# Can you build good legs without squat?



## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Hi, i was wondering whether you can build decent legs just by using leg extension, hamstring curls, deadlifts, SLDL?

I know squats are the daddy of lifts but i just cant get em right, thinking of just giving up and training the isolations instead.

Thanks


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## Jux (Jul 23, 2008)

You're going to give up the daddy of all exercises (period.) just because you can't achieve good form?

Dude .......


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## Jux (Jul 23, 2008)

Just try using the bar at first and progressively add the weight to it.

Or use a smith machine, unless youre already doing this...?


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## joeyh1485 (Mar 2, 2008)

as said above mate

keep going until your form is spot on use just the bar if you have to


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## roc-star (Aug 20, 2006)

I wouldnt give up mate, they are awesome for putting some size on and hit a range of muscles that it would take you a dozen exercises to isolate individually

Ask someone to spot you in the gym, I did and my form improved and now I can squat a fair amount and have noticed some good gains in only a few months of 'proper' squating.

Get your form nailed on first then stick a few plates on...


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Alright thanks for the comments, i think it definately is a combo of poor form and just weakness, i tend to start bending my back too much towards the end of my sets, almost like a good morning lol, not quite that extreme but you get the idea of what im doing wrong.


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

LloydOfGrimsby said:


> Just try using the bar at first and progressively add the weight to it.
> 
> Or use a smith machine, unless youre already doing this...?


No not using the smith machine.


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## miles2345 (Mar 26, 2008)

winners dont quit.............quitters dont win


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Its not that really, i was wondering whether there was just a way around it. Training to build muscle, not too fussed about strength.


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## joeyh1485 (Mar 2, 2008)

why don't you just drop the weight down when your form starts to get slopy


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

try looking slightly up when your squatting to keep your back straight and stop you leaning forward. believe me squats are hard, and yes you can build good legs without, i have been training 4-5 years and only incorporated squats properly a few months back, it makes a hell of a differenc tho mate


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## paulo (Feb 17, 2007)

google squat rx its a series of short videos on squats,good advice on form depth etc-wish that was available when i started,learn to squat properly,be patient and not upping weight too quick and you will grow big legs guaranteed with the squat,once you get in to it its great,i miss it big time but due to back probs caused by bad form in early days cant do.

get squating


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

joeyh1485 said:


> why don't you just drop the weight down when your form starts to get slopy


I'll give this a whirl, i think dropping weight on the whole is a good idea until i get form nailed, then with good form i should be able to up weight quite quickly.



BigDom86 said:


> try looking slightly up when your squatting to keep your back straight and stop you leaning forward. believe me squats are hard, and yes you can build good legs without, i have been training 4-5 years and only incorporated squats properly a few months back, it makes a hell of a differenc tho mate


Thanks for the tip, i guess squats must be the hardest lift to master, i havent had any problems with the other compounds, deadlift is one of my favs.



paulo said:


> google squat rx its a series of short videos on squats,good advice on form depth etc-wish that was available when i started,learn to squat properly,be patient and not upping weight too quick and you will grow big legs guaranteed with the squat,once you get in to it its great,i miss it big time but due to back probs caused by bad form in early days cant do.
> 
> get squating


Thanks i'll google it now.


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

paulo said:


> google squat rx its a series of short videos on squats,good advice on form depth etc-wish that was available when i started,learn to squat properly,be patient and not upping weight too quick and you will grow big legs guaranteed with the squat,once you get in to it its great,i miss it big time but due to back probs caused by bad form in early days cant do.
> 
> get squating


Yeh ive seen them before thru youtube, they are good instruction, im going to watch them before leg day then go work on it, looks like my squat depth isnt great too by the looks of that vid.

Was just watching this, front squat i know but pretty awesome form and strength for his size.


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

hack squat? lunges? squat with dumbells?


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Squat with dumbells i find much easier actually. Hmm thats got me thinking now.

Its still squat lol


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

squat is just a word for a movement  does it matter if its a squat? just do it lol


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Gonna try front squat as well again, last time i tried it i struggled with the bar on my shoulders and also the grip you use, its kind of like an olympic grip with the elbows up.

The good thing about the front squat tho is if i bend my back forwards the bar will fall to the ground so have to keep strict form, it also hits the quads more i found.


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## donggle (Aug 28, 2007)

You can build decent legs without squatting, I rarely squat and mine are quite big (albeit covered in fat lol).


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

yeah squat isnt the be all and end all. why you decided to go for front squat instead or normal style? i tried it before but couldnt lift **** all


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## ba baracuss (Apr 26, 2004)

Pscarb doesn't squat and has big legs.

I don't like squats myself but I do them.

I have long legs and inflexible hamstrings and am basically not built to squat and generally do not like the exercise as they are just uncomfortable and no fun.

I find my traps and shoulders tense up way too much and I also find I use my back in a good mornings fashion.


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## colt24 (Aug 24, 2007)

I stick too leg press due to bad kneeeeeeeeeeeee


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## MartialArtMan (May 28, 2007)

I spent 3 months squatting with 48kg just trying to get my form spot on. I have only recently started to progress the weight back up but they are much more "comfortable" than they were before.

Like the OP I felt it was due to weakness and poor form as I really felt it in my lower back. The best modification I made to counter the bending in my back was to keep the weight as low on my back as possible (Fozy has a good picture highlighting it). After all my hard, monotonous work I'm hoping that as I progress towards my previous pb I will maintain my form but its as much about concentration as it is moving weight.

I really think you should try to stick with it...


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Thanks all, have decided to give it another shot.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

i ahve got good legs and i have not squatted for 12yrs they are not essential


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## Bulk_250 (May 10, 2008)

What about squat machines? Theres a machine in our gym that has pads that come out like a standing calf maxchine.

The plate u stand on is on an angle and it feels so much better than normal squats. No strain on my back at all... No walking back with a bar full of weight on your back and don't have to worry about walking forwards again and getting the bar back on the rack when all you want to do is fall on the floor after thre last set!!

Do these still hit the legs the same as proper squats?


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

your describing hack squats. they are ok, find puts alot of pressure on the knees though, i use it every now and again depending which gym i train at


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## Bulk_250 (May 10, 2008)

Erm, well theres a hack squat machine next to it. But this one the weight and machine is in front of you, instead of behind and theres nothing to keep your back straight. Not usre if it works in the same way though?? As ive never used the hack machine!

Much prefer this machine to normal squats anyway


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## carly (Mar 8, 2008)

miles2345 said:


> winners dont quit.............quitters dont win


couldnt have said it better myself!! :thumb: :thumb :


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## leveret (Jun 13, 2007)

yes


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## jw007 (Apr 12, 2007)

Everyones different, my legs are a fcker, wont grow at all unless i squat, which can be a pain sometimes, especially when not really "feeling it"

Wish i could do other stuff and make gains, but i cant.

Believe me i have tried


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## Wheyhey (May 20, 2007)

Currently doing front squat now, have bought one of these mantra-ray support devices, that holds the bar on your shoulders, its really helped me a lot. Miight not be to everyones taste's especially the hardcore BBlder but dont have the shoulder development yet to support the bar properly, this thing holds it clear of my throught and collar bone area.


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## MaKaVeLi (Aug 12, 2008)

squats are the king! when i first started working out i could see my legs were bigger after 1 session lol, i couldn't walk for a week though.


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## drago78 (Oct 1, 2007)

Squats done poorly will knacker your lower back / your knees / even your hips if your lucky.

As PSCARB and others show, the squat is not essential, the leg press is definately a viable alternative, as are perhaps squat variations like the front squat. If you train from home you may want to invest in a trap bar, the trap bar deadlift exercises the quad quite well in its execution, more so than the straight bar version .


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

Wheyhey said:


> Hi, i was wondering whether you can build decent legs just by using leg extension, hamstring curls, deadlifts, SLDL?
> 
> I know squats are the daddy of lifts but i just cant get em right, thinking of just giving up and training the isolations instead.
> 
> Thanks


Squats are a great mass builder.

One of the side effects of becoming strong in the squat is a larger gluteus.

I know alot of people who avoid back squatting and front squat/hack squat instead so their glutes aren't built up further.

You don't have to do any exercise. But you will be missing out on a great exercise by not squatting.

Leg Press / SLDL / Lunges are all great exercises.

But they ALL require good form.

If the issue is form then just keep working on form and find the point where your form breaks down and then look to address the issue.

Is it after 8 reps of a 12 rep set? If so they do sets of 6 reps.

Is it after a certain weight? If so then try 20 rep sets.

Are your hammies letting you down? Then try Box Squats/Pull Throughs/GHRs

etc etc etc etc etc


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## Nidge (Jan 22, 2007)

Wheyhey said:


> Hi, i was wondering whether you can build decent legs just by using leg extension, hamstring curls, deadlifts, SLDL?
> 
> I know squats are the daddy of lifts but i just cant get em right, thinking of just giving up and training the isolations instead.
> 
> Thanks


Squats are the daddy for legs, start off on the Smith machine then progress to the squat rack.


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## pain=gain (Jan 17, 2008)

is it best to do it free weights rather than machine??


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## Tall (Aug 14, 2007)

pain=gain said:


> is it best to do it free weights rather than machine??


Works more muscles on Free Weights


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## xzx (Jun 6, 2008)

pain=gain said:


> is it best to do it free weights rather than machine??


Free weights are best, but the trick is to get your balance sorted so you get low and can push from your heel. Many people do not have the flexibility or balance for this.

A good trick to perfect your balance is to just squat down into position and hold the position whenever you are sitting around the house watching the telly or reading. You will perfect your balance over time. Crazy, but it WORKS


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## nathanlowe (Jan 8, 2008)

Do body squats until you have the flexability and balance.

Then use dumbbells up until 20kg.

After that start using the bar and progressing.


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## pecman (May 11, 2008)

I dont do squats anymore as i have a fuked left knee and a lower back issue from way back when.

But i have built pretty good legs although my hammies need looking at again...

So it can be achieved, dont let it get you down as long as you put the effort and intensity into whatever you chose to replace them with you shouln't have an issue... :thumb:


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## anabolic ant (Jun 5, 2008)

no no no....like people say...the grand daddy of all exercises!!!!!

sqauts are a big compound movement,incorporating a lot of big and small muscle groups...and build not only leg strength,but overall strength and size like deadlifts!!!!

dont be a jonny bravo...bodybuild yourself the whole package,top to bottom!!!

never give up,thats no way to talk...!!!!

if you do not succed at first...try...and try again!!!!

maybe you might wanna go back just the bar (freeweight of course,not the beer bar)and try perfecting your form!!!!

everybody can perform squats correctly...i have even seen above the knee amputees doing one leg squats at stanmore gym...now if that doesnt shame you,what will???

if you have a spinal problem,physical disability...or your bone structure or biomechanics does not allow you to perform this exercise,then you have good reason not too...but if you are a fully functional and able bodied person,then you should keep trying to do these til your too old to do em!!!!!

like so many people have said...even dorian said...if your form is bad and you cannot complete the exercise properly with no pump or pumps in the wrong place...then cut the weight in half and try again!!!!

there are so many angles you can take,dumbells,even at home practising off the edge of your bed,bum just touching the edge of the bed,we all squat up n down of and on chairs all day long,keep at it mate,never ever say die!!!!!

back straight or even better arched...natural curvature,chest out,looking up,bum poking out backwards...legs shoulder width apart and lower down keeping back in fixed position all the way up/down and where your quads or femurs are parrallel to the ground,then press back up,get someone experienced in squat training to watch and spot you,they will help you in your problem area's there n then!!!

look on you tube,google it...get training vids...there is so much for you to learn from...how dare you say your gonna give up or substitute squats!!!!

get to it bro...you know what they say...and it is true........*practice makes perfect*

never say never and never say give up...and i'm not breaking into a rick astley hit!!!


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

well i still stand by my opinion that you do not need them to build good legs


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## ShaunMc (Apr 28, 2008)

I personally think squats are a must ... three years ago i ruptured my quad and hamstring and tore my knee cartilage (doing a dads race at my little girls sports day ..... pathetic i know)

i had to take a year of from legs which were not great to start ..... i started squatting to build them up but could only manage the bar with good form. I stuck with week after week and now my upper legs are one of my better muscle groups

i can squat 250kg for reps good form now and my legs are much thicker and better developed than ever.

I know there are alternatives but for me they worked


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## JawD (Sep 15, 2004)

They are an excellent compound and usually no 1 on anyones list. However, if you dont do them thats not to say you can no longer build your legs. Its just a matter of finding different ways to put that same load and intensity on the same muscle groups. Leg Press will hit your quads, its just not the compound that squats are.

I think


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## willsey4 (Apr 21, 2008)

I was convinced that squats where the exercise for legs. Now im not too sure. I have only been training seriously since October so not too much experience with them but I went through a stage of heavy sqauts but after 10 weeks my back was shot to bits. Now Im only doing squats every other week. Last night I didnt do sqauts. My routine was Leg Press, Single Leg Press, Lunges then Extensions. My legs were so f**ked, the pump was unbelievable and without the squats. Atm I feel like i get more of a leg workout wihtout the use of squats.

Try various workouts and see what works best for you. Maybe try squatting for 10 weeks then on the next 10 weeks try the leg press and compare the differences and the gains etc.

Was Dorian ever into squats as he didnt do any in Blood and Guts and I have never read anything on him and squatting?


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## BrokenBack (Nov 12, 2006)

How do people feel about squats with a swiss ball behind u agaist the wall and using db's, ive just done my 1st leg workout for over a year due to my bloody back, and im hoping to build my legs this way, i know i will be limited in months to come with the heavyness of db's i can grip. Does this work like a squt or more of a home made leg press?


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## Kezz (Sep 3, 2007)

i have long legs and a short body and squats do sweet fa for me except put strain on my knees and lower back, heavy leg presses and hack squats all day long for me


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## musc (Oct 11, 2006)

Its a great exercise using the ball especially for people new to squatting or such as yourself recovering from an injury. Eventually the potential to stimulate and tear fibres will be resticted by the stabalising force of the ball, but this exercise is fantastic for helping to build the sufficient strength to do the proper movement.


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## Incredible Bulk (Sep 19, 2007)

i love them as an exercise so i use them in my leg routine, but they are not the be and end all of leg training.

i dropped deadlifts much to the cry of the chest beaters 'ug ug, you cant drop deads, your back will suffer in development ug ug'

i've been doing just fine


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## BrokenBack (Nov 12, 2006)

musc said:


> Its a great exercise using the ball especially for people new to squatting or such as yourself recovering from an injury. Eventually the potential to stimulate and tear fibres will be resticted by the stabalising force of the ball, but this exercise is fantastic for helping to build the sufficient strength to do the proper movement.


Thanks buddy, its good to know im not going to be wasting my time with them, as at the moment ive seen bigger legs hanging out of birds nests lol


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## tombsc (May 29, 2008)

Great thread. I also cannot squat due to a knackered disc in my back and also because my hams are so short I can't physically do the movement (even with no weight - I just fall over or end up on my toes!). So it's good to know there is hope for when (if) my back recovers and I can start training legs again. At the moment I can't do any legs work


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## dholmes290181 (Aug 26, 2008)

I had a similar problem !!!

I stupidly went to a gym with no squat rack and had to use a smith machine although the weights i could lift went up no big increases in quad size

I joined a proper gym and found I couldnt squat for **** , tried using the same weight and ended up with a good morning squat.

to rectify this

1. Swallow big pride

2. Drop the weight right down , to ensure no good morning and at least parrellel hams to the floor

3. when you reach the bottom of the movement push up through the soles of your feet and look straight ahead this will stop you from leaning forward.

all the best m8


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