# first time gh user would like some help..please



## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

not sure if i am doing something wrong but i have tried to ask for help/advice a couple times now in threads and by posting my own questions for it but as yet have had no replies, forgive me if i am not going about it correctly but i do need some advice none the less..after spending a a fair bit of spare time now reading various protocols for the use of gh i find there is a lot of conflicting ideas, only last night i was reading on an american forum that small amounts (4iu ed) over a longer period would be what they recomend for best results,then on another us site a guy has a sticky where he has basically said use as much as you can afford daily as the more you use the better the results! and then theres the 3 times a week hi dose, eod at 8iu, 1 big dose followed by top up and all sorts in between..i know some are more aimed towards fat loss others mass and i know it works better with slin but all that aside i as a first time user am trying to find where i should start from and thats where i would apreciate some advice...

i would like to get the most out of it and i have been thinking that my best bet would be the 3 times a week or eod at 8iu and then using peps on days in between (as a matter of interest would this help keep natural gh from stalling? just a thought) anyway i can afford it so money is not an issue, i have genetech genetropin and can get more if it's worthwhile sticking with it and some black top (pinwheels )on order if not..

would this be best way to use it for a first time user or would i be better at 4iu daily for a few months? my goal is of course as much lean bulk as i can achieve

do i need to start at 2iu for a few days or straight in at the dose/protocol i end up using?

i am trying to bring myself on in understanding with regard all the subjects i touch on from aa's to growth,diet and all thats in between but as yet i don't know enough to be confident in choosing a way forward so would be grateful for some assistance or ideas

@Pscarb i would be grateful for your thoughts on this please


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> not sure if i am doing something wrong but i have tried to ask for help/advice a couple times now in threads and by posting my own questions for it but as yet have had no replies, forgive me if i am not going about it correctly but i do need some advice none the less..after spending a a fair bit of spare time now reading various protocols for the use of gh i find there is a lot of conflicting ideas, only last night i was reading on an american forum that small amounts (4iu ed) over a longer period would be what they recomend for best results,then on another us site a guy has a sticky where he has basically said use as much as you can afford daily as the more you use the better the results! and then theres the 3 times a week hi dose, eod at 8iu, 1 big dose followed by top up and all sorts in between..i know some are more aimed towards fat loss others mass and i know it works better with slin but all that aside i as a first time user am trying to find where i should start from and thats where i would apreciate some advice...
> 
> i would like to get the most out of it and i have been thinking that my best bet would be the 3 times a week or eod at 8iu and then using peps on days in between (as a matter of interest would this help keep natural gh from stalling? just a thought) anyway i can afford it so money is not an issue, i have genetech genetropin and can get more if it's worthwhile sticking with it and some black top (pinwheels )on order if not..
> 
> ...


the only thing you need to do when asking a certain person a question as you have done with me is to tag them in the post (as you have done in this one) then i am notified and i can answer the question.

the thing is there is like with everything many opinions on what is the best way to use GH, in my stickies about methods i have used you will see i have pretty much used all the ways to use GH, and to be fair they all work to a degree.

i find consistency the best thing to do, with that in mind i take my GH in 2 ways, these are what i have found to be optimal for me.

1 - small amount daily, this is normally 4iu and is taken every day, either in the morning or before bed it really does not matter although fat burning can be increased if you use it before cardio due to its ability to release FFA's.

2 - M/W/F this would be an amount slightly more than 4iu for me it is either 6 or 8iu although you can use more, this amount would extended the time the GH is in the system causing what many would refer to as a 'Bleed' type scenario which is not good but because you are doing it EOD or M/W/F then this does not harm the body own release any more than any other method.

the above method is the only one that has a study to back up the results (this sticky) and for me this is crucial in using this method, it is the one i favour the most.

when i want to up things i use peptides on the T/Th/Sa leaving sunday drug free, this allows me to get the best of both worlds but for many can be cost prohibitive

so either method 1 or 2 will work well


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> the only thing you need to do when asking a certain person a question as you have done with me is to tag them in the post (as you have done in this one) then i am notified and i can answer the question.
> 
> the thing is there is like with everything many opinions on what is the best way to use GH, in my stickies about methods i have used you will see i have pretty much used all the ways to use GH, and to be fair they all work to a degree.
> 
> ...


thanks very much exactly what i was hoping for..as i can afford it at present i'm tempted to go with the second of the two methods , am i ok to jump straight in at 6 or 8iu? taken any time during the morning?

i take it while i am waiting for peptides to arrive i could just go with 4 everday then switch over when i have it all? i can't see where that would cause an issue but i will ask just in case it's a waste of time?

and lastly is sub q in my belly ok?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

you can jump straight in with the 6-8iu then just alter depending on sides (remember not everyone gets sides)

there is no reason you cannot do the 4iu EOD, IM or SubQ injections are fine


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

again thanks..

sorry to keep on at you but if you could answer a couple of last questions i'd be grateful... firstly should it bubble when you mix it? i put 100iu bacs water in a 10 iu vail but i did it very slowly and gently rather than squirt hard as i do with hcg and then just swirled it round and it dissolved but with no bubbles at all, i had read it to wait untill bubbles subside and that it should bubble up but you read all sorts and half turns out to be no good so i thought i'd ask

and lastly is there a way to stop wasting the bit thats left in the barrel? what i mean is i used a slin with the removable orange spikes instaed of an all in one slin pin as i thought i needed to change the pin with it having gone through the rubber in the vial but then i realised that by using one of them you waste 10iu of fluid (1iu growth) as its left in end of barrel..is it just a case of man up and use the all in one slin pin after it's been through the rubber top?

sorry if thats not very clear


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## warsteiner (Jul 15, 2013)

It shouldn't bubble when mixing and you are right to slowly put the bac water into the gh vial. Once the bac water is in the vial you should slowly turn the vial around to mix with the powder. I use 29g slin pins to inject but because the needle is so short I can't get all of the gh liquid out of the vial so what I do is use a 21g needle to get the gh out of the vial and then back-fill the slin pin so I get all of the liquid and then inject.


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

warsteiner said:


> It shouldn't bubble when mixing and you are right to slowly put the bac water into the gh vial. Once the bac water is in the vial you should slowly turn the vial around to mix with the powder. I use 29g slin pins to inject but because the needle is so short I can't get all of the gh liquid out of the vial so what I do is use a 21g needle to get the gh out of the vial and then back-fill the slin pin so I get all of the liquid and then inject.


thanks for the reply, i thought about back filling but last time i tried it (hcg)when i put plunger in i squirted a load of it out before i could flick it down the barrel..i'm a bit ham fisted to be fair


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> again thanks..
> 
> sorry to keep on at you but if you could answer a couple of last questions i'd be grateful... firstly should it bubble when you mix it? i put 100iu bacs water in a 10 iu vail but i did it very slowly and gently rather than squirt hard as i do with hcg and then just swirled it round and it dissolved but with no bubbles at all, i had read it to wait untill bubbles subside and that it should bubble up but you read all sorts and half turns out to be no good so i thought i'd ask


idealy is should not bubble but it can, releasing the air in the vial by taking the plunger out of the skin pin and piercing the end of the vial will do this can help, as long as you do not shake the vial you are fine



husaberg said:


> and lastly is there a way to stop wasting the bit thats left in the barrel? what i mean is i used a slin with the removable orange spikes instaed of an all in one slin pin as i thought i needed to change the pin with it having gone through the rubber in the vial but then i realised that by using one of them you waste 10iu of fluid (1iu growth) as its left in end of barrel..is it just a case of man up and use the all in one slin pin after it's been through the rubber top?
> 
> sorry if thats not very clear


yes clear and no there is nothing you can do about it


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> idealy is should not bubble but it can, releasing the air in the vial by taking the plunger out of the skin pin and piercing the end of the vial will do this can help, as long as you do not shake the vial you are fine
> 
> yes clear and no there is nothing you can do about it


 thats me sorted then thanks again


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## Kazza61 (Jun 14, 2008)

A really helpful thread.

What results should a first timer expect from running a course of GH as described above?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Kazza61 said:


> A really helpful thread.
> 
> What results should a first timer expect from running a course of GH as described above?


i am not sure how long that piece of string is mate


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Kazza61 said:


> A really helpful thread.
> 
> What results should a first timer expect from running a course of GH as described above?


i would imagine there are so many external factors it's hard to quantify, i am using tren/prop as well in fact am just starting ap parabolin so that and diet are going to be a big factor in my results and i would imagine diet/training/genetics would all play a part


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> you can jump straight in with the 6-8iu then just alter depending on sides (remember not everyone gets sides)
> 
> there is no reason you cannot do the 4iu EOD, IM or SubQ injections are fine


sorry mate got another question if you'd be so kind..

if using 4iu ed is going to close my own gh production down and 8iu eod is likely to also, is using peps on the days you don't use growth to stimulate your own production worthwhile? as if thats the case i am far better off with 8eod and peps as i will keep mine on line so to speak..can you enlighten on this please?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> sorry mate got another question if you'd be so kind..
> 
> if using 4iu ed is going to close my own gh production down and 8iu eod is likely to also, is using peps on the days you don't use growth to stimulate your own production worthwhile? as if thats the case i am far better off with 8eod and peps as i will keep mine on line so to speak..can you enlighten on this please?


any use of a synthetic drug will suppress the natural production, can you counter this by using peptides on the days off i doubt it as peptides do not produce GH they release it


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## John J Rambo (Mar 11, 2014)

I have tried lots ways and found the most beneficial for muscle mass was splitting my dose up and taking it prior and post workout ie;

say I was on 8iu ed then 8 x 7 days = 56 iu a week

I would divide the dose to how many workouts a week I did which was 4 (at the time)

56iu divided by 4 workouts is 14 so I would shoot 10iu before my work out and 4iu right after

This helps the body deal with GH as it mimics what happens in real life with GH release.

I did this after pct during an off cycle and I actually added mass but I ran into nerve compression problems and my arms would go dead unless they were hanging down.

I use 2-4 iu ed now depending how my arms feel.

Just shoot some test or primo if you want lean mass gains, damn cheaper.


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> any use of a synthetic drug will suppress the natural production, can you counter this by using peptides on the days off i doubt it as peptides do not produce GH they release it


thanks for reply

did you feel it made a difference when you did peps on days off though? as you can imagine i don't want to be pinning however many times a day if there is not really going to be a difference, there's the cost also but if it's a definate goer i am going to try it..

i just reread your first reply above and you seem to have done it with some success so looks like thats maybe answered the question


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

John J Rambo said:


> I have tried lots ways and found the most beneficial for muscle mass was splitting my dose up and taking it prior and post workout ie;
> 
> say I was on 8iu ed then 8 x 7 days = 56 iu a week
> 
> ...


thanks for the imput it's given me something to think on


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

John J Rambo said:


> I have tried lots ways and found the most beneficial for muscle mass was splitting my dose up and taking it prior and post workout ie;
> 
> say I was on 8iu ed then 8 x 7 days = 56 iu a week
> 
> ...


no it doesn't, please explain how using a huge dose such as 10iu before a workout mimics how the body releases gh in real life.... this dose done every day will damage the pituitary gland as not only is it a huge dose per day but it will cause a bleed type effect, the body releases GH in a pulsing manner several times a day so as you can imagine i am keen to hear where you have read taking 10iu mimics the body's natural release.

the nerve compression problem you ran into was due to the high dose you was using thus causing water retention and the compression of your nerves in your arm.....(Carpel Tunnel Syndrome)


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> thanks for reply
> 
> did you feel it made a difference when you did peps on days off though? as you can imagine i don't want to be pinning however many times a day if there is not really going to be a difference, there's the cost also but if it's a definate goer i am going to try it..
> 
> i just reread your first reply above and you seem to have done it with some success so looks like thats maybe answered the question


of course adding peptides to GH use will increase the results but many are disappointed with both GH and Peptides as they expect huge results and neither will give that, anyone who says they have gained mass from either are fooled by water retention not muscle tissue.

they will give some muscle tissue but it is far from what many would assume could be portrayed as Mass


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## John J Rambo (Mar 11, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> no it doesn't, please explain how using a huge dose such as 10iu before a workout mimics how the body releases gh in real life.... this dose done every day will damage the pituitary gland as not only is it a huge dose per day but it will cause a bleed type effect, the body releases GH in a pulsing manner several times a day so as you can imagine i am keen to hear where you have read taking 10iu mimics the body's natural release.
> 
> the nerve compression problem you ran into was due to the high dose you was using thus causing water retention and the compression of your nerves in your arm.....(Carpel Tunnel Syndrome)


Sorry I might not have explained that very well at all.

I was told by my Doctor that GH is released in heavy bursts like when a child is having a growth spurt compared to when not. Granted GH is released at a nominal amount daily but to get the best out of it you should try and mimic a growth spurt effect. He said rather than take say 4 iu daily it is more beneficial for muscle growth to take a larger amount but not as often and so to break it down from daily injections to 3 or so a week, as such mimicking a growth spurt. He didn't actually advise me to take such high does tho. As for the pre workout shot, this has a fair bit of following, I know a lot think its nonsense but I wanted to try it and honestly find I have amazing workouts when I do it.

Like I said in my post Ive been on it a year and tried all sorts of variations but doing this gave me the best results regarding adding lean muscle mass. I only did it for 6 weeks and added 4lbs of muscle in an off cycle.

As for the nerve compression it first started well before I did this when I was on a normal dose of 4 iu ed so doubling my weekly dose wasn't the best thing I could have done but I wanted to try it out. Even now if I don't take GH for a week or two as soon as I take the first shot again I get pins and needles in my arms in bed that night.

Do you have anything I can read on what GH doses damage the pituitary gland, would be interested in looking at that as it's the first time Ive seen in mentioned?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

John J Rambo said:


> Sorry I might not have explained that very well at all.
> 
> I was told by my Doctor that GH is released in heavy bursts like when a child is having a growth spurt compared to when not. Granted GH is released at a nominal amount daily but to get the best out of it you should try and mimic a growth spurt effect. He said rather than take say 4 iu daily it is more beneficial for muscle growth to take a larger amount but not as often and so to break it down from daily injections to 3 or so a week, as such mimicking a growth spurt. He didn't actually advise me to take such high does tho. As for the pre workout shot, this has a fair bit of following, I know a lot think its nonsense but I wanted to try it and honestly find I have amazing workouts when I do it.


he is wrong, children have growth spurts by releasing high amounts of GH normally every few weeks, this is not the same once we are adults and trying to mimic this will not do the same, you will gain weight without doubt but it will be mostly water. just because something is done does not make it the best way, i have used GH for over 10yrs in pretty much every way possible and one thing is for sure once all the water has settled the differences in results are minimal.....

the body in any adult pulses GH in small amounts through the day IT DOES NOT release large amounts in one go......



John J Rambo said:


> Like I said in my post Ive been on it a year and tried all sorts of variations but doing this gave me the best results regarding adding lean muscle mass. I only did it for 6 weeks and added 4lbs of muscle in an off cycle.


how did you gauge the lean muscle tissue gain?? was it dexa scan or just on the scales, i have no doubt you gained weight i would be passed if i was using that much GH and did not gain....



John J Rambo said:


> As for the nerve compression it first started well before I did this when I was on a normal dose of 4 iu ed so doubling my weekly dose wasn't the best thing I could have done but I wanted to try it out. Even now if I don't take GH for a week or two as soon as I take the first shot again I get pins and needles in my arms in bed that night.


normal dose? there is no normal dose just a dose that most use, the pins and needles are a sign that you are using to much GH for your body.....



John J Rambo said:


> Do you have anything I can read on what GH doses damage the pituitary gland, would be interested in looking at that as it's the first time Ive seen in mentioned?


i am surprised that you have not heard about this, as GH is a synthetic drug and any drug that you use that is synthetic will cause a negative feedback loop on the pituitary gland causing the lowering of production of natural GH, when the body gets a synthetic version of something like GH it lowers its own production very much like Test does through the HPTA......it doe not happen straight away but will over time, this is one of the benefits of GHRP/GHRH peptides over synthetic GH as they release natural GH.....


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## John J Rambo (Mar 11, 2014)

Pscarb said:


> he is wrong, children have growth spurts by releasing high amounts of GH normally every few weeks, this is not the same once we are adults and trying to mimic this will not do the same, you will gain weight without doubt but it will be mostly water. just because something is done does not make it the best way, i have used GH for over 10yrs in pretty much every way possible and one thing is for sure once all the water has settled the differences in results are minimal.....
> 
> the body in any adult pulses GH in small amounts through the day IT DOES NOT release large amounts in one go......
> 
> ...


Thanks for taking the time to put me straight, really appreciated. I have an appointment to see my Doc this week so I will raise these issues. He actually sells me the GH (he's one of these lifestyle Docs) so get the feeling maybe he's just telling me anything to keep me a customer or they are his beliefs??

As for my weight gain, it was just measured via scales and callipers. Upped the cals slightly and don't forget I started this amount after I'd finished PCT from a 12 wk Test cycle so really I should have been shedding a few pounds. I kept my end of cycle strength too. You think a lot of this was water?

One thing I've never noticed tho is this GH buzz and feeling of well being that people often talk about, I never feel any different. Is that common?


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## Dark Prowler (Jun 20, 2013)

How long would you typically run GH for, @Pscarb? And if running GH @ 4iu ED, would you run it on the weekends, too, or keep it to Monday through Friday?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

ideally you run GH for as long as you can, running it at 4iu ed is fine most run it Monday through Friday for financial reasons


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## Dark Prowler (Jun 20, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> ideally you run GH for as long as you can, running it at 4iu ed is fine most run it Monday through Friday for financial reasons


Would you say there is a minimum amount of time GH should be run? And in your opinion, do you lose out on anything running it @ 5 days a week as opposed to 7?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Dark Prowler said:


> Would you say there is a minimum amount of time GH should be run? And in your opinion, do you lose out on anything running it @ 5 days a week as opposed to 7?


There is a study in this section that shows decent number for lean tissue gain and fat loss after 6 weeks use M/W/F I would not use it for less than that...(the study used pharma GH)

You will lose out if you run it 5 days instead of 7 because your using less GH


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> There is a study in this section that shows decent number for lean tissue gain and fat loss after 6 weeks use M/W/F I would not use it for less than that...(the study used pharma GH)
> 
> You will lose out if you run it 5 days instead of 7 because your using less GH


just wondering if you had unlimited funds how you would run it?


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## Bob &amp; Weave (Apr 28, 2012)

With unlimited funds I'd run it everyday at 8iu with 5x saturation dose of ipam and mod, I'm not sure that'd be sensible though..


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> just wondering if you had unlimited funds how you would run it?


M/W/F


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## trio (Sep 12, 2011)

@Pscarb Im running my GH on its own 3IU of hydratropin 5 days a week to aid in ligament repair in my knee from a sprting injury.. the reason i take the two days off because I read on forums, no main reliable source, that these 2 days allow my own GH levels to pulse better (giving my body a rest).. I have the funding to run it 7 days a week but don't want to increase the detrimental limitation of my own GH... Have I read correct... can i just take one day off or should I run it the full 7 days?

Thanks, Trio.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

trio said:


> @Pscarb Im running my GH on its own 3IU of hydratropin 5 days a week to aid in ligament repair in my knee from a sprting injury.. the reason i take the two days off because I read on forums, no main reliable source, that these 2 days allow my own GH levels to pulse better (giving my body a rest).. I have the funding to run it 7 days a week but don't want to increase the detrimental limitation of my own GH... Have I read correct... can i just take one day off or should I run it the full 7 days?
> 
> Thanks, Trio.


2 days off GH will not fix any negative feedback you get form 5 days on GH, you are using a low dose i would use it 7 days a week, keep it consistent


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## trio (Sep 12, 2011)

thanks @Pscarb. Im having jab's to go abroad soon, uncertain of which.. but would GH affect this?

Also, how detriment is rHGH on my own, very suppressive/slows it town.. When i stop taking it will a see a massive laps in recovery time, as in worse than what I originally had before rHGH.

Thanks, Trio


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> 2 days off GH will not fix any negative feedback you get form 5 days on GH, you are using a low dose i would use it 7 days a week, keep it consistent


would be grateful for your thoughts on the length of time it takes before your body stops its own gh production as i have done 7 weeks now at 4iu ed and as i am a couple weeks into trt/cuise afetr finnishing my cycle (didn't think it worth pct as going again after a 10/12week rest)..i had thought of going to 8iu eod and using peps on days in between but if my body will have stopped producing it would seem to be pointless using peps...as i say i would be grateful for your thoughts on whether it's worth going this route or just staying with 4iu daily...thanks


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

your body does not stop producing GH it suppresses the process....negative feedback does not mean a total stop to production.....

how long it takes is down to the individual and dose used.........


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> your body does not stop producing GH it suppresses the process....negative feedback does not mean a total stop to production.....
> 
> how long it takes is down to the individual and dose used.........


thanks, i apreciate its an individual thing and not quantifiable so you can't say for sure but if anyone would have a good idea on this i would think it to be you so as an educated guess would you think the using peps worthwhile at this point if i went to 8eod with the growth? i'll have done 8 weeks at 4iu daily by the time i introduce the new regime with peps if it seems wothwhile...thanks


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

yes adding peptides that release natural GH in a pulsing manner that contains all of the Isoforms will be a good thing it certainly will not be a bad thing


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> yes adding peptides that release natural GH in a pulsing manner that contains all of the Isoforms will be a good thing it certainly will not be a bad thing


great thanks ..what would you suggest best practice would be? if take 8 of growth eod then i had thought pre workout , post workout and before bed with peps (grhp2 grf1 29 without) or should i take a morning one? it's bulk i am aiming at while i am off cycle, i think it will give me a mental edge as well if i believe i can still gain while trt/cruising..is it worth doing more than 3 a day?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Wow so many questions??

M/W/F is my preferred method for GH with peptides on either days off or just weekends depending on budget, yes the results would be better at 5 x day

As you are aware there needs to be 3hrs between peptide injections so I am unsure how you think you can use them pre and post workout unless you train for 3hrs?

You will not add what I consider mass with peptides and GH IMO you will add some muscle but it is not what I call mass, your diet dictates every thing when it comes to gaining or losing


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> Wow so many questions??
> 
> M/W/F is my preferred method for GH with peptides on either days off or just weekends depending on budget, yes the results would be better at 5 x day
> 
> ...


thanks again..sorry about all the questions but having someone that knows so much thats prepared to help is an oppertunity to good to miss, i could really drive you nuts if i asked all the things i wanted to know more about! this is me being restrained  i suspect i am becoming a pest already so am trying to ask the minimum amount.. in all honesty i really enjoy learning more about any subject i am involved in and if i am messing with my health i should know as much as poss! i have untold more knowledge since i started using the forum and researching on line but as i am aware you have limited time i ask just what i think would help me most..

i'll try and make this the last question then ..if i do pre and post workout one would have to be about 1.5 hours either before or after to make the 3 hour gap do you think that the post workout straight after or pre immediately before would be most benificial? thanks again


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> thanks again..sorry about all the questions but having someone that knows so much thats prepared to help is an oppertunity to good to miss, i could really drive you nuts if i asked all the things i wanted to know more about! this is me being restrained  i suspect i am becoming a pest already so am trying to ask the minimum amount.. in all honesty i really enjoy learning more about any subject i am involved in and if i am messing with my health i should know as much as poss! i have untold more knowledge since i started using the forum and researching on line but as i am aware you have limited time i ask just what i think would help me most..
> 
> i'll try and make this the last question then ..if i do pre and post workout one would have to be about 1.5 hours either before or after to make the 3 hour gap do you think that the post workout straight after or pre immediately before would be most benificial? thanks again


why don't you just use them AM/PWO/B4 bed??


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## husaberg (May 23, 2013)

i left morning out as i had thought pre and post workout would be more bulk orientated but thats just a guess .. i am happy to go am/ pwo and b4 bed but just to clarify is the pwo post or pre?..thanks again


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

husaberg said:


> i left morning out as i had thought pre and post workout would be more bulk orientated but thats just a guess .. i am happy to go am/ pwo and b4 bed but just to clarify is the pwo post or pre?..thanks again


it is a guess that is incorrect mate, PWO is always Post


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