# Belly getter bigger!!



## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I am really ****ed off with this. For the past few years I have a had a big belly with a slim frame.

I have started stronglifts and its worked (not on my belly though).

(My belly started at about 36 inches, now its 38 inches)

The belly is probably more to do with what I eat:

7am: 100g porridge + 300ml soya milk + protein drink

12pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice

6pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + protein drink

8pm: 2 x breaded fish fillets

11pm: 100g porridge + 300ml soya milk + protein drink

This roughly works out to 3000 calories.

Can someone tell me what I should change?


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## Frijiman (Nov 23, 2007)

The only thing i can think of mate is its the carbs. Try reducing 100g porridge to 75g porridge. 125g rice to 100g rice. see how you get on for a week.


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## Robbie (Dec 31, 2007)

100g of porridge before bed seems excessive!


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## adlewar (Oct 14, 2008)

what height/weight are you?

3000 calories is not over eating depending on the above........

do you do any form of cardio?

normally reducing calories by 300 a week till you find your losing the desired weight works, but 3000 is not excessive (i'm eating about 4500)but again depending on height/weight.cardio etc


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## Goose (Jan 29, 2009)

I wouldnt cut any calories. Have 65 grams of oats before bed and make up the other carbs in the meals during the day.

Introduce some PWO cardio, whilst maintaining calories you won't be sacrificing and muscle mass but the cardio will help with the bodyfat loss.


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## ParaManiac (Mar 20, 2007)

Diet is poor - lacking vital nutrients from fruit veg and efa's.

Gaps too long between meals

Excessive alcohol consumption?

What time do you train? what is your routine?


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## bigsteve1974 (Jun 4, 2008)

Frijiman said:


> The only thing i can think of mate is its the carbs. Try reducing 100g porridge to 75g porridge. 125g rice to 100g rice. see how you get on for a week.


that Sounds about right.....Why only 50gms of chicken..?

also is that 125 of cooked weight....?

Steve


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

7am: 100g porridge + 300ml soya milk + protein drink + 2 x Omega 3 6 9 caps

10am: protein drink

12pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + salad

3pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + protein drink+ salad

6pm: 2 x breaded fish fillets + salad <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>

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9pm 2 x breaded fish fillets + salad

11pm: protein drink<o></o>

<o></o>

This is what my diet looks like today. I have reduced the carbs but I will be upping my protein to compensate.<o></o>

I am 5'8" 78kg. I don't drink or smoke. Some online calculators suggest that I need 2300 calories to maintain body weight. But I am trying to increase body weight so I have upped calories to 3000. I do no cardio but I have been told not to do cardio so that I have more calories to increase body weight.<o></o>

This morning my partner said that my belly looked much smaller than yesterday and sure enough it was 37 inches. This leads me to believe that I consumed something that made my belly bloat a lot!!<o></o>

<o></o>

I reduced carbs by a bit to see if that will reduce my belly fat. I will also add a little bit of veg to my last 4 meals<o></o>

Should I sacrifice calories and do cardio?

What fruits should i eat?

I do a workout A and B routine which involves compound exercises only<o></o>


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## shorty (Mar 13, 2007)

i'd stick a protein shake inbetween 7am and 12... thats 5 hours without food... also fish oils / good fats and veg are lacking like para said... these are essential imo.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

7am: 150g porridge + 300ml soya milk (needs to be replaced) + protein drink + 2 x Omega 3 6 9 caps

10am: protein drink

12pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + salad

3pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + protein drink+ salad

6pm: 2 fish fillets + 1 boiled egg + salad

9pm: 1fish fillets + 2 boiled eggs + salad

11pm: protein drink + yoghurt

Equals to 3375 calories

Is this a better diet?


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## willsey4 (Apr 21, 2008)

Have you tried upping your cardio? Do some cardion on non workout days


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## hilly (Jan 19, 2008)

pras1011 said:


> 7am: 150g porridge + 300ml soya milk (needs to be replaced) + protein drink + 2 x Omega 3 6 9 caps
> 
> 10am: protein drink
> 
> ...


its is better but before bed get rid of the yogurt and add some natty peanut butter or nuts etc. take 12pm and 3pm meal rice down to 75 gram. takebreakfast porridge down to 75 g and add in 75g rice/sweet potatoe with with meal 6.

make sure rice is basmati or brown. soya milk is fine IMO get the unsweetned stuff.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Will: I was told not to do cardio as it will steal valuable calories from muscle building.

Hilly: I was trying push my entire carb intake to early on during the day. For some odd reason my belly bloats with carbs and I don't won't to go to sleep with a bloated belly!

Soya is horrible unsweetened. Shame that milk gives me the runs!!

7am: 150g porridge + 300ml soya milk (needs to be replaced) + protein drink + 2 x Omega 3 6 9 caps

10am: protein drink

12pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + salad

3pm: 200g chicken + 125g rice + protein drink+ salad

6pm: 2 Mackerel fillets + salad

9pm: 2 Mackerel fillets + salad

11pm: protein drink


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## invisiblekid (Jun 18, 2006)

pras1011 said:


> Will: I was told not to do cardio as it will steal valuable calories from muscle building.
> 
> Hilly: I was trying push my entire carb intake to early on during the day. For some odd reason my belly bloats with carbs and I don't won't to go to sleep with a bloated belly!
> 
> ...


What kind of fish is it? Unless it's Salmon or some other oily fish you have a near complete lack of EFAs in your diet. A diet devoid of EFAs can lead to fat gain.

Whoever told you not to do cardio is an idiot. I could understand his point if you were running for an hour at 170bmp, but what is a 30 min incline walk x 3 per week going to do other than good?

I'd still drop the yoghurt and add either fish oils or as previous stated natural peanut butter in your pre-bed shake.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I eat Mackerel which is loaded with EFAs (I think).

Could I go for a light 30 min jog 3 times per week?

I had bad stomach pain and I was throwing up after eating Nobby's Nuts and I haven't eaten any nuts since!


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## leeston (May 30, 2006)

pras, i wont comment in too much detail as it has been said above.

However, mackeral should be good for efas (subject to how it's cooked/stored etc). Try and have fish oils at other meals (or olive oil drizzled)

Jogging is going to burn muscle. Not sure of your goals but a steady/brisk walk or cross trainer for 30 mins may be better.

With regards nuts, keep them simple and plain. Not sure but are Nobby's nuts coated, excess oil or have salt on them???? Just get a plain pack of mixed nuts (from supermarket) and jobs a good 'ern.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

My goal is to build muscle. But I am adding 3 x 30 mins brisk walk on my days off.

The odd thing is that once I eat my 6pm mackerel meal, in about 1.5 hours later I am feeling hungry!


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I bought a 200g bag of nuts. Its says on the back that 100g will give 600 calories!!!!!

This seems a bit excessive to eat all 200g as I am already getting my good fats from the 300g worth of Mackerel.

Or could I drop more of the carbs and replace with nuts?


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## W4SIM (Jan 14, 2008)

Pras - Im stuck in a simliar situation as you mate, whereby my general frame is thin but theres a pot belly going on. I too was wondering if it was possible to build up my arms, chest, legs etc etc whilst losing my gut at the same time.

Reading on here i think its too tricky to be doing both things at once. So im trying to lose the gut first and then build it all up from there.

But hows it going for you anyways, any joy with losing the stomach?

The best way to burn fat is to do cardio, so dont stop that or keep that out.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I think the problem with losing the belly first is that 1) you might loose muscle therefore lowering metabolism 2) When you then start upping the calories to bulk up the body might regain the belly even quicker.


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## W4SIM (Jan 14, 2008)

pras1011 said:


> I think the problem with losing the belly first is that 1) you might loose muscle therefore lowering metabolism 2) When you then start upping the calories to bulk up the body might regain the belly even quicker.


There is a certain point to what your saying but the next time when i up the calories il be training the ABS aswell so hopefully the belly wont come back on. Or is that not how it works?

Coz having said that i have seen a few of my mates from a long time ago who were into their body buidling and had the proper figures back then. But looking at them now their arms, chests and legs were going great, however nearly all of them had a pot belly aswell. I just dont get it. :confused1:


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## Cymru (Apr 8, 2008)

I have this problem aswell. It's pretty much flat in the morning, but as soon as I start eating it starts to look bloated. I've been saying for ages that I'm going to start adding cardio to my routine along with abs and tva exercises, but I haven't got around to it yet :mellow:

I've read that 1 reason for looking bloated is that your abs aren't strong enough to stop the food from showing.


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## W4SIM (Jan 14, 2008)

Cymru said:


> I've read that 1 reason for looking bloated is that your abs aren't strong enough to stop the food from showing.


Well mine certainly arnt that strong at all, and i think there may be some truth in that coz first thing in the morning or when im hungary the belly doesnt look too bad, but after a meal it sticks out like a balloon. After a big meal i just look pregnant.

Iv started doing light exercises at home for about an hour and a half each day. This includes going around the local area on my bike for about half an hour, which i mainly use as a warm up routine. Then light work with dumbells and generally finish with some exercises for the core muscles, like 3 reps of the Plank etc.

Iv been doing it for about 2 weeks now and i can see small changes in my arms and shoulders but not anything on the belly, which is kind of frustrating really, but then i think i might be expecting a little too much for only 2 weeks. But i cant push myself too far either coz im suffering from Tennis Elbow, and now on the same side my shoulder is starting to get a pain aswell. :cursing:

I suggest you start adding cardio to your routine, it will make a difference in the way of fat burning. And whats TVA exercises? lol


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## Cymru (Apr 8, 2008)

W4SIM said:


> Well mine certainly arnt that strong at all, and i think there may be some truth in that coz first thing in the morning or when im hungary the belly doesnt look too bad, but after a meal it sticks out like a balloon. After a big meal i just look pregnant.
> 
> Iv started doing light exercises at home for about an hour and a half each day. This includes going around the local area on my bike for about half an hour, which i mainly use as a warm up routine. Then light work with dumbells and generally finish with some exercises for the core muscles, like 3 reps of the Plank etc.
> 
> ...


I don't know an awful lot about it myself to be honest. Just that they're exercises to strengthen your TVA (Transverse Abdominus). I copied this when it was posted in a thread a few months back, maybe someone will be able to elaborate abit more if you need some more info on it :thumbup1:



> Some core exercises, last two are TVA specific:
> 
> Ball Prone ISO Arm Lift:
> 
> ...


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## W4SIM (Jan 14, 2008)

Cymru said:


> I don't know an awful lot about it myself to be honest. Just that they're exercises to strengthen your TVA (Transverse Abdominus). I copied this when it was posted in a thread a few months back, maybe someone will be able to elaborate abit more if you need some more info on it :thumbup1:


Cheers mate, i get it now. :thumbup1:

They're just ABS exercises really, and which seem to be really good.


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

If your fat, you need to get rid of that before you decide to build muscle. I dont care what anyone says excess fat isnt needed to build muscle and if anyone wants to build muscle and cut down then their main aim should be to remove excess fat first. You wont bloat up again or any of that bollocks people tell you, and if loosing 30lbs of bodyfat means i have to sacrifice some muscle mass it wouldnt bother me one bit. The best way to bulk up is to get lean and stay lean. The more you yoyo the worse it is for your health.

Your eating far too many carbs, you dont need any cabs other than peri training for optimum muscle growth.

heres a typical meal plan which i would wave towards somone like you, or infact anyone whos not on gear.

meal 1:

10 oz steak (or an egg omlette with low fat cheese and lean ham)

1/4 cup brazil nuts

meal 2:

8 oz chicken

1/4 cup raw almonds

meal 3:

8 oz chicken

1/4 cup raw almonds

meal 4: post workout

50g whey

75g liquid carbs during and post training

1/4cup grapes

1 apple

meal 5:

2 organic turkey patties

5 fish oil tabs

meal 6:

50g whey

1/2 cup cottage cheese

1 tbsp olive oil

At any of those meals i urge you to stuff in lots of green veggies too as they have nearly zero carbs and calories in them.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Ok how about this:

7am: 50g porridge + 150 milk + protein drink + 2 x Omega 3 6 9 caps

10am: Nuts

12pm: 200g chicken + salad

3pm: 200g chicken + salad

5pm: Workout (PWO Protein drink and Lucozade)

6pm: 1 Mackerel fillet + salad

9pm: 1 Mackerel fillet + salad

11pm: protein drink

This works out to about 2450 calories which isn't enough!


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

Calories are only a measure of heat, i dont count my food in calories anymore as your body doesnt recognise them, it only recognises nutrients. Plus if your putting on fat the cut in calories will clearly help your growing gut. Your main aim should be to cut the fat from your belly, forget about eating ridiculour amounts of calories for now as fat loss should be your main goal first.

Try a lower calorie diet with more protein and efa's first to burn some flab. Try adding a few more clean calories to the mix if you think your not making progress with it. You also miss out the 3rd law of muscle which is post workout carbs:

7am: 50g porridge + 150 milk + 4 egg omlette w/low fat cheese and lean ham + 2 x Omega 3 6 9 caps

10am: protein drink + Nuts

12pm: 200g chicken + salad + nuts

3pm: 200g chicken + salad + nuts

5pm: Workout (PWO Protein drink and Lucozade)

6pm: 1 Mackerel fillet + salad + 1 apple + banana + 1/2 cup of grapes

9pm: 1 Mackerel fillet + salad + nuts

11pm: protein drink + cottage cheese + 1tbsp peanut butter mixed in a blender


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Thanks Dizzee.

Just realised that I maybe insulin resistant. The big belly with a slim body is a bit of a clue!! (My mum has diabetes but she doesn't take any medication for it.)

Hopefully this new low carb diet should bring it down.

Fruits have a lot of sugar. Can I still eat these these? Which fruits should i eat?

Which veggies should I eat or avoid?


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## W4SIM (Jan 14, 2008)

pras1011 said:


> Thanks Dizzee.
> 
> Just realised that I maybe insulin resistant.


errr . . . . can you explain how this works and how it affects weight control or shape? :confused1:

Coz im the same as you and there i have a family history of diabetes, but i didnt think i was affected by it.


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

pras1011 said:


> Thanks Dizzee.
> 
> Just realised that I maybe insulin resistant. The big belly with a slim body is a bit of a clue!! (My mum has diabetes but she doesn't take any medication for it.)
> 
> ...


As your insulin resistant, you want to minimise carbs to peri-training and upto 2 hours after training, as this is when your muscles will be able to make use on the carbs the most. Stay away from oatmeal and grains as these will just pack fat on you.

Id minimise fruit intake, stick to low GI fruits and rule out berries, citrus fruits and fruit juice. Obv the lower the GI the more it will fill you and the less its going to oveload you with carbs.

Any green veggie (except pulses ie peas, beans) will be fine for you as they are very low in carbs, stuff like carrots and coloured root veg you will have to check the GI rating for them before adding them to your diet.

Its also worth noting many people have whats called type 2 diabetes from eating carb heavy diets, i forget the statistic now but i think its something like 25-50% of over 30's have it but dont know about it.

Seeing as im only researching this to aid myself and not others, it might be worth having a word with a GP about seeing if you have type 2 diabetes and what you need to do to keep your blood sugar levels in check, as i dont want to advise you and then find out you collapsed lol.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I have noticed that I get hungry quickly after the protein meals.

Any Ideas?


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

Slam more fiberous foods into your meals like green veg, if you think your hungry - have a glass of water, take your mind off food and wait 15 minutes. If your still hungry then either eat more at your meal or have a handful of nuts to help fill you again (seeing as your bulking the extra calories wont kill you) if your not hungry then its just habit or boredom telling you to eat.


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2009)

the whole dont do cardio thing isnt true

i started out under that impression

some cardio actually helps muscle growth such as hiit training

i do it on a bike, just intervals of intensity, always nice after a heavy workout


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2009)

pras1011 said:


> I have noticed that I get hungry quickly after the protein meals.
> 
> Any Ideas?


high protein diets increase your metabolism by 30% average

food is digested quicker and your left feeling hungry lol

this is where my weakness is and junk food creeps in, but ive been good lately


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Thanks all. I do 3 x 1 hour brisk walks on my days off. I tried one session on HIIT (sprinting) but this made my legs too sore for my workouts!!

After eating a protein and veg meal I am hungry again in about 1 hour and then my cravings for sweeties and take-aways creep in. But thankfully I am resisting!!

On Tuesday morning (14/04/09) this week I weighed 77.2 kg and my belly was approx 37.5 inches. Today I am 75.5 kg and my belly is approx 35.5 inches.

What the hell is going on!!!????


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2009)

did you do hiit training post or pre weights?

you cna hiit training on just about anything, rowing cycling

im on the bike at the moment as ive always hated treadmill running

plus a nice sit down on a bike is good after a weight session lol

my legs did hurt first week, i think it was because i was using muscle fibres i dont normally use as it was more endurance training in a way


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2009)

pras1011 said:


> Thanks all. I do 3 x 1 hour brisk walks on my days off. I tried one session on HIIT (sprinting) but this made my legs too sore for my workouts!!
> 
> *After eating a protein and veg meal I am hungry again in about 1 hour and then my cravings for sweeties and take-aways creep in. But thankfully I am resisting!!*
> 
> ...


answered that above mate, is completely normal and a good sign

you could of been holding alot of water, scales might be broken lol

all else fails just use a mirror to check up on progress

i weigh myself every other month but use the mirror for regular checks


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Unfortunately I am weeing a lot too!! This could be caused by the excessive salt in the mackerel?

I did a sprint HIIT on my day off. I am on an excellent workout program (Stronglifts) which involves (amongst other things), doing squats for all three workouts per week.


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

Extra salt in a high protein diet actually helps protein synthesis, remember RDA's are set out by pen pushers who are probably 3 stone overweight anyway and havnt a clue about what a well exercised body needs to grow and maintain correctly.

I pee a lot too, but that because of the 3 litres of water i drink a day...

Your loosing weight, some of it will be water weight and some will be fat too, you will be suprised at how much body fat you loose through cutting out carbs.

As for HIIT training. The tempo you want to use is jog for 30 seconds, then sprint for 30 seconds. Do this for 10 minutes 3 times a week (preferably on your non training days, or at the very least in the mornings) and also try and include 3 sessions of NEPA (non exercise physical activity) such as walking for 30-45 minutes at a time to help burn excess fat.

You do need some cardio in your regime, but any more than 10-15 minutes at a time will switch off fat burning and begin to turn your body into a state of catabolysis, which we all know isnt any good so keep it short and sweet but make sure you work your ass off to hammer those fat deposits.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Excellent!

I will increase my cardio on my off days but I will take one day off from exercise.

I am currently eating approx 100g of carbs per day and approx 300g of protein per day.


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## BoomTime (Feb 19, 2009)

not that im an expert but you are having long breaks between meals could be that your body is going into a famin and holding onto the fats could be that?

try hvaing meals every 3 hours to keep metabolisam high and cravings at bay..

100g carbs a day is not really enough for bulking tbh


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Mattchew100 said:


> not that im an expert but you are having long breaks between meals could be that your body is going into a famin and holding onto the fats could be that?
> 
> try hvaing meals every 3 hours to keep metabolisam high and cravings at bay..
> 
> 100g carbs a day is not really enough for bulking tbh


I am trying to reduce carbs due to me possibly being insulin resistant.

I eat nuts between meals.


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

give it a week or 2 to see if the pangs subside, and if your still always feeling hungry up your protein a bit at meals and add yet more veg!

Also its not 100g of carbs its 150-200g of carbs peri training (50 before, 150 after), peri training is the time your body is most sensitive to insulin and consequently can use carbs to their full effect. Otherwise excess carbs in the day are just stored as fat, made even worse if the subject is insluin resistant.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

What is a pang? and what is a peri? Its a bit difficult to understand what you wrote.


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

A hunger pang is basically a sudden feeling of being hungry. IE your at work and havnt had anything to eat for a few hours then all of a sudden you feel hungry - thats a hunger pang. Some are false though, ie you have changed your diet - you may be physically full but if your used to eating a lot of junk food and carbs your body will still crave them and send out hunger pangs untill its adjusted to the change in diet.

Peri-training is basically the time before, during and after training. But its a well known fact to serious sports nutritionists and competitiors that the body is most sensive to insulin upto 2 hours after you train, liver glycogen levels are also depleted so this is the time where carbs play a massive part in your diet. Without getting too techinical, your body will absorb the excess carbs and protein these 2 hours after you train at an astronomical rate - if you take advantage of this by banging 150-200g of simple and some complex carbs into your body these will help fuel the accelerated muscle building and fat burning potential your body can acheive.

Its called the 3rd law of muscle, if you exploit it properly you will notice increased fat loss and extra muscle gains in a much shorter time than your used to.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I thought the word "pang" you used was actually meant to be "pain" and the word "peri" is meant to be "pre"!!!

I had the strongest cravings for something sweet after my workout yesterday. The worst yet. So I bought some flavoured water and that seemed to sort it!


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

Should have had some fruit or bottle of lucozade. Remember 150g of carbs after your workout so stuff like fruits and liquid carbs like lucozade are good for this.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

Dizzee said:


> Should have had some fruit or bottle of lucozade. Remember 150g of carbs after your workout so stuff like fruits and liquid carbs like lucozade are good for this.


How much carbs should I consume on rest days?


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## Dizzee (Mar 30, 2009)

Its upto you really, myself i wouldnt have any carbs - but if you do feel the need id go for 100g in the morning where liver glycogen levels are also depleted. Keep your calorie intake the same though so if you decide not to have carbs make sure you substitute them with extra protein and fats as a separate meal or in addition to other meals in the day.

Some people make the fatal mistake of eating less on none training days, but as rest days are where growth occurs you need to keep your calorie intake the same as a training day for optimal bulking. Where a low carb bulking diet differs from a low carb cutting diet is on a bulking diet your calorie intake remains the same on training and rest days, but on a cutting diet the calorie intake may drop 800-1000 calories on none training days.


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

But should my calorie intake be?


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## pras1011 (Apr 18, 2008)

I weigh 74 kg today and belly was about 35 inches. Its a major drop in weight but I think I do not smaller and I haven't lost (I think) any strength!


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