# Tren and Liver Toxicity



## Jock (Apr 8, 2003)

Written by Jason Meuller.

*On The Issue Of Tren Toxicity*

I wanted to share this with everyone on Elite because this is a question I see commonly asked on the boards. This is Author L. Rea's commentary on trenbolone toxicity and first appeared on www.anabolicbeast.com.

Question: I've got the following problem: In many books(including CME, WAR) I can read trenbolone is quite toxic, and you should use low dosages for short periods. I now some people who used Parabolan ****ed blood. BUT I can also read that trenbolone isn't toxic (Bill Roberts: WAR revisited):

"I have found no indication in the scientific literature of particular kidney toxicity with trenbolone. I know of a number of users, at doses of typically 50 mg/day, who have experienced no problems. There are however anecdotal claims of kidney problems. It seems to me, however, that this is occurring only with athletes stacking an incredible amount of drugs, and how the blame can fairly be laid at trenbolone (actually at Parabolan, not trenbolone acetate) is not clear."

In Anabolics 2002 nor William Llewellyn mentioned anything about this toxicity.

I know people using trenbolone acetate 100mg/day for 10weeks without any problem. Just see Nevertoobig's stack: he uses 100mg trenbolone acetate ED.

As I know liver toxicity is in connection with the hexahydrobenzylcarbonate ester and it can be a problem with Parabolan but you don't have to worry if you uses other ester like acetate. So what is the truth? And if I'm right why was finajet so toxic? Just because it was for animals and the oil was not clear enough?

Answer: Trenbolone acetate preperations are toxic to both liver and kidney tissue. The extent is a matter of period of administration for the most part. The reasons are strange but true.

At one time there were the many black-market preperations of Finaplix, FinaJect and others. Most of these contained simple ground Finaplex-H implants...as most are painfully aware. With the process (if you can refer to a caveman approach as a process. The idea of "I have a rock and can make my own AAS" is not a good one) came many foreign non-kidney-friendly materials, some of which were non-soluable. The use of Fina-kits eleminated some of the material concerns due to the use of benzyl alcohol as a solvent to seperate the binders from the AAS in Finaplex-H implants. But there is another concern. The EOD or ED administration of trenbolone acetate preperations also means an accumulation of benzyl alcohol (which is quite high in these kits). Personally I felt that in itself this would not be a huge concern. Unfortunately athlete liver and kidney stress markers consistantly showed in those who utilized the drug. (A little research to discuss)

TR-343

Toxicology and Carcinogenesis Studies of Benzyl Alcohol (CAS No. 100-51-6) in F344/N Rats and B6C3F1 Mice (Gavage Studies)

Chemical Formula: C7H8O - 3D Structure*

Toxicology and carcinogenesis studies of technical-grade benzyl alcohol (99% pure), a textile dye additive, solvent, and food flavoring agent, were conducted by administering the chemical by gavage in corn oil vehicle to groups of F344/N rats and B6C3F1 mice of each sex for 16 days, 13 weeks, or 2 years.

Short-Term Studies:

In 16-day studies, all five male and five female rats and mice dosed with 2,000 mg/kg benzyl alcohol died. Two of five male and 3/5 female rats and 1/5 male and 2/5 female mice dosed with 1,000 mg/kg died. Rats and mice of each sex in the two highest dose groups were lethargic after dosing. Other toxic responses to benzyl alcohol in these dose groups included blood around the mouth and nose, subcutaneous hemorrhages, and blood in the urinary and gastrointestinal tracts of rats and blood in the urinary bladder of mice. Animals administered lower doses of benzyl alcohol (125, 250, or 500 mg/kg) had no compound-related histologic lesions.

Doses selected for the 13-week studies were 0, 50, 100, 200, 400, and 800 mg/kg for rats and mice. Eight of 10 male rats dosed with 800 mg/kg died during weeks 7 and 8; four of these deaths were described as gavage related. Rats dosed with 800 mg/kg exhibited clinical signs indicative of neurotoxicity including staggering, respiratory difficulty, and lethargy. Hemorrhages occurred around the mouth and nose, and there were histologic lesions in the brain, thymus, skeletal muscle, and kidney.

In truth I now feel that it is the accumulative benzyl alcohol that had altered the liver and kidney markers disfavorably far more so than the trenbolone itself. One must remember that the amount of benzyl alcohol in 1ml of most kit preperations is several times higher than an entire 10ml vial of testosterone enanthate.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Nice post Jock. Here is another clip from Author L Rea's book Chemical Enhancement 2.

Trenbolone and tissue Duress

Trenbolone acetate is usually a black market of kit manufactured AAS. As such the amount of benzyl alcohol in the products tends to cause coughing and other respiratory trauma for some. (Not good. That is the body removing the benzyl alcohol by way of the lungs) Benzyl alcohol can be toxic to tissues in higher dosages. This is why the older Finabol and other black market preperations sometimes induced liver and kidney duress. Of course the amount of benzyl alcohol in those products was much higher than current products.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

On another note, high blood pressure can cause kidney damage and I have heard of guys on tren having unusually higher than normal AAS blood pressure problems. This by itself (high blood pressure) can hammer the kidneys.

Again, great post Jock.

Next question are you still going to use the tren?

Do you notice sides?

I myself wont touch that stuff. Some say it is a bad rap but others say NOT GOOD!


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## Jock (Apr 8, 2003)

Yeah, I'm using Tren @ 75mg EOD so I don't think I should get unduly worried about liver/kidney problems. I'm having some BP troubles at the moment, allthough it could be related to Clen also.

Took my resting heart rate today it was 90BPM!

Cheers, Jock


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Wow, not good resting pulse rate.

My B/P is up too. But with all that water you are drinking I think your kidneys will be ok.

I have heard of guys using distilled water to clean out the kidneys but their is no minerals in that water and when water has no minerals then when you urinate you will have minerals in your urine. So this leaching effect is not good either.

So many variables here.

I do have a good herb book at home and can look up something for the kidneys that might be good.

The liver can repair itself but the kidneys cant and when damage is done damage is done.

The guy that got kidney problems that i read about from Steroidiology forum had high bp for along time using tren.

He loves tren the most but it gave him kidney problems from the high bp.

He said it was like urinating dish soap from all the foam.

So Jock, if you urinate foam then you better take heed and go to the Dr., or drop the tren.

I dont want to scare you I think you will be ok.


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## Jock (Apr 8, 2003)

Thanks for the input mate, much appreciated!


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## Brishulk (Mar 16, 2010)

Yeah Tren is nasty, I ended up in hospital on tren. I was in bed for days feeling like someone had stabbed me in the side. Then I started to **** blood, Not trickles, Bright red blood gushing out. Yeah I wont touch it again.

They reckon if I came in a week later I would of had liver / kidney failure. They had no idea what caused it.


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## Testoholic (Jun 13, 2009)

Brishulk said:


> Yeah Tren is nasty, I ended up in hospital on tren. I was in bed for days feeling like someone had stabbed me in the side. Then I started to **** blood, Not trickles, Bright red blood gushing out. Yeah I wont touch it again.
> 
> They reckon if I came in a week later I would of had liver / kidney failure. They had no idea what caused it.


sorry to hear about your experience fella, tren can be a harsh med. it too has had me in hospital with severe hypertension issues. it amazes me how many inexperienced guys use it these days without even a thought


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## criticalbench (Apr 3, 2010)

hackskii said:


> On another note, high blood pressure can cause kidney damage and I have heard of guys on tren having unusually higher than normal AAS blood pressure problems. This by itself (high blood pressure) can hammer the kidneys.
> 
> Again, great post Jock.
> 
> ...


For sure. Thank god I have a cardiologist willing to accept I use AAS and care about my health. Because of this, we try to prevent heart complications instead of treating them. I keep my blood pressure pretty damn low to prevent left ventricular hypertrophy. I use,

Norvasc- Calcium channel blocker to dilate arteries, lowers bp

Atenolol- Beta blocker, slows my heart rate to 60 so it doesn't have to work as hard

HCTZ- Thiazide diuretic, only when needed, usually once a week to flush me since I tend to love my rice and seasonings!

^^All that is monitored by a physician, I don't promote self medicating.


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## 9inchesofheaven (Apr 8, 2011)

Err.. Is tren really THAT dangerous?


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## Mr White (Feb 8, 2009)

Yep it is, I am on 3rd week of 100Tren A + 120Test P EOD

By the 10th day I started getting kidney pains (mentioned above stabbing pain in lower back side). I have started drinking more water and using liv-52 2 tabs 3-4 times a day. The pain is nowhere as strong now but still can fill a little discomfort. Also before my urine was very dark and smelly, now it seems normal.

By 2nd week I have noticed that my blood pressure is very high, 85-90 at rest.

By the 3rd week (just 2 days ago) I started getting stabbing pain in my chest and shortness of breath, possibly heart. I started using aspirin and trental, ordered some clonidine and carvedilol to treat high PB and prevent heart attack it may lead to.

If that fails to reduce my PB I am really considering coming off for good, as I really dont fancy bypass surgery at 22. Cons outweigh the pros in this case.


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

Jock said:


> Yeah, I'm using Tren @ 75mg EOD so I don't think I should get unduly worried about liver/kidney problems. I'm having some BP troubles at the moment, allthough it could be related to Clen also.
> 
> Took my resting heart rate today it was 90BPM!
> 
> Cheers, Jock


mate 90bpm is your PULSE rate and not related to your BLOOD PRESSURE.. its elevated due to STIMULANTS... like clen



Brishulk said:


> Yeah Tren is nasty, I ended up in hospital on tren. I was in bed for days feeling like someone had stabbed me in the side. Then I started to **** blood, Not trickles, Bright red blood gushing out. Yeah I wont touch it again.
> 
> They reckon if I came in a week later I would of had liver / kidney failure. They had no idea what caused it.


I call bull$hit on this one!!! post up your Hospital blood tests... you want to know what causes more liver failure than anything else? Paracetamol my friend:

"...While generally safe for use at recommended doses (1,000 mg per single dose and up to 3,000 mg per day for adults),[6] acute *overdoses of paracetamol* can cause *potentially fatal liver damage and*, *in rare individuals, a normal dose can do the same*; the risk is heightened by alcohol consumption. *Paracetamol toxicity is the foremost cause of acute liver failure in the Western world, and accounts for most drug overdoses in the United States, the United Kingdom, Australia and New Zealand*"

from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paracetamol

somehow tren doesn't get a mention in the NHS...



criticalbench said:


> For sure. Thank god I have a cardiologist willing to accept I use AAS and care about my health. Because of this, we try to prevent heart complications instead of treating them. I keep my blood pressure pretty damn low to prevent left ventricular hypertrophy. I use,
> 
> Norvasc- Calcium channel blocker to dilate arteries, lowers bp
> 
> ...


well i'd personally use seasonings without salt.. rather than use a loop-sparing diuretic like thiazide...

Also, why use a beta blocker over cardio?? using a beta blocker to cancel out the HR increase from stimulants is not a great strategy.

As for a calcium channel blocker.. oK, but an ACE inhibitor like enalapril will work just as well, and when combined with yohimbine, increase fat loss (see the artilce by Dharkham- he was Dan Duchaine's researcher):

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/articles/dharkam/captopril-and-fat-loss.htm

of all the meds the calcium channel blocker is the only sensible one, but i can't help but think you have an underlying BP problems (not everyone on AAS gets High BP), or you have serious water retention issues (hence the thiazide... normally given to little old ladys with oedema and conseqeuent high BP)



Mr White said:


> Yep it is, I am on 3rd week of 100Tren A + 120Test P EOD
> 
> By the 10th day I started getting kidney pains (mentioned above stabbing pain in lower back side). I have started drinking more water and using liv-52 2 tabs 3-4 times a day. The pain is nowhere as strong now but still can fill a little discomfort. Also before my urine was very dark and smelly, now it seems normal.
> 
> ...


what planet are you on? tren doesn't lead to blood clots- aspirin acts as an anti-coagulant.

You talk about a heart issue? have you had an EEG at the Dr to measure your heart's rhythm to see if you have arrhythmia etc? you could have this apart from Tren.

you can get blood in the urine from hard exercise:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/blood-in-urine/DS01013

if you look at other possible cuases:

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/003138.htm

at 22, you're more than likely to have a urinary tract infection (from unsafe sex) which can also lead to kidney infection.

Don't blame tren for things that are likely unrelated.. in fact i doubt you've ever taken tren...


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## Mr White (Feb 8, 2009)

Thanks Auss, I am going to see a doctor after Christmas, working 12h shifts till then.

And I can assure I've taken tren  Happy Hanukkah


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

Mr White said:


> Thanks Auss, I am going to see a doctor after Christmas, working 12h shifts till then.
> 
> And I can assure I've taken tren  Happy Hanukkah


well post up a pic of your size then.. since tren is known to make you massive for all those side effects right? LOL

at any rate, in all seriousness, if you had such health issues, you'd have had a blood panel done in hospital- blank out your name and post it up...

if you have a congenital heart defect, nothing in tren would exacerbate it...


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