# A question regarding deadlift



## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

I've I recently got into doing deadlifts a few months back and it's safe to say I fking love them! I just have a question with them if anyone with some knowledge could shed some light for me.

I've currently got a PB of 165kg as of last night. Before that my PB was 155kg which was set with no belt or straps using a mixed grip. I used a belt and mixed grip for my new PB. I don't normally use a belt but this time I did and I have to say the whole thing felt strange and my back feels more sore than usual and not the usual back doms I get from deadlift. The belt itself felt tight and didn't seem to be too high or too low in position. Can anyone help me with this?


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## barnz (Mar 25, 2014)

It will feel different as the loading on your back has changed due to the extra support so muscles are being used differently. You should get used to it after a few times.


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## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

Should I still be using no belt for my working sets then? Feel like my core and back can handle it. Just wanted to try it out for my max, or should I utilize the belt more so I can become more accustomed to it?


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## Bataz (Jan 21, 2014)

Don't have the belt too tight. You want to be able to push your stomach out into it to get tight. You don't want it so tight there's no movement. And as said above it may just be the case that using the belt is so something you will get used to. For heavy singles I would definitely be using a belt, I use one for my rep work aswell on 5x5.


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## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

Okay thanks guys, appreciated


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## Bataz (Jan 21, 2014)

Find Andy Bolton on YouTube, awesome dead lifter.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

barnz said:


> It will feel different as the loading on your back has changed due to the extra support so muscles are being used differently. You should get used to it after a few times.


how exactly does a belt support you ?


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## barneycharles (Jan 3, 2014)

ewen said:


> how exactly does a belt support you ?


Your actually taking the P!ss right


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

barneycharles said:


> Your actually taking the P!ss right


i would love to hear how wearing a belt changes the loading on the back and how muscles are used differently .


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## barneycharles (Jan 3, 2014)

no point wasting my time explaining it cause you will never agree. thinking you so smart. Like to see you compete against me at deadlifting


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## barnz (Mar 25, 2014)

ewen said:


> how exactly does a belt support you ?


Srs? Do you wear a belt and if so why?

My reasoning is thus:

Forcing stomach out into the belt creates intra abdominal pressure which is beneficial to posture and strength when lifting.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

barneycharles said:


> no point wasting my time explaining it cause you will never agree. thinking you so smart. Like to see you compete against me at deadlifting


i hope for your sake you pull as much as you talk sh1t .


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## barneycharles (Jan 3, 2014)

its not a pull its a *lift*


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## aad123 (Dec 7, 2011)

barneycharles said:


> no point wasting my time explaining it cause you will never agree. thinking you so smart. Like to see you compete against me at deadlifting


Wow, where did that come from ??????

Do you and Ewen have a history ? I thought I would have a read for a few tips on deadlifting and didn't expect this.

This could get interesting.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

barnz said:


> Srs? Do you wear a belt and if so why?
> 
> My reasoning is thus:
> 
> Forcing stomach out into the belt creates intra abdominal pressure which is beneficial to posture and strength when lifting.


yes srs

i wear a belt as explained why here http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/benefits-and-proper-use-of-weightlifting-belts/


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## barneycharles (Jan 3, 2014)

aad123 said:


> Wow, where did that come from ??????
> 
> Do you and Ewen have a history ? I thought I would have a read for a few tips on deadlifting and didn't expect this.
> 
> This could get interesting.


[email protected]


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## barneycharles (Jan 3, 2014)

aad123 said:


> Wow, where did that come from ??????
> 
> Do you and Ewen have a history ? I thought I would have a read for a few tips on deadlifting and didn't expect this.
> 
> This could get interesting.


yah me and ewen go way back


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

barneycharles said:


> no point wasting my time explaining it cause you will never agree. thinking you so smart. Like to see you compete against me at deadlifting


would like to see this/10


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## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

Well this thread got abit weird


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## barnz (Mar 25, 2014)

ewen said:


> i would love to hear how wearing a belt changes the loading on the back and how muscles are used differently .


A decent belt fitted correctly will keep the lower back flatter and take the pressure off the lower erectors that are protected by the belt and thus the muscles either side of the belt will then be taking more load as they are not supported as well. I definitely feel it more in my upper back and glutes when using a belt.

Plus, as mentioned before, using the valsalva technique to increase the intra abdominal pressure helps force the chest up and keep the abdomen straighter during the lift and this technique is more effective when using a belt due to the back pressure the belt causes.

But of course you should already know all of this being a strongman...


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## aad123 (Dec 7, 2011)

barneycharles said:


> yah me and ewen go way back


Did he steal you lunch money as a child or something.


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## Rick89 (Feb 27, 2009)

this thread made me lol

seriously though, OP what is it you actually want help with??

if you like using a belt use it if not dont simples


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## aad123 (Dec 7, 2011)

Rick89 said:


> this thread made me lol
> 
> seriously though, OP what is it you actually want help with??
> 
> if you like using a belt use it if not dont simples


The voice of reason.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

UkWardy said:


> I've I recently got into doing deadlifts a few months back and it's safe to say I fking love them! I just have a question with them if anyone with some knowledge could shed some light for me.
> 
> I've currently got a PB of 165kg as of last night. Before that my PB was 155kg which was set with no belt or straps using a mixed grip. I used a belt and mixed grip for my new PB. I don't normally use a belt but this time I did and I have to say the whole thing felt strange and my back feels more sore than usual and not the usual back doms I get from deadlift. The belt itself felt tight and didn't seem to be too high or too low in position. Can anyone help me with this?


best thing to do is post a video of you deadlifting to get a form check .


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## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

ewen said:


> best thing to do is post a video of you deadlifting to get a form check .


Will do mate, be next Wednesday like. I just assumed it's the belt as I've never felt this pain in my back, feels like a pull or muscular strain. I've researched form quite a lot and asked quite a few people at my gym and they seem happy with it.

Edit: @Rick89 it's not about me liking or disliking using said belt. I just didn't know if I was doing something drastically wrong. On further discussion and research I think I had it too tight around my core and that was preventing me from tightening up properly during my 1rm. I just wanted more opinions to eliminate every factor. I'll upload a form check video when I get around to it.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

UkWardy said:


> Will do mate, be next Wednesday like. I just assumed it's the belt as I've never felt this pain in my back, feels like a pull or muscular strain. I've researched form quite a lot and asked quite a few people at my gym and they seem happy with it.


could be anything mate but witthout seeing nobody knows


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## barnz (Mar 25, 2014)

@ewen, I would like to hear your rebuttal for the case I made above as to how a belt can change the muscles affected by wearing a belt.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

barnz said:


> @ewen, I would like to hear your rebuttal for the case I made above as to how a belt can change the muscles affected by wearing a belt.


I am sure you would


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## barnz (Mar 25, 2014)

ewen said:


> I am sure you would


I am trying to have a reasonable debate after you called me out earlier, but you do not seem to wish to continue said debate. The article you linked to agrees with me that that belt offers support, and if that is your only argument against what I said then I think you need to up your comprehension skills as you are arguing for my motion.



> I tend to think of a belt as a performance enhancer rather than protection. If you are lifting correctly, your midsection should be strong enough to support itself through the vast majority of tasks you put it through. You may be limited in how much weight you can lift, but you are not in any significant danger of injury without it. *The belt really comes into play when you need the extra support to get after heavy weights*.
> 
> Most people assume that a lifting belt supports your back. The truth is that a good belt is designed to increase intra-abdominal pressure, which stabilizes your entire midsection. This is why the design of your belt is very important. The typical gym belts that are skinny up front and wide in the back do not cover enough abdominal surface area to provide the support you need. For lifts that challenge core strength like the squat and deadlift, you need a belt that is wide all the way around and will support your abdominals and obliques.


The belt supports your midsection - now would you not agree that your back is part of your midsection and thus it supports your back?

I do not know why you are not up for a reasonable debate on this matter, as I believe in the sharing of knowledge through discussion and debate and when presented with a reasonable argument disproving my motions then I am willing to accede my position and change my mind.

Until such discussion and debate is forthcoming, I quote the Dragons "I'm out".

Thank you and good day.


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

barnz said:


> I am trying to have a reasonable debate after you called me out earlier, but you do not seem to wish to continue said debate. The article you linked to agrees with me that that belt offers support, and if that is your only argument against what I said then I think you need to up your comprehension skills as you are arguing for my motion.
> 
> The belt supports your midsection - now would you not agree that your back is part of your midsection and thus it supports your back?
> 
> ...


 :lol:


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## Bataz (Jan 21, 2014)

Oh dear


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## Goosh (Jun 24, 2012)

Nice to see established members being helpful again :rolleye:


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## Twisted (Oct 6, 2010)

Welcome to UKM where you have to agree!


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Goosh said:


> Nice to see established members being helpful again :rolleye:


here to please


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## aad123 (Dec 7, 2011)

Twisted said:


> Welcome to UKM where you have to agree!


I dissagree


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## JR8908 (Aug 17, 2012)

Bataz said:


> Don't have the belt too tight. You want to be able to push your stomach out into it to get tight. You don't want it so tight there's no movement. And as said above it may just be the case that using the belt is so something you will get used to. For heavy singles I would definitely be using a belt, I use one for my rep work aswell on 5x5.


Good advice here ^


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## amike1221 (May 2, 2014)

A quick word on the mixed grip for your max. Be careful with that, especially if you do lots of bicep work. The mixed grip puts a lot of strain on your supinated bicep. Try a hook grip instead.


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## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

amike1221 said:


> A quick word on the mixed grip for your max. Be careful with that, especially if you do lots of bicep work. The mixed grip puts a lot of strain on your supinated bicep. Try a hook grip instead.


Been told this a few times and that it happens all of a sudden so it does worry me, but isn't hook grip supposed to be abit dodgey too? Have no evidence to back my claims up though, just hear say.


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## amike1221 (May 2, 2014)

Not that I know of. The earlier and lighter you start with the hook grip the less it will hurt, I imagine for the dudes lifting 600+ for reps that straps would be the way to go though.


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