# Really come to a dead end ( I think)



## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

Basically having difficultly now getting the last bit of fat off. Not sure for its down to diet or what, but I know training and cardio is in check.

currently my **** body composition.

Macros at the moment is 2000 cals, 150 carbs and 50-60g fat.

Meal one 4 eggs

2 brown toast

Meal 2 Tuna and 2 slices of brown bread

Meal 3 same as above

Meal 4 chicken with veg

Meal 5 pre workout 50g oats with shake mixed and 3 weetabix

Meal 6 chicken with veg

Yes I think my diet is completely **** but I'm back to cutting and before I was carb cycling with was a lot easier with rice eggs chicken tuna and bread lol.

Thanks.
View attachment 162192


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## leezers (Mar 2, 2010)

What you reckon your bf is mate?


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## BettySwallocks (Aug 1, 2012)

I can't advise you because you're in better shape than I've ever been.

But credit where it's due, I remember when you first signed up here and you've come a long way. quality transformation pal :thumbup1:


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## JonnyBoy81 (Jun 26, 2013)

You look quite small, so perhaps drop the cals a bit. drop carbs up fats?

Im guessing you are still on gear so you can be a bit more agressive.


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## scot-ish (Oct 21, 2014)

what height/weight are you ? 2000 cals is what im on to cut fat, thats based on 83kg, 5 foot 11.

i'd say the easiest way is to drop another 200Kcals off - and take it from there.


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## Yes (May 4, 2014)

Were you very obese when you first started training? Loose skin?


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## Captain lats (Mar 25, 2014)

You look cool regardless young man. safe bruv.


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## Neuroscience (Sep 9, 2014)

people need to learn about insulin sensitivity and cortisol.

i mean i just had pizza with sauce hollandaise and ben and jerrys icecream. if i ate 2000 calories a day i would lose muscles and weight like mad. i lost 19kg just going sightly below 3000 for 9 months. now my bf is about 7-8% and i neither have great genetics nor a bodybuilding specific diet. all i do is make sure my nutrients are not being stored as fat by increasing insulin sensitivity mostly and training with very heavy weight, low volume, high frequency.


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## naturalun (Mar 21, 2014)

Maybe drop some carbs up fats, possibly. Although that diet is pretty much what I'll be hitting but i have a biiittt more fat than you so i can cope ending up with your condition lol.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

leezers said:


> What you reckon your bf is mate?


 probably 18% or so mate on some days I can see outline of abs lol like 4 lol.



BettySwallocks said:


> I can't advise you because you're in better shape than I've ever been.
> 
> But credit where it's due, I remember when you first signed up here and you've come a long way. quality transformation pal :thumbup1:


Haha thanks mate!



JonnyBoy81 said:


> You look quite small, so perhaps drop the cals a bit. drop carbs up fats?
> 
> Im guessing you are still on gear so you can be a bit more agressive.


Yeah I might try this, just on low dose test at the moment coming off shortly maybe.



scot-ish said:


> what height/weight are you ? 2000 cals is what im on to cut fat, thats based on 83kg, 5 foot 11.
> 
> i'd say the easiest way is to drop another 200Kcals off - and take it from there.


I'm 5ft5 and 72kf mate. Ahhh I see, I'm on a 500 deficit via cardio too.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

naturalun said:


> Maybe drop some carbs up fats, possibly. Although that diet is pretty much what I'll be hitting but i have a biiittt more fat than you so i can cope ending up with your condition lol.


Haha thanks mate. I'm no all that good still have fatty chest lol.



Neuroscience said:


> people need to learn about insulin sensitivity and cortisol.
> 
> i mean i just had pizza with sauce hollandaise and ben and jerrys icecream. if i ate 2000 calories a day i would lose muscles and weight like mad. i lost 19kg just going sightly below 3000 for 9 months. now my bf is about 7-8% and i neither have great genetics nor a bodybuilding specific diet. all i do is make sure my nutrients are not being stored as fat by increasing insulin sensitivity mostly and training with very heavy weight, low volume, high frequency.


 ahhh I see. I do have Chet meals yes and do help.



Captain lats said:


> You look cool regardless young man. safe bruv.


 thanks man much appreciated.



Yes said:


> Were you very obese when you first started training? Loose skin?


Yes I was mate, do have a lot of loose skin I think on my stomach. Haha.

Just a few shots.

View attachment 162189
View attachment 162190
View attachment 162191


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

View attachment 162188


Not sure on body fat but seem to have veins in. A lot of places I.e chest and stomach on certain days. Veins coming through on quads and calves lol. And well that's the arm shot uploaded


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## scot-ish (Oct 21, 2014)

i'd deffo be looking at dropping the Kcals a little bit more mate, from what i've got you should be looking betweek 1600-2000 cals assumption made that you are training everyday of the week.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

scot-ish said:


> i'd deffo be looking at dropping the Kcals a little bit more mate, from what i've got you should be looking betweek 1600-2000 cals assumption made that you are training everyday of the week.


Cheers. Does that calorie deficit from cardio not count


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## Marcus2014 (Mar 24, 2014)

HDU said:


> Cheers. Does that calorie deficit from cardio not count


Yes it does mate so if you do a diet deficit of 500cals and burn 500cals through cardio your total deficit will be 1000cals 

Ive always used keto to cut it's super effective and don't lose to much muscle in my case.


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## Robbie789 (Sep 6, 2012)

I'd say your maintenance was closer to 2300 if you're 72kg, drop the kcals an extra 300, you're on cycle so don't worry about muscle lose at your bodyfat mate, I'd say you were around 15-16%


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## troponin (Apr 2, 2014)

Tbh mate from pics looks like u hold most of your fat aroubd your chest and stomach. What compounds are you running atm?


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

Marcus2014 said:


> Yes it does mate so if you do a diet deficit of 500cals and burn 500cals through cardio your total deficit will be 1000cals
> 
> Ive always used keto to cut it's super effective and don't lose to much muscle in my case.


Ah yeah lol. After the deficit im looking around 1600-1700.

I don't think I could stick to keto probably always end up eating junk lol.



Robbie789 said:


> I'd say your maintenance was closer to 2300 if you're 72kg, drop the kcals an extra 300, you're on cycle so don't worry about muscle lose at your bodyfat mate, I'd say you were around 15-16%


Yeah my maintenance is around 2200/2300. And ah true. I just want my Bodyfat down asap then I can put some size on lol.



troponin said:


> Tbh mate from pics looks like u hold most of your fat aroubd your chest and stomach. What compounds are you running atm?


Yeah mate that's actually where im holding it all! Chest and stomach lol. I'm on test T3 and clen at the moment.


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## Robbie789 (Sep 6, 2012)

Mix up your cardio a bit too, that always helps me if I stall, 1-3 LISS a week 1-2 HIIT, used to do one the liss sessions fasted at the weekend


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## scot-ish (Oct 21, 2014)

HDU said:


> Cheers. Does that calorie deficit from cardio not count


assuming you are 25 :/, not much difference, maint is actually less than 1800, addiing in the fact you train 5-7 times a week, i still get that you should be between 1600-1900 Kcals a day to cut.

if you wanna drop more and are stuck, just knock another 100-150 off and see where you stand, you'll soon see if you weigh yerself in the same state a week apart.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

scot-ish said:


> assuming you are 25 :/, not much difference, maint is actually less than 1800, addiing in the fact you train 5-7 times a week, i still get that you should be between 1600-1900 Kcals a day to cut.
> 
> if you wanna drop more and are stuck, just knock another 100-150 off and see where you stand, you'll soon see if you weigh yerself in the same state a week apart.


Im not 25 lol! I'm 18.


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## andyhuggins (Nov 21, 2008)

keep the cals the same, but reduce the carbs and increase the fats if that makes sense?


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

andyhuggins said:


> keep the cals the same, but reduce the carbs and increase the fats if that makes sense?


Yep I get you. What would you say to increase fats too and drop carbs too?


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## Marcus2014 (Mar 24, 2014)

In that case matey

1)fasted weight (pre workout and bcaas of course)

2) PROPPER hiit cardio. Doing it properly you shouldn't be able to do more than 20 mins imo


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## andyhuggins (Nov 21, 2008)

HDU said:


> Yep I get you. What would you say to increase fats too and drop carbs too?


What are your current macros/cals for carbs and fats?


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

andyhuggins said:


> What are your current macros/cals for carbs and fats?


Currently cals are 2000, carbs 150 fats 60 Aprox.


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## scot-ish (Oct 21, 2014)

HDU said:


> Im not 25 lol! I'm 18.


age doesnt make too much difference. less than 50cals, between 25 and 18.


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## andyhuggins (Nov 21, 2008)

HDU said:


> Currently cals are 2000, carbs 150 fats 60 Aprox.


I would drop your carbs to 100g and adjust your fats accordingly. To start with.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

andyhuggins said:


> I would drop your carbs to 100g and adjust your fats accordingly. To start with.


Thank. I'll give this a go.


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## andyhuggins (Nov 21, 2008)

HDU said:


> Thank. I'll give this a go.


Best of luck @HDU its all about trial and error tbh .


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

andyhuggins said:


> Best of luck @HDU its all about trial and error tbh .


Suppose so it is all person dependent to be honest.


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## Robbie789 (Sep 6, 2012)

*If you're not loosing weight at 15%+ don't just adjust your macros, drop your calories ffs*


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## Kabz r34 (Aug 15, 2013)

How long have you been on the cal defict iifym diet? And how much have you lost in the time? Only asking as I'm doing the same and my body looks like your pic 5.


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

HDU said:


> View attachment 162188
> 
> 
> Not sure on body fat but seem to have veins in. A lot of places I.e chest and stomach on certain days. Veins coming through on quads and calves lol. And well that's the arm shot uploaded


try dropping carbs and upping fats slowly drop out after several weeks add in slight cardio

also diet for 2-3 weeks without cheating, bring food up to maintenance and eat clean for 2 days and you should continue losing weight then drop again

its all about metabolism and how efficient your metabolism is at burning fat and using nutrients correctly as neuroscience said.

read up on phil learney metabolism damage


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## Neuroscience (Sep 9, 2014)

don't drop calories, try using something like glycophase, glycobol or burn24 before carb rich meals. it will give you more energy, fuller muscles, help burn bodyfat and also allow you to work out harder which in turn will make you stronger in the gym and burn more calories and increase your insulin sensitivity even more.

my friend was 110kg, on gear, 2800kcal, low carb, very big and strong but just couldn't lose fat. i recommended glycobol and he dropped 10kg in 2 months while maintaining his muscle mass eating 3200 calories and 300 grams of carbohydrates.

if you don't lose fat or get lean on 3000 or less, being a hrad training athlete, increasing cardio or training frequency and dcreseing calories is not the way to go, manipuating metabolism is much more effective.


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## Sambuca (Jul 25, 2012)

your diet is ****e mate

if you wanna lose all that fat then u need to change it up completely.

plenty of Omegas, vitamin C etc

Meal one lean mince - 1-2 whole egg, veg

Meal 2 Tuna, 30g olives, 30g avocado

Meal 3 chicken, cashews, veg

snack if you are hungry, almonds,cashews

Meal 5 pre workout BCAA, ECaa, 10g maltodextrin

intra shake 40ish g maltodextrin, bcaa, eaas or pepto pro

post WO, 200g chicken, white rice or white bagel with jam, veg, apple or banana, 1g vit c

Meal 6 250g total yoghurt, casein, 1g omega 3

id do something like that smash all carbs in 90mins or under postworkout


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

More gear.


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## Neuroscience (Sep 9, 2014)

i just had a cheese and mayonnaise sandwich and more than quarter of a chocolate cherry cheesecake. and my bf is definitely below 10%. i do eat healthy and cook mysef too but the body recognizes glucose as glucose etc., it is about how you metabolize it. of course you need a caloric deficit, but if you can change your bodies metabolism from using 3000cals for maintenance to 4000cals losing fat will become much easier. lack of insulinsensitivity seems to be the main culprit followed by excess cortisol.

just using some berberine and ashwagandha sensoril brand would already make a difference.


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## Trevor McDonald (Mar 30, 2010)

Neuroscience said:


> i just had a cheese and mayonnaise sandwich and more than quarter of a chocolate cherry cheesecake. and my bf is definitely below 10%. i do eat healthy and cook mysef too but the body recognizes glucose as glucose etc., it is about how you metabolize it. of course you need a caloric deficit, but if you can change your bodies metabolism from using 3000cals for maintenance to 4000cals losing fat will become much easier. lack of insulinsensitivity seems to be the main culprit followed by excess cortisol.
> 
> just using some berberine and ashwagandha sensoril brand would already make a difference.


And how do you go about this?


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## Neuroscience (Sep 9, 2014)

i use insulinomimetics mainly. right now just using a product containing berberine and banaba but it works well actually.

the most effective one on the market is omega sports burn24. i would not use more than one capsule with less than 100 grams of carbs, otherwise you will be so hungry you will need to eat 3 meals lol. it simply delivers carbohydrates to muscle tissue instead of fat, blocks glut-4 in fat cells and also insulins action there.

if you keep calories constant you will lose fat like crazy. especially helpes me lose stubborn lower ab fat. they recommend 6 capsules per day but i would say 1 cap per 100 grams of carbs is plenty.


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## Kabz r34 (Aug 15, 2013)

Neuroscience said:


> i use insulinomimetics mainly. right now just using a product containing berberine and banaba but it works well actually.
> 
> the most effective one on the market is omega sports burn24. i would not use more than one capsule with less than 100 grams of carbs, otherwise you will be so hungry you will need to eat 3 meals lol. it simply delivers carbohydrates to muscle tissue instead of fat, blocks glut-4 in fat cells and also insulins action there.
> 
> if you keep calories constant you will lose fat like crazy. especially helpes me lose stubborn lower ab fat. they recommend 6 capsules per day but i would say 1 cap per 100 grams of carbs is plenty.


Where can you purchase these and can you eat what you want when on these and still lose weight?


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## Neuroscience (Sep 9, 2014)

well, glycox on amazon, glycophase which will be a bit stronger at powermyself, burn24 as well but it is always sold out.

judging by the strength of glycox i would say glycophase is definitely nearly stronger than necessary. one cap will kill 100 grams of carbs. one hour later you might be starving again. it is because the nutrients have already been metabolized. the hunger will guide you along and show you how much you can eat. if you are not full you can eat without worrying about fat gain.


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## Kabz r34 (Aug 15, 2013)

Sounds intresting has anyone else tryed this? Also I'm 28% bf and would it be any good for me or is it for people that have the last bit of fat they need to melt.


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## saxondale (Nov 11, 2012)

Neuroscience said:


> people need to learn about insulin sensitivity and cortisol.
> 
> i mean i just had pizza with sauce hollandaise and ben and jerrys icecream. if i ate 2000 calories a day i would lose muscles and weight like mad. i lost 19kg just going sightly below 3000 for 9 months. now my bf is about 7-8% and i neither have great genetics nor a bodybuilding specific diet. all i do is make sure my nutrients are not being stored as fat by increasing insulin sensitivity mostly and training with very heavy weight, low volume, high frequency.


Seriously mate, no one cares what your stats are. Hdu has come a long way give him credit where its due.


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## saxondale (Nov 11, 2012)

HDU said:


> Basically having difficultly now getting the last bit of fat off. Not sure for its down to diet or what, but I know training and cardio is in check.
> 
> currently my **** body composition.
> 
> ...


Mate, be happy how you are and just keep doing what youve been doing.


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## Neuroscience (Sep 9, 2014)

saxondale said:


> Seriously mate, no one cares what your stats are. Hdu has come a long way give him credit where its due.


i was trying to help him lose weight easier without reducing calories further. i also gave examples of other people who were carb sensitive and had great results with the right kind of enhancement of insulinsensitivity.

nobody needs to starve or do low carb to lose fat if they learn to manipulate their metabolism properly. i was trying to help.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

2000 cals will ruin any physiqe and lead to muscle loss and will never effect fat

Loss,you need to up cals and keep protein high,drop cardio for now and increase

Training intensity,should see a marked difference in a few weeks.


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## Heavyassweights (Jan 18, 2014)

I think you should stay with @saxondale for a month. He will fcuk the excess weight off u.

Not srs

@HDU u look good mate, take it slow, Rome wasnt built in a day


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

Marcus2014 said:


> In that case matey
> 
> 1)fasted weight (pre workout and bcaas of course)
> 
> 2) PROPPER hiit cardio. Doing it properly you shouldn't be able to do more than 20 mins imo


 thanks mate going to start HIIT and LISS again.



Neuroscience said:


> don't drop calories, try using something like glycophase, glycobol or burn24 before carb rich meals. it will give you more energy, fuller muscles, help burn bodyfat and also allow you to work out harder which in turn will make you stronger in the gym and burn more calories and increase your insulin sensitivity even more.
> 
> my friend was 110kg, on gear, 2800kcal, low carb, very big and strong but just couldn't lose fat. i recommended glycobol and he dropped 10kg in 2 months while maintaining his muscle mass eating 3200 calories and 300 grams of carbohydrates.
> 
> if you don't lose fat or get lean on 3000 or less, being a hrad training athlete, increasing cardio or training frequency and dcreseing calories is not the way to go, manipuating metabolism is much more effective.


 sounds too good to be true lol, serious ? Those products actually burn carbs ?



Sambuca said:


> your diet is ****e mate
> 
> if you wanna lose all that fat then u need to change it up completely.
> 
> ...


Thanks mate ill cooperate this soon. When you say lean mince? I.e how much 250g? Same with rice ? A serving off.? Lol. And yoghurt too??


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

Neuroscience said:


> well, glycox on amazon, glycophase which will be a bit stronger at powermyself, burn24 as well but it is always sold out.
> 
> judging by the strength of glycox i would say glycophase is definitely nearly stronger than necessary. one cap will kill 100 grams of carbs. one hour later you might be starving again. it is because the nutrients have already been metabolized. the hunger will guide you along and show you how much you can eat. if you are not full you can eat without worrying about fat gain.


So basically these tablets make carbs more use; and burn the carbs off. So glycophase is the strongest?



saxondale said:


> Seriously mate, no one cares what your stats are. Hdu has come a long way give him credit where its due.





saxondale said:


> Mate, be happy how you are and just keep doing what youve been doing.


 lol no one is happy how they are butt hanks mate much appreciated.



Heavyassweights said:


> I think you should stay with @saxondale for a month. He will fcuk the excess weight off u.
> 
> Not srs
> 
> @HDU u look good mate, take it slow, Rome wasnt built in a day


Hahahahaha thanjs mate.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

TommyBananas said:


> This is ridiculous. If you want to lose fat, get sufficient protein, be in a calorie deficit and stop posting ridiculous "30g olives, 3 bread lololol".


Me? Hence I was asking for advice. But hey ho it's worked, just the last bit needs to come off.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

TommyBananas said:


> All this ridiculous crap people are posting. About "2 whole eggs" "Lean Mince"
> 
> Wtf. It's 2014. Use a calorie counting app, educate yourself on flexible dieting/nutrition methods and stop living in the past.
> 
> None of this NON-SENSE Neuroscience is talking about either, jesus christ.


That's what I'm doing. Using IIFYM hence the use of different foods.


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## Robbie (Dec 31, 2007)

TommyBananas said:


> Then why is your diet so bland? I don't understand.
> 
> Lets start from scratch.
> 
> ...


^^^ what he said


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## Awt (Feb 23, 2014)

HDU said:


> Basically having difficultly now getting the last bit of fat off. Not sure for its down to diet or what, but I know training and cardio is in check.
> 
> currently my **** body composition.
> 
> ...


6 slices of bread a day??

change it for rice? white rice imo is the best carb in the way that it does not bloat me and is easily digestible

switch meal one to protein/fat meal, then have your carb pre and post ?

also maybe switch training so your expending more calories eg push pull legs twice a week etc


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## Awt (Feb 23, 2014)

TommyBananas said:


> None of this is relevant to dropping bodyfat.


ok mate

i mean on the terms of if i eat 6 slices a toast a day or the equivalent of rice i will look bloated so what i mean is certain foods will bloat your more, same with oats

so your saying that all the guys that do the carbs around workouts are wrong?john meadows, etc?


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## Awt (Feb 23, 2014)

TommyBananas said:


> John Meadows is an absolute moron. Second of all - adhering personal preference is what counts with dietary habits.
> 
> Having carbs around workouts is not going to make any difference to fat loss if total macronutrient/calorie intake is the same over the entire day.


i am aware of that but hes already quite low calories so something has to change surely?or just more time..


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

TommyBananas said:


> I can almost guarentee he is not on 2,000 calories - if he is he has to either lower them, or increase activity.
> 
> But as I said, I can 99.9% guarentee he is miscalculating calories, it happens to so, so, so, so many people. I don't care if they tell me they are recording everything, I bet you he is not weighing all his foods, recording them with a calorie tracker etc.


I am. But ill recalculate them again.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

Neuroscience said:


> i use insulinomimetics mainly. right now just using a product containing berberine and banaba but it works well actually.
> 
> the most effective one on the market is omega sports burn24. i would not use more than one capsule with less than 100 grams of carbs, otherwise you will be so hungry you will need to eat 3 meals lol. it simply delivers carbohydrates to muscle tissue instead of fat, blocks glut-4 in fat cells and also insulins action there.
> 
> if you keep calories constant you will lose fat like crazy. especially helpes me lose stubborn lower ab fat. they recommend 6 capsules per day but i would say 1 cap per 100 grams of carbs is plenty.


So...one tub would last me a while as theres 180 caps, and you say not to have more than one with less than 100g carbs?


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## vlb (Oct 20, 2008)

HDU said:


> Haha thanks mate. I'm no all that good still have fatty chest lol.
> 
> ahhh I see. I do have Chet meals yes and do help.
> 
> ...


holy **** mate, that before and after is amazing.

you had some belly on you before huh.

how long did it take you to get rid of the distended gut?


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

@GaryGains give me a PM Mare please


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## GaryGains (Jan 7, 2015)

HDU said:


> @GaryGains give me a PM Mare please


Cant private message buddy as havent been on forum long enough for the privilleage! Am I allowed to post up my email address?


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

GaryGains said:


> Cant private message buddy as havent been on forum long enough for the privilleage! Am I allowed to post up my email address?


Never mind mate sorted.


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