# considering IGF-1,HGH,Slin,T3 plus AAS



## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

Hi, I've been training about 7 years and I started at around 9st at 6ft 2" tall and I'm now around 210lbs (15st) at same height probably about 15% bodyfat is what a lot of people said to me. I have done several cycles using AAS and seen good results however I was recently talking to a guy who competes and has won a few shows, he was suggesting that rather than keep doing cycles of Test, and Decca and Tren ect ect, it is more logical to use peptides and to use them all because of the way that the Endocrine system works they all work in synergy together rather than just boosting one thing and leaving other areas out of the "loop". So using IGF-1,HGH,Slin,T3 plus a smaller amount of AAS keeps your hormone levels more level and the test is not enough to cause serious damage.

Hope this makes sense to people, I'm having trouble understanding it all and whats best to do, I feel I have nothing much more to gain from AAS and would like to move onto the peptides.

Thanks


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## musc (Oct 11, 2006)

Your hormone levels will be about as far from 'normal' as they can possibly be when using any synthetic hormones! If you have only done 'several' cycles of AAS I would strongly suggest that your opinion of having 'nothing much more to gain' is very wrong!

Talking about using insulin after only 'several' cycles sounds crazy as the risks should be thoroughly investiagted before considering. HGH will be a waste of money compared to the size you can gain if you use AAS properly with the right diet.


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## Guest (Jul 13, 2008)

Ronnie_Coalman said:


> it is more logical to use peptides and to use them all because of the way that the Endocrine system works they all work in synergy together rather than just boosting one thing and leaving other areas out of the "loop".


 Why do more "experienced" people (which he isnt as he is totally off the mark) always suggest begginers to do **** like this?!

There is a 17 year old who works in my gym hes very skinny and he got advised by a local competitor to start using insulin:confused1:.

Mate your 6ft2 and 210lb AAS diet and training will give you many years more growth dont waste your time or money ****ing about with those other things.


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

ok well thanks for your advices guys. So at what weight and bodyfat would you advise is a suitable point to begin using GH and IGF-1?


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## Guest (Jul 13, 2008)

Ronnie_Coalman said:


> ok well thanks for your advices guys. So at what weight and bodyfat would you advise is a suitable point to begin using GH and IGF-1?


 It is a personal thing mate but IMO unless your already walking around with a body worthy of getting on stage then stick to basic AAS.

Sure post up some pictures its always nice to see new members pics:thumbup1:


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

thanks I may well put up some pics. OK, so as im here I may as well ask what you think of the next cycle I was planning anyway.

Dbol 50mg ED - weeks 1-4

Test E 750mg Per Week - weeks 1-12

Decca 600mg Per Week - weeks 1-10

Tren Acetate 75mg or 100mg depending on what I can get EOD - weeks 7-12

Usual PCT of Nolva,Clomid and HCG. May use HCG before, hlaf way through and at the end of the cycle to keep natural test going???


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Just because he has won a few shows does not mean he knows what he is talking about....

he is off the mark in so many ways..

for starters you dont need to use GH/Slin and IGF to see results can you ask this guy how he suggests you use AAS to to keep hormones level stable? and what he means by serouise damage seeing as insulin can kill you and test won't...

Ok so i give him the fact that their is a synergy between these peptides but this only happens when you use them in a particular way at a certain dose...can you let us know what method and dosing he has suggested?

6ft and 210lbs you don't need peptides mate you need to eat more food simple really i am not being off with you but at 6ft tall you should be weighing at least 250lbs....

what is your daily diet? how much protein and carbs do you eat a day?


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

Pscarb to be honest that is what I was thinking, that I need to eat more and get bigger in other ways before going down the route of GH, slin ect. I'm currently taking in around about 4500cals, 460g protein, 530g carbs, and about 80g fats and I'm finding it VERY difficult to eat that much food even with shakes. Do you think that it is acheivable for someone who is very ectomorphic and severe hard gainer to reach 250lbs plus?


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## noel (Dec 30, 2005)

overtraining maybe?? not resting enough... I know that thats why I wasnt gaining much - and overdoing cardio too... am similar height to you dude and always had trouble gaining but have added about 10kg over the past 6 mths on a cpl of cycles of AAS and a decent diet BUT more importantly resting a bit more and giving my body time to recover


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Ronnie_Coalman said:


> Pscarb to be honest that is what I was thinking, that I need to eat more and get bigger in other ways before going down the route of GH, slin ect. I'm currently taking in around about 4500cals, 460g protein, 530g carbs, and about 80g fats and I'm finding it VERY difficult to eat that much food even with shakes. Do you think that it is acheivable for someone who is very ectomorphic and severe hard gainer to reach 250lbs plus?


yes of course it is possible but it takes time, you say you struggle eating that much food what do you struggle with? i would plan out 8 meals 2hrs apart and have 4 solid meals and 4 liquid meals.

apart from your post workout shake which should be fast acting carbs in the other 3 blend 2 or 3 scoops protein with 100g ultra fine scottich oats and add 20g PB and a banana this will give you approx 100g carbs 60-75g protein and 30g of good fats 3 of these a day plus meals will certainly put the weight on you.

then look at training EOD the added rest will again help you out....


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

Thanks for all your help guys, much appreciated.


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## DB (Oct 31, 2003)

defo follow pscarbs advise on this one mate..

u should be looking at 240lbs at that height matey imo.. food food & food 

where abouts in Woking do you train?


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## Tee1 (Jul 17, 2008)

Thanks, Thats some good advice there PScarb..


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

Hi, I'm not sure if I should be continuing this thread in this forum because its more about diet and training than AAS or Peptides. Anyway, I've followed peoples advices and now taking in just over 6000cals, reduced my training.......................gained nothing still in 3 weeks, surely I should have gained SOMETHING? not even 1% more bodyfat or 1lb of weight from 4500 - 6000 cals. How much do I need to eat to gain? 10,000cals? I'm also taking 1ml Sus 250 eod. I'm considering just giving up training all together to be honest. Any advices again very welcome.

Thanks and apologies for complaining but Im totally stuck for what to do.


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## Five-O (May 21, 2006)

We all know whats he's gonna do.

B0llocks, your taking in 6k cals at 210lbs and NOT gaining anything.......thats a massive surplus, you'd be getting fat for sure, if nothing else I doubt, the real Ronnie Coleman eats 6k cals per day.

Post up these calories, im all ears.....


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## Guest (Aug 6, 2008)

Five-O said:


> We all know whats he's gonna do.
> 
> B0llocks, your taking in 6k cals at 210lbs and NOT gaining anything.......thats a massive surplus, you'd be gettign fat for sure.


 He may have IBS i have this at times when i eat the wrong things and dont take enough digestive enzymes. I have in the past eaten 6k and not grew at all but nothing was getting absorbed while recently when i ate 4000cals i gained well because it was all absorbed.


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## Five-O (May 21, 2006)

Con said:


> He may have IBS i have this at times when i eat the wrong things and dont take enough digestive enzymes. I have in the past eaten 6k and not grew at all but nothing was getting absorbed while recently when i ate 4000cals i gained well because it was all absorbed.


fair point, he could well have...

I keep forgettign to pick up some udo's enzymes, you just reminded me, good stuff :thumb:


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Ronnie_Coalman said:


> now taking in just over 6000cals, reduced my training.......................gained nothing still in 3 weeks.
> 
> Thanks and apologies for complaining but Im totally stuck for what to do.


i would agree that if you have IBS then this is possible but let us first go on the basis that you don't....6000cals is a huge amount of food much more than i could eat....i find it hard to believe you are eating this everyday and not gaining so please post up your exact diet and meal times along with the weights of all foods so we can see if it does add up to that much....this is not a dig but i have found when i coach guys they think they are eating way more than they really are....


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## Guest (Aug 6, 2008)

Pscarb said:


> i would agree that if you have IBS then this is possible but let us first go on the basis that you don't....6000cals is a huge amount of food much more than i could eat....i find it hard to believe you are eating this everyday and not gaining so please post up your exact diet and meal times along with the weights of all foods so we can see if it does add up to that much....this is not a dig but i have found when i coach guys they think they are eating way more than they really are....


 Have to fully agree with that mate.

Its very easy to say oh yeah i am going to eat 6k per day but actually doing it is another matter.

Personally i was only able to keep it going by drinking half my calories as that amount of real food would make me very sick, that said i do believe my IBS is mainly brought on by too many shakes and/or shakes of the wrong kind.


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

This is what I have been eating ED for the last 3 weeks

9:00am - 100g Oats 381 Cals

2 Scoops MuscleMilk in skimmed milk 485 Cals

Total = 866 Cals

11:00am - 300g Chicken 300 Cals

100g Wholegrain Rice 344 Cals

30ml Flax Oil 270 Cals

Total = 914 Cals

1:00pm - 4 Scoops NLarge 600 Cals

30ml Flax Oil 270 Cals

Total = 870 Cals

2 or 2:30pm Training

3:00pm - 2 Scoops Pro-Recover 297 Cals

1 Scoop Pro-Peptide 115 Cals

Total = 412 Cals

4:00pm - 300g Steak 375 Cals

- 100g Wholegrain Rice 344 Cals

- 30ml Flax Oil 270 Cals

Total = 989 Cals

6:00pm - 2 Scoops Pro-Peptide in Milk 230 Cals

- 100g Oats blended in 381 Cals

Total = 611 Cals

8:00pm - 300g Chicken 300 Cals

100g Avocado 160 Cals

100g Oats with Skimmed Milk 381 Cals

Total = 841 Cals

10:00 - 2 Scoops Pro-Peptide in Milk 230 Cals

100g Oats blended in 381 Cals

Total = 611 Cals

Bedtime - 2 Scoops Pro-Peptide in Milk 230 Cals

Total = 230 Cals

Total Cals = 6344 Cals

Training was this but will change so that I have more rest:

Mon - Delts and Triceps

Mon eve- Martial Arts Class 2hrs

Tues - Back

Wed - Chest

Wed eve- Martial Arts Class 2hrs

Thurs - Biceps and Triceps Supersetted

Fri - Legs

Sat - REST

Sun - REST

If there is anything I have left out please just ask me for more information

Cheers

Ben


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## Five-O (May 21, 2006)

All I can say is fair play mate, the cals are there, way too many supps but that is 6k in cals....Ive no idea how you haven't gained something, be it fat or muscle, maybe Con and Paul were right...IBS etc?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

all i can say is that if you are eating this amount of calories constantly every day for 3 weeks and you have not gained a single pound than either you have a severe digestion issue or you are a freak, the reason i say this is because for every 1g of carbs your body will take in 2.7g of water this is science so i cannot see how you have not gained a single pound.....


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

OK, so lets assume that "hopefully" im not a freak and maybe the scales are wrong perhaps and I have gained, I cant see that I have myself by the mirror but you dont always see it yourself. Can you recommend anything for helping degestion? I was also thinking that maybe because I'm taking in more cals and carbs I have more energy, so I'm training harder and burning more cals than before, plus mondays and wednesdays im training twice a day as I train martial arts in the evenings? just a thought.


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## Five-O (May 21, 2006)

Ronnie_Coalman said:


> OK, so lets assume that "hopefully" im not a freak and maybe the scales are wrong perhaps and I have gained, I cant see that I have myself by the mirror but you dont always see it yourself. Can you recommend anything for helping degestion? I was also thinking that maybe because I'm taking in more cals and carbs I have more energy, so I'm training harder and burning more cals than before, plus mondays and wednesdays im training twice a day as I train martial arts in the evenings? just a thought.


Udo's digestive enzymes are very good, although a bit pricey, worht it though.


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## Ronnie_Coalman (Jul 13, 2008)

Mad Manic can you actually read????? I never said I was taking any peptides at all, the topic originally said "CONSIDERING............." NOT "I AM TAKING". Get your facts straight before you go abusing people.

Five-o, thankyou for your suggestion, I will look at getting some Udo's Enzymes.


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