# Upper Lower Split



## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Hello All,

Does anyone has a good layout of a upper lower split ?

Request you to share.

Thanks

Jatin


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## Slagface (Dec 10, 2016)

Imo if you manage to train shoulders, back, chest and arms all in 1 session, youre not putting enough effort into your lifts.

I have to give overhead press its own session, if I trained like a girl I could probably stretch to doing all those excersizes at once but not if youre training with any kind of intensity.

I think crossfit does this kind of training? :lol:


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Slagface said:


> Imo if you manage to train shoulders, back, chest and arms all in 1 session, youre not putting enough effort into your lifts.
> 
> I have to give overhead press its own session, if I trained like a girl I could probably stretch to doing all those excersizes at once but not if youre training with any kind of intensity.
> 
> I think crossfit does this kind of training? :lol:


 That is my worry. I don't know whether to shift from PPL to Upper lower split or not or go back again to Bro splits. I was reading few articles on PHUL and it really made me think how someone can manage so much of work in one day and that too all lifts near 80% of RM.


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## AestheticManlet (Jun 12, 2012)

Push pull legs mate :thumb

I aborted my 4 day split after 2 weeks.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Ross1991 said:


> Push pull legs mate :thumb
> 
> I aborted my 4 day split after 2 weeks.


 Currently doing it. The reason i was thinking of shifting to upper lower from PPL was to decrease the taxing of upper body joints. In totality, i understand upper lower gives more time for recovery to joints.


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## Slagface (Dec 10, 2016)

I think sticking to a set routine is too restrictive and counter productive. Different areas recover faster than others for example I can train shoulders most days but chest I need 4 days between. I train what feels like needs training. Which could be any group on any different day. For example monday I did chest and shoulders, tuesday back and shoulders and bi's and then did another overhead 5 x 5 in the evening. Today ill do legs and arms, tomorrow I might just do chest and tris. I find this method best.


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## DLTBB (Jan 26, 2015)

I'd take P/P/L twice a week over an U/L split any day TBH, I couldn't stimulate all of my upper body muscles properly in a single workout.

If you do P/P/L rotate between chest and shoulder focus for push, row and pull down focus for pull and hamstring and quad focus for legs.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

DLTBB said:


> I'd take P/P/L twice a week over an U/L split any day TBH, I couldn't stimulate all of my upper body muscles properly in a single workout.
> 
> If you do P/P/L rotate between chest and shoulder focus for push, row and pull down focus for pull and hamstring and quad focus for legs.


 Twice a week?. You mean pull on Monday and then again pull on Thursday? Or by week you mean with in 7 days?


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Slagface said:


> I think sticking to a set routine is too restrictive and counter productive. Different areas recover faster than others for example I can train shoulders most days but chest I need 4 days between. I train what feels like needs training. Which could be any group on any different day. For example monday I did chest and shoulders, tuesday back and shoulders and bi's and then did another overhead 5 x 5 in the evening. Today ill do legs and arms, tomorrow I might just do chest and tris. I find this method best.


 I have done this all my life. Lately, shifted to this routine thing. Was enjoying it in the initial phases, now feels like a job.


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

http://oldschooltrainer.com/upper-lower-training-split/

I train using an Upper/Lower split. There's lots of productive, well known routines.


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## DLTBB (Jan 26, 2015)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Twice a week?. You mean pull on Monday and then again pull on Thursday? Or by week you mean with in 7 days?


 3 on, 1 off.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Mingster said:


> http://oldschooltrainer.com/upper-lower-training-split/
> 
> I train using an Upper/Lower split. There's lots of productive, well known routines.


 How would you adjust your rep ranges from one upper body session to the second upper session?. Would you change it or keep them more or less same?

Workout A
chest - flat bench
shoulders - overhead barbell press
triceps - weighted dips
back - 45 degree chest supported rows
biceps - barbell body drag curls

Workout B
Hams - Romanian deadlift
quads - back squats
calves - Standing calf raises
forearms - grip machine
core - planks, crunches and roman chair side bends


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

DLTBB said:


> 3 on, 1 off.


 Got it.

Secondly, Lets say you did weight near 85% of RM in your first push session, will you follow the same principle in your coming push session or would decrease the effort?

Edit :- Better question would be how to take care of progressive overload on a PPL routine or upper/lower or PPL twice a week.


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## Sphinkter (Apr 10, 2015)

Slagface said:


> I think sticking to a set routine is too restrictive and counter productive. Different areas recover faster than others for example I can train shoulders most days but chest I need 4 days between. *I train what feels like needs training. Which could be any group on any different day*. For example monday I did chest and shoulders, tuesday back and shoulders and bi's and then did another overhead 5 x 5 in the evening. Today ill do legs and arms, tomorrow I might just do chest and tris. I find this method best.


 How can you live like that mate my arse is clenching just thinking about it.


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> How would you adjust your rep ranges from one upper body session to the second upper session?. Would you change it or keep them more or less same?
> 
> Workout A
> chest - flat bench
> ...


 I generally keep it the same. I try to progress weight on at least one exercise a session.

If I'm feeling run down I may lower the weight and up the reps occasionally.

Currently I do - Upper: Face pulls 5x10, Pulldowns 4x8, Bench 4x8, Side Laterals 3X15, Pin Presses 3x12, and, if I have the energy, a bicep exercise.

- Lower: Deads 6x4-8, Extensions 3x10 + final set to failure, Curls 4x10, Hyperextensions 3x10, and again occasionally a couple of sets of Calves.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Mingster said:


> I generally keep it the same. I try to progress weight on at least one exercise a session.
> 
> If I'm feeling run down I may lower the weight and up the reps occasionally.
> 
> ...


 Ok.

Lets say i aim at doing progressive overload only on Bench press, Overhead Press, Rows and Squats. And all other lifts, i would want to keep the number of sets and Reps constant. This is just from the point of view keeping an easier track on progressive overload.

Now, Let's say on First session of Upper body , I did 100Kg for 8 reps on Bench press(And 1 don't want to go higher than 8 reps on bench). In the second session of the week, should i go for lets say 105 Kg for x amount of reps or i should concentrate on progressive overload on some other exercise rather than bench and just do bench with around 12-15 reps. I am concerned that if in the same week i would aim to do progressive overload through weight , it may fail and i won't go anywhere. Reason behind this thinking is most of the strength programs rotate around hitting the 85% of 1RM once a week on compound lifts. The other concern would be joint fatigues.


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Ok.
> 
> Lets say i aim at doing progressive overload only on Bench press, Overhead Press, Rows and Squats. And all other lifts, i would want to keep the number of sets and Reps constant. This is just from the point of view keeping an easier track on progressive overload.
> 
> Now, Let's say on First session of Upper body , I did 100Kg for 8 reps on Bench press(And 1 don't want to go higher than 8 reps on bench). In the second session of the week, should i go for lets say 105 Kg for x amount of reps or i should concentrate on progressive overload on some other exercise rather than bench and just do bench with around 12-15 reps. I am concerned that if in the same week i would aim to do progressive overload through weight , it may fail and i won't go anywhere. Reason behind this thinking is most of the strength programs rotate around hitting the 85% of 1RM once a week on compound lifts. The other concern would be joint fatigues.


 It depends how you feel on the day.

Exercises like Deads and Bench I can generally progress session on session - as long as you start your training cycle at 80% or thereabouts. Over 5-8 weeks you should push past your previous best and then the whole process would start over. I don't go over 8 reps on Bench, and may well drop as low as 4, but week on week the weight or reps will increase. As the weight increases you may have to drop the increases to 2.5kg or less.

You shouldn't fail as long as you have a realistic starting weight/%. The initial sessions should be fairly comfortable which will allow you to build momentum leading into the tougher 5th, 6th, and 7th weeks. Even if, occasionally, you can only manage to repeat the weight/reps lifted at the previous session I would consider this worthwhile 'consolidation' of your previous lift. I only consider it as a stall when I can't improve the lift for three consecutive sessions.

If you have a deload week - 3x5 at 50-60% - every eighth week you should minimize joint fatigue.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Mingster said:


> It depends how you feel on the day.
> 
> Exercises like Deads and Bench I can generally progress session on session - as long as you start your training cycle at 80% or thereabouts. Over 5-8 weeks you should push past your previous best and then the whole process would start over. I don't go over 8 reps on Bench, and may well drop as low as 4, but week on week the weight or reps will increase. As the weight increases you may have to drop the increases to 2.5kg or less.
> 
> ...


 Understood. Thank you


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## Mayzini (May 18, 2016)

I generally run a PPL ( in a HIT STYLE) 3 on 1 off style routine but every 8 weeks I switch to 4 weeks of upper lower split over 4 days, so as to switch up volume and decrease the weights slightly. I also run an RPE system over the same periods increasing RPE week on week. the RPE system is something I have only recently introduced and its taking me a little while to get used to it, as I have been used to running full tilt balls to the wall lifts, but as I get older the joints and body takes a beating so, building in the RPE system allows to keep the time and tension in place without wrecking the body full tilt all the time, plus it is also a good way of increasing the lifts overall.


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## AncientOldBloke (Dec 11, 2014)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Does anyone has a good layout of a upper lower split ?
> 
> Request you to share.


 Jatin, I thought this was a good layout but like a lot of fellas posting above, I found that it wasn't sustainable for more than a month. It burnt me out and buggered up my elbows.

But here it is anyway:

*EVERY MORNING *




Treadmill 8kmh, 8%

Month 1 on: 30 mins = 4km

Month 2 on: 45 mins = 6km

Month 3 off: 60 mins = 8km






*10 mins stretching:*

15 seconds each, straight sets

Calves: up against wall

Hams: toe touches

Quads: ankle hold while standing one-legged

Chest: elbows behind back

Shoulders: lean forward with fingers in doorway

Triceps: palm behind back, finger on elbow

Back: interlock fingers, then palms away

Back: flat bench back extension

Back: Superman

Abs: Plank

Abs: Decline bench crunch

Abs: Incline bench leg raise

Abs: Hands and knees. Raise opposing limbs





*MON, WED, FRI EVES - UPPER*




*5 mins warm up on elliptical*

*45 mins weights*

*10 sets of 10 reps*

Bent row

Deadlift

BB shrug

Wide-grip palms-away chin

Seated overhead press

Incline bench press

Incline DB flye

Seated upright DB lateral








*5 mins stretching*



*TUE, THU, SAT EVES - LOWER*






*5 mins warm up on elliptical*

*45 mins weights*

*10 sets of 10 reps*



Squat

Leg extension

Leg curl

BB hip thrust

DB lunge

DB standing calf raise








*5 mins stretching*


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## jake87 (May 7, 2010)

Slagface said:


> I think sticking to a set routine is too restrictive and counter productive. Different areas recover faster than others for example I can train shoulders most days but chest I need 4 days between. I train what feels like needs training. Which could be any group on any different day. For example monday I did chest and shoulders, tuesday back and shoulders and bi's and then did another overhead 5 x 5 in the evening. Today ill do legs and arms, tomorrow I might just do chest and tris. I find this method best.


 Legs and arms same day? You train like a girl


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

As you've been training a good while I'll just mention a slightly different way to structure progressive overload, which is to have periodised variations in numbers of sets in addition to increasing weight. This is an idea Mike Israetel promotes, which I've been using recently and like. There are loads of YouTube videos where he talks about this but the ideas are set out here:

https://renaissanceperiodization.com/training-volume-landmarks-muscle-growth/

Just a different option to consider.


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## jjtreml (Dec 13, 2016)

I'm doing full body compound movements strength and hypertrophy sessions three times a week and making great gains :thumb


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Slagface said:


> Imo *if you manage to train shoulders, back, chest and arms all in 1 session, youre not putting enough effort into your lifts.*
> 
> I have to give overhead press its own session, if I trained like a girl I could probably stretch to doing all those excersizes at once but not if youre training with any kind of intensity.
> 
> I think crossfit does this kind of training? :lol:


 IMO your full of s**t :lol:


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Slagface said:


> *I think sticking to a set routine is too restrictive and counter productive. *Different areas recover faster than others for example I can train shoulders most days but chest I need 4 days between. I train what feels like needs training. Which could be any group on any different day.* For example monday I did chest and shoulders, tuesday back and shoulders and bi's and then did another overhead 5 x 5 in the evening.* Today ill do legs and arms, tomorrow I might just do chest and tris. I find this method best.


 I rest my case :lol:


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Hello All,
> 
> Does anyone has a good layout of a upper lower split ?
> 
> ...


 Yes

Once I stalled in terms of progress and recovery I moved away from full body workout (compound lifts) 2 - 3 x per week. changing to an upper lower split gave the same energy level to concentrate on upper/lower days respectively over a 45 - 60 min training session. this resulted in moving more weight in good form and increasing recovery time.

*1)Upper day consists of:*

Chest

Back

shoulders

triceps

*2)Lower day consists of:*

Legs

abdominal s

biceps

3) Rest

4) Rest

repeat

This works really well training each body part 2X over an 8 day cycle. To create any kind of muscular size and shape you need to allow recovery with good nutrition. Skip, scrimp or lack in either of these you are not fulfilling your natural physical potential.

I can further break upper/lower sessions down into individual exercises with weight and reps if your interested. Although the weight I move is only significant to me you will need to find your own level.

Keeping to a set routine is a good way to track progress.


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

What a crock of sh1t some of this thread is @Jatin Bhatia

Flat Bench - 5 sets

Push Press - 3 sets

CGBP - 3 sets

Weighted Chin Ups - 3 sets

Weighted Dips - 3 sets

Seated Dumbbell Curls - 3 sets

Single arm Row - 3 sets

You've effectively trained chest, shoulders, triceps and stimulated back & biceps. it's only when you're lifting *extremely* heavy, you won't be able to train in this fashion. problem is, people are just lazy and have a sh1t work capacity. you could even drop the curls and you've hit everything hard in 20 sets.

each to their own. obviously if you're benching 160kg+, it would be a lot of strain to then perform something like a 100kg single arm dumbbell row for sets/reps, you're tendons + joints would be under a lot of stress. my Upper/Lower, I get the frequency and similar volume to this in just 4 days. I'd rather be in the gym for 2hours or more, for 4 days a week, than to turn up and train 5 or 6 days for a shorter timeframe.


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## The-Real-Deal (Dec 5, 2014)

Starz said:


> *What a crock of sh1t some of this thread is* @Jatin Bhatia
> 
> Flat Bench - 5 sets
> 
> ...


 Which you have just contributed to!

In the gym for 2 hrs or more = fail


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## Slagface (Dec 10, 2016)

Natty Steve'o said:


> IMO your full of s**t :lol:





Natty Steve'o said:


> IMO your full of s**t :lol:


 Thanks for sharing. But I dont care what you think :thumbup1:


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## Slagface (Dec 10, 2016)

jake87 said:


> Legs and arms same day? You train like a girl


 Looking at your pic my only response can be.. "but atleast I lift" :lol:


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## jake87 (May 7, 2010)

Slagface said:


> Looking at your pic my only response can be.. "but atleast I lift" :lol:


 Pics


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## Sphinkter (Apr 10, 2015)

jake87 said:


> Pics of mrs' new fake tits


 We have not forgotten @Slagface now deliver


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## Slagface (Dec 10, 2016)

jake87 said:


> Pics


 Ok ok its an old one from when I was doing a bit of strongman but. 18 inch arms doe.

Train with me ill have you cry like a girl


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## jake87 (May 7, 2010)

Slagface said:


> Ok ok its an old one from when I was doing a bit of strongman but. 18 inch arms doe.
> 
> Train with me ill have you cry like a girl
> 
> View attachment 143764


 What are you saying these days?


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## Slagface (Dec 10, 2016)

jake87 said:


> What are you saying these days?


 Half the size with a dick twice as big.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

This thread is giving me a headache :mellow:

I'll put it this way. I've stuck to an upper/lower for most of my 4 years of training. I've put on over 70lbs of muscle in that time. My weights have gone up dramatically across the board. I don't get people saying it's too much. The only "big" exercise in there that takes a lot out of you is the back exercises. The bench press variant and shoulder press variant or whatever before those aren't overly taxing. I train fu**ing hard and I push my sets to absolute failure and beyond, I've been into the Dorian Yates style of training for the last few years and I truly believe I've learned to replicate the same intensity otherwise I wouldn't have gotten the results that I had on such low volume.

Granted, there's going to come a time when you're lifting ridiculously heavy and your body can't handle that much weight in every session, but we're talking having tripled the weights you started with at the very least.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

AncientOldBloke said:


> Jatin, I thought this was a good layout but like a lot of fellas posting above, I found that it wasn't sustainable for more than a month. It burnt me out and buggered up my elbows.
> 
> But here it is anyway:
> 
> ...


 Jesus fu**ing Christ, that's one of THE most insane routines I've ever seen mate :lol: No wonder you got burned out quickly! 10x10 is supposed to be done on two exercises per session, not 6-8 exercises! Also 10x10 is meant to be done once a week for each muscle. Upper/lower is also supposed to be done 4 days a week as opposed to 6. So basically you were doing GVT for each muscle group every two days with no muscles missed. You did fu**ing well to last a month and if your poor tendons aren't meant to handle that much volume. I think even Arnie would shudder at what you've laid out here


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## Pancake' (Aug 30, 2012)

Natty Steve'o said:


> Which you have just contributed to!
> 
> In the gym for 2 hrs or more = fail


 No it doesn't you big softie. Plenty of top tier physiques have been built training even longer than that. like I said, each to their own. there are many paths, that lead to the same destinations.


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## AncientOldBloke (Dec 11, 2014)

I'mNotAPervert! said:


> Jesus fu**ing Christ, that's one of THE most insane routines I've ever seen mate :lol: No wonder you got burned out quickly! 10x10 is supposed to be done on two exercises per session, not 6-8 exercises! Also 10x10 is meant to be done once a week for each muscle. Upper/lower is also supposed to be done 4 days a week as opposed to 6. So basically you were doing GVT for each muscle group every two days with no muscles missed. You did fu**ing well to last a month and if your poor tendons aren't meant to handle that much volume. I think even Arnie would shudder at what you've laid out here


 Yeah. Ended up at the GP for Naproxen two days ago.

https://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/topic/302260-thoughts-while-in-gps-reception/?do=embed

1. I'm never maxing out again. Ever. It's only a fu**ing hobby, not a money-making career

2. I'm never taking winnie or any oral again. Elbows shot to pieces. Test and maybe some NPP is enough

3. Train EoD, whole body, no GVT

4. Eat and watch TV more

5. Be horizontal more


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

AncientOldBloke said:


> Yeah. Ended up at the GP for Naproxen two days ago.
> 
> https://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/topic/302260-thoughts-while-in-gps-reception/?do=embed
> 
> ...


 Tbh an upper/lower might be better for your joints if you train EOD and stick to a basic set/rep scheme  My upper/lower typically looks like:

Chest

Side delts

Pulldowns

Rows

Rear delts/upper back

Bis

Tris

Squats/leg press

Leg ext

Leg curl

Calves


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## AncientOldBloke (Dec 11, 2014)

@I'mNotAPervert!

Thanks. I'm taking a week or so off for the GP prescription to do its thing.

I'll give yours a bash just as soon as I can push and pull.

PS - that Naproxin plain bloody works! Its only day two and it's made a huge difference.


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## Michael Harrington (Aug 4, 2021)

An upper/lower split is a workout plan that alternates between upper and lower body training. On one day, you do upper-body workouts and on another day, you do lower-body activities.

Upper Body:
Upper-body workouts are lifting that target the chest, middle and upper back, shoulders, biceps, and triceps.

Lower Body:
Lower-body splits target the abdominals, lower back, glutes, quads, hamstrings, and calves.

Here are the effective Strength Training & Conditioning classes Per Week:

Monday - Lat
Tuesday - Bicep
Wednesday - Chest
Thursday - Tricep
Friday - Shoulder
Saturday - Leg
Sunday rest day

I’ve learned these techniques from the Iron Orr Fitness gym and from these strategic plans are worked well on building my muscle.


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