# Scottish Independance



## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

Honestly who cares any more? If you don't like it fúck off - simple. I'm sure we won't miss the massive benefit and NHS cheque going up there very year. You can revel in your own economy without London banck-rolling your dreary, bleak little squirt of rock.


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## eezy1 (Dec 14, 2010)

its not gonna be the united kingdom anymore :crying:


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## Heavyassweights (Jan 18, 2014)

megatron said:


> Honestly who cares any more? If you don't like it fúck off - simple. I'm sure we won't miss the massive benefit and NHS cheque going up there very year. You can revel in your own economy without London banck-rolling your dreary, bleak little squirt of rock.


doesn't make sense mate


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## BettySwallocks (Aug 1, 2012)

if they vote that they do want to stay with us then we should all have our vote on whether we want them or not.


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

Can't say I've looked into it, but I'd be surprised if we both aren't worse off as separate countries.


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## DC1 (May 5, 2014)

Bit Anti-Scottish are we guys?


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## MrM (Feb 6, 2012)

megatron said:


> Honestly who cares any more? If you don't like it fúck off - simple. I'm sure we won't miss the massive benefit and NHS cheque going up there very year. You can revel in your own economy without London banck-rolling your dreary, bleak little squirt of rock.


You might miss the oil money, energy security and port to launch your deep water nuclear subs from.


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## BaronSamedii (Aug 29, 2014)

MrM said:


> You might miss the oil money, energy security and port to launch your deep water nuclear subs from.


If we miss it too much we can just invade you and take it all


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

megatron said:


> Honestly who cares any more? If you don't like it fúck off - simple. I'm sure we won't miss the massive benefit and NHS cheque going up there very year. You can revel in your own economy without London banck-rolling your dreary, bleak little squirt of rock.


Probably the most uneducated post I've seen regarding this topic, not digging you fella but there is so much more to this that even the people in the yes and no camps can't come up with a decent argument to fight there cause


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

BettySwallocks said:


> if they vote that they do want to stay with us then we should all have our vote on whether we want them or not.


Haha like it


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## Machette (Oct 29, 2011)

MrM said:


> You might miss the oil money, energy security and port to launch your deep water nuclear subs from.


Plus all the duty from the distileries producing massive amounts of alcohol...


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## BettySwallocks (Aug 1, 2012)

MrM said:


> You might miss the oil money, energy security and port to launch your deep water nuclear subs from.


Or portsmouth will re-open causing the scots to lose a lot of jobs from the MOD contracts we have acquired :whistling:


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## Pinky (Sep 3, 2014)

I would like to know all the people who are voting yes are they prepared to pay the 1000pound plus per person to set the country up as a stand alone one. Me personally i think if they go it will be suicide for them.

Who ever said we'll miss the oil etc, we dont have all the money, they get free prescribtions, free education etc its not like they dont benefit from it


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## braxbro (Aug 6, 2013)

Don't mind what they do to be honest i'm just sick of hearing about it. Quite a lot of anti-english sentiment up there so would happily be rid of it. Its taken the south of Ireland years to work out that the average Englishman is not to blame for the trouble and atrocities committed by previous governments so the abuse on holidays is getting less and less as the years go by lol. If the Scots get their own independence then eventually they might work this out too?

All us civilians are all the same, its the scum bag governments who shame their nations with outrageous crimes against humanity, mis-spending of tax money and completely laughable policies who gives their nations a bad name.


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## harrison180 (Aug 6, 2013)

You no who i blame? Scotish muslims

Sorry just thought a thread without them being mentioned isnt the norm these days lol .

In seriousness what in this day and age does it matter? If they were under the rule of a tyrant then fair enough but whats so different living in scotland as part of britain to being apart?


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## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

T100 said:


> Probably the most uneducated post I've seen regarding this topic, not digging you fella but there is so much more to this that even the people in the yes and no camps can't come up with a decent argument to fight there cause


Hands up - I am totally uneducated about this, thought i'd spark a debate with an inflammatory comment haha.


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## harrison180 (Aug 6, 2013)

Misspinky1983 said:


> I would like to know all the people who are voting yes are they prepared to pay the 1000pound plus per person to set the country up as a stand alone one. Me personally i think if they go it will be suicide for them.
> 
> Who ever said we'll miss the oil etc, we dont have all the money, they get free prescribtions, free education etc its not like they dont benefit from it


Who gets free perscriptions? The doctors and chemist by me are running some kind of racket i think. Robbin ba5tards. Last time i went i had to pay nearly 8 quid for the smallest tube of cream i have ever seen in my life and it didnt work.


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## Pinky (Sep 3, 2014)

harrison180 said:


> Who gets free perscriptions? The doctors and chemist by me are running some kind of racket i think. Robbin ba5tards. Last time i went i had to pay nearly 8 quid for the smallest tube of cream i have ever seen in my life and it didnt work.


Scottish people do.

If you work matey your entitled to diddley squat. I have to pay for EVERYTHING. Its a joke. I can understand why people feel the need to pop out 4 kids tbh and not work when they get 1300pound a month in benefits, rent paid and council tax!!


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## jocksir (Aug 8, 2012)

Scotland represents just 8.3% of the UK population and this is what we contribute to the UK

We have the following share of UK resources -

- 32% Land area

- 61% Sea area

- 90% Surface fresh water

- 65% North Sea natural gas production

- 96.5% North Sea crude oil production

- 47% Open cast coal production

- 81% Coal reserves at sites not yet in production

- 62% Timber production (green tonnes)

- 46% Total forest area (hectares)

- 92% Hydro electric production

- 40% Wind, wave, solar production

- 60% Fish Landings (total by Scottish vessels)

- 55% Fish Landings (total from Scottish waters)

- 30% Beef herd (breeding stock)

- 20% Sheep herd (breeding flock)

- 9% Dairy herd

- 10% Pig herd

- 15% Cereal holdings (hectares)

- 20% potato holdings (hectares)

All with 8.3% of the population!


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

megatron said:


> Hands up - I am totally uneducated about this, thought i'd spark a debate with an inflammatory comment haha.


You should be in politics mate haha


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

braxbro said:


> Don't mind what they do to be honest i'm just sick of hearing about it. Quite a lot of anti-english sentiment up there so would happily be rid of it. Its taken the south of Ireland years to work out that the average Englishman is not to blame for the trouble and atrocities committed by previous governments so the abuse on holidays is getting less and less as the years go by lol. If the Scots get their own independence then eventually they might work this out too?
> 
> All us civilians are all the same, its the scum bag governments who shame their nations with outrageous crimes against humanity, mis-spending of tax money and completely laughable policies who gives their nations a bad name.


I think most Scots do get that already. As the old saying goes, empty barrels make the most noise, so don't judge us all on the behaviour of a vocal minority. Your last point is good and it's worth pointing out that for many in the Yes camp it is a vote against Westminster, not the people of England.


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## harrison180 (Aug 6, 2013)

Misspinky1983 said:


> Scottish people do.
> 
> If you work matey your entitled to diddley squat. I have to pay for EVERYTHING. Its a joke. I can understand why people feel the need to pop out 4 kids tbh and not work when they get 1300pound a month in benefits, rent paid and council tax!!


  you mean to tell me their are people who dont work and have a better life than those who work themselves into the ground???? lol.

oh yes that winds me right up. the bone idle scum of this world get it handed to them on a plate.

if i run the country then they would be put in work houses or left to starve.


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## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

Ian_Montrose said:


> I think most Scots do get that already. As the old saying goes, empty barrels make the most noise, so don't judge us all on the behaviour of a vocal minority. Your last point is good and it's worth pointing out that for many in the Yes camp it is a vote against Westminster, not the people of England.


How can the rest of us vote "no" to being governed by said bunch of idiots?


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

harrison180 said:


> You no who i blame? Scotish muslims
> 
> Sorry just thought a thread without them being mentioned isnt the norm these days lol .
> 
> In seriousness what in this day and age does it matter? If they were under the rule of a tyrant then fair enough but whats so different living in scotland as part of britain to being apart?


Me too.

Dirty sneaky bstards the Scuslims.


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## Pinky (Sep 3, 2014)

harrison180 said:


> you mean to tell me their are people who dont work and have a better life than those who work themselves into the ground???? lol.
> 
> oh yes that winds me right up. the bone idle scum of this world get it handed to them on a plate.
> 
> if i run the country then they would be put in work houses or left to starve.


Yeah mate theres a woman up the road from me with 4 kids she gets 1300 a month in benefits, no rent or CT i work i get slightly more but have to pay rent, CT the lot. IMO the last gov created a lazy nation, by allowing people to have kids and think its ok to let the tax payers keep them!! Makes my pi55 fizz i tell ya


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## Deasy (May 5, 2014)

megatron said:


> Honestly who cares any more? If you don't like it fúck off - simple. I'm sure we won't miss the massive benefit and NHS cheque going up there very year. You can revel in your own economy without London banck-rolling your dreary, bleak little squirt of rock.


Good luck without the oil revenue and the security for the massive uk debt set against that


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## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

Deasy said:


> Good luck without the oil revenue and the security for the massive uk debt set against that


Since gas/oil and coal only account for 2% of the GNP for the UK I think we will be just fine 

Evidence: http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article14682.html


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## harrison180 (Aug 6, 2013)

Misspinky1983 said:


> Yeah mate theres a woman up the road from me with 4 kids she gets 1300 a month in benefits, no rent or CT i work i get slightly more but have to pay rent, CT the lot. IMO the last gov created a lazy nation, by allowing people to have kids and think its ok to let the tax payers keep them!! Makes my pi55 fizz i tell ya


haha you wanna bottle that then and sell it tramps that hang round by the tesco at burntree lol.

my mrs lives by dudley and im always round that part and her estate is the same. everyone works in the house yet the council let it become a death trap, the lazy fvckers next door have had the house gutted and redone and sh1t loads of other stuff in two years. not one of them have done a days work.


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## Mhoon (May 29, 2014)

Deasy said:


> Good luck without the oil revenue and the security for the massive uk debt set against that


Oil revenues were only about £4billion last year. Not to mention the costs of setting up new pipelines, maintaining existing.

The whole thing is pandering to Alex Salmond's ego and his cronies in the Scottish Natzi Party.

#VOTENO :thumbup1:


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## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

Doesn't anyone else find it odd that Alisdar Darling, the man who single-handedly sent the UK into the worst debt in history, who sold off our gold reserves for cheap, who on his last day in office signed over 15 BILLION pounds to fund Ireland's debt crisis.... Is the man leading Scotland away from the UK, good luck with that tool.


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## Deasy (May 5, 2014)

megatron said:


> Since gas/oil and coal only account for 2% of the GNP for the UK I think we will be just fine
> 
> Evidence: http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article14682.html


Aye,but go check what the uk government borrows against....future oil revenues.

Your government in London have made a great job of it these last 15-20 years eh?

Sure all those people eating out of foodbanks think you'll be just fine without us..


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

As a proud scot I would find it hard to vote no purely on the fact that how could any country vote no to being it's own country, all politics aside, oh and we get Andy Murray back!


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

If it doesn't work out,they can rejoin the union later on.


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

megatron said:


> Doesn't anyone else find it odd that Alisdar Darling, the man who single-handedly sent the UK into the worst debt in history, who sold off our gold reserves for cheap, who on his last day in office signed over 15 BILLION pounds to fund Ireland's debt crisis.... Is the man leading Scotland away from the UK, good luck with that tool.


 :confused1: No he is the one opposing us moving away from the UK


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## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

T100 said:


> As a proud scot I would find it hard to vote no purely on the fact that how could any country vote no to being it's own country, all politics aside, oh and we get Andy Murray back!


hes not long been beaten in the US open, you can have him back until june next year.


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## no-way (Oct 14, 2012)

BaronSamedii said:


> If we miss it too much we can just invade you and take it all


It's funny you should say that. I read today that the british military number 202,500 (or something close) and if they vote yes, 200k of those will either move south, or not have a job.

They'll have a military consisting on a few thousand at most. Let's do a Putin and take everything worth anything. :lol:


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

megatron said:


> How can the rest of us vote "no" to being governed by said bunch of idiots?


You're welcome to come and live with us. If we end up with a Yes vote they're going to have to replace/untangle all the various corporate and public sector IT systems so you'll make a killing.


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## BigMeech (Jan 21, 2011)

megatron said:


> Doesn't anyone else find it odd that Alisdar Darling, the man who single-handedly sent the UK into the worst debt in history, who sold off our gold reserves for cheap, who on his last day in office signed over 15 BILLION pounds to fund Ireland's debt crisis.... Is the man leading Scotland away from the UK, good luck with that tool.


No he isn't. He's the one leading the "better together" campaign.


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## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

BigMeech said:


> No he isn't. He's the one leading the "better together" campaign.


Ahh, as I said - very uneducated 

BUt then if he's leading the campaign to stay... i'd say leave!


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## jocksir (Aug 8, 2012)

megatron said:


> Since gas/oil and coal only account for 2% of the GNP for the UK I think we will be just fine
> 
> Evidence: http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article14682.html


In the last 30 odd years Scotland has contributed over 200 billion more in tax revenue than the rest of the UK per capita, even last year we provided over £1500 more per person in the rest of the UK in tax.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

@jocksir

You forgot to mention Whiskey!!


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## Muckshifter (Apr 5, 2014)

megatron said:


> Honestly who cares any more?


The people of Scotland and the way the polls are showing you won't have to long for us to fcuk off as you put it


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

latblaster said:


> @jocksir
> 
> You forgot to mention Whiskey!!


And alcoholics. There's barely a pub in the developed world that doesn't have a drunken Scot propping up the bar. We just need to find a way to profit from that particular export. We could maybe use them as pop-up embassies I suppose:

"Ye want a visa wee man? Aye nae problem. Just get me a hawf-an-a-hawf whilst I sort it oot. By ra way, dae ye ken Jimmy McKay? He's fae the Brum an a'. Ye sure? Ye must ken big Jimmy. Big nutter wi ginger hair, a bit too haundy wi a chiv but no a bad lad. Ye really dinnae know him? Ach well, stick yer visa up yer erse."


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## Muckshifter (Apr 5, 2014)

Misspinky1983 said:


> Scottish people do.
> 
> If you work matey your entitled to diddley squat. I have to pay for EVERYTHING. Its a joke. I can understand why people feel the need to pop out 4 kids tbh and not work when they get 1300pound a month in benefits, rent paid and council tax!!


Your wrong there cause I work and I'm entitled to free prescriptions plus free uni for our kids,it ain't our fault your government would rather rob you's for medicine and education.


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## Pinky (Sep 3, 2014)

Muckshifter said:


> Your wrong there cause I work and I'm entitled to free prescriptions plus free uni for our kids,it ain't our fault your government would rather rob you's for medicine and education.


Wind your neck in i was on about in the uk but your right it's not the peoples fault same as the illegal and legal immigration problem you cant blame the people for wanting to come to a country that would rather look after other countries wafes, strays and sponges its the pathetic gove thats the problem and lack of back bone. So you saying you get things for free are you happy to walk away from that?


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## tmacf (Jan 27, 2009)

I don't know why the better together campaign can't be honest and say the Uk needs Scotland. Instead all they have done is say no you can't do it. The desperation from Westminster today outlining what powers we are getting if we vote no. Should that not have outlined months ago? Instead they will rush a carrot to dangle hoping that yes momentum can be broken.

Don't understand how any Scotsman could vote no especially when you see the anti scottish sentiment on here.


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## Total Rebuild (Sep 9, 2009)

megatron said:


> Doesn't anyone else find it odd that Alisdar Darling, the man who single-handedly sent the UK into the worst debt in history, who sold off our gold reserves for cheap, who on his last day in office signed over 15 BILLION pounds to fund Ireland's debt crisis.... Is the man leading Scotland away from the UK, good luck with that tool.


And it was Gordon Brown who sold off all the gold.


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## Muckshifter (Apr 5, 2014)

What the fcuk do I have to wind my neck in for you said Scottish people get free prescriptions and if you work you get diddly I corrected you and why would I be walking away from free prescriptions and uni fees if I vote yes I would still be be getting free stuff like a said your government doesn't want you's to have that.


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## Lotte (Feb 10, 2014)

For months now a group of Scots at my work have been getting together during breaktimes to have a good old rail against the English, their government and to generally spout crazy nationalist stuff, they are really, really passionate about getting independence from us [email protected] down south.

I'm not bothered and I don't feel anti-Scottish because of it. I'm not a nationalist so when people hate on the "English" I don't feel as if it is anything to do with me. If the Scots want to be independent and manage to get it then good for them.

No skin off my nose, it's only the media trying to make the average joe in the rest of Britain give a sh1t about something they can't change and that will have basically no day to day effect on them.

Classic diversion tactics for all of us south of the border.


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## jason7474utd (Oct 12, 2010)

I love all the braveheart wannabes banging on like england is going to collapse if scotland break away. Have you thought about what currency you are going to use? you cant use the pound your not part of the united kingdom anymore the euro has allready said you cant use that. you wont be able to join europe you would be no better than half of the old eastern block countries.

if you look at the actual facts and numbers its been printed over and over again that scotland takes more than it gives from the overall pot how do you plan to make up that deficit?

instead of just basing your vote and point of view on a good old bit of english bashing i think you should really look at the facts and figures and nothing speaks louder than bottom line ins and outs


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

It's always been about "their" oil, little do they realise that if it goes by territory, it would all belong to the Orkney Islands! I say let them have independence lol

Nothing against Scott's as I've worked with them most of my career, but the majority do no reciprocate the love lol


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

tmacf said:


> I don't know why the better together campaign can't be honest and say the Uk needs Scotland. *Instead all they have done is say no you can't do it.*


They've scored a massive own goal with that tactic. I don't care if you're English, Scottish, Irish or Welsh. If someone sneers at you and says "you couldn't possibly cope without us" they're only going to get one response - "You reckon? Just watch us!".


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

^^ EXACTLY!

The Brits are well know for pulling together and getting on with business!


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

I think you need to understand that the Scottish government not English pays for us to have free prescriptions, free education. So we won't be walking away from that.

Scotland hands all it's money to London and they give us pocket money back,so to speak. It is up to The Scottish government to decide what they spend this money on and they have decide free prescriptions and education etc

You should be wondering why the Scottish government can pay for this for its people and the English government can't,


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

Sim0x said:


> It's always been about "their" oil, little do they realise that if it goes by territory, it would all belong to the Orkney Islands! I say let them have independence lol


The Orkneys? Really? Sure about that?


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

That's what I was told by one of the top men at BP mate.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

jason7474utd said:


> I love all the braveheart wannabes banging on like england is going to collapse if scotland break away. Have you thought about what currency you are going to use? you cant use the pound your not part of the united kingdom anymore the euro has allready said you cant use that. you wont be able to join europe you would be no better than half of the old eastern block countries.
> 
> if you look at the actual facts and numbers its been printed over and over again that scotland takes more than it gives from the overall pot how do you plan to make up that deficit?
> 
> instead of just basing your vote and point of view on a good old bit of english bashing i think you should really look at the facts and figures and nothing speaks louder than bottom line ins and outs


Show me these facts?


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Sim0x said:


> That's what I was told by one of the top men at BP mate.


Just so happens that these islands have said they will remain part of Scotland


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## jason7474utd (Oct 12, 2010)

amurphy said:


> Show me these facts?


its been published a thousand times and personaly i dont care much for scotland iv never met a half decent scot in my life.

go vote yes have your independence and well see were your econemy is in few years


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

Maybe for a while mate until they get the same attitude as Scotland and go for independence lol

To be fair, I'm all for it, change is as good as the rest. You never know, it could be a good boost for both parties.

Crack on... Lol


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

jason7474utd said:


> its been published a thousand times and personaly i dont care much for scotland iv never met a half decent scot in my life.
> 
> go vote yes have your independence and well see were your econemy is in few years


For 33 years Scotland has given the UK more money that what they get back. That's why we want independence so we can look after our own money and make our own rules.


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

I so t see why not, it's not going to affect GB really apart from shelling out more money. It won't hurt us if Scotland goes belly up so I say let you guys do what every you want.

I also think that you should use the Scottish thistle as Pounds and haggis as pence lol


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

Sim0x said:


> That's what I was told by one of the top men at BP mate.


I would have thought he'd have mentioned the Shetlands before the Orkneys.They have much larger oil reserves within what would be their territorial waters if they were to be independent. They also have a much stronger sense of national identity and don't really see themselves as Scottish. Holyrood is just as far away as Westminster as far as your average Shetlander is concerned.


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

Keep a close eye on them crafty buggers then mate, they will take sullem voe with them lol


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Double post!


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Ian_Montrose said:


> I would have thought he'd have mentioned the Shetlands before the Orkneys.They have much larger oil reserves within what would be their territorial waters if they were to be independent. They also have a much stronger sense of national identity and don't really see themselves as Scottish. Holyrood is just as far away as Westminster as far as your average Shetlander is concerned.


I would have thought Shetland to.

the 3 councils have said they will remain part of Scotland if they do get independence.


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## Wallace86 (Jan 20, 2013)

T100 said:


> Probably the most uneducated post I've seen regarding this topic, not digging you fella but there is so much more to this that even the people in the yes and no camps can't come up with a decent argument to fight there cause


Il second that haha...When we are Bankl rolling London with all our Oil,Whiskey, Renuables and all they have are the immigrants :thumbup1:


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

Ripping it up said:


> *all our Oil*


Pretty much says it all right there.

Let them have it and just hope the wells dry up lol, a lot of them don't have much left anyway lol.


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## Armitage Shanks (Jul 7, 2014)

I do not want to see the UK split as we have done great things together and stood up to adversity and hardship. I feel at home be it Northern Ireland, Wales, Scotland or England. But if Scotland want to go their own way then I wish them the best and hope we can just move on and all be successful. Its just like a couple you know splitting up, there is no winners, just degrees of loosing.


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## Wallace86 (Jan 20, 2013)

Sim0x said:


> Pretty much says it all right there.
> 
> Let them have it and just hope the wells dry up lol, a lot of them don't have much left anyway lol.


Maybe worth doing a little research on the Oil situation then buddy. theres plenty Oil left


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Its gone on that long I just think if they want to go, then go, like the pisorious case bored sh1tless with both.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Ripping it up said:


> Maybe worth doing a little research on the Oil situation then buddy. theres plenty Oil left


and plenty untapped in the west coast of Scotland.

Get rid of trident and we can go drilling!


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

Ripping it up said:


> Maybe worth doing a little research on the Oil situation then buddy. theres plenty Oil left


I've working in the Oil & Gas industry for over 10 years, on most of the North Sea Platforms, if you would have read the post you would have seen that I never said there is not plenty left, only that a lot of wells do not have a lot left.

I find this quite interesting in the fact that 62% of GB actually want to get rid of Scotland, myself I'm not really bothered either way.



^^ It would seem that we actually want it more than you guys lol


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

Sim0x said:


> I've working in the Oil & Gas industry for over 10 years, on most of the North Sea Platforms, if you would have read the post you would have seen that I never said there is not plenty left, only that a lot of wells do not have a lot left.
> 
> I find this quite interesting in the fact that 62% of GB actually want to get rid of Scotland, myself I'm not really bothered either way.
> 
> ...


 Try reading that again, this time with your glasses on. That says 62% No and that was the initial poll results circa 2011


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

Should have gone to Spec Savers Haha nice one mate, too tired and didn't even look at it to good obviously lol

Anyway, who is it that would actually say "OK Scotland your free to go" would it be that miserable old bit who wears that crown thing lol


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## Wallace86 (Jan 20, 2013)

Sim0x said:


> I've working in the Oil & Gas industry for over 10 years, on most of the North Sea Platforms, if you would have read the post you would have seen that I never said there is not plenty left, only that a lot of wells do not have a lot left.
> 
> I find this quite interesting in the fact that 62% of GB actually want to get rid of Scotland, myself I'm not really bothered either way.
> 
> ...


Haha how old is the poll? And why does the Uk Goverment not want a split?? Because they wouldnt manage with out Scotland.... Any way only time will tell


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## EpicSquats (Mar 29, 2014)

Scottish independence? If you're not one of the super rich with political power then you don't get a say at all one way or the other, and you're kidding yourself if you think you do.


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## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

T100 said:


> As a proud scot* I would find it hard to vote no purely on the fact that how could any country vote no to being it's own country*, all politics aside, oh and we get Andy Murray back!


this^^^.....one thing I never understood, is why people in England classify themselves as 'British' and not 'English'


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

I think its because the UK government are control freaks and its only more people to control.


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## Chrisallan (Jul 11, 2014)

The biggest problem I see with this independence argument is that a lot of English people are taking it as a personal dig at them.

It's not the English people the majority of Scottish people hate,it's the English government.im sure most English,Northern Irish and welsh people hate the government too!

I know,unfortunately,there are a few ****holes who make life hard for English settlers,but we are not all like this.

I stay in the highlands and there are a helluva lot of English settlers here,who don't feel threatened and enjoy staying there.

I used to work offshore and have worked on rigs where the crew are predominantly English and there is always good banter between everybody.....most of the time!

To me if you are alright your alright,wherever you are from.


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## Sams (Nov 3, 2013)

If they do get independence will you still be able to get the angus burger from BK ? if the answer is no then I want them to stay part of the UK


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## Sim0x (Aug 19, 2013)

Sams said:


> If they do get independence will you still be able to get the angus burger from BK ? if the answer is no then I want them to stay part of the UK


Pure quality!


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## Armitage Shanks (Jul 7, 2014)

Chrisallan said:


> The biggest problem I see with this independence argument is that a lot of English people are taking it as a personal dig at them.
> 
> It's not the English people the majority of Scottish people hate,it's the English government.im sure most English,Northern Irish and welsh people hate the government too!
> 
> ...


In the Military and working in the North Sea 95% of Sottish people are are warm and friendly. I met more Northern English who had a problem with me being a shandy drinking Southerner than any Scotsman.


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

barsnack said:


> this^^^.....one thing I never understood, is why people in England classify themselves as 'British' and not 'English'


That's always baffled me as well, it's not that I have a problem with being classed as british but when ever I'm abroad I always say I'm Scottish and never referred to myself as British, I used to add Scottish on application forms when filling them in haha


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## EctoSize (Nov 28, 2013)

Are Scotland going to repay the Darien Debt plus inflation and interest? :tongue:

In all seriousness it's obvious that both countries would suffer from a break up but it's also obvious that it wouldn't be disastrous and the average person wouldn't notice much change (positive or negative) in there quality of life as a result. People keep quoting 'fact' and figures they've been spoon fed by the media when really nobody has got a fvcking clue what the actual facts are because they change depending on which source it has came from.

Personally though, I would like to see it happen just to how it will play out, it would probably be the biggest political change to happen since the Berlin Wall came down! And good look to them if they do get it!


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## Normsky (Aug 29, 2014)

I love how the Scottish independence advocates use William Wallace as their symbol to coax working class Scottish nationalist sentiment in the Scottish masses.

The irony of using a man from nobility of non Scottish (welsh) descent who fought for the English as a mercenary, as the symbol of your nations strive for independence, is somewhat genius, even if lost on the Scot's.


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## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

EctoSize said:


> Are Scotland going to repay the Darien Debt plus inflation and interest? :tongue:
> 
> In all seriousness it's obvious that both countries would suffer from a break up but it's also obvious that it wouldn't be disastrous and the average person wouldn't notice much change (positive or negative) in there quality of life as a result. People keep quoting 'fact' and figures they've been spoon fed by the media when really nobody has got a fvcking clue what the actual facts are because they change depending on which source it has came from.
> 
> Personally though, I would like to see it happen just to how it will play out, it *would probably be the biggest political change to happen since the Berlin Wall came down*! And good look to them if they do get it!


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## jocksir (Aug 8, 2012)

Normsky said:


> I love how the Scottish independence advocates use William Wallace as their symbol to coax working class Scottish nationalist sentiment in the Scottish masses.
> 
> The irony of using a man from nobility of non Scottish (welsh) descent who fought for the English as a mercenary, as the symbol of your nations strive for independence, is somewhat genius, even if lost on the Scot's.


I'm of Irish decent but im Scottish as i was born in here, what does having where your heritage come from have anything to do with it also as with most Scots of lower nobilty and landowners during the "stewardship" of King Edward would have been required to fight for him as would have been there due's for their land. Of course it's genius he's a symbol of Scotland and classed as a Patriot but to say it's lost on the Scot's is insulting to me and many other Scot's i know.

Lets take your argument of irony and propose it also applies to the Queen who is of German decent and by royal proclamation name was change to Windsor due to anti German sentiment during the first world war, the family Saxe-Coburg and Gotha which was the original name of the British Royal family where the ruling monarchs of Germany During WW1 but the royals are now being used as symbol of British nationalism, to fight for queen and country, somewhat genius!


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## Normsky (Aug 29, 2014)

jocksir said:


> I'm of Irish decent but im Scottish as i was born in here, what does having where your heritage come from have anything to do with it also as with most Scots of lower nobilty and landowners during the "stewardship" of King Edward would have been required to fight for him as would have been there due's for their land. Of course it's genius he's a symbol of Scotland and classed as a Patriot but to say it's lost on the Scot's is insulting to me and many other Scot's i know.
> 
> Lets take your argument of irony and propose it also applies to the Queen who is of German decent and by royal proclamation name was change to Windsor due to anti German sentiment during the first world war, the family Saxe-Coburg and Gotha which was the original name of the British Royal family where the ruling monarchs of Germany During WW1 but the royals are now being used as symbol of British nationalism, to fight for queen and country, somewhat genius!


The blithering idiots who get all teary eyed about the queen in my country are morons too, I think both are examples of people being susceptible to jingoistic nonsense.

However pointing out the latter does not negate the former.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Ripping it up said:


> Il second that haha...When we are Bankl rolling London with all our Oil,Whiskey, Renuables and all they have are the immigrants :thumbup1:


Alex Salmond has said he wants to open the doors to immigrants in Scotland post independence.

Im a Yes voter. The way i look at it is either way yes or no the next 20 years+ will be hard but I have more faith in our own government than i do in Westminster. I dont doubt for a minute that we can survive on our own.


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## DeskSitter (Jan 28, 2013)

Interesting video this. Talks about media bias with regards to the coverage of the debate surrounding Scottish Independence. The last five minutes is especially eye opening.

I'm the sort of person that knows I'm being lied to and brainwashed when I watch the BBC but for those that don't I suggest you watch this video. It's narrative comes from a guy whose pro-independence and makes no qualms about it, but his observational analysis of the whole thing is very close to the bone, in my opinion anyway


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## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

DeskSitter said:


> Interesting video this. Talks about media bias with regards to the coverage of the debate surrounding Scottish Independence. The last five minutes is especially eye opening.
> 
> I'm the sort of person that knows I'm being lied to and brainwashed when I watch the BBC but for those that don't I suggest you watch this video. It's narrative comes from a guy whose pro-independence and makes no qualms about it, but his observational analysis of the whole thing is very close to the bone, in my opinion anyway


can you summarise it, boxing is on


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## DeskSitter (Jan 28, 2013)

barsnack said:


> can you summarise it, boxing is on


No mate lol watch it


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## omle (Jul 10, 2014)

If they go they go, if they stay they stay.

Some huge issues to sort out if they go though, Passports, Vehicle licencing, Currency, banking, but the choice is Scotlands.

This video is worth a watch and tells them how valubale the oil really is.


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)




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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)




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## PD89 (Mar 27, 2014)

Scotland is going to be split down the middle either way now.... Half the country wants out and half wants to stay in, whoever wins there's going to be a fcuk load of really disappointed and probably angry people feeling like they aren't represented, could see that being the biggest problem now is the massive resentment one side is going to feel losing such a close race.


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## Simspin (Sep 5, 2011)

My main worry with this is what will happen to SuperGran?


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## gycraig (Oct 5, 2008)

Have to wonder what's in this for the torys. They know it always leads to a spike in the yes camp when they go, then they go anyway


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

Frankie Boyle - 2014 - Scottish Independence [co&#8230;:


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

Kevin Bridges on Scottish Independence:


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

Jack Dee 'Live At The Referendum':


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

haven't read thread blah blah, misinformed this, bullsh1t that

I'll tell you the problem with Scotland - its full of Scots

Pikey c**ts

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

gotta admit i haven't really looked into the issues of this very much. does it not just boil down to whether or not north sea oil revenues outweigh the subsidy sctotland takes out of public expenditure? i can't see why they would even contemplate breaking away otherwise.

and has salmond actually explained why he is so confident scotland can keep using the pound if they split, the the government and bank of england are saying point blank they won't let them use the currency

i have heard him say they will definitely keep the pound but i haven't seen him pressed on why he is so confident they can yet


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

josephbloggs said:


> gotta admit i haven't really looked into the issues of this very much. does it not just boil down to whether or not north sea oil revenues outweigh the subsidy sctotland takes out of public expenditure? i can't see why they would even contemplate breaking away otherwise.
> 
> and has salmond actually explained why he is so confident scotland can keep using the pound if they split, the the government and bank of england are saying point blank they won't let them use the currency
> 
> i have heard him say they will definitely keep the pound but i haven't seen him pressed on why he is so confident they can yet


I don't follow it, probably should take a more active approach, but tbh my general opinion is that politicians generally could do with the addition of an extra hole in the forehead, 9mm in diameter :lol:

APPARENTLY there is nothing stopping the quid being used... and APPARENTLY more comes out of Scotland, than it gets back in any payments.

But I'll tell you what I know for sure. They all lie. So you can't trust any of it!


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## Tommy10 (Feb 17, 2009)

Yohan said:


> I do not want to see the UK split as we have done great things together and stood up to adversity and hardship. I feel at home be it Northern Ireland, Wales, Scotland or England. But if Scotland want to go their own way then I wish them the best and hope we can just move on and all be successful. Its just like a couple you know splitting up, there is no winners, just degrees of loosing.


I always feel like I'm in another country in Wales


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## gycraig (Oct 5, 2008)

rs007 said:


> I don't follow it, probably should take a more active approach, but tbh my general opinion is that politicians generally could do with the addition of an extra hole in the forehead, 9mm in diameter :lol:
> 
> APPARENTLY there is nothing stopping the quid being used... and APPARENTLY more comes out of Scotland, than it gets back in any payments.
> 
> But I'll tell you what I know for sure. They all lie. So you can't trust any of it!


they couldnt do that without the bonuses they have of being in europe


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

rs007 said:


> I don't follow it, probably should take a more active approach, but tbh my general opinion is that politicians generally could do with the addition of an extra hole in the forehead, 9mm in diameter :lol:
> 
> APPARENTLY there is nothing stopping the quid being used... and APPARENTLY more comes out of Scotland, than it gets back in any payments.
> 
> But I'll tell you what I know for sure. They all lie. So you can't trust any of it!


yeh agree you can't trust much of what comes out of any of their mouths that's for sure!

but this thing with the currency really baffles me. the pound is the UK's , so if scotland breaks away surely it would be down to the UK whether or not they will allow them to continue using it(?) the governor of the bank of england seems adamant they will not be able to use it.

maybe there is some legal clause or something that means you would have to be allowed to continue using it if you wanted, but if i was scottish and considering this, i would really like to know salmond's reasoning as to why he is so confident this will be the case.

and tbh if scotland does keep the pound as it's currency , your interest rates and monetary policy will still be set by the bank of england, which really won't make it that independent of the UK anyway.

i don't really know either way but the "yes" campaign's proposals and forecasts etc do seem a bit sketchy to me, but i haven't been paying that much attention tbh.


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## Fissure (Sep 14, 2014)

I'm voting no, but like I've said to so many 'yes' voters if they can give me some real good valid reasons for going independent

Then I would change my vote....but i have had nothing convincing.

Well up here, people who have 'No' banners are getting there property vandalised.

Can't seem to portray there view fairly...


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

jocksir said:


> Scotland represents just 8.3% of the UK population and this is what we contribute to the UK
> 
> We have the following share of UK resources -
> 
> ...


85% of the gingers


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## 12 gauge (Jul 16, 2011)

One word to vote YES


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Fissure said:


> I'm voting no, but like I've said to so many 'yes' voters if they can give me some real good valid reasons for going independent
> 
> Then I would change my vote....but i have had nothing convincing.
> 
> ...


Same is happening to yes voters. My neighbour had a yes sticker on his car 2 days later smashed windscreen and nails in 2 front tyres.its not just a minority of yes that are @rse holes it a minority of No as well. just lucky it is a minority either way. the sooner its over and the dust settles the better


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## Dezw (May 13, 2009)

If nothing else, it should be a good laugh whatever happens.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

Dezw said:


> If nothing else, it should be a good laugh whatever happens.


well my mate whose parents are scottish said he saw some politician from the no campaign saying something like sometimes politics can be hard to think about, but just think you and your family can have x amount more fish and chip dinners if you stay in the union. he said how patronising scottish people would take that as, said would have been much better if he had used bottles of buckfast instead. lol


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## gearchange (Mar 19, 2010)

It will be just like Mexico and America.

Except with sporons instead of sombreros


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## blanko (Jun 22, 2011)

Yohan said:


> I do not want to see the UK split as we have done great things together and stood up to adversity and hardship. I feel at home be it Northern Ireland, Wales, Scotland or England. But if Scotland want to go their own way then I wish them the best and hope we can just move on and all be successful. Its just like a couple you know splitting up, there is no winners, just degrees of loosing.


^^^This. I'm from N.Ireland and I'd be gutted to see Scotland leave. Even an independence vote here would be nowhere near as close as this Scottish vote seems to be!! That seems mad in itself!

I just think, we've done so much together, been one country for so long, why would you change it? Fought two world wars, defended the Falklands, hell, plenty of Scots died/risked their lives to defend my small part of the nation and I'm proud of that.

Seems to me, each region basically runs itself now anyway, what have you really got to gain from independence? and would you really be better off? You can still be proud to be Scottish, welsh etc and still be proud to be British... I don't pretend to know the facts but I can't believe anyone is in a better position if Scotland leaves.

Hey, we all hate the English, even the English hate the English, but thats no reason to leave on its own! :tongue:


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## vendettax (Jan 29, 2012)

blanko said:


> I just think, we've done so much together, been one country for so long, why would you change it? Fought two world wars, defended the Falklands, hell, plenty of Scots died/risked their lives to defend my small part of the nation and I'm proud of that.


You didn't do any of that personally firstly.

Secondly, most of the world fought two world wars.

Thirdly, the the falklands and Northern Ireland (bigots holding union jack flags from there are not British to me) is nothing to be proud of.

Lastly, if the English got rid of the UK we would then be free of all the bad press it seems only the English get for the bad deeds of the British Empire. We will then be able to start afresh and thrive as a nation without having the so called terrible history of the British Empire hanging over us. We can become more cultural too. It would be an exciting time for me personally, but then again I like change. I would like less Americanization, more people proud to be English, less multiculturalism etc etc. That doesn't mean I hate Scotland, Wales or Ireland. I'm sure they'll all be great partners just like the ROI is with the UK these days.

We also won't see any of the we all hate the English phrases you posted also since we will leave you even more to your own affairs. For you personally probably shooting innocent teenage Catholics in the back or whatever you heroes over there do defending the most bailed out part of Ireland.


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## dek (Nov 23, 2009)

12 gauge said:


> One word to vote YES


what crap the film was not even historically accurate I am voting the sums dont add up the yeSNP lie about everything and have divided this whole country


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Fissure said:


> I'm voting no, but like I've said to so many 'yes' voters if they can give me some real good valid reasons for going independent
> 
> Then I would change my vote....but i have had nothing convincing.
> 
> ...


I was a hardcore no voter. I believed, and still do, that its all going to fvck either way.

I changed to a yes for two IRREFUTABLE reasons that aren't based on shaky statistics or political lies, just black and white fact.

1. In future elections, the Scots get what they vote for. A population of only 5.5 (app) million is just simply outweighed by what England, particularly the South (due to pop density from London) vote for. Two completely different areas with their own economies essentially anyway. Thats my main reason - so Scotland is governed by what its people vote for, simple fact.

2. It will be hilarious watching it all go to fvck, and being able to say "told you so" - and also the usual source of blame for the retards up here - England - won't be able to be blamed. It will be all down to us, no one else to blame or whine about. :lol:

Thats it, IMO the only 2 reasons anyone needs to vote yes, and the only two that are not conjoured up politically, just simple fact


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## Edinburgh (Sep 2, 2012)

dek h said:


> what crap the film was not even historically accurate I am voting the sums dont add up the yeSNP lie about everything and have divided this whole country


Wouldn't surprise me if they play this film on ITV in Scotland on Wednesday or Thursday at some point,

Be glad when this circus referendum is all over! Too many 'YES' voters basing their vote on the 'Auld Enemy' theory, not all, but I can guarantee a sh!t load are


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## Fissure (Sep 14, 2014)

rs007 said:


> I was a hardcore no voter. I believed, and still do, that its all going to fvck either way.
> 
> I changed to a yes for two IRREFUTABLE reasons that aren't based on shaky statistics or political lies, just black and white fact.
> 
> ...


I do like that second point, just letting them get on with it.

Either way, if it goes tits up then like you said we can all say it was inevitable...

But if it miraculously pans out and works for Scotland then I'll hold my hand up and admit I was wrong

And we come away with a better Scotland.


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## Fortunatus (Apr 12, 2013)

Let them go at it alone why do we want them to stay so much anyway.

heard david beckham spoke out about it this morning, made me laugh as If that dry lunch knows anything just reading out a script handed to him


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## dann19900 (Dec 29, 2012)

jocksir said:


> Scotland represents just 8.3% of the UK population and this is what we contribute to the UK
> 
> We have the following share of UK resources -
> 
> ...


So England should bulldoze London and Birmingham and make 1 big farm with lots of solar panels and windmills


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

josephbloggs said:


> yeh agree you can't trust much of what comes out of any of their mouths that's for sure!
> 
> but this thing with the currency really baffles me. the pound is the UK's , so if scotland breaks away surely it would be down to the UK whether or not they will allow them to continue using it(?) the governor of the bank of england seems adamant they will not be able to use it.
> 
> ...


Scotland can use the pound and will use it but if for some reason they dont get a currency union then Scotland can and will walk away from all the UK's debt. This is not what Scotland want to do but they can.............


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

The basic reasons to vote YES

1) Scotland sends more money south than we get back and have done for last 33 years

2) Getting independence will allow the Scottish poeple to vote for who they want as government, SNP, Labour, Cons etc

3) We get to decide our own future, create our own future not Westminster


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

I went for a walk around Edinburgh on Sunday and seen yes posters everywhere, I walked into st Gilles cathedral on the royal mile and looked at the union jacks hanging from the walls, these flags were very, very old I would suggest 150-200 years old and were being held together by mesh due to their age and condition. I felt angry that my people would so willingly forget our past like that and wish to be out of the union.

I am a Scotsman 100% but I am also British 100% the yes campaign has attempted to call me not a real Scotsman for voting no. But let's look at who the REAL scots are here...my second name is a clan name and I can trace my roots back to the Picts and before to the kingdom of fye (now known as fife), my mothers maiden name hails from the largest clan in Scotland (MacDonald) all four of my grandparents are the same (Pringle, Brodie). All of my family has it's roots here from the very, very start and well before the union began by hundreds if not thousands of years. So it's fair to say I am Scottish through and through... How DARE they say I am not truly Scottish for voting no. All this from SALMOND and STURGEON both of which are ENGLISH names. And of course let's not forget about SWINNEY and his IRISH ancestors. How ****ing dare they call me not Scottish.

I love the union and NO one will tell me I am not Scottish or British.

No no no


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## braxbro (Aug 6, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> Same is happening to yes voters. My neighbour had a yes sticker on his car 2 days later smashed windscreen and nails in 2 front tyres.its not just a minority of yes that are @rse holes it a minority of No as well. just lucky it is a minority either way. the sooner its over and the dust settles the better


Thats what they all get ( both sides) for pushing their political opinion onto other people. Keep your political opinions to yourself and stop inflicting it on other people who are just going about their day normally.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

braxbro said:


> Thats what they all get ( both sides) for pushing their political opinion onto other people. Keep your political opinions to yourself and stop inflicting it on other people who are just going about their day normally.


I dont think a yes or no sticker on a car merits someone smashing it up though cos they felt like you were pushing your opinion on them while they were just trying to go about theyre day lol


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## braxbro (Aug 6, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> I dont think a yes or no sticker on a car merits someone smashing it up though cos they felt like you were pushing your opinion on them while they were just trying to go about theyre day lol


I don't think it warrants it either, but I can completely see why its being done. I am sick of hearing about it down here, imagine having this ****e in your face 24/7. I don't get why you would broadcast your opinion into someones face who isn't looking to hear it.


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## GGLynch89 (Mar 6, 2014)

MrM said:


> You might miss the oil money, energy security and port to launch your deep water nuclear subs from.


I was discussing this the other day, what will happen with 45 commando? Going to be a pretty big ball ache of a move isn't it :lol:


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

GGLynch89 said:


> I was discussing this the other day, what will happen with 45 commando? Going to be a pretty big ball ache of a move isn't it :lol:


Nothing compared to Trident!

It also raises the question what will happen to all Scots currently serving in HM Forces? Will they have the option to continue service or will they have to leave?


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## no-way (Oct 14, 2012)

amurphy said:


> Scotland can use the pound and will use it but if for some reason they dont get a currency union then Scotland can and will walk away from all the UK's debt. This is not what Scotland want to do but they can.............


They can but won't.

Why? Because if they default on day one of being an independant country they'll be in the **** for many years to come.

Extremely high interest rates on money loaned, no EU membership and no doubt a very high rate of inflation.

The UK won't be the bail out central bank for an independent country. That sounds pretty fair to me. Scotland will probably still use the pound though, like many countries use the dollar. It'll just not be a currency union.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

no-way said:


> They can but won't.
> 
> Why? Because if they default on day one of being an independant country they'll be in the **** for many years to come.
> 
> ...


Many reasons why but only time will tell what really will happen if we can or can't get a currency union...


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## GGLynch89 (Mar 6, 2014)

Ian_Montrose said:


> Nothing compared to Trident!
> 
> It also raises the question what will happen to all Scots currently serving in HM Forces? Will they have the option to continue service or will they have to leave?


I would imagine Plymouth and another near by dock would be the best option but still the move will come at a serious expense.

As for current serving Scots, I can see them being given the choice to stay or given a transfer option.


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## no-way (Oct 14, 2012)

amurphy said:


> Many reasons why but only time will tell what really will happen if we can or can't get a currency union...


It's going to be very interesting to see what actually happens if it's a Yes vote.

From my, English perspective, I'd back a Yes vote.

The rest of the UK will be just fine IMO, Scotland could either prosper, or have a very difficult decade or two.

What is certain though, you'll still have politicians leading the country, they'll still **** you over, you'll just be voting for them solely.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

no-way said:


> It's going to be very interesting to see what actually happens if it's a Yes vote.
> 
> From my, English perspective, I'd back a Yes vote.
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more but at least the politicians will be voted by the Scottish people. Currently we get what we are given as our population is much smaller than England.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

amurphy said:


> Scotland can use the pound and will use it but if for some reason they dont get a currency union then Scotland can and will walk away from all the UK's debt. This is not what Scotland want to do but they can.............


yes i have heard several times salmond say they WILL use the £, but i would like to know the reasons behind his confidence in this , as the government and the BofE are adamant that they can't.

Also, considering Scotland(as a whole) always takes out more in public spending than they they pay in tax, i don't think it would really bother the UK if they walk away from UK debt, as they generally just add to it anyway.


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## jocksir (Aug 8, 2012)

josephbloggs said:


> yes i have heard several times salmond say they WILL use the £, but i would like to know the reasons behind his confidence in this , as the government and the BofE are adamant that they can't.
> 
> Also, considering Scotland(as a whole) always takes out more in public spending than they they pay in tax, i don't think it would really bother the UK if they walk away from UK debt, as they generally just add to it anyway.


We pay more in taxes, since the 80's Scotland has contributed over 200 billion more in tax's this would not have been the case if we had simply matched what the rest of the UK was paying over the years, that's an average of £1350 more each year.

The £ also needs the security it gets from gas and oil assets which has essentally been under pinning the Strength of it for years.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

jocksir said:


> We pay more in taxes, since the 80's Scotland has contributed over 200 billion more in tax's this would not have been the case if we had simply matched what the rest of the UK was paying over the years, that's an average of £1350 more each year.
> 
> The £ also needs the security it gets from gas and oil assets which has essentally been under pinning the Strength of it for years.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16477990

"What about revenues? The same source shows Scottish total non-oil tax revenues coming in at £42.7bn in 2009-10, or £8,221 per head, which compares with total public expenditure attributable to Scotland of £59.2bn, or £11,370 per head.

Incidentally, these numbers include not just the so-called "identifiable" public spending that took place in Scotland, on schools, roads and the like, but also more amorphous parts of the budget like defense and debt interest.

*On this basis, Scotland 'got' £16.5bn more in UK public spending in 2009-10 than it contributed to total UK revenues *- or a 'subsidy' of around £3,150 per head."

in 2009-2010 scotland had a public expenditure shortfall of £16.5 billion and i'm sure from previous reading this is pretty typical every year.

this is what i was saying in my 1st post , it seems to all boil down to north sea oil revenue. whether or not north sea oil revenue out shoots the subsidy...and how long is north sea oil projected to last for etc


----------



## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

also does anyone actually know what will happen to north sea oil revenues should scotland gain independence? will scotland get all of it or will it be split between UK and scotland?


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

josephbloggs said:


> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16477990
> 
> "What about revenues? The same source shows Scottish total non-oil tax revenues coming in at £42.7bn in 2009-10, or £8,221 per head, which compares with total public expenditure attributable to Scotland of £59.2bn, or £11,370 per head.
> 
> ...


All from the BBC? Not even worth clicking the link


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

josephbloggs said:


> also does anyone actually know what will happen to north sea oil revenues should scotland gain independence? will scotland get all of it or will it be split between UK and scotland?


Im pretty sure the north sea oil revenue will all be Scotlands and not shared.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> All from the BBC? Not even worth clicking the link


the figures quoted by the BBC are from the scottish government

from the same link

"*Scottish Executive figures *for 2009-10 show that spending per capita in Scotland was £11,370, versus £10,320 for the UK. In other words, spending in Scotland was £1,030 - or 10% higher - per head of population than the UK average."


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

Dizzee! said:


> Im pretty sure the north sea oil revenue will all be Scotlands and not shared.


Except perhaps for those fields that were "stolen" when Blair moved the maritime boundaries just before devolution:

http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2012/01/scotlandengland-maritime-boundaries/

Aye, we can trust our elected representatives in Westminster!


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

josephbloggs said:


> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16477990
> 
> "What about revenues? The same source shows Scottish total non-oil tax revenues coming in at £42.7bn in 2009-10, or £8,221 per head, which compares with total public expenditure attributable to Scotland of £59.2bn, or £11,370 per head.
> 
> ...


 Here is a pre-agenda quote from the BBC website.

"In 2011-12, Scotland generated 9.9% of UK revenues with 8.4% of the population, while only receiving 9.3% of UK public spending back from the UK government. This demonstrates beyond any doubt that Scotland more than pays her way in the UK."

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-21684684


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

personally i would prefer if they do gain independence, because it will seriously weaken the chances of labour getting back into power in the UK and that has to be a good thing


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

I'm voting yes 

In 15 years we will be a lot better off and richer than england and won't have west minister dictate our spendings and budget.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

RS86 said:


> Here is a pre-agenda quote from the BBC website.
> 
> "In 2011-12, Scotland generated 9.9% of UK revenues with 8.4% of the population, while only receiving 9.3% of UK public spending back from the UK government. This demonstrates beyond any doubt that Scotland more than pays her way in the UK."
> 
> http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-21684684


that link you just put up says exactly the same thing, look this is from it

"Total Scottish public sector revenue (excluding North Sea income) was estimated at *£46.3bn *(8.2% of the total UK non-North Sea revenue.)

Including a per capita share of North Sea income, Scottish public sector revenue was estimated at £47.2bn (8.2% of the UK total public sector revenue.)

Including an geographical share of North Sea income, Scottish public sector revenue was estimated at *£56.9bn *(9.9% of UK total public sector revenue.)"

forget about what % of the population you make up and what % of public spending you take blah blah blah, because you have to remember that something like the top 1% of earners pay something like 40% of total taxes and the vast majority of those 1% live in the south of england.

the bottom line is AS A WHOLE scotland pays in 16 odd billion less in tax than it takes out in public spending. no matter how you dress it up that is the facts in black and white from scottish executive figures.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

josephbloggs said:


> personally i would prefer if they do gain independence, because it will seriously weaken the chances of labour getting back into power in the UK and that has to be a good thing


So if the Torries are going to be out and nobody votes labour or lib dems who does that leave for the rest of the UK?

UKIP

Monster Raving Looney Party lol

BNP

Im 99.9% voting Yes. I dont fancy any of they parties if we remain in the UK id take SNP over them anyday they have done ok up here up till now.

edit - I dont just mean I dont fancy those 3. I mean including Torries lib dem etc....


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Dizzee! said:


> All from the BBC? Not even worth clicking the link


Agreed anything from the BBC is biased to the NO campaign....


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Ian_Montrose said:


> Except perhaps for those fields that were "stolen" when Blair moved the maritime boundaries just before devolution:
> 
> http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2012/01/scotlandengland-maritime-boundaries/
> 
> Aye, we can trust our elected representatives in Westminster!


Is that the one Donald Dewar also played a part in?

Surely if this is true Scotland has grounds to get it back!


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

josephbloggs said:


> that link you just put up says exactly the same thing, look this is from it
> 
> "Total Scottish public sector revenue (excluding North Sea income) was estimated at *£46.3bn *(8.2% of the total UK non-North Sea revenue.)
> 
> ...


 You realise the bits you highlighted were both revenue, neither were expenditure and the % was a % contribution to UK revenue. The only mention of what we take back was the 9.6% which was lower than the 9.9% contributed in that period.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

apologies made a mistake with above post the second bolded fig was revenue with estimated north sea oil added.

the point i'm trying to make about the flaw in looking at % of population to % paid etc etc is it skews the real picture.

for instance from the same article you linked

"Including an geographical share of North Sea income, Scottish public sector revenue was estimated at *£56.9bn* (9.9% of UK total public sector revenue.)"

Total public sector spending for the benefit of Scotland by the Scottish and UK governments and other public sector areas was *£64.5bn,* or 9.3% of total UK public sector expenditure (including a per capita share of UK debt interest payments).

so you see going on the figs from your linked even with north sea estimates added in you still have 7.4 billion more in public spending than is being paid in tax revenue.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

josephbloggs said:


> also does anyone actually know what will happen to north sea oil revenues should scotland gain independence? will scotland get all of it or will it be split between UK and scotland?


Irrelevant

The US will invade us and take the lot, its what they do

:lol:


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

amurphy said:


> Is that the one Donald Dewar also played a part in?
> 
> Surely if this is true Scotland has grounds to get it back!


Yes and yes.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> So if the Torries are going to be out and nobody votes labour or lib dems who does that leave for the rest of the UK?
> 
> UKIP
> 
> ...


highly unlikely the tories will be out though if we lose the scottish electorate. i'm not a big tory fan but anything is better than letting the labour retards run the country into the ground again. ukip bnp etc are never really going to be serious contenders in a general election.


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

josephbloggs said:


> apologies made a mistake with above post the second bolded fig was revenue with estimated north sea oil added.
> 
> the point i'm trying to make about the flaw in looking at % of population to % paid etc etc is it skews the real picture.
> 
> ...


The whole of the UK has higher public spending than tax revenues, that's why the treasury reports a budget deficit every year. Scotland per capita is slightly worse than the overall UK average but we are not the ungrateful scroungers you seem to be implying we are. I'd also bet, if figures were available, there will be quite a few regions in the rest of the UK that are a bigger financial burden than Scotland.


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

josephbloggs said:


> apologies made a mistake with above post the second bolded fig was revenue with estimated north sea oil added.
> 
> the point i'm trying to make about the flaw in looking at % of population to % paid etc etc is it skews the real picture.
> 
> ...


 So an overspend of £7.4b. As opposed to the UK budget deficit over the same period of £126b? (I think they slightly undercut this target)

8.4% of the population - 8.4% of £126b would be £10.58b. So should we have overspent by more to keep more in line with the rest of the UK?


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

Ian_Montrose said:


> The whole of the UK has higher public spending than tax revenues, that's why the treasury reports a budget deficit every year. Scotland per capita is slightly worse than the overall UK average but we are not the ungrateful scroungers you seem to be implying we are. I'd also bet, if figures were available, there will be quite a few regions in the rest of the UK that are a bigger financial burden than Scotland.


mate i am not implying anything of the sort. i was just trying to point out facts. i just like breaking things down objectively, i know the whole of the north is subsdised, i wouldn't dream of calling them scroungers either. different circumstances , opportunities etc etc. so i'm not judging either way.


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

josephbloggs said:


> mate i am not implying anything of the sort. i was just trying to point out facts. i just like breaking things down objectively, i know the whole of the north is subsdised, i wouldn't dream of calling them scroungers either. different circumstances , opportunities etc etc. so i'm not judging either way.


Fair enough and sorry for making that assumption. It is a view that is commonly expressed, though I accept it is not yours.


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

josephbloggs said:


> mate i am not implying anything of the sort. i was just trying to point out facts. i just like breaking things down objectively, i know the whole of the north is subsdised, i wouldn't dream of calling them scroungers either. different circumstances , opportunities etc etc. so i'm not judging either way.


 It was a tongue-in-cheek comment lol. I wont lie, I have my doubts and concerns about independence. I am swaying towards Yes but I can't help but fear the uncertainty a little.


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

RS86 said:


> So an overspend of £7.4b. As opposed to the UK budget deficit over the same period of £126b? (I think they slightly undercut this target)
> 
> 8.4% of the population - 8.4% of £126b would be £10.58b. So should we have overspent by more to keep more in line with the rest of the UK?


i get entirely what you're saying ,but the majority of the UK is subsidised by the sout east anywa. if you gain independence you will lose that subsidy. and how long is north sea oil revenue predicted to last for? who knows maybe for whatever reason you will be better off ...i really don't know


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

RS86 said:


> It was a tongue-in-cheek comment lol. I wont lie, I have my doubts and concerns about independence. I am swaying towards Yes but I can't help but fear the uncertainty a little.


I'm swaying towards yes because I believe the political establishment of the UK is fundamentally corrupt and rotten to the core. Yes, there are a lot of economic uncertainties but surely we can't fail to create a far better democracy and fairer society than what we have currently. I wish we could do that for the UK as a whole but I'm not being given that option unfortunately.

Still 3 days to deliberate though before making a final decision.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Ian_Montrose said:


> Yes and yes.


Add the McCrone report to that. That was buried by Westminster prior to 79 referendum and shows how corrupt they are.

That's part of the reason I am voting yes, for change to get rid of these people


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

amurphy said:


> Agreed anything from the BBC is biased to the NO campaign....


To be fair being a no voter I have to agree with this. Shameful from the BBC


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

They talk about these 'Extra Powers' lol I think its fair to say everyone up here see's right through that that its 100% a lie considering they have never even told us what they are lol. I still think there will be a big twist from the No campaign last minute panic. They are going to have to do better than have David Beckham read a script this time though. desperation really.

If devomax was an option I would have thought harder about it but 100% YES from me. The Union is broken times have changed since back in the day people voting No because we fought wars together we stood up to adversity together. Thats never going to change, Its part of history. Move on!


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> They talk about these 'Extra Powers' lol I think its fair to say everyone up here see's right through that that its 100% a lie considering they have never even told us what they are lol. I still think there will be a big twist from the No campaign last minute panic. They are going to have to do better than have David Beckham read a script this time though. desperation really.
> 
> If devomax was an option I would have thought harder about it but 100% YES from me. The Union is broken times have changed since back in the day people voting No because we fought wars together we stood up to adversity together. Thats never going to change, Its part of history. Move on!


The only lies being told are by Mr Salmond and his crew. There will be no 'twist' just yet more people who are telling it as it is. You believe all these people and businesses are part of David Cameron's conspiracy lol com on you are sounding like desksitter. I wonder how mr Cameron managed to convince the likes of deuschebank, the pope, the EU, America. Australia, the banking and fianance centre, the oil industry, the fishing industry, the retail industry, the army, the whisky industry, even irn bru is against it. Cameron must be a magician to have got all these guys on board.

You also may not consider history important but many people do. Both my grandfathers and ancestors fought in the war. And I can 100% assure you I KNOW they believed in what they were fighting for and WHO for... They fought for US and The British empire.

No one will be telling me that after the sacrifices my family has made for me that I can't be proud to be British and Scottish. Even if there is a yes vote I won't be handing in my passport, I refuse to denounce my nationality to people I neither trust or like. I and many like me will be British wether you like it or not.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Dizzee! said:


> They talk about these 'Extra Powers' lol I think its fair to say everyone up here see's right through that that its 100% a lie considering they have never even told us what they are lol. I still think there will be a big twist from the No campaign last minute panic. They are going to have to do better than have David Beckham read a script this time though. desperation really.
> 
> If devomax was an option I would have thought harder about it but 100% YES from me. The Union is broken times have changed since back in the day people voting No because we fought wars together we stood up to adversity together. Thats never going to change, Its part of history. Move on!


The three big parties in London today proposed more powers for Scotland should we vote no, some hurried agreement. I haven't heard what they have proposed but it won't change my mind. I doubt we will know either.

David Cameron said that it has always been his plan to give more powers to Scotland, such a lie or he would have have had devomax on the ballot paper.

People of Scotland have seen right through it!


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> The only lies being told are by Mr Salmond and his crew. There will be no 'twist' just yet more people who are telling it as it is. You believe all these people and businesses are part of David Cameron's conspiracy lol com on you are sounding like desksitter. I wonder how mr Cameron managed to convince the likes of deuschebank, the pope, the EU, America. Australia, the banking and fianance centre, the oil industry, the fishing industry, the retail industry, the army, the whisky industry, even irn bru is against it. Cameron must be a magician to have got all these guys on board.
> 
> You also may not consider history important but many people do. Both my grandfathers and ancestors fought in the war. And I can 100% assure you I KNOW they believed in what they were fighting for and WHO for... They fought for US and The British empire.
> 
> No one will be telling me that after the sacrifices my family has made for me that I can't be proud to be British and Scottish. Even if there is a yes vote I won't be handing in my passport, I refuse to denounce my nationality to people I neither trust or like. I and many like me will be British wether you like it or not.


Read all that on the BBC did you? Strange you say the banking and finance centre yet RBS have already said Business as usual. Also Shell have came out recently saying they are going to invest billions in the north sea and no matter what the outcome on thursday it changes nothing.

i dont not consider it important I to believe we stood together for a great cause im not taking anything away from that all im saying is its THE PAST we need to think to the future here. I believe the future would be better in an independant Scotland

"Even if there is a yes vote I won't be handing in my passport, I refuse to denounce my nationality to people I neither trust or like. I and many like me will be British wether you like it or not" Bla bla bla Your begining to just sound like a typical Rangers fan type here. also good luck going on Holiday when your British passport expires and you have to get a scottish passport wether you like it or not :lol:


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Dizzee! said:


> They talk about these 'Extra Powers' lol I think its fair to say everyone up here see's right through that that its 100% a lie considering they have never even told us what they are lol. I still think there will be a big twist from the No campaign last minute panic. They are going to have to do better than have David Beckham read a script this time though. desperation really.
> 
> If devomax was an option I would have thought harder about it but 100% YES from me. The Union is broken times have changed since back in the day people voting No because we fought wars together we stood up to adversity together. Thats never going to change, Its part of history. Move on!


100% from me too, Yes, not shown much interest in it up to the last few days, but hearing what I have though I don't have a vote because i'm English I want a yes vote, I live in the northwest of England and see it as an opportunity for some real investment here, and if it is a no then more money will be invested up there, You already have £1200 more spend on you for NHS cost than the rest of the UK which is 6 billion annually, you will exist next week and so will we, I wish you all the best for the future, one big thing that has bothered me for a while is Scottish MP's voting on English maters that our Mp's don't up there, just that alone makes me feel we are better separate nations, some people in England are taking it personal, I am not.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

amurphy said:


> The three big parties in London today proposed more powers for Scotland should we vote no, some hurried agreement. I haven't heard what they have proposed but it won't change my mind. I doubt we will know either.
> 
> David Cameron said that it has always been his plan to give more powers to Scotland, such a lie or he would have have had devomax on the ballot paper.
> 
> People of Scotland have seen right through it!


Well apparently its Salmond that said no to devomax being on the ballot paper. He wanted it just to be yes or no.

Exactly tell us what you propose and lets see it in a legally bound document of some sort and not just hope they are telling the truth.


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Why do you hope they are telling the truth?? you sound like a yes vote, it doesn't matter does it? or don't you really think it will go through???!


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

freddee said:


> 100% from me too, Yes, not shown much interest in it up to the last few days, but hearing what I have though I don't have a vote because i'm English I want a yes vote, I live in the northwest of England and see it as an opportunity for some real investment here, and if it is a no then more money will be invested up there, You already have £1200 more spend on you for NHS cost than the rest of the UK which is 6 billion annually, you will exist next week and so will we, I wish you all the best for the future, one big thing that has bothered me for a while is Scottish MP's voting on English maters that our Mp's don't up there, just that alone makes me feel we are better separate nations, some people in England are taking it personal, I am not.


Yeah heard so much bullsh!t about it being because we hate the English I guess maybe a small minority of braindead ****s are making it about that but the large majority dont and just think its best for Scotland to seperate. I work with Englishmen and have friends down south also. They havent taken it personal and we have actually been having some good laughs about it all.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

freddee said:


> Why do you hope they are telling the truth?? you sound like a yes vote, it doesn't matter does it? or don't you really think it will go through???!


I am a Yes voter at the moment but i had said from the start If devo max was an option I think i would have went for that.


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

I spent a few years in Scotland and believe me until you have been an English person in Scotland you could not conceive the endemic dislike, hatred in some, I was once in conversation, with some fella's, who were blaming me for your civil war, i'm not that old, the thing was, they were arguing with me but not with another guy from Bolton, I am an Anglo Saxon, I know where my family come from, the name, it is in the doomsday book, no body 400 years ago and more knew anything that was happening in Scotland, but the main difference was between me and the lad from Bolton was he was black, and with that they took his nationality away from him, a lot of your voters will come from this bigoted ilk.


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Dizzee! said:


> I am a Yes voter at the moment but i had said from the start If devo max was an option I think i would have went for that.


I hope it is not on the table.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Read all that on the BBC did you? Strange you say the banking and finance centre yet RBS have already said Business as usual. Also Shell have came out recently saying they are going to invest billions in the north sea and no matter what the outcome on thursday it changes nothing.
> 
> Lol read my earlier post that criticises the BBC for being no biased...
> 
> ...


lol at typical rangers fan...even the pope (yes the pope) agrees that independence is a bad move. And for your info if yes wins I would consider moving to England anyway. I am a high earner and skilled worker and many just like me are saying the same. I already work in England but I live in Scotland and I am Scottish. I fly to my office each week and enjoy the benefits of being British.

Lol what you probably don't realise is that for someone like me if yes was to win I would gain financially, i would be far better off than I am now. I would still be paying UK treasury my tax (cause my job is there and I am paid in UK pound) so would benefit from the stronger pound AND lower taxes (as independent Scotland will raise them) AND higher salary that UK affords (think about the wage divide only bigger)

So all in all I would personally gain thousands more each year... But I will be voting NO. Why? Because I recognise that my personal situation is not entirely of my own doing it is because I am British that these opportunities has been presented to me. Opportunities that in an independent Scotland I would never have had. Opportunities that you have and both our kids would have if we remain in the union.

So what should I do? Take a selfish pay rise of thousands each year or provide my kids and others with the same opportunities as I have had?

No no no

EDIT: using the same or similar pseudo science that SNP have used in their calculation I estimate I would be between 20-30 thousand a year better off if a yes vote wins.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Or look at it this way... If the union did not exist we would not have UK muscle. You would be currently logged onto Scottish muscle. And believe me that site would have about 20 active members and not a fraction of the knowledge and experience found on here. Don't believe me? Well a Scottish muscle forum existed a few years back called ripped glutes, it was a good wee site and members such as td and weeman started on there. They and others quickly realised the opportunity of joining something bigger and better and then joined the likes of UK muscle. Ripped flutes is now closed btw... Due to lack of members, posts and knowledge.

Is that what you REALLY want? Or do you believe I am also part of David Cameron's conspiracy? You say Westminster has promised nothing, yet they have all signed up to Devo max. What has snp promised in real terms that is not at best a gamble?


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Or look at it this way... If the union did not exist we would not have UK muscle. You would be currently logged onto Scottish muscle. And believe me that site would have about 20 active members and not a fraction of the knowledge and experience found on here. Don't believe me? Well a Scottish muscle forum existed a few years back called ripped glutes, it was a good wee site and members such as td and weeman started on there. They and others quickly realised the opportunity of joining something bigger and better and then joined the likes of UK muscle. Ripped flutes is now closed btw... Due to lack of members, posts and knowledge.
> 
> Is that what you REALLY want? Or do you believe I am also part of David Cameron's conspiracy? You say Westminster has promised nothing, yet they have all signed up to Devo max. What has snp promised in real terms that is not at best a gamble?


Being honest this is pointless. You listen to Cameron and the pope and say Salmond is a liar. I Say Cameron is a liar so its going nowhere.

Comparing it to UKM is a bit silly though lol


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

Who cares?? The yes votes will win... Scotland will become independent and **** everything up and then the EU will have to bail them out. Its all fvcking pointless. Nothing will change for the average joe on the street. The only people than benefit from **** like this is the fat cats and politicians.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Being honest this is pointless. You listen to Cameron and the pope and say Salmond is a liar. I Say Cameron is a liar so its going nowhere.
> 
> Comparing it to UKM is a bit silly though lol


It's not Cameron and the pope though is it? It them and Obama nearly every other

Major economy including g8 countries, most of the commonwealth. It's the financial sector, the oil industry, the retail industry, all the religions, pretty much all the FTSE 100 companies, the fishing authorities, the army, half of Scotland, most of the uk and countless other millions from around the globe. But hey ho Alex salmons and you clearly know more than all of them and us.and the question I need to ask is WHY? Why are you voting for nothing more than a promise of rainbows and fairies? SNP has nothing concrete, just a statement here and there promising everything will be better with no substance behind it.

In comparing UK muscle to the referendum was a bit of fun I agree but really it's not that far from the truth if you think about it. But you won't because you can see past the messiah salmond and HIS lies. It amazes me that you believe everyone else is lying except him.

The ONLY truth in all of this is that it is a HUGE gamble. Neither the yes or no camp can or will say this but the truth is that Scotland could either prosper or collapse. That is the ONLY truth mate. Now we all like a wee flutter but only a fool would gamble his house, family, job and health on a 50/50 bet. Why are you gambling?


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

Delhi said:


> Or look at it this way... If the union did not exist we would not have UK muscle. You would be currently logged onto Scottish muscle


 Most of the members also post on other forums ie Tmuscle. Pretty sure an independent Scotland would have global internet access still and not be confined to our own Scottish internet.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

RS86 said:


> Most of the members also post on other forums ie Tmuscle. Pretty sure an independent Scotland would have global internet access still and not be confined to our own Scottish internet.[/quote
> 
> Lol I don't want to start on this but how many Scottish muscle sites are there? How active are they? How much information, knowledge and experience is on them. You are missing the point here mate completely. Wish people would think before they post...
> 
> I think we can all agree that one thing Alex salmond has done is split this country and Scottish people down the line. An achievement the English never managed to do...


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> It's not Cameron and the pope though is it? It them and Obama nearly every other
> 
> Major economy including g8 countries, most of the commonwealth. It's the financial sector, the oil industry, the retail industry, all the religions, pretty much all the FTSE 100 companies, the fishing authorities, the army, half of Scotland, most of the uk and countless other millions from around the globe. But hey ho Alex salmons and you clearly know more than all of them and us.and the question I need to ask is WHY? Why are you voting for nothing more than a promise of rainbows and fairies? SNP has nothing concrete, just a statement here and there promising everything will be better with no substance behind it.
> 
> ...


For every BP theres a Shell whos investing billions in the north sea for every Asda thats saying prices are going up theres a tesco /morrisons/aldi/sainsbury who have said they wont.Of course Obama etc are going to speak negativley on it. If it happens, Trident will be removed and that causes a big problem for America. What exactly has Salmond lied about? and by the way your also voting No on a promise of rainbows and fairies. If there were significant powers being devolved to Scotland they would have revealed them prior to the vote.

Nobody has said taxes will rise and the financial times has stated Scotland will be financially better off on day 1 of independance


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Some scot on the news today said he didn't know but since he heard Salmond tell him the facts?!! I wonder if Salmond could give me tonights euro Lotto numbers now, nobody can predict what is going to happen, all I know is business does not like uncertainty but I am sure compromise will happen, on the energy thing, who are you going to sell it to, deep water ports, there are other places, security??? more jobs in England, please vote yes!!


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## 31205 (Jan 16, 2013)

I don't have a clue what Scotland/England will gain/lose. Surely they can't be any worse off than they are already? The UK is ****.


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## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

Delhi said:


> You are missing the point here mate completely. Wish people would think before they post.


 Wtf are you talking about. I did think before I posted, I got the point you were trying to make but I commented because it was a very sh!t example.

OK perhaps the name UK Muscle wouldn't be applicable or would be different but just because it is 'UK' muscle doesn't mean there aren't members from outside the UK (some of the most knowledgeable of whom are not from the UK). Scotland being independent doesn't mean Scots being isolated.


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## gycraig (Oct 5, 2008)

RS86 said:


> Wtf are you talking about. I did think before I posted, I got the point you were trying to make but I commented because it was a very sh!t example.
> 
> OK perhaps the name UK Muscle wouldn't be applicable or would be different but just because it is 'UK' muscle doesn't mean there aren't members from outside the UK (some of the most knowledgeable of whom are not from the UK). Scotland being independent doesn't mean Scots being isolated.


of course it does they will have to pick there england or scotland.


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## 2scoops (Mar 17, 2012)

Too be honest I think everyone has missed the key point. If the yes vote is successful will all Scottish members of this board have to leave, as it is clearly called UK - Muscle??


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

RS86 said:


> Wtf are you talking about. I did think before I posted, I got the point you were trying to make but I commented because it was a very sh!t example.
> 
> OK perhaps the name UK Muscle wouldn't be applicable or would be different but just because it is 'UK' muscle doesn't mean there aren't members from outside the UK (some of the most knowledgeable of whom are not from the UK). Scotland being independent doesn't mean Scots being isolated.


Oh for heavens sake. Right Show me Scottish muscle sites...there are none. Why cause everyone is here (or TN etc) why? Cause they are better sites with more members, posts, information and experience.

Why are we all here and why is this relevant to politics? Cause TOGETHER WE MAKE THE BOARD BETTER. Now are you getting my point? Probably not you still think it's about network and internet access lol.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

freddee said:


> Some scot on the news today said he didn't know but since he heard Salmond tell him the facts?!! I wonder if Salmond could give me tonights euro Lotto numbers now, nobody can predict what is going to happen, all I know is business does not like uncertainty but I am sure compromise will happen, on the energy thing, who are you going to sell it to, deep water ports, there are other places, security??? more jobs in England, please vote yes!!


Great post and what these mob don't seem to see. My previous employer whom I still have very close ties with have ALREADY started to recruit over 200 jobs that are currently based in Scotland. They are recruiting right now in Newcastle. This employer has over 5000 on the books here in Scotland, they have made a "no comment" about the vote. Which these idiots seem to think is an endorsement of a yes. The 200 is due to contingency and potential crisis if yes win the vote. That's 200 jobs gone already before the vote has even been counted. 200 lost jobs in Scotland. I will name the employer post vote if yes win. These are the FACTS that none of the idiots want to hear.

They will be on in ainute telling us about the 1000 million jobs salmond will create once he gets power.

He lied about NHS, lied about economy, lied about jobs and lied about pensions. Infact he has lied about everything he has said...why? Because he does NOT know (no one does) the impact of independence. If he is promising all these things without fact or figures to back it up that makes him at best a story teller and realistically a liar. Lethe yes voters will not see it though, they pretend it's not true. I challenge them to tell me how he will ensure not a single job will be lost. Prove it, show me the case. If they did this I would vote yes. But they can't cause it's all a fairy tale lie.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Great post and what these mob don't seem to see. My previous employer whom I still have very close ties with have ALREADY started to recruit over 200 jobs that are currently based in Scotland. They are recruiting right now in Newcastle. This employer has over 5000 on the books here in Scotland, they have made a "no comment" about the vote. Which these idiots seem to think is an endorsement of a yes. The 200 is due to contingency and potential crisis if yes win the vote. That's 200 jobs gone already before the vote has even been counted. 200 lost jobs in Scotland. I will name the employer post vote if yes win. These are the FACTS that none of the idiots want to hear.
> 
> They will be on in ainute telling us about the 1000 million jobs salmond will create once he gets power.
> 
> He lied about NHS, lied about economy, lied about jobs and lied about pensions. Infact he has lied about everything he has said...why? Because he does NOT know (no one does) the impact of independence. If he is promising all these things without fact or figures to back it up that makes him at best a story teller and realistically a liar. Lethe yes voters will not see it though, they pretend it's not true. I challenge them to tell me how he will ensure not a single job will be lost. Prove it, show me the case. If they did this I would vote yes. But they can't cause it's all a fairy tale lie.


exactly how did he lie about jobs and pensions? It was the No side who were caught trying to make it appear the banks would move jobs down south and they themselves dispelled that lie. As far as pensions at the moment Scotland's are more affordable than the rest of the UK's, it's further down the line we'll have a bigger gap if we don't increase the workforce, this has been openly spoken about throughout the Yes campaign. As far as the health 2-3% of Scotland NHS contracts went to private firms, which is 2-3% too many, but it was 70% down south so lets put it in perspective. Plus the ScotGov is dealing with over 7% of cuts passed from Westminster since the 2010 election, they're not doing too badly.


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## Tommy10 (Feb 17, 2009)

And it continues ........England now want their own parliament regardless of the result , only fair as Scotland and wales already have theirs,

The English want only English to rule on matters that only affect England ....fair play I say .


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Tommy10 said:


> And it continues ........England now want their own parliament regardless of the result , only fair as Scotland and wales already have theirs,
> 
> The English want only English to rule on matters that only affect England ....fair play I say .


It pretty much is an English parliment anyway lol Scottish MP's shouldnt be able to vote on certain issues though I agree


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Well it will finally be all over soon, and one way or other, well at first at least nothing much will change, but if it is a strong no vote I think a lot of damage will have been done, and if it is a yes then I hope it works out for us all because In a coupke of years time I don't want to hear that its all getting back together...


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Look everyone is mud slinging over nonsense they themselves cannot prove or disprove, just "you can't believe X because he lies" "NO!!! you can't believe Y because he lies!!" "those voting yes are believing in fairytales" and so on

THose are all very vague and elastic arguments that can never be won

Who gives a **** about what the pope thinks lol, is he an expert on the topic now :lol:

As already stated, I'm voting yes for 2 reasons, and 2 only - both IRREFUTABLE and not subject to any lying scum politician - on either side.

1. If independent, when the Scots vote, they will get what the majority of their people vote for. Not be vastly outnumbered by the far great number South of the border.

2. If/when it all goes to hell in a hand basket, the retards up here who blame the English for everything, will no longer be able to do so. Its all on us.

Thats it. And that should be enough.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

rs007 said:


> Look everyone is mud slinging over nonsense they themselves cannot prove or disprove, just "you can't believe X because he lies" "NO!!! you can't believe Y because he lies!!" "those voting yes are believing in fairytales" and so on
> 
> THose are all very vague and elastic arguments that can never be won
> 
> ...


Away with you and your voice of reason!


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## big vin (Apr 18, 2010)

Its obviously going to end up with majority of NO vote, the bookies are giving odds of 4-1 of it being a yes vote they would not be offering you those odds if it was going to end up a YES vote .If you think its going to be a YES majoriy get you money on @ 4-1 but it wont happens bookies rarely get it wrong


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

Will Scottish bb's still be able to compete at the Brits?


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

mal said:


> Will Scottish bb's still be able to compete at the Brits?


There has actually been some discussion about that, whether we will be able to be part of the UKBFF

No great loss if not, we only have one show up here, and the promotor for it is a superb, he'll make something else work if it comes to it.


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## Edinburgh (Sep 2, 2012)

This will be auld Eck in the early hours of Saturday morning strolling down Leith Walk after the NO result


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## MisterMuscle (Mar 24, 2014)

If we're such a drain, why is every numerate Englishman trying so hard to keep us?

Ever consider maybe they know something they're not telling you?


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## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

if i was scottish, i would rather put up with the tools in london telling me what to do that the even bigger tools in brussels.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

rs007 said:


> There has actually been some discussion about that, whether we will be able to be part of the UKBFF
> 
> No great loss if not, we only have one show up here, and the promotor for it is a superb, he'll make something else work if it comes to it.


 are you still lifting (brother of Scotland) and how is weeman?


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

rs007 said:


> Look everyone is mud slinging over nonsense they themselves cannot prove or disprove, just "you can't believe X because he lies" "NO!!! you can't believe Y because he lies!!" "those voting yes are believing in fairytales" and so on
> 
> THose are all very vague and elastic arguments that can never be won
> 
> ...


Only one thing is true about yes campaign and that is independence will allow the people of Scotland more influence in who the vote to power. That's it nothing else... Your second point may have some merit but is in large not true. I don't blame the English for my woes but then again I don't support socialism (which is what SNP are). I don't think the state owes me anything. And I also hate the idea of paying more tax to support more people up here to sit on their erse drinking buckie. Almost every socialist government in power anywhere in the world spends more that it can afford, so taxes go up. Infact it's one of the few things we know about SNP post independence...they are going to incease public borrowing. Lol even before they get to power their only real commitment has been to increase our debt.

No vote is best for jobs, nhs, pensions, investment, security and future. You might not care to much about that mate but I do.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

mal said:


> are you still lifting (brother of Scotland) and how is weeman?


Hey buddy - yeah been training regular - although with no real intensity - since the start of the year. Just training to stop my body siezing up worse basically :lol:

Been dieting on tinned "foodbank" grub past 10 weeks to raise money for The Trussell Trust, made more progress eating tins of beans than most muppets make with all the fancy supps/drugs (I'm assistance free for now, have been for quite a while)

Journal is on TM, will be starting a new one once diet experiment is finished, here too.

What about yourself?


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Delhi said:


> Only one thing is true about yes campaign and that is independence will allow the people of Scotland more influence in who the vote to power. That's it nothing else... Your second point may have some merit but is in large not true. I don't blame the English for my woes but then again I don't support socialism (which is what SNP are). I don't think the state owes me anything. And I also hate the idea of paying more tax to support more people up here to sit on their erse drinking buckie. Almost every socialist government in power anywhere in the world spends more that it can afford, so taxes go up. Infact it's one of the few things we know about SNP post independence...they are going to incease public borrowing. Lol even before they get to power their only real commitment has been to increase our debt.
> 
> *No vote is best for jobs, nhs, pensions, investment, security and future. You might not care to much about that mate but I do.*


Del, you don't know any of that for sure, so don't turn this into a you don't / I don't care argument - thats pretty **** poor :lol:

Del we know each other - not real well - but well enough to know that neither of us are idiots.

But I will not trust the camps on either side, because they are all full of ****, that is fact.

So, I'll revert to the irrefutable - as you agree - Scotland will have more control over who governs it.

Which renders the SNP negatives you mention completely null, if they **** it up, they will be ejected unceremoniously 

As for patriotism - if anyone is accusing you of being "un Scottish" for voting no, tell them to **** off.

Like all political arguments, you can bend that either way with never a concrete answer to be had.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

MisterMuscle said:


> If we're such a drain, why is every numerate Englishman trying so hard to keep us?
> 
> Ever consider maybe they know something they're not telling you?


Ever consider that there is no conspiracy and that YES they know the rest of the UK will lose out ALSO if Scotland go independent. England, Wales and NI have much to lose also depending on the vote tomorrow but that's not because Scotland is supporting them all. It's because the UK will lose more power and influence in the world. Imagine if Germany decided they wanted to leave the Euro or New York decided they no longer wanted to be part of the states.

Breaking up a union impacts everyone in it, no conspiracy, nothing sinister just plain old simple explanation. That's why the other parties are clamouring to keep Britain United. I am through with this debate TBH let's just see what happens tomorrow. As I said in either case I will be fine.


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

rs007 said:


> Del, you don't know any of that for sure, so don't turn this into a you don't / I don't care argument - thats pretty **** poor :lol:
> 
> Del we know each other - not real well - but well enough to know that neither of us are idiots.
> 
> ...


Fair play Ramsey, I know you ain't dumb and yeah you are right the ONLY truth in all of this is no one really knows. I said it my previous posts. But for me, we have done reasonably ok as a country within the UK and there at least is facts to back that up (unemployment is lower here than London for example). Why gamble is my point.

Hope a is well mate and I am not being militant, just having healthy debate


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## BigFelch (Jul 12, 2012)

rs007 said:


> Del, you don't know any of that for sure, so don't turn this into a you don't / I don't care argument - thats pretty **** poor :lol:
> 
> Del we know each other - not real well - but well enough to know that neither of us are idiots.
> 
> ...


what made you change your mind? http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/general-conversation/164252-should-scotland-remain-part-britain-5.html

Not a dig just generally interested.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

BigFelch said:


> what made you change your mind? http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/general-conversation/164252-should-scotland-remain-part-britain-5.html
> 
> Not a dig just generally interested.


That all still stands - actually up until relatively recently I was a no.

In a perfect world I would still rather fight for a monarch, than politicians - and on a side note, would still stand with England united if there was ever any conflict that merited it.

My no got switched out after witnessing months of bull**** tit-for tatting between the no or yes camps. Both talking sh1t about stuff they simply cannot know. All conjecture, all choosing only to see what they want to see, to try and convince us they are right.

The only fact, is the one I've stated above, its concrete, and cannot be refuted - so I've went for that.

If Scotland gets independence, it becomes better for the Scots with respect to getting the government THEY vote for.

Thats it.

That post you quoted, I actually still do believe in. I don't think this little lump of rock should be chopped up in principal - and we SHOULD all stick together - in principal

But the reality is, it is politicians that run this, and it will never work - and has went to far to be dragged back. We aren't Great Britain anymore - haven't been for a long time. Too much sleaze, rot and corruption.

So, at least if Scotland can govern itself, we get the sleaze, rot, and corruption WE vote for :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

rs007 said:


> Hey buddy - yeah been training regular - although with no real intensity - since the start of the year. Just training to stop my body siezing up worse basically :lol:
> 
> Been dieting on tinned "foodbank" grub past 10 weeks to raise money for The Trussell Trust, made more progress eating tins of beans than most muppets make with all the fancy supps/drugs (I'm assistance free for now, have been for quite a while)
> 
> ...


still plodding along,I'm experimenting a diet atm as well lol involves not much

Food and being extremely hot and sweaty at times lol.


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## MisterMuscle (Mar 24, 2014)

Delhi said:


> Ever consider that there is no conspiracy and that YES they know the rest of the UK will lose out ALSO if Scotland go independent. England, Wales and NI have much to lose also depending on the vote tomorrow but that's not because Scotland is supporting them all. It's because the UK will lose more power and influence in the world. Imagine if Germany decided they wanted to leave the Euro or New York decided they no longer wanted to be part of the states.
> 
> Breaking up a union impacts everyone in it, no conspiracy, nothing sinister just plain old simple explanation. That's why the other parties are clamouring to keep Britain United. I am through with this debate TBH let's just see what happens tomorrow. As I said in either case I will be fine.


I don't agree with the first part, but he second bit, definitely. I just want the vote over and for it to go away. For at least 10 years anyway.


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

MisterMuscle said:


> If we're such a drain, why is every numerate Englishman trying so hard to keep us?
> 
> Ever consider maybe they know something they're not telling you?


It is history, no politician wants to be linked with the break up of the union, I am numerate, what the rich want is a million miles from what your average joe wants, in my opinion it might just bring more prosperity to the North west, and Scotland will still blame the English if it goes pear shaped, a no vote would just mean they kiss your @rse even more at the cost to us, so please go.


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## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

Well, it's a no

How about England have a vote to see if we want to keep you winging bunch of alcoholics living off us?


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## Fissure (Sep 14, 2014)

megatron said:


> Well, it's a no
> 
> How about England have a vote to see if we want to keep you winging bunch of alcoholics living off us?


Hold on a minute, we ain't all alcoholics... I only drink on non training days and every second training day :lol:


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## MrSilver (Aug 4, 2014)

Well that was all a big anti climax.


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## IGotTekkers (Jun 6, 2012)

Can we vote for England to be independent of parliament?


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## PD89 (Mar 27, 2014)

IGotTekkers said:


> Can we vote for England to be independent of parliament?


No.. You can either vote for one wnaker... Or another wnaker who went to the same school.


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

IGotTekkers said:


> Can we vote for England to be independent of parliament?


The pundits are suggesting that is what could pretty much happen as a result of this. Scotland have been promised greater devolution. Cameron has stated clearly this morning that promise will be kept but also that greater devolution to rest of UK as well and addressing the issue of non-English MPs voting on English-only issues.

The winds of change are starting to blow. Maybe we might actually see real constitutional change and a rebirth of democracy in the UK.


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

Pity really - it would have ben a really cheap way to have taken a whinging missus 'abroad'!


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## Edinburgh (Sep 2, 2012)

silverzx said:


> Well that was all a big anti climax.


Really? lol Facebook is very quiet this morning from the folk that were constantly trying to shove a Yes vote to every cvnt

Alex Salmond is probably having a cheer up w*nk right now whilst watching Braveheart

Here is the map result for the whole of Scotland;


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

So happy with the result. I never wanted to lose my citizenship. I must admit I was up all last night waiting on the result and I was nervous. But as more and more came in I started to feel more and more confident.

A couple of points for me...

A substantial proportion of Scottish people want change, Westminster need to deliver it or I don't think people would volte no again (me included).

Reporters got it wrong all night in their analysis- trying to compare and correlate results to general election voting and history. This was never about party politics, the people of Scotland knew what was at stake, I heard one reporter say she was shocked at Falkirk voting no because of the battle of Falkirk lol. Comments like that are silly at best.

Anyone up here knows the real debate came down to 3 things-

Money

Jobs

Unionist or republican (or presbyterian vs catholic for people that don't get it)

Where there was no money, high unemployment and a strong anti union movement we saw more yes votes. The UK government need to recognise that.

Today I am a proud scot and an even prouder Brit. Last week I was on the royal mile in Edinburgh getting measured up for a kilt in my family name and was chatting to the kilt maker. He informed me that my family were supporters of the union 300 years ago (against lots of protest) and I felt pride in the knowledge that my ancestors made the right choice (no one could argue that in hindsight) and that I was personally going to be in a position repeat it.

And a final wee joke just for fun that I heard two nights before the vote:

The yes voters were gathering late last night in and around George square, drinking and celebrating a historic victory. Meanwhile the no voters were getting ready for bed...they had work in the morning. 

Seriously though I am a scot and government now needs to do something to create opportunity up here.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Edinburgh said:


> Really? lol Facebook is very quiet this morning from the folk that were constantly trying to shove a Yes vote to every cvnt
> 
> Alex Salmond is probably having a cheer up w*nk right now whilst watching Braveheart
> 
> ...


Yeah nobody was trying to ram a no vote to anyone on facebook the whole time right enough.


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## IGotTekkers (Jun 6, 2012)

Ian_Montrose said:


> The pundits are suggesting that is what could pretty much happen as a result of this. Scotland have been promised greater devolution. Cameron has stated clearly this morning that promise will be kept but also that greater devolution to rest of UK as well and addressing the issue of non-English MPs voting on English-only issues.
> 
> The winds of change are starting to blow. Maybe we might actually see real constitutional change and a rebirth of democracy in the UK.


Lol a change by name but not by nature. Still won't make any fecking difference to anything though.


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

I'm still torn as what I think would have been best for the rest of the UK.

I always though that the yes camps main argument was an emotional one... but I think it was probably an equal factor for the no camp too.

All along I wanted a no vote, but was also concious that devolution of power would be a good thing.

What we got was a no with seemingly more devolution, so I should be happy.

But waking up to the no, the reality dawned that it does cost more per head to run Scotland (I suppose that's inevitable with less dense population), they do get free university, free prescriptions etc. This is nothing I begrudge when I actually engage the brain, but now I'm thinking decisions like that would better be made by an independent country... then you live by the sword you die by the sword.

The main thing that's come out of though is it shows the level of interest (for and against) when political reform is an option.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

2004mark said:


> I'm still torn as what I think would have been best for the rest of the UK.
> 
> I always though that the yes camps main argument was an emotional one... but I think it was probably an equal factor for the no camp too.
> 
> ...


I wonder if the rest of the UK had a vote to keep Scotland or bin us how it would result. Im guessing they would dump us high and dry.

Yet we cling on to the union so badly


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## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

Dizzee! said:


> I wonder if the rest of the UK had a vote to keep Scotland or bin us how it would result. Im guessing they would dump us high and dry.
> 
> Yet we cling on to the union so badly


not a single person i know wanted scotland out of the uk so i really dont think youd be dumped. the dislike between the scots and the english is one sided.


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## AlexB18 (Dec 10, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> I wonder if the rest of the UK had a vote to keep Scotland or bin us how it would result. Im guessing they would dump us high and dry.
> 
> Yet we cling on to the union so badly


I don't necessarily think we would have left you high and dry tbh majority of people I know including myself wanted Scotland to remain as part of the UK, from a political viewpoint I think you staying in the UK benefits us more than you though however, that's if im correct in saying you really do have a **** load of untapped oil that is yours but im not sure if that is indeed true. If it is you could easily be self sufficient off it imo


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## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> I wonder if the rest of the UK had a vote to keep Scotland or bin us how it would result. Im guessing they would dump us high and dry.
> 
> Yet we cling on to the union so badly


Drop the anti English nonsense. Face it the English don't hate you as much as you would love them to. I don't know anyone from England who would have dumped us. I work in England and can assure you they would have voted to keep us. To paraphrase your own quote to me yesterday...you sound like a typical Celtic supporter


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> I wonder if the rest of the UK had a vote to keep Scotland or bin us how it would result. Im guessing they would dump us high and dry.
> 
> Yet we cling on to the union so badly


I agree with @a.notherguy Don't think I've spoke to one person who wanted a yes vote.


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Edinburgh said:


> Really? lol Facebook is very quiet this morning from the folk that were constantly trying to shove a Yes vote to every cvnt
> 
> Alex Salmond is probably having a cheer up w*nk right now whilst watching Braveheart
> 
> ...


The map - like many things in this whole campaign (both sides) is misleading.

It was total 45% yes 55% no - so much closer than that map leads casual observers to believe - because its just done by area. If a side gets a majority in an area, by even just 1 vote - the whole area gets allocated to that side... my own area - North Ayrshire - is a perfect example. It was pretty near 50:50 - but just tipped into No. Its a fairly sizeable area, yet being almost 50:50, gets coloured in No on the map.

I'm proud of my fellow scots - on the yes side, the no side, and even those who made a point of purposely spoiling their papers as a protest.

Record levels of turnout, I've never seen this turnout in ANY election in my lifetime, and I suspect for a couple of decades prior. Something like 84% of the electorate turned out.

There is a bit of slating of the No voters just now and I vehemently disagree with that. They voted for what THEY believed was best for Scotland, just like the Yes voters. I mean it isn't as if anyone voted because they thought it would make things worse!!

Great engagement, in a time of political disillusionment, I'm proud to be Scottish today!


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## Fortis (Oct 20, 2012)

gutted they didn't leave tbh, would have been funny to see them crying to join back(I know they cant before the trolls come...)


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

RE the hate for the English - it is perpetuated by a few fools with shoe sizes larger than their IQ, and usually mostly based on football teams and stupid old alliegances that those who espouse them don't even understand themselves... one of Scotlands big embarrassments to be honest.


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## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Drop the anti English nonsense. Face it the English don't hate you as much as you would love them to. I don't know anyone from England who would have dumped us. I work in England and can assure you they would have voted to keep us. To paraphrase your own quote to me yesterday...you sound like a typical Celtic supporter


Oh now you jump in? I replied to you 3 times before the vote trying to have a bit of a sensible debate and you ignored it all 3 times.

Yeah i dont even actually hate English people so I wouldnt say its anti english id say more of an observation of what Ive personally seen throughout this whole thing. Also when I say rest of the UK i mean wales and NI too. I guess it comes down to 2 groups in England the ones who dont want to lose the oil (cough) i mean Scotland or the ones who just think were are moany [email protected] and they should just get rid of us.

You say it was down to 3 things Money jobs or unionist or republican.

For me it was about Child poverty,Foodbanks,pointless nuclear fcuking missiles being kept in the clyde

But hey ho I guess you all got your wish just hope we dont regret it in years to come.

For the record im a jambo,far from a celtic fan lol


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

rs007 said:


> RE the hate for the English - it is perpetuated by a few fools with shoe sizes larger than their IQ, and usually mostly based on football teams and stupid old alliegances that those who espouse them don't even understand themselves... one of Scotlands big embarrassments to be honest.


Here, Ive never once said I hate the English so im unsure why folk are getting on high horses about it here. All i said was i wonder why we cling on to the unionwhen from what I have personally seen over FB etc that I get the feeling the rest f the UK would ditch us.

2 of you now claiming im anti English here and thats completley out of order


----------



## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

Biggest anti climax ever.


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Here, Ive never once said I hate the English so im unsure why folk are getting on high horses about it here. All i said was i wonder why we cling on to the unionwhen from what I have personally seen over FB etc that I get the feeling the rest f the UK would ditch us.
> 
> 2 of you now claiming im anti English here and thats completley out of order


You are caught out mate. Typical Jambi fan lol. Say one thing and do / mean another. What issues you call me out on yesterday? I replied all day to posts and don't recall you asking me ANYTHING. I assure you I would have answered any question as I have nowt to fear from your sort. I would have chewed up and exposed ANY political point you had to make.

And we know you hate the English... Hurry and edit your post so that others might not think you dont


----------



## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

Smitch said:


> Biggest anti climax ever.


Went to bed early last night, woke up nothing's changed apart from

Politicians all looking smug and happy with it all,another big waste of

Tax payer monies :lol:


----------



## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

how to lose with grace. gotta respect the guy.

Scotland's First Minister Alex Salmond: "Scotland has by majority decided not at this stage to become an independent country and I accept that verdict of the people, and I call on all Scots to follow suit in accepting the democratic verdict of the people of Scotland.

"The process by which we have made our decision as a nation reflects enormous credit upon Scotland.

"A turnout of 86% is one of the highest in the democratic world for any election or any referendum in history - this has been a triumph for the democratic process and for participation in politics."


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> You are caught out mate. Typical Jambi fan lol. Say one thing and do / mean another. What issues you call me out on yesterday? I replied all day to posts and don't recall you asking me ANYTHING. I assure you I would have answered any question as I have nowt to fear from your sort. I would have chewed up and exposed ANY political point you had to make.
> 
> And we know you hate the English... Hurry and edit your post so that others might not think you dont


Yeah im active on a forum thats largely made up of English people that I get on well with here but I hate the English. Solid point you have there.

obv we cant have a civil talk about anything here, Considering in your words were all idoits that voted yes and you have nout to fear from my sort.

Ive never once said anything about hating english yet you seem quite keen to try and make out that I do. like a little teachers pet trying to get me in trouble or something? Im not sure.


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

2004mark said:


> I agree with @a.notherguy Don't think I've spoke to one person who wanted a yes vote.


Out of interest what were peoples reasons for wanting us to stay?

Like i said majority of posts i read on fb were all pretty much happy to let us go


----------



## megatron (Apr 21, 2004)

I pretty much hate the English along with every other nationality


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Dizzee! said:


> Here, Ive never once said I hate the English so im unsure why folk are getting on high horses about it here. All i said was i wonder why we cling on to the unionwhen from what I have personally seen over FB etc that I get the feeling the rest f the UK would ditch us.
> 
> 2 of you now claiming im anti English here and thats completley out of order


Wind your neck in - I was speaking generally, wasn't accusing you off **** all :lol:


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

rs007 said:


> Wind your neck in - I was speaking generally, wasn't accusing you off **** all :lol:


In that case, Apologies :stupid:


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Dizzee! said:


> In that case, Apologies :stupid:


Del was definitely calling you a cvunt though, i seen him

:lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Get it right rams. I called him a Jambo c*nt


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Yeah im active on a forum thats largely made up of English people that I get on well with here but I hate the English. Solid point you have there.
> 
> obv we cant have a civil talk about anything here, Considering in your words were all idoits that voted yes and you have nout to fear from my sort.
> 
> Ive never once said anything about hating english yet you seem quite keen to try and make out that I do. like a little teachers pet trying to get me in trouble or something? Im not sure.


Funny how nearly every thread posted after yours seen it as anti English sentiment, everyone except you that is. But then again you are right everyone else is wrong. Sort of like the yes case for independence that...

Also still waiting on your questions you "called me out on" yesterday. Where are they, I will answer them...here is your chance.


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Get it right rams. I called him a Jambo c*nt


Come on if your not rangers and not celtic who are you then. cant be calling me a jambo cnut and keep your team a secret here

Hoping your a hibs fan lol


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Funny how nearly every thread posted after yours seen it as anti English sentiment, everyone except you that is. But then again you are right everyone else is wrong. Sort of like the yes case for independence that...


Past caring to be honest

Fcuk you and fcuk England FCUK EVERYBODY apart from me im always right

In all seriousness though. I think its been win win at the referendum. Positive change secured by the Yes voters and UK secured by the No voters. Thats my opinion on the matter and im sticking to it


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Come on if your not rangers and not celtic who are you then. cant be calling me a jambo cnut and keep your team a secret here
> 
> Hoping your a hibs fan lol


Ha ha all joking aside mate I don't support any football team. My family are mostly rangers but my wife is Celtic and friends are Aberdeen, hearts and bibs. I have no interest in football. IMO they are all overpaid wee p00fs that are generally idolised by pie eating morons shouting about either Ireland or some other irrelevant tribal BS

I didn't even watch a single World Cup game and the last game I watched on TV would have been about ten years ago maybe


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

But don't be mistaken though I am a British unionist absolute.


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Past caring to be honest
> 
> Fcuk you and fcuk England FCUK EVERYBODY apart from me im always right
> 
> In all seriousness though. I think its been win win at the referendum. Positive change secured by the Yes voters and UK secured by the No voters. Thats my opinion on the matter and im sticking to it


It is a win win mate. I agree with that.


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

I tell you what we can ALL be proud of... Scottish people's fantastic ability to moan like fcuk. Our moaning has shaped this country for the better for everyone. Be you Scottish (yes or no), English, welsh or Irish or astounding ability to complain has once again triumphed for the greater good of all.

The other great ability of us scots is to take a bit of banter well. No hard feelings towards anyone. I like a debate, but when all is said and done I love my country and ALL it's people. Including jambos


----------



## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> Out of interest what were peoples reasons for wanting us to stay?
> 
> Like i said majority of posts i read on fb were all pretty much happy to let us go


A lot were because, like myself, there's some sort of Scottish heritage down their family line so it would be sad to see the Union spilt up. I told you a lie though, as I just remembered my brother did want a yes vote, but that was because he thought you'd do better by yourself.

Believe me, it's got nothing to do with the oil. The consensus seems to be that Scotland costs 'us' money. God knows how it could ever be worked out though (if indeed it should be).

People with the 'fvck off' attitude seemed to be the ones with the knee-jerk "Well if you don't want us we don't want you" child like thought process.


----------



## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

rs007 said:


> RE the hate for the English - it is perpetuated by a few fools with shoe sizes larger than their IQ, and usually mostly based on football teams and stupid old alliegances that those who espouse them don't even understand themselves... one of Scotlands big embarrassments to be honest.


The few years in Scotland I met a lot of them, I find it hard to believe the likes of the Isle of Skye voted no and low land area's voted yes?!


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Ha ha all joking aside mate I don't support any football team. My family are mostly rangers but my wife is Celtic and friends are Aberdeen, hearts and bibs. I have no interest in football. IMO they are all overpaid wee p00fs that are generally idolised by pie eating morons shouting about either Ireland or some other irrelevant tribal BS
> 
> I didn't even watch a single World Cup game and the last game I watched on TV would have been about ten years ago maybe


Cant disagree with much of that lol

I have a season ticket and about 95% of the people sitting around me constantly shouting absolute pish with no understanding of the game what so ever. Meanwhile spitting bit of pie around while they shout lol

Ok for arguments sake I will call you a sheep [email protected] [email protected] Aberdeen fan. Sound fair?


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

Dizzee! said:


> Cant disagree with much of that lol
> 
> I have a season ticket and about 95% of the people sitting around me constantly shouting absolute pish with no understanding of the game what so ever. Meanwhile spitting bit of pie around while they shout lol
> 
> Ok for arguments sake I will call you a sheep [email protected] [email protected] Aberdeen fan. Sound fair?


Mate there is below the belt and downright insulting... Even Aberdeen fans don't want to admit they support Aberdeen. Let's settle on Kilmarnock.


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

2004mark said:


> A lot were because, like myself, there's some sort of Scottish heritage down their family line so it would be sad to see the Union spilt up. I told you a lie though, as I just remembered my brother did want a yes vote, but that was because he thought you'd do better by yourself.
> 
> Believe me, it's got nothing to do with the oil. The consensus seems to be that Scotland costs 'us' money. God knows how it could ever be worked out though (if indeed it should be).
> 
> People with the 'fvck off' attitude seemed to be the ones with the knee-jerk "Well if you don't want us we don't want you" child like thought process.


So this says to me, Minority of idiots down there that have the fcuk off attitude voices are outweighing the genuine folk that are all for the union on social media. I actually seen a video yesterday of Newcastle fans chanting about getting rid of us. I never watched it so not sure what exactly they were chanting but caption said it was something about us being greedy up here lol


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

freddee said:


> The few years in Scotland I met a lot of them, I find it hard to believe the likes of the Isle of Skye voted no and low land area's voted yes?!


Basically, where ever people are doing allright, they vote no - obviously they don't want change - thats why I can't understand the shock at Aberdeen getting a no. Why shocked? Just because its Salmonds back yard? Thats like saying I should be expected to win the Olympia if I trained at a gym the top pros used :lol:

Islands the same, they through necessity get propped up by the UK, more money per head - they need it, nothing foul at play - but you can understand why they might be sh1tting themselves more at the prospect of an independent Scotland, it isn't just unknowns to them, its potentially the end of their life-blood funding.

One that did shock me was my area, I would have bet everything I had on it being a good majority yes... it was one of the tightest areas, but still just tipped a no. Odd. I wonder if that is the football thing at play because North Ayrshire has definitely suffered terribly over the last 30 years.


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Delhi said:


> Mate there is below the belt and downright insulting... Even Aberdeen fans don't want to admit they support Aberdeen. Let's settle on Kilmarnock.


Killmarnock, smart move would have prefered it to be Hibs since they are forever in Hearts shadows and I would always have the upper hand in future football debates with you non football supporting weirdos.


----------



## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> So this says to me, Minority of idiots down there that have the fcuk off attitude voices are *outweighing the genuine folk that are all for the union on social media*. I actually seen a video yesterday of Newcastle fans chanting about getting rid of us. I never watched it so not sure what exactly they were chanting but caption said it was something about us being greedy up here lol


I think that's generally how social media works lol


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

2004mark said:


> I think that's generally how social media works lol


Should see some of the stuff on my feed right now. No voters calling yes voters brain dead, Yes voters telling no voters they arent Scottish. Its crazy and I really hope the dust settles quick. Like I said both Yes and No voters played a part in the bigger picture


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

rs007 said:


> Basically, where ever people are doing allright, they vote no - obviously they don't want change - thats why I can't understand the shock at Aberdeen getting a no. Why shocked? Just because its Salmonds back yard? Thats like saying I should be expected to win the Olympia if I trained at a gym the top pros used :lol:
> 
> Islands the same, they through necessity get propped up by the UK, more money per head - they need it, nothing foul at play - but you can understand why they might be sh1tting themselves more at the prospect of an independent Scotland, it isn't just unknowns to them, its potentially the end of their life-blood funding.
> 
> One that did shock me was my area, I would have bet everything I had on it being a good majority yes... it was one of the tightest areas, but still just tipped a no. Odd. I wonder if that is the football thing at play because North Ayrshire has definitely suffered terribly over the last 30 years.


Brilliant post and similar to what I said earlier. It was all about money, jobs and (let's call it) football. I to was surprised when Ayrshire etc came in as a no and my first though when I seen it was "prody vote".

I am glad it was so close as it does send a chilling message out to Westminster. The people won't take much more BS we are sick of lies and London getting all the money and investment. Change HAS to happen across the UK otherwise next time the union, the UK Nd even Westminster will be no more. I personally pledge my "yes" vote if they choose to do nothing, fix it for all of the UK not just London.


----------



## Delhi (Dec 8, 2005)

rs007 said:


> Basically, where ever people are doing allright, they vote no - obviously they don't want change - thats why I can't understand the shock at Aberdeen getting a no. Why shocked? Just because its Salmonds back yard? Thats like saying I should be expected to win the Olympia if I trained at a gym the top pros used :lol:
> 
> Islands the same, they through necessity get propped up by the UK, more money per head - they need it, nothing foul at play - but you can understand why they might be sh1tting themselves more at the prospect of an independent Scotland, it isn't just unknowns to them, its potentially the end of their life-blood funding.
> 
> One that did shock me was my area, I would have bet everything I had on it being a good majority yes... it was one of the tightest areas, but still just tipped a no. Odd. I wonder if that is the football thing at play because North Ayrshire has definitely suffered terribly over the last 30 years.


Brilliant post and similar to what I said earlier. It was all about money, jobs and (let's call it) football. I to was surprised when Ayrshire etc came in as a no and my first though when I seen it was "prody vote".

I am glad it was so close as it does send a chilling message out to Westminster. The people won't take much more BS we are sick of lies and London getting all the money and investment. Change HAS to happen across the UK otherwise next time the union, the UK Nd even Westminster will be no more. I personally pledge my "yes" vote if they choose to do nothing, fix it for all of the UK not just London.


----------



## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

Great post Del

As said to you in rep comment, I'm all for the UK in a perfect world, but I percieve it to be broken, and full of cancer... now if this referendum and the fact that it wasn't exactly a landslide victory for them snaps wheels into motion that work toward fixing the UK to make it better for the people rather than the f&*King bankers and big business... well, I'll be a happy man, that would be the ideal outcome.


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Not sure if I heard it right but am I right in saying that the strength of the £ grew last night during the vote?


----------



## Edinburgh (Sep 2, 2012)

Dizzee! said:


> Yeah nobody was trying to ram a no vote to anyone on facebook the whole time right enough.


Dizzee you're from Edinburgh, the Yes campaigners out in the street were everywhere trying to shove leaflets in your face

My facebook every Yes voter was constantly pushing it, the No voters kept their mouth shut


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Edinburgh said:


> Dizzee you're from Edinburgh, the Yes campaigners out in the street were everywhere trying to shove leaflets in your face
> 
> My facebook every Yes voter was constantly pushing it, the No voters kept their mouth shut


Not round my way probs 50/50


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

Not even 12 hours in and thats Milliband already saying he will NOT sign off on more devolution powers in Scotland.

Also Salmond has resigned


----------



## Edinburgh (Sep 2, 2012)

Dizzee! said:


> Not even 12 hours in and thats Milliband already saying he will NOT sign off on more devolution powers in Scotland.
> 
> *Also Salmond has resigned*


Just noticed this as well


----------



## BioSynth (Sep 17, 2014)

Wow did not expect that. Everything or nothing type of chap huh..well glad he didn't get it if he's that much of a bad loser


----------



## BettySwallocks (Aug 1, 2012)

So will there be any difference to any individuals lifes now all this is over and the scots are staying? or is it something that won't affect the general population.


----------



## Sams (Nov 3, 2013)

After all this stress I am relived that the Scottish Aberdeen Angus burger will be available at Burger King.


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

BioSynth said:


> Wow did not expect that. Everything or nothing type of chap huh..well glad he didn't get it if he's that much of a bad loser


I think he said a while back regardless of outcome he would resign, I maybe wrong but I think it was to try put the point accross that we werent voting for him we were simply voting yes.


----------



## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

Dizzee! said:


> For me it was about Child poverty,Foodbanks,pointless nuclear fcuking missiles being kept in the clyde
> 
> But hey ho I guess you all got your wish just hope we dont regret it in years to come.
> 
> For the record im a jambo,far from a celtic fan lol


 Agree. These were issues that helped me make my decision too.

And 'mon the Hearts!!


----------



## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

Delhi said:


> Get it right rams. I called him a Jambo c*nt


 How very dare you


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

RS86 said:


> Agree. These were issues that helped me make my decision too.
> 
> And 'mon the Hearts!!


Ah another Jambo. Excellent


----------



## 38945 (Nov 23, 2013)

For the record Alex Salmond is also a Jambo. Just thought I'd put that out there


----------



## Beats (Jun 9, 2011)

RS86 said:


> For the record Alex Salmond is also a Jambo. Just thought I'd put that out there


Yeah so he claims but being from Aberdeen im not sure how much truth is in that lol


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## Zurg (Jan 28, 2014)

Vote rigging?

Is there any truth to this?

Is it that easy?


----------



## 39005 (Nov 25, 2013)

lol ive stood as a 'watcher' in local voting and seen the exact same thing happen (theres usually 4 watchers to each table once counting starts) - i stopped the person just as they were about to band the 25 votes and put them in another candidates pile ( they took one slip from another candidate and put it on top of another candidates pile making it look like they have 25 full votes in that pile).


----------



## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

Zurg said:


> Vote rigging?


No



Zurg said:


> Is there any truth to this?


No



Zurg said:


> Is it that easy?


No


----------



## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Just seen the news, the no voter have been celebrating and the yes voters have been drowning their sorrows and now they are having a big fight, bless em, cant beat Scottish culture!!!


----------



## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

freddee said:


> Just seen the news, the no voter have been celebrating and the yes voters have been drowning their sorrows and now they are having a big fight, bless em, cant beat Scottish culture!!!


We need something to fight about till the celtic v rangers games are back


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

freddee said:


> Just seen the news, the no voter have been celebrating and the yes voters have been drowning their sorrows and now they are having a big fight, bless em, cant beat Scottish culture!!!


Its been kicking off in George square with a few loyalist No supports running riot.......


----------



## 36-26 (Jun 30, 2009)

I'd have been better off financially to stay living at home with my parents but I'd prefer to get out there and live my own life and be independent. Disappointed in the Scottish tbh,


----------



## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

T100 said:


> We need something to fight about till the celtic v rangers games are back


This is it see we all want our counter parts to do bad but when they're gone we miss the interaction??


----------



## Normsky (Aug 29, 2014)

megatron said:


> Honestly who cares any more? If you don't like it fúck off - simple. I'm sure we won't miss the massive benefit and NHS cheque going up there very year. You can revel in your own economy without London banck-rolling your dreary, bleak little squirt of rock.


 Don't the Scottish Public pay more in tax ( because scotland is the only part of Britain that producing anything anymore) than any other nation in the union? I believe they pay around 22 billion and don't really get their fair share when it comes to development schemes etc.

I could be wrong though.


----------



## harrison180 (Aug 6, 2013)

Im just waiting for northern ireland to kick up a sh1t storm again. Scotland get a vote so easy but they dont.

I dunno why scotland would want to be independant in this age. Its not like they were trud down etc it was just an extension of england.


----------



## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

^^^ ye you are industrially it is the north west and midlands, services south east.


----------



## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

amurphy said:


> Its been kicking off in George square with a few loyalist No supports running riot.......


Sadly, Glasgow still has a fair number of eejit bigots. They are a dying breed though and not representative of modern Scots. Just a pity they're not dying out quickly enough (that goes for the knuckle dragging nutfuggets on both sides).


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Ian_Montrose said:


> Sadly, Glasgow still has a fair number of eejit bigots. They are a dying breed though and not representative of modern Scots. Just a pity they're not dying out quickly enough (that goes for the knuckle dragging nutfuggets on both sides).


Very true from both sides but this divide won't die out in my life time. I am 35.


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

It's a shame people still act this way


----------



## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

What a lot of rubbish. The guy that wanted the yes has resigned and now there is riots between the Scottish people. Absolute joke


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> What a lot of rubbish. The guy that wanted the yes has resigned and now there is riots *between* the Scottish people. Absolute joke


Not riots between Scottish people, riots from one side.


----------



## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

amurphy said:


> Not riots between Scottish people, riots from one side.


Wiiiitttt. ?????

So some English have came to fight??

The riots are between YES and NO voters all of which are Scottish so it's a fight between the Scottish people!!!!


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> Wiiiitttt. ?????
> 
> So some English have came to fight??
> 
> The riots are between YES and NO voters all of which are Scottish so it's a fight between the Scottish people!!!!


Wrong.

Loyalist supporters not unionist have been causing chaos around the city centre. Win and they still riot. Shameful scenes from west of Scotland mentality @Ian_Montrose mentioned egjit bigots still exist from both sides!

Sad but true


----------



## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

amurphy said:


> Wrong.
> 
> Loyalist supporters not unionist have been causing chaos around the city centre. Win and they still riot. Shameful scenes from west of Scotland mentality @Ian_Montrose mentioned egjit bigots still exist from both sides!
> 
> Sad but true


How is it wrong??? Are Scottish people fighting???? Would this have happened if there wasn't a vote yesterday? No....... So **** off


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> How is it wrong??? Are Scottish people fighting???? Would this have happened if there wasn't a vote yesterday? No....... So **** off


Can you read?

Why so aggressive?


----------



## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

amurphy said:


> Can you read?
> 
> Why so aggressive?


Can you read??? It's simple. Scottish people fighting Scottish people. It's not hard to understand! Simple look I will say it again scottish people fighting Scottish people unionists. Loyalist whatever....Scottish! Not on in my eyes. If this fat pr**k never started all this there would be no problem. Joke.

End of good night sir


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> Can you read??? It's simple. Scottish people fighting Scottish people. It's not hard to understand! Simple look I will say it again scottish people fighting Scottish people unionists. Loyalist whatever....Scottish! Not on in my eyes. If this fat pr**k never started all this there would be no problem. Joke.
> 
> End of good night sir


Fighting involves one side v another side

That's not happening in Glasgow tonight.


----------



## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> Can you read??? It's simple. Scottish people fighting Scottish people. It's not hard to understand! Simple look I will say it again scottish people fighting Scottish people unionists. Loyalist whatever....Scottish! Not on in my eyes. If this fat pr**k never started all this there would be no problem. Joke.
> 
> End of good night sir


It's not on in the vast majority of Scots eyes as well. You obviously don't get it despite the various hints that have been dropped. Most people from the west of Scotland know exactly what they're looking at when they see thugs waving Union Jacks causing trouble. The referendum is just they're current excuse for making fools of themselves. At other times it will be a Rangers game, the Orange walk or they might even go over to Northern Ireland to join in the riots during the marching season. They are one half of the religious divide that once made Glasgow infamous. I've said already, they are not representative of modern Scots and you suggesting they are is just plain ignorant in every sense of the word.


----------



## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

Ian_Montrose said:


> It's not on in the vast majority of Scots eyes as well. You obviously don't get it despite the various hints that have been dropped. Most people from the west of Scotland know exactly what they're looking at when they see thugs waving Union Jacks causing trouble. The referendum is just they're current excuse for making fools of themselves. At other times it will be a Rangers game, the Orange walk or they might even go over to Northern Ireland to join in the riots during the marching season. They are one half of the religious divide that once made Glasgow infamous. I've said already, they are not representative of modern Scots and you suggesting they are is just plain ignorant in every sense of the word.


You are going on like a politician rambling nosnence. Simple yes or no answer

Are Scottish people fighting/rioting/arguing in glasgow tonight???


----------



## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> You are going on like a politician rambling nosnence. Simple yes or no answer
> 
> Are Scottish people fighting/rioting/arguing in glasgow tonight???


Total ignorant of the comments put towards you tonight. It has been commented on a few times what'd happening in Glasgow tonight. Why the need to ask again and again.


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

This thread was started 11 day s ago, about the split of the union, we have been through a lot just in this century alone, 2 world wars, lead the world in literature, invention, modern sport, music and much more, but most the posts have been in the last 12 hours or if not many of them, I find that quite strange, it might show just how little the rest of the UK really cared if Scotland left or not??!


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## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

amurphy said:


> Total ignorant of the comments put towards you tonight. It has been commented on a few times what'd happening in Glasgow tonight. Why the need to ask again and again.


Haha are the two of you part time PMs. I have stated my point that it's not on for Scottish people to be fighting over anything in the streets of Scotland. Be it over a pint or independence or a bird ****ting on your mates heed. No one has answered with a straigh answer it a joke and you two can waffle on over your beans all night I am away


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> You are going on like a politician rambling nosnence. Simple yes or no answer
> 
> Are Scottish people fighting/rioting/arguing in glasgow tonight???


An extremely small minority are. You seem intent on tarring us all with the same brush and quite clearly do not want to be educated. If I suggested that all black people were drug dealing gangsters because a black drug gang was in the news, that would be the same kind of logic. Fortunately, I am neither a racist nor a bigot so would never jump to such ridiculous conclusions. Seems like we can't say the same for you.

Sorry if that's not the simple yes or no answer you were looking for. If you only like communicating in words of one syllable I'm not the right person to try and debate with.


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

freddee said:


> This thread was started 11 day s ago, about the split of the union, we have been through a lot just in this century alone, 2 world wars, lead the world in literature, invention, modern sport, music and much more, but most the posts have been in the last 12 hours or if not many of them, I find that quite strange, it might show just how little the rest of the UK really cared if Scotland left or not??!


Agree on it being strange to people looking at the outside in but if you were to live in the reality of it it's some what different. Try to change a culture is going to be a challenge in its self, a culture change from both sides


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

Ian_Montrose said:


> An extremely small minority are. You seem intent on tarring us all with the same brush and quite clearly do not want to be educated. If I suggested that all black people were drug dealing gangsters because a black drug gang was in the news, that would be the same kind of logic. Fortunately, I am neither a racist nor a bigot so would never jump to such ridiculous conclusions. Seems like we can't say the same for you.
> 
> Sorry if that's not the simple yes or no answer you were looking for. If you only like communicating in words of one syllable I'm not the right person to try and debate with.


Pi$$ing against the wind trying to explain it to him


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## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

Ian_Montrose said:


> An extremely small minority are. You seem intent on tarring us all with the same brush and quite clearly do not want to be educated. If I suggested that all black people were drug dealing gangsters because a black drug gang was in the news, that would be the same kind of logic. Fortunately, I am neither a racist nor a bigot so would never jump to such ridiculous conclusions. Seems like we can't say the same for you.
> 
> Sorry if that's not the simple yes or no answer you were looking for. If you only like communicating in words of one syllable I'm not the right person to try and debate with.


WAFFLE

listen Ian you sounded abit rasist in the last comment. I am not tarring anyone I am clearly saying no one should be fighting. I do not want people fighting. Simple

And talking about education what's the squre route of 42....jokes zero ****s are given.

I am not here for a debate mate I have better stuff to do than waffle a lot of rubbish over a clear fact I pointed out that no one should be fighting. So @IanWafflemontrose good night sir. Please tuck your main homie @amurphy into bed


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## Ian_Montrose (Nov 13, 2007)

amurphy said:


> Pi$$ing against the wind trying to explain it to him


I know. That was my final try. I almost fell into the trap of trying to cure the internet of idiots. I'm off to bed.


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## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

amurphy said:


> Pi$$ing against the wind trying to explain it to him


Explain what????? I know what yous are saying but are saying but are yous to educated to understand what I am saying???


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## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

Ian_Montrose said:


> I know. That was my final try. I almost fell into the trap of trying to cure the internet of idiots. I'm off to bed.


Idiots you are the one that looks an idiot insulting people and have a guy with a giant chicken as your avi


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## T100 (Oct 8, 2011)

These are unionist ****wits who sour the name of Scotland and put it to shame on a regular basis with their usual sectarian bigotry, what the **** Bobby Sands has got to do with Scotland I'll never know, just any excuse for rangers fans to cause trouble, and before the rangers fans jump all over me just read on Twitter and the decent rangers fans are saying it's mostly rangers fans causing trouble and signing sectarian songs and burning the Saltaire, feckin disgrace to the human race


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> Explain what????? I know what yous are saying but are saying but are yous to educated to understand what I am saying???


That's the thing clearly you don't understand.

Am I educated enough to understand you? Clearly we are on different paths who can't agree


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## grant hunter (Apr 21, 2009)

amurphy said:


> That's the thing clearly you don't understand.
> 
> Am I educated enough to understand you? Clearly we are on different paths who can't agree


There is nothing to agree on. I have seen it with my own eyes. I live in glasgow I can hear people singing god save the queen. There are poepe fighting yous clearly don't understand what I am saying


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## 4NT5 (Jun 1, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> There is nothing to agree on. I have seen it with my own eyes. I live in glasgow I can hear people singing god save the queen. There are poepe fighting yous clearly don't understand what I am saying


Seen what with your own eyes?

I live in Glasgow myself and seen first hand what was happening tonight?


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## Prophecy (Nov 26, 2011)

amurphy said:


> Fighting involves one side v another side
> 
> That's not happening in Glasgow tonight.


What were you smoking when you typed this?


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

grant hunter said:


> WAFFLE
> 
> listen Ian you sounded abit rasist in the last comment. I am not tarring anyone I am clearly saying no one should be fighting. I do not want people fighting. Simple
> 
> ...


Of course no one should be fighting - thats just stating the obvious

But your logic, shouldn't vote on anything in case it causes fights basically? Or am I way off?


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