# The 'pregnant' bodybuilder look



## dtlv

I saw this pic of Marcus Haley at the Arnolds this last weekend and it's so horrible I can't get it out of my head...



Anyone else really repulsed by that kind of look? Apparently several of the others came in with similar pregnant look too... just shocking IMO.


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## Mingster

Horrendous. Even us powerlifter types would be ashamed to look like that:whistling:


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## Rusky87

Abdominal distention?


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## BatemanLondon

GH ? lol


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## 1manarmy

hes expecting twins next week...


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## eezy1

gas?


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## Dai Jones

BatemanLondon said:


> GH ? lol


Yeh most possible


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## Guest

whats causes that


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## 1manarmy

growth causes that id say...well abusing it


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## TELBOR

GH and Slin 

He must be really annoyed at that picture doing the rounds!!


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## K-Rod

Looks like Ephialtes from the film 300. Google it, you'll see what I mean :whistling:


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## Suprakill4

That is horrific!!!!!!!!!! I honestly would not compete if i had a gut like that. Looks like something out of an aliens film!

Mines like that in the evening but from all the food, come morning its flat again.


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## dtlv

Yeah the result of improper GH use. Apparently so many of the male competitors had that look to a degree in the Arnolds this year there has been a big call started for the reintroduction of the vacum pose as a mandatory... would give anyone with that pregnant look a real problem so might actually encourage different prep.



Frank Zane showing the vacum pose.


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## Dai Jones

R0BLET said:


> He must be really annoyed at that picture doing the rounds!!


i would be


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## Mingster

I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


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## BatemanLondon

i believe GH can make the cartilaginous sternum grow and also has an impact on the upper intestine ..

before anyone asks me for quotes , I have this in my head and I am sure i was told this or read it .. sounds legit right ? lol


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## Dai Jones

dtlv said:


> Yeah the result of improper GH use. Apparently so many of the male competitors had that look to a degree in the Arnolds this year there has been a big call started for the reintroduction of the vacum pose as a mandatory... would give anyone with that pregnant look a real problem so might actually encourage different prep.
> 
> View attachment 113228
> 
> 
> Frank Zane showing the vacum pose.


I hope they do, I like the classic look


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## Suprakill4

Mingster said:


> I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


You have it bang on here mate. The classic bodybuilding look was much nicer!


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## montytom

That's wrong it looks like somebody has stuck on a superhero outfit on a fat guy


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## Guest

Mingster said:


> I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


totally agree with this.


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## MRSTRONG

i read somewhere that protein powders were more to blame than gh lol something to do with casein setting like a thick cement in the intestines and this is how its slow released into the body .

no idea if its true or not however it does sound possible , theres many other guys like pscarb that uses gh and doesnt look pregnant once dieted down and he eats lots of whole foods .

either way the old bodybuilder types of 60`s-80`s looked awesome , nowadays they look awful .


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## dtlv

Mingster said:


> I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


I totally agree 100%... not to take away from the hard work of the modern generation, but the different PED protocols and modern approaches/attitudes I think have made the sport far less appealing.

There are more competitive bodybuilders now than at any other time, yet only a handful of physiques in the last decade that really have any wow factor... go back 20 years plus and there were fewer guys overall but the standard at the top was much higher and the variety of physiques made the shows much more interesting I think.


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## musclemate

That's horrible. Bring back the days of Bob Paris, Frank Zane, Berry Dey Mey and Bertil Fox. Classics.


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## fastcar_uk

Mingster said:


> I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


well thats you and me both mate, apart from people like phil heath theres a lot of crap physiques...imo branch warren looks horrible.its all politics and money these days. :yawn:


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## Guest

should the judging criteria be changed you think?


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## Sambuca

Mingster said:


> I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


I couldnt agree more. That full look but v taper body shape looked amazing. not a fan of todays BB's


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## Guest

I always thought the Flex Wheeler look was one of the best tbh.


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## dtlv

ewen said:


> i read somewhere that protein powders were more to blame than gh lol something to do with casein setting like a thick cement in the intestines and this is how its slow released into the body .
> 
> no idea if its true or not however it does sound possible , theres many other guys like pscarb that uses gh and doesnt look pregnant once dieted down and he eats lots of whole foods .
> 
> either way the old bodybuilder types of 60`s-80`s looked awesome , nowadays they look awful .


Am not sure about that particularly with casein causing distension like that... diet does play a role though am sure, over zealous AAS, GH and slin use at the same time as prolonged massive bulking is the route to look like that from what I understand... as you say, guys like @Pscarb and many others show that GH and slin don't have to do that if used properly... it's not an inevitable look from PED use at all.


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## MRSTRONG

Cheeky Monkey said:


> I always thought the Flex Wheeler look was one of the best tbh.


i thought black men had big cocks .


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## Oztrix

scary, looks like he going give birth to a protein baby.


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## Guest

ewen said:


> i thought black men had big cocks .


Letting his brethren down there a bit ain't he !


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## MRSTRONG

dtlv said:


> Am not sure about that particularly with casein causing distension like that... diet does play a role though am sure, over zealous AAS, GH and slin use at the same time as prolonged massive bulking is the route to look like that from what I understand... as you say, guys like @Pscarb and many others show that GH and slin don't have to do that if used properly... it's not an inevitable look from PED use at all.


perhaps the effects of a large bulk then cut rather than a lean gain diet im not sure but i do know like you say its a lot of everything thats caused it imo


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## achilles88

ewen said:


> i thought black men had big cocks .


either what they say about black men is a lie or what they say about steroids is true :whistling:


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## fastcar_uk

what makes me laugh is, he still competed!

i mean surley when he said to his mate/trainer "how do i look?"..they would have told him "get back to greggs you fat bstard" ( or something along those lines)


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## shaunmac

Looks like he's eaten far too many horse burgers......


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## MRSTRONG

just a bad picture i think .

View attachment 113241


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## fastcar_uk

ewen said:


> just a bad picture i think .
> 
> View attachment 113241


well thats toney freeman...not marcus healey


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## Marshan

Cant wholeheartedly agree there DTLV..I've seen Paul with the teensiest bit of distension, not bad compared to some, but it could be seen.


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## MRSTRONG

fastcar_uk said:


> well thats toney freeman...not marcus healey


oh dear , fcuking google


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## MRSTRONG

fastcar_uk said:


> well thats toney freeman...not marcus healey



View attachment 113242


better :whistling:


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## dtlv

mixerD1 said:


> Cant wholeheartedly agree there DTLV..I've seen Paul with the teensiest bit of distension, not bad compared to some, but it could be seen.


Yes, in all respect to Paul in some side shots you can see what looks like the effect of peptides to a small degree... but from what I've seen of the progression of his physique over the last few years until his last show he certainly appears to have got clever and prevented it from developing into the "hey, I'm carrying triplets!" look.


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## MRSTRONG

dtlv said:


> Yes, in all respect to Paul in some side shots you can see what looks like the effect of peptides to a small degree... but from what I've seen of the progression of his physique over the last few years until his last show he certainly appears to have got clever and prevented it from developing into the "hey, I'm carrying triplets!" look.


but defo twins ?


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## Lifter2012

Here is the article from zane good read http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/train-with-zane-vacuum-your-waist/


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## El Toro Mr UK98

from my understanding i thought that look was down to a massive misuse og hgh as it makes everything in your body grow bigger including ur vital organs and they push the stomach out... I think you have to take a lot to get like that though and everyone reacts differently, Personaly I think that was a bad pic taken of him and in the rite pose he would be able to hold it all in.... Pretty sure he wouldnt be able to do a vacume pose though lol


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## Marshan

dtlv said:


> Yes, in all respect to Paul in some side shots you can see what looks like the effect of peptides to a small degree... but from what I've seen of the progression of his physique over the last few years until his last show he certainly appears to have got clever and prevented it from developing into the "hey, I'm carrying triplets!" look.


Without a doubt, I only thought to myself after typing, it's a credit to his knowledge and its application he can carry off the large pro look for so much longer than other guys without the ridiculous 'ready-to-drop' look that can come with it.


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## DeadlyCoobra

Read the whole thing on the MD forums the other day, basically he was doing an "ab roll" which is a wierd ab trick during his routine and that is a snap shot at the worst time possible lol!

But the fact still stands he does have a big gut, and ben pakulski who placed second also had a large midsection also

Was gutted cedrick mcmillan who actually has a small waist came in poor conditioning, he could have taken the show and given this years arnold classic some class and credibility. To be fair Dex was a worthy champ though


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## dtlv

El Toro Mr UK98 said:


> from my understanding i thought that look was down to a massive misuse og hgh as it makes everything in your body grow bigger including ur vital organs and they push the stomach out... I think you have to take a lot to get like that though and everyone reacts differently, Personaly I think that was a bad pic taken of him and in the rite pose he would be able to hold it all in.... Pretty sure he wouldnt be able to do a vacume pose though lol


Yeah it's about the worst mid pose transition pic that you could ever see for the guy... that pic sure is gonna haunt him, but he is a decent bb'er for sure. It's just that in any kind of sport that is marked on aesthetics, is hard not to be taken aback by that I think.


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## DeadlyCoobra

Good article written on it by peter mcgrough: http://www.musculardevelopment.com/team-md-blogs/344-the-mcgough-report/5379-wtf-happened-soft-and-swell-goings-on-at-the-2013-arnold.html

For those that cannot be bothered to follow a link: :lol:

With only Dexter Jackson from last year's Mr. Olympia top six participating in the 2013 Arnold Classic, a range of cynics said the line-up for the 25th annual Lorimer/Schwarzenegger bash would be soft. Other's said, no worries, it'll be swell. In the end both contrasting views were right, as many of the 13 entrants were soft and missed their peak (including Dexter Jackson) and at least six showed up with midsections that were &#8230;. well, swell.

In regard to the distended bellies, it became somewhat of an epidemic in the mid 2000s, but these past few years it was not such a common sight; maybe one seen here and there in pro contests. Why suddenly the 2013 Arnold Classic line-up looked like a pre-natal clinic 8 1/2 months after the end of World War II is beyond moi. And Marcus Haley took the "If ya got it, flaunt it baby!" approach by during his routine several times deliberately pushing out his belly to extraordinary lengths. One braced oneself for a repeat of the most famous scene from Alien, or bodybuilding's first onstage birth. Whatever, maybe the gut glut was a coincidence. There now follows a pregnant pause until someone comes up with the answer.

THE HARD (Sort Of) TRUTH.

On the reality of so many guys not being in top condition it is a fact that in recent years those hitting their peak in contests (pro and amateur) have been in the minority. The paradox is that increasingly over the years "condition" has come to be the deciding factor in contests. It is no longer just one part of the shape/proportion/development/condition assessment it is the pre-requisite for determining victory with the other three aspects taking secondary roles. The proof of conditioning taking pre-eminence over shape and proportion was proved by the freaky but hard Ben Pakulski beating X-Man Toney Freeman, and Cedric "More balanced than a Cirque du Soleil act" McMillan being marooned in sixth place. So if condition is now the ultimate arbiter, the question "Why do so many not hit their peak on contest day?" makes one's head spin like Linda Blair in The Exorcist. It's like LeBron James not practicing three pointers.

A personal opinion is that too many guys are striving so hard for condition that they do too much in the last couple of days leading up to a contest and fall short. One loses count of the number of competitors who look like they are spot-on 24 hours before the contest and then fade away by the time prejudging begins. Hate to speak percentages (but as the oil rigger said to the apprentice, "If the cap fits, wear it"), but consider the following. My feeling is that say a guy is at 98% the night before a contest, there's an overwhelming urge to go for 100%. Thus some eleventh hour alchemy takes place and quicker than you can say, "When I said I was going flat out for victory I didn't mean this for Chrissake!" the guy is at 90% and out of the running. Twelve weeks of dieting gone in a puff of smoke and mirrors. Much better not to tinker and go forward confidently at 98%. Legendary soccer manager Brian Clough used to tell his Nottingham Forest (my home club) players, "Never try to make a good goal scoring chance, a better one." The canny Clough knew that trying to improve your chances, when a good one has already presented itself, all too often ends in failure.

PAST CONDITIONS

The following is not to suggest that present day bodybuilders are inferior to their predecessors, but it is true to say that overall they have not equaled the conditioning consistency achieved by guys from the ''80s and '90s like Haney, Gaspari, Labrada, Taylor, DeMey, Benfatto, Yates, Wheeler, Ray, Levrone, Cottrell and Cormier. Ask those guys their encapsulation of how they hit sinew-splitting condition and their consolidated simple answer will be, "We suffered."


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## eezy1

bet he took a giant dump right after he got off stage


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## Blinkey

Bodybuilding at top level is the only sport that seems to need to go backwards and perhaps have a serious look at itself, as it is becoming very difficult to take seriously. If it carries on like it is it will end up as a circus act.


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## DeadlyCoobra

Also just dug up this realloy old artice (like 1968 i think) but still, for anyone interested its just the abstract from an article done by Department of Medicine, Metabolism Division, Washington University School of Medicine. Basically saying rats producing higher levels of somatotropin had an onset of visceromegaly (internal organ growth).

I appreciate this is old science, but is it outdated, i always thought the whole GH gut was a myth?

http://endo.endojournals.org/content/83/4/714?related-urls=yes&legid=endo;83/4/714


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## dtlv

^^ I think the above article is true, that many guys at the show blew their last minute prep, and the result was a line-up that generally looked a bit soft and didn't impress, not to mention the big bellies on some of them.

I like the Clough quote used as an analogy too, a point relevant to many things in life.


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## cas

I'm sure I heard either cutler or priest taking about this and they were told to constantly hold their stomach in when doing normal every day tasks...and it helped a lot apparently


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## Kimball

Kai Greene looked pretty much like that at bodypower last year! Awful


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## Ally1981

cas said:


> I'm sure I heard either cutler or priest taking about this and they were told to constantly hold their stomach in when doing normal every day tasks...and it helped a lot apparently


Yeah I heard the same. Also heard Big Ronnie was told to reduce his mid section so what he done was wear a lifting belt all day while and hold and tense his stomach in every so often , he reported back saying it made a noticeable difference, think it was Weider that advised him to do this.


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## 3752

not every BB who's stomach sticks out has distention of those who have commented who has stood onstage and carried out comparison after comparison on a hot stage dehydrated will a load of carbs to fill them out?? imagine running sprints time after time and after your breathing out your ar*s*e you would find it hard to control your midsection......

distention is a real issue for some i had to contend with it at one point and i think for me it was putting on a load of weight and being as short as i am i have been criticised before but i also have wide hips which does not help the look, i do not use Insulin my GH dose for the last 4-5yrs has never been more than 8iu a day if that at all......for me true distention is a combination of factors and poor posture is one...there is a reason no one and i mean no one can provide proof any one thing or anyone combination of things cause this and that is because different Peds react differently with different people and there genetics.

if it was only down to GH and insulin then everyone would suffer to a degree who took these drugs and the fact is they don't, i have noticed guys many amateurs suffer from this when they force feed themselves in the off season though......but what has to be realised is distention can only be really seen on stage as then there is no fat, many might be bloated but this is different.

i noticed the post about the Pro's going backwards sorry but that is the most stupidest thing i have heard......they are photographed at every angle on stage you try competing without breathing out your ass at some point....


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## Milky

Pscarb said:


> not every BB who's stomach sticks out has distention of those who have commented who has stood onstage and carried out comparison after comparison on a hot stage dehydrated will a load of carbs to fill them out?? imagine running sprints time after time and after your breathing out your ar*s*e you would find it hard to control your midsection......
> 
> distention is a real issue for some i had to contend with it at one point and i think for me it was putting on a load of weight and being as short as i am i have been criticised before but i also have wide hips which does not help the look, i do not use Insulin my GH dose for the last 4-5yrs has never been more than 8iu a day if that at all......for me true distention is a combination of factors and poor posture is one...there is a reason no one and i mean no one can provide proof any one thing or anyone combination of things cause this and that is because different Peds react differently with different people and there genetics.
> 
> if it was only down to GH and insulin then everyone would suffer to a degree who took these drugs and the fact is they don't, i have noticed guys many amateurs suffer from this when they force feed themselves in the off season though......but what has to be realised is distention can only be really seen on stage as then there is no fat, many might be bloated but this is different.
> 
> *i noticed the post about the Pro's going backwards sorry but that is the most stupidest thing i have heard......they are photographed at every angle on stage you try competing without breathing out your ass at some point....[/*QUOTE]
> 
> I once heard someone say " the difference between a great photo and a crap one on stage can be a split second " absolutely spot on IMO...


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## Blinkey

Pscarb said:


> not every BB who's stomach sticks out has distention of those who have commented who has stood onstage and carried out comparison after comparison on a hot stage dehydrated will a load of carbs to fill them out?? imagine running sprints time after time and after your breathing out your ar*s*e you would find it hard to control your midsection......
> 
> distention is a real issue for some i had to contend with it at one point and i think for me it was putting on a load of weight and being as short as i am i have been criticised before but i also have wide hips which does not help the look, i do not use Insulin my GH dose for the last 4-5yrs has never been more than 8iu a day if that at all......for me true distention is a combination of factors and poor posture is one...there is a reason no one and i mean no one can provide proof any one thing or anyone combination of things cause this and that is because different Peds react differently with different people and there genetics.
> 
> if it was only down to GH and insulin then everyone would suffer to a degree who took these drugs and the fact is they don't, i have noticed guys many amateurs suffer from this when they force feed themselves in the off season though......but what has to be realised is distention can only be really seen on stage as then there is no fat, many might be bloated but this is different.
> 
> i noticed the post about the Pro's going backwards sorry but that is the most stupidest thing i have heard......they are photographed at every angle on stage you try competing without breathing out your ass at some point....


It is not a stupid thing, it is another opinion. the post was more about perhaps how the ethos of BB has been lost along the way.


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## Milky

I noticed later into his carreer Coleman did a lot of poses with an arm or both arms in front of his stomach IMO to try to hide this issue...


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## dtlv

Pscarb said:


> not every BB who's stomach sticks out has distention of those who have commented who has stood onstage and carried out comparison after comparison on a hot stage dehydrated will a load of carbs to fill them out?? imagine running sprints time after time and after your breathing out your ar*s*e you would find it hard to control your midsection......
> 
> distention is a real issue for some i had to contend with it at one point and i think for me it was putting on a load of weight and being as short as i am i have been criticised before but i also have wide hips which does not help the look, i do not use Insulin my GH dose for the last 4-5yrs has never been more than 8iu a day if that at all......for me true distention is a combination of factors and poor posture is one...there is a reason no one and i mean no one can provide proof any one thing or anyone combination of things cause this and that is because different Peds react differently with different people and there genetics.
> 
> if it was only down to GH and insulin then everyone would suffer to a degree who took these drugs and the fact is they don't, i have noticed guys many amateurs suffer from this when they force feed themselves in the off season though......but what has to be realised is distention can only be really seen on stage as then there is no fat, many might be bloated but this is different.
> 
> i noticed the post about the Pro's going backwards sorry but that is the most stupidest thing i have heard......they are photographed at every angle on stage you try competing without breathing out your ass at some point....


Some real good points about the breathing on stage with all the posing under hot lights etc... is difficult for any of us not having done that to appreciate it, and needs to be reminded. Physical structure too as you say can often give an appearance of distension that isn't really there - was thinking about that just now too.

Since you are now a qualified judge, do you think from that perspective it's a common mark down issue, or are we making a little much of it? Also adding the vacum pose to manditories, good idea or not worth it?


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## Tinytom

While I do agree that lots of pro guys have massive guts now a lot don't.

If it was purely down to the drugs then every one of them would have it and they don't.

Not saying they don't use tons of gear or Gh or whatever but also remember the amount of food necessary to plough in on a daily basis will cause the intestine to expand. This happens in normal people as well and part of the mentality behind stomach stapling is to lessen the amount of food that can be eaten and as well as reducing calories it reduces the work needed to be done by the small and large intestine.

This over time helps to reduce stomach bloat.

Like Paul has said standing on stage dehydrated under hot lights tires you out immensely and by the end of it you feel battered so holding your stomach in is very difficult. Plus if you have excess carbs in your gut but no water this will make the intestine rock solid and so posing the abs is very difficult.

I'm not saying its not helped by the drugs but its not JUST the drugs.


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## phoenix1980

Thats absolutely horrendous!!!!


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## Milky

Tinytom said:


> While I do agree that lots of pro guys have massive guts now a lot don't.
> 
> If it was purely down to the drugs then every one of them would have it and they don't.
> 
> Not saying they don't use tons of gear or Gh or whatever but also remember the amount of food necessary to plough in on a daily basis will cause the intestine to expand. This happens in normal people as well and part of the mentality behind stomach stapling is to lessen the amount of food that can be eaten and as well as reducing calories it reduces the work needed to be done by the small and large intestine.
> 
> This over time helps to reduce stomach bloat.
> 
> Like Paul has said standing on stage dehydrated under hot lights tires you out immensely and by the end of it you feel battered so holding your stomach in is very difficult. Plus if you have excess carbs in your gut but no water this will make the intestine rock solid and so posing the abs is very difficult.
> 
> I'm not saying its not helped by the drugs but its not JUST the drugs.


Weeman has a real issue with this and he agrees with you, the outrageous amount of cals they consume have to go somewhere...


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## 3752

The Vegetarian said:


> It is not a stupid thing, it is another opinion. the post was more about perhaps how the ethos of BB has been lost along the way.


exactly as me thinking it was a stupid comment was my opinion


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## 3752

dtlv said:


> Some real good points about the breathing on stage with all the posing under hot lights etc... is difficult for any of us not having done that to appreciate it, and needs to be reminded. Physical structure too as you say can often give an appearance of distension that isn't really there - was thinking about that just now too.
> 
> *Since you are now a qualified judge, do you think from that perspective it's a common mark down issue, or are we making a little much of it? Also adding the vacum pose to manditories, good idea or not worth it?*


if a competitor has real distention you cannot hide it in all poses for me this would be marked down i do think to much is made of it though as many throw assumptions around with no real idea of what it is with most backing up there theory with the good old days they did not have it........says who?

back in Arnolds Day (which many harp back to) the biggest guys onstage where 230-240lbs (maybe there was one or two exceptions) nowadays they are much more common, this is to do with more widespread drug use and availability of food and supplements i can bet arnold did not eat 7000+ cals per day.....plus who is to say there was no distention back then? shows and Pros in general where not photographed as much......

as for the vacum pose lets be fair here how many of guys who are average build or even natty can do this as it should be done??? i don't mean suck your stomach in but a true vacum pose i would bet not many and whats it showing? that you can suck your stomach all the way in???


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## Blinkey

Pscarb said:


> exactly as me thinking it was a stupid comment was my opinion


I gave an opinion on how I see pro BB in its current form. You call it stupid. I have full respect on what you have achieved and the knowledge that you have. But I feel that just because my views perhaps differ from yours give you no right to call my view as stupid. Different, yes, but stupid, no.

UKM should be able to facilitate an opinion without mods calling fellow members views, because they are not the same as theirs, as stupid.


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## 3752

The Vegetarian said:


> I gave an opinion on how I see pro BB in its current form. You call it stupid. I have full respect on what you have achieved and the knowledge that you have. But I feel that just because my views perhaps differ from yours give you no right to call my view as stupid. Different, yes, but stupid, no.
> 
> UKM should be able to facilitate an opinion without mods calling fellow members views, because they are not the same as theirs, as stupid.


oooops sorry did my written word offend you? I am sorry now do you feel better? Jesus grow a pair mate


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## Blinkey

Pscarb said:


> oooops sorry did my written word offend you? I am sorry now do you feel better? Jesus grow a pair mate


Not offended, just disappointed. And if I grew a pair I would be called 4 bollocks.


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## 3752

The Vegetarian said:


> Not offended, just disappointed. And if I grew a pair I would be called 4 bollocks.


Disappointment is a fact of life it is good to hear you can deal with it........


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## onthebuild

Got to agree with most, for me the 'mass monster' is not pleasing to the eye, and I much prefer the bb'ers of the 70's/80's.

But then again if they were pleasing to the eye they wouldnt be called monsters would they?


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## Blinkey

Pscarb said:


> Disappointment is a fact of life it is good to hear you can deal with it........


Disappointment is one of the facts of life that everyone suffers, but this is different to the response that someone gives because someone has a different opinion to there's.


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## andyhuggins

At the end of the day it,s what the judges are looking for you to replicate on stage. You just have to bring what they want with a twist to stick out from the crowd.


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## MrM

I think some of it comes down to modern photography - digital camera means they can just keep their finger on the button and fire off a thousand photos, inevitably they will get some horrific photos of athletes who are exhausted and look bad.

I'm not saying its the only reason bit it's part of it, personally I'm a big Frank Zane fan and would love to see it head more down that route.


----------



## stone14

Milky said:


> Weeman has a real issue with this and he agrees with you, the outrageous amount of cals they consume have to go somewhere...


yeh i think people seem to forget the mass amounts of food that goes in daily putting a constant stretch on the core area, plus the bloat from carbs and protein digestion. i think most will look pregnant if they relaxed there core. im only 200+lb average joe on 5000-6000cals ed atm and on a bulk if i let my stomach relax it moons right out, but its not fat or distended, that just the **** that happens lol.


----------



## stone14

i do noticed more bloating on slin and i actually feel a stretch on my stomach skin if i relax, but thats temporary while im on, i dont believe its distended i dont use enough or been on enough and dont think i even will use enough to cause that. i have read a post that said the intestines have more receptors to absorb carbs so that could be a reason for bloat in the stomach on slin, but that was just a random post, cant remember were or when i read it.


----------



## stone14

onthebuild said:


> Got to agree with most, for me the 'mass monster' is not pleasing to the eye, and I much prefer the bb'ers of the 70's/80's.
> 
> But then again if they were pleasing to the eye they wouldnt be called monsters would they?


i agree, i think its great to push your size to the max but its not the best look for mr oly's i think the 240-260lb's look alot better


----------



## stone14

MrM said:


> I think some of it comes down to modern photography - digital camera means they can just keep their finger on the button and fire off a thousand photos, inevitably they will get some horrific photos of athletes who are exhausted and look bad.
> 
> .


yeh i think hes just been caught taking a deep breath in in that pic.


----------



## greekgod

dtlv said:


> I saw this pic of Marcus Haley at the Arnolds this last weekend and it's so horrible I can't get it out of my head...
> 
> View attachment 113225
> 
> 
> Anyone else really repulsed by that kind of look? Apparently several of the others came in with similar pregnant look too... just shocking IMO.


you right it doesnt look good, but in all fairness the camera has clicked him in a bad light ,so to speak he's was taking in air to hit an abb shot... true, no excuse for the GH /PALUMBO look... welcome to the now era of b/building


----------



## dtlv

greekgod said:


> you right it doesnt look good, but in all fairness the camera has clicked him in a bad light ,so to speak he's was taking in air to hit an abb shot... true, no excuse for the GH /PALUMBO look... welcome to the now era of b/building


Yes agreed it was the worst moment for a camera to click because he does look a lot better than that and the shot definitely doesn't do him any justice. I know he was rolling his abs at that moment too, and probably a bit puffed out also, but it's still just such a visually unappealing pic.


----------



## Lockon

I'm a big fan of bodybuilding from the beginning to 1999. Now they just look fat. 4% bf with a bigger beer belly than most isn't the perfect physique.


----------



## andyhuggins

Have to agree about the camera shots its probably a split second breath before the pose.


----------



## Gee Kay

not a good look yuk


----------



## ClarkyBoy

BatemanLondon said:


> i believe GH can make the cartilaginous sternum grow and also has an impact on the upper intestine ..
> 
> before anyone asks me for quotes , I have this in my head and I am sure i was told this or read it .. sounds legit right ? lol


Quotes or gtfo....


----------



## B.I.G

I personally prefer the mass monsters who still are in proportion. Flex Wheeler had a great shape and size and didn't have a massive gut.


----------



## Bulk1

Agree with the old skool BB's over current. I may be wrong, but I don't recall seeing any pics of Arnie overloading back in his day during his offseason with the 'pregnant stomach look'.

I might be on my own here, but when you see guy's that have a good size and well built but with a fat belly they just look like fat greedy fookers.

The abs make or break you if your already in good shape everywhere else.


----------



## 3752

Why are most posting on here speaking as if every Pro has distension or look fat??

Phil Heath

Tony Freeman

Flex Lewis

Dextor

Wolf

Johnnycake Jackson

Even Kai (Now)

Centapani

More and more can be named so I don't get why most are clumping all pros into this category???


----------



## cas

Pscarb said:


> Why are most posting on here speaking as if every Pro has distension or look fat??
> 
> Phil Heath
> 
> Tony Freeman
> 
> Flex Lewis
> 
> Dextor
> 
> Wolf
> 
> Johnnycake Jackson
> 
> Even Kai (Now)
> 
> Centapani
> 
> More and more can be named so I don't get why most are clumping all pros into this category???


Wolf's stomach looks like a machine! Well they all look pretty good..


----------



## cas

Waist lines don't get much smaller than this do they, just a shame about his high lats


----------



## dtlv

Pscarb said:


> Why are most posting on here speaking as if every Pro has distension or look fat??
> 
> Phil Heath
> 
> Tony Freeman
> 
> Flex Lewis
> 
> Dextor
> 
> Wolf
> 
> Johnnycake Jackson
> 
> Even Kai (Now)
> 
> Centapani
> 
> More and more can be named so I don't get why most are clumping all pros into this category???


Yep, not all by any means have that issue. One of my fav relatively new pros to break through is Rhoden, who has a tiny waist and a great physique.


----------



## Milky

dtlv said:


> Yep, not all by any means have that issue. One of my fav relatively new pros to break through is Rhoden, who has a tiny waist and a great physique.


Rhoden has a big future IMO.

I think we may be seeing a turn around in this tho as the likes of Heath have shown it doesnt have to be like that.


----------



## essexboy

Pscarb said:


> not every BB who's stomach sticks out has distention of those who have commented who has stood onstage and carried out comparison after comparison on a hot stage dehydrated will a load of carbs to fill them out?? imagine running sprints time after time and after your breathing out your ar*s*e you would find it hard to control your midsection......
> 
> distention is a real issue for some i had to contend with it at one point and i think for me it was putting on a load of weight and being as short as i am i have been criticised before but i also have wide hips which does not help the look, i do not use Insulin my GH dose for the last 4-5yrs has never been more than 8iu a day if that at all......for me true distention is a combination of factors and poor posture is one...there is a reason no one and i mean no one can provide proof any one thing or anyone combination of things cause this and that is because different Peds react differently with different people and there genetics.
> 
> if it was only down to GH and insulin then everyone would suffer to a degree who took these drugs and the fact is they don't, i have noticed guys many amateurs suffer from this when they force feed themselves in the off season though......but what has to be realised is distention can only be really seen on stage as then there is no fat, many might be bloated but this is different.
> 
> i noticed the post about the Pro's going backwards sorry but that is the most stupidest thing i have heard......they are photographed at every angle on stage you try competing without breathing out your ass at some point....


I dont agree that breathing has any inpact on this "gut" Issue.Nor do I accept that food does either.View any major competition from 30 years ago.The issue didnt exist.Are we to believe that competitors of that time didnt breath heavily of eat too much?

No something else is to blame.That something is drug/gh use.Individuals responses will vary, as they do with any drug therapy.Some get it, some dont.

Interestingly, I recall the first time that what came to be labelled "distention" was directed at Mike Mentzer.Who conicidentally was the first top level competitor, to admit GH use.


----------



## Milky

The think is its like anything in life, things have to progress to survive and unfortunatly the only BB'ing can progress is size, you cant get more conditioned, you can only get bigger so for this condition suffers.

Just my opinion, l personally think its a shame, give me Wheeler, Ray and Charles Clairemonte any day TBH.


----------



## dtlv

Milky said:


> Rhoden has a big future IMO.
> 
> I think we may be seeing a turn around in this tho as the likes of Heath have shown it doesnt have to be like that.


In one sense I kind of regret starting this thread, because I did kind of overreact to the pic of Haley... but it's spawned a few arguments and a nice debate so all good.

I agree, and as I said in the other thread about bodybuilding losing its way I think things evolve over time and often kind of go in circles and it is turning around maybe. I think there has been a slight move back towards the more aesthetic look... am actually really interested in this years mr O to see what happens with Cutler back in the mix, and with Heath, Kai and Rhoden all up there. Been a while since I've cared too much about the mr O to be honest.


----------



## Milky

essexboy said:


> I dont agree that breathing has any inpact on this "gut" Issue.Nor do I accept that food does either.View any major competition from 30 years ago.The issue didnt exist.Are we to believe that competitors of that time didnt breath heavily of eat too much?
> 
> No something else is to blame.That something is drug/gh use.Individuals responses will vary, as they do with any drug therapy.Some get it, some dont.
> 
> Interestingly, I recall the first time that what came to be labelled "distention" was directed at Mike Mentzer.Who conicidentally was the first top level competitor, to admit GH use.


I a currently watching Ant and Dec mate and felt compelled to respond too the breathing part of your qoute.

There are a group of dancers here called spellbound and there are teenagers who are slim as fu*k with abs but one or two were caught on camera blowing a bit and even there skinny little guts stuck out profusely...

I actually believe its a combination of ALL the factors you mention but l have said before it takes a split second to make the difference betwee a great pic and a crap one.


----------



## Barman

Mingster said:


> I know I'm probably going against popular thinking here, but I don't like the current bodybuilding look full stop. They all look virtually the same. Back in the day the field was full of individuals with their own 'look.' Sergio and Arnold and Franco and Lou all had their own individual look and character. Nowadays it's like a production line imo...


Yeh alot of amatures look better than bros to and better conditioning and i also think its to do with these guys put so much mass on i all just blurs together look at ronnie before he got super huge he looked amazing then thrugh the years he was just a blob of meat


----------



## musio

ewen said:


> i read somewhere that protein powders were more to blame than gh lol something to do with casein setting like a thick cement in the intestines and this is how its slow released into the body .


Where did you read this?


----------



## MRSTRONG

musio said:


> Where did you read this?


cant remember mate but it does sound possible .


----------



## balance

I feel that if competitive bodybuilding was mainstream and observed by people in the same way that football, tennis or marathons were that you would probably see less of the freaky sights but because they are unknown to the general public its like its not acceptable but the competitive bodybuilding world is too small to make much of a fuss over it.


----------



## 3752

essexboy said:


> I dont agree that breathing has any inpact on this "gut" Issue.Nor do I accept that food does either.View any major competition from 30 years ago.The issue didnt exist.Are we to believe that competitors of that time didnt breath heavily of eat too much?
> 
> No something else is to blame.That something is drug/gh use.Individuals responses will vary, as they do with any drug therapy.Some get it, some dont.
> 
> Interestingly, I recall the first time that what came to be labelled "distention" was directed at Mike Mentzer.Who conicidentally was the first top level competitor, to admit GH use.


You don't have to agree but I cannot see how you can dismiss the food issue when the top big guys are eating upwards of 7000calories per day but as I mentioned before no one person can point at one thing that causes it and until they do all people are doing including me and you are making a guess


----------



## essexboy

Pscarb said:


> You don't have to agree but I cannot see how you can dismiss the food issue when the top big guys are eating upwards of 7000calories per day but as I mentioned before no one person can point at one thing that causes it and until they do all people are doing including me and you are making a guess


Well, obviously its all speculation.However, as I previously stated.The problem didnt exist 30 years ago.Are we to summise that huge calorific input, is a recent development? I dont think so.Im sure excessive eating was as prevelant in the 60s/70s/80s as it is today.


----------



## Milky

essexboy said:


> Well, obviously its all speculation.However, as I previously stated.The problem didnt exist 30 years ago.Are we to summise that huge calorific input, is a recent development? I dont think so.Im sure excessive eating was as prevelant in the 60s/70s/80s as it is today.


personally l dont think it was mate, nor was the gear use.

People back then had no sponsors etc and couldnt afford the massive amounts of food the guys eat now IMO.


----------



## dentylad

Many years ago, all bodybuilders had to play with was basic test, deca and the orals but now its all gh this and pro hormone that. Urgh! Give me normal shnitt any day :scared:


----------



## 3752

essexboy said:


> Well, obviously its all speculation.However, as I previously stated.The problem didnt exist 30 years ago.Are we to summise that huge calorific input, is a recent development? I dont think so.Im sure excessive eating was as prevelant in the 60s/70s/80s as it is today.


Really how big where the biggest BB back in the 60s,70s,80s really who was the biggest?? 230, 240 maybe?? Opposed to guys 250, 260+ being a regular thing now and that is all drugs is it? As you have clearly said above it is speculation you might believe they eat excessive calories that does not mean they did and what was considered excessive back then?? As many have pointed out more drugs are available now and so more use them at bigger doses just as food is more available more supplements so by that simple theory would you not say they then use more now than back then??.......but as I said guessing


----------



## Leeds89

Milky said:


> I a currently watching Ant and Dec mate and felt compelled to respond too the breathing part of your qoute.
> 
> There are a group of dancers here called spellbound and there are teenagers who are slim as fu*k with abs but one or two were caught on camera blowing a bit and even there skinny little guts stuck out profusely...
> 
> I actually believe its a combination of ALL the factors you mention but l have said before *it takes a split second to make the difference betwee a great pic and a crap one*.


I watched him at the Arnold Classic and he didn't look anywhere near as bad as the picture in the OP actually


----------



## dentylad

If you see pics of old bodybuilders like dorian 20years ago or a bloke called shawn the dinosaur bulldog if I remember right, you would notice their body composition was quite watery and 'stocky' to put it in a matter of speaking but pro's these days have no problem being ripped and huge providing they get the balance of nutrition and gear use right.


----------



## dentylad

Pscarb said:


> Really how big where the biggest BB back in the 60s,70s,80s really who was the biggest?? 230, 240 maybe?? Opposed to guys 250, 260+ being a regular thing now and that is all drugs is it? As you have clearly said above it is speculation you might believe they eat excessive calories that does not mean they did and what was considered excessive back then?? As many have pointed out more drugs are available now and so more use them at bigger doses just as food is more available more supplements so by that simple theory would you not say they then use more now than back then??.......but as I said guessing


Protein back then was that 90+ crap and wharever chicken and beans you could eat. You are right, things have come a hell of a long way including training methods and science.


----------



## essexboy

Pscarb said:


> Really how big where the biggest BB back in the 60s,70s,80s really who was the biggest?? 230, 240 maybe?? Opposed to guys 250, 260+ being a regular thing now and that is all drugs is it? As you have clearly said above it is speculation you might believe they eat excessive calories that does not mean they did and what was considered excessive back then?? As many have pointed out more drugs are available now and so more use them at bigger doses just as food is more available more supplements so by that simple theory would you not say they then use more now than back then??.......but as I said guessing


Link to a USA site, that offers treatment advice for doctors.If you read the list of possible side effects,something becomes apparent.

http://www.md-health.com/Growth-Hormone-Side-Effects.html


----------



## PHMG

dentylad said:


> If you see pics of old bodybuilders like dorian 20years ago or a bloke called shawn the dinosaur bulldog if I remember right, you would notice their body composition was quite watery and 'stocky' to put it in a matter of speaking but pro's these days have no problem being ripped and huge providing they get the balance of nutrition and gear use right.


yeah. i hated dorians watery stocky look :whistling:


----------



## luther1

I suffer badly from abdominal distention and can breath out and genuinely look pregnant with triplets,and was led to believe it was caused by gas/slow food digestion/fats in the small intestine.


----------



## 3752

essexboy said:


> Link to a USA site, that offers treatment advice for doctors.If you read the list of possible side effects,something becomes apparent.
> 
> http://www.md-health.com/Growth-Hormone-Side-Effects.html


Yes that's it you solved it GH is the cause it must be as it says it in this list under 'Rare side effect' there you go you have found the answer to the mystery :thumb:


----------



## 3752

luther1 said:


> I suffer badly from abdominal distention and can breath out and genuinely look pregnant with triplets,and was led to believe it was caused by gas/slow food digestion/fats in the small intestine.


NO it is not it is all down to GH look at @essexboy link


----------



## onthebuild

Pscarb said:


> Yes that's it you solved it GH is the cause it must be as it says it in this list under 'Rare side effect' there you go you have found the answer to the mystery :thumb:


Haven't read the link, but if it's for doctors then surely it's talking about doses of gh a doctor would prescribe?

If tren were prescribed as a TRT dose, then most wouldn't experience insomnia/sweating, it's only when the dose in increased these sides appear. But it's laughable to describe tren sides as 'extremely rare' in the bodybuilding community.

Just a thought, it MAY be a rare side effect in a minuscule dose, but if you increase this dramatically as bodybuilders do, it may become more prevalent.

Just a thought, as I'm sitting on the fence and believe its a combination of many factors leading to this increase, so I kind of agree with everyone!


----------



## 3752

onthebuild said:


> Haven't read the link, but if it's for doctors then surely it's talking about doses of gh a doctor would prescribe?
> 
> If tren were prescribed as a TRT dose, then most wouldn't experience insomnia/sweating, it's only when the dose in increased these sides appear. But it's laughable to describe tren sides as 'extremely rare' in the bodybuilding community.
> 
> Just a thought, it MAY be a rare side effect in a minuscule dose, but if you increase this dramatically as bodybuilders do, it may become more prevalent.
> 
> Just a thought, as I'm sitting on the fence and believe its a combination of many factors leading to this increase, so I kind of agree with everyone!


What the hell has tren got to do with this???

Look up aspirin and look at the possible side effects of that, the point is and everyone knows this is that rare side effects are just that rare there is no side note saying "these are rare only at x dose" if GH was the true cause of distension the. It would be a side effect not a rare side effect there is a lot of assumptions being made with very little fact.....

If this was the cause then why was it not seen in Arnold's day or the 80's and 90's GH was available back then and plenty of it especially to Pro's?? Again there are many assumptions on GH dose for the Pro's with no real fact to numbers just the "they must be using high doses" quote to justify there size


----------



## onthebuild

Pscarb said:


> What the hell has tren got to do with this???
> 
> Look up aspirin and look at the possible side effects of that, the point is and everyone knows this is that rare side effects are just that rare there is no side not saying "these are rare only at x dose" if GH was the true cause of distension the. It would be a side effect not a rare side effect there is a lot of assumptions being made with very little fact


Yes mate but what I'm saying is a 'rare' side effect of any drug, just using tren as an example, is more likely to become more prevalent the more of the drug you take.

A very rare side effect of paracetamol would be death, but take enough of the stuff and it becomes a very real one.

There is also a lot of assumption in bodybuilders of today eating 7000 cals and bb'ers of the 80's/90's not IMO.


----------



## 3752

onthebuild said:


> Yes mate but what I'm saying is a 'rare' side effect of any drug, just using tren as an example, is more likely to become more prevalent the more of the drug you take.
> 
> A very rare side effect of paracetamol would be death, but take enough of the stuff and it becomes a very real one.
> 
> There is also a lot of assumption in bodybuilders of today eating 7000 cals and bb'ers of the 80's/90's not IMO.


Correct and as I said earlier it is all speculation there is no fact to any of this no one knows what causes it and why it effects some and not others, finding a list of side effects and belly enlargement being noted as a rare side effect does not prove anything, u mention the "take enough of anything" theory but how much is to much or enough to make a rare side effect a real one?? 10iu, 20iu's etc my point is NO ONE KNOWS not me not you not even essexboy


----------



## onthebuild

Pscarb said:


> Correct and as I said earlier it is all speculation there is no fact to any of this no one knows what causes it and why it effects some and not others, finding a list of side effects and belly enlargement being noted as a rare side effect does not prove anything, u mention the "take enough of anything" theory but how much is to much or enough to make a rare side effect a real one?? 10iu, 20iu's etc my point is NO ONE KNOWS not me not you not even essexboy


I agree that no one knows, but I would think it common sense that increases in doseage equal increases in side effects.

And when you see examples of bodybuilders who use (and arguably abuse) large doses of drugs with distention becoming more frequent, it only backs up these claims.

Interesting debate none the less, has there ever been a study to determine if its true that GH causes enlargement of the organs? Including intestines?


----------



## 3752

onthebuild said:


> I agree that no one knows, but I would think it common sense that increases in doseage equal increases in side effects.
> 
> And when you see examples of bodybuilders who use (and arguably abuse) large doses of drugs with distention becoming more frequent, it only backs up these claims.
> 
> Interesting debate none the less, has there ever been a study to determine if its true that GH causes enlargement of the organs? Including intestines?


Yea but this is my point show me where you have seen the true numbers of pro's using / abusing PEDs?? I am not saying it is not one of the causes but there are some huge Pro's with no distension.....

Plus going by some of the numbers guys on here are using half the members must have it 

A simple search on the net will give you a whole plethora of causes for distension

http://www.patient.co.uk/doctor/Abdominal-Distension-and-Bloating.htm

http://www.puristat.com/bloating/abdominal-bloating-or-distention.aspx


----------



## marknorthumbria

All I know is if it ever happens to me I'll be one sad man with a fat belly !


----------



## C.Hill

Right. That's it. I'm doing planks for an hour everyday from now on.


----------



## luther1

As we have around 25feet of intestines,a little bloat can certainly make you look awful. Diet is the main culprit,especially carbs but gh certainly does increase organ growth,but as said before,at what what dose and duration. Pro biotics,freeze dried are a great relief for bloat but to try and diagnose the cause for a distended stomach on a bodybuilder is like trying to guess the cause of someones headache. Go to a doctor withsymptoms and you'll get told to drop carbs,esp oats wheat etc. I know a super heavyweight competitor who even off season never gets bloat or distended stomach. Diet,posture,ibs,gh etc it can be a combination of none or all


----------



## saxondale

cas said:


> Waist lines don't get much smaller than this do they,* just a shame* about his high lats


your taking the psss right?


----------



## cas

saxondale said:


> your taking the psss right?


About what?


----------



## TELBOR

cas said:


> About what?


Tiny waists 

These are 'tiny'


----------



## saxondale

cas said:


> About what?


high lats been a flaw when you look that good (no ****)


----------



## cas

R0BLET said:


> Tiny waists
> 
> These are 'tiny'
> 
> View attachment 113436
> 
> 
> View attachment 113437


I'm on about compared to todays bbrs not people from 260 years ago


----------



## jake87

all i can say is..thank fvck for shawn rhoden taking the ifbb pro physique back to what it should be like


----------



## TELBOR

cas said:


> I'm on about compared to todays bbrs not people from 260 years ago


Lol, ok :lol:


----------



## jake87

cas said:


> Waist lines don't get much smaller than this do they, just a shame about his high lats


i hope youre having a laugh about his waist


----------



## saxondale

jake87 said:


> i hope youre having a laugh about his waist


thats the least of his worries, apparently he has "high lats"

such a shame.


----------



## DeadlyCoobra

jake87 said:


> i hope youre having a laugh about his waist


Top picture is dennis wolf, who does have a small waist line, pic you posted is of jay cutler, this is dennis wolfs waistline:


----------



## Themanthatcan

That just looks disgusting, go for the Jay Cutler look anyday


----------



## jake87

hahaha they both have the same nose. yeh fair play wolf has a tiny waist


----------



## cas

DeadlyCoobra said:


> Top picture is dennis wolf, who does have a small waist line, pic you posted is of jay cutler, this is dennis wolfs waistline:


Nice to see someone can spot the difference between the two lol


----------



## stone14

DeadlyCoobra said:


> Top picture is dennis wolf, who does have a small waist line, pic you posted is of jay cutler, this is dennis wolfs waistline:


he looks bigger in the pic on the left. is that cold and pumped? lol


----------



## DeadlyCoobra

stone14 said:


> he looks bigger in the pic on the left. is that cold and pumped? lol


Im not sure, i think the right hand pic is the genuine one though, he doesnt have the best arm genetics and i think the left pic is a "what he could look like pic" but im not too sure


----------



## Milky

saxondale said:


> thats the least of his worries, apparently he has "high lats"
> 
> such a shame.


Wolf DOES have high lats, its a fact and possibly the reason he hasnt placed better in the Olympia....

Look at a lat spread front or rear if you dont believe me...


----------



## cas

Milky said:


> Wolf DOES have high lats, its a fact and possibly the reason he hasnt placed better in the Olympia....
> 
> Look at a lat spread front or rear if you dont believe me...


Atleast someone agrees with me


----------



## Milky

cas said:


> Atleast someone agrees with me


Its a real shame mate he has a cracking physique apart from it.


----------



## balance

Just gonna throw this in but Shawn Ray always looked fantastic to me. His abdominal region remained tight looking from what i remember.


----------



## Milky

balance said:


> Just gonna throw this in but Shawn Ray always looked fantastic to me. His abdominal region remained tight looking from what i remember.


Yep, he was a great package, not as good as Wheeler tho IMO.


----------



## cas

Milky said:


> Its a real shame mate he has a cracking physique apart from it.


It is a shame, he has a awesome body. And comes in well conditioned. In a relaxed pose he looks awesome..its just those couple of things letting him down


----------



## rectus

I'm not sure if this has been posted already but the man speaks about it here: http://forums.musculardevelopment.com/showthread.php/69658-Outakes-from-the-Marcus-Haley-amp-Clarence-De-Vis-training-at-Body-Tech


----------



## dtlv

A slight thread de-rail, but these are the guys from the late eighties/early nineties who inspired me the most -



Lee Haney, Lee Labrada, Rich Gaspari, Flex Wheeler, Shawn Ray and Kevin Levrone.

There are others of that time too too, and many others from earlier ages of bodybuilding and some later on of course, but for me that was the end of the golden age when awe inspiring physiques seemed everywhere. Nowadays there are many guys with superb physiques, but few who inspire me like these guys did (and still do).


----------



## saxondale

DeadlyCoobra said:


> Top picture is dennis wolf, who does have a small waist line, pic you posted is of jay cutler, this is dennis wolfs waistline:


jeses he`s hidious with those high lats


----------



## Milky

saxondale said:


> jeses he`s hidious with those high lats


I am confused here, are you saying he doesnt have them ?


----------



## saxondale

Milky said:


> I am confused here, are you saying he doesnt have them ?


he does, can see what you all mean in the newer pictures but I was saying I would be happy to look like him.


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## Milky

saxondale said:


> he does, can see what you all mean - the guy in the first picture who was incorrectly named didn`t but I would be happy to look like either of them to be fair.


Cutler doesnt have them no and your spot on l would like to look as good as either of them but it is an issue for him unfortunatly.


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## DeadlyCoobra

saxondale said:


> jeses he`s hidious with those high lats


Cant tell if youre being sarcastic? he does have high lat insertions, it is quite a big problem for him, it really takes away from his back double bicep:










Makes his delts look huge but his back look quite small...


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## 36-26

jake87 said:


> i hope youre having a laugh about his waist


That 2nd pic is Jay Cutler


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## Bull Terrier

Milky said:


> Yep, he was a great package, not as good as Wheeler tho IMO.


I agree with you Milky. That was a great age for bodybuilding though. For me the best physiques back then were Flex Wheeler, Kevin Levrone, Mohammed Benaziza, Shawn Ray and Andreas Munzer. I still don't think I've seen another bodybuilder with a more striated physique than Munzer.


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## infernal0988

this is just my opinion but hey its me so agree or not i will say it anyway , the guys today look awful ! Sorry but the only people who look anywhere near a decent look is Dexter & Phil now a days, & i dont even like them infact i dont like anyone that competes today its a freakshow its not longer art like it use to be. Bodybuilding use to be a thing of beauty now we have destroyed it the sport HAS lost its way. I weep for the future cause unless something is changed bodybuilding will be a lost cause.


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## luther1

Just thought I'd put this up as its in the current issue of Muscular Development. @Pscarb and @dtlv might find it of interest

http://www.musculardevelopment.com/news/bodybuilding-news/5384-the-big-gut-are-excess-gh-and-insulin-to-blame.html


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## johnnyg

thats just fcuking wrong in so many ways!


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## DeadlyCoobra

infernal0988 said:


> this is just my opinion but hey its me so agree or not i will say it anyway , the guys today look awful ! Sorry but the only people who look anywhere near a decent look is Dexter & Phil now a days, & i dont even like them infact i dont like anyone that competes today its a freakshow its not longer art like it use to be. Bodybuilding use to be a thing of beauty now we have destroyed it the sport HAS lost its way. I weep for the future cause unless something is changed bodybuilding will be a lost cause.


Well just so you know, it does seem like pro bodybuilding is going back towards the old school look. Phil winning was a start as he does have a small waist and aesthetic physique (sounds like you dont agree though). Shawn Rhoden won the arnold classic europe and placed 3rd at the olympia, Kai Greene came in lighter and focused on getting a tighter waist and placed 2nd at the olympia. Dexter Jackson won the arnold classic 2013 and the australian pro, great shape and small waist, beating a bigger and similarly conditioned ben pakulski who did not have the classic shape and small waist. Cedric Mcmillan has just been signed by MD, placed 5th at the arnold (his conditioning was waay off) but is being praised as a future mr olympia, he had the ultimate aesthetic physique. tony freeman has a small waist and good x frame, and although he wasnt in his best shape still took 3rd at the arnorld.

I watched an interview with jay cutler the other day and he was saying he has already started his ab training and isnt worried about mass as he know he has that covered, he is trying to tighten up his waist for the olympia. People are taking note and things are changing. The fact that muscular development have done a few big articles about gut distension / lack of narrow waist shows the awareness as before it was just ignored.

So dont weep for the future buddy it looks like things are going to be just fine! :thumb:


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## infernal0988

DeadlyCoobra said:


> Well just so you know, it does seem like pro bodybuilding is going back towards the old school look. Phil winning was a start as he does have a small waist and aesthetic physique (sounds like you dont agree though). Shawn Rhoden won the arnold classic europe and placed 3rd at the olympia, Kai Greene came in lighter and focused on getting a tighter waist and placed 2nd at the olympia. Dexter Jackson won the arnold classic 2013 and the australian pro, great shape and small waist, beating a bigger and similarly conditioned ben pakulski who did not have the classic shape and small waist. Cedric Mcmillan has just been signed by MD, placed 5th at the arnold (his conditioning was waay off) but is being praised as a future mr olympia, he had the ultimate aesthetic physique. tony freeman has a small waist and good x frame, and although he wasnt in his best shape still took 3rd at the arnorld.
> 
> I watched an interview with jay cutler the other day and he was saying he has already started his ab training and isnt worried about mass as he know he has that covered, he is trying to tighten up his waist for the olympia. People are taking note and things are changing. The fact that muscular development have done a few big articles about gut distension / lack of narrow waist shows the awareness as before it was just ignored.
> 
> So dont weep for the future buddy it looks like things are going to be just fine! :thumb:


I certainly hope so cause i love it and bodybuilding has made a significant impact on my life


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## DeadlyCoobra

infernal0988 said:


> I certainly hope so cause i love it and bodybuilding has made a significant impact on my life


Future Mr O when he gets his conditioning right, Is this physique what you mean or is he still a freakshow in your opinion?


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## infernal0988

DeadlyCoobra said:


> Future Mr O when he gets his conditioning right, Is this physique what you mean or is he still a freakshow in your opinion?


thats a perfect size not to big & not to small with a very pleasing physique


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## andyhuggins

Things tend to go in cycles mass then asthetics and so on.


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## DeadlyCoobra

infernal0988 said:


> thats a perfect size not to big & not to small with a very pleasing physique


Good stuff! haha he is pretty big though, 6'1" or 2", dwarfs everyone


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## luther1

infernal0988 said:


> thats a perfect size not to big & not to small with a very pleasing physique


6'1" and 256lb. Not a bad size!


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## dtlv

luther1 said:


> Just thought I'd put this up as its in the current issue of Muscular Development. @Pscarb and @dtlv might find it of interest
> 
> http://www.musculardevelopment.com/news/bodybuilding-news/5384-the-big-gut-are-excess-gh-and-insulin-to-blame.html


Interesting, good link. Have read studies that show the negative effects of GH upon insulin sensitivity, and that can occur even at HR doses of just a few IU's for a long enough time, but did not realize there was such a profound effect on visceral fat development - I thought the distention was mostly organ size growth as in animal studies. Insulin in large doses I didn't realize was so potentially bad either - will follow up some of the authors references, very interesting and reps for the share.


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## infernal0988

luther1 said:


> 6'1" and 256lb. Not a bad size!


how about 6,7 and 85 kg  ?


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