# Strongman cutting diet.



## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Deepurple has asked me to ask about a good strongman diet but he needs to lose some fat.

Any one got any ideas ?

Maintain strength but lose fat..... all help appreciated.


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## Benchbum (Apr 20, 2011)

I would be interested in this


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## Dezw (May 13, 2009)

I always seem to do well on super high protein, with a sensible amount of carbs and some decent EFA's.


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## gymgym (Mar 20, 2012)

Chicken alternated with fish on every meals from morning to late afternoon, *evening*: massive salad with long greenies and all sort of veggies + omelette.. cardio x 6 / week 45' LISS or 20' HITT

:thumb:


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

He has very very ltd budget as well TBH, got it bad all round.


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

Liver every day,with eggs am

tuna/chilli/in w/meal pitta

full salad and chicken breast 50g brown rice

tin hot dog pitta or w/meal slice and evoo

6 boiled eggs.rolled in cabbage,pepper and fresh beans

oats/egg whites/milk powder/milk

Move around to put carbs b4 and after training example


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

i know of his situation .

oats eggs and olive oil is the base .

carbs in the morning and before training .

protein and fats at other times .

low carb high protein high fat , the fat helps hormone levels and joints .

chicken and red meat thrown in a pan of water with veg made into a broth .

oily fish as a treat .


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> i know of his situation .
> 
> oats eggs and olive oil is the base .
> 
> ...


He is trying to lose weight not stay the same?


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

biglbs said:


> He is trying to lose weight not stay the same?


hence the low carb and retain muscle .

fats are a better source of energy than carbs .

our body stores carbs but fats are a better fuel source by far .


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> hence the low carb and retain muscle .
> 
> fats are a better source of energy than carbs .
> 
> our body stores carbs but fats are a better fuel source by far .


Yes but too much fat imo is far worse,fault the diet for a day i set out and see--evoo is 3 tbs,plus all chicken and liver is cooked in two more,lol


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

The carbs before training are important fuel,the ones after are for glucose uptake on pulse.


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## Malibu (May 13, 2010)

Very low defiect since he doesnt want to lose strength. Aslong as set macros are hit it doesnt when or what he eats


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

biglbs said:


> Yes but too much fat imo is far worse,fault the diet for a day i set out and see--evoo is 3 tbs,plus all chicken and liver is cooked in two more,lol


when i do 50ml of olive oil ed i lean up thats without adjusting carbs .


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

best bet i would say is be more picky with carb timing and do some heavy cardio .


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> best bet i would say is be more picky with carb timing and do some heavy cardio .


Starts at diet,what timing for carbs iyo mate?


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

biglbs said:


> Starts at diet,what timing for carbs iyo mate?


10;15 am 3;15pm and 6pm ....



im different as i really dont hold much fat and the more gear i take and oil the leaner i get .

milky tell him if hes in aylesford next week about 12 (ministry of muscle) ill pay for him to have a strongman session .


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## Malibu (May 13, 2010)

Whats really the point of timed carbs, when your body cant tell the time?


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> 10;15 am 3;15pm and 6pm ....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ok mate,thanks:tongue:


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

Malibu said:


> Whats really the point of timed carbs, when your body cant tell the time?


hungry fibres


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Malibu said:


> Whats really the point of timed carbs, when your body cant tell the time?


lol

insulin peaks and the like .


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> lol
> 
> insulin peaks and the like .


 :thumb:


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

ewen said:


> 10;15 am 3;15pm and 6pm ....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Will do mate, is that near him?


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Milky said:


> Will do mate, is that near him?


not sure which part of kent hes in :confused1:


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

ewen said:


> not sure which part of kent hes in :confused1:


Near Tilbury l think, cant remember exactly.


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> not sure which part of kent hes in :confused1:


Never offered me a freebe!cvnt!


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## Malibu (May 13, 2010)

ewen said:


> lol
> 
> insulin peaks and the like .


Protein also spike insulin and in some case better than carbs


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Milky said:


> Near Tilbury l think, cant remember exactly.


might be a trek for him mate , he used to train with terry at dartford , im only 20-30 mins down the road but its couple hours on foot lol .


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Malibu said:


> Protein also spike insulin and in some case better than carbs


i mean the nutrient shuttling effect when slin peaks through training .


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## Fleg (May 27, 2011)

Ewen you got your diet anywhere mate I'd be interested to read..? I trained for strength before I got in to BB but never got the strongman diet nailed.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Fleg said:


> Ewen you got your diet anywhere mate I'd be interested to read..? I trained for strength before I got in to BB but never got the strongman diet nailed.


ill run through it mate i dont macro count though .

1- porridge

2- protein shake 66g of protein 1/3 tin of condensed milk .

3- 200-250g of beef fahitja (spl) peppers onions sauce .

4-same as 3

5-same as 2

6- 500g diced beef and med type roasting veg cooked on hot plate .

7- pizza

8-same as 2/5

protein i use is bodybuilding warehouse premium whey 30g is 22g of protein i use 3 scoops .

week end is different like today ive had a big fry up pizza weetabix diced beef and peppers gonna have pizza again then protein before bed , tomorrow will be a big protein based day .


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## Fleg (May 27, 2011)

That's some food bill mate I'm amazed you don't pack on fat nice work! I'll take a look through your journal I think!

Like the signature by the way JPS was the man!


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Fleg said:


> That's some food bill mate I'm amazed you don't pack on fat nice work! I'll take a look through your journal I think!
> 
> Like the signature by the way JPS was the man!


yeah jps was a brilliant guy all round mate .

im lucky in that im naturally an 11 stone guy so being the just off 18 i am now fat just doesnt stick around , plus heavy training helps loads .

if you see anything in my journal you can help with please do


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

ewen said:



> fats are a better source of energy than carbs .
> 
> our body stores carbs but fats are a better fuel source by far .


I would be interested to hear the reasoning behind this.


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## Fat (Jan 2, 2010)

MattGriff said:


> I would be interested to hear the reasoning behind this.


Excess protein can be turned into glucose via a process known as gluconeogenesis. However, it only usually occurs when dietary sources of glucose are not available.


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

Fat said:


> Excess protein can be turned into glucose via a process known as gluconeogenesis. However, it only usually occurs when dietary sources of glucose are not available.


Indeed it can; this is far from an optimal practice for a strength athlete however and does not answer the question as to why Ewan believes fats are a superior fuel source for a strength athlete.

I can completely see the reasoning for a bodybuilder or someone who prefers to focus on appearance however Strongman is not bodybuilding: performance is all that matters.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

I was under the belief that fats are a better source for the body as a whole not just sport specific ?


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

ewen said:


> I was under the belief that fats are a better source for the body as a whole not just sport specific ?


The body wants its fuel source as simply as possible - the brain uses approx 20% kcals of a person and it wants glucose - which is a derivative of carbs. The trouble is these days people group refined and unrefined carbs together.

They are simply fuel, and a very efficient one at that - the body will opt to break down proteins before fats as an energy source as fats by their nature are difficult to break down.

I want to lift things in the simplest way much like I want to give my body the fuel it wants, when it wants to enable me to complete such things.

Carbs are fantastic when used well, cheap, high in fibre and excellent for replenishing glycogen in muscles allowing the protein to do what you want it to do.

All the top strongmen pay their dues to carbs, and for a good reason too.

Fats are good fuel if use well, but for an athlete they are a poor relation to carbs for energy.

Sports does play a role in dietary requirement. The energy expenditure of a strongman is massively higher than a bodybuilder so something must adjusted.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Good post Matt .

Does make sense and shows that I know Fcuk all about actual strongman lol


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

ewen said:


> Good post Matt .
> 
> Does make sense and shows that I know Fcuk all about actual strongman lol


You think these boys shy away from carbs



I'm not suggesting eating 20 bags of Haribo a day either lol


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

MattGriff said:


> You think these boys shy away from carbs
> 
> View attachment 83592
> 
> ...


Not when powering up , but for cutting like the op is after then yeah.low carbs .

Pretty sure glen Ross eats a carb meal or 2 lol


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

http://uk.search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A7x9QXzx_bBPdF0A5ttLBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTE1MnRoaDh nBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2lyZAR2dGlkA0FDQk1VSzJfO DQ-/SIG=12pofkp1s/EXP=1337028209/**http%3a//www.mynchen.demon.co.uk/Ketogenic_diet/Supplements/MCT_oil.htm



MattGriff said:


> I believe there is one oil that kind of swerves rule,M.C.T. all others do not,carbs are needed especialy before and after training for op's purposes,imo


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

ewen said:


> Not when powering up , but for cutting like the op is after then yeah.low carbs .
> 
> Pretty sure glen Ross eats a carb meal or 2 lol


This is the thing though - a strongman has no business 'cutting' - if he trains hard and gets quick at medley and moving events and strong at static events what his body looks like is irrelivant.

The only difference ever should be training - if your weak at moving events or recovery slow you add more functiona fitness (light medleys, sledgehammer on a tyre etc), or you focus on power or technique etc alwys improving something - your body will follow suit and find the appropriate level for your training.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

MattGriff said:


> This is the thing though - a strongman has no business 'cutting' - if he trains hard and gets quick at medley and moving events and strong at static events what his body looks like is irrelivant.
> 
> The only difference ever should be training - if your weak at moving events or recovery slow you add more functiona fitness (light medleys, sledgehammer on a tyre etc), or you focus on power or technique etc alwys improving something - your body will follow suit and find the appropriate level for your training.


Totally agree .

I'm a fat bodybuiler


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> Totally agree .
> 
> I'm a fat bodybuiler


Fat northern fooker,ya mean


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## mikemull (Oct 23, 2011)

ewen said:


> best bet i would say is be more picky with carb timing and do some heavy cardio .


What do you mean by heavy cardio mate?


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

mikemull said:


> What do you mean by heavy cardio mate?


Event work , stuff like heavy yoke runs , these smash the cv and the muscles forcing a bigger energy need .


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## mikemull (Oct 23, 2011)

ewen said:


> Event work , stuff like heavy yoke runs , these smash the cv and the muscles forcing a bigger energy need .


I've had similar thoughts myself but don't have access to the equipment. Best I could prob do would be farmers with DBS or carrying sandbags etc.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

mikemull said:


> I've had similar thoughts myself but don't have access to the equipment. Best I could prob do would be farmers with DBS or carrying sandbags etc.


where about is north west mate ?

i might know or griff might know of a strongman gym you can go try stuff out at .


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## mikemull (Oct 23, 2011)

ewen said:


> where about is north west mate ?
> 
> i might know or griff might know of a strongman gym you can go try stuff out at .


Wigan mate.


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## JDinurthread (Mar 18, 2012)

oh lawd read the first page seen some douche with a beard telling someone to eat liver every day and to do 'heavy cardio' and to eat more fats and less carbs..........how do you even dress yourselves in the morning you fools cals in vs cals out = fat loss. decrese cals by 10%-15% to retain strength and watch the fat fall off. the only reason to do cardio is to improve your hearts performance and to increase deficit. lol liver.......this aint the 1960's just eat some chicken/pasta/olive oil and some whey and a steak and broccoli and shut up and squat.


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## JDinurthread (Mar 18, 2012)

mikemull said:


> Wigan mate.


olympic sports gym in ashton under lyne is a good gym pal. only gym im aware of that is active in strongman comps/training.


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## JDinurthread (Mar 18, 2012)

you can build your own yoke for about £100 if your good with a hammer etc get 2 oil drums some chains and some thick drain pipe and get building. as for farmers walk get some hammer curl bars the ones that come in those sets from argos for about £40 they hold about 60kg so buy two and train farmers with them. medleys are simple buy a sandbag (1kg of sand from asda is £1 atm) fill em and make a platform or just use your whellybins outside (if your anything like me you will have 3) to put the sand bags on. the rest can be done in the gym. log pressing is more aqward better of just investing in a log press of the interwebz. hope this helps


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

JDinurthread said:


> oh lawd read the first page seen some douche with a beard telling someone to eat liver every day and to do 'heavy cardio' and to eat more fats and less carbs..........how do you even dress yourselves in the morning you fools cals in vs cals out = fat loss. decrese cals by 10%-15% to retain strength and watch the fat fall off. the only reason to do cardio is to improve your hearts performance and to increase deficit. lol liver.......this aint the 1960's just eat some chicken/pasta/olive oil and some whey and a steak and broccoli and shut up and squat.


Ewen was incorrect, but don't insult him mate,he knows a lot,he is coming up very fast!Who are you again?


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

JDinurthread said:


> oh lawd read the first page seen some douche with a beard telling someone to eat liver every day and to do 'heavy cardio' and to eat more fats and less carbs..........how do you even dress yourselves in the morning you fools cals in vs cals out = fat loss. decrese cals by 10%-15% to retain strength and watch the fat fall off. the only reason to do cardio is to improve your hearts performance and to increase deficit. lol liver.......this aint the 1960's just eat some chicken/pasta/olive oil and some whey and a steak and broccoli and shut up and squat.


Eat liver ? Really ,learn to read .

What does running with a yoke do ? Burns more cals .

Were talking fat loss here there is no such thing as a strongman cutting diet its simply following a bodybuilders type diet for which I am actually Fcuking right .


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

BTW you don't reduce cals you reduce carbs so get it right .


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## Fat (Jan 2, 2010)

:lol:


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> Eat liver ? Really ,learn to read .
> 
> What does running with a yoke do ? Burns more cals .
> 
> Were talking fat loss here there is no such thing as a strongman cutting diet its simply following a bodybuilders type diet for which I am actually Fcuking right .


Not with fats mate!I was far more correct!lol


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

JDinurthread said:


> you can build your own yoke for about £100 if your good with a hammer etc get 2 oil drums some chains and some thick drain pipe and get building. as for farmers walk get some hammer curl bars the ones that come in those sets from argos for about £40 they hold about 60kg so buy two and train farmers with them. medleys are simple buy a sandbag (1kg of sand from asda is £1 atm) fill em and make a platform or just use your whellybins outside (if your anything like me you will have 3) to put the sand bags on. the rest can be done in the gym. log pressing is more aqward better of just investing in a log press of the interwebz. hope this helps


Buy a log pressing machine off the interwebz Haha wtf is one of them ?.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

biglbs said:


> Not with fats mate!I was far more correct!lol


Ok so you keep fats the same as you would in a normal cutting diet .


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

ewen said:


> Ok so you keep fats the same as you would in a normal cutting diet .


Low,yup correct,carbs as needed at relevent times,,,,,,oh i wish i could:whistling:


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## JDinurthread (Mar 18, 2012)

ewen said:


> Buy a log pressing machine off the interwebz Haha wtf is one of them ?.


lol you tell me to read and incorrectly qwote me! log press machine? no a log press. was gunna say log but thought id better add press so ppl knew what i was talking about. ive seen a few of your posts and there full of bro science its untrue. and to the other dude who asked me who i was does it really matter? pretty much put that guy to shame. so dislike whatever i said etc but deep down you know im right.

please stay safe


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

JDinurthread said:


> lol you tell me to read and incorrectly qwote me! log press machine? no a log press. was gunna say log but thought id better add press so ppl knew what i was talking about. ive seen a few of your posts and there full of bro science its untrue. and to the other dude who asked me who i was does it really matter? pretty much put that guy to shame. so dislike whatever i said etc but deep down you know im right.
> 
> please stay safe


Funny thing is I know who you are .


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## JDinurthread (Mar 18, 2012)

ewen said:


> Funny thing is I know who you are .


not even ****d m8 not one bit. good look in your future endeavours. and i hardly doubt you 'know' who i am. all you know is whats on this profile i can assure you.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

JDinurthread said:


> not even ****d m8 not one bit. good look in your future endeavours. and i hardly doubt you 'know' who i am. all you know is whats on this profile i can assure you.


You know where I am .


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Chillout guys, is sunday, and the weather is good and life is short... so just enjoy the day, and forget the posturing and keep on topic.


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## Rick89 (Feb 27, 2009)

gymgym said:


> Chicken alternated with fish on every meals from morning to late afternoon, *evening*: massive salad with long greenies and all sort of veggies + omelette.. cardio x 6 / week 45' LISS or 20' HITT
> 
> :thumb:


good luck managing to be statically strong on that diet


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## biglbs (Jan 26, 2012)

:lol:



Rick89 said:


> good luck managing to be statically strong on that diet


Blimeee mate you have grown!?? :lol:


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## Rick89 (Feb 27, 2009)

biglbs said:


> :lol:
> 
> Blimeee mate you have grown!?? :lol:


I know mate , I hold a number of world records and world titles aswell now :lol:


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Carbs support ATP stores, glycogen stores, and the brain is a glucose hog.

But, you can live without carbs just fine, not so without fats.

I know very little about strongman stuff, but dieting is simple.

I would count macros if I was dieting.


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## stone14 (Mar 24, 2005)

ewen said:


> when i do 50ml of olive oil ed i lean up thats without adjusting carbs .


Wud u say 50ml is 2-3 glugs out the bottle? I'm sick of evoo taste so onto flaxseed atm altho is £10 for 500ml compared to evoo £1.80 for 750ml lol, plus flax has a better omega range, and I'm only dieting a few weeks on dnp. I just gulp the flax down don't like the taste either. H&b said good fats help remove fat from your body when dieting also is this correct? I thought it was just good at removing fat from bad cholesterol in your blood system so good for your heart etc...


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

No such thing as bad cholesterol.

Keto diets tend to turn off the switch from using sugars to using fats for fuel.

Fats are a more stable form of fuel to keep blood sugars level in ketosis.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

stone14 said:


> Wud u say 50ml is 2-3 glugs out the bottle? I'm sick of evoo taste so onto flaxseed atm altho is £10 for 500ml compared to evoo £1.80 for 750ml lol, plus flax has a better omega range, and I'm only dieting a few weeks on dnp. I just gulp the flax down don't like the taste either. H&b said good fats help remove fat from your body when dieting also is this correct? I thought it was just good at removing fat from bad cholesterol in your blood system so good for your heart etc...


im not the best person to ask ive never cut bf% as its counter productive for my goals , if i was to cut bf i would run a blast of dnp and limit carbs , or just limit carbs .


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

that being said when i increase my event work (movement based) i burn fat pretty easy .


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

hackskii said:


> But, you can live without carbs just fine, not so without fats.
> 
> I know very little about strongman stuff, but dieting is simple.


Now make the aim repeated physical performance, strength endurance and recovery and I can pretty much garuntee most on this board know very little about it - Strongman is most certainly not bodybuilding, bodybuilding dieting is simple - strongman not so much, the energy requirements are totally different.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

MattGriff said:


> Now make the aim repeated physical performance, strength endurance and recovery and I can pretty much garuntee most on this board know very little about it - Strongman is most certainly not bodybuilding, bodybuilding dieting is simple - strongman not so much, the energy requirements are totally different.


Yah, but this is not rocket science and lets not make as such.

Someone posted up what Marius Pudzianowski ate in a day, it was guess who eats this type of question.

Looking at the post I thought hell, that is alot of simple sugar, then I realized that the energy expenditure had to be something off the chart that used alot of carbs that were needed for fuel.

When they said his name, it made sense to me.

Guys that ride the Tour De France eat thousands of calories more than the normal person in a day.

Ian Thorpe ate like 6 to 7 thousand calories a day, and due to his training I understand why.

Sitting burns predominantly fats, walking too, running is a split between fats and carbs, sprinting, HIIT, HIT all burn almost 100% carbs, so depending on what you are doing diet will have to change to adapt to training.

Keeping glycogen stores topped off, ATP stores topped off, all will allow for tons of energy, much of which will be stamina.

I remember Marius said he does not diet, he just trains harder.

When I said I don't know much about strongman stuff, I don't, but I do understand basic principles of energy expenditure and how the body runs.

I only need to take a moment to look at it and it becomes clear pretty fast.

For most of sports 40/30/30 Carbs/protein/fats is fine, and promotes good eicosanoid production.


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

hackskii said:


> Sitting burns predominantly fats, walking too, running is a split between fats and carbs, sprinting, HIIT, HIT all burn almost 100% carbs, so depending on what you are doing diet will have to change to adapt to training.
> 
> Keeping glycogen stores topped off, ATP stores topped off, all will allow for tons of energy, much of which will be stamina.
> 
> For most of sports 40/30/30 Carbs/protein/fats is fine, and promotes good eicosanoid production.


Sorry only just seen this post.

Can you provide any studies to demonstrate sitting burns predominantly fats? And so on? I would be very interested to see the science behind this as I simply cannot fathom how the body is choosing one fuel over another more readily available source due to sitting down.

How will tons of energy 'much of which be stamina' work exactly? Stamina is based upon the efficiency of blood oxygen and the appropriate motor units firing - neither of which require huge amounts of glycogen and they won't really depleate the ATP stores.

When I played rugby we were given diets by the sports dieticians linked to the club, they were approx 55/30/15 split of C/P/F.

I think you will find the majority of sports will require a higher proportion of carbs - it is only really likely those with stop/start type play such as American Football where they will likely replace carbs with fats.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

MattGriff said:


> Sorry only just seen this post.
> 
> Can you provide any studies to demonstrate sitting burns predominantly fats? And so on? I would be very interested to see the science behind this as I simply cannot fathom how the body is choosing one fuel over another more readily available source due to sitting down.
> 
> ...


Carbs provide a faster energy source.

So whenever you need to do something fast or produce force, propel the movements of the musculoskeletal system during athletic activities, then carbs are the better source of fuel.

Carbs are also the exclusive source for which the brain and central nervous system are supplied with their energy needs.

Fats are favored during long, low-intensity activities. It's not that you stop using one or the other fuel, it's that the ratio of both shifts depending on your activity, you alternate between aerobic (more fat-burning) and anaerobic (more carb-burning) metabolism.

So, high intensity exercise (anaerobic metabolism) creates ATP exclusively from carbohydrates, with lactic acid being a byproduct.

Low intensity exercise (Aerobic Metabolism) uses oxygen to convert nutrients (carbs, fats, proteins) to ATP.

Nutrients get converted to ATP based upon the intensity and duration of activity, with carbohydrate as the main nutrient fueling exercise of a moderate to high intensity, and fat providing energy during exercise that occurs at a lower intensity.

*At rest approximately 70% of the ATP produced is derived from fats and 30% from carbohydrates.*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basal_animal_metabolic_rate

The stamina comment was a bit out of context, what I meant to say is that if ATP stores are full, glycogen stores are full, one will have more ability to perform more intensity for longer than someone that does not have full stores (think keto diet here).

This is what I meant about stamina (the ability to do it harder for longer), which diet will influence.

Example being my 1 rep max is not compromised when I am on a keto diet, but the higher rep ranges that I would normally do on my workset will be lower.

On a keto diet I just don't have the stamina I do have on a non keto diet when doing heavy resistance training; I tend to crash on a keto diet.

But, 1 rep max is not compromised.

On the percentages of carbs/protein/fats, this has been studied by a Dr. Barry Sears with athletes.

Notice how the protein is the same between what I posted and you posted?

This is probably because 30% of the diet being protein is enough to satisfy the bodies requirements.

Now it is the other percentages that is the debate.

There is only a limited amount of carbohydrates being able to be stored, it is not unlimited.

What is unlimited (just an example) is the amount of fats that get stored (macros converted as well).

I do feel that 40% of the diet in carbs is enough to store to keep glycogen stores, and ATP stores topped off, the extra carbs spike blood sugars which spikes insulin, which then will store the rest as fat.

Another reason for the higher fat in the diet is to lower the glycemic load of the meal, allowing for less of a spike from insulin.

Now, of course if one was replacing fuel when exercising this becomes a whole other ball game.

My post was based on just meal eating and training, not replacement things during training which I like and also not like depending on if one was losing or trying to gain weight.


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

hackskii said:


> Carbs provide a faster energy source.
> 
> So whenever you need to do something fast or produce force, propel the movements of the musculoskeletal system during athletic activities, then carbs are the better source of fuel.
> 
> ...


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I totally agree, I am not depicting carbs as bad, it would be the over consumption of carbs that would be bad, and over time could put you more into an environment of insulin resistance.

Not to mention the carb selection would contribute negatively or positively depending on it being processed or raw foods.

I just don't like the idea of over-prioritizing carbs over fats.

Again, you can live without any carbs at all and live a healthy happy life, not so with fats.

Low fat diets have been shown to disrupt hormones.

If you add fats (lets say olive oil as an example) into a meal even with carbs and protein you lower the glycemic load.

Protein (whole foods) do not spike insulin to the extent that carbohydrates do and specifically simple sugars.

I would be happy to express my thoughts on food combinations, fats, and eicasinoid production with you, it happens to be one of my most favorite topic and has been a hobby of mine forever.

I love to read the latest and greatest diets out there, but all the information does tend to conflict some.

Hell, back in the 1860's the original keto diet was suggested and the man that invented it was laughed out of his profession.

Then 100 years later it became popular by a Dr. Atkins.

Hell, more than 100 years ago they thought you could not live without salt, then 70 years later it was demonized as bad for you.

But, fact is it is an essential electorate and in moderation is totally fine.

In fact those that try to limit as much as possible once they get salt, they will retain it.

The body is very smart and adapts, common sense is key here, everything in moderation.

The sitting and ATP, ADP is not even something that I would be worried about at all.

My point was depending on what you are doing, your energy sources will change, and that modification of diet will either benefit, or not benefit types of training.


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## MattGriff (Aug 21, 2012)

You would have to massively over indulge in simple carbs to build insulin resistance to any noticeable effect.

There is little point using a live without one or the other argument - it will never happen - the discussion is optimal energy levels for sports, the majority of sports are heavily based around high intensity intervals and as such carbs are prioritised by the top dieticians to support the requirements.

I think everyone understands the principle of glycemic loading etc as it is so basic.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

MattGriff said:


> You would have to massively over indulge in simple carbs to build insulin resistance to any noticeable effect.
> 
> There is little point using a live without one or the other argument - it will never happen - the discussion is optimal energy levels for sports, the majority of sports are heavily based around high intensity intervals and as such carbs are prioritised by the top dieticians to support the requirements.
> 
> I think everyone understands the principle of glycemic loading etc as it is so basic.


But you missed the biggest point mate, dietary fats at 15% of total calories can result in less than optimal sex steroids.

Diet should not go below 20% in fats as maximum testosterone production levels will be between 30% and 33% of total calories in fat.

At 15% you are compromising testosterone production, and circulating androgens potentially causing a decrease in the resting metabolic rate and lipolysis.

The live and live without statement was supporting the importance of fats, which should have a bit more priority if you want to achieve your goals at maximum performance.

Does not say much for the top dieticians not knowing the importance of testosterone declining with the use of low fat diets, which is what is suggested at 15% total cals.


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