# No Pain No Gain My friends!!! haha



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Okay, havenâ€™t been training much the last few weeks, I pulled my right pectoral muscle a few weeks ago, been doing cardio most days while my chest healed, still twinges a little when workout but not so much that I have to stop. Started Weights again last week and was pleased I came though it, gonna increase the intensity this week. As it says no pain no gain!!! I've mixed up my training a little, stopped the footy (cold weather, dosent put me in the mood, bitch I know) so more free time.

Also Iâ€™ve been putting off the Muai and BJJ for a couple of weeks but plan to attend my first class after 4 years out at Kaobon, Fighters and Fitness either Tomorrow or Thursday.

So Schedule

Mon

6am Jog (2 mile)

1pm Gym (Weights)

Tues

6am Jog (2 mile)

7pm Muai Thai

Wed

6am Jog (2 mile)

1pm Gym (Weights)

6pm Gym (Cardio, Burn 2000cals here)

Thu

1pm Gym (Cardio, 4 - 5 miles Treadmill)

7pm Muai Thai

Fri

1pm Gym (Weights)

6pm Gym (Cardio, Burn 2000cals here)

Sat

1pm BJJ

Sun

6am Jog (2 miles)

So Fridays Weights session went like this (Chest, Shoulders, Back, Arms).

Flat bench presses

1 x 10 30kg

1 x 10 40kg

1 x 3 70kg

2 x 8 50kg

2 x 5 60kg

Incline bench presses

1 x 3 70kg

2 x 8 50kg

2 x 5 60kg

Incline DB flyâ€™s

3 x 15 12kg (Each arm)

One arm DB rows 3 x 8 18kg (Left arm)

3 x 8 18kg (Right arm)

Bent over barbell rows

2 x 4 40kg

Overhead DB presses	3 x 8 18kg

1 x 8 20kg

Lateral DB raises

3 x 8 18kg

1 x 8 20kg

Seated rows

3 x 8 40kg

2 x 6 60kg

All comments welcome

Peter


----------



## MMABulk (Oct 17, 2007)

introduce overhead barbell presses, ideally clean and press for power mate.

i'm a keen fan of deadlifting and wide chins too


----------



## marc (Jul 16, 2007)

damn pete, thats a lot of cardio you must be fit as a butchers fiddle!

Whats your weight and your goals, i know you've probably gone over this in another thread but im too lazy to do a search right now!

As IB says if your after mass deadlifts and/or squats are a must in your routine, looks good though mate are you upping the weight every couple of workouts?


----------



## MMABulk (Oct 17, 2007)

not just mass, the power and strength of implementing those lifts into your workout are ideal for MMA.

being able to squat 130kg helps a fair amount when doing takedowns on someone who weighs 90kg for instance.

same with deadlifts, i train with 150kg-170kg and it helps with my takedowns and ground work with lighter opponents that weight 90kg>


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

marc said:


> damn pete, thats a lot of cardio you must be fit as a butchers fiddle!


I'm doing alright mate, only been at it (diet wise) 8 months, always been fit able to run good distance, pace was an issue cos I was weighty and I've always been weighty though thats been my problem. I'm a naturally big guy only 5'10 though, but always benn broad. When I started thinking seriously about this shit I was 15 stone, (Still able to piss sefton park though, which is 3 miles, not bad for a 15 stone lump!!! haha).



marc said:


> Whats your weight and your goals, i know you've probably gone over this in another thread but im too lazy to do a search right now!


I'm 13st 6lbs at the minute, wanna get down to about, 12 stone of lean muscle, I mean low low BF%......I've give myself 2 years to be six packed up, but its hard to get and keep abs, so working like a ****er in the gym to get rid of the ale gut and love handles!! haha Also 2 years I wanna run a marathon....Can do the park twice now 6 miles but I'm blowin after that.



marc said:


> As IB says if your after mass deadlifts and/or squats are a must in your routine, looks good though mate are you upping the weight every couple of workouts?


Tryna get lean really but wanna increase strength. I do increase my weights but 70kg is top weight at the minute, arms fall asleep for abit after that!!! haha


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Incredible Bulk said:


> not just mass, the power and strength of implementing those lifts into your workout are ideal for MMA.


Beat me too it. Strength is one of my main goals especially for Thai and BJJ.



Incredible Bulk said:


> being able to squat 130kg helps a fair amount when doing takedowns on someone who weighs 90kg for instance.


Big Bastard!!!

hahahaha


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Okay, half-term in Uni so changed my Monday (23/10) round abit. Went the Gym at 6pm instead of 1pm. Worked Arms and Legs.

Barbell curls

3 x 15 20kg

3 x 10 30kg

1 x 10 40kg

Seated DB curls

3 x 15 (tens)

3 x 10 (twelves)

1 x 10 (sixteens)

Lying overhead triceps extensions

5 x 8 (Tens)

Seated overhead triceps extensions (1 arm at a time)

3 x 10 (twelves)

Flat bench triceps dips

3 x 20

Squats

3 x 10 20kg

2 x 8 30kg

2 x 8 50kg

DB lunges

5 x 20 (Twentys)

Deadlifts

3 x 10 20kg

2x 8 40kg

2 x 4 60kg


----------



## marso70 (Oct 10, 2007)

Peter with all due respect mate your routine is way out of whack you're doing 25 sets for your arms which are a relatively small muscle group & which also get worked when you train your torso, and you're only doing 12 sets for your legs which is one of the largest muscle groups!!!!!

If you are looking to specialise on your arms I can give you a routine to do this whilst also working the rest of your body.

Paul.


----------



## MMABulk (Oct 17, 2007)

even if you were to train arms and legs again, at least train legs first when you are fresh


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

marso70 said:


> Peter with all due respect mate your routine is way out of whack you're doing 25 sets for your arms which are a relatively small muscle group & which also get worked when you train your torso, and you're only doing 12 sets for your legs which is one of the largest muscle groups!!!!!
> 
> If you are looking to specialise on your arms I can give you a routine to do this whilst also working the rest of your body.
> 
> Paul.


I did focus on my arms alot on Monday and I am tryna build up my arms so just had a day working them, only used quite light weights though thats why so many sets (Warm Up as well).

I dont know why but I tend to do less on my legs, its just habit I think. I do lots of running and my brain sort of tells me this is enough haha....

In ref to the arms routine you've got I will be glad of any help I can get really. To be honest, I'm not a weightlifter and my routines are random, I've just picked up exercises from copying others in the gym really so all the experienced help I can get is much appriciated.

Ta Mate


----------



## MMABulk (Oct 17, 2007)

you wouldnt be the first to put 120% into your arms and think that your legs are fine with the bare minimum... you even got the cliche "i do some running so i think they get hit well enough" line lol.

usually people say they play football and they get worked hard enough or they dont want to lose flexability

end result is they are trying to say they dont like training legs as you cant see them in a t-shirt on a friday night down the Kings Head. :biggerGrin:

lol, copying others in the gym is a bad idea as most people in gyms tend to stick to chest and biceps and chest and biceps.

the lat pulldown machine is popular too though lol

how many days can you commit to the gym?

what are your honest goals, notice 'honest'.... some say they want to be big and well built but do not have the drive and motivation to follow through and ends up being like a new years resolution type of goal.

Or say they want to get fit and obtain a good level of fighting fitness but hate cardio and try to avoid it like the plague


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Incredible Bulk said:


> you wouldnt be the first to put 120% into your arms and think that your legs are fine with the bare minimum... you even got the cliche "i do some running so i think they get hit well enough" line lol.


haha hands up you got me!!! although I run about 20 miles a week then do a lot of sprint work on top of that....plus time in the gym for legs, albeit a small amount for legs....but as I said I am willing to listen and learn. Just wouldnt pay for a personal trainer LOL....



Incredible Bulk said:


> end result is they are trying to say they dont like training legs as you cant see them in a t-shirt on a friday night down the Kings Head. :biggerGrin:


LOL in the Ba Ba please!!! haha nail on head



Incredible Bulk said:


> lol, copying others in the gym is a bad idea as most people in gyms tend to stick to chest and biceps and chest and biceps.
> 
> the lat pulldown machine is popular too though lol


I dont copy exact, when I was younger I'd ask advice in the gym, see these massive fellas pumping pure weights, most of them **** you off in a nice way, so I just copied as I went along....It was a case of if I hurt the next day, its working....as I said, I'm listening and learning LOL



Incredible Bulk said:


> how many days can you commit to the gym?


I go the gym 3 times a week for weights, and more for cardio....see first post.



Incredible Bulk said:


> what are your honest goals, notice 'honest'.... some say they want to be big and well built but do not have the drive and motivation to follow through and ends up being like a new years resolution type of goal.


I dont want to be bulky, I want say a sprinter physique. And I do have the motivation, I've got my diet nailed just need to tweak my training. Ideally I'd like to run the london marathon in 2009.


----------



## MMABulk (Oct 17, 2007)

Big conflict mate, sprinters have a decent amount of size for burst power where as marathon runners look like POW survivors.


----------



## marc (Jul 16, 2007)

Ah yes but good old linford was muching the Dianabols for breakfast, bless him

Just remember peter 80% of how you look is down to diet, if you've got that nailed you've got a good advantage over people that havent, leg training isnt the be all and end all of training but it is needed to promote new muscle growth, if you want to get bigger defo work your legs.


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

I dont wanna be a maraton runner, I just wanna run the marathon. I dont wanna be a sprinter the example was just lean muscle, not bulk....sorry bad example. you can still be fit, medium bulk and run a marathon...


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

marc said:


> Ah yes but good old linford was muching the Dianabols for breakfast, bless him
> 
> Just remember peter 80% of how you look is down to diet, if you've got that nailed you've got a good advantage over people that havent, leg training isnt the be all and end all of training but it is needed to promote new muscle growth, if you want to get bigger defo work your legs.


Yes good old linford was!!! haha

Marc we've worked on my diet mate, it was getting there when we spoke. I think its sorted now....not losing weight but I'm losing body fat (trimming down, losing inches) thats the plan...hopefully it will carry on


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

23/10/2007

6.00 - Wake Up....2 Mile Jog

6.40 - 40g Porridge, Skimmed Milk, 3 egg whites 1 egg yolk (Drank Raw)

10.15 - MRP (HXS), Handful Large Oats, Natural Yoghurt

13.00 - 100g Boiled Ham on Wholemeal Bread, mixed Salad, Oil Based Spread, 2 Oatcakes, an Apple and 2 Oranges

15.00 - MRP (HXS) Apple, Banana

17.15 - 40g Instant Whey, 2 Oatcakes, Plenty Water

18.00 to 19.00 - Gym (4 Miles Treadmill)

19.30 - 40g Protein Powder in Water

21.00 - 180g Fillet Steak, 60g Boiled Rice and 2 poached eggs

22.00 - Bed

Comments welcome


----------



## marc (Jul 16, 2007)

Good stuff mate, diet looks good the only thing i would say is try to include some whole food (not from supplements) as the bulk of your diet between 1 & 9 are from supps they are convient but if you can real food would be better, id recommend droppping the 7.30 pm shake for some chicken & veggies (or something equivalent) but other than that mate looks good, have you stated Kaobon yet?


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

nah mate, my brothers a shithouse, been tryna get him to come with me, but he keeps putting it off "we'll start next week", "we'll start next week" is all I hear outta him!!...

I dont fancy turning up on my own, pairing up with someone thats been there a while and after a good workout in clinches and pad work if I'm doing something wrong and messing thier workout up for them....basically a beginner again so it will take me time to get into it....

haha I just want someone to hold my hand!!! haha

Defo starting next Tuesday though with or without him.....


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

marc said:


> Good stuff mate, diet looks good the only thing i would say is try to include some whole food (not from supplements) as the bulk of your diet between 1 & 9 are from supps they are convient but if you can real food would be better, id recommend droppping the 7.30 pm shake for some chicken & veggies (or something equivalent) but other than that mate looks good, have you stated Kaobon yet?


The Sup's come in handy while I'm in work, then cant be assed cooking two meals of a night after a good workout....weekends and Uni days are different though, I eat plenty more whole food then. In work all day Tue, Wed and Thurs so use sup's more on these days....


----------



## JayC (Jul 16, 2007)

PeterJ said:


> I dont fancy turning up on my own, pairing up with someone thats been there a while and after a good workout in clinches and pad work if I'm doing something wrong and messing thier workout up for them....basically a beginner again so it will take me time to get into it....


Yep, I always seem to get the new ones who can't hold pads or the kids who think they're solid and still can't hold pads and talk too much.

At first I was like "I need to go with the new people cause im crap" but now I just get pissed off unless my forearms are hurting at the end from holding the pads. You work harder when with someone who's boss at Muay Thai too, cause you wanna earn their respect in a way. Especially if Colin Heron is walking and looking at you, you just go balls out %500.


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

JayC said:


> Yep, I always seem to get the new ones who can't hold pads or the kids who think they're solid and still can't hold pads and talk too much.
> 
> At first I was like "I need to go with the new people cause im crap" but now I just get pissed off unless my forearms are hurting at the end from holding the pads. You work harder when with someone who's boss at Muay Thai too, cause you wanna earn their respect in a way. Especially if Colin Heron is walking and looking at you, you just go balls out %500.


I was the same when I used to Box mate, got sick of telling them hold the pads higher or try not to back off, I'm not gonna hit you!!! hahaha


----------



## MMABulk (Oct 17, 2007)

JayC said:


> You work harder when with someone *who's boss *at Muay Thai too.


you are such a scouser


----------



## JayC (Jul 16, 2007)

Always a scouser mate, always


----------



## marso70 (Oct 10, 2007)

Peter without getting too technical if you wish to run a Marathon then based *on something called the **S.A.I.D (Specific Adapation To Imposed Demands) *principle then you will have to train to run a marathon, ie the training has to be specific to the task or goal and the body adapts accordingly.

For example sprinters are the way they are based on their genetics, they have a high percentage of fast twitch muscle fibers, these are the ones with the greatest potential for growth and are able to generate a lot of force when recruited, the down side is they fatigue very quickly, in contrast Marathon runners have a high percentage of Slow Twitch muscle fibers, these have the least potential for growth but fatigue very slowly and hence have a high level of endurance.

Linford Christy has all the right traits, ie: long muscle bellys, high percentage of fast twitch fibers, high level of neurological efficiency, rate ratio of limb lengths etc etc...

In addition to this, sprinters have a high level of *neurological efficiency* this is the ability to recruit a large percentage of the available muscle fibers, the more you can recruit the fast, stronger and dare I say it "explosive" you will be.

One very important note, lifting fast or explosively does not make you fast or explosive, this is a misconception and violates the principle of specificity, the ability to produce more power and force is generated by increasing the* size *of your muscles, the best way to do this is to lift heavy enough weights in a slow and controlled manner, using a fast speed of movement is dangerous as the impact forces sky rocket ( A 100 barbell can generate forces in excess of 600 lbs if lifted in such a manner) and this increases the potential for injury, plus momentum is called into play which actually reduces the effect on the muscles making the exercise less effective for the task in hand.


----------



## marso70 (Oct 10, 2007)

Okay, here is the routine from Dr Ellington Darden you need to follow this TO THE LETTER, no altering is allowed otherwise you will lessen the results.

Here's a look at the revised arm cycle, followed by a description of each exercise:

* One-repetition chinup, 30-45 seconds up and 30-45 seconds down, immediately followed by

* Biceps curl, halves, 8-12 partial reps on both.

Rest for 2 minutes.

* One-repetition dip, 30-45 seconds up and 30-45 seconds down, immediately followed by

* Triceps extension with one dumbbell, halves, 8-12 partial reps on both.

Other Exercises to Complete the Workout

Okay, to that four-exercise arm cycle, add four other exercises and you've got an effective HIT routine. Do the four arm exercises first in the workout. My suggestions for the four other exercises are the following:

* Leg extension or Leg press

* Leg curl

* Calf raise with barbell or machine

* Side bend with one dumbbell

Thus, your entire routine would be:

* One-repetition chinup, immediately followed by

* Biceps curl, halves; Rest for 2 minutes.

* One-repetition dip, immediately followed by

* Triceps extension, halves; Rest for 2 minutes.

* Leg extension or Leg press

* Leg curl

* Calf raise

* Side bend

I've tried this routine and its a killer the one rep chin and dip are extremely tough and afterwards your arms feel like they are filled with helium they are so pumped!

Paul..


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

marso70 said:


> Peter without getting too technical if you wish to run a Marathon then based *on something called the **S.A.I.D (Specific Adapation To Imposed Demands) *principle then you will have to train to run a marathon, ie the training has to be specific to the task or goal and the body adapts accordingly.
> 
> For example sprinters are the way they are based on their genetics, they have a high percentage of fast twitch muscle fibers, these are the ones with the greatest potential for growth and are able to generate a lot of force when recruited, the down side is they fatigue very quickly, in contrast Marathon runners have a high percentage of Slow Twitch muscle fibers, these have the least potential for growth but fatigue very slowly and hence have a high level of endurance.
> 
> ...


So does this mean if I build lean muscle, and want a physique "like" a sprinter then there is no possible way I will be able to run a marathon, I'm running 7 miles almost daily now, (Which will increase, over time) I also lift weights and I'm on a high protien, carb low fat diet. So will build lean muscle but I run alot of miles. Does this matter or physically will I not be able to do it?

I think I've came across the wrong way here, I dont want to be a marathon runner. I would like to run a marathon to say yes I've done it but I dont want to look like a belson escapee in order to do so....


----------



## marso70 (Oct 10, 2007)

There is no reason you can't have decent physique but to do a full marathon is going to severley tax your recovery ability. They actually did a post marathon test on the runners and in a majority of cases they found muscles fibers that were split and some had even turned inside out!! For some it took six months to fully recover in terms of having normal looking muscle fibers. The demands of a marathon are THAT severe.

In a nut shell and based on stress physiology once the body has been exposed to a stress or stressor which is of *sufficient magnitude* to evoke the alarm reaction, it first has to replace what has been used up, then and ONLY then will it overcompensate.

Here is an example I often use: Think of a sunbed. The usual time for these is 3-9 mintues. Why? Because the* intensity* of the UV rays is so intense you can't physically tolerate any longer, if you do, what happens? You burn, this is when the stress or stressor has exceeded the bodies ability to adpat. Taken to the extreme, you would get sun stroke or in fact burn to death.

A tan is a forced adaptation to the demands that a sunbed has placed on your skin, once you stop the tan fades and the body reinstates its homeostasis (balance).

Exercise is no different, so in weight training terms the stress or stressor MUST be of a high enough intensity in order to trigger the alarm reaction if you train too long or too often then the body cannot recover, you overtrain, get run down and you end up looking smaller and weaker.

To run a marathon you need to be running a distance which is about 80 % of a full one.

Simple question how many large muscular marathon runners do you see? How many skinny sprinters are there?

When training with weights, you should be training like the sprinter, ie: an all out high intensity of effort, but by it's very nature has to be of a short duration, then rest and allow the body to recover and grow. Weight training, contray to how many people train, is NOT an endurance event.

And before anyone pipes in, Proffesional bodybuilders are a by product of their training not because it, simply put they can get away with a lot more than most people and that usually means more sets and frequency, coupled with HUGE amounts of steroids which further enhance recovery.

Paul.

Paul.


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

marso70 said:


> There is no reason you can't have decent physique but to do a full marathon is going to severley tax your recovery ability. They actually did a post marathon test on the runners and in a majority of cases they found muscles fibers that were split and some had even turned inside out!! For some it took six months to fully recover in terms of having normal looking muscle fibers. The demands of a marathon are THAT severe.
> 
> In a nut shell and based on stress physiology once the body has been exposed to a stress or stressor which is of *sufficient magnitude* to evoke the alarm reaction, it first has to replace what has been used up, then and ONLY then will it overcompensate.
> 
> ...


Very well put...its a shame you cant have both...a marathon is just something I'd like to say I've done. I'd much rather look good in a t-shirt!!!


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Okay so did a short session lunchtime yesterday then some cardio work in the evening.

Flat bench presses

1 x 10 40kg

1 x 3 70kg

2 x 8 50kg

2 x 5 60kg

Incline bench presses

1 x 1 70kg

2 x 8 40kg

2 x 5 55kg

Incline DB flyâ€™s

3 x 15 12kg (Each arm)

One arm DB rows

3 x 8 18kg (Left arm)

3 x 8 18kg (Right arm)

Overhead DB presses

1 x 8 20kg

Lateral DB raises

3 x 8 18kg

1 x 8 20kg

Cardio in the evening - treadmill 5.4miles (was blowin last night)


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Okay so yesterday

Dinner time 4 miles treadmill.

Played squash in the night, (I know some think its a shite sport but), burn around 1000cals in a 40min session. I play a double session....2000cals burned here....


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 27, 2007)

Just back from the gym....hahaha LOL

Tried Paul's arm work out and can hardly type!!! some serious shit!!!

Having tonight off....cheers Paul...

1 x 1 Chins (Slow Up/Slow Down)

2 x 12 (Each Arm) DB Curls 16kg

1 x 1 Dip (Slow Up/Slow Down)

2 x 12 (Each Arm) DB Triceps extension 12kg (Shaking at this point)


----------

