# Belly!!!



## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

been bulking for 11 weeks now.... gained 10lbs so just under a pound a week.... however my stomach definitely feels a lot bigger, rounder - hate it.

im eating 3500kals a day approx. and no major junk food or treats along the way.

doing 4 gym sessions a week split upper lower. no cv at present.

I don't want to stop bulking as I need ot pack on some size but id love my middle to trim/ton eup - is this possible?

should I add in some cv? if I remove food I will not gain as required I doubt.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

If you expect to lose body fat you need to eat fewer calories than you use.

As I've said a few times before you're eating too much just from the point of view of bulking sensibly at the moment.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

My first reply was perhaps a little brief - 5 low calorie days are catching up with me...

Cardio when bulking is good for fitness, but at the point you're looking to do more purely control fat gain I'd personally say you're better off just eating less. This saves time, effort and money.

If you want to continue to focus on gaining muscle you should reduce your calories to get fat gain more under control than it is now. If you actually want to start reducing your body fat level you should reduce your calories by more.

Given the time of year I'd be tempted to try to bulk on fewer calories up till the start of January, and then cut for a while.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Thanks mate. Im not convinced i would grow at all with less cals. If anything i didnt think i was eating enough!

can i ask whatu would take out of my diet if u were looking to reduce cals without stunting growth?


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

View attachment IMG_4786.JPG


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Thanks mate. Im not convinced i would grow at all with less cals. If anything i didnt think i was eating enough!
> 
> can i ask whatu would take out of my diet if u were looking to reduce cals without stunting growth?


 Body fat is your reserve energy store. If you eat more calories than you need the excess is stored as fat. If you eat less than you use, you lose body fat. The fact you are gaining body fat at a significant rate tells you that you are eating too much.

Several people has told in you at different times that it is unrealistic for you to think you can gain 1lb of muscle per week. Look at 1lb of chicken - it's a lot of muscle. dtlv in particular wrote quite a detailed post in one of your threads IIRC.

The simplest change to your diet would be to remove the two protein powder and milk shakes. You'd still be eating more protein than you need even then. 1.6 g per kg of body weight is likely all that is actually beneficial for you.

More generally, you don't have to eat so many meals if you don't want to, and more variety and some more pleasureable foods wouldn't do you any harm if you had total calories right. As it stands your diet looks monumentally dull, but if this doesn't bother you it's OK.

Are your chicken weights cooked and your rice weights uncooked?


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> Body fat is your reserve energy store. If you eat more calories than you need the excess is stored as fat. If you eat less than you use, you lose body fat. The fact you are gaining body fat at a significant rate tells you that you are eating too much.
> 
> Several people has told in you at different times that it is unrealistic for you to think you can gain 1lb of muscle per week. Look at 1lb of chicken - it's a lot of muscle. dtlv in particular wrote quite a detailed post in one of your threads IIRC.
> 
> ...


 Thanks again

yes chicken cooked rice uncooked.

The meals dont actually bother me to be honest, i mix it up a bit over weekend.

I can bin the large protein shake with masses of milk altogether for a while and see how that does me. Maybe just have a shake on weekends and with water

the only other thing in there thats 'bad' maybe is the granola so if needbe i can remove/reduce that but i just wanted to leave enough in to grow


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> the only other thing in there thats 'bad' maybe is the granola so if needbe i can remove/reduce that but i just wanted to leave enough in to grow


 No food is 'bad'. Short of something with a load of trans fat perhaps.

Too many calories makes you fat, not 'bad' food choices. Personally I'd aim for a base diet that is varied and healthly but allow yourself some foods purely because you like them. I have some form or cake most days for example. I'll also have lots of sauces rather than dry chicken and rice - spaghetti bolognese, beef stew, chicken with Chicken Tonight sauces or pasta with pesto etc.

Your current diet is OK if you like it, but don't feel it's essential to eat this way.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> No food is 'bad'. Short of something with a load of trans fat perhaps.
> 
> Too many calories makes you fat, not 'bad' food choices. Personally I'd aim for a base diet that is varied and healthly but allow yourself some foods purely because you like them. I have some form or cake most days for example. I'll also have lots of sauces rather than dry chicken and rice - spaghetti bolognese, beef stew, chicken with Chicken Tonight sauces or pasta with pesto etc.
> 
> Your current diet is OK if you like it, but don't feel it's essential to eat this way.


 Yeah thanks again. Does get a bit more interesting at weekends

im just a bit of a loss what todo now - want to keep bulking as im not even started properly yet but this fat/bloted XL stomach is pissing me off. If i breath out its like a beach ball lol

id like to tone midrift right up as well as bulking!


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Baggy said:


> View attachment 137109


 God, that's one dull fu**ing diet mate :lol:

As for the belly, if you're eating a lot of carbs every day then it might get a little bloaty-looking, just the nature of the beast unfortunately. Best thing you can do is improve your posture - standing up straight will automatically flatten your stomach as well as make your chest look bigger and shoulders look better from the side


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## Ares (Dec 3, 2015)

If you're feeling fat now, it's only going to get worse tbh. And unless you're on gear, most of the 10lb you've gained is likely going to be fat/water

Not sure why you're eating 300g protein, but again - you've not given us much info about yourself (still likely overkill)

The bloated gut look isn't a good one IME, but a lot of people don't seem to mind it. I'd personally get lean and start a sensible surplus (hate the term bulk.)


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

I'mNotAPervert! said:


> God, that's one dull fu**ing diet mate :lol:
> 
> As for the belly, if you're eating a lot of carbs every day then it might get a little bloaty-looking, just the nature of the beast unfortunately. Best thing you can do is improve your posture - standing up straight will automatically flatten your stomach as well as make your chest look bigger and shoulders look better from the side


 Yeah feels like bloat. Hate it. Is there a way to reduce bulk

i have to avoid wheat soya and bananas so the food plan is a bit limited!!


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ares said:


> If you're feeling fat now, it's only going to get worse tbh. And unless you're on gear, most of the 10lb you've gained is likely going to be fat/water
> 
> Not sure why you're eating 300g protein, but again - you've not given us much info about yourself (still likely overkill)
> 
> The bloated gut look isn't a good one IME, but a lot of people don't seem to mind it. I'd personally get lean and start a sensible surplus (hate the term bulk.)


 Yeah i really dont like the bloat look or feel and want to get rid

im 200lbs approx 20% bf, 6ft 1 and not really definied annoyinlgy


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## Ares (Dec 3, 2015)

Baggy said:


> Yeah i really dont like the bloat look or feel and want to get rid
> 
> im 200lbs approx 20% bf, 6ft 1 and not really definied annoyinlgy


 Everyone is different mate, plenty here would tell you not to worry about fat and just 'whack the mass on' and s**t like that. Personally, I would not want to bulk at 20%, I've done it before (was already unhappy) and ended up feeling even more miserable, lol. I'm working on getting to 170lbs or thereabouts and adding cals slowly from that point (was 200 a few weeks ago, down to 185 now.)

Will I look and feel like a waif? I expect so! Will I miss having a bloated gut and man boobies? Absolutely f*cking not!

It would be awesome if we could get bigger and cut up at the same time, that's not how our physiology works though unfortunately. Not without drugs, anyway.

Getting a lean base first would be my priority at 20% though :thumbup1:


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Yeah cheers



Ares said:


> Everyone is different mate, plenty here would tell you not to worry about fat and just 'whack the mass on' and s**t like that. Personally, I would not want to bulk at 20%, I've done it before (was already unhappy) and ended up feeling even more miserable, lol. I'm working on getting to 170lbs or thereabouts and adding cals slowly from that point (was 200 a few weeks ago, down to 185 now.)
> 
> Will I look and feel like a waif? I expect so! Will I miss having a bloated gut and man boobies? Absolutely f*cking not!
> 
> ...


 Yeah cheers mate. Im guessing if i threw in a fair amount of cv and cut down some of the cals and carbs but keep heavy on weights i could probably trim up as well as not losing any muscle?!


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## mrwright (Oct 22, 2013)

Baggy said:


> Yeah cheers
> 
> Yeah cheers mate. Im guessing if i threw in a fair amount of cv and cut down some of the cals and carbs but keep heavy on weights i could probably trim up as well as not losing any muscle?!


 Tren.

Tren is what you need.


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## Ares (Dec 3, 2015)

Baggy said:


> Yeah cheers
> 
> Yeah cheers mate. Im guessing if i threw in a fair amount of cv and cut down some of the cals and carbs but keep heavy on weights i could probably trim up as well as not losing any muscle?!


 CV (which people should do regardless of 'bulking' or cutting down IMO) would certainly increase your energy expenditure

But you're probably well overshooting your caloric needs already, so this may have a negligible effect on what you see in the mirror. Plus.. being in a bulking mindset, it might make you feel as if you're spinning your wheels a bit. While carbs do bring water weight and glycogen along, they're not really the enemy, it's overall calories that will make you either gain or lose weight.

As for muscle loss - don't worry about that at this stage.

Milk can be a big gut irritant for some people which contributes to bloat. Maybe get rid of that, and try dropping 500 cals overall next week and see how you feel (I'd get rid of at least 50g protein too, you don't need 300g.) Do some cardio if you want. Reassess your naval measurement next Sunday and see if anything changed.

It's tricky with Christmas coming up, doesn't mean you can't start testing the waters now though


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> im just a bit of a loss what todo now - want to keep bulking as im not even started properly yet but this fat/bloted XL stomach is pissing me off. If i breath out its like a beach ball lol
> 
> id like to tone midrift right up as well as bulking!


 Generally what people mean by 'tone' is actually lower body fat. As @I'mNotAPervert! said, improving posture will help. Deadlifting when I first started helped improve my posture, and if part of the issue is that your abs are weak then training them directly will obviously help.

Protein is hard work for the body to digest, so reducing your protein intake may help. More fat and simple carbs can also help with bloating. I still think the main issue is you're simply eating too much though.



Baggy said:


> Yeah feels like bloat. Hate it. Is there a way to reduce bulk
> 
> i have to avoid wheat soya and bananas so the food plan is a bit limited!!


 I think I've probably asked this before, but why do you need to avoid wheat? Even with the restrictions you've mentioned the scope for a more interesting diet is huge.



Baggy said:


> Yeah cheers mate. Im guessing if i threw in a fair amount of cv and cut down some of the cals and carbs but keep heavy on weights i could probably trim up as well as not losing any muscle?!


 Muscle loss shouldn't be a problem for you provided you keep pushing yourself in the gym. You may even be able to gain a little muscle whilst in a calorie deficit if it isn't too extreme.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Thanks mate i am wheat intolerant as well as soya and bananas - random!

just at a bit of a loss really as i had a clear path in my head to bulk and nailed the eating and the lifting and enjoyed it.

12 weeks completed today and up from 191lbs to 201.4lbs. I was hoping to just keep bulking for 6-9 months and lifting heavy to put on some much needed size

now im torn as to eat a bit less, actually diet or carry on bulking!!


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ares said:


> CV (which people should do regardless of 'bulking' or cutting down IMO) would certainly increase your energy expenditure
> 
> But you're probably well overshooting your caloric needs already, so this may have a negligible effect on what you see in the mirror. Plus.. being in a bulking mindset, it might make you feel as if you're spinning your wheels a bit. While carbs do bring water weight and glycogen along, they're not really the enemy, it's overall calories that will make you either gain or lose weight.
> 
> ...


 Yeah i been having a large protein shake with like 600ml of milk and 10g creatine over last 2 weeks. I will stop this for a week or 2 and just have a shake with water and 1 scoop on weekends

will need to add some cv, i literally not had time for any over last 2 months as my gym seah takes 60mins and i do that 4 days a week during lunch from work!! Need to dial in some cv on my day off weds and maybe 1-2 more 30mins over a weekend


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Thanks mate i am wheat intolerant as well as soya and bananas - random!
> 
> just at a bit of a loss really as i had a clear path in my head to bulk and nailed the eating and the lifting and enjoyed it.
> 
> ...


 If you want to you can still choose to just focus on gaining muscle rather than fat loss, but just do so on fewer calories as I suggested. *DOING THIS PROPERLY WILL NOT MEAN YOU GAIN LESS MUSCLE, JUST LESS FAT.*


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> No food is 'bad'. Short of something with a load of trans fat perhaps.
> 
> Too many calories makes you fat, not 'bad' food choices. Personally I'd aim for a base diet that is varied and healthly but allow yourself some foods purely because you like them. I have some form or cake most days for example. I'll also have lots of sauces rather than dry chicken and rice - spaghetti bolognese, beef stew, chicken with Chicken Tonight sauces or pasta with pesto etc.
> 
> Your current diet is OK if you like it, but don't feel it's essential to eat this way.


 I should add, i do have tasty chicken sauce (piri piri / raeggae sauce etc) on all my chicken and sometimes substiute chicken and rice for lean mince and mash for example


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Yeah i been having a large protein shake with like 600ml of milk and 10g creatine over last 2 weeks.


 That wasn't in the diet you posted?



> I will stop this for a week or 2 and just have a shake with water and 1 scoop on weekends


 Unless you eat less chicken you have not need to any protein powder at all.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> If you want to you can still choose to just focus on gaining muscle rather than fat loss, but just do so on fewer calories as I suggested. *DOING THIS PROPERLY WILL NOT MEAN YOU GAIN LESS MUSCLE, JUST LESS FAT.*


 Yep cheers. Having read back thro this thread and all replied im going todo a few weeks of trimming down some food, binning the shakes with milk and maintaining heavy as poss weights 4x a week and add in some cv - see how that pans out. Thanks a million all ??


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> That wasn't in the diet you posted?
> 
> Unless you eat less chicken you have not need to any protein powder at all.


 Yeah just last 2 weeks while i started creatine ive just been adding 10g to a large scoop protein and having it all with lots milk instead of 2 seperate scoops.

I do eat a bit less chicken over weekend sometimes depending on activites with the kids


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## NoGutsNoGloryy (Jan 7, 2013)

There's alot of things you could switch for other/better things imo. For example meal 6 and every meal you have seems to have x2 or even x3 more carbs than protein, I think you should cut them down about and raise protein. If your body can't process all the carbs, which some people cannot do so well, it is it is simple fact they'll store as fat.

Also are you on AAS?


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

NoGutsNoGloryy said:


> There's alot of things you could switch for other/better things imo. For example meal 6 and every meal you have seems to have x2 or even x3 more carbs than protein, I think you should cut them down about and raise protein. If your body can't process all the carbs, which some people cannot do so well, it is it is simple fact they'll store as fat.


 That's poor advice as far as I'm concerned.

There is no way extra protein will help, and the body needs to 'process' carbs significantly to convert them to fat and store them. What happens far more readily is that the carbs are used for energy and that dietary fat get stored as body fat. These specifics don't really matter though and all the OP need to worry about is total calories.


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## NoGutsNoGloryy (Jan 7, 2013)

Ultrasonic said:


> That's poor advice as far as I'm concerned.
> 
> There is no way extra protein will help, and the body needs to 'process' carbs significantly to convert them to fat and store them. What happens far more readily is that the carbs are used for energy and that dietary fat get stored as body fat. These specifics don't really matter though and all the OP need to worry about is total calories.


 Just saying what I do for myself... I'm on 3200calories and losing weight but I am on AAS with a higher protein intake, which means more protein is used so I can have more without worrying it wont be used.

It is a well known fact to many carbs are stored as fat and infact it does it quite easily and I don't understand how you mean by carbs are used more readily for energy because that all depends on what you are doing with yourself.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

NoGutsNoGloryy said:


> It is a well known fact to many carbs are stored as fat and infact it does it quite easily and I don't understand how you mean by carbs are used more readily for energy because that all depends on what you are doing with yourself.


 Have a read of this:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/how-we-get-fat.html/

OP is natty BTW.

There is some evidence that overeating on protein vs other macronutrients may lead to less fat gain, but that just means it's a waste of protein (and money), not that it's a helpful thing to do as far as I'm concerned. Also, too much protein is just putting unnecessary stress on the digestive system. Not enough protein is categorically not the OP's problem though.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Yep cheers. Having read back thro this thread and all replied im going todo a few weeks of trimming down some food, binning the shakes with milk and maintaining heavy as poss weights 4x a week and add in some cv - see how that pans out.


 I realise I had actually forgotten to say anything about how much to change calories by. If the aim is to continue to focus on muscle gain (bulk) I'd try dropping by 300 kcal in the first iinstance. If the aim is to go for fat loss I'd drop by more like 1000 kcal (assuming you don't suddenly do loads of cardio).


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> I realise I had actually forgotten to say anything about how much to change calories by. If the aim is to continue to focus on muscle gain (bulk) I'd try dropping by 300 kcal in the first iinstance. If the aim is to go for fat loss I'd drop by more like 1000 kcal (assuming you don't suddenly do loads of cardio).


 Thanks. Going to do 30 mins cv on my day off weights on a weds and one more 30mins cv ona weekend.

Will also drop the shakes with milk


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Thanks. Going to do 30 mins cv on my day off weights on a weds and one more 30mins cv ona weekend.
> 
> Will also drop the shakes with milk


 That's kind of a middle ground between the two options I mentioned - I'd personally be more inclined to have a clearer focus on one goal or the other.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> That's kind of a middle ground between the two options I mentioned - I'd personally be more inclined to have a clearer focus on one goal or the other.


 Very true. My main goal is to get bigger. But i dont wanna get a rounded midrift


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Very true. My main goal is to get bigger. But i dont wanna get a rounded midrift


 If you don't want to gain more abdominal fat whilst still trying to gain muscle go for the 300 kcal reduction option. If you want to try to reduce the amount of fat go for the 1000 kcal reduction option, but muscle gain is likely to be slower, or may stop completely.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> If you don't want to gain more abdominal fat whilst still trying to gain muscle go for the 300 kcal reduction option. If you want to try to reduce the amount of fat go for the 1000 kcal reduction option, but muscle gain is likely to be slower, or may stop completely.


 Thanks yeah. Removing The shakes are closer the 300k option so i will go that route for now mate


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> Thanks yeah. Removing The shakes are closer the 300k option so i will go that route for now mate


 Just removing the shakes would remove about 450 kcal, which is likely too much. So add another 150 kcal in somewhere if you do this, or just keep in this much milk.

(I'm basing my 300 kcal guess of what to change by on the fact it takes approximately 500 kcal per day (3500 kcal per week) to gain 1 lb of fat per week. You're gaining about 1lb of weight per week, some of which is hopefully muscle.)


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> Just removing the shakes would remove about 450 kcal, which is likely too much. So add another 150 kcal in somewhere if you do this, or just keep in this much milk.
> 
> (I'm basing my 300 kcal guess of what to change by on the fact it takes approximately 500 kcal per day (3500 kcal per week) to gain 1 lb of fat per week. You're gaining about 1lb of weight per week, some of which is hopefully muscle.)


 Yeah thanks. Last 2 weeks i been having a large scoop/1.5 scoops plus lots milk once a day so leaving that out is prob 300ish cals


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## Lifesizepenguin (Jul 25, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> No food is 'bad'. Short of something with a load of trans fat perhaps.
> 
> Too many calories makes you fat, not 'bad' food choices. Personally I'd aim for a base diet that is varied and healthly but allow yourself some foods purely because you like them. I have some form or cake most days for example. I'll also have lots of sauces rather than dry chicken and rice - spaghetti bolognese, beef stew, chicken with Chicken Tonight sauces or pasta with pesto etc.


 THIS


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

A week ago saturday i was 201.4lbs

weighed every morning last week, bang on 201.4 every day.

Weighed in for saturdays normal weigh in and was 200.4 so actually lost a pound! Doh!


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Baggy said:


> weighed every morning last week, bang on 201.4 every day.


 If it was exactly the same every day then you might have bathroom scales like mine that appear to have a memory of sorts, and only give you a new number if it is significantly different. I realise the following is likely to be laughed at but what I do to get round this is to first weigh myself holding a dumbbell, and then put the dumbbell down to weigh myself. Having the higher weight holding the dumbbell makes it 'forget' what I weighed the day before and so give me a sensible reading. If I just had mechanical scales I wouldn't have this problem, and I doubt all digital ones do it either.

It sounds like you could do with eating a little more though. Maybe try 100 kcal more for a week.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Up 0.6lbs back to 201lbs on sat!!


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## Frost_uk (Sep 1, 2014)

I'd try removing 60grams Jordans from Meal 4 and remove 150milk from Meal 6, that's removing 433cals right there.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Frost_uk said:


> I'd try removing 60grams Jordans from Meal 4 and remove 150milk from Meal 6, that's removing 433cals right there.


 He's trying to gain weight...


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## Frost_uk (Sep 1, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> He's trying to gain weight...


 I understand this  but he is complaining about a belly, so sounds like as most have pointed out that maybe he is eating too many cals and need to reduce a lil? I'd remove these two and continue and see if weight still gains and stomach reduces a lil or stops getting bigger? no?


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Frost_uk said:


> I understand this  but he is complaining about a belly, so sounds like as most have pointed out that maybe he is eating too many cals and need to reduce a lil? I'd remove these two and continue and see if weight still gains and stomach reduces a lil or stops getting bigger? no?


 I agree he'd probably be better off cutting but that's not what he wants to do. He's got fat gain under control though since he's apparently not gaining weight, which is why I'd suggested he slightly increase calories.


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## AestheticManlet (Jun 12, 2012)

If you're natty and gaining around a pound a week I'd say that too much, inevitable noticeably fat gain will happen in 10 weeks, id be aiming for half of that.


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## Baggy (Jan 7, 2011)

Just done a new thread in 'losing weight'

gained 11 lbs in 12 weeks. Def wanting to trim stomach a bit its pissing me off a bit

but also want to continue to grow!


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