# Do you use t3 while on a tren cycle?



## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Started my parabolan today and just looking over the alpha pharma leaflet and i noticed the paragraph stating to use t3 at 25mcg throughout a trenbolone treatment ( something that iv read many times before on the net)

The last few tren cycles i have noticed a drop in metabolism at week 4-5 mainly bloating as if what i was eating is now to much for my body to deal with so added t3 , my personally opinion is that its needed for me but maybe not everyone.


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## Benchbum (Apr 20, 2011)

I ran t3 with my last tren cycle at 50mcg and feel my results were significantly better in terms of fat loss and muscle retention.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Benchbum said:


> I ran t3 with my last tren cycle at 50mcg and feel my results were significantly better in terms of fat loss and muscle retention.


It stopped my bloating last time anyway , Il prob go with 25mcg straight off this time starting tomorrow, i use a 200mcg of t4 ed anyway.


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## Benchbum (Apr 20, 2011)

Perminatly use the t4 or just on cycle?


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## Andrewgenic (Jul 5, 2010)

Interesting this one, i have heard a few folk mention using t3 on a tren cycle. I am personally very wary of thyroid drugs as there is a history of thyroid problems in our family (yes, i know aas have an effect on the thyroid too).

Got to be honest i know nothing about t3 really whats the protocol?


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## need2bodybuild (May 11, 2011)

Just added 50mcg t3 to my diet and been using tren for 10 weeks now. Look foward to the faster fatloss with it and if my thyroid was slowed down, it certainly will be running fast now!


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

Trenbolone has a negative effect on natural levels of t3 hormone, so its always good to run around 25/50mcg during a cycle of trenbolone, and this increases the nutrient partitioning effect that tren has, by adding in the t3 as not only does the tren then increase the rate of which nutrients are absorbed but also the rate at which their broken down...

T3 and Tren should always be ran together

I run 25mcg of t3 every cycle I do along with Proviron at 25mcg.


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## Venom (Feb 17, 2014)

Dead lee said:


> Started my parabolan today and just looking over the alpha pharma leaflet and i noticed the paragraph stating to use t3 at 25mcg throughout a trenbolone treatment ( something that iv read many times before on the net)
> 
> *The last few tren cycles i have noticed a drop in metabolism at week 4-5 *mainly bloating as if what i was eating is now to much for my body to deal with so added t3 , my personally opinion is that its needed for me but maybe not everyone.


Drop in metabolism on Tren?

Tren increases your ability to absorb nutrients from food. It's not a decrease in metabolism, just increased nutrient efficiency.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Benchbum said:


> Perminatly use the t4 or just on cycle?


Permanently for now , last two bloods t4 came in below normal could be from GH so I started 200 mcg and now it's mid range


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Venom said:


> Drop in metabolism on Tren?
> 
> Tren increases your ability to absorb nutrients from food. It's not a decrease in metabolism, just increased nutrient efficiency.


What's the use of t3 for with tren then?


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## Venom (Feb 17, 2014)

Dead lee said:


> What's the use of t3 for with tren then?


The same as if you're not on Tren. A boost in metabolism.


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## Benchbum (Apr 20, 2011)

I was lead to believe that tren interferes with the conversion of t4-t3...


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Venom said:


> The same as if you're not on Tren. A boost in metabolism.


It states on the leaflet a decrease in t3 production which would point to a drop in metabolism which is what I notice I certainly don't get an increase, as I count my calories.


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## TrenFury (Jun 8, 2009)

I always use 25MCG T3 before bed, empty stomach.

Works very well with low-medium dose of tren. Prevents gyno and slow down of metabolism. I think it's all you need.

50MCG will usually makes me flat.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Started 50mcg d hacks today was going to do 25 mcg but the splitting of the tab didn't go well and ended up doing it all

Was sweating more than normal doing fasted cardio , and had trouble sleeping last night which seems a bit early to me


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

Is it best to dose T3 all in one go or split it AM/PM?


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## Boshlop (Apr 1, 2012)

Dead lee said:


> Started 50mcg d hacks today was going to do 25 mcg but the splitting of the tab didn't go well and ended up doing it all
> 
> Was sweating more than normal doing fasted cardio , and had trouble sleeping last night which seems a bit early to me


if the tren drops the production like you state, going from below normal to above average might make it have them effects a lot quicker then just going from average to above. bit like drinking on an empty stomach


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

TrenFury said:


> I always use 25MCG T3 before bed, empty stomach.
> 
> Works very well with low-medium dose of tren. Prevents gyno and slow down of metabolism. I think it's all you need.
> 
> 50MCG will usually makes me flat.


I normally take mine in the morning at least 30 mins before food or before fasted training , do you mean prolactin gyno ?


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)

realgains89 said:


> Trenbolone has a negative effect on natural levels of t3 hormone


Got any studies to back up your claim? Strong bro science imho. Any effect tren has on natural T3 production is negligable and the human body produces approx 25mcg of T3 per day anyway.

Remember alpha "pharma" is not actually real Pharma grade in the sense of organon ect. and therefore can put any BS they want on their labels in order to increase sales.


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## TrenFury (Jun 8, 2009)

Dead lee said:


> I normally take mine in the morning at least 30 mins before food or before fasted training , do you mean prolactin gyno ?


Yes prolactin gyno Lee.

Also, i take at night because i feel it prevents fat gain during night and speeds up metabolismo even more. In the morning i do cardio so it speeds up naturally.


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## Venom (Feb 17, 2014)

TrenFury said:


> Yes prolactin gyno Lee.
> 
> Also, i take at night because i feel it prevents fat gain during night and speeds up metabolismo even more. In the morning i do cardio so it speeds up naturally.


LOL. Fat gain during the night?

Also, T3 has a half life of 1 day so it won't make much of a difference. Calories in vs calories out, meal timing mostly irrelevant. Just comes down to *consistency*.


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## TrenFury (Jun 8, 2009)

I feel the difference, and i like the results. Yes, i am sure t3 at night makes sucks any carbs down that i might overeated.

Also i think it makes tren cycles work way better.

you should definitely try.


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## LeVzi (Nov 18, 2013)

First i've ever heard of T3 being needed while using tren.

Tren can be run on it's own, and tren helps increase liposis (However it's spelt) which is the increase in which fat is burned.

I'd only throw in T3 or such like if I was using Tren on a cut.

I am bulking on Tren and it just makes it a lot more of a lean bulk imo.


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

SickCurrent said:


> Got any studies to back up your claim? Strong bro science imho. Any effect tren has on natural T3 production is negligable and the human body produces approx 25mcg of T3 per day anyway.
> 
> Remember alpha "pharma" is not actually real Pharma grade in the sense of organon ect. and therefore can put any BS they want on their labels in order to increase sales.


trenbolone lowers the thyroid function somehow, its practically fact, I've had bloods and my t3 levels have dropped out of normal range and borderline hypothyroidism... as did 2 of my pals who also had blood, no bro science here, just someone who's a little more educated on this use of this drug then you are... so yeh man, BRO SCIENCE...

And I forgot to mention, tren hasn't got any studies, all the information we find out about tren has to be taught through use until, human studies are taken. only studies they have is on cows.

Twice I've taken tren each time my thyroid dropped to borderline or under normal range, and like I said above 2 of my pals experienced the very same thing and posted up on this forum mentioning about it


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## TrenFury (Jun 8, 2009)

Also, a lot of sources say t3 at 25mcg it's usefull in all cycles for gaining mass and do not gain fat during the proccess.


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## Venom (Feb 17, 2014)

TrenFury said:


> Also, a lot of sources say t3 at 25mcg it's usefull in all cycles for gaining mass and do not gain fat during the proccess.


Don't mean to sound rude, but you have a lot to learn mate. There is no magic pill or drug that will prevent fat gain. It's all maths, calories in vs calories out.

i.e. If your maintenance is 3000 calories and you're intaking 5000 calories with some T3, you will gain fat regardless of the drug you're on.


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## bigjohnc (Apr 10, 2014)

This theory of using T3 with tren comes from claims that tren reduces your natural t3 (that's not exactly what we are debating here so I won't get into it too much but what I will say is I can bulk and stay lean on tren and I can get shredded when I cut on it without T3 so make of that what you will).

So if the question is do you NEED to use T3 on tren I would say no in my experience. However T3 is a good fat burner and makes a nice addition to any cutting cycle.


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## TrenFury (Jun 8, 2009)

Venom said:


> Don't mean to sound rude, but you have a lot to learn mate. There is no magic pill or drug that will prevent fat gain. It's all maths, calories in vs calories out.
> 
> i.e. If your maintenance is 3000 calories and you're intaking 5000 calories with some T3, you will gain fat regardless of the drug you're on.


You don't sound rude at all lol internet discussions don't leave me stressed out, but it's obvious we are not in sintony  .

Why do we use performance enhance drugs? Enhance our physique, adding t3, can help any cycle without using higher doses.

I have some knowledge on the subject competed several times and i leave you a photo of yesterday. You can look for my cycle if you want  nuff said.


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## Venom (Feb 17, 2014)

TrenFury said:


> You don't sound rude at all lol internet discussions don't leave me stressed out, but it's obvious we are not in sintony  .
> 
> Why do we use performance enhance drugs? Enhance our physique, adding t3, can help any cycle without using higher doses.


Well obviously the 25mcg T3 will increase your metabolism SLIGHTLY, but It's not going to make much of a difference, if ANY, to body composition regardless if you take it or not.


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## TrenFury (Jun 8, 2009)

your opinion mate, i've tried both and the difference is big. cheers


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## Venom (Feb 17, 2014)

TrenFury said:


> your opinion mate, i've tried both and the difference is big. cheers


If it works for you, go for it. Just saying 25mcg is nothing, it's the same amount your body produces so all you're doing is replacing your natural T3 levels.


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## Benchbum (Apr 20, 2011)

Unless tren has reduced your natural levels and your bringing your self back in to range.


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## adpolice (Oct 27, 2011)

According to my endo all androgens especially on high doses will slow somewhat the thyroid gland...I got bloods and my TSH was on the high end only on testosterone(750mg per week)Same also thing happened to my friend


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

We can get by with low levels of thyroid and be totally unaware and not actually be affected by it a great deal , iv had my own problems with low t4 which iv known about for over a year due to testing and gave very little problems until February my hands were just freezing cold and i just couldn't warm up i decided to self medicate my own t4 dose at 200mcg which cured it (iv got tests at various doses), iv also been using HGH and peptides for nearly two years and is known to lower t4 levels in some.

I think the fact that the alpha leaflet recommends to do 25mcg is just to maintain a healthy thyroid level and not for some magic fat burning or amazing gains to begin , it would be better to have a fully active thyroid to get the best out of a tren cycle and for all other health benefits, there are many problems with an under active thyroid that have nothing to do with with metabolism

Its not a study but still i think its pretty good and relevant and just gives an idea that its not all to do with metabolism

http://www.health.com/health/gallery/0,,20723100,00.html


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)

realgains89 said:


> just someone who's a little more educated on this use of this drug then you are


How the fcuk would you know cheeky little cnut? I was running tren when u were still in nappys son!

u mad?


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

SickCurrent said:


> How the fcuk would you know cheeky little cnut? I was running tren when u were still in nappys son!
> 
> u mad?


How the fcuk would you know cheeky little cnut? one sec whilst I repeat this... "How the fcuk would you know cheeky little cnut".... Well first off you bellend, I already mentioned I've ran tren twice before, and had bloods each time and thyroids have came back below average both times... then 2 of my pals who've also ran it have had the very same issue in bloods, Now? what does you running cycles when I was in nappys have to do with fcuk all? anyone can just stick juice into themselves you complete and utter moron. its not some sort of fancy Chinese art which makes you more knowledgeable on what its doing to you on the inside... so you stupid useless man, with your petty little charv quote, **** off.


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)

realgains89 said:


> How the fcuk would you know cheeky little cnut? one sec whilst I repeat this... "How the fcuk would you know cheeky little cnut".... Well first off you bellend, I already mentioned I've ran tren twice before, and had bloods each time and thyroids have came back below average both times... then 2 of my pals who've also ran it have had the very same issue in bloods, Now? what does you running cycles when I was in nappys have to do with fcuk all? anyone can just stick juice into themselves you complete and utter moron. its not some sort of fancy Chinese art which makes you more knowledgeable on what its doing to you on the inside... so you stupid useless man, with your petty little charv quote, **** off.


So you can provide no studies to back up your total bullsh1t claim about tren and T3 but you and your "bro's" havs decided its the case. Thats called bro science son 

You ran tren twice WOW! what a steroid guru!

Enjoy the T3 rebound btw


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Here's a study for deca

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/16531893/


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

SickCurrent said:


> So you can provide no studies to back up your total bullsh1t claim about tren and T3 but you and your "bro's" havs decided its the case. Thats called bro science son
> 
> You ran tren twice WOW! what a steroid guru!
> 
> Enjoy the T3 rebound btw


Okay, so studies would usually include placebo? and actual test studies on individual people correct? well me and my 2pals, who've ran tren each time have noticed a drop in in thyroid function when we've had bloods, so whats so hard to understand? are can your small little head not come to terms that 3people who've ran trenbolone more than once seem to have quite a commonly noted side effect on tren whilst running it? i think you need to get your head out your ass, and stop being such a stuck up ponce, i'm a fairly nice person, but you sir are both arrogant, pig headed, and got a massive attitude problem.

- My wife told me to say that end part.


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## spardaa (Dec 22, 2013)

quick question about T3. (don't mean to hi-jack thread)

1) if you're deciding to take T3 with the tren in order to replace what you would theoretically loose out on. Surely when you come off the tren and T3, you are now in a worse position as you have to recover from the harsh effects of tren, and your thyroid must recover from the T3? (it is known that exogenous T3 will shut down your own)

2) A lot of people say the shut down of T3 is over exaggerated. I can slightly attest to this as i have recently ran T3 for 14 weeks and when i tapered off, the effects weren't actually all that bad. And i feel i recovered fine within 1-2 weeks. However, i just wanted to ask how much time people recommend to take off between T3 cycles?

---please correct me if i'm wrong. (if anybody knows some other good threads on UKM about this please let me know)


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

spardaa said:


> quick question about T3. (don't mean to hi-jack thread)
> 
> 1) if you're deciding to take T3 with the tren in order to replace what you would theoretically loose out on. Surely when you come off the tren and T3, you are now in a worse position as you have to recover from the harsh effects of tren, and your thyroid must recover from the T3? (it is known that exogenous T3 will shut down your own)
> 
> ...


I also recover from t3 after the first 1-2weeks, and this is blood work which backs this up, so yeah i believe from my individual point of view, t3 is a very easy drug to recover from, however i say specifically INDIVIDUAL, some people can get issues but very rarely from my knowledge... well think of it this way, if trenbolone is already having a negative effect on your thyroid, you may aswell just shut it down and run t3 anyhow, then when you come off the tren and the t3 it just recovers normally as if like any other normal t3 cycle.


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## DutchTony (Sep 25, 2011)

Interesting stuff here


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)

realgains89 said:


> Okay, so studies would usually include placebo? and actual test studies on individual people correct? well me and my 2pals, who've ran tren each time have noticed a drop in in thyroid function when we've had bloods, so whats so hard to understand? are can your small little head not come to terms that 3people who've ran trenbolone more than once seem to have quite a commonly noted side effect on tren whilst running it? i think you need to get your head out your ass, and stop being such a stuck up ponce, i'm a fairly nice person, but you sir are both arrogant, pig headed, and got a massive attitude problem.
> 
> - My wife told me to say that end part.


I've run tren 100's of times without T3 and IME running T3 at a proper high dose e.g 100-120mcg ed for 6 weeks and the drop in strength it causes is just not justifiable in addition to muscle loss regardless of running high dose androgens concurrently.

This purpose of this thread clearly seems to be planting the seed that T3 must be run alongside tren which is a load of bollox fact!

@realgains89

A. Do you even lift?

B. Are you affiliated with alpha pharma?

C. Does your wife wear the trousers?

sICKC


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

SickCurrent said:


> I've run tren 100's of times without T3 and IME running T3 at a proper high dose e.g 100-120mcg ed for 6 weeks and the drop in strength it causes is just not justifiable in addition to muscle loss regardless of running high dose androgens concurrently.
> 
> This purpose of this thread clearly seems to be planting the seed that T3 must be run alongside tren which is a load of bollox fact!
> 
> ...


Because you ran tren without t3 '100's' of times which i doubt doesnt mean you wouldnt have had low t3 levels as you werent tested.. or were you?

The thread is a debate with others chipping in , im sure people can make there own minds up the fact that its a load of bollox is your opinion.


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)

Dead lee said:


> Because you ran tren without t3 '100's' of times which i doubt doesnt mean you wouldnt have had low t3 levels as you werent tested.. or were you?
> 
> The thread is a debate with others chipping in , im sure people can make there own minds up the fact that its a load of bollox is your opinion.


Hi there you must be realgains89 wife! pleased to meet you madam 

sICKc


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## SickCurrent (Sep 19, 2005)

realgains89 said:


> but you sir are both arrogant, pig headed, and got a massive attitude problem.
> 
> - My wife told me to say that end part.


Lol funny thing is shes actually spot on there mate lol. That pretty much sums me up tbh.

Ok lettuce be cereal. If one prefers to run T3 with tren then by all means do but at least run 50mcg so your getting a performance enhancing effect and not just what most ppls bodies can do naturally [i.e 25mcg]

Don't stay on T3 too long and its best practice to taper off also to avoid thyriod issues afterwards [will not effect everyone in this way as @Dead lee has already said]

That said the quality and fat burning effectiveness of the "nouveau" stims [which didn't exist 10 years ago] but are available nowadays such as DMAA etc. is outstanding imhe and pretty much makes more nasty fatburners [in terms of their physiological effects] like T3 and DNP redundant imo.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

SickCurrent said:


> Hi there you must be realgains89 wife! pleased to meet you madam
> 
> sICKc


I don't do handbags mate.


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

SickCurrent said:


> I've run tren 100's of times without T3 and IME running T3 at a proper high dose e.g 100-120mcg ed for 6 weeks and the drop in strength it causes is just not justifiable in addition to muscle loss regardless of running high dose androgens concurrently.
> 
> This purpose of this thread clearly seems to be planting the seed that T3 must be run alongside tren which is a load of bollox fact!
> 
> ...


I thought it was common sense that if a man ever got married it was the woman who wore the pants? otherwise what man in their right mind would ever do a thing like that? LOL


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

SickCurrent said:


> Lol funny thing is shes actually spot on there mate lol. That pretty much sums me up tbh.
> 
> Ok lettuce be cereal. If one prefers to run T3 with tren then by all means do but at least run 50mcg so your getting a performance enhancing effect and not just what most ppls bodies can do naturally [i.e 25mcg]
> 
> ...


Tapering off t3 makes no difference at all. and this is a completely different subject, the subject began you telling me what i said about thyroid function on tren to be bro science... not the educational usage of T3... :S make your mind up.


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## spardaa (Dec 22, 2013)

realgains89 said:


> I also recover from t3 after the first 1-2weeks, and this is blood work which backs this up, so yeah i believe from my individual point of view, t3 is a very easy drug to recover from, however i say specifically INDIVIDUAL, some people can get issues but very rarely from my knowledge... well think of it this way, if trenbolone is already having a negative effect on your thyroid, you may aswell just shut it down and run t3 anyhow, then when you come off the tren and the t3 it just recovers normally as if like any other normal t3 cycle.


fantastic - good to know  as i didnt do blood just for T3 haha.

-any recommendations for time off T3? as a general rule of thumb i would assume time off = time on? As is the case with AAS?


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## realgains89 (May 10, 2014)

spardaa said:


> fantastic - good to know  as i didnt do blood just for T3 haha.
> 
> -any recommendations for time off T3? as a general rule of thumb i would assume time off = time on? As is the case with AAS?


I always give my body the same time off as i had on + and extra 6weeks or more... just to make sure.


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## spardaa (Dec 22, 2013)

realgains89 said:


> I always give my body the same time off as i had on + and extra 6weeks or more... just to make sure.


thanks for the confirmation brother


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## Selim (Nov 4, 2014)

Benchbum said:


> Unless tren has reduced your natural levels and your bringing your self back in to range.


Hey adpolice, I'm new here I live in Greece to, I just want to know about increlex a product you have used thanks


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## bumont (Aug 18, 2012)

Regardless of if you're on tren or not I think T3 is useful in any cycle. I use between 50-100mcg on a bulk or cut. So many benefits from it, my body composition is overall much leaner and it's incredibly difficult to gain fat even on high calories. The downside is that if you slack on your carbs you'll flatten out massively. The difference between my physique when I had a day of good eating vs not eating enough the next day is drastic, although it's easy as anything to drop fat on 100mcg T3 you really have to push the calories to grow.


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## Bmw-Freak (Mar 13, 2013)

Chronic administration of anabolic andr... - PubMed Mobile - NCBI

Growth hormone, insulin, prolactin and total thyroxine in the plasm... - PubMed - NCBI

And yeah i know its animal studies but you wont find many human studies done with Tren.


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## gcortese (Jan 12, 2013)

Bmw-Freak said:


> Chronic administration of anabolic andr... - PubMed Mobile - NCBI
> 
> Growth hormone, insulin, prolactin and total thyroxine in the plasm... - PubMed - NCBI
> 
> And yeah i know its animal studies but you wont find many human studies done with Tren.


Many? I dont think there is a single one mate


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## Bmw-Freak (Mar 13, 2013)

Bmw-Freak said:


> Chronic administration of anabolic andr... - PubMed Mobile - NCBI
> 
> Growth hormone, insulin, prolactin and total thyroxine in the plasm... - PubMed - NCBI
> 
> And yeah i know its animal studies but you wont find many human studies done with Tren.


There is probaly a few old studies with little to no info, but today no way there will ever be that kind of human studies it would be unethical.


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## iamyou (Oct 29, 2012)

What bloods should I get to see if this is true or not? Is T3 enough? I'll get the results on the same day. Been on tren a for almost 5 weeks now.


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## sgtsniff (Feb 4, 2012)

Bmw-Freak said:


> There is probaly a few old studies with little to no info, but today no way there will ever be that kind of human studies it would be unethical.


Errm I'm sure there would be a few willing participants on this forum.


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## Bmw-Freak (Mar 13, 2013)

iamyou said:


> What bloods should I get to see if this is true or not? Is T3 enough? I'll get the results on the same day. Been on tren a for almost 5 weeks now.


Well if you didnt know your blood levels pre using tren, blood test is off very little use. lets say you had a high metabolism and the tren lovered it a littl the blood test would then show you have a normal metabolism.. but again if you have a suspiscion that your metabolism is sluggish get the blood test and then decide.


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## Bmw-Freak (Mar 13, 2013)

sgtsniff said:


> Errm I'm sure there would be a few willing participants on this forum.


Deff. i know of several people that would voluntere.. but i dont think the medical community would accept it.


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## iamyou (Oct 29, 2012)

Bmw-Freak said:


> Well if you didnt know your blood levels pre using tren, blood test is off very little use. lets say you had a high metabolism and the tren lovered it a littl the blood test would then show you have a normal metabolism.. but again if you have a suspiscion that your metabolism is sluggish get the blood test and then decide.


Not exactly pre tren but a few years ago I had everything related to my thyroid done and no problems were found. I have blasted and cruised constantly after that though. No hypo symptoms at the moment though, but this thread got me curious. Personally I don't buy it.


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## Bmw-Freak (Mar 13, 2013)

iamyou said:


> Not exactly pre tren but a few years ago I had everything related to my thyroid done and no problems were found. I have blasted and cruised constantly after that though. No hypo symptoms at the moment though, but this thread got me curious. Personally I don't buy it.


Well if it was me and i the possibility i would get i done deff. the test should include TSH, T4 and T3 levels.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Bmw-Freak said:


> Chronic administration of anabolic andr... - PubMed Mobile - NCBI
> 
> Growth hormone, insulin, prolactin and total thyroxine in the plasm... - PubMed - NCBI
> 
> And yeah i know its animal studies but you wont find many human studies done with Tren.


Two good studies both backing the claim up


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Still on 50mcg since i started the thread , worked my way up to 5000 cals ed since mid august just on 250mg test e PW for nearly 2 moths still putting away 5000 cals and never eaten as much and held my weight & BF, the worrying thing is i dont want to come off the t3 as it gives me to much calorie freedom.


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## infraredline (Mar 20, 2014)

How specifically does Tren screw up T3? Is it like GH where is speeds up conversion of T4 to T3 or does it prevent T4 from converting to T3?


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

infraredline said:


> How specifically does Tren screw up T3? Is it like GH where is speeds up conversion of T4 to T3 or does it prevent T4 from converting to T3?


You want to look at the first study which measures the free t4 this is whats available to be converted to t3 and showed a decrease in the deca administration.

The second study doesnt mention free t4 but measures total t4 which shows a 45% decrease , 80% of t3 is produced from t4

[Thyroxine (T4) and tri-iodothyronine (T3) determinations: techniqu... - PubMed - NCBI

Again these aren't humans studies, the first is a rat study they use rats for many different reasons but there biological and other characteristics closely resemble humans and not just used because there rats.


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## Guest (Nov 5, 2014)

Tren, T3 and carbs = ruined mattress for me. Bet I lose a litre in sweat a night at least.


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

sgtsniff said:


> Errm I'm sure there would be a few willing participants on this forum.


Me


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## HDU (Jul 27, 2012)

I don't see how all you's get sweats on Tren, I get them like a few times a day when I'm sweating my ass of but that's it lol and ofc the insane aggression and sex drive


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## Bmw-Freak (Mar 13, 2013)

HDU said:


> I don't see how all you's get sweats on Tren, I get them like a few times a day when I'm sweating my ass of but that's it lol and ofc the insane aggression and sex drive


Tren is a very diff. beast for everyone, also depending on what you stack it with and how your diet is. Som people lose all sexdrive on tren while others get and insane sex drive etc.


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## 31205 (Jan 16, 2013)

HDU said:


> I don't see how all you's get sweats on Tren, I get them like a few times a day when I'm sweating my ass of but that's it lol and ofc the insane aggression and sex drive


Don't know how you lot get sweats off tren, I get them a few times a day when I'm sweating my ass off??

I don't get it?


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## infraredline (Mar 20, 2014)

Dead lee said:


> You want to look at the first study which measures the free t4 this is whats available to be converted to t3 and showed a decrease in the deca administration.
> 
> The second study doesnt mention free t4 but measures total t4 which shows a 45% decrease , 80% of t3 is produced from t4
> 
> ...


So then wouldn't supplementation with T4 be more beneficial since it is T4 that is decreasing, likely due to an increase in conversion to T3?


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

infraredline said:


> So then wouldn't supplementation with T4 be more beneficial since it is T4 that is decreasing, likely due to an increase in conversion to T3?


Possibly but trying to dose t4 is far more difficult than t3, while the leaflet state 25mcg t3 personally i use 50mcg this makes sure your have enough t3 available and more than a replacement dose but 25 mcg is closer to what would be classed as a replacement dose but then again it may not be.


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## Pictor (Jan 10, 2011)

Spawn of Haney said:


> Tren, T3 and carbs = ruined mattress for me. Bet I lose a litre in sweat a night at least.


I've gone through x3 pillows on my current cycle, ended up buying some cheap x2 for £10 jobs from asda lol, will replace the decent one once I'm off the tren and t3


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## spardaa (Dec 22, 2013)

Dead lee said:


> Still on 50mcg since i started the thread , worked my way up to 5000 cals ed since mid august just on 250mg test e PW for nearly 2 moths still putting away 5000 cals and never eaten as much and held my weight & BF, the worrying thing is i dont want to come off the t3 as it gives me to much calorie freedom.


-dude when you say your on 50mcg T3 is that dhacks?

-also i wanted to ask if that is in addition to your T4? Am i correct in saying you take Bitiron 62.5mcg tabs? so to get the 200mcg T4 you would take 4 of those tabs which would already give you 50mcg T3?

-Do you think any more than 50mcg of T3 while cruising on 250mg Test E per week would be detrimental? ie the test not providing enough anabolism to counter act the T3's catabolism.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

spardaa said:


> -dude when you say your on 50mcg T3 is that dhacks?
> 
> -also i wanted to ask if that is in addition to your T4? Am i correct in saying you take Bitiron 62.5mcg tabs? so to get the 200mcg T4 you would take 4 of those tabs which would already give you 50mcg T3?
> 
> -Do you think any more than 50mcg of T3 while cruising on 250mg Test E per week would be detrimental? ie the test not providing enough anabolism to counter act the T3's catabolism.


Im using alpha pharma t3, the t4 was dosed separately , i dropped the t4 last weekend to try a t3 only run to compare, i would only use separates and i wouldn't use over 100mcg t4 with 50mcg of t3 i dont think there's any need for more

I played with 75- 100mcg t3 with the t4 for a while a few weeks back and thought there was no difference worth while continuing in fact i seemed to lose appetite food didn't seem to be burning so fast and switched back to 50mcg.

I think you could easily take more t3 as long as your eating enough


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## infraredline (Mar 20, 2014)

Dead lee said:


> Possibly but trying to dose t4 is far more difficult than t3, while the leaflet state 25mcg t3 personally i use 50mcg this makes sure your have enough t3 available and more than a replacement dose but 25 mcg is closer to what would be classed as a replacement dose but then again it may not be.


Yeah no I feel ya, definitely simpler to just take 25-50mcg of T3


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## Hashtagmachine (Nov 2, 2014)

Any know what to do agains the sweating from T3, 25mcg is enough to make me sweat all day when I have to do anything that makes my heart rate goes up. Think I cant handle the T3 side's becouse of the sweat.


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## infraredline (Mar 20, 2014)

Hashtagmachine said:


> Any know what to do agains the sweating from T3, 25mcg is enough to make me sweat all day when I have to do anything that makes my heart rate goes up. Think I cant handle the T3 side's becouse of the sweat.


I would say maybe try T4, since it is milder than T3 you may feel more comfortable. But as mentioned earlier it's definitely trickier to pin point T4 since everyone is so different. For example, I take 60mcg of T4 and feel great, but if I take 100mcg I feel like garbage, yet 100mcg is considered pretty low for T4 dosing. So take that for what it's worth


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## Hashtagmachine (Nov 2, 2014)

infraredline said:


> I would say maybe try T4, since it is milder than T3 you may feel more comfortable. But as mentioned earlier it's definitely trickier to pin point T4 since everyone is so different. For example, I take 60mcg of T4 and feel great, but if I take 100mcg I feel like garbage, yet 100mcg is considered pretty low for T4 dosing. So take that for what it's worth


oke thanks mate. Ill take a look at it


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## Elvis82 (Mar 23, 2012)

I'm



realgains89 said:


> trenbolone lowers the thyroid function somehow, its practically fact, I've had bloods and my t3 levels have dropped out of normal range and borderline hypothyroidism... as did 2 of my pals who also had blood, no bro science here, just someone who's a little more educated on this use of this drug then you are... so yeh man, BRO SCIENCE...
> 
> And I forgot to mention, tren hasn't got any studies, all the information we find out about tren has to be taught through use until, human studies are taken. only studies they have is on cows.
> 
> Twice I've taken tren each time my thyroid dropped to borderline or under normal range, and like I said above 2 of my pals experienced the very same thing and posted up on this forum mentioning about it


Quick question mate, you say your t3 levels were low after tren, did you also notice a rise in your TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone)? I had mine checked about 2 years ago and TSH was 2.6, I recently did a tren cycle and 8 weeks after cycle had a full blood test and my TSH is 4.0, top end of normal. Just wondering whether to be concerned and get my thyroid fully checked or if high TSH is common after tren. My morning body temp is also low at around 96.5 deg which can happen in some people but can also relate to thyroid.

I'll be getting TSH checked again in a few weeks anyway to check any fluctuations just thought Id ask after seeing your post.


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Elvis82 said:


> I'm
> 
> Quick question mate, you say your t3 levels were low after tren, did you also notice a rise in your TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone)? I had mine checked about 2 years ago and TSH was 2.6, I recently did a tren cycle and 8 weeks after cycle had a full blood test and my TSH is 4.0, top end of normal. Just wondering whether to be concerned and get my thyroid fully checked or if high TSH is common after tren. My morning body temp is also low at around 96.5 deg which can happen in some people but can also relate to thyroid.
> 
> I'll be getting TSH checked again in a few weeks anyway to check any fluctuations just thought Id ask after seeing your post.


You need the t4 test as well, do you have that if not ask for it to be done the same time.


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## Elvis82 (Mar 23, 2012)

Dead lee said:


> You need the t4 test as well, do you have that if not ask for it to be done the same time.


When TSH was 2.6 my free thyroxine was 18. (Is that t4?). No other thyroid test were taken with the recent reading with TSH at 4.0. I've just spoke to the clinic though and they said they can check t3 and t4 next time i go if there is a reason to do so. Do you think this will cover all bases?

I'm just thrown with my morning temp being 96.4 deg when it's supposed to be 97.8 or above, although I know there are exceptions. Im a quite tired person in general but im pretty confident if I wanted to diet down Id be able to get the fat off ok, so I'm contradicting myself in certain ways.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

I'm never cycling anything without T3 again if I can help it :lol:


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## Elvis82 (Mar 23, 2012)

> I'm never cycling anything without T3 again if I can help it :lol:


How much mate? What's your experiences with vs without?


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Elvis82 said:


> How much mate? What's your experiences with vs without?


Well, I've not actually got a great deal of experience with cutting with it, in fact this is my first time and I'm currently low-dosing some leftover Bitiron tabs until I get some more delivered (some initial delays so getting it later than expected, coming from Mexico so still another 3ish weeks to wait..). But I've used it to bulk with several times and it's brilliant stuff tbh, I can eat way over what I'd normally eat and not gain any fat, whilst gaining more muscle than what I would otherwise which I believe to be down to increased PTOR (was eating 300-400g of protein a day). Generally run it at 75mcg a day on cycle, might go a bit higher during this cutting cycle. If it keeps fat off whilst eating so much then I imagine it'll help me lose fat :thumbup1:


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## UkWardy (Mar 30, 2014)

I'd always use t3 cutting or bulking


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## Dead lee (Jul 4, 2010)

Elvis82 said:


> When TSH was 2.6 my free thyroxine was 18. (Is that t4?). No other thyroid test were taken with the recent reading with TSH at 4.0. I've just spoke to the clinic though and they said they can check t3 and t4 next time i go if there is a reason to do so. Do you think this will cover all bases?
> 
> I'm just thrown with my morning temp being 96.4 deg when it's supposed to be 97.8 or above, although I know there are exceptions. Im a quite tired person in general but im pretty confident if I wanted to diet down Id be able to get the fat off ok, so I'm contradicting myself in certain ways.


Yes get t3 & t4 that will cover it, free thyroxine is t4, its pointless speculating till you have the test results but 18 is fine for t4 , you will know off that if there is a change

It may have recovered some by now.


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## Elvis82 (Mar 23, 2012)

Dead lee said:


> Yes get t3 & t4 that will cover it, free thyroxine is t4, its pointless speculating till you have the test results but 18 is fine for t4 , you will know off that if there is a change
> 
> It may have recovered some by now.


Thanks mate, I'll get it all checked in a couple of weeks and check any fluctuations.


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