# new routine!



## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

ok guys so here is my new routine last time you guys said i was over training so ch-ch- check it out!

chest tri's

back bi's

shoulders calves

off

legs

chest tri's

off

(repeat again) so im always working one muscle group 2x a week and rotates to 1 muscle group gets worked out 2x once every month:cool:

so what you guys think?


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

unless i am mistaken, you are a man, so i'll move it for you..


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

personally, i think 5 days per week is tooo much, esp if you are not on gear.. i only train 3 days, maybe 4..


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

lol oops..

ya i heard 4 days is better but since im 22 that i could get away with 5 days.


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

nah, im 22 and train 3!

i like your idea, but its too much IMO..

for size and strength, what has worked best for me is:

Mon. Legs

Weds. Chest, shoulders, tris,

Fri. Back, traps, bis

Another good split if you want to train 4 days is:

Mon. Chest

Tues. Legs

Thurs. Shoulders, Tris

Fri. Back and bis


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

ya that 4 day routine looks good to i think im gonna try the 5 day split and if i feel its to much ill take it down a notch to that 4 day split

Mon. Chest

Tues. Legs

Thurs. Shoulders, Tris

Fri. Back and bis


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

BigGiver said:


> Mon. Chest
> 
> Tues. Legs
> 
> ...


This does look good


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

hmmm im thinking

cause my schedule is messed due to work..grrr

wed. chest

thurs. legs

sat. shoulders, tris

sun. back and bis


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

also im doing 3 exercises for every muscle group besides tris and bis which i do only 2

wouldn't it be better you think to work chest and tri's 2ghter just cause u work tris naturally with chest as a secondary?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Well, some guys do and some dont.

Some guys do chest and bicep as there is indirect tricep work on chest day.

Then on back day they work triceps as the biceps would bet indirectly on back day.

Then there are guys that dont work bicep or tricep all toghther and do heavy compound exercises.

Like today for example I did chest. I got a massive pump in my triceps and they felt really hard and full of blood. Depending on how many sets you do, how many pressing movements you do, and the number of reps you do, you will get tricep work.

Some guys use more triceps for chest than others and this will depend on the width of your grip.

I dont want to confuse you though.

In a nut shell, I would not do more than 12 sets max for your shoulders, chest and back.

Legs is another story. Like 8 max for quads 4-6 max for hamstrings 4 for calves.

I would keep the reps between 8-12 for beginners and I would lean more twards the 12 rep range as this will help your form and cut down on injury.

I dont know if I helped you here.


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

im doing

chest

bench 4 sets (6-8 reps)

incline db press 4 sets (6-8 reps)

flys 3 sets (8-10 reps)

bi's

CG cable curl 4 sets (6-8reps)

barbell curl 4 sets 8-10

alternating dumbel curls 3 sets 6-8 reps

tri's

close grip bench superset with incline overhead extensions 4 sets (8-10 reps)

cable pull down 4 sets (8-10 reps)

back

CG cable row 4 sets (8-10 reps)

WG lat pull down superset to CG lat pulldown 4 sets (8-10 reps)

t-bar row 4 sets (8-10 reps)

legs

squats 4 sets (8-10 reps)

leg extensions 3 sets (8-10reps)

leg curls 3 sets (8-10 reps)

leg press 4 sets (8-10 reps)

Calves

calve raises 4 sets (8-10 reps)

leg press calves 3 sets (8-12 reps)

Shoulders

miltary press 4 sets (8-10 reps)

side lateral raises 4 sets (8-10 reps)

Reverse Peck deck 4 sets 8-10 reps)

and i switch exercises up one a week sometimes through in stripping and etc..


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Looks pretty good but the back needs modifications to add some dead lifts in there.

I might do 5 sets for the military press as military is the single biggest mass builder for the shoulders.

11 sets for biceps in my opinion might be a tad bit much, you can cut it down by 2-3 sets. Could get away with 9 easy if the intensity is there. 8-12 rep range for the biceps might be a bit better. I have to double check on the type 1 to type 2 muscle fibers but if my memory serves me correctly the arms might have more type 1 fiber and will need a few more reps for better results.

But every body is diffrent and for bulking then the lower reps might be ok.

I would do more for the quads. That might not be enough for a pressing manuver. Maybe you should do a couple of sets of leg presses to finish off and 4 sets of extensions.


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## Aftershock (Jan 28, 2004)

I really would consider a 3 day schedule as Panthro has suggested.......

At the risk of repeating myself i tell everyone u grow outside of the gym not in it!!

Less is more in some cases......


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

doesn't your strength go down at all? i mean i feel like my strength goes down if i miss that my much time off.. maybe im just paranoid


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

hackskii said:


> Looks pretty good but the back needs modifications to add some dead lifts in there.
> 
> I might do 5 sets for the military press as military is the single biggest mass builder for the shoulders.


so how bout this for back

deadlift 4 sets (6-8 reps)

CG cable row 4 sets (8-10 reps)

WG lat pull down superset to CG lat pulldown 4 sets (8-10 reps)

t-bar row 4 sets (6-8 reps)

and for shoulders

miltary press 5 sets (8-10 reps)

side lateral raises 4 sets (8-10 reps)

Reverse Peck deck 4 sets 8-10 reps)


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

That would be ok but I would cut the t-bar down to 3 sets

and the CG cable row to 3 sets or you could do this:

Each week I do 1 thickining exercise and 2 widening exercises.

Then the following week I do 2 thickining exercises and 1 widening.

So you can do 3 sets of 2 of each or do 9 sets and alternate between widening and thickening.

I dont know if I explained that right.

Tomorrow I am going to do:

Pullups 4 sets to failure.

close grip pulldown with a T-bar 3-4 sets (8-12) reps (depending how I feel).

Bent over cable rows 4 sets 8-12 reps with a good stretch.

Next week (tuesday) I am going to do:

Bent over rows (bar) 4 sets heavy 8-10 reps.

Low rows (hammer strength) 4 sets (slow with a full pull and stretch) 8-12 reps.

Pulldowns (wide grip) 8-12 reps 4 sets to failure.

Usually I save myself for the last 2 sets (each exercise) as the first couple of sets are more of a warmup but not a warm-up perse. There is some resistance but I save myself for moving up in weight and then I go to failure using heavier weight.

Shoulders look good.


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

hackskii said:


> That would be ok but I would cut the t-bar down to 3 sets
> 
> and the CG cable row to 3 sets or you could do this:
> 
> ...


what about dead lifts where do you through in dead lifts?

ya i change my weeks normally to power/shock (shock normally envolves stripping and or supersetting.. or higher fast reps) and then back to power 6-8 reps 8-10

so i do 1 week power next week shock then back to power


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I am a sissy and dont do deadlifts. 

But I do clean and jerks on shoulder day and I feel that the bar speed I need to get is good enough for replacing deads.

I do these because they wind me more than most exercises and make me sweat. Pretty much a all around strength exercise that does allot for the whole body.

I feel comfortable with these and I hate to do them, so that is why I do them. 

Many times I go into the gym and just feel like doing something diffrent then I do it and get sore. It breaks things up from the norm. This game lasts a long time and everyone can do it.


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## Greyphantom (Oct 23, 2003)

BigGiver said:


> im doing
> 
> chest
> 
> ...


The bold in the above is my suggestions... I would also do as Panthro suggests and do a 3 day a week training... trust me if you put enough intensity into it it will be well enough...

say Chest and biceps, legs and triceps, and then back and shoulders... or something similar... as Hacksii explained IMHO your tris get the biggest work out on chest day and the bis thier biggest on back day so they should be done apart from chest and back... also you may want to lower your sets if you are going for size and strength to no more than 3... in some cases 2 would be enough but for the novice 3 is good... with 8ish reps... and focus....


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

i have one more question now.. how come in the bodybuilding encyclopedia, routine look like this..

arnolds routine are working every muscle group 2x a week?

mon - chest / back

tues - shoulders / upper arms / forearms

wed - thighs calvs lowerback

thur - chest / back

fri - shoulders /upper arms / forearms

sat - thighs calves

sun - off

and we all know how freakin huge arnold is so im pretty sure he knows his sh!t


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## Greyphantom (Oct 23, 2003)

It is true that he got huge off that... but dont forget he wasnt natural and he had freaky genetics... if you want to compare... look at Arnie... and then look at Dorian... they had very different training styles and Dorian was alot bigger and more defined... probably on a lot more too though eh... also some people do respond well to the higher volume training schedule... but in general most gain very well on the less is more principle...


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

ya but why would it be in the encyclopedia he has several routines and all of them have 2x body parts worked out each week.

another one listed

mon-chest back /evenings thigh calves

tues- shoulders upper arms forearms calves

wed-chest back /evenings thigh calves

thur-shoulders upper arms forearms calves

fri-chest back /evenings thigh calves

sat-shoulders upper arms forearms calves

sun-off

this is his advanced level 2 program

his level 1 was listed previously

mon - chest / back

tues - shoulders / upper arms / forearms

wed - thighs calvs lowerback

thur - chest / back

fri - shoulders /upper arms / forearms

sat - thighs calves lower back

sun - off

my routine is not nearly as intense and if this is how urs supposed to do it i rather listen to arnold just wondering why he would have these programs in the bb bible can't be bad if arnold does it and look how huge he was

the book doesn't say anything about genes and him cranking it during his routines so im assuming that hes not on gear


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

also you wil find 99% of people tear apart the training scedules in arnies book. they are useless! far too much.. great if you have his genetics, all day to train, and loads of gear, but for us mere mortals they are a load os sh1t! so ignore those bits in the book!!!


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

you asume arnie wasnt on gear??????? lmao!

Also you will find most if not all of the biggest and strongest guys on this board train 4days per week max. oh, and supprise they are the strongest guys too...

Me, Greyphantom & bigpete, are good examples (I think!! lol)

I have made by far the biggest gains training 3x per week.

Training each bodypart 2x per week WILL lead to overtraining... your muscles need a good 5-7 days to fully recover and especially as you are not on drugs, it will take the upper side of that to recover, so trainin them 2x per week WILL lead to overtraining, exhaustion, you wont go anywhere.. etc... etc. (Unless you are the next arnie 

hope this helps


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

Panthro said:


> you asume arnie wasnt on gear??????? lmao!


no i know he was just saying though the book is for bodybuilding not "bodybuilding while on gear"

those routines are specifically for only on gear and his genetics then only thing it would be good for is expensive toilet paper:mad:


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

well, IMO and many others opinions, the routines are only good for toilet paper!!!


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

Panthro said:


> well, IMO and many others opinions, the routines are only good for toilet paper!!!


but in arnolds opinion body building champ says those are best routines, im assuming on and off of gear


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

see how many people on any forum agree with his routines, then we will pick up where we left off..

I swear that they are useless. however, im sure best way is to find out yourself. so try them..


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## Panthro (Jan 12, 2004)

if i were you matey, i'd stick to the adjustments greyphantom has made to your routine, and split it over 4 days..

even better, id recommend dropping it to only 3 days, but i doubt you'll go for that one! lol


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## big pete (Mar 23, 2004)

try them for a couple of months. see how you feel

but, it would be a fair assumption that youll be a tad smaller, tired and pee'd off

less=more (in moderation)

and cheers panthro, feelin alot better now lol


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## big pete (Mar 23, 2004)

as soon as im back up and running properly, il be back down to a 3 day split

it worked great, and the poundages went up nicely to boot. something that was/is seriously lacking on my part.

on a side note, when are you finishing your course? and whats your waist size? im thinking... thick back+275lbs=38+"


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I trained each bodypart twice a week and did 12 sets per body part, except legs. For probably 7 years I was very lean and pretty strong but did not really have much mass. I was natural and until I started doing each muscle group once a week I got thicker and more size. Strength went up drasticly doing only one body part a week too.

I did not figure this out till I took like a week off and when I did my lifts they all were higher and I could not understand it at all. Now I know I was a classic example of overtraining.

Many factors are at play here, amount of sleep, amount of stress, age, blood testosterone levels, amounts of type 1 and type 2 muscle fibers we each have, genetics, diet, supplements, all these play in the factoring in.

The longer you lift the better you will be able to understand your own body and we are all diffrent. Try to keep an open mind and there is no set rules here.

My routine along with wingers is diffrent than everyone on the board. No one would agree with our routine but It does work for us and we are both probably the strongest for our age @ 44 and one of the stronger guys in the gym. Our routine:

Monday= chest

Tuesday= back

Wednesday= quads

Thursdays= shoulders

Friday= light tricep work, abs, some neck work.

Saturday= Biceps, traps and maybe some forearms.

Sunday= hamstrings, abductors, adductors, abs, and some leg extensions (for knees).

No one works out like this. I spend 20 minutes a day in the gym only.


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

what about a routine like this: (my bro does this one)

chest/ back

shoulders /arms

legs /abs

day off

(repeat)


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## Greyphantom (Oct 23, 2003)

Awe Shucks Panthro... you really know how to make me blush...lol... Arnie wrote those routines as they work for him when he was on a shed load of gear... also he only trained really around contest time supposedly... and that book is really only good for its exercise references... the actual routines are pretty much a waste of paper... they may work for a the first few weeks but then over training will set in big time... I have done a program that trained the body twice a week and my gains were very minimal and I soon got p'd off at the lack of progress... as soon as I changed to the 3/4 day split training each body part once a week... man the gains started rolling in... it really is up to you to try it and see if you like though...


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## Aftershock (Jan 28, 2004)

BigGiver said:


> but in arnolds opinion body building champ says those are best routines, im assuming on and off of gear


Well that assumption couldnt be further off the mark mate....

Gear dramatically speeds up protein syntesis (not to mention your red blood cell count) and therefore increases your powers of recuperation...

In fact its the first thing I noticed when I started taking gear... Whereas I would ache for 3-4 days after a workout when training naturally, I only ached for about 36 hours on gear and my poundages and intensity where higher than when training naturally.....

So if you take enough gear then it is possible to train each bodypart twice a week without overtraining, but for a natural bodybuilder its out of the question...

Remember when training you are breaking down muscle, your body then has to replace this broken down tissue and by as way of a bonus it adds a little more so that it is better able to cope with the exersion next time...

By training each bodypart twice a week your not even giving ur body chance to replace the broken down tissue let alone add any extra muscle, consequently you will gradually get smaller and weeker :-(

Scrap the routines in Arnies book, or for that matter any routine you see in any bodybuilding mag.... The pros are far from natural mate and their routines reflect that...


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

only thing is i find when im working out is that if i take that much time off my body is getting weaker feels like i tried a routine where i only work 1 muscle group 1 time a week and the results sucked. i found that the best routine for me was when i was doing

chest / tris

back / bis

shoulders / calves

legs / abs

off

(repeat)

do this routine for 8 weeks then take a week off then repeat with different work outs.

the fact is that if you work your chest on monday by thursday your chest is healed and ready to be worked out again. and if you don't work out the muscle and take time off such as the routine post previously you take 7 days off until you work out your muscle again to much time i feel i get weaker i think it maybe just me though. i also talked to a personal trainer to get views on different routines; he told me that it takes 4 days roughly for a muscle to be ready to go again + it depends on the intensity of the work out. so with that im gonna try both routines and see which one would best work for me. i personaly think that the routine with 3 days off is to little and not working the body to its full potential

i lost gains for trying that routine 7 days in between exercises it soo long 4 days is enough until muscles are back up and running fully.


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## Aftershock (Jan 28, 2004)

Well u can only do what works for you mate, I would say that after 3-4 days your muscle will have recovered back to its previous state and u will have stopped aching, but its doubtfull if it would have had chance to put any extra muscle down....

If ur going to insist on working out each bodypart twice a week id recomend you go heavy in the first session and go loighter and just go for the pump in the second session...


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## Greyphantom (Oct 23, 2003)

I think its 72 hours for muscles to recover but longer for them to also grow and gain... good advice from Aftershock there... heavy first session and then a lighter "recovery" session for the next one...


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## BigGiver (May 20, 2004)

ya i know what your saying makes sense i just take 1 day after off after the 4 days i work out.. i guess in all honesty you have to find out what works for you and that this routine works for me  to lojng i get weaker thats all i know


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