# Adding mass while loosing BF



## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

If I'm doing a lean bulk.. And trying to loose BF and add Mass.. What's the maximum amount of cardio I should do a week and which exercises would burn muscle rather than fat?

I've heard too much cardio will burn muscle which I understand but how much is too much..?


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Is that using AAS? or without them?


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Add muscle = calorie surplus.

Lose fat = Calorie deficit.

Add muscle and lose fat = AAS.

Or GH...


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## ws0158 (Jun 23, 2010)

i find fasted cardio for 45 mins in the morning works best and 15mins after weight training, and just eat really clean.

its more your diet than cardio when lean bulking imo

as longs as your eating enough through the day you shouldnt lose any muscle


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

ironman1985bcn said:


> Add muscle = calorie surplus.
> 
> Lose fat = Calorie deficit.
> 
> ...


I'm on Superdrol atm..

So I'm guessing if I run a cycle of any AAS I won't loose hardly any muscle if not build muscle and do all the cardio I want?


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Wardy33 said:


> I'm on Superdrol atm..
> 
> So I'm guessing if I run a cycle of any AAS I won't loose hardly any muscle if not build muscle and do all the cardio I want?


No of course not... AAS will help you to not lose muscle, but it's not the holy grail.


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

ws0158 said:


> i find fasted cardio for 45 mins in the morning works best and 15mins after weight training, and just eat really clean.
> 
> its more your diet than cardio when lean bulking imo
> 
> as longs as your eating enough through the day you shouldnt lose any muscle


M1. Whey shake + banana

M2. Oats w/milk

M3. 3 chicken breast, half cup rice, brocolli

M4. Whey shake

Train

M5. Whey Shake

M6. Lean meat, 2 low gi carbs

M7. Peanut butter, banana

How's that look for my goals?


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Wardy33 said:


> M1. Whey shake + banana
> 
> M2. Oats w/milk
> 
> ...


Way too many protein from shakes mate.

I would rather use proper food you are basicly only eating 2 meals a day, the rest is pretty much weak


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## binghooper23 (Dec 18, 2010)

Thought about clen? I find it anti catabolic and use it in my pct.


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

ironman1985bcn said:


> Way too many protein from shakes mate.
> 
> I would rather use proper food you are basicly only eating 2 meals a day, the rest is pretty much weak


What would you suggest?


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## ironman1985bcn (Mar 3, 2010)

Wardy33 said:


> What would you suggest?


Well, more food basicly... Brown rice, pasta as carb sources, chicken breast, egg whites and fish as for protein sources, and I personally use protein powder as for post-training and just before bedtime.


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

ironman1985bcn said:


> Well, more food basicly... Brown rice, pasta as carb sources, chicken breast, egg whites and fish as for protein sources, and I personally use protein powder as for post-training and just before bedtime.


I dont know where i can fit another meal in tho.. i work in london, have 1 n hlf hour commuting each way..

Get 1 hour lunch.. i fit in what i can when i can lol


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

I would do 3x30 minutes medium intensity cardio a week. There's no issue in having 3 shakes a day if that suits your lifestyle better, and if your overall daily consumption meets your needs.


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## focus_and_win (May 12, 2012)

eat clean and eat big, you will grow, and in time grow lean, wont be the quickest way to rippedville but your getting best of both


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Mingster said:


> I would do 3x30 minutes medium intensity cardio a week. There's no issue in having 3 shakes a day if that suits your lifestyle better, and if your overall daily consumption meets your needs.


Sounds good to me bro..

i do need some help with how many cals etc i need each day..

anyone give me a ruff idea?

im 5.11, 85KG, 14-16% BF..


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## Chris86 (Oct 17, 2011)

I'm using test at 500mg pw I've put on around 10 lbs in 6 week strength is way up and body fat is defo lower eating 1700-1800kcal per day useing clen too 2weeks on 2 off


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Wardy33 said:


> Sounds good to me bro..
> 
> i do need some help with how many cals etc i need each day..
> 
> ...


People will give you numbers that fit your starts but the only real way to know for certain is to log everything you eat, together with the macros, and see how your weight fluctuates. It may take some time to perfect your diet this way, but it will; serve you well in the long term.

The trouble with the formula's that given you calories based on your height and weight is that they do not take into consideration your metabolic rate, your lifestyle, your daily activities, whether you are a stresshead or not et al... We are individuals and don't all fit a pattern based on the average.


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## focus_and_win (May 12, 2012)

Mingster said:


> People will give you numbers that fit your starts but the only real way to know for certain is to log everything you eat, together with the macros, and see how your weight fluctuates. It may take some time to perfect your diet this way, but it will; serve you well in the long term.
> 
> The trouble with the formula's that given you calories based on your height and weight is that they do not take into consideration your metabolic rate, your lifestyle, your daily activities, whether you are a stresshead or not et al... We are individuals and don't all fit a pattern based on the average.


agreed, caloires are only a figure, all this maitance-500 is aload of bollocks IMO

eat a set diet, weigh in start of week, then same again end of week, if lost weight, slightly up, and so on!


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Mingster said:


> People will give you numbers that fit your starts but the only real way to know for certain is to log everything you eat, together with the macros, and see how your weight fluctuates. It may take some time to perfect your diet this way, but it will; serve you well in the long term.
> 
> The trouble with the formula's that given you calories based on your height and weight is that they do not take into consideration your metabolic rate, your lifestyle, your daily activities, whether you are a stresshead or not et al... We are individuals and don't all fit a pattern based on the average.


Ok so i need 1-1.5g of protein per lb?

what is a good amount of carbs to loose weight?


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Wardy33 said:


> Ok so i need 1-1.5g of protein per lb?
> 
> what is a good amount of carbs to loose weight?


As I say it varies. Some people follow very low carb diets - 100g or less a day - and don't take in any carbs after 4pm or whatever. Me, I can diet on 300/400g of carbs and eat them right up until bed time. The secret is to learn what works for you. It's not an easy answer but it is the right one...


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Mingster said:


> As I say it varies. Some people follow very low carb diets - 100g or less a day - and don't take in any carbs after 4pm or whatever. Me, I can diet on 300/400g of carbs and eat them right up until bed time. The secret is to learn what works for you. It's not an easy answer but it is the right one...


ok well when i lost the most weight was low carb diet with ECA so im gonna start lower carbs and higher protien, not worry about fat intake aslong as its good fats..

i was hitting -50g of carbs per day..


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

You looked into carb cycling ?


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Wardy33 said:


> ok well when i lost the most weight was low carb diet with ECA so im gonna start lower carbs and higher protien, not worry about fat intake aslong as its good fats..
> 
> i was hitting -50g of carbs per day..


There you go. Low carbs work for you. I would generally recommend something like 300g protein, 250g carbs, 100g fat or similar, and then add and subtract from there depending on results. But you know your body best. Don't be afraid to juggle the totals a little to see what gives the best results.


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Marrsy86 said:


> You looked into carb cycling ?


Na mate, i used to be 18 stone when i was 15/16 years old..

always been up and down, this is the smallest if been and leanest ive been..

I know if i loose my fat down to under 10% BF ill be happy coz i hate the fat with a passion hatred lol!

ill be happy soon as fat is gone as ill just maintain the fat and bulk..


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

Only just realised your a different wards to the one I though you were


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Mingster said:


> There you go. Low carbs work for you. I would generally recommend something like 300g protein, 250g carbs, 100g fat or similar, and then add and subtract from there depending on results. But you know your body best. Don't be afraid to juggle the totals a little to see what gives the best results.


ha being a previous fat boy, i LOVE CARBS.. desert is my favorite meal lol! its hard bro..

i think ill go for 300g pro, as u said.. 100-150g carbs and 100g fat..

on T3 and Clen so it should give that a boost i spose..


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Marrsy86 said:


> Only just realised your a different wards to the one I though you were


ha theres a different wards LOL


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Mingster said:


> There you go. Low carbs work for you. I would generally recommend something like 300g protein, 250g carbs, 100g fat or similar, and then add and subtract from there depending on results. But you know your body best. Don't be afraid to juggle the totals a little to see what gives the best results.


just worked my daily macros out of which i NORMALLY have..

273G Protein

90G Carbs

F**ks knows about Fats.. thats 2 main meals, 3 shakes and oats.


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## Marrsy86 (Dec 13, 2011)

Hmm try work out your fats mate.

I'm not 100% on the process but if your body isn't getting a decent % of one form of energy from one of your macros it can remove the nitrogen from protein and turn it into a form of carbs.


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Marrsy86 said:


> Hmm try work out your fats mate.
> 
> I'm not 100% on the process but if your body isn't getting a decent % of one form of energy from one of your macros it can remove the nitrogen from protein and turn it into a form of carbs.


FAking hell! This is rediculous lol

Why can't I just b slim! Chocolate cake can suck my leftie!


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## reza85 (Jan 11, 2009)

Marrsy86 said:


> Hmm try work out your fats mate.
> 
> I'm not 100% on the process but if your body isn't getting a decent % of one form of energy from one of your macros it can remove the nitrogen from protein and turn it into a form of carbs.


Glucogenissis is called were protein amino acids gets converted in to glucose hence why aas work on a diet stops this happening due to higher protein synthesis

cant spell


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

reza85 said:


> Glucogenissis is called were protein amino acids gets converted in to glucose hence why aas work on a diet stops this happening due to higher protein synthesis
> 
> cant spell


Good effort lol

Alright so my peanut butter should make up for most of the fats I have a day.. Oats has some in and the shakes have a tad so ill add it up..

I'm adding 1 can of Tuna in there each day as a snack around 11am.. Mixed with a bit of mayo so that will bring my protein up to 303g and the mayo will add a bit of carbs n fat and that's my dailys sorted.. 300g prot/100-150g carb/50g fat..


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## murphy2010 (Dec 17, 2010)

why 7 meals a day out of curiosity?


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

murphy2010 said:


> why 7 meals a day out of curiosity?


Try to keep it littleish but often to keep my metabolism going..


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## ws0158 (Jun 23, 2010)

Wardy33 said:


> M1. Whey shake + banana
> 
> M2. Oats w/milk
> 
> ...


abit low on carbs for my liking and maybe cut the banana out before bed


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## TommyFire (Jul 18, 2010)

Wardy33 said:


> Try to keep it littleish but often to keep my metabolism going..


oh dear...


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## theshrew (Nov 7, 2011)

Wardy33 said:


> FAking hell! This is rediculous lol
> 
> Why can't I just b slim! Chocolate cake can suck my leftie!


I'm with you on this mate lol. I've read so much about diets etc the last year and I still feel as I no sod all lol

I find it all interesting tho for some sad reason


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

theshrew said:


> I'm with you on this mate lol. I've read so much about diets etc the last year and I still feel as I no sod all lol
> 
> I find it all interesting tho for some sad reason


lol dieting is hard, I've been half ass'd before and had good results so I'm glad I'm sticking it out hard this time!


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## murphy2010 (Dec 17, 2010)

Wardy33 said:


> Try to keep it littleish but often to keep my metabolism going..


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## Dutchguy_Asia (Nov 22, 2012)

murphy2010 said:


> View attachment 102427


Seems most people know it has been disproved over here. I can still remember the time it was considered one of the few truths we had. Its way easier knowing its not worth the effort.


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## buffetslayer (Mar 29, 2012)

binghooper23 said:


> Thought about clen? I find it anti catabolic and use it in my pct.


This is interesting. I'm in first week of a 10 week deca/sus/dbol/proviron course. Wondering how you make this work for you?


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## Dagman72 (Apr 2, 2009)

Wardy33 said:


> I dont know where i can fit another meal in tho.. i work in london, have 1 n hlf hour commuting each way..
> 
> Get 1 hour lunch.. i fit in what i can when i can lol


i work in london, cook meals night before and take them with you for the day.


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## Wardy33 (Nov 12, 2012)

Dagman72 said:


> i work in london, cook meals night before and take them with you for the day.


Yeah I already do that but I'm saying I don't have the spare time at work to have 2 or 3 different full meals


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## binghooper23 (Dec 18, 2010)

buffetslayer said:


> This is interesting. I'm in first week of a 10 week deca/sus/dbol/proviron course. Wondering how you make this work for you?


I start it during 2nd week of pct, and follow 2 on 2 off protocol, seem to cut up slightly but don't lose a lot of size.

But then what works for me may not work for others.


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