# ECA STACK VS FORZA T5



## alabbadi

After reading some of the comments in this forum with regards to fat burners a lot of people suggested making your own ECA stack up as a cheaper way than buying ready made ones

so taking the advice i looked at the prices of the items i needed for a 60 day supply and this is what it would cost

*do do Chesteze* = £1.85 pack containig 9 tablets 18.6mg ephidrine and 30mg cafiene so if we say 2 a day for 7 days this would be 14 a week now for 8 weeks it would be 112 tablets

so i will need 13 packs at a cost of *£24*

*Pro Plus Cafiene* = £2.45 a pack containig 36 50mg tablets, so 3 tablets twice a day for 8 weeks would be 336

this makes it 10 packs at a cost of *£24.50*

*Asprin = *35pence for a pack of 16 300mg tablets, half or 1 twice a day for 8 weeks is 84 or 112 tablets

so this makes it 7 packs at a cost of *£1.23* or *£2.45*

the total cost of all this for 8 weeks is about *£50* or *£51*

now correct me if i am wrong but you can buy FORZA T5 max strength 120 tablets containig all the ingredients above for *£34.99*

in fact it contains more Ephidrine 30mg each tablet taking 2 a day gives you 60mg Eph 400mg Caffiene and 60mg Asprin

so the way i see it, it is cheaper and easier to buy the ready made stuff than getting your own.

i have had trouble getting the chesteze as boots will only sell one pack at a time so i have had to make several visits at different time so i don't bump into the same assistant in the shop.

regards


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## Darylbethyname

lol it is cheaper.

your buying 'branded' sh*t so no wonder its more expensive.

pro plus :lol:

and wtf is chesteze? its pretty damn expensive what ever the f*ck it is.

caffiene cost 2p for 200mg, ephe cost 22p for 30mg, and aspirin is so cheap its basically free


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## bowen86

forza t5 ftw.


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## xbonez182

I been using the t5's from eph-nutrition (I don't think I violated rules doing this as it's where I got the url from) and I have been happy using them...Started with the half strength ones as it's my first lot.


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## alabbadi

I read it on another forum that suggested making your own ECA stack, Ephidrine it hard to get hold of as it is banned in many places, Chesteze are decongestion tablets that contains 18.6mg of ephidrine and 30mg of caffiene and can be bought over the counter at most pharmacys

regards


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## Bomb

MyProtein or Bulk Powder do 200mg Caffeine Tablets for a few pence each, if you take 1,000 its like £30 delivered. Even cheaper with a discount code.

Ephedrine, if you can't source 30mg which are pretty damned hard at the moment (other than unexo which are ****), buy Kaizen 8mg, and your looking at 6 per day, and you can buy 600 for $70/£50ish*, or 1200 for $134/£95ish (on the first site I saw), and aspirin was £15 per 1000 all over the net.

So maximum

8p per day Caffeine

50p per day Ephedrine (this is highest priced option)

3p per day Aspirin

60p per day AVG, so 60 days would be £36

*I assume prices on Kaizen are ok mods ?


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## Darylbethyname

Bomb said:


> MyProtein or Bulk Powder do 200mg Caffeine Tablets for a few pence each, if you take 1,000 its like £30 delivered. Even cheaper with a discount code.
> 
> Ephedrine, if you can't source 30mg which are pretty damned hard at the moment (other than unexo which are ****), buy Kaizen 8mg, and your looking at 6 per day, and you can buy 600 for $70/£50ish*, or 1200 for $134/£95ish (on the first site I saw), and aspirin was £15 per 1000 all over the net.
> 
> So maximum
> 
> 8p per day Caffeine
> 
> 50p per day Ephedrine (this is highest priced option)
> 
> 3p per day Aspirin
> 
> 60p per day AVG, so 60 days would be £36
> 
> *I assume prices on Kaizen are ok mods ?


why is unexo 'sh*t' ?


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## alabbadi

Some body the other day told me about unexo which come in 30mg and 50mg doses. he was saying that they are Ephedrine but they change the name for legal reasons.

i thought they were the real thing and was going to check them out. can anyone tell me why they are not good. and if so where can i get some that are the real deal.

regards


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## Bomb

I have bought Unexo's from 3 different 'reliable' sources, and they have all proved to be rubbish quality.

Even on as high a dose as 6 tablets, barely felt anything.

Many people say there is alot of fakes going around.

I just bought another lot, lets see if they are any better.

My Opinion is the Unexo's that are around at the moment are MASSIVELY underdosed.


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## alabbadi

Thats the point how can we trust anyone. i mean its not cheap and if it is not good stuff its just like throwing money down the toilet.

what i have at the minute is chesteze which has only 18.6mg of ephedrine and 30mg of caffeiene in them but at least you know that it is what it says. and if you wanted you could take two which would be about 37mg of eph and 60mg of caffeiene. the only problem is the price 1.85 for 9 tablets so if taking 2 twice a day you are talking 2 day supply only

at the moment i am taking one, plus 150mg of caffeine and half an Asprin which is 150mg.

i am not sure it is doing anything for me in terms of the buzz as they say, i really don't feel anything and the caffeiene is not keeping me alert it has the opposite effect , i feel more tired

although after a few hours taking my second dose today i felt a bit miserable and my tongue is drying out, plus i can't keep out of the damn toilet i must go for a **** every 30 minutes so something must be doing something.

what i am not sure about is the Asprin dosage i have read that some take 300 -325mg some say 150mg but in some places the ideal dosage is 81mg,

i know that the Asprin has no effect on the fat reducing side but may help carry fat quicker through the bloodstream due to the thinning effects the Asprin has on the blood.

what is everyones opinion here.

please let us have your views

regards


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## Bomb

Buy Kaizen 8mg, you can trust them to be +/- 0.1mg I believe the scope is, it was mentioned some time ago, and I think it was 10th of a mg somewhere.

Order caffeine from bulk powders or my protein, and order some tyrosine. This is your best bet, for knowing what your taking.


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## alabbadi

what is tyrosine for?

I know it is an Amino Acid and i think i have heard some use it to combat depression, is this what you are suggesting or is it for any other reason.

regards


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## Bomb

sorry typing will be bad as or rather worse than usual as im on my lil note book on a train.

Tyrosine is proven to be more synergistic with eph than aspirin. Some also say its 10s x more effective with prostaglandin inhibition, so better overall and no so harsh on the gut, The potential thyroid increase and mood enhancer are just icing.


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## alabbadi

i have to say that i am having some weird effects from the ECA stack, although i am taking low dosages

the first dosage i take is about 1 hour before my training session, i feel no ill effects from this and my training is fine can't tell yet if it has made any difference to my training as i have only been using it for 3 days.

however when i take my second dosage about 5 hours later it makes me depressed within 2 hours, my mouth is drying out and i feel a bit iffy not sick but weird, snappy and moody, i am really starting to not like it at all

i just don't know why the second dosage has this effect yet the first doesn't, maybe because the first is used just before a hard gym session and the effects are not felt while i am training, the second time i am sat at home and maybe this is why i am noticing it more.

has anyone had these effects and will they go, i am using the stack for the first time. i hope that it gets better as i get used to it.

i have read that tyrosine can get rid of the anxiety and deprssion , mood swings and elivate alertness if so i think i will have to get some becuase i can't stand being miserable. the misses has even noticed that i am withdrawn and not fun to be around lately.

well any advice would be appreciated

regards


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## Bomb

A homemade prep of separate tablets will never work as well them all mixed together in a capsule (in my opinion).

If I take 2 eph tablets, 1 caffeine and an Aspirin, it never works as well as a 60mg ECA Capsule.

You may want to try going with 60mg Eph, 200mg Caffeine and 300mg Aspirin half hour to 45 mins before training, and see if the single hit helps any.

Mood swings happens, but never heard of depression (other than long term users with no breaks when they stop and crash).


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## alabbadi

maybe i am interprating the mood swings as depression, i just feel terrible almost nauseous. its making me moody

which one capsule would you recommend because i have read around some are fake

regards


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## Bomb

Thats the theophyline in it, like I said makes me feel sick as hell.

According to Wiki

Side-effects

It can also cause *nausea*, diarrhea, increase in heart rate, arrhythmias, and CNS excitation (*headaches*, insomnia, *irritability*, *dizziness *and lightheadedness) [9][10].

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theophylline

My experiences of it are in bold, makes me feel sooooo yucky.

In the other thread, I posted google SND Online and order kaizen from them


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## Stupeo

Tomorrow will be the end of my first full week on Forza T5's and ive lost 6lb! I cant reccommend them enough. Im talking 1 of the full strength (new yellow ones) a day. My GF has also lost about 5lb in her first week.


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## alabbadi

mcfcforever said:


> Tomorrow will be the end of my first full week on Forza T5's and ive lost 6lb! I cant reccommend them enough. Im talking 1 of the full strength (new yellow ones) a day. My GF has also lost about 5lb in her first week.


I have read that Forza T5 has ephedra in them and not Ephedrine which i have heard works in a different way and is slower in its reaction

regards


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## bowen86

Alabbadi, the only way you will really find out is trying it yourself?

i started 15.8st took t5 plus changed my diet and my trainning and iam now 13.12st

im not saying take t5 and you will wake up the next day 2st lighter just you gotta take the plunge and try it?

there's loads of info on this forum and out there on the net.

all i can is that everyines diffrent, but you gotta be in it to win it.


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## alabbadi

bowen86 said:


> Alabbadi, the only way you will really find out is trying it yourself?
> 
> i started 15.8st took t5 plus changed my diet and my trainning and iam now 13.12st
> 
> im not saying take t5 and you will wake up the next day 2st lighter just you gotta take the plunge and try it?
> 
> there's loads of info on this forum and out there on the net.
> 
> all i can is that everyines diffrent, but you gotta be in it to win it.


thaks for the reply bowen86, i think that i have to try something different anyway because as i have mentioned the *Chesteze* is making me feel funny and that is using one tablet which only contains 18mg of ephedirine.

as been mentioned on this thread it must be the other ingredients in it that is doing this so i think that i am not going to up the dose as i had planned next week, i will have to find alternative sources of Ephedirne.

just wondered if anyone has heard about *Kaizen* and is it as effective as *Forza T5s*

which ever way i go i will have to make a change and see for myself the results.

regards


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## bowen86

tried kaizen, really odd tight feelings in my left arm.... what bugged me more was that i had to take seperate tabs e.g pro plus and asprin with the kaizen.

my priorities were abit messed up lol^

i rate t5 tbh.


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## Bomb

I'm not convinced Forza yellow things are even eph of any variety, there is just no reason for it to be yellow. Yellow capsule yeah, original stackrs was yellow, m double are too, but yellow tablets?

Any established users tried them ?

As for Kaizen, quality product


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## bowen86

Bomb said:


> I'm not convinced Forza yellow things are even eph of any variety, there is just no reason for it to be yellow. *Yellow capsule yeah*, original stackrs was yellow, m double are too, *but yellow tablets?*
> 
> Any established users tried them ?
> 
> As for Kaizen, quality product


if im reading this correctly...........

they *are* yellow *capsules*. *not tablets*.

hope that helps. :rockon:


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## Bomb

I don't know tablets or capsules, its one of my lil bugs, when people say tablets and mean capsules.

Tablets, Capsules, Caplets and Luiqicaps are ALL different GRRRRRR 










This is the photo of them they posted.


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## bowen86

^they are what i call tablets.

capsules are in a clear case thingy? lol


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## GTP

Just got some new Forza t5 yellow tablets with ephedra extract and compared to the previous sort capsules with ephedrine in them I didn't get quite the same buzz that i usually get. Just a case of suck it and see!


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## alabbadi

bowen86 said:


> tried kaizen, really odd tight feelings in my left arm.... what bugged me more was that i had to take seperate tabs e.g pro plus and asprin with the kaizen.
> 
> my priorities were abit messed up lol^
> 
> i rate t5 tbh.


Kaizen is only ephedrine so you will have to take the Caffeine and if you want the Asprin seperately

i know that T5 has it all in one tablet but been hearing that it is not as effective as it use to be

regards


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## Bomb

bowen86, GRRRRR man, they are more like Caplets to me  (i did tell you it was one of my lil bugs). hehehe.

So they are def Caplets (tablets), then as mentioned above.

alabbadi, yes Kaizen are only Ephedrine, but they are near as damned to 8mg of quality ephedrine per tablet.

Which makes them a quality building block in a home made ECA.

So if you pick up 300 x Kaizen, 100 Caffeine, you can either make 100 ECA at 24mg, or go to 400 Kaizen and you can make 100 x 32mg ECA without any extra crap 

There are still 30mg ECA's out there, some like ECA 30+, Eph 30+, Grenade on the retail side, and various websites selling propper stacks


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## electroberty

hi all been trying to find out some reviews on these new yellow forza t5s

ive used the old t5s they used to sell and thought they were great

but the new ones are exactly the same as aps yellow thunder even the smell of them is the same

so im guessing that the old ones were ephedrine hcl and the new ones are the extract hence the fact they have more caffeine in them and the fact they say its ok to take double!!

oh well back to the kaizens!!!


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## alabbadi

i am wary sometimes buying from websites unless they are one of the big sellers of supplements. i noticed that these websites don't sell Kaizen or T5 so i have to trust someone who has bought from a site and had a good experience.

can anyone recommend such a website as i have been ripped off in the past

regards


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## bowen86

i think that may break some rules?


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## Bomb

I've ordered from both places I have suggested


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## sparkles

hi,

could you please tell me whats best for fast efficient weight loss? is forza t5 any good?

not taken before ! I want weight loss rather than building muscle however i do workout at the gym

regards


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## Nytol

Forza T5 contains a large amount of Yohimbe, which makes me and many others feel like crap, be aware of that.


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## Virtus

sparkles said:


> hi,
> 
> could you please tell me whats best for fast efficient weight loss? is forza t5 any good?
> 
> not taken before ! I want weight loss rather than building muscle however i do workout at the gym
> 
> regards


Diet and exercise, simples!!!


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## Gaz_1989

Sorry to jump in the thread here, but whats the difference between and ECA stack and Forza T5?

Do Forza T5 contain ephedrine? Or are they legal to buy in the UK?

Thanks

Gaz


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## bowen86

hiya Gaz,

It seems that a month or two ago the EU got very strict on Eph (you may remember on the radio and tv that there was a crack down on legal highs) causing my supplier of t5 to up their prices and makes doubt there is any eph in it at all.

EPH i believe is illegal to sell in the uk.

T5 contains ECA in one tab.

where as ECA is at least three tabs.

you get me?


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## Gaz_1989

Right okay, sort of get you, lol.

So what is the usual make up of T5?

Is it stronger or better than ECA?

Cheers


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## bowen86

T5 usually forza T5

As i mentioned my usual source has upped their prices....and changed the ingriedents slightly making me doubt that there is any eph in it.

You may be best making your own ECA

Kaizien Eph

Asprin

Pro plus

= Eca

Tasty!


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## Bomb

Back in the early 90s (from memory 93+/-), no one knew what eph or eca was but we all knew what Thyroxine (T3/T4), so it was marketed as T5 the 'New Tyroxine Fat Burners'. It was ECA all along, back then I don't even think it was eph, I think it was more like speed as you was off it for like 18 hours on 1 cap and the caps was like size 3 tiny lil things.

Think about it like ECA Stack are the Ingrediants as a collective and T5 is a nick name, much like Insulin and Slin 

I haven't tried forza's new stuff yet because frankly after the last 3 things I have bought off them, they have all been ****, so not worth testing really. I probably will test them soon tho just so I know.


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## sonnybatty

I have ordered from Forza and x-burn.co.uk recently with good results.


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## Dmega

you can get kaizen from century or astro... both have been around for awhile, especially astro. Ive been ordering from them for awhile. they also have pretty good selection packaged eca stacks, but Id suggest getting what you need individually.


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## Louis_90

Bowen96, im just about to start ECA and ive been looking around, so if i were to start an ECA Stack, its as easy as me just buying some kaizen, caffeine and aspiring ?

And if so i take this once a day 20 minutes before a workout ?


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## AdamSmith

What variation of Forza T5 are you using? Maximum strength etc?

Planing on taking the ECA in a few weeks to support a cut, do you recommend putting together the stack yourself or getting on of the ECA stacks, such as the forza?


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## ausbuilt

Darylbethyname said:


> lol it is cheaper.
> 
> your buying 'branded' sh*t so no wonder its more expensive.
> 
> pro plus :lol:
> 
> and wtf is chesteze? its pretty damn expensive what ever the f*ck it is.
> 
> caffiene cost 2p for 200mg, ephe cost 22p for 30mg, and aspirin is so cheap its basically free


chest eze is undoubtedly the BEST source of Ephedrine available! why? its the ONLY REGULATED/Tested dose easily available (all the supplement companies are not tested, they only have to certify that the dose, but its not medicine... chest eze is)

Chest eze is PHARMA eph- made by NOVARTIS... a well known publicly listed pharma company- who are the supplement companies?????


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