routine as it seemed to work for you and also assume you enjoyed.
> 
> Diet wise I would start tracking what you are eating and weighing yourself to see if you are slightly gaining etc. From there you should start seeing progress.


 I once read on one of the forums that looking in the mirror was an important part of getting the diet right and definitely a bit chubbier than I was, kinda where my assumption came from.

I am well up on the protein count as I make sure of that, meal wise it depends what the Mrs is cooking for everyone else really, I do complain if there's not enough protein on the plate 

I started putting 3g of Creatine in my morning and evening shake, wasn't sure if that was causing some water retention and maybe the fat round my lower back, not sure, again just guessing. I've been very reluctant to miss any training days as the way it's been going lately if I miss one or two days it could be the slippery slope to quitting altogether, it's been hard work lately for what's seeming to be nothing especially reading about everyone's PB's and my training going in the wrong direction!

As for going back to full body workout's 3 times a week, I changed to PPL because that's when the gains stopped, hitting everybody part in an hour or so I was having trouble having enough energy for the whole routine, full body was great when I started and the weights were lighter so easier but increasing the load more my energy levels weren't lasting so exercises towards the end didn't get 100%. I did switch to a PPL as this was advised for the reasons above on another forum, you know, when something stops working try something new and it was the full body that had stopped for me.

It may well be I'm to fricken old and this is it, where's my :smoke: and slippers.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

1691ssor said:


> I once read on one of the forums that looking in the mirror was an important part of getting the diet right and definitely a bit chubbier than I was, kinda where my assumption came from.
> 
> I am well up on the protein count as I make sure of that, meal wise it depends what the Mrs is cooking for everyone else really, I do complain if there's not enough protein on the plate
> 
> ...


 Creatine causes more water to be stored inside muscle cells but nowhere else.

Everybody needs to take periodic breaks from training.

This may not be what has happened to you but it is possible but unusual to get into a situation where you haven't fully recovered from a previous workout the next time you train, and if you keep on doing this over time you will end up getting weaker. This possibility will become more likely as you get older and recovery capabilities aren't as good I think.

This is why I'd suggest at least two weeks off.

If you don't want to go back to whole body training then maybe try PPL training 3 days per week not 4.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Ultrasonic said:


> Creatine causes more water to be stored inside muscle cells but nowhere else.
> 
> Everybody needs to take periodic breaks from training.
> 
> ...


 Thanks mate, advice taken on board

I constantly hit muscles that are still aching from previous session. I read that you should try and hit every muscle group at least twice a week and have just got used to muscles aching/hurting all the time now, assumed it was all part of the game.

Perhaps I'll try PPL Mon/Wed/Fri and see if it makes any difference.

Cheers

Ssor


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

1691ssor said:


> Thanks mate, advice taken on board
> 
> I constantly hit muscles that are still aching from previous session. I read that you should try and hit every muscle group at least twice a week and have just got used to muscles aching/hurting all the time now, assumed it was all part of the game.
> 
> ...


 I train different muscles 2 or 3 times per week but they are not sore the next time I train them. Getting a training programme right is a balance between doing enough work to stimulate growth but not so much you aren't able to have recovered and hopefully grown by the next workout.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

I'll just add that studies generally report averages. For training frequency you're right there is some evidence that training a muscle twice per week is likely to be better than once for most, but not necessarily everyone. Also the data that this view is based on will be overwhelmingly for people younger than you, if not entirely.

You need to find what works best for you.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

:thumbup1:


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## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

1691ssor said:


> Really brief or as short as I can make it:
> 
> Been training 9 months now and for the first 6 everything was going faster/better than expected, getting bigger/stronger went from 12 stone to 13 stone 10lbs, steady increase in what I could lift then it all stopped and I'm fighting to maintain anything I had in the way of gains. It's really depressing now, my bench went from 50kg on the bar to struggling 10 reps of 40kg, I'm kidding myself techniques better, lifting a little more precise but it's crap, I'm getting weaker.
> 
> ...


 We all get that feeling every once in a while honey , like we're not advancing.

Especially after the first months when improvement is so easily visible

has anything else change in your daily routine ?

Maybe also get some exams done ?

x


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Thanks Anna, run out of likes but :thumbup1:


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## anna1 (Mar 22, 2014)

1691ssor said:


> Thanks Anna, run out of likes but :thumbup1:


 Yeah , me too . But I like you back


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

anna1 said:


> Yeah , me too . But I like you back


 :lol:


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

There are several things that could be an issue here, and it's not easy to identify them through chatting on a forum.

First question, what does a typical workout look like for you? Post up an example, and explain how you would aim to progress from it in the next session, and that might reveal something obvious.

Also give us a sample of an honest days eating so we can look at that.

Other variables - do you work a physical job, have a mentally or emotionally stressful job or home life? Do you do shift work or have an irregular sleeping pattern? All of that can have a significant effect.

Finally, have you had your health checked? Any high blood pressure, any meds you take regularly for anything, and also have you had your testosterone levels checked and have you been checked for type 2 diabetes? Normally people are too quick to blame low testosterone levels when they feel a bit crappy, but once in your fifties it is something worth looking at if there's a significant and sustained performance drop off.


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## Jack of blades (Apr 2, 2017)

1691ssor said:


> Really brief or as short as I can make it:
> 
> Been training 9 months now and for the first 6 everything was going faster/better than expected, getting bigger/stronger went from 12 stone to 13 stone 10lbs, steady increase in what I could lift then it all stopped and I'm fighting to maintain anything I had in the way of gains. It's really depressing now, my bench went from 50kg on the bar to struggling 10 reps of 40kg, I'm kidding myself techniques better, lifting a little more precise but it's crap, I'm getting weaker.
> 
> ...


 Well if your doing 40kg bench for 10reps and not progressing past that then you are definitely doing something wrong as that should be easy to progress. I can guarantee you it's because your not eating enough you say your having 2000 calories a day at 13stone 10 I'm surprised you haven't gone back to 12stone. Eat 3000 calories at least. What do you mean by your now lifting with precision what we're you doing before hand?


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

dtlv said:


> There are several things that could be an issue here, and it's not easy to identify them through chatting on a forum.
> 
> First question, what does a typical workout look like for you? Post up an example, and explain how you would aim to progress from it in the next session, and that might reveal something obvious.
> 
> ...


 Hi and thanks for taking the time out to read and respond, appreciated.

Here is the PPL I am currently using, it is one I copied from a member on here and I liked it as I was hitting different parts different nights so seemed like muscle groups were getting a longer rest before hitting them again.










An honest day's eating consists of;

Up 5.30am breakfast eaten by 6.15am.

Breakfast

Cup of tea, semi skimmed milk no sugar, bowl of high protein cereal - semi skimmed milk, protein shake + 3g Creatine -350ml semi skimmed milk, 1000mg cod liver oil capsul

At work: sneaky protein bar around 10.30am

Lunchtime 12.30pm 'ish' 500ml flask of coffee - semi skimmed milk, Quark 20g protein yogurt thing, two medium banana's, apple, protein bar if still hungry

Sneaky 2.30pm protein bar if I didn't eat it lunch time.

Teatime;

Maybe cake and coffee when I first get in

Tea could consist of: 5 whole egg omelette and tin of beans. or could be a fresh breaded chicken breast and some oven chips.

7-7.30 pm train for an hour

9.00pm protein shake with 3g Creatine, 350ml of semi skimmed milk. 1000mg cod liver oil capsule, vitamin d tablet, some alpha male vitamin thing that came with a bulk purchase.

Bed.

Job is physical and mentally challenging, run a furniture department in a large centre and pretty much on the go from 7.30 or earlier till 5.00pm. on my feet all day rushing from one area to another, some of the girls who don't seem to move that much claim they're doing 8 + miles a day [watch thingy], I'd be doing at least that. When I started 3 years ago I was around 15 1/2 stone, lost that much weight in the first 1 1/2 years doctors thought I had a life threatening illness, I'd dropped to 12 stone without dieting, god did the quacks put me through some tests. I decided stuff it, if I was going to go I'd go out with a bang, bought gym equipment, started training and managed to get up to 13 stone 10lbs.

It's really the tiredness that worried me and I do get fed up feeling tired, funny not at work as that's a buzz if busy [drag if not]. My wife tried to book me into the doctors two weeks ago but totally booked and told to ring back mid June!

This I should imagine will read like a lack of food [I'm guessing as seen what you bigger guys eat], I eat a lot especially on my two days off, picking all the time. I am a normal size guy with now what looks like a bit of muscle, my diets worked for me for the first 6 months and I put on weight in that time, diets not changed but gains have most definitely stopped.

No high blood pressure, no medication, normally pretty healthy so not at doc's much, will look into getting checked out for whatever he's prepared to do.

Thanks again

Ssor


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Jack of blades said:


> Well if your doing 40kg bench for 10reps and not progressing past that then you are definitely doing something wrong as that should be easy to progress. I can guarantee you it's because your not eating enough you say your having 2000 calories a day at 13stone 10 I'm surprised you haven't gone back to 12stone. Eat 3000 calories at least. What do you mean by your now lifting with precision what we're you doing before hand?


 I am going to have to count calories or whatever you call it as my wife say's I don't eat anywhere near 3000 cal's so saying nearer 2000 is a guess. I was in McDonalds Wednesday and ate 2000 cals in one hit, bought a lot of chicken thinking it was going to be healthy but guessing fried, tasted fatty anyway.

Training is depressing, when I switched from a machine to free weights I could struggle 50kg on an Olympic bar for 10 reps, I'd be lucky if I could get 4 now. When I said precise I tried to kid myself I was doing them better hence the drop in weight, I can now do a massive 40kg for 3 sets of 10 almost in slow motion down to my chest and back up but the last couple of reps I'm struggling like a good'un. I read of everyone chasing the 100kg for 10 and I can't get past 40? fricken depressing. Bit that's really weird is I'm 6'3 nearly 14 stone, have a pretty large looking chest and front delts and lift like my mother, don't make sense.

Just got on scales now [8.25pm] 14 stone dead.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Start tracking your diet in Myfitnesspal to get a better idea of what you truly eat. If what you posted above is truly representative it does look like you're probably not eating enough.

I'd dtill take a couple of weeks off training.

This is a minor thing but you don't want to take Vitamin D3 before bed as it reduces melatonin and so can adversely affect sleep. With breakfast is best unless this is a low fat meal for you.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Ultrasonic said:


> Start tracking your diet in Myfitnesspal to get a better idea of what you truly eat. If what you posted above is truly representative it does look like you're probably not eating enough.
> 
> I'd dtill take a couple of weeks off training.
> 
> This is a minor thing but you don't want to take Vitamin D3 before bed as it reduces melatonin and so can adversely affect sleep. With breakfast is best unless this is a low fat meal for you.


 Will try to track diet, I've always put it off because starting at 56 I never really expected to get to a stage where it was that important as long as I wasn't eating crap and was meeting my protein targets. Or just plain lazy or to knackered take ya pick, will try and have tried but never quite got my head round it :whistling:

I last trained Tuesday, Wednesday was rest, I did nothing last night or tonight and will start PPL Monday only doing three nights a week. So still got weekend off to recoup, funny feel lazy/guilty already and only missed a couple of nights mind you backs no longer aching, I can move my arms and shoulders around and nothing :thumbup1:

Didn't know about the Vitamin D at night, my sleeps been crap for ages, I'll take that one with my morning drink.

Cheers


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

1691ssor said:


> Will try to track diet, I've always put it off because starting at 56 I never really expected to get to a stage where it was that important as long as I wasn't eating crap and was meeting my protein targets. Or just plain lazy or to knackered take ya pick, will try and have tried but never quite got my head round it :whistling:
> 
> I last trained Tuesday, Wednesday was rest, I did nothing last night or tonight and will start PPL Monday only doing three nights a week. So still got weekend off to recoup, funny feel lazy/guilty already and only missed a couple of nights mind you backs no longer aching, I can move my arms and shoulders around and nothing :thumbup1:
> 
> ...


 I would encourage you to take a couple of weeks off rather than a few days.


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## Viv (Jun 1, 2018)

1691ssor said:


> Really brief or as short as I can make it:
> 
> Been training 9 months now and for the first 6 everything was going faster/better than expected, getting bigger/stronger went from 12 stone to 13 stone 10lbs, steady increase in what I could lift then it all stopped and I'm fighting to maintain anything I had in the way of gains. It's really depressing now, my bench went from 50kg on the bar to struggling 10 reps of 40kg, I'm kidding myself techniques better, lifting a little more precise but it's crap, I'm getting weaker.
> 
> ...


 Do you want to loose weight and keep muscle? Look athletic and feel fit or a bit of both?

do ab work everyday for 10 mins no more then run .5 mile quick as you can then walk back. Intermittent fast from 12 midday to 8 pm. Include 2-4 eggs, chicken or fish and 100% whey shake with full fat milk as your last meal prob 20 mins before 8pm. Drink at least 4 litres of water and 2 fruit through the day. Nuts as a snack. Morning just have a coffee with little milk, as long as you don't exceed more than 50 cals during your fast your fine. Fish twice a week (must) And loads of veg like tinned sweet corn or kidney beans. 4 excercises on different muscle groups 5 days a week. 45mins Max. then two rest when you should stretch(yoga). And sleep as much as you can. Sleep builds testosterone. Swim once a month at least. Even if you just tread water for 5 mins. One dirty meal a week like curry or pizza. You'll bulk, cut and feel great within 3 weeks.


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## Jack of blades (Apr 2, 2017)

1691ssor said:


> I am going to have to count calories or whatever you call it as my wife say's I don't eat anywhere near 3000 cal's so saying nearer 2000 is a guess. I was in McDonalds Wednesday and ate 2000 cals in one hit, bought a lot of chicken thinking it was going to be healthy but guessing fried, tasted fatty anyway.
> 
> Training is depressing, when I switched from a machine to free weights I could struggle 50kg on an Olympic bar for 10 reps, I'd be lucky if I could get 4 now. When I said precise I tried to kid myself I was doing them better hence the drop in weight, I can now do a massive 40kg for 3 sets of 10 almost in slow motion down to my chest and back up but the last couple of reps I'm struggling like a good'un. I read of everyone chasing the 100kg for 10 and I can't get past 40? fricken depressing. Bit that's really weird is I'm 6'3 nearly 14 stone, have a pretty large looking chest and front delts and lift like my mother, don't make sense.
> 
> Just got on scales now [8.25pm] 14 stone dead.


 well you don't need to go to McDonalds and get in 2000 calories to reach your target just so you know incase that's what you feel like you have to do. Having quick easy meal every 2 to 3 hours would do the trick example make porridge mixed with protein powder and nuts you'll get decent amount of carbs, proteins and fats. I don't know though seems odd being 14 stone and lifting so little but if your aiming for size don't be so bothered about how much your lifting anyways just train by getting the feeling off your muscles being worked in a range where there's constant tension. Maybe try some powerlifting style training for a bit if you want to get your numbers up


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Jack of blades said:


> Having quick easy meal every 2 to 3 hours would do the trick example make porridge mixed with protein powder and nuts you'll get decent amount of carbs, proteins and fats.


 I'm confident the OP could perfectly easily get the calories he needs from a decent sized breakfast, lunch and dinner, plus a snack or two if he fancies. I do. Nothing as weird as eating every 2-3 hours is needed.


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## Jack of blades (Apr 2, 2017)

Ultrasonic said:


> I'm confident the OP could perfectly easily get the calories he needs from a decent sized breakfast, lunch and dinner, plus a snack or two if he fancies. I do. Nothing as weird as eating every 2-3 hours is needed.


 I know that wouldn't work for me because if I had to many of my calories in the morning I'd be to hungry during the day. You burn off most calories in the morning so you'd be more catabolic during the day that's why it's best to spread it out plus it speeds up your metabolism


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Jack of blades said:


> I know that wouldn't work for me because if I had to many of my calories in the morning I'd be to hungry during the day. *You burn off most calories in the morning so you'd be more catabolic during the day that's why it's best to spread it out plus it speeds up your metabolism*


 The bit in bold is not true.

Absolutely spread your food out through the day in whatever way suits you best though - personal preference is a huge factor in finding the 'best' diet for someone. My point for the OP was that if he wants to it is perfectly possible to eat much more like a 'normal person'. The fact that I eat more than average won't be obvious to most of the people I know as they don't see the ~1000 kcal breakfast I typically have. People on very high calorie intakes cant get away with this but 3000 kcal is totally achievable this way and I doubt OP needs to go higher than this.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Viv said:


> Do you want to loose weight and keep muscle? Look athletic and feel fit or a bit of both?
> 
> do ab work everyday for 10 mins no more then run .5 mile quick as you can then walk back. Intermittent fast from 12 midday to 8 pm. Include 2-4 eggs, chicken or fish and 100% whey shake with full fat milk as your last meal prob 20 mins before 8pm. Drink at least 4 litres of water and 2 fruit through the day. Nuts as a snack. Morning just have a coffee with little milk, as long as you don't exceed more than 50 cals during your fast your fine. Fish twice a week (must) And loads of veg like tinned sweet corn or kidney beans. 4 excercises on different muscle groups 5 days a week. 45mins Max. then two rest when you should stretch(yoga). And sleep as much as you can. Sleep builds testosterone. Swim once a month at least. Even if you just tread water for 5 mins. One dirty meal a week like curry or pizza. You'll bulk, cut and feel great within 3 weeks.


 Welcome to the forum  .

I'm going to have to say that I really don't think the OP needs to be considering intermittent fasting though. It helps some people lose fat by making it easier for them to reduce total calories but the same results can be achieved with a normal diet. The OP also isn't looking to prioritise fat loss from my reading of what he has said.

Rather than worrying about a particular target of water to drink per day I think it's sufficient to just drink enough to try not get thirsty often (different to drinking when thirsty). Also note that water from all drinks 'count' - much of mine comes in the form of green tea and coffee (some of it decaf), along with some water too.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Jack of blades said:


> well you don't need to go to McDonalds and get in 2000 calories to reach your target just so you know incase that's what you feel like you have to do. Having quick easy meal every 2 to 3 hours would do the trick example make porridge mixed with protein powder and nuts you'll get decent amount of carbs, proteins and fats. I don't know though seems odd being 14 stone and lifting so little but if your aiming for size don't be so bothered about how much your lifting anyways just train by getting the feeling off your muscles being worked in a range where there's constant tension. Maybe try some powerlifting style training for a bit if you want to get your numbers up


 Thanks, the McD's was a treat when out and not regular thing


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## Matt6210 (Feb 15, 2018)

1691ssor said:


> Thanks, the McD's was a treat when out and not regular thing


 Mc d's milkshakes are serious gains.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Viv said:


> Do you want to loose weight and keep muscle? Look athletic and feel fit or a bit of both?
> 
> do ab work everyday for 10 mins no more then run .5 mile quick as you can then walk back. Intermittent fast from 12 midday to 8 pm. Include 2-4 eggs, chicken or fish and 100% whey shake with full fat milk as your last meal prob 20 mins before 8pm. Drink at least 4 litres of water and 2 fruit through the day. Nuts as a snack. Morning just have a coffee with little milk, as long as you don't exceed more than 50 cals during your fast your fine. Fish twice a week (must) And loads of veg like tinned sweet corn or kidney beans. 4 excercises on different muscle groups 5 days a week. 45mins Max. then two rest when you should stretch(yoga). And sleep as much as you can. Sleep builds testosterone. Swim once a month at least. Even if you just tread water for 5 mins. One dirty meal a week like curry or pizza. You'll bulk, cut and feel great within 3 weeks.


 Hi and thanks for taking the time to reply :thumbup1:

I think we're on a misunderstanding or cross wires, you did get that I was 57 [old] working out and getting weaker. I mentioned getting fatter as my way of saying I must be eating in surplus, I know the wrong way of working things out but mirror and scales was how I was doing it.

I wasn't to worried about gaining the extra weight, it was working out and the lack of gains that was confusing plus being tired all the time.

Cheers for the input though, appreciated

Ssor


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## ausmaz (Jul 14, 2014)

Hi mate, good on you for training regularly and putting in the effort! ....now as everyone else has duscussed diet with you, lets discuss your training.... i saw above the routine you had posted and just had a couple of questions...

1. How do you gauge your efforts in this routine? Ie do you take any, or all sets to failure?

2. Do you keep a training diary/journal?

3. How do you know when to progress? Is it just hit all 3 sets of 8 for example.... then add 5kg?

4. And finally do you schedule periods of lighter weights or easier workouts?

Again, good job on the effort your putting in.... now we just need to make sure you're getting the most bang for your buck!


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

ausmaz said:


> Hi mate, good on you for training regularly and putting in the effort! ....now as everyone else has duscussed diet with you, lets discuss your training.... i saw above the routine you had posted and just had a couple of questions...
> 
> 1. How do you gauge your efforts in this routine? Ie do you take any, or all sets to failure?
> 
> ...


 Hi ausmaz

1. first set is usually just under the max I did last time, if I was supposed to do 8 and I could squeeze out ten I would. second set I would up to max and go for 8, last set would be same weight if I found previous set a struggle and go to failure. I usually warm up for 10 with an empty bar beforehand to lubricate the joints so to speak.

2. Yes I keep records, mine are very depressing.

3. When I started, adding 2.5kg or 5kg was a regular thing and how I progressed, I was always pushing myself that little harder and it worked for six months. I now find myself fighting to try and hold on to the gains I had, the numbers have started dropping off, last night flat bench I maxed out at 40kg for 7 reps. Considered selling everything up and getting the jigsaws out!

4. No, never done lighter workouts, always pushing myself and believe it or not giving 110%. I don't have another hobby/past time so lifting weights gets my all.

Just doesn't make any sense?

I rested as suggested so last nights training was the first since last Tuesday [6 days off] now not supposed to train again till Wednesday, I'm not convinced this is going to help as I was down again last night and if I'm still eating as much and doing less, well we know where that's going to end.

If you have any ideas

Thanks


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## ausmaz (Jul 14, 2014)

1691ssor said:


> Hi ausmaz
> 
> 1. first set is usually just under the max I did last time, if I was supposed to do 8 and I could squeeze out ten I would. second set I would up to max and go for 8, last set would be same weight if I found previous set a struggle and go to failure. I usually warm up for 10 with an empty bar beforehand to lubricate the joints so to speak.
> 
> ...


 Dont get the jigsaws out just yet mate! EVERYBODY experiences setbacks in this game.....EVERYBODY! If it was possible to progress all the time we'd all be benching 500 kilos....

However it is a cause for concern when a) your putting in the effort and

B your still well into your 'novice' phase

Ok, so first things first.... i will echo what @Ultrasonic and others have said.... deload, if you've been pushing 100% and your not progressing...guess what? You aren't going to progress by pressing on harder! It's like doing the same thing over and over and expecting a dufferent result!

Now, after said deload subtract 20% from your previous best poundages.... and simply work back up again... however, YOU MUST RESIST the temptation early on to add weight faster on your way back....even though it will feel very easy.... stick with a kilo or two each week, otherwise you'll soon be spinning your wheels again.

One last thing.... are all your exercises weaker? Or is it just bench (as this is the only example you've given) can you still add weight to your squats and deadlift? If you can, simply deload the bench as described but keep pushing on those.... keep your routine the same in terms of exercise selection/reps/ sets and we'll look at each component in turn until progress resumes.... hang in there!!


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

ausmaz said:


> Dont get the jigsaws out just yet mate! EVERYBODY experiences setbacks in this game.....EVERYBODY! If it was possible to progress all the time we'd all be benching 500 kilos....
> 
> However it is a cause for concern when a) your putting in the effort and
> 
> ...


 Cheers for the positive reply mate, it helps :thumbup1:

No I'm getting weaker across all exercises, or at least not progressing, I wouldn't lie to you or cheat myself, I'm giving it everything, I've got and feeling I've peaked, is this it for an older guy!

I took a few lousy pic's on my phone but having trouble getting them to laptop but guessing I'm currently around 18% body fat so enough there to call it bulking, as said diet may not be absolutely perfect but I do watch what I eat, I don't eat fried food, I'm up on protein intake [200g +] and most of what I eat I would call healthy [obviously not the once or twice a month McD's, that's my feel good food  ].

Still trying to get into the doc's in case I've something missing from my diet, if I can get the pic's up I'll post one up for a laugh.

Currently PPL Mon/Wed/Fri not heard of that before but the rest days are nice :whistling:


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

1691ssor said:


> I've got and feeling I've peaked,


 You definitely haven't.



> I took a few lousy pic's on my phone but having trouble getting them to laptop but guessing I'm currently around 18% body fat so enough there to call it bulking, as said diet may not be absolutely perfect but I do watch what I eat, I don't eat fried food, I'm up on protein intake [200g +] and most of what I eat I would call healthy [obviously not the once or twice a month McD's, that's my feel good food  ].
> 
> Still trying to get into the doc's in case I've something missing from my diet,


 Have you started tracking your diet in Myfitnesspal yet? Getting an idea of what you're truly eating and sharing it here will be far more helpful than any conversation you could have with your GP about your diet would be.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

I'll just add that the reason to see your GP would be to rule out any underlying health condition, but I deliberately didn't mention this in my earlier advice as I think you should only do this AFTER trying a deload and sorting out your diet, as these are far more likely to be the issue.


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Ultrasonic said:


> You definitely haven't.
> 
> Have you started tracking your diet in Myfitnesspal yet? Getting an idea of what you're truly eating and sharing it here will be far more helpful than any conversation you could have with your GP about your diet would be.


 Me booking in to see the GP is really to check everything's fine and not for dietary advice, I'm older, who knows what packs up working with age.

Just spent 20 mins trying to suss myfitnesspal thingy out, was trying going on what I eat yesterday but left a couple of doughnuts off, I was hungry :whistling:

Breakfast not shown as got cut off when printing my screen but was at the top and included.









This is pretty typical, obviously slight variations, no doughnuts today! Is this to far off?


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## 1691ssor (May 21, 2018)

Finally got to the Quacks for a check up explaining I was feeling tired all the time and had to give some blood for testing, got a week or so for results to come back but testing for [just standard tests for now I guess]










and


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