# Need help for last few weeks...



## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

Good morning all,

have currently been on a decent cut but seem to have come to a slow stop and as have holiday just wondered what best tips you suggest could do now leading up to holiday coming in few weeks time.

Currently train as follows...

tuesday - chest and triceps

Thursday - shoulders and legs

saturday - back and biceps and abs

had been doing cardio after every session but am not doing cardio everyday including after weights from hoot for 15 mins, 45 60% heard rate, and hill clim on bike. Current daily diet is as follows...

Meal 1 - 80g oats with skimmed milk, protein shake with water and egg whites, small glass of orange juice

Meal 2 - 3 oat cakes, with organic natural p.butter, piece of fruit

Meal 3 - chicken breast, brown rice, salad

Meal 4 - protein shake, 3 table spoons natural yoghurt (natural not low fat)

Meal 5 - same as 3 or extra lean mince with green veg

Meal 6 - casein shake or low fat cottage cheese

I am feeling good with myself but just want more lean/tightness all over, and will holiday coming up...keep doing the same or change any of above??

Cheers all


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Lower you carbs on non training days, or and introduce 30 minutes of cardio for 3 other days, maybe with some abs and stretching, you have gone the straight low calorie way? I always go low carb, its tough but works for me, I notice a complete lack of healthy fats in your diet!!!


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

Hi mate, so on non training days cut out any rice with meal 5 etc...also am doing cardio everyday so where else can I do anymore?

Re healthy fats, have peanut butter with meal 2 and have yoghurt with 4...what else you suggest ?


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## freddee (Mar 2, 2009)

Some coconut oil or udos oil ios good when dieting, if you are doing cardio on training days make sure its after weights, then you will be in the fat burning environment straight away, I'm trying to get down into some good condition for my hols on the 14th sep, not there yet but its coming, I still have water on me, that will go in the next week, I have my carb up tonight until tomorrow afternoon, I train chest and biceps tomorrow, the best I look all week!


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

Swap some of the steady state stuff with HIIT. (Max 4 sessions a week).

Decrease the number of carbs week by week.

Why not give meats & nuts brekky a try (i.e don't eat carbs here). Have oats at night instead.

Might be worth also, going off chicken and beef for a bit. Substitute with turkey, fish, venison etc..


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## daddy123 (Nov 30, 2012)

I would either look at reducing your carbs or increase your cardio.


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

Thanks splinter for above.

Splinter based on above mentioned where would you look at reducing carbs mate also just started cardio everyday...so what do you find is most effective and how long for...maybe should do more hiit...just done back and biceps finished off with hiit cardio on bike...30 secs max, 30 secs normal for 10 mins and feel done in now ha ha


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

daddy123 said:


> I would either look at reducing your carbs or increase your cardio.


Daddy what do you also find most effective on cardio and for how long mate...as just started trying to get some in d wry day


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

daddy123 said:


> I would either look at reducing your carbs or increase your cardio.


Daddy what do you also find most effective on cardio and for how long mate...as just started trying to get some in d wry day


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## daddy123 (Nov 30, 2012)

What some people find suits them doesn't suit others. Why not try doing hitt on training days and ssc on non-training days to try and get the best of both worlds.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

any idea what your cals are and the breakdown of pro carbs and fats?

also stress can fcuk with weight loss/weight gain, is that a factor? do you sleep well etc?


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

Jordi said:


> Thanks splinter for above.
> 
> Splinter based on above mentioned where would you look at reducing carbs mate also just started cardio everyday...so what do you find is most effective and how long for...maybe should do more hiit...just done back and biceps finished off with hiit cardio on bike...30 secs max, 30 secs normal for 10 mins and feel done in now ha ha


Go out to a park and do some 100-200 metre sprints, as if you were racing Usain Bolt. Should be caked within 10 mins! That's just an idea of what you can do HIIT wise, all sorts.

Cals right on total macronutrients, do you know roughly how many your on from all the respective sources?


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

splinter said:


> Go out to a park and do some 100-200 metre sprints, as if you were racing Usain Bolt. Should be caked within 10 mins! That's just an idea of what you can do HIIT wise, all sorts.
> 
> Cals right on total macronutrients, do you know roughly how many your on from all the respective sources?


No to be honest I don't know the exact amounts on each part...just an eating plan I was put on by local pt...bit just wanna loose bit more and feel tighter before holiday and wanting tips from all you guys...how drastic should I change current eating plan?...or just increase cardio etc?

What you all think based on what I'm currently eating, cut more or add more cardio


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## daddy123 (Nov 30, 2012)

When is your holiday mate?


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

daddy123 said:


> When is your holiday mate?


Hi daddy, I go Thursday 12th September


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

Jordi said:


> Hi daddy, I go Thursday 12th September


To be realistic, if your not in the shape you wanna be in, don't expect to be there within 12 days.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

download an app called my fitness pal.


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

TheCrazyCal said:


> download an app called my fitness pal.


Cheers Cal will do shortly...does it list everything on there?

Gents I am in the best shape I've been in a long time just wanna be more for holiday in few weeks and wondered what you suggest/change to what I'm currently doing...anyone ever do more than an hour on steady pace cardio on bike at 60%??


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

Also what heart rate would anyone say staying in for steady 1 hour bike cardio....am 32 and staying in 125-130


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

heart rate is fine, ive done lots of steady state cardio fior more than an hour, i was fine, i also train someone who`s now into ultra running and he`s sh1tting muscle weekly..

just be prudent with it..

just scan you foods in tho the app. gotta be aware that all protein will be listed not just the good sources.. i e it will include the protein in bread..


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

would one of you diet chaps feel like modifying jordi`s diet specifically for him?


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

TheCrazyCal said:


> would one of you diet chaps feel like modifying jordi`s diet specifically for him?


Here's an example on the fly, of a meal suggestion plan, assuming you train at 6pm. Try to avoid stacking carbs and fats together.

Meal 1 - Meats & Nuts brekky (P + F)

Meal 2 - P + F

Meal 3 - P + C

Meal 4 - P + F

Meal 5 - P + C

Meal 6 - P + C

P = Protein, F = fat, C = carbs

Be creative with your protein sources if you can, i.e. not just chicken constantly. Have your P + C meals after your workouts. If you train later in the day, might be advisable to get 1-2 P + C meals prior to workout, especially if your doing something hard like a leg session. Carbs are there for recovery, so utilise them PWO.

Feel free to add veg to every meal you can.

No sugary sauces with saturated fats (i.e. BBQ sauce with steak).

Eggs cooked are more digestible, now for anyone that's about to hag me on that one... here's a reference: Digestibility of Cooked and Raw Egg Protein in Humans as Assessed by Stable Isotope Techniques

Try oats at night, works a treat if you train in the morning.

Get some fish in there!

What's your supplement regimen like too?


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## EXTREME (Aug 5, 2005)

Spend less time downloading and more time pedalling!

If your diet is good and your training hard you will lose fat, your body will stall at times but what I'd like to ask is are you going by the scales or the mirror? If it's the scales you're going by then you're setting a false goal, nobody is going to look at you on the beach and say "He has a nice physique, he must be 14 stones", if you look good, you look good. What difference does the weight make?

When you hit the wall as you have I'd advise you to carb cycle and for the next 12 days make the exercise bike your best friend and aim for 90 minutes a time.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

lol i`m usually scathing of apps doug, but this is a really helpful one as long as you ignore how much weight you`ll gain or use..

scan your bar codes in and you get a breakdown


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## daddy123 (Nov 30, 2012)

Jordi said:


> Hi daddy, I go Thursday 12th September


You can only do the best you can by being very strict and focused. So just give it your all mate.


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## spaglemon (Mar 15, 2012)

TheCrazyCal said:


> download an app called my fitness pal.


Just downloaded this, had to put it on my wifes phone as it's not available on mine, very impressed and as Cal said forget about the weight side of it and just use it to track macros,etc

i scanned the foods i have most days and it identified them all including my whey protein, it gives you a pie chart of your macros and tbh i didn't really know what mine were ? they worked out at 42% protein 42% fat and 16% carbs

cheers


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

So when you suggest F for fats what are best sources you suggest and amount for me gents? Cheers all



splinter said:


> Here's an example on the fly, of a meal suggestion plan, assuming you train at 6pm. Try to avoid stacking carbs and fats together.
> 
> Meal 1 - Meats & Nuts brekky (P + F)
> 
> ...


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

Really 90 mins on bike...that's some cardio ha ha...best way to cycle...Low through out week then high weds and sat mate?



Extreme said:


> Spend less time downloading and more time pedalling!
> 
> If your diet is good and your training hard you will lose fat, your body will stall at times but what I'd like to ask is are you going by the scales or the mirror? If it's the scales you're going by then you're setting a false goal, nobody is going to look at you on the beach and say "He has a nice physique, he must be 14 stones", if you look good, you look good. What difference does the weight make?
> 
> When you hit the wall as you have I'd advise you to carb cycle and for the next 12 days make the exercise bike your best friend and aim for 90 minutes a time.


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

Jordi said:


> So when you suggest F for fats what are best sources you suggest and amount for me gents? Cheers all


Natural nuts, coconut oil, olive oil, avocado, olives, include the fat content of meat/eggs too.

Training days, you'll want to lean more toward slightly more carbs then fats, on non training days slightly more fat. Remember carbs are our recovery tool. Fats are 9 cals per g, whereas protein and carbs are 4 cals per g, so you'll want smaller portion sizes (for fats that is). If your going low carb, there's room to have a little more fat.

If you can be bothered and weighed all your food, you could use a site such as fitday.com to workout your total calorific intake.


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## EXTREME (Aug 5, 2005)

No Jordi, if there is much difference to be made I would advise 90 minutes cardio PER DAY for the next 12 days and I'd be carb cycling too.


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## Jordi B (Jan 15, 2010)

Extreme said:


> No Jordi, if there is much difference to be made I would advise 90 minutes cardio PER DAY for the next 12 days and I'd be carb cycling too.


Extreme what would you suggest best approach to carb cycling...high days weds and Saturday when I have treat meal. Also still 90mins cardio after weights? Don't think do less after weights ?

Really appreciate all your help gents with all this.


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## EXTREME (Aug 5, 2005)

If you are struggling to get cut why are you having a cheat meal?

I suggest one normal day then 2 days with 50g of carbs, then repeat.


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

Extreme said:


> No Jordi, if there is much difference to be made I would advise 90 minutes cardio PER DAY for the next 12 days and I'd be carb cycling too.


90 mins of steady cardio... who on earth has time for that?

20 mins of HIIT cardio = better hormonal response.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

HIIT is people who dont like cardio 

swings and roundabouts dude, fcuk that 20 mins of intense pain when theres options..

doug im guessing suggested it as a temporary measure as theres a time limit.


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## gingernut (Dec 11, 2006)

HIIT is good but do too much, for too long(like every day for weeks) and you end up knackered.


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

1-2 a week if you've only a few pounds to lose, upto four times a week if you've say 10lb or so more to lose.

Steady state has its place, I do it myself here and there. But we have a wealth of studies/anecdotal evidence purporting HIIT's efficacy.

Boils down to personal preference, just 90 mins of cardio to me sounds dire! Also sounds reminiscent of alot of the ladies you see who won't touch weights!


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## EXTREME (Aug 5, 2005)

Splinter, if he wants to lose the fat for his holiday he will make time.

If you really needed to I bet you could come up with 90 minutes a day, I always did mine on my exercise bike in the living room watching TV, I expect most people could do this.

Yes Cal, you'll see in my post I was advising this for the 12 days in the run up to his holiday.

Personally I'm not a fat of HIIT, it drains you too much to allow you to bodybuild to the best of your ability in my opinion.


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

Extreme said:


> Splinter, if he wants to lose the fat for his holiday he will make time.
> 
> If you really needed to I bet you could come up with 90 minutes a day, I always did mine on my exercise bike in the living room watching TV, I expect most people could do this.


Still not the most optimal method.

I'll have to disagree with HIIT being too draining to bodybuild. That's what we have nutrition and rest for.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

i wonder if anyone at the olympia does HIIT


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## splinter1466867924 (Aug 5, 2005)

TheCrazyCal said:


> i wonder if anyone at the olympia does HIIT


How about Ben Pakulski who just came second in the Arnold? Unfortunately he had to pull out of the olympia this year.

Here's him doing HIIT cardio. About 6 sprints, 20 seconds a go, with 90 seconds rest. Done in about 15 mins. Who said HIIT had to always be 20 mins? Get creative.


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

lol well done..

if thats your thing, you go for it..

i`ve shot my wad training n wouldnt fancy it..

i dont think you`ll convince everyone any style is optimal.


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## Ben_Dover (Apr 12, 2012)

HIIT for me, bollocks to sitting on a bike for an hour plus when you can burn the same amount of cals in a third of that time


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## Piranha Smudge (Jan 16, 2011)

Not always about the calories burnt tho BJ!! Need to focus on fat cals!!!


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## crazycal1 (Sep 21, 2005)

the trick if you want to do longer cardio is to pick something you can enjoy..

if you dont enjoy it you wont stick to it..

you couldnt pay me to sit on a bike for 5 mins, or a rower (my back) or an elipitical stepper.. (in fact all hate my back)

set me on a tread mill on an incline facing a brickwall and i could walk for hours..

same for swimming...

if i do HIIT i skip.. my back doesnt like it tho..

the important thing is to do the appropriate exercise, done specifically to get the goals youre after.

consistently.


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## spaglemon (Mar 15, 2012)

TheCrazyCal said:


> the trick if you want to do longer cardio is to pick something you can enjoy..
> 
> if you dont enjoy it you wont stick to it..
> 
> ...


couldn't agree more, got to be something you enjoy, i get very bored very quickly on bikes, rowers etc but like Cal i could walk on an inclined treadmill all day but my preferred cardio is step, i use quite a high step, put 20kg into a rucksack on my back and go like the clappers in front of the telly,sometimes i put another 10kg on a rucksack on my chest too, i love what it does for my legs, keeps my legs conditioned for hillwalking and i do a lot of it on the balls of my feet which hammers my calfs, usualy do 10mins warmup without weight then 30 mins weighted although yesterday i was feeling energetic and did an hour, am paying for it today though lol

cheers


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## Ben_Dover (Apr 12, 2012)

SoldierSmudge said:


> Not always about the calories burnt tho BJ!! Need to focus on fat cals!!!


Is there really a "fat burning zone" though?

As long as im burning calories and keeping my heart in good condition i'm happy


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