# Suspended from work



## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Hi guys,

As the title says I have been suspended from work today for excessive internet usage and also using a proxy hiding website.

I have suffered really badly from depression in the past and feel it happening all over again. I have a new baby and a new mortgage so I know what an idiot I have been.

I was told by my boss to expect the worst which I know means I am going to be fired after my hearing next week.

I planned to hand my resignation in before getting fired but my brother is urging me to fight it as its my first ever offence in 4 years and people have not been fired in the past for fighting/intimidation etc

Just after some opinions really especially if there are any HR guys on here..

Cheers


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## Sophocles (Mar 17, 2012)

Bad news mate, sorry to hear that. Not an HR guy but is there policies in place regarding internet usage etc? Have you been warned before? Most places would give you a warning over internet usage, depending on if it's affecting your job performance. What's the deal with the proxy hiding website?


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Gutted to hear mate. I would expect the worst to be honest but wouldnt resign, get searching for a new job immediately though. Bringing up the fact people have being sacked for things in the past will hold no merit in your hearing though.


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## Dai Jones (Dec 1, 2009)

Sorry to hear this mate I haven't got much advice but what sites have you been looking at? as long as its not porn I don't think they can do much, but now you've said this I better watch my usage to


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## madmuscles (Mar 10, 2011)

Maybe the company's doing badly as it's a recession and are looking for any stupid excuse to start getting rid of people without having to pay them off, as said above isn't there a warning scale? Ie, verbal, written then dismissal?


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## littlesimon (May 24, 2010)

Are you a Civil Servant mate?

They really throw the book at people for internet misuse.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

its the proxy hiding site that they are taking the most serious because it gets through their filters and they cant see what you have surfed, so in their eyes it could have been anything (I used it to read on here)

also they have proof of it effecting my work, so doesnt look good at all.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

there is a warning scale but some things can mean instant dismissal I believe


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## Mark_08 (Feb 15, 2012)

MutantX said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> As the title says I have been suspended from work today for excessive internet usage and also using a proxy hiding website.
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear that mate, I know its hard but keep positive until the verdict. Like others said, they surely have to give you some warning first?

I better watch out too as I am on the net around 5 hours a day but finish all my work and ask them for more which they dont give.


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## Super_G (Feb 20, 2012)

Unless you were on fabswingers, then you should be ok. If he tries to sack you, you can go down the wrongful dismissal line as they haven't followed procedures however it all does hinge on what site youv been on..porn, casual sex, animal sex, steroids etc will all fall under gross misconduct...really do hope it goes well for you buddy,


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## Tasty (Aug 28, 2007)

I've been sacked for being on UKM before :sad: I did have multiple warnings though.


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

if its affected your work and you know it has then in all honesty you should have known better IMO.

That said im sure the company would have to warn you before dismissal, IF it hadnt been for the proxy hiding site. Look at it from the employers eyes, you could have been doing anything from sharing sensitive business details to setting up a terrorist training camp! I know they are extreme situations, but its why the filters are in place to start with. Anyway mate, best of look at the hearing, hope you find some good luck on your side.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Gordie1876 said:


> Unless you were on fabswingers, then you should be ok. If he tries to sack you, you can go down the wrongful dismissal line as they haven't followed procedures however it all does hinge on what site youv been on..porn, casual sex, animal sex, steroids etc will all fall under gross misconduct...really do hope it goes well for you buddy,


they will probably find some steroid sites, fvck.


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## madmuscles (Mar 10, 2011)

Tasty said:


> I've been sacked for being on UKM before :sad: I did have multiple warnings though.


Really? Was it the internet usage or this actual site?


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## Sophocles (Mar 17, 2012)

MutantX said:


> its the proxy hiding site that they are taking the most serious because it gets through their filters and they cant see what you have surfed, so in their eyes it could have been anything (I used it to read on here)
> 
> also they have proof of it effecting my work, so doesnt look good at all.





MutantX said:


> there is a warning scale but some things can mean instant dismissal I believe


You've been there 4 years with no problems so I'd be tempted to stick with it, put your case that it was only this site you were accessing (just seen about the steroid sites too). They can choose to believe you or not. It depends how much your work has been affected too.

Are you a member of a Union? If so, they could advise and support you.

Sorry for you, mate, especially with a history of depression and a lot on your plate right now. Sometimes is does feel easier to walk away but then you have to get another job and references can be an issue.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

onthebuild said:


> if its affected your work and you know it has then in all honesty you should have known better IMO.
> 
> That said im sure the company would have to warn you before dismissal, IF it hadnt been for the proxy hiding site. Look at it from the employers eyes, you could have been doing anything from sharing sensitive business details to setting up a terrorist training camp! I know they are extreme situations, but its why the filters are in place to start with. Anyway mate, best of look at the hearing, hope you find some good luck on your side.


I am still pondering resigning before the hearing to be honest because there is only going to be 1 outcome


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## Bashy (Jun 16, 2010)

Bad news mate sorry to hear it, the proxy issue they will play balls with as in their minds you could have been on anything.

I assume you have no way of proving what sites you were visiting but even so Id be wary of directing them here, can just imagine them saying' Oh he has been looking at steroids etc'


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## Super_G (Feb 20, 2012)

Do not resign!! Then what if you can't find work? See the process out and if the worst comes and you get sacked, atleast youl be able to sign on. You wont get sacked though buddy, final warning or something like it


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## 2004mark (Oct 26, 2013)

How many people shit themselves when reading this thread :lol:


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## Sophocles (Mar 17, 2012)

Depending on where you work, you might get a final warning or some kind of probation or performance monitoring thing.


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

MutantX said:


> I am still pondering resigning before the hearing to be honest because there is only going to be 1 outcome


Definately dont resign mate. Looks bad on references, PROVES you have something to hide, and also it may be unnecessary. Stick with it, argue your side of it, and hope for the best, thats what i'd do. Worst comes to worst you need a new job, you'll need one anyway if you resign, so just see what happens.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

It only takes 1 sweep of the system from IT and your fvcked, learn from this guys because its not worth it.


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

MutantX said:


> It only takes 1 sweep of the system from IT and your fvcked, learn from this guys because its not worth it.


might be a longshot but could you try and explain that you had to use the proxy hiding site because you wanted to access something that would have been caught by the filter for the wrong reason? maybe something embarassing, that you didnt want to do at home incase the missus saw? eg 'S3X change' 'S3XUALLY transmitted infections' 'B00B job' 'PEN1S enlargement' etc etc. They surely couldnt fire you for looking up info on sex changes, however it explains why you needed the hiding site, and no-one would make that $hit up


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## Ahal84 (Jun 2, 2010)

Not sure if it's been mentioned previously. But that's an unfair dismissal, unless you have been warned before or if it's in your contract or that's their policy. And even if it's in their polices there are three stages to a dismissal: word, written and a final meeting (manager and HR). Challenge it.

I'll ask my partner as she used to work in HR for a long time.


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## Sharpiedj (Oct 24, 2011)

Mate don't resign wait to get sacked then fight it. If you resign you're not eligible for legal aid or benefits. You will probs get a discipline


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## Bashy (Jun 16, 2010)

Sharpiedj said:


> Mate don't resign wait to get sacked then fight it. If you resign you're not eligible for legal aid or benefits. You will probs get a discipline


I also agree you shouldnt resign but you can get benefits if you do, I thought this was the case when I left my old job and didnt claim anything as I thought I wasnt entitled but turns out you can now!!

Kind of explains this bloody leech culture tho


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## soob the dug (Apr 12, 2011)

hang in there mate.....dont resign


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

I can just imagine sitting in the hearing where they will list off all the stupid sites I've been on.

Such an idiot but like others I had been getting away with it so carried on but they will dig deeper now and my usage was ultra excessive!


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## L00NEY (Feb 22, 2010)

as said don`t resign.. because you wont be able to get jobseekers/housing benefit and depending on how long you been there (12mth+) its difficult to just sack someone without any formal warnings from what i understand

if i was you id apologise and say you made a stupid mistake and it will never happen again, hopefully will give you another chance


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## Tasty (Aug 28, 2007)

madmuscles said:


> Really? Was it the internet usage or this actual site?


Essentially usage in general but everything else was blocked so this was the only site I used, generally for 6 hours out of an 8 hour day haha. Hated that job.


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## Sharpiedj (Oct 24, 2011)

I work in IT & they cant monitor as much as you think, you will be fine you will get a warning & put on a PIP


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Sharpiedj said:


> I work in IT & they cant monitor as much as you think, you will be fine you will get a warning & put on a PIP


They quickly showed me a list of the sites already today so they must be able to


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

morgan84 said:


> Not sure if it's been mentioned previously. But that's an unfair dismissal, unless you have been warned before or if it's in your contract or that's their policy. And even if it's in their polices there are three stages to a dismissal: word, written and a final meeting (manager and HR). Challenge it.
> 
> I'll ask my partner as she used to work in HR for a long time.


Would appreciate it if you ask your partner, cheers mate


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## Readyandwaiting (Mar 20, 2011)

I blame UK muscle.

This place is like crack for a fiend!


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## Guest (Apr 18, 2012)

Senior Manager:

Done loads of Dp's for this sort of thing so....

What does your company policy say is gross misconduct?

Have you received any verbal or written warnings already for anything?

Your employer has to follow what is written in their company policy regarding internet miss use if they don't and sack you then 99% they will lose a tribunal for unfair dismissal which carries an unlimited pay out, re-instatement or both.

Apologise, be truthful about why you did it, DO NOT admit to visiting any pornographic websites even if they say they have proof it's highly unlikely they do.

Eat humble pie and graciously accept a first or final written warning (depending on what your company policy says) and be a good boy for the next 12 months.


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## tony10 (Oct 15, 2009)

give acas a call and ask them for advice, they will tell you where you stand and what they can and not do.

the number is 0845 747 4747

good luck fella.


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## fitrut (Nov 20, 2007)

do you share your computer with somebody else? if they catch you actually browsing then you can say it was couple of times etc, but its also depends on company policies, job that you do etc.

I used to work in gov finance company, they were very strict with internet usage, half of the office wouldnt have access at all and those who had were monitored but still those who were on the list, had warnings. I dont think they simply can fire you if this is first time, and if you share your pc with somebody else how they can prove that was you who viewed those websites


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

I don't share my computer with anyone unfortunately.

Trying to find my copy of the employees handbook


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## WilsonR6 (Feb 14, 2012)

Good luck mate

Life is too short for depression


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## Nemises (Jun 29, 2008)

You should have been warned first.

And if they have evidence against you, you should ask the question why build a case against you when they could have just warned you about usage.


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## Ahal84 (Jun 2, 2010)

Right had a word with my partner.

She says, that they can't just dismiss you like that. You can take them to court if they do, as it's an unfair dismissal. First you should have been verbally warned, if you continued then a written warning and if you still didn't listen then a Manager and HR meeting where your position is decided. They also have to look at your performance, if you have been doing well, then they cant dismiss you (depends if you have been warned before, which I take you haven't), if you have been doing crap they have a very good reason to. Also if they say that you are not allowed to go on Internet and its blocked by IT and you can only use work related internet, so why is it were you able to access uk-muscle... they have failed on that part.

One more thing, they should have at the start of your employment made you aware on all the can do's and not's.

Hope it helps


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## Trevor McDonald (Mar 30, 2010)

Dai Jones said:


> Sorry to hear this mate I haven't got much advice but what sites have you been looking at? as long as its not porn I don't think they can do much, but now you've said this I better watch my usage to


Is that you and the random images thread over then!?


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## guvnor82 (Oct 23, 2011)

do what ed does


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## WilsonR6 (Feb 14, 2012)

This unfair dismissal business never usually goes anywhere

There's loopholes, like the phrase 'Grose misconduct' that give employers a leg to stand on and employees f*ck all

Used to work at a call centre, when ever people weren't achieving they would sack them on the grounds of grose misconduct, for nothing at all. A lot of people went to these union/citizens advice bureau asking for help and no one ever got anywhere :/


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

cant find my works handbook but I remember something in there about gross misconduct which I am sure they will class this as.

Only small chance I have is that even though its affected my work which they can prove, I am still the only person who can do every part of my job and they will certainly notice the difference if I am not there


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## Rusty_Mann (Oct 31, 2011)

Appeal it ... but in all honesty i was busted for looking at porn at work so i just handed my notice in and went... They can't give you a bad reference though and you don't have to tell any prospective employer you got fired just tell them you disagreed with the company and left .. Good luck though if you can fight it do so...


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

I cant believe how common it seems getting the push due to internet misuse!

UKM should only open out of 9-5 hours


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## Kalliste73 (Nov 15, 2012)

i am so sorry for you, Mutant 

Your problem, my worry.

we all workers have to pass trought a proxy server we are in similar "danger", no escape.

my deepest sympathy, mate.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Got no appetite and feel like total sh1t today.

Think it's the only the misses and baby keeping me around


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## eezy1 (Dec 14, 2010)

stop feeling sorry for urself and man the fcuk up

take whatever happens as a lesson learnt and move on mate


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## Guest (Apr 19, 2012)

Mate you need to do your homework, get a copy of your disciplinary procedure and read it. It will tell you what is considered as gross miss conduct. Internet use is not gross miss conduct unless they can prove you were looking at porno sites that then could bring unwanted attention to your company.

Take a work colleague or a union rep in with you to ensure they follow their process correctly and you are also legally entitled to see any evidence they have against you. You can adjourn at any time if you do not want to carry on with the hearing which will give you a chance to mount a defence.

If you really want to stay in this job then you need to prepare for the hearing and get your story straight.

Any questions ask.


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## UKLifter88 (Sep 19, 2011)

Sorry to hear that bro, I'm doing it right now. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

In my defence at this current time it's lunch time. I'm pretty much the admin and the boss recently told me to block Utube, facebook, and loads of other sites because people were dossing around at work


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

To be honest I hate the job but it's pretty laid back and pays the bills.

I'd much rather retrain to do something more worth while with my life but training costs $$$ these days


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## Guest (Apr 19, 2012)

i once got fired for spending all day on the net.

It was in insurance sales and I was 1.5x more productive than the next guy but they fired me anyway.


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## Guest (Apr 19, 2012)

Though admittedly I had about ten warnings, but wtf are you meant to do for 20 mins between calls!!


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## webby06_2007 (Dec 14, 2009)

wait to see what happens bro they might just give u a warning!!


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## UKLifter88 (Sep 19, 2011)

FrankDangerMaus said:


> Though admittedly I had about ten warnings, but wtf are you meant to do for 20 mins between calls!!


20 mins in between calls? Must of been one of those insurance companies that quoted me 7 grand for a VW Golf :lol:


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## Bish83 (Nov 18, 2009)

What sites were you using it might help everyone here give a better suggestion.

Either way you should be visiting your HR and getting a staff hand book since that is what the union rep would want to gloss over.


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## Guest (Apr 19, 2012)

JammyGit said:


> 20 mins in between calls? Must of been one of those insurance companies that quoted me 7 grand for a VW Golf :lol:


yeah it was expensive as hell, I only did about 2 months I was actually waiting for another role to open up elsewhere I just took something to tide me over so didn't give a rats ass.

We used to rely on old people who didn't have the internet, basically ripping them off.


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## Tommy10 (Feb 17, 2009)

MutantX said:


> there is a warning scale but some things can mean instant dismissal I believe


They may view at as gross misconduct depending on how serious they take it , have you read your employee handbook ?


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## BLUE(UK) (Jan 9, 2008)

All for the sake of about £60 per year which would get 500mb of Internet data per month. :-/

If they don't put evidence of sites you visited and when, just say you were trying to research your depression(work related)to try and overcome it rather than hide from it by going on the sick.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

BLUE(UK) said:


> All for the sake of about £60 per year which would get 500mb of Internet data per month. :-/
> 
> If they don't put evidence of sites you visited and when, just say you were trying to research your depression(work related)to try and overcome it rather than hide from it by going on the sick.


They got a catalogue of evidence unfortunately but would have tried that 1


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## Zola (Mar 14, 2012)

MutantX said:


> They got a catalogue of evidence unfortunately but would have tried that 1


I would call a meeting as soon as you can with them.

If thats not possible just walk into the boss's office, hold your hands up and say you are truly sorry and won't do it again.


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## Zola (Mar 14, 2012)

Zola said:


> I would call a meeting as soon as you can with them.
> 
> If thats not possible just walk into the boss's office, hold your hands up and say you are truly sorry and won't do it again.


In other words don't let it fester, try and get it resolved before your hearing before they make their minds up.


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

guvnor82 said:


> do what ed does


I like ed's way!


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

I have no advice fella but feel what ur goin through I'm suspended at the min got my hearing tomorrow, wish you luck it don't let it get you down there's work out there for those prepared to look!

Only thought I just had is if they do dismiss you ask to be sacked 'officially' for some thing other than gross misconduct just looks better for next job and try negotiating a dEcent reference out of them.

If all fail do it ed's way


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Zola said:


> I would call a meeting as soon as you can with them.
> 
> If thats not possible just walk into the boss's office, hold your hands up and say you are truly sorry and won't do it again.


Already done that, but was still suspended and told it doesn't look good


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## barsnack (Mar 12, 2011)

tell them your getting picked on at work and your taking the steroids to make you bigger to protect yourself, if they sack you tell them you'll take them up for the mental pain frmo bullying you've been under...otherwise hope it turns out well for ya mate


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Currently reading the employee handbook and 'Abuse or breach of Internet policy' does fall under gross misconduct which can render to dismissal without notice.

I am reading the Internet policy and there is nothing specific about proxy hiding sites, just that personal use is not allowed. Now if they sack me for this they will need to sack 95% of the company including my boss.

Could I request other users Internet logs if they sack me to use in appeal?

Fighting is also under gross misconduct and people have not been sacked for this.

Thoughts please?


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## Daedalus (Apr 16, 2012)

MutantX said:


> there is a warning scale but some things can mean instant dismissal I believe


Maybe assaulting a fellow employee, hacking or damaging computer systems on purpose, stealing, or bringing in drugs or alcohol or guns onto the premesis but surely not misuse of internet


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Daedalus said:


> Maybe assaulting a fellow employee, hacking or damaging computer systems on purpose, stealing, or bringing in drugs or alcohol or guns onto the premesis but surely not misuse of internet


See above. lol


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## methos (Dec 23, 2008)

I'm surprised that falls under gross misconduct. It would normally be misconduct which would require a warning at least first. If you have 4 years of good performance you have an excellent chance of keeping your job. I've been through this with my previous company on numerous occasions. I was a manager and the general consensus was if they wanted to sack someone just do it. The appeal would be overruled as it went to the manager's manager who made the decision so he'd agree anyway and most employees are too lazy to appeal anyway which is sadly true.

Some of the info here is incorrect however. If it goes to a tribunal it's not uncapped compensation. I've been involved in plenty and the compensation is a lot less than most would think and reinstatement curiously happens very rarely.

Whatever you do don't quit and fight your case all the way. Most managers go in half hearted as they're expecting the employee to be intimidated and unprepared. Which again is generally the case unfortunately. If you can find a decent rep you'll stand an excellent chance of winning as a tribunal is expensive for the employee.

You're not at orange/t-mobile are you? They're sacking **** loads at the moment for this exact reason.


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## Guest (Apr 19, 2012)

MutantX said:


> Currently reading the employee handbook and 'Abuse or breach of Internet policy' does fall under gross misconduct which can render to dismissal without notice.
> 
> I am reading the Internet policy and there is nothing specific about proxy hiding sites, just that personal use is not allowed. Now if they sack me for this they will need to sack 95% of the company including my boss.
> 
> ...


you can certainly try to make a case that internet use whilst at work is widely accepted as 'custom and practice' at your place of employment, especially if your boss does it also and in spite of the handbook regulations. As for requesting other users internet logs, I'm not sure you could demand it but could certainly mention that you want them. It's unlikely that they would provide you with them as I would expect that to be a breach of privacy relating to other employees but if they stated that checks revealed you were the only culprit and you know this not to be the case then they may be required to provide more information on appeal (tricky area this).

An employment lawyer or Union rep could advise you on exactly what you're able to request and the way forward. ACAS can also give you information. If it goes against you, what does the handbook say about the appeals process, if they've included one. I'm thinking the proxy hiding site is the biggest concern for you, as security issues may be grounds for gross misconduct, even though not specifically stated.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

I am waiting for my letter from work with the exact details of my suspension so that I know exactly what they are going to throw at me. Then I can plan how to fight it. I will def contact ACAS tho.


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## Fatboy 23 (Apr 21, 2009)

cant you just go on the sick for a while to prolong it while you search for another job ? workers have more rights that you may think


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

methos said:


> I'm surprised that falls under gross misconduct. It would normally be misconduct which would require a warning at least first. If you have 4 years of good performance you have an excellent chance of keeping your job. I've been through this with my previous company on numerous occasions. I was a manager and the general consensus was if they wanted to sack someone just do it. The appeal would be overruled as it went to the manager's manager who made the decision so he'd agree anyway and most employees are too lazy to appeal anyway which is sadly true.
> 
> Some of the info here is incorrect however. If it goes to a tribunal it's not uncapped compensation. I've been involved in plenty and the compensation is a lot less than most would think and reinstatement curiously happens very rarely.
> 
> ...


Hi mate, in the employees handbook it says that the appeal procedure is as follows:

Need to write to a director of the company who was not involved in the hearing and state that you wish to appeal.

If they decide to up keep the decision then thats that basically.

Does that mean I cant take the appeal further, ie; outside the company?

Nah I dont work for those companies but its a decent size company that has branches in uk/usa/canada etc.

I know they are having issues with being sued in america for something and my boss mentioned its why they are taking the internet misuse so seriously...


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## Keenam (Jan 24, 2010)

If they are going to make a case on this then they will simply say that the use of the proxy site has caused a breakdown in the relationship trust and confidence between the employer and employee. This alone can be sufficient in order to dismiss someone. Adding to this the fact that they will argue that your performance has been affected by the excessive use and they will most likely be able to uphold a dismissal on these grounds especially where the policy says that this is gross misconduct. They do have take into account your record and their previous decisions however I suspect that they will use the proxy sire in order to differentiate the case. If I were you I would seek some assistance from either a law centre or the citizens advice so that they can give you advice on the specific facts and view the policy. Resigning can sometimes be the right course of action in order to ensure that you don't have a dismissal on your record but I accept that this may not always be possible depending on your circumstances. Good luck mate.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

Would you really want to stay on at a company that are trying to get rid of you?

If you've broken the rules, which you clearly have, and then try and get out of it you'll just be marked out as a trouble maker from there on in and forever feel watched.

Might as well quit while you can of your own accord and get a job that you actually want to do.


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## Rusty_Mann (Oct 31, 2011)

I work for the Government and they have the misconduct rules everywhere... funny thing is there's no consistency between offices a contact centre up the road fires people all the time for internet misuse .. another office has only a few licences for senior bosses to use.. but my office everyone has internet use and 99 % of staff are on the net check football scores ebay shopping you name it and no one gets a bollocking...

Mutant i think your unlucky fella ... but in all honesty look for another job asap ... they will prob fire you but if you have someting else lined up go for it... Better still play the lottery this fri and sat win 100k walk in on monday stick 2 fingers up to them and walk out..


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## methos (Dec 23, 2008)

Smitch said:


> Would you really want to stay on at a company that are trying to get rid of you?
> 
> If you've broken the rules, which you clearly have, and then try and get out of it you'll just be marked out as a trouble maker from there on in and forever feel watched.
> 
> Might as well quit while you can of your own accord and get a job that you actually want to do.


I'd disagree with quitting. At the end of the day we all have bills to pay and JSA doesn't cut it. Also if you're sacked what record would you have it on? You're hardly going to put it on your cv. I got sacked from a job for gross misconduct and told every potential future employer I was made redundant. Applied for 3 jobs since and got all 3. They rarely check the references anyway and it's actually illegal to give a bad reference. Just make sure you give the hr dept for the reference and they just issue a generic reference which states from when to when you worked there. Completely pointless but doesn't hinder your future in any way. Or if you have any mates who still work there, give their names and home addresses and when they get a call they can say whatever they like is their role within the company. I gave so many references for ex members of staff and made up complete bullsh!t. The whole recruitment process is a farce. If you do well in the interview that's the main thing. There are ways around the other obstacles without them ever finding out that you were fired and why.


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## methos (Dec 23, 2008)

Rusty_Mann said:


> I work for the Government and they have the misconduct rules everywhere... funny thing is there's no consistency between offices a contact centre up the road fires people all the time for internet misuse .. another office has only a few licences for senior bosses to use.. but my office everyone has internet use and 99 % of staff are on the net check football scores ebay shopping you name it and no one gets a bollocking...
> 
> Mutant i think your unlucky fella ... but in all honesty look for another job asap ... they will prob fire you but if you have someting else lined up go for it... Better still play the lottery this fri and sat win 100k walk in on monday stick 2 fingers up to them and walk out..


Yeah I work for the government as well now and although I got sacked for gross misconduct and it fell within a breach of the data protection act, customer privacy policy and a breach of the company trust I still got employed although they did a shed load of background checks apparently. As worrying as it is mate it really isn't the end of the world and certainly doesn't have to prevent you getting another job.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

As far as I can see I have nothing to lose from going into the hearing and fighting my corner.

It's another life experience at the very least.

I will be looking at ways of going to university and making more of this 1 life we have and some part time work whether I'm fired or not.

Thanks everyone for all the help and encouragement so far and I am feeling far more positive.


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## hardcoregeneral (Jul 14, 2008)

Just had a similar thing with my work regarding my time keeping. From what I have learned if this is your first bit of trouble (officially) then they can't just get rid of you without warning. They have to have been seen to have spoken to you and implemented a plan or some form of control/reporting to nip this in the bud. I was sure I was going to lose my job but they put me straight to a final written warning. Needless to say I'm meticulate about things now. I wouldn't hand in your notice to save face mate, I'd see it through. If they charge you with gross misconduct and dismiss you then you immediately have grounds for an appeal. Just my two penneth worth. Hope it works out for you.


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## 065744 (May 13, 2008)

just use it as a chance to go from doing something you hate to something you love. also i bet loads of time with your young child isnt bad. just look at the positives m8.


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## Shadow (Aug 20, 2004)

I work in IT and believe be there is a high probability that you will have signed or agreed to the IT usage policy. In everyone policy I've seen over the years every single one allows them to discipline you with instant dismissal if you are proven to be circumventing the company/organisation IT security software/hardware. By using a proxy server you will be regarded as intentionally and knowingly opened up the entire organisations IT infrastructure to possibility of malware or virus intrusion. If possible check the IT usage policy to see if it mentions the prohibited use pf proxy servers. If it hasn't then you've got a chance but if it does then your defence is seriously weakend. Either way, good luck mate and I hope you get a second chance.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Shadow said:


> I work in IT and believe be there is a high probability that you will have signed or agreed to the IT usage policy. In everyone policy I've seen over the years every single one allows them to discipline you with instant dismissal if you are proven to be circumventing the company/organisation IT security software/hardware. By using a proxy server you will be regarded as intentionally and knowingly opened up the entire organisations IT infrastructure to possibility of malware or virus intrusion. If possible check the IT usage policy to see if it mentions the prohibited use pf proxy servers. If it hasn't then you've got a chance but if it does then your defence is seriously weakend. Either way, good luck mate and I hope you get a second chance.


Thanks for your reply, I have read the Internet policy and there is nothing directly about proxy sites. Just personal use etc


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## Little stu (Oct 26, 2011)

Is it not a verbal then written warning tell him ur solicitor or union rep will b at meeting


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## Stuey (Mar 23, 2012)

Hey Mutant,

Wow, sorry Dude, that's tough. However, I made sure that I read through every post and have a couple of points to make that I Hope Help you. However, before I do, contact a Solicitor's that deals specifically in Employment Law, or, if you can't afford this, use a Community Law Service, CAB or at the very least, a credible help centre!

Firstly, this ties in and relates to your two 'supposedly', individual offences! Now, you have been working there for Four Years, however, you haven't said whether this 'sweep' has been done before! Do you know? Have they told you? Because, A) If not, then it's a great deal of time in which not to carry one out and are they random? As you say that you Have been the only one to be caught? This displays a Huge amount of incompetence within the company itself. However, I would be very Tactful about how you handle this, maybe ask a colleague to advocate for you, can you do this??? You should be able to!!!

And B) Your Proxy server usage is definitely the 'Biggie', However, you were having to do this for Private reasons and meant no harm and you have been terribly depressed and body-conscious at the minute :whistling: An Explanation to your GP, about a bout of depression and feeling low, will not mean that you are labelled as mentally ill, or even, necessarily, viewed as prone to depression, in fact, you can highlight that this is rare and this is why you felt all the more reason for you to feel that you had to hide it, particularly if there are no provisions for Employment Counselling Services at your Workplace!

And, most importantly, you DO NOT want to lose your job Mate, by all means, hang on to this one and then in six months to a year, stick two fingers up, Grab some decent funding and Head off To Uni and Knuckle down, or Train with a Guaranteed Placement Company, with a Fixed-Salary.

Whichever, should you not fight and be sacked, it is true, they can't write you a Bad Reference. However, they have ways and means, what they leave out is far more important than what they include, an employees Third Eye, if you like, that's where I'd like to kick some of these Hypocritical ****ers! And, if you throw your job in, I believe that, in terms of benefits, you will not be entitled to anything for Six Months and this will also significantly decrease your appeal as someone who can see out a course or maybe a placement Successfully!

I read through Everyone's posts and there's Great Advice, however, take it all with you to a Professional in these matters and go and see your Doctor, he/she, will have an idea of how they May be able to help. And, to restate, you definitely need an Employment Lawyer, Union Rep, Colleague (working on an Advocacy Defence for you) or, Preferably, all three, with one aim, to get you back up and running!!!

Now is not the time to be Getting Sacked Dude, this could have a potentially Huge impact on your life. By all means, re-consider your position, WHEN your current job is still secure and you have Discovered what is that you truly want to do out there and then, things will be sweet with you and your financial/emotional/psychological Selves; this will not be leaving you between a BIG Rock and a Hard-place!!!

I have hopefully added at least something that hasn't been covered, I hope so and get some help and nail this meeting,

Keep Safe Mate And, Think Of Your Lovely Family, To Give It Your Best And T Keep You String,

That's what I wish you Bud, the very best, in everything that you do Chap, as you rightfully deserve and need!!!

Stuey,


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Thanks Stuey that was a really helpful post and has made me certain to see my doctor. I have been there before about depression but adding the body conscious stuff could really help explain the sites I used. Also will keep in mind that my company doesn't have an employee counselling service.

Do you think ACAS will be helpful?


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## Threepwood (Nov 12, 2009)

Am I missing something??

You've been on the internet at work so much that they can prove it's affected you work.. Not being funny but you deserve the sack. If I was the boss and found out that i've been paying you and you just sat on the internet all day, i'd sack you straight away.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Threepwood said:


> Am I missing something??
> 
> You've been on the internet at work so much that they can prove it's affected you work.. Not being funny but you deserve the sack. If I was the boss and found out that i've been paying you and you just sat on the internet all day, i'd sack you straight away.


No you are completely right but like I say they should sack 95% of the company.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Right, I have just received my letter from work which states a disciplinary hearing has been set for 25th April 2012 to consider allegations that used a ''proxy avoidance site' to by-pass internet security blocks and obscure the web browser history which is in direct contravention of the internet policy. Also that indulged in unauthorised internet activity during normal working hours and failed to carry out normal duties to an acceptable standard.

These are very serious accusations that the company consider gross misconduct and could result in the termination of employment.

It says I am also advised of my right to be accompanied by a work colleague.

Thoughts?


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## Davey666 (Jun 21, 2011)

MutantX said:


> No you are completely right but like I say they should sack 95% of the company.


Can you prove that others have used the internet for own use and should be in the same situation?

If you can then let them sack you. Then go and see a solicitor with your proof and claim for unfair dismissal on them grounds.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

cant really prove it but it would be all on their IT logs if I could request them for other users..


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## BatemanLondon (Jun 14, 2011)

MutantX said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> As the title says I have been suspended from work today for excessive internet usage and also using a proxy hiding website.
> 
> ...


posted at 3:54 pm on wednesday ... irony , you cant make it up


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## Leeds89 (Feb 13, 2012)

Tbh I think it's time to start looking for a new job


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## BatemanLondon (Jun 14, 2011)

MutantX said:


> Right, I have just received my letter from work which states a disciplinary hearing has been set for 25th April 2012 to consider allegations that used a ''proxy avoidance site' to by-pass internet security blocks and obscure the web browser history which is in direct contravention of the internet policy. Also that indulged in unauthorised internet activity during normal working hours and failed to carry out normal duties to an acceptable standard.
> 
> These are very serious accusations that the company consider gross misconduct and could result in the termination of employment.
> 
> ...


maybe stop using the internet at work ?


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## Magic Torch (May 30, 2005)

In this case attack is not the best form of defence. If you go with the 'everyone is doing it' attitude then you will be admitting guilt and will get fired. Simple. Plus you cannot ask to see IT records relating to others.

You need to hold your hands up and offer an appology and ask them to consider allowing you to stay with regular performance checks to prove you can be productive.


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## Stuey (Mar 23, 2012)

Yeah Mute, I think that they will be very helpful. I do not know the extent to which they can or will get professionally involved, however, their carefully thought out and experience based dedicated input and advice could be more beneficial than a colleague, or a Trade Union Representative, advocating for you, as they can mediate. But, you must decide on which path that you wish to continue on and not deviate.

I am guessing that you probably do have a form of obsessive behaviour and that this may be uncomfortable for you to admit, all the more reason for them to listen to you in the Tribunal, plus, this is a very severe dismissal, particularly if it contradicts or contravenes a temporary mental health problem. That you haven't told your Employer's about this is the best thing. You are legally obliged to inform any employer of any 'existing' mental, as well as physical, health conditions that you may have. Now, I am sure that with a bit of outside help, this issue of internet overuse will be cleared up, it also explains your hidden Proxy use, however, an acknowledgement that it was short-sighted of you and that you were so caught up in trying to help yourself, may help.

I really think, that you Need to contact ACAS now, or any other organisation that you feel comfortable with, after spending an hur on their website and familiarising yourself with how they use and implement any administrative procedures. You have everyone on here's support and a great many informative and Honest opinions, many, borne out of either personal experience or out of secondary experience and some, having been an actual employer to have to 'do the dirty deed' so to speak.

So, Mutey, Decide on your path, IMO, a Temporary fixation problem, maybe a Strong answer as to why and what for, as long as you are prepared to get help with this and move on, so that you do not have to recycle it at a later date and explain it, you shouldn't have to, if it is resolved.

Now, Prove yourself to your company and to yourself as an individual and then, really spend some time and give as much thought to your next move and I am sure that you will leap into a workplace environment that you Love, when you have the time and security to really think about this and this is another reason why quitting your job would be a Very Dangerous thing to do. And, as said, you will have everything thrown at you, or, rather, nowt', no 'Golden Goodbye', a Reference which WILL show up your flaws, albeit, through managerial lingo, as said, what they miss out and how they hoose to do this, is a common way of striking back at a former employer who they do not want to help in any way! And, think about how much you have saved? You may not even qualify for benefits because of too much savings, however, as said, if you walk, then you have left a paid position and, unless the rules have changed, which I dubt, you are not going to Get a Penny!!! Be Very Careful Bud!!!

So, to Summarise, However you want to play it, that's what you Need to get your head around and then, give ACAS a ring and they will help you. I am Very certain (you Cannot and Should not, ever be 100% Certain about these things, especially when you are giving subjective advice, as we all are) that, whilst 'holding your cards tightly to your chest' then common-sense and reason attitude and answer as to why this has happened and questionable employer ethics, backed up by both medically trained professionals and Mediators, WILL win out and as to the other alternatives??? Well, a slightly depressed man maybe? Leaving his job, without fighting and Having a legitimate response, will be very demoralising and please don't assume that you will recover from this quickly, I didn't. In this climate, a job, any job, is most probably your biggest external asset by far, so hang on in there Man!

Have Great Luck And My True Best Wishes Dude!

Stuey,


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Stuey said:


> I am guessing that you probably do have a form of obsessive behaviour and that this may be uncomfortable for you to admit
> 
> Stuey,


Yes I have to agree I can be very obsessive about things and I think I have always known this but I didn't even contemplate bringing that up. I have made a doctors appointment but they couldnt get me in until 5th May which is far after my hearing


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## Stuey (Mar 23, 2012)

Well Mutant, this is an emergency, in my opinion, yet again, that's all we have, opinions, so make an emergency appointment, you NEED This!

Anything that I can help you with, with regards to Obsessive Behaviour, well, that is something I know a Great Deal About, please, either post or wait a week or so, until I am a Bronze Member and PM me dude and I shall Give you any and all Help that I can!

Once Again, Good Luck (and get a bloody next day app. As stated, this is so important Fella)!

Stuey,


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## ZyZee_2012 (Jan 1, 2010)

Threepwood said:


> Am I missing something??
> 
> You've been on the internet at work so much that they can prove it's affected you work.. Not being funny but you deserve the sack. If I was the boss and found out that i've been paying you and you just sat on the internet all day, i'd sack you straight away.


I agree. Especially with how hard jobs are to get nowadays, why do people risk it?

IMO start looking for a new job, but I dont blame them - they aren't paying you to browse UK M or other websites.


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## Stuey (Mar 23, 2012)

Mutant, the whole point is that you know that you have done wrong, however, you have your reasons and it does really seem like you are going to struggle to find a new job (mostly, because of how you have mentioned that you have been feeling lately) as motivation and self-belief are two of the Strongest things that you must have and Need in today's Employer's market!, however, should it come to this, I Hope that you will secure something quickly and that you find this decent enough. However, I do not believe that you should be sacked, however, I believe that this is a Massive Possibility and oe that you need to put all your Strength into, to fight against, you Need to hit them Hard, whilst being remorseful for your 'entirely ignorant actions', whilst being, unknowingly, 'temporarily' unwell'!! That's How it is so start formulating your very best speech of both new-found confidence in yourself and an admittance that your work may have fallen a bit, however, you want to correct and improve on this immensely and most of all, how hard it was for you to admit to your own problems and how the hidden server problem was out of sheer, blind panic as you thought that you could get yourself out of this and once that you started to give yourself health advice, it started to become obsessive and you are ashamed of this. You would like to prove to yourself and to your colleagues, how hard that you can and Need to work!

However, it has not come to this, fight for this Dude. Get this Doctor's Letter, this is a HUGE matter of Urgency!!!

Yes, you have been a naughty Boy, however, there are reasons and good ones at that, so smash this 'Trial By Cocknocker' apart, not literally, of course! And then, apologise for the Hidden Proxy and claim ignorance, which I am sure is the truth and self-absorption and prove yourself useful and keep your head down and then in a year or two, when you are in a Stronger Place, go for it, whatever you Need to do Matey, Get out and Live!

Stuey,


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

It's hard to explain but I have major ups where I think I will fight this and win but then major lows where I just want to resign and think fvck it

But this is how I have always been


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## Stuey (Mar 23, 2012)

Fight it Mate, giving in never proved owt' to anyone! You have all my support and that of many others Dude! Really, fight this, you will feel so much Better,

Stuey,


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## Guest (Apr 20, 2012)

MutantX said:


> It's hard to explain but I have major ups where I think I will fight this and win but then major lows where I just want to resign and think fvck it
> 
> But this is how I have always been


This is a typical depression response: It all gets too much and you want it all to go away.

This particular problem will go away but there's an aftermath.

Action Plan: Change yr doctors appointment. It's an emergency.

Get advice from an Employment Lawyer/CAB/Someone professional and qualified

You also need advice about benefits, should you decide to pack it all in, though you may feel you can struggle on with partner's income and maybe a part-time job.

If you go to the hearing, (depending on advice from legal professional) be prepared to:

Admit to what you've done.

Give reasons why eg research on body dysmorphia, depression, health and mental health etc(ie proxy server usage)

State that most employees use the internet during work time.

Explain your depression issues, OCD etc. with information from your doctor explaining you've recently recognised that you needed help on this.

Full apology and performance monitoring etc.


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## ooomoo (Jan 29, 2008)

I'd put a sickline in for as lo g as h get full pay and spend that time looking for a new job, they can't touch u with a line in


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## huge monguss (Apr 5, 2011)

Sorry to hear.....Think I best get back to work!


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

ooomoo said:


> I'd put a sickline in for as lo g as h get full pay and spend that time looking for a new job, they can't touch u with a line in


I have considered the sick note route if that's what you mean


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## ooomoo (Jan 29, 2008)

Yeah it was buddy, fones playing up lol


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

After doing much reading I am pretty consigned to the fact I'm going to be sacked if I don't resign first.

Need to start planning for the obvious.


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## huge monguss (Apr 5, 2011)

MutantX said:


> After doing much reading I am pretty consigned to the fact I'm going to be sacked if I don't resign first.
> 
> Need to start planning for the obvious.


Good luck


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## diplomatic (May 26, 2009)

boss man, important point to note is that HR is not your friend, HR is there to protect the business from its employees, so I wouldnt entrust your faith in them too much. I guess the deciding factor would be the types of sites you were frequenting, if their are counter-productive to the line of business your in, or "dodgy" then your in a sticky situation. Since you have a baby and a mortgage I wouldnt throw in the towel, I would aim to be apologetic and claim depression. My understanding is that its illegal to sack someone with on going mental treatment, so pay your doc a visit before your showcase and get something down on paper. Hope this helps you brovs. Chin up yeh.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Update -

Had my hearing with my boss and head of HR where I accepted all allegations and profusely apologised.

They adjourned to make decision and then just my boss came back in and said basically all he could do to help me was give me the chance to resign by mutual consent and pay me until end of month and all holiday days left.

I accepted this and resigned so I have now officially on the unemployed list!


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## David2012 (Feb 29, 2012)

oh god

you wont even be able to get job seekers allowance because you resigned !

best get looking for jobs right now


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## Dai Jones (Dec 1, 2009)

MutantX said:


> Update -
> 
> Had my hearing with my boss and head of HR where I accepted all allegations and profusely apologised.
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear this dude I'm sure you will be a man and take it on the chin and get a better job


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

David2012 said:


> oh god
> 
> you wont even be able to get job seekers allowance because you resigned !
> 
> best get looking for jobs right now


yes you can


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## spike (Jul 27, 2009)

Having read where your head's at, as ridiculous as it sounds, try to be gentle with yourself.

Time to start getting any help that might be needed in the areas you mentioned.

Today. Well, as soon as you're able, anyway.

Please do not procrastinate: the price you pay will go up if you don't start dealing with the issues relevant to you.

Good luck and all the best to you and yours. :cowboy:


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

They'll only deny you JSA if they can prove you had other options than resigning, choosing to resign cuz your manager told you to means you can claim.

Also they'll pay you whilst they make a decision on it anyway so its fine.


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

Sorry to hear that mate but you shouldn't have resigned for the simple fact that they clearly did not have enough to sack you outright. You may now be on a final warning instead but at least you would of had a job.

Nevermind it's done now and sometimes i do believe that things happen for a reason so hopefully something good will come along soon. Don't beat yourself up over it start looking at your outgoings and tackle them head on, get help from the CAB to who you can put on the back burner and who you have to pay to keep a roof over your head etc.. Don't bury your head in the sand, have a cry, get angry but don't ignore things.

Good Luck


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

double post


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## David2012 (Feb 29, 2012)

FrankDangerMaus said:


> They'll only deny you JSA if they can prove you had other options than resigning, choosing to resign cuz your manager told you to means you can claim.
> 
> Also they'll pay you whilst they make a decision on it anyway so its fine.


Ahhh yes, this is correct actually

my bad


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Not sure I will qualify for JSA as my misses is on good money?


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## gymgym (Mar 20, 2012)

Look I might be wrong on this but if u resign would it not be any better as it wouldnt show into ur employment history that u being sacked right ?

If that's the case then please *DO* resign. Much better to have a clean record to find job again than having such record 'cose this will make it difficult to find any job tbh..


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

Sorry to hear the outcome mate I'm in exactly same position myself got sacked on Monday, as far as Jsa goes my sincere advice there is just say you were sacked and it saves all the bs questions they will ask. You don't have to prove u were or weren't


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

MutantX said:


> Not sure I will qualify for JSA as my misses is on good money?


Think you qualify as long as u dont have s avings over 16k


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## tyramhall (Dec 28, 2011)

a trip to citizens advice wouldnt do any harm. i was always lead to believe that if you resign or get sacked then receiving JSA can take some time. Hope this isnt the case mate. Citizens advice would be my next port of call followed by the Job centre.

Good luck pal.


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

FrankDangerMaus said:


> Think you qualify as long as u dont have s avings over 16k


No savings to that amount so will try. Mainly because I want to do a course in sept and will be free if I'm on JSA


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

MutantX said:


> No savings to that amount so will try. Mainly because I want to do a course in sept and will be free if I'm on JSA


Just tell them you have zero savings


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

Pain2Gain said:


> Just tell them you have zero savings


They can run a "Goldmine" check and catch you out, seriously, I know someone who got caught out!


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

FrankDangerMaus said:


> They can run a "Goldmine" check and catch you out, seriously, I know someone who got caught out!


This is right. After my mother died, My sister got caught with my mothers estate cash while she was sorting out her financial affairs


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## Heath (Mar 3, 2011)

Leigh L said:


> This is right. After my mother died, My sister got caught with my mothers estate cash while she was sorting out her financial affairs


Something similar happened to my mother so won't be doing that lol.

Don't have that much in savings anyway


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## Diegouru (Oct 31, 2010)

Really sorry about that mate!!!


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## Bulk1 (Apr 12, 2007)

As much as I was warned at work (as everyone was warned not to use the Internet for personal use) I couldn't stop myself surfing when the day was going so slowly.. I never got caught.. but there were a few sacked for being silly enough for DOWNLOADING porn at work! Not only losing there job, but the embarrassment of being caught surfing porn at work and everyone knowing why they were sacked.

Good luck with yours, hope they can give you a final warning.. and you get another chance.


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

FrankDangerMaus said:


> They can run a "Goldmine" check and catch you out, seriously, I know someone who got caught out!


Up to you I guess but its not that like you will be checked on I've never told them anything like the truth and would never do so. What immbasically saying us with these tossers honesty is not always best just say what you need to to get paid!


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## Guest (Apr 25, 2012)

Pain2Gain said:


> Up to you I guess but its not that like you will be checked on I've never told them anything like the truth and would never do so. What immbasically saying us with these tossers honesty is not always best just say what you need to to get paid!


i'm jjst sayin it isn't worth the risk.

its ridiculous really, earn good money, pay taxes, save a bit and get no help from the government when you lose your job.

pay barely any tax, dont save anything cuz you don't earn enough, and the government helps you out.


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

Pain2Gain said:


> Up to you I guess but its not that like you will be checked on I've never told them anything like the truth and would never do so. What im basically saying us with these tossers honesty is not always best just say what you need to to get paid!


Even if u don't have 16k be very careful about disclosing any savings even just a grand they can and do tell you to use that first! Hence you say you got nothing.


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## Pain2Gain (Feb 28, 2012)

FrankDangerMaus said:


> i'm jjst sayin it isn't worth the risk.
> 
> its ridiculous really, earn good money, pay taxes, save a bit and get no help from the government when you lose your job.
> 
> pay barely any tax, dont save anything cuz you don't earn enough, and the government helps you out.


Oh I totally agree mate the systems absolutely crackers!


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