# Keto or calorie deficit to reduce bf% and maintain lean mass



## filberto (May 14, 2010)

As stated in the title, when most people cut they go on a ketonogenic diet.

What I don't understand is how many calories are the target. For example do you eat 500 calories below your needs, or do you lose weight eating your maintenance number of calories purely because it is a ketonogenic diet?

Or does the ketonogenic diet ensure that all the stuff burnt due to the 500 calorie deficit is fat amd mot lean muscle?

I need 3000 calories to maintain my mass, so if I wanted to reduce bf% do I eat 3000 calories on keto, or just 2500?

Also is keto absolutely NO carbs?

Thanks


----------



## Big Dawg (Feb 24, 2008)

filberto said:


> As stated in the title, when most people cut they go on a ketonogenic diet.
> 
> *No they don't. Where did you hear that?*
> 
> ...


----------



## filberto (May 14, 2010)

Sorry its just almost all posts in this forum are about ketonogenic diets or cardio!

I want to burn as close to zero muscle mass as possible, so would you just suggest a clean diet with a 500 cal deficit? By clean I mean no sugary drinks, white bread and such? Also I would intend to keep my calories eaten and burn 500 through cardio, as I figure this will improve fitness and keep muscle loss to a minimum?

What is the main benefit of ketonogenic diets then? A sustained level of hormones?


----------



## filberto (May 14, 2010)

gyppo12345 said:


> how do you work out your daily maintenance calories???


You couldn't be bothered to google it? http://www.bmi-calculator.net/bmr-calculator/


----------



## Big Dawg (Feb 24, 2008)

filberto said:


> Sorry its just almost all posts in this forum are about ketonogenic diets or cardio!
> 
> I want to burn as close to zero muscle mass as possible, so would you just suggest a clean diet with a 500 cal deficit? By clean I mean no sugary drinks, white bread and such? Also I would intend to keep my calories eaten and burn 500 through cardio, as I figure this will improve fitness and keep muscle loss to a minimum?
> 
> What is the main benefit of ketonogenic diets then? A sustained level of hormones?


There's a few benefits of keto diets. Firstly there are no insulin spikes. Insulin is really the only hormone that can be controlled through diet. Think of an insulin spike as a storage mechanism - when insulin is spiked the body halts all fat burning and shuttles the nutrients ingested into either muscle or adipose tissue. No insulin spikes, or very small ones (as elicited by protein) will theoretically mean your body is constantly in a fat burning stage and not an anabolic one. It's carbs that cause insulin spikes in their extreme by the way (higher the GI the larger the spike).

Another benefit is that blood sugar will be fairly constant, so in theory hunger will be fairly controlled, as will energy.

I've personally lost a lot of fat following a CKD, but also a fair bit of muscle. I felt like death all the time too. Personally I don't feel it's the best way to go about things.

I'd personally suggest carb cycling. Take a look at this: http://forums.rxmuscle.com/showthread.php?t=32018&highlight=carb+cycling - that pretty much sums up my opinion


----------



## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

AlasTTTair has summed it all up perfectly... the advantage of very low carb/ketogenic dieting is less insulin, the disadvantage is much greater loss of muscle, especially in a natty.

As also said the main thing to lose fat is calorie deficit...always the most important factor in fat loss. Other things can make a difference, but you still need the deficit.

I'd also agree to look at carb cycling, and if deciding to go keto not to do a straight keto diet but either a CKD or TKD.


----------

