# Bench press angle?



## smithy1436114491 (Nov 19, 2003)

Ive been training for around for around 5 years now but there is one place on my body that needs some attention.My chest looks good but there is a lack of muscle at the top of my chest on both sides and i can't seem to get the line which devides my chest up to the top.This is despite of doing high angle presses and cable crossovers.Any suggestions anyone?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I would drop the cable cross overs and stick pretty much to the bench and incline presses doing each once a week.

Start

Week (1) start with bar bench first, 5 sets 8-12 reps and then dumbbell inclines 5 sets for for 8-12 reps. Last sets on each do to failure.

week (2) start with barbell inclines 5 sets for 8-12 reps and dumbbell bench for 5 sets 8-12 reps. last sets on each go to failure.

Trade off every other week with dumbbells and barbell and alternate between starting with bench and the inclines.

If you want to do a stretching exercise then do a fly with light weight and after the muscle is pumped really good stretch the hell out of it with the fly exercise. You are going to be doing a total of 10 sets of presses and this is alot for the chest and even shoulders. I want you to work chest first on the chest day and the last set go to failure, how ever the number of reps you are going to get. You can save yourself a little bit on the other sets but the last set I want you to go to failure.

After 5 weeks I want you to drop 2 reps for 6-10 reps on the bench and inclines.

Bench and inclines are the 2 best building exercises for your chest. inclines hit upper chest and bench gives the width and size through the middle of the chest.

I dont recomend doing declines as if the lower part of the chest gets too big it can kindof look like tits and it is a short lift with not much of a stretch.


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## smithy1436114491 (Nov 19, 2003)

Ok,sounds good so i'll give it a go.I'll drop the crossovers and the declines.Would it be ok to do dips or would it be best drop them as well?


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## DB (Oct 31, 2003)

If i was you mate i'd keep the crossovers in there just do them at the end of the of the session and just do one maybe 2sets just to get a final stretch into the muscle to help it grow, i agree with hackskii on the rest tho i find incline bar works better for me personally than dumbbell,


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## T-man (Sep 3, 2003)

Dips and declines work the lower pecs. Crossovers do as well (depending on how much you lean over) and the middle.

Do like hackskii said. Keep it simple and try and increase your poundages.

You say you do high inclines presses. These might be to high angle and you are working front delts more. I like to stick with about 30 degrees.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

First, dont do the high inclines. If you are looking for only upper chest then do inclines first and put most of your energy into them otherwise stick with above. 

Dips absolutely these are a really good power exercise. If you can do your bodyweight good. If you are doing any more than 15 reps I would suggest adding 10 lbs to your waist.

Those can give you some nice triceps in the process. Dips are incorporated in most strength training routines and will help your bench.

Leaning forward works more chest and leaning back hits triceps more. The more weight you push (weighted) on dips will force you to lean forward so either way you will hit the chest.

Cable crossovers: unless you are way in front of the machine or using a incline bench you cant get the stretch as a flat bench with gravity pushing the weights down. Sorry, those are more for the fingers on the inside of the chest. They can be done from the floor or in any combination up to the ceiling. Each hit the chest at different angles. I personally don't care for them and in my opinion do a flat bench fly that stretches massively at the bottom of the lift and a squeeze at the top would be more preferred especially after the chest is really pumped. Read this article: http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/showthread.php?s=&threadid=795&highlight=stretch

You can do the same with the inclines as well.

So lets summarize: bench 5 sets 8-12 reps. Inclines 4 sets 8-12 reps and now dips 3 sets to failure or use weight and 8-12 reps. I modified your routine because you like the dips and were doing the declines and cable crossovers. This is 12 sets, if you go to failure in the last set on each lift then I would not recommend doing any more. Remember these are compound exercises and are hitting chest, front deltoids and triceps. This is plenty and the biggest bang for your buck.

Remember, this is only a suggestion and you can modify many combinations with this.


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## powerU (Oct 22, 2003)

it's definitley enough - i've had more gains in size and strength training like this than ever before. In fact, due to xmas do's etc. i've missed the odd day in the last couple of weeks (chest last week) and found i could still lift more this week!


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## smithy1436114491 (Nov 19, 2003)

I've been stuck in the same routine now for the past 12 months so i'm looking forward to a change!Thanks for the advice.


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## robin_3_16 (Aug 27, 2003)

its good to miss aweek every now and then u will find u can generally lift more the next week when u feel fresh!


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I have heard that a soft muscle builds faster than a hard muscle. So a week off (especially with an injury) would be good now and then. I just feel guilty if i do so I usually only miss a few days now and then.


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## OnePack (Jan 9, 2004)

i normally angle whichever angle feels comfortable.


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## Great White (Apr 4, 2003)

This is my chest workout if it helps:

Monday

Bench Press

20 x 70kg

15 x 80kg

10 x 90kg

10 x 100kg

8 x 110kg

6 x 120kg

2 x 130kg

1 x 140kg

7 x 100kg (3 sets to finish)

Incline dumbell Press

12 x 20kg (Per Dumbell)

10 x 25kg (per Dumbell)

8 x 30 kg (per Dumbell)

8 x 30kg (per Dumbell)

Cable Cross Overs

20 x 20kg (per side)

15 x 25kg (per side)

10 x 30kg (per side)

8 x 35kg (per side)

4 x 40kg (per side)

I then train chest thursday as well. Same as above but the incline dumbell press are replaced by an incline barbell press on a smith machine

Hope this helps

Paul


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## damagedgoods (Oct 17, 2003)

personally I try and keep the angel of the bench fairly low when doing inclines - otherwise I end up trainging my delts... hackskii is right about dips - do these insted of declines.... they are great for getting your strength up there... I've only been doing htm for the past month and it is helping my chest grow...


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Paul, do you mind if I comment on your lifts/routine?


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## Guest (Jan 28, 2004)

Go ahead, whats the boy gonna do?


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## Guest (Jan 28, 2004)

Jesus, your cable cross overs are weak man! I stick 150kgs on either side!


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## leanman (May 29, 2003)

Monday

Bench Press

20 x 70kg

15 x 80kg

10 x 90kg

10 x 100kg

8 x 110kg

6 x 120kg

2 x 130kg

1 x 140kg

7 x 100kg (3 sets to finish)

Incline dumbell Press

12 x 20kg (Per Dumbell)

10 x 25kg (per Dumbell)

8 x 30 kg (per Dumbell)

8 x 30kg (per Dumbell)

Cable Cross Overs

20 x 20kg (per side)

15 x 25kg (per side)

10 x 30kg (per side)

8 x 35kg (per side)

4 x 40kg (per side)

I then train chest thursday as well. Same as above but the incline dumbell press are replaced by an incline barbell press on a smith machine

Hope this helps

Paul dont you think this is a little excessive,and then you repeat it 3 days later??

Less IS more in my humble opinion


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Well, here goes. Hey Paul don't pull my mod status please.

First of all every 3 days might be too much. Push that at least 5 days. 7 might be preferred especially without gear.

Second 11 sets on the bench either that is too much warm-up or just too many sets. I would cut out some of the warm-up sets and drop the down sets altogether.

You can pyramid up but the trick is to time your warm-up sets so you are not fatigued but warmed up at the same time to do your 1-3 failure sets.

Your bench seems strong and this brings me to the next point.

DON'T DEMOD ME! 

Your inclines are out of proportion to your bench. You should be somewhere around 50kg on your dumbbells with that bench. My twin can do 100 lb dumbbells with his inclines for 7-8 reps but his bench might be just under 300 at the moment.

Beings that your bench is good I would start your chest workout with the inclines. Right off the bat you will notice a jump in the weight you will push your first time because your energy is not spent on doing 11 sets with the bench. Do 5 sets with the inclines and the last 2 sets go heavy. If you like you can switch between doing bench first then inclines first but I feel that your inclines are suffering at the expense of your bench.

Cable Crossovers, I don't like these and if you do any kind of a stretching exercise it should either be flys flat or incline. You can switch off every other week if you just have to do the cable crossovers. Do the flys after you have done your presses. Get a really good deep stretch. This will stretch the fascia and make room for more growth with the muscle. With the exception of a shoulder injury I would do this. Don't go heavy the thing we want to do here is stretch the fascia and muscle not build anything.

If you feel that you just are not doing enough for your chest you can do close grip bench presses and dips on your triceps days that will help work the triceps and indirectly hit the chest.

Cheers M8 you are still the best looking guy in this forum


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Paul, did you get this?


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## BSF James (Sep 29, 2003)

I agree with your comments hackskii. The inclines are a bit disproportionate from the bench press. My bench is quite a bit lower than pauls, but when I do incline db presses (not very often!) I lift that much (30kgs) or more. I rate db flyes as the best non-pressing chest exercise. Plus training chest once every three days is too often for 99% of lifters especially in that kind of volume.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Paul, did you read this? I want you to comment.


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## T-man (Sep 3, 2003)

Yes that does look a bit low for incline db press compared to his bench but it is probably because he is doing a lot of sets of flat benching first.

I would alternate from time to time and do inclines first for a while. Especially if your flat bench has been at a sticking point for a while.

I can only bb bench 100kg for 5 but use the 45kg db's for incline press 7 reps.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Hey, that is good T-man. Nice incline. Respectable.

I think people don't realize what an upper chest looks like. Most fat people, or big people have a chest. But to have an upper chest you can see this in clothes and know that you lift weights. I am still plagued with a shoulder injury and it is only getting just a little bit better. I will be forced to do dumbbells and incline dumbbells dont seem to agrivate it so much. Have to listen to the body sooner or later and sooner is safer than later if you know what I mean.


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## T-man (Sep 3, 2003)

Thanks hackskii,

I find that I can go heavier on the dumbells because I train alone and if I can't do the last rep I can allways drop them instead of getting stuck under a bar. Although it's hard work just picking the dumbells up and getting them into position.

Also dumbells don't hurt my shoulder as much as well as I can bring it down just a half an inch higher or lower on my chest to where it does not hurt or click and that make a real difference. I think it is because my left arm is slightly shorter than my right one as I had it broken badly a few times during sports as a teenager so with a barbell the shoulder on that side is getting more work and sometimes plays up.


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## Guest (Feb 1, 2004)

Erm...are you sure those cable crossover weights are right,

they seem extremely weak to me, I've only started back and am doing 90kgs, and that was just light training


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Paul needs to start his chest workout with the incline dumbbells. He could gain 20 percent strength from that if this was his focus but might lose maybe 1 percent on the bench. Good percentages if I might say.


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