# HIT Training



## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

There's been a bit of conversation about HIT training at the min so thought I'd give it a go the other day on my back.

The short version of the story is that after 15mins work and 2 working sets I felt as sick as a blackpool donkey! Also slept like a log which I hardly ever do.

I'll be doing this for a while and seeing where it takes me, got legs to do today mg:

Just wondered if anyone else has given it a try, and what you thought?


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

what did you do for your session??


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## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

Did dead lifts first then wide grip pull downs.

Did 2 sets of 12's then as much weight as I could for 5 reps, drop a little bit of weight off then went til failure. Hurt like hell. Would have been better with a spotter so could have got a bit more work out.

I've never felt as pumped or as ill


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## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

I used a HIT program about 2 years ago. Worked out great for me. Could finished my weights in less than 30 minutes. I think around 20 minutes when I pushed myself.

What program did you follow?


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

its the only way to train i recon, bloody hardcore and fry the muscle


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## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

I'm finding the feeling after training totally different. Although do feel you need a spotter to get full benefit.

Just got back from doing legs, to be honest I was a bit scared doing squats due to me having a crap knee and no spotter but managed to push myself hard enough to see stars. On the leg press managed 540lb on the last set for 8.

I'm still finding how to use the system to it's full potential but am enjoying it so far. Plus should do my body good as I've never trained this way.

I should be able to use it to more effect tomorow on arms


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## fits (Feb 3, 2004)

I read a mike menzer book a few years ago and must say that his writings seems very scientific and made allot of sense. I know people that use it and say its THE ONLY WAY to train. I think its ok for a period. It is tough on the body and tough on the mind after a while. You definitely need a spotter to do it 100% i think. Also for encouragement.


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## hertderg (Jun 15, 2007)

Let me know what routines you are going to do Rack for the rest of your body.

After reading a little on Righty's thread I decided to give it a go for chest/biceps this week, like you i was totally knackered and pumped so much It hurt, 3 days later chest still felt tight and a little pumped, loved it.

I downloaded a torrent - Mike Mentzer's HIT , it's well worth a look, shows you the basics of HIT training but I need to mixed up the routines and learn it more.

Can anyone suggest any routines for the like of myself and Rack who are new to this type of training please ??


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## Guest (Nov 16, 2007)

Kezz said:


> its the only way to train i recon, bloody hardcore and fry the muscle


Agreed!

I love both Yates style and DC style and very rarely do any thing else( i do for example if on holiday or some thing).

Hertderg is this torrent to a more than one of his books or just his main one, if its to others could i get the link please.


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## hertderg (Jun 15, 2007)

Con - it wasn't a book that I downloaded it was one of mentzer's videos.If you have a pdf file yourself of his book I wouldn't mind a look please mate.

I used www.isohunt.com and found a massive 20gig torrent full of BB footage including the mike mentzer video . Here's the link m8 - http://torrents.thepiratebay.org/hashtorrent/3524400.torrent/MASSIVE_BODYBUILDING_VIDEO_COLLECTION.3524400.TPB.torrent

If you use Utorrent to d/l the files you can select the files you want instead of having to d/l all 20gigs.

Hope this helps.

What routines are your doing at the minute Con ?


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## Guest (Nov 16, 2007)

Sadly i suck at computers i couldnt work out how to download any thing, on that site i saw they have mikes book on nutrition(which would be **** cause he couldnt give a rats **** about it) and a couple of seminars.

Nah i dont have his main book on my computer i actually bought it in a shop.

My program at the moment uses the biohazard pre exhaust set aka 50 reps which is done via a lot of drops, the first set is usually reached around 20 reps.

Followed by a couple of exercises all with only one main working set.

Personally i think for the non enhanced or *off* athlete the 3 way DC split as found on www.intensemuscle.com is the best routine and i will probably start it up again in the new year.

The key to HIT which is also the reason people usually dont like it is they dont give it enough time, personally i like a 6 week full on training cycle followed by 2-4 weeks less intense (obviously this is built around supplument/drug/calorie cycles).


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## Rosko (Oct 15, 2007)

Apologies for being a clueless loser but what exactly is HIT training?


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## Guest (Nov 17, 2007)

Rosko said:


> Apologies for being a clueless loser but what exactly is HIT training?


High Intensity Training.

Basically the thinking is put more effort into each set thus doing less sets and spending less time in the gym.

It saves time, reduces over training, promotes strenght over purely pumping.

For most systems it dictates 1 working set per exercise 1-4 exercises per body part taking the working set to failure and then beyond using techniques such as forced reps, rest pause, drop sets, static holds, super slow negatives........i think you get the idea


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I love HIT training, only drawback is sore joints from prolonged use.

Other than that I think it is the best.

In and out.

Stimulate, and recover.


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## Stanco (Jan 7, 2007)

I would love to see anyone who has built a big, decent physique using mike mentzers heavy duty. It sounds good in theory, but i honestly havent seen any proof of anyone gaining a ton of muscle from it. Why dont powerlifters do heavy duty if its the one and only best routine?

Thats just my beef with heavy duty. If i saw some physical proof of his routine i would do it. Other then that ive read mentzer books and downloaded his underground seminars and to me he seems like the smartest man to do bodybuilding.


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## hertderg (Jun 15, 2007)

Stanco said:


> I would love to see anyone who has built a big, decent physique using mike mentzers heavy duty. It sounds good in theory, but i honestly havent seen any proof of anyone gaining a ton of muscle from it.


Have you seen Con's new avatar? Proof enough for me mate! If more proof is needed check out Kezz's thread, his lat spread is off the map. Also can't wait to see new pics of Righty.

Have your tried this type of training yourself? If you have did you give it long enough ?

:crazy:


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## TaintedSoul (May 16, 2007)

hertderg said:


> Have you seen Con's new avatar? Proof enough for me mate! If more proof is needed check out Kezz's thread, his lat spread is off the map. Also can't wait to see new pics of Righty.
> 
> Have your tried this type of training yourself? If you have did you give it long enough ?
> 
> :crazy:


Cons back is looking impressive hey!! And atleast now his avatar does not look like he is trying to take a dump in the toilet!!


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

ha ha yeah!!!!


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## Stanco (Jan 7, 2007)

hertderg said:


> Have you seen Con's new avatar? Proof enough for me mate! If more proof is needed check out Kezz's thread, his lat spread is off the map. Also can't wait to see new pics of Righty.
> 
> Have your tried this type of training yourself? If you have did you give it long enough ?
> 
> :crazy:


Yeah he did HIT but not HD (If he did then my bad). I havent really seen proof of greats results from doing HD. Lots of testimonials but no pics.

I did heavy duty for about 2 months. I didnt gain weight and i didnt lose weight. I actually gained a bit of fat from being so inactive.


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## Guest (Nov 17, 2007)

Stanco said:


> I would love to see anyone who has built a big, decent physique using mike mentzers heavy duty. It sounds good in theory, but i honestly havent seen any proof of anyone gaining a ton of muscle from it. Why dont powerlifters do heavy duty if its the one and only best routine?


You must remember Mike had gone a bit insane at the time of writing his book and took an elitist attitude.

His theorys are sound but you just have to ignore certain points such as the training every 4 days or whatever he does.

I train 3-4 days per week normally and thats plenty for me and i know Nytol trains 2 times per week and hes not exactly lacking size nor power :lift:

Stanco to your post above mine, so your saying you lost muscle(no weight gained but you gained fat) which screams out to me that you were not ready for this kind of training, i my self for several years all through my teens did high volume and then wsb for powerlifting doing even more volume and it worked great for several years but now i find my self tearing muscles(my lat and quad this year major tear in lat minor in quad)and my cns burning out quickly thus i find the HIT style to be suitable for me.

DC training founder Dante states that no one who hasnt at least been training 3-5 years full on should attempt even the most basic version of his program.

Food for thought.

P.S. very funny about the P1ssing in the mains ya fookers! lol


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Stanco said:


> I would love to see anyone who has built a big, decent physique using mike mentzers heavy duty. It sounds good in theory, but i honestly havent seen any proof of anyone gaining a ton of muscle from it. Why dont powerlifters do heavy duty if its the one and only best routine?
> 
> Thats just my beef with heavy duty. If i saw some physical proof of his routine i would do it. Other then that ive read mentzer books and downloaded his underground seminars and to me he seems like the smartest man to do bodybuilding.


I always have trained dorian yates\mentzer style. Heavy duty.

Basically 2 exercises per body part then maybe 4-6 working sets tops for both exercises depending on bodypart.

Low to med reps, failure everytime plus forced reps

Out of gym in 45 min tops.

Even had a go at that HIT super heavy drop sets as suggested on here the other day, just 3 sets and 8 reps and done.

Sh1t hot.

Ps im 230-235lb around 6-7% bodyfat, squat 350kg raw, 220kg bench raw

over 19" arms cold.

So it works for me

pps Im a natural ectomorph to boot


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

jw007 said:


> I always have trained dorian yates\mentzer style. Heavy duty.
> 
> Basically 2 exercises per body part then maybe 4-6 working sets tops for both exercises depending on bodypart.
> 
> ...


ok maybe 8% lol


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

you fookin beast! !


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## thestudbeast (Jul 20, 2007)

wow, this board loves HIT.

Too much CNS stress for me.


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

jw007 said:


> I always have trained dorian yates\mentzer style. Heavy duty.
> 
> Basically 2 exercises per body part then maybe 4-6 working sets tops for both exercises depending on bodypart.
> 
> ...


PMSL Natural...?


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## Greyphantom (Oct 23, 2003)

Con said:


> i my self for several years all through my teens did high volume and then wsb for powerlifting doing even more volume and it worked great for several years but now i find my self tearing muscles(my lat and quad this year major tear in lat minor in quad)and my cns burning out quickly thus i find the HIT style to be suitable for me.
> 
> DC training founder Dante states that no one who hasnt at least been training 3-5 years full on should attempt even the most basic version of his program.
> 
> ...


So in fact a good foundation needs to be built before moving on to HIT or DC or other similar training approaches, therefore HIT and the others are not responsible for the most part of growth... would you agree with this? I would also like to argue that HIT etc used exclusively can also lead to stagnation in gains (ie plateau)... if the body adapts then we need to mix it up a little, therefore high volume training periods are very beneficial... but thats just me...


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

Greyphantom said:


> *So in fact a good foundation needs to be built before moving on to HIT or DC or other similar training approaches*, therefore HIT and the others are not responsible for the most part of growth... would you agree with this? I would also like to argue that HIT etc used exclusively can also lead to stagnation in gains (ie plateau)... if the body adapts then we need to mix it up a little, therefore high volume training periods are very beneficial... but thats just me...


Seems to be the case... I'm not sure these routines are suited for the natural trainer...


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

thestudbeast said:


> wow, this board loves HIT.
> 
> Too much CNS stress for me.


I thought that myself, but if frequency is not that often then you can spend the least time in the gym and get good benefits.

If you give yourself enough time you would recover, hell that even goes for a broken arm (just using that as an example for trauma).

Sure there is a fine line in training, frequency, volume, intensity, but I have trained HIT for so long due to time constraints, it isnt funny.

I do mix volume up with HIT.

Hell, my injuries dictate this.

I am stiff in many parts of my body (no not stiff, just stiff for my age, well not stiff for my age as I am not as stiff as most for my age, just stiffer).

Hell, I see flames here...........Stiffer.......................OOP's........... 

I am basicly lazy...................:eek:



Greyphantom said:


> So in fact a good foundation needs to be built before moving on to HIT or DC or other similar training approaches, therefore HIT and the others are not responsible for the most part of growth... would you agree with this? I would also like to argue that HIT etc used exclusively can also lead to stagnation in gains (ie plateau)... if the body adapts then we need to mix it up a little, therefore high volume training periods are very beneficial... but thats just me...


I totally agree with the stagnation deal.


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

TH&S said:


> PMSL Natural...?


Ectomorph at any rate lol


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## Rosko (Oct 15, 2007)

I like the sound of HIT training if i'm understanding it right, mainly because of the time factor, in and out the gym in 45 mins jw, sounds good to me?

Can someone give me an example, i guess chest will be easiest one. Am i right in thinking that instead of doing 4 or 5 diff excercises, flat bench, incline, flies, decline and cables say, that you just do 2, flat bench and incline bells maybe?

I'm not sure about how many reps / sets though, and how heavy you should go. I currently on the flat bench do 5 sets, aiming for 8 reps first couple of sets, 6 - 8 for the last few, starting on 80kg, then 90, 100, 110 and finishing on 120kg, my max lift being 130kg.

I know that some days your stronger than others so aint looking for excacts but something to give me a clearer idea of how it goes so i can maybe give it a go for a week or 2 to mix things up and see how i react to a diff approach!


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## Guest (Nov 19, 2007)

Rosko said:


> I know that some days your stronger than others so aint looking for excacts but something to give me a clearer idea of how it goes so i can maybe give it a go for a week or 2 to mix things up and see how i react to a diff approach!


This is an example of my chest work out

Machine flys for pre exhaust 3 warm ups just 8 light reps each then one triple drop set aiming for 50 reps(this is not true hit but i have been doing these 50 reppers for chest and quads and seen improvements)

Incline bench press 3 warm ups 6 reps not very heavy pryamiding up then one set 6 reps failure is reached then 2 forced reps then static hold in the mid way position.

Machine incline hammer press same deal as the incline bench.

Then i do delts in a similar fashion.


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

Rosko said:


> I like the sound of HIT training if i'm understanding it right, mainly because of the time factor, in and out the gym in 45 mins jw, sounds good to me?
> 
> Can someone give me an example, i guess chest will be easiest one. Am i right in thinking that instead of doing 4 or 5 diff excercises, flat bench, incline, flies, decline and cables say, that you just do 2, flat bench and incline bells maybe?
> 
> ...


Its not about how strong you are mate, its about how much pain you can withstand!!!:biggrin1::target:


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Rosko said:


> I like the sound of HIT training if i'm understanding it right, mainly because of the time factor, in and out the gym in 45 mins jw, sounds good to me?
> 
> Can someone give me an example, i guess chest will be easiest one. Am i right in thinking that instead of doing 4 or 5 diff excercises, flat bench, incline, flies, decline and cables say, that you just do 2, flat bench and incline bells maybe?
> 
> ...


For me, in order to get the most out of heavy duty\HIT training you have to ensure that the muscle being worked is thoroughly warmed up first.

so if i was training chest i would warm my shoulders up with a few light sets of lateral raises, then maybe a light set of cables then a few sets of bench gradually increasing weight until its heavyish but not heavy where i stuggle, and stop well before failure.

Then i would do 1 set to failure of a weight i could do maybe 7-9 reps (plus a couple forced) 2 sets of 2-4 reps to failure (plus one forced) 1 set 6-8 to failure (including forced)

Then 2 sets dumbell incline press both 4-8 reps to failure plus forced reps.

So i completely seperate what i call warm ups with what are then working sets.

This more heavy duty, so 6 sets 15-20 min and finished.


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## Guest (Nov 19, 2007)

jw007 said:


> , squat 350kg raw,


Why not train for 6 months in a squat suit and then be one of the lightest guys ever to squat 500kgmg:


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## Rosko (Oct 15, 2007)

When you say you do for example, ''2 sets of 2-4 reps to failure'' do you mean that you use a weight where you reach failure on the 4th rep? And are ''forced reps'' where a spotter is helps you get the rep out?

Other than that i think i got the idea!!!

Appreciate the replies boys!

If your avatars are anything to go by HIT works, both looking good!! (Did that sound a bit gay?!!)


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## RipCord (Apr 5, 2005)

Arthur Jones Taught Metzer everything he knew about HIT. If you read up on Arthur Jones you'll see his idea of HIT is more effective then Metzers. When Metzer did his book he was Koo Koo according to some valid sources. Any video you see of Metzer would actually be an Arthur Jones production under the name of Nuatalis (sp) or something similar (minds drawn a blank on it).

I love HIT - - -> hate metzer


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Hey bro, do you have any articles on Mr. Jones?

I would totally love that.............


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## ah24 (Jun 25, 2006)

hackskii said:


> Hey bro, do you have any articles on Mr. Jones?
> 
> I would totally love that.............


I dont have any articles on him, but have you read '*The Nautilus Bulletin*'?

Not sure if its what you mean, but thats an article written by him.


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## invisiblekid (Jun 18, 2006)

ah24 said:


> I dont have any articles on him, but have you read '*The Nautilus Bulletin*'?
> 
> Not sure if its what you mean, but thats an article written by him.


http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/cyberpump28.htm this?


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## Nine Pack (Oct 30, 2006)

The Nautilus bulletins (there was more than one) are quite hard work to read but worth the effort. Arthur had a habit of using twelve words where one would have done just fine. His writing style is a bit laborious, but you can forgive him that as the guy was nothing short of a genius.


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## ah24 (Jun 25, 2006)

invisiblekid said:


> http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/cyberpump28.htm this?


Didnt check properly, just skimmed through but that looks a little short...

Heres part 1;

http://www.empirefitness.co.uk/pdf_s/bullettin_no_1.pdf


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## johnboy05 (May 13, 2007)

excellent read, really interesting stuff


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Con said:


> Why not train for 6 months in a squat suit and then be one of the lightest guys ever to squat 500kgmg:


I am actually lol. Going to do the BPC in march i think nytol said it was.

Training raw (belt and 10 year old leg wraps) up until xmas then getting a suit and new knee wraps after and seeing what i can do.

Dont know about 500kg but hoping for 380-400 in suit what u reckon??

There is video somewhere on here of me doing 340kg for 3 or 4 reps a while back i think.

Will prob go on a course off aas as well


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Cant wait to read that.

Hey JW, do you have a link to the video so I can check it out?


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/general-conversation/20423-squatting-685-pounds-goes-wrong.html

zip file.. was a while back

doing 350kg now.. squatting tonight will get vid of progress if can


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)




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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

that was 2 reps lol, new video has 4, wil get newer one tonight if knees hold up


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Cool, is this you doing 220K?






Man, on the squat video the guy talking has a very heavy accent, where is he from?


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

hackskii said:


> I cant open it.
> 
> Seems it is quick time or something, we dont use that at work.
> 
> ...


its on you tube link below


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## Guest (Nov 20, 2007)

jw007 said:


> I am actually lol. Going to do the BPC in march i think nytol said it was.
> 
> Training raw (belt and 10 year old leg wraps) up until xmas then getting a suit and new knee wraps after and seeing what i can do.
> 
> ...


Now i couldnt see how deep you went but it was deffo not far off if it was high.

With a good fitting super suit and 2.5 meter knee wraps i dont see why you wont be well into the 400s as long as you can handle the weight at the top , mind you in the BPC you wont have to walk with the weight thanks to the mono lift.

Course of aas eh thought you were on always:lift: :bounce:

P.S. I have doen 325kg in comp and 350kg in gym and trust me i couldnt squat close to what you can raw lol.


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Con said:


> Now i couldnt see how deep you went but it was deffo not far off if it was high.
> 
> With a good fitting super suit and 2.5 meter knee wraps i dont see why you wont be well into the 400s as long as you can handle the weight at the top , mind you in the BPC you wont have to walk with the weight thanks to the mono lift.
> 
> ...


was prob a little high yes, only just started to train for power again as have been lying doormant for years lol so is going to take some time.

Hoping for 400 that would be good, dont know how much difference a suit makes tho, only used one once when 17 lol.

On my "bridge" course at moment ha ha, will need to sort out a proper strength cycle one after xmas..any suggestions??

Bl00dy good squating still mate


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

JW, is this you doing 220K?


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## Guest (Nov 20, 2007)

jw007 said:


> was prob a little high yes, only just started to train for power again as have been lying doormant for years lol so is going to take some time.
> 
> Hoping for 400 that would be good, dont know how much difference a suit makes tho, only used one once when 17 lol.
> 
> ...


Strenght course eh, test,tren,halo,anadrol and some cheque drops on the day should do the job

Lol ps power meet cycles are different its not like bb where you run the orals for weeks and weeks the halo and anadrol would be run for 1-3 weeks prior to the comp even one week will add a lot of power.

Dont be fooled suits add tons of weight but you need them to be really uncomfortable, if you can get in them within 15 mins its prob too loose!

Bleeding hell that bench press looks dangerous on the shoulders you must have titanium RCsmg:


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

hackskii said:


> JW, is this you doing 220K?


yep with a bit of bouncing lol


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## RipCord (Apr 5, 2005)

hackskii said:


> Hey bro, do you have any articles on Mr. Jones?
> 
> I would totally love that.............


Sorry hacks, as of right now all my stuff on him is hardcopy. I will try and work something out.


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Con said:


> Strenght course eh, test,tren,halo,anadrol and some cheque drops on the day should do the job
> 
> Lol ps power meet cycles are different its not like bb where you run the orals for weeks and weeks the halo and anadrol would be run for 1-3 weeks prior to the comp even one week will add a lot of power.
> 
> ...


Lol, bench was a while back now, guy filming missed 1st rep which was loads better, touch wood never any major injuries..loads of niggly joints tho..p1sses me off.

That oxytest and pw101 is pretty good for strentth as well before a workout.

Im going to have to research sort of course best to do as dont want to put on too much weight either.

Attached squatting video from today, you can play on quicktime.

Was my last set. 340kg for 2, looked deep enough in mirror for me, loads left in tank but clearly not deep enough to pass.. going to get a block made up to get used to hitting correct height.










340 squats .zip


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## Nytol (Jul 16, 2005)

Con said:


> You must remember Mike had gone a bit insane at the time of writing his book and took an elitist attitude.
> 
> His theorys are sound but you just have to ignore certain points such as the training every 4 days or whatever he does.
> 
> I train 3-4 days per week normally and thats plenty for me *and i know Nytol trains 2 times per week and hes not exactly lacking size nor power :lift:*


Cheers mate, yes my whole training for 13 years has been based around HIT, and abbreviated training, I have never done volume stuff in my life, and have added well over 100lb of lean tissue, on a very slim frame, 60lb of that with no AAS or supps.


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## 7i7 (Sep 22, 2007)

ah24 said:


> Didnt check properly, just skimmed through but that looks a little short...
> 
> Heres part 1;
> 
> http://www.empirefitness.co.uk/pdf_s/bullettin_no_1.pdf


Good read, cheers for that. Got more? :bounce:


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## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

Just about half way through the Mike Mentzer book and his theories seem sound enough, plus I tried my arms using HIT yesterday and they felt like they were going to drop off!

I'm thinking of experiment training twice a week while running my carb cycling diet, so will weight train on high carb days. On the others I'll keep my cardio going.


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