# I'll never be a body builder :(



## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Can anyone help someone who is ready to give in? Just before you read this I have been using weights on and off for a few years. I'm trying to understand the science behind it, but I'm boggled by all the so called info out there. Im 24 years old and gag when i look on youtube and see guys years younger than me that look like beef cakes...........read on and if any further info required I'm on hand........

I am.....5" 7'...... and stuck at 66kg.

Diet for today as an example

8:00am large bowl of oat cereal and milk

10:00am 2 nutrigrain bars and a banana

12:15 white pasta and tuna approx 650cals + fruit

3:00 nutrigrain bar + protoplex deluxe shake (44g prot, 25g carbs)

6:30 jacket potato, 3 beef steaks, salad

WORK OUT -

8:45 2 x fresh cod fillets approx 30g protein each

NOTE: I also eat trail mix in between this food.

My work out regime is Day on, Day rest. One day triceps using 10kg slow controlled reps followed by chest routine of push ups on bars onto bench fly of 14kg per arm then inline bench 32kg - all slow controlled reps.

Day of rest

Biceps quick double reps of 8kg per arm to warm up on to slow one arm curls 16kg per arm 6 reps at a time and finishing with curl bar 10 reps with 20kg on the bar, i then finish the work out with 26kg (bent over row lift) for back.

I DO NO CARDIO AT ALL! This is because I feel doing cardio will make me waste away?!

I hope this is enough info and you may be able to help me. I have been lifting for 7 weeks and had good results in the 1st three weeks and now the only thing i see getting bigger is this little tyre around the bottom of my stomach. My shoulders and arms are a good size...but no matter what i do now or have done in the past ...my chicken chest wont grow! I'm almost at a point where I wanna say I give up cos the food and the work out doesnt seem to be worth it.....I work 40-50 hours a week and i just wanna see some reward for what I'm doing in my spare time. I feel like a skeleton  HELP

A big thank you to anyone who can reply with something that may help and good luck to those who are trying hard.


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## anabolic ant (Jun 5, 2008)

bro all i can say is...never say never....never give up(not singing a rick astley tune)...but just try,if you dont succeed the first time,keep trying,and try harder...things will work n happen...bodybuilding is a long term thing...those who get disheartened after 2 weeks want the magic pill,powder or potion...it doesnt work...as the saying goes 'rome wasnt built in a day'!!!!!

neither will your body...use 3,6,9 and 12 month peroids as goals or time frames to achieve little improvements...you cant turn into ronnie coleman overnight....in fact there is only one ronnie,there's only one ronnie....there's only one ronnie....ooops scuse me for breaking into song!!!

you will get there if you persist,dont need to get too technical...or make it into complex science...it isnt really!!!!!

3 major steps for training is(other bits can include later):

1,*train hard*(good intensity,form and discipline)

2,*eat well*(include regular routinely balanced diet,increase,decrease to your body's demands,bad fats out,include good,increase water intake,also,most bodybuilders eat little and often as oppose to 3 big meals per day etc etc etc)

3,*sleep*(include a regular routinely good sleep 7-9 hrs per night,rest n recovery n repair,GH release)

if your a hard gainer then you must persist all the more...you think you was a skeleton,i think i'll post pics of me when i started,most people dont believe its me...skinny...hahaha i looked like a full bore crackhead!!!!

train hard....be hungry for what you want bro...its the only way...get focussed,become tunnel visioned,you'll succeed!!!!!


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Don't forget legs!!!!

Take a look at some of the routines in people's blogs and journals (in the Blog, Member's Pics and Shows Pros and Inspiration' sections, as well as the form and technique sections.

Heavy compound lifts are what you need to start building mass - most routines are based on squats, deadlifts and bench press.

Good luck!


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

I really appreciate your advice.....I am determined, but unsure of what is required to get results. I'm sick of seeing kids in scholl uniforms walking down the street lookin bigger than me LOL.

One thing i dont do is drink a lot.....Im really poor on that front.

I dont eat chocolate or any junk not even for 1 day a week, if thats you in the pic on the reply you just posted then you have been doing something right. I dont think its all bad as my arms seem to build easily...this looks disproportionate to the rest of me though. I'm gonna keep on pushing but i need educating on what to do for training to do the major muscle groups? Cardio?

Thanks for taking the time to reply.


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Legs, and squats.....I do nowt with my legs cos i half think how can fit it in? My body wont be able to recover in time before the next work out? Or so i think? Sometimes i'm still sore after the days rest. i was told not to train when sore?

Yeah mass building is what i wanna go for but I dont wanna drag in a fat gut for good measure. With my arms they ballooned in size, and feel solid but not much definition.

Thank you for replyin...I'm stock piling info....cheers


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

P.s I forget to mention that on the days i do biceps, I also work shoulders......


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

Most people train a bodypart once or twice a week (someone correct me if I'm wrong)

They split the bodyparts so they're not training the same thing every day.

For example I used to do a 3 day split;

Chest, triceps, delts

Back, biceps, abs

Legs

I'd train every other day, or do the 3 days in a row then have a day off.

At the moment I'm doing a 4 day split but about to change it (I've been doing it a while and need to change it up);

Chest, triceps, abs

Back, biceps

Delts, traps, abs

Legs

Not sure what my next split will be because I haven't decided yet :lol:

I start with heavy compound moves then do the isolation stuff afterwards.

Chest day starts with bench or incline bench, back day starts with deadlifts or pullups, leg day starts with squats or leg press, usually :beer:


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

dont give up. i started training properly 3-4 years ago. a year and a half into it i was going to give up as i wasnt gaining anything. then i dont know something switched in me and i just started gaining, 11 - 16 stone in 4 years 

it will happen it just takes time like everything, also your diet is ok. dont be scared of eating junk as you need alot of calories, also you will have to accept slight fat gains or you wont be gaining muscle otherwise or its very difficult to while keeping very low bodyfat


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

This is all great advice and i really appreciate it. I dont want a miracle just to be a bit bigger and acheive something through hard work. I eat no junk at all lol and i think if i did i would feel like I was destroying all the work outs and strict food intake I have been doing already, but what your saying makes sense as i think my calorie intake does need to increase despite what I'm eating. Also i need to educate myself on basics like muscle groups and names.....triceps, biceps, quads, glutes is about all i know at the mo...i might be working muscles and dont even know the name of it ......cheers for the replies i'm feelin better already to keep it goin.


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## Slamdog (Jun 11, 2007)

the exercises you have listed really won't do much..

Try deadlifting.. you will find that it will work all the muscles in one go....


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Ok I'm gonna give it a try but everyone tells mes different things. The only reason I'm doing what I do now is bcos someone told me to do it.

Are you saying give up on arm curls and bench pressing?


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## Slamdog (Jun 11, 2007)

give up arm curls for sure....

bench pressing on an incline, not flat bench...

really though... deadlifts, squats and chin ups will sort you out. go as heavy as you can with good form.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

I'll be honest with you mate, you probably wont be a bber, but that doesn't stop you putting on some quality muscle, you just need a little help with your diet and training.

First lets take a look at your diet. Its not bad.


```
Diet for today as an example<br>
8:00am large bowl of oat cereal and milk<br>
10:00am 2 nutrigrain bars and a banana<br>
12:15 white pasta and tuna approx 650cals + fruit<br>
3:00 nutrigrain bar + protoplex deluxe shake (44g prot, 25g carbs)<br>
6:30 jacket potato, 3 beef steaks, salad<br>
WORK OUT - <br>
8:45 2 x fresh cod fillets approx 30g protein each<br>
NOTE: I also eat trail mix in between this food.[/PHP]
```
The first thing i notice here is a lack of protein between 8am and 12,15pm. You would benefit from dropping the nutrigain bars and having something substantial with at least 40g protein, IE chicken, tuna, beef, fish, make up a lunch box for that 10am meal if you can.

After your workout, you might like to add a PWO shake, this will feed your muscles, then your main meal at around 9pm, also take in some more protein before bed.

Training, i think we need to go back to basics.

So could you manage 45-60 mins say, mon/wed/fri.? ( i'll be back)..


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

training i currently doing 90 mins every other day. So I get a days rest. I'm getting told all sorts at the moment and i'm getting confused over what to do training wise as some say no curls etc......then i get told eat some junk food to add cals.....

To be honest i dont want to be a body builder in the sense of competitions.....but despite that if i wanted to i would keep going until i either got ther or it killed me.

But like you said I just want to add some uscle and bulk to my frame.

I'm takin on board the advice about the diet cos i know it needs tweaking. But about working out? I'm just plain confused.........


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## Beklet (May 13, 2005)

jamjam84 said:


> training i currently doing 90 mins every other day. So I get a days rest. I'm getting told all sorts at the moment and i'm getting confused over what to do training wise as some say no curls etc......then i get told eat some junk food to add cals.....
> 
> To be honest i dont want to be a body builder in the sense of competitions.....but despite that if i wanted to i would keep going until i either got ther or it killed me.
> 
> ...


Hmm I find the diet harder to deal with lol.

Seriously, base your workouts on heavy basic moves. I'm no expert but the basic exercises I do on each day (though you can check my blog for details);

1. Bench press, incline press, flyes, dips, pressdowns, pushups, crunches, leg raises.

2. Deadlifts, rows, pulldowns, dumbbell and hammer curls, hyperextensions.

3. Shoulder press, reverse flye, lateral raises, shrugs, side bends, leg raises, wieghted crunches

4. Squat, leg press, stiff legged deadlift, leg extensions, leg curls, calf raises


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Thanks your very patient with all my naivity.

I'm just educating myself on the different exercises your mentioning. It just becomes confusing, some say your over training, some say lift heavier, some say eat clean and plow in the carbs and protein , some say eat some junk for cal building. Basically I think I have learnt that things work differently for each individual and I need to spend time finding what works for me.


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## Dwaine Chambers (Sep 14, 2008)

As a huge cardio guy I recommend finding time for some. If nothing else it helps you able to do a longer and harder work out, plus improves your mental state.


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

jamjam84 said:


> training i currently doing 90 mins every other day. So I get a days rest. I'm getting told all sorts at the moment and i'm getting confused over what to do training wise as some say no curls etc......then i get told eat some junk food to add cals.....
> 
> To be honest i don't want to be a body builder in the sense of competitions.....but despite that if i wanted to i would keep going until i either got their or it killed me.
> 
> ...


Ok mate, for the training, like i said it's got to be back to basic mass builders. Mon/wed/fri.

Squats, deadlifts, bench press, military press, wide grip chins/bent rows.

Warm up with a lightweight for 15 reps, then pick a weight that will allow you to get 8 reps using proper form, start by doing 2-3 sets for each of the above, when you can get 10 reps add enough weight to take you back down to 8 again, don't go too slow, find a nice rhythm and pound them out, you must up the intensity, just have a look on youtube at some of the guys training, this is the intensity that you will need to put in every session, before you know it your weights will start going up and you;ll start seeing the results in the mirror, if you do this and adjust your diet, i guarantee you will grow.

PS, don't forget that PWO shake.


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Thanks i will update when things start improving....thanks to all


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Im off to get that much needed sleep now. i have been reading about anabolic steroids. They seem like they would help do the trick......im sure some people on here will not be pleased with that comment. I'm thinking about taking ZMA zinc, magnesium and B6 to increase the testosterone and help me recover better. I'll get some capsules tmw. This and tweaking the diet, along with basic (good form) mass building exercises and maybe results will come my way......1 question though with the PWO shake can just use the protoplex deluxe I have?


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## Dwaine Chambers (Sep 14, 2008)

Be sure to do lots of research before doing steroids. You need to work out your post cycle theraphy, (pct), etc. Most sites that sell it on the net are scams as well.


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## flapjack (Mar 1, 2008)

You seem to be suffering from information overload and overcomplicating things. Take the sound advice given by others in this thread and workout three times per week with a routine based around the three big lifts, Bench press, squats, and deadlift. Save things like curls for when you have built the size you want and just need to shape things a bit. I am using a basic routine at the moment and growing well.

Day 1: Front squats(atg), Stiff leg deadlifts, Hyperextensions, Crunches (with a weight on chest).

Day 2: Bench press, dips, shoulder press, Pull ups.

Day 3: Deadlifts, Cable rows, Upright row(don't pull too high), Lat pull downs.

I eat everything in large quantities.

Go for five sets of five for each exercise. Intensity is the key. Put so much in you feel like you are going to die (almost)

Zma is a waste of money and could actually have negative effects as you body will do everything it can to neutralise it. If you want to spend money on somethging worthwhile get some EAA's and take 10g pre and post workout to help you recover and grow (quite cheap from myprotein.co.uk)

go for it


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## willsey4 (Apr 21, 2008)

Never say never. You might have really good genetics for bodybuilding which you just have not realised yet.

- Sort out your training

- Get a good clean diet together

- Stay focuswed and train hard

Have a little patience and you will get there. You never know after a year or two training you could be in good enough shape to do a first timers comp if thats what your looking to do.

I trained on and off till I was 24 then took it seriously and have been training for a year now. Ive learnt a lot and now looking to compete.


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## genesis (Jul 4, 2006)

flapjack said:


> You seem to be suffering from information overload and overcomplicating things. Take the sound advice given by others in this thread and workout three times per week with a routine based around the three big lifts, Bench press, squats, and deadlift. Save things like curls for when you have built the size you want and just need to shape things a bit. I am using a basic routine at the moment and growing well.
> 
> Day 1: Front squats(atg), Stiff leg deadlifts, Hyperextensions, Crunches (with a weight on chest).
> 
> ...


That was a good post up until that comment, how would your body do everything it can to neutralise 2 minerals?


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

I have a tub of tablets called amino1000 I have not taken them yet but I'm guessing that an eaa supplement? Meant to take 2, 3 times a day .......I'll give the ZMA a miss if you really think its not worth it.....cos otherwise its £18 down the drain and I can get some good quality protein instead?


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

never say never just stick at it. also dont buy into all these supplements. i only take a basic protein powder from myprotein and then some vitamins that is it for my supplements. gave up creatine a while ago after getting kidney pains


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Ok I get what your saying, I take a multi vit now and also vit c plus. Thing is you look like a pretty big bloke and maybe you've got better genetics than me or summat as well?

I posted a pic but it doesnt come up? do you know why?

Thanks for the advice I'll save my coin for something thAT will help....


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

nope i just stuck with it. i havent got good genetics. my weight when i started was about 11 stone at 6ft. im now 16 stone at 6ft1 after a good 4 years solid training and eating. just make sure your eating protein and carbs with every meal and you will grow. dont be scared of biscuits or chocolate or whatever as you need the extra calories to grow. you can have all the protein in the world but if your not supplying your body enough calories it simply will not grow. also i chronically overtrain lol, arms 3 times a week, chest twice, back twice, legs once or twice, shoulders twice. but it works for me


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## Guest (Sep 27, 2008)

i scanned your post but ill give my two pence....

cardio wont make you waste away mr gum is a perfect example he runs like route 66 every day and is still gaining mass (of course theres limits lol a 20 minute jog wont do you harm)

also if you get boggled by the science then dont learn the science mate, stick the basics like me and the majority of lifters do, eat well train hard simple as mate

dont pull your hair out over the nitty gritty


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Cheers....i can see it works for you lot from your pics......My goal is to look something like anyone of ya.....simple is good....

Thanks for taking the time to reply


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

you will get there mate. just takes time, and im guessing your 23ish from your user name. so you got tons of time!! i hope to still be training into my 60s and 70s healthy


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

yeah 25 in 4 months. I'll keep it simple, lift basic and heavy and eat well....got to be better than doing nowt.......and ending up a skinny guy with body fat in places......the worst king in my opinion.......


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

*thing......not king!


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## flapjack (Mar 1, 2008)

genesis said:


> That was a good post up until that comment, how would your body do everything it can to neutralise 2 minerals?


I probably should have said "IMHO the small increases in testosterone produced by taking ZMA could cause the body to then produce more estrogen and thus have a negative effect"

TBH I was just airing the opinion that the OP would be wasting his money and would get no real benefit from the supp.

I am still very low on the learning curve but climbing step by step:thumbup1:


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## irwit (Mar 29, 2007)

My 2ps worth.

Bicep curls ... Do a hundered a day, amillion a day lifting 100k each arm. All you are working is your bicep. Have you ever seen anyone with huge defined bicep and a weedy chest, shoulders, legs? Work your whole body. The more weight you are lifting, the more you are working your body. The lifts where you can lift the most, ie deadlift, squat, bench, dips, pull ups are going to put meat on your bones, bicep curls are going to swell your biceps for a few days, thats about it.

Do yourself a favour and READ!!!! Read as much as you can, the stickies in here and in teh diet section should give youa a great base knowledge but then keep reading!!! Knowledge is key IMO.


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## ba baracuss (Apr 26, 2004)

Don't do 5x5 - this is strength focussed - go for 3 sets of 8-12 instead.


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## Littleluke (Nov 21, 2005)

BigDom86 said:


> nope i just stuck with it. i havent got good genetics. my weight when i started was about 11 stone at 6ft. im now 16 stone at 6ft1 after a good 4 years solid training and eating. just make sure your eating protein and carbs with every meal and you will grow. *dont be scared of biscuits or chocolate or whatever as you need the extra calories to grow*. you can have all the protein in the world but if your not supplying your body enough calories it simply will not grow. also i chronically overtrain lol, arms 3 times a week, chest twice, back twice, legs once or twice, shoulders twice. but it works for me


Yes you need extra calories to grow but eating junk is pointless and will only encourage fat gain which isn't weight you want to gain. If you need extra calories then have a protein bar or some oats blended into a shake, some nuts.. But not chocolate and [email protected].. Save that for a cheat day. :beer:

jamjam84 - Before you do anything. Change your attitude to a positive one. With the right mindset, diet and training you can achieve your goals.


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

not everyone can afford protein bars etc. i must admit i am getting fairly chunky these days lol. maybe i should start getting scared of those mentioned things


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## dru0111 (Aug 28, 2007)

Im 24 and love bodybuilding but will never know if I can reach the standards of a pro due to joint defects and deformations. I would pay all the money in the world to be a small 60kg man with no defective bones / joints. Your lucky, you should be able to take it as far as you can given the correct training, nutrition and determination. Stop worrying and go for it.


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## ben jamming (Jan 28, 2008)

for me, the only routine as of yet to pack on notable weight and muscle in a short time frame was bill starr madcow 5x5. as everyone else says, eat well and sleep and you WILL see results.


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## kingprop (May 8, 2005)

Buddy, you ARE a bodybuilder. The very fact you want what you want makes you one.


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## Littleluke (Nov 21, 2005)

BigDom86 said:


> not everyone can afford protein bars etc. i must admit i am getting fairly chunky these days lol. maybe i should start getting scared of those mentioned things


judging from your pic I would invest in some quality food and drop the junk :thumb:


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

lol thats a old pic mate. bigger now, but chunkier too!


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## Littleluke (Nov 21, 2005)

LOL! I'm only messing mate!


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## Jux (Jul 23, 2008)

What do you have to lose?

Balls to the walls and sit back and watch yourself morph into a being of god-like stature.


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Just checked back in on this. Cheers. I'm still going and its goin well.

Cheers for this one especially....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Buddy, you ARE a bodybuilder. The very fact you want what you want makes you one.


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## Alex Redford (Sep 9, 2008)

hi mate,

First of all whatever you do not say never and do not give up... becoming a bodybuilder is all about hard work, dedication and diet, the diet is better than the average diet , however if you could get back to us with what your average rep range is that would be great because if your looking to put the size on as you say you are then you are going to need to lower the reps and up the weight, if you take a look at my thread in the welcome lounge thers a copy of my diet this has been made for me to pack on weight and in the last 2 months of me doing it, size, weight, definition has all shot up... and this is with doing rugby training which is extra cardio which your not going to have which will work out even better... below is the link to my thread , reply on your thread and ill have a read...

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/welcome-lounge/39954-hi-heres-me-i-look-compete-one-day-pics.html

Good luck matey.


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

Reps and training at the mo are..... Squats 8/10 reps 47kilo's x 5 sets

deadlift 8/10 reps 53kilos's x5 sets

arm curl 10 reps 32 kilo's x 5 sets

bench press 6 reps 48kilos 5 setx and 3 sets incline

tricep row 15kilo 8 reps per arm 5 sets per arm

military press 33 kilo 5 reps x 5 sets

preachers curls 20 kilos 6 reps 5 sets per arm

bent over row 48 kilo 8 reps x 6 sets

chin ups 38 kilos 8 reps x 5 sets

this is not all on the same day obviously but this is what i have been doing for the last 2 weeks.....after changing my original routine. My clothes are feeling much tighter and I can see differences but I get unsure as to whether i'm doing it right


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

I just looked at your thread . Thats very very impressive. The thing that strikes me is that I am no where near as small as you were hwn you 1st started. My arms are big and look similar to yours now but i need the overall growth similar to yours. I can see it happening on the shoulders and back but my chest is only making tiny gains....... i need to know your secret LOL...and what is 5x5 trianing...people are raving about it?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I have not read the entire thread so pardon me if I am repeating something.

You need to do basic compound movements and drop all the arm work. Squats, dead lifts, bench press, pull ups, dips, inclines, military press, rows (upright and bent over), all should be considered and when I say considered, prioritized.

Do a 4 day split and take the other 3 days as rest days.

Try and work out a combination of lets say chest and bicep, quads and calves, back and hamstrings, shoulders and triceps.

You need a foundation, you need to keep the volume low, and the food a bit high, intensity needs to be there too, this will spark an adaptive responce and force the body into submission.

A few things that will be hindering your progress would be but not limited too: not enough sleep, over training, not eating enough, using too many isolation exercises, etc.


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

I know this is a cheat but I think I need someone to say what to eat and when, and then what exercises to do and when, how many reps, how much weight, how many sets

cos I have heard so much info i dunno what to do......i just dont want to be the guy that tries hard and gets no where cos he's doing it wrong.


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## irwit (Mar 29, 2007)

monday : dead lifts, pull ups, single arm rows

wednesday : bench press with dumbells, military press, dips

friday : squats, sldl, calf raises

Meal 1 : 100 grams oats, 30 grams of whey, half pint of milk

Meal 2 : 6 eggs

Meal 3 : meat carbs and veges

Meal 4 : ( meal 1 or 2 repeated )

Meal 5 : ( Meal 3 repeat )

Meal 6 : cottage cheese and lots of it !!!

Plenty of water through the day

Buy a new bed and some black out curtains and get 8 hours sleep a night no excuses. Avoid alcohol as it just ruins your body ( I say this while enjoying a nice cold beer  )

There the basis for my diet and training for me its working really well. Yes there are better ones maybe but this is the direction you should be headed imo

hope it helps !


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

ok perhaps im on the right track already cos i dont drink or smoke. I eat a lot and its always good meats veg oats rice etc. no junk on any day. The exercise regime you said though seems really small?

I am crap with water though, i drink very very little when im not training.


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## not the face!! (Apr 4, 2008)

jamjam if you type myprotein into google it has some very good diets on there and agreed drop all isolation exercises focus on the compound thats what most people (including myself) do wrong when new to weight training


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

I'm just worried that if i only stick to squats, military press, bench/incline, deadlifts, bent over row, and chin ups i wont see results.....I wanna bulk but i want muscle not to turn into a fat bugga with no definition.I drew up a 1 day on 1 day off regime....what do you think?

Day 1

Squats, Bench press/incline, arm curl (full body, chest, biceps)

Day 2

deadlift, tricep row, pull ups, military press, bent over row (full body, triceps, shoulders, back)

All approx 6/8 reps with 75% max weight for 5 sets each exercise

I know i'm annoying and naive but I'm just trying to get to a point that makes me feel like i might be on the right track....both nutrition and exercise wise.....

Again thanks to everyone for input I really appreciate it


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

* above is repeated with one day rest in between each session


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## not the face!! (Apr 4, 2008)

jamjam you dont want to be doing any arm curls, this may work for the lucky few but as you say your not one of them id steer well clear till youve added some good muscle, squats-deads-bench-milatary press is all you need but throw some pull ups in or chin ups (great for biceps) and your away give it 5-6 moths with a good diet you should make some real decent gains. The weight you should be lifting should be the maximun weight you can make 5 reps with then keep training with that till you can do all 5 sets then up the weight 10 pounds and start again


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

thanks for the advice. The thing is my arms are big...the biggest part of my body. and for some reason I found that arm curls and tricep rows seem to make them big and much quicker than my other muscles. Second to this is my shoulders, and my chest is the slowest gaining


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## BigDom86 (Jul 27, 2008)

no curls? why not?

sure do compounds but add in isolation work too. just do the compounds first.

i took the advice of just doing compounds before and never went over 15" arms, it wasnt until i added in isolation exercises and lots of drop sets that i manged to push over 17"


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

as long as it does not hinder the gains I'm happy to mix in a few isolation exercises. Just for biceps and triceps.

I figured that if im breaking the fibres in these muscles then they would grow back bigger and stronger next time (with the right nutrition of course)


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Here is a article I typed up for a guy starting out a website, I am actually not supposed to put this here as I gave it to him, but here goes, it fits here.

Tips for teenagers wanting to start bodybuilding.

First of all I wish I had some information when I started out.

I was 15 years old when I first started training, for the most part I just watched the football players in school.

Sure they had some direction from the coaches and this is why I tried to copy them.

But bodybuilding is a different training philosophy than football training (American Football).

Bodybuilding in itself is not just lifting weights but we will focus on that here. It is a balance of diet, exercise and rest.

To make it simple, you grow when you sleep and not in the gym.

The idea is very simple, you stimulate the muscle, and let the body adapt to the stimulation you have given the muscle.

If you are eating and sleeping in theory you should grow.

This all can be shortchanged by not getting enough food, or not getting enough rest, these two things will hinder the body's recovery and growth.

Overtraining is another obstacle that most people will do without even knowing it, in the normal thinking of things, more is not better here.

Ok, best advice I can give for anyone starting out would be to stick to basic compound movements. Compound movement's mean that the exercise has more than one joint.

For instance leg extensions have one joint movement (knee), whereas squats will have knee, hip, ankle, etc.

What are basic compound exercises?

Squat, dead lift, military press, pull up's, bench press, incline press, bar dips, rowing exercises, etc.

You can not go wrong by choosing all of the above in your workout routine.

Notice that curls and triceps are not included there?

That is because they are an isolation movement and not a compound movement.

Every one of those in some way or another hit arms, for instance. Bench will hit chest, front deltoids and also triceps. Military press will hit triceps, so will dips. Actually those three exercises will hit the whole tricep.

Now that we have the basic compound exercises identified, we will figure out what rep range we want to use. I have found that a rep range of between 8 to 12 reps to work very well for most people, some may like less reps, some may like more, but we will stick to those for now as 70% of your 1 rep max will work 90% of both slow and fast twitch muscles. Or in simple terms, it will work all your muscles, which is what we want.

Remember these rep ranges are on your own with no help from someone else, if you need help to get to your 8th rep, then you are going too heavy.

It is often said, control the weight or the weight will control you.

What does this mean?

This means that you choose a weight you can do comfortably without having to cheat or ask for help to execute the exercise. It is a good idea to use the full range of the movement and not do half reps, or cheat reps. This is not only good practice but also will help you to avoid injury.

I know it looks good using big weights in the gym and others are watching you, but if you use a weight you can handle, over time you will get stronger, and what you lift tomorrow will be more than you lift today.

It is a good idea to write your lifts down to compare from week to week or month to month. Once you have a weight you do more than 12 reps with, next week, you will add some weight to the bar and probably take you back down to the 8 rep mark.

Remember Rome was not built in a day and neither was Arnold.

Now that we have the exercises down, the rep range down, let's focus on how many exercises for each body part. I myself like to work with about 3 different exercises per body part, for instance, I like to do bench, inclines and dips for chest, pull downs, bent over rows, and dead lifts for back. I occasionally do add another rowing exercise to that due to most people do too much pushing and not enough pulling exercises.

Remember the bigger muscle groups will generally have more exercises than let's say the smaller muscle groups like let's say biceps. For some reason biceps tend to get more attention than most other muscle groups. Arms in particular seem to be everyone's favorite to work. It might sound strange that many don't even work arms directly as they get hit with all the compound lifts. So, not only should they not be the main focus, but they should be the least focus. Arms will grow if you do compound exercises period. Yes it is ok to do some arm work but it is not priority.

So, let's think of the bigger muscle groups as having between 3 to 4 different exercises per large group and 2 exercises for the smaller muscle groups.

Never neglect working your legs.

Most think that weight lifting is either pushing (concentric) the weight up, or pulling (concentric) the weight down. Yes, muscles do contract and this is called the concentric part of the movement. An example of this is the bench press where one was to push the weight off of the chest; this is called the concentric part of the exercise.

Many will let the weight just drop with little resistance. But doing any lift this way cheats you out of half of the benefits of the exercise.

The eccentric part of the bench press would be controlling the weight on the way down (giving resistance) to force the muscle into a stretched contraction, or lengthen under tension.

This eccentric part of the exercise actually causes the muscle to have greater soreness.

Using both the concentric and eccentric part of each lift will offer greater gains in strength and muscle size then not using both.

So, next time you are in the gym, use those basic compound movements, utilizing both concentric and eccentric parts of the exercise, shoot for 3 to 4 max exercises for the big muscle groups, and 2 exercises for the smaller muscles.

Try to keep the rep ranges between 8 to 12 reps, if you can't get 8 you went too heavy, if you can do more than 12 you are too light.

Try and get at least 8 hours of sleep and take rest days when you feel fatigue.

Muscle takes time to develop, it is not something that happens over night, it takes along time, be patient.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Lets not make this more complicated than we have to, foods.

*Protein*

Meat, fish, all foul, or even simpler, if it walks, runs, swims, flies, or crawls, eat it as it is protein.

*Carbohydrates*

For bodybuilding, complex are preferred, so oats, sweet potato, wild rice, whole grain pasta, whole grain breads, etc.

For fruits, you can pretty much eat all of them, unless you are cutting, choose diffrent colors to get diffrent minerals and vitamins.

Greens, now this would be stuff like asparagus, broccoli, green beans, spinish, this will keep your digestive system nice and happy due to the fiber, it will also lower cholesterol, and lastly they are very high in the mineral department making them excellant for buffering excess acid, which most people are acidic.

*Fats*

You can pretty much eat all, but prioritize stuff like olive oil, and olives, nuts and seeds, oily fish, fish oils, butter (sparingly), etc.

The fats to avoid would be hydrogenated oils, and trans fats.

Now if you want ratio's then this post will be huge, and would likely depend on your body type......lol


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## jamjam84 (Sep 26, 2008)

That is really good and pretty much answers many things in the one go. love the bit about rome and arnold LOL.

`People say that correct exercise, sleep, and nutrition will give results. I would extend that slightly and say all the above but plus patience`and determination'

Thanks for the advice......i gotta go do some eatin


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