# Best fat loss supplements



## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Hi, I'm new on here and just wondering what's the best supplement for quick weight loss. I've tried ECA for a while, the first time I used it it worked really really well and dropped 1 and a half stone in about 6 weeks and I felt and slept fine.

What you guys says the best and what to run it with?

DNP, Clen, ECA or T3.

Thanks for any help.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I would not run T3 if not on gear.

I think first thing is diet, then supplements.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

hackskii said:


> I would not run T3 if not on gear.
> 
> I think first thing is diet, then supplements.


My diets not too bad, I'm not overweight just feeling a little bloated tbh, could do with a stone or so off. I can't really cut down on carbs so much because of my job, I'm a scaffolder and work 12 hour days so it's getting difficult to go to the gym as frequent as I normally do.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

DNP is the most effective, but also very harsh in terms of sides and needs serious research before use to be used safely.

T3 is better than ECA and clen hands down IME, and is generally tolerated well by most with minimal side effects, if any. As has been said though, it's not to be run without steroids unless you don't mind losing muscle. I'd choose T3 over DNP any day as I can use it and still get on with my normal life.


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## VeneCZ (May 30, 2014)

I personally think that loosing muscle on T3 can differ from person to person. I haven't had problem with doses like 50mcg and lower, with 50 I started feeling a bit flat (but I also ran it with clen). I wouldn't go above 50mcg though. I just kept my protein intake higher than normal and I was fine.

Clen is fine, but albuterol/salbutamol is even better...it causes same effects but with less sides. It has to dosed frequently bc of short half-life...probably like every 4h.

Don't have experience with ECA or DNP, but yohimbine stacked with T3 was reported to me to have good effects on fat loss.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

VeneCZ said:


> I personally think that loosing muscle on T3 can differ from person to person. I haven't had problem with doses like 50mcg and lower, with 50 I started feeling a bit flat (but I also ran it with clen). I wouldn't go above 50mcg though. I just kept my protein intake higher than normal and I was fine.
> 
> Clen is fine, but albuterol/salbutamol is even better...it causes same effects but with less sides. It has to dosed frequently bc of short half-life...probably like every 4h.
> 
> Don't have experience with ECA or DNP, but yohimbine stacked with T3 was reported to me to have good effects on fat loss.


Did you run any AAS or PH with the T3 mate? Even lowish doses should stop muscle loss on T3, but probably would be different without.

I've used yohimbine with T3 as well, tbh I was losing just as much fat running T3 alone than when I was running it with yohimbine.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

welshjay said:


> My diets not too bad, I'm not overweight just feeling a little bloated tbh, could do with a stone or so off. I can't really cut down on carbs so much because of my job, I'm a scaffolder and work 12 hour days so it's getting difficult to go to the gym as frequent as I normally do.


If you're a scaffolder working 12 hour days and you need to lose a stone after using drugs to lose an initial one and a half stone I would say that you're probably eating a load of sh1te and are just better off not eating it in the first place.

But you'll take drugs regardless so get some DNP.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Smitch said:


> If you're a scaffolder working 12 hour days and you need to lose a stone after using drugs to lose an initial one and a half stone I would say that you're probably eating a load of sh1te and are just better off not eating it in the first place.
> 
> But you'll take drugs regardless so get some DNP.


I used ECA last summer and it worked well. But the second time I tried it not so much. I genuinely don't eat too bad, a bit carb heavy somedays because obviously it's harder to graft all day when you've hardly eaten but I don't eat many fatty foods.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

> DNP is the most effective, but also very harsh in terms of sides and needs serious research before use to be used safely.
> 
> T3 is better than ECA and clen hands down IME, and is generally tolerated well by most with minimal side effects, if any. As has been said though, it's not to be run without steroids unless you don't mind losing muscle. I'd choose T3 over DNP any day as I can use it and still get on with my normal life.


What T3 is the best to buy? I'm not too bothered about the price, I'd rather get the better stuff, PM links on here please mate if you get it online.


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## 31205 (Jan 16, 2013)

welshjay said:


> I used ECA last summer and it worked well. But the second time I tried it not so much. I genuinely don't eat too bad, a bit carb heavy somedays because obviously it's harder to graft all day when you've hardly eaten but I don't eat many fatty foods.


Gotta at least suffer a bit if you wanna lose fat mate. A calorie deficit should be enough doing the job you do. I did fine just by dropping cals and I sit on my ass most of the day.


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## Smitch (Dec 29, 2008)

welshjay said:


> I used ECA last summer and it worked well. But the second time I tried it not so much. I genuinely don't eat too bad, a bit carb heavy somedays because obviously it's harder to graft all day when you've hardly eaten but I don't eat many fatty foods.


Over eating is over eating whether it be fats, carbs or protein.

Drugs will get the weight off, but unless you change the way you eat you'll only put it back on again.


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## VeneCZ (May 30, 2014)

> Did you run any AAS or PH with the T3 mate? Even lowish doses should stop muscle loss on T3, but probably would be different without.
> 
> I've used yohimbine with T3 as well, tbh I was losing just as much fat running T3 alone than when I was running it with yohimbine.


First time I did not, but no significant muscle loss, second time I ran it with Osta and I was gaining muscle  .

For yohimbine I also haven't had any superb results but it should be potent as transdermal gel stacked with theophyline. One study I've read claims it  .


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I have seen studies on T3 and weight loss, for every 3 pounds of weight lost, is 1 pound of muscle.

That is not an acceptable ratio of fat loss to muscle loss IMO.

Not to mention the muscle lost would have a higher requirement for fuel, thus lowering the amount of fuel one may need.


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## Jammy Dodger (Nov 2, 2014)

hackskii said:


> I have seen studies on T3 and weight loss, for every 3 pounds of weight lost, is 1 pound of muscle.
> 
> That is not an acceptable ratio of fat loss to muscle loss IMO.
> 
> Not to mention the muscle lost would have a higher requirement for fuel, thus lowering the amount of fuel one may need.


Is that when running it with large doses of AAS?

I'm asking because I'm running 100mg a day currently for my holiday and am only putting in 250mg of test a week!


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

I suggested in my other post not to run T3 without steroids.


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## seandog69 (Mar 8, 2013)

welshjay said:


> H I've tried ECA for a while, the first time I used it it worked really really well and dropped 1 and a half stone in about 6 weeks and I felt and slept fine.


ive just lost 8lb in 10 days by changing diet, drugs can help, but diet is king


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

hackskii said:


> I suggested in my other post not to run T3 without steroids.


Is there anything else you would recommend taking with t3 that would limit the muscle loss mate? I don't want to take steroids.


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## G-man99 (Jul 15, 2008)

welshjay said:


> Is there anything else you would recommend taking with t3 that would limit the muscle loss mate? I don't want to take steroids.


I'd take less calories with it instead then


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

VeneCZ said:


> First time I did not, but no significant muscle loss, second time I ran it with Osta and I was gaining muscle  .
> 
> For yohimbine I also haven't had any superb results but it should be potent as transdermal gel stacked with theophyline. One study I've read claims it  .


Would you recommend osta and t3 then?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

welshjay said:


> Is there anything else you would recommend taking with t3 that would limit the muscle loss mate? I don't want to take steroids.


No



welshjay said:


> Would you recommend osta and t3 then?


No

HIIT, low carb, and keep things clean.

You won't get from a pill that you can't get from a diet.

I would rather see you on DNP than T3, but then, you probably could not do your job.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

hackskii said:


> I would rather see you on DNP than T3, but then, you probably could not do your job.


Lol Why?


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

welshjay said:


> Lol Why?


Because DNP is an energy uncoupler and you will get very hot, and lethargic, and might not have the energy to do your job.

Unless the dose was low enough.

But you look like you are in a hurry. :lol:


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

welshjay said:


> I don't want to take steroids.


What is your logic for not wanting to take steroids but even contemplating the likes of DNP?


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## VeneCZ (May 30, 2014)

welshjay said:


> Would you recommend osta and t3 then?


I'd recommend you to study how to diet first, as long as you are 12-14% bf and above, you don't need any of these aids. Learn how to eat right foods in a moderate ammount first, bc you will get all that fat back as soon as you drop all these fat loss pills if diets sucks.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

VeneCZ said:


> I'd recommend you to study how to diet first, as long as you are 12-14% bf and above, you don't need any of these aids. Learn how to eat right foods in a moderate ammount first, bc you will get all that fat back as soon as you drop all these fat loss pills if diets sucks.


Oh, the ol rebound. :lol:


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> Would you recommend osta and t3 then?


I'm scratching my head here... You do not wish to use any type of steroids, yet thyroid drugs and DNP are somehow fine?

I'm guessing you didn't research ostarine - whilst it's technically not a steroid, it's very similar. It can still shut down your own testosterone production and all that stuff.

Honestly mate, adjusting your diet is the first step, didn't read the whole OP originally and now I have it seems like you're looking for a shortcut for fat loss rather than adjusting your diet, which isn't a long term solution as the fat will just pile back on once the drugs are ceased.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Efedrino said:


> Clenbuterol
> 
> *Anavar*
> 
> ...


Anavar doesn't burn fat :wink:


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Efedrino said:


> Clenbuterol
> 
> Anavar
> 
> ...


Best In that order?


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Ultrasonic said:


> What is your logic for not wanting to take steroids but even contemplating the likes of DNP?


Do you have an answer to this? I asked as I'm concerned that by describing the substances you are considering as "supplelements" you are underestimating the risks involved, and that you really need to do far more research before considering any of them.

As others have said, with a job like yours you really shouldn't have an issue with losing fat naturally. At one point you mentioned not wanting to cut carbs - the obvious thing to try is to cut fats instead. Rule number one of fat loss is to achieve a calorie deficit, however this is achieved.


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## Jalex (Nov 16, 2014)

> Anavar doesn't burn fat :wink:


Was there studies showing it helped lose abdominal visceral fat in a deficit and isn't there a lot of ancedotal evidence of this?

Might be thinking of something else


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Ultrasonic said:


> Do you have an answer to this? I asked as I'm concerned that by describing the substances you are considering as "supplelements" you are underestimating the risks involved, and that you really need to do far more research before considering any of them.
> 
> As others have said, with a job like yours you really shouldn't have an issue with losing fat naturally. At one point you mentioned not wanting to cut carbs - the obvious thing to try is to cut fats instead. Rule number one of fat loss is to achieve a calorie deficit, however this is achieved.


I'm just looking for advice at this moment and then I'll research further. I'm not underestimating any of the "supplements" I'm just asking for people opinions into what stack would work best for weightloss.

Like I said I don't eat that much fat, I just tend to eat at the wrong time and can't do much cardio as im used to doing.

It seems running t3 and Clen is an option and the safest.

DNP is the best but there's too many risks.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

welshjay said:


> Like I said I don't eat that much fat, I just tend to eat at the wrong time and can't do much cardio as im used to doing.


Just in case there is confusion, eating fat doesn't make you fat, eating too many calories does. I was suggesting reducing fats as a way of reducing calorie intake.

With your active job you shouldn't need any cartio at all. Plenty of people with desk jobs drop body fat with no cardio.


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## SK50 (Apr 7, 2013)

If you're doing manual labour you need nothing! Fat melts off if you're on your feet all day. Just drop the carbs and fat intake a bit IMO.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Jalex said:


> Was there studies showing it helped lose abdominal visceral fat in a deficit and isn't there a lot of ancedotal evidence of this?
> 
> Might be thinking of something else


Most steroidal compounds can have an effect on which areas fat is shifted from first, for example in men abdominal fat is commonly the last area to go whereas it might not be so stubborn during AAS use. However, there is no evidence that steroids like anavar actually increase the rate of fat loss, they just alter the areas of preferance for fat mobilisation.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

I said:


> Most steroidal compounds can have an effect on which areas fat is shifted from first' date=' for example in men abdominal fat is commonly the last area to go whereas it might not be so stubborn during AAS use. However, there is no evidence that steroids like anavar actually increase the rate of fat loss, they just alter the areas of preferance for fat mobilisation.[/quote']
> 
> Is there somewhere online where I can get some good, genuine t3 and Clen? I've read up about them both and think I'm going to give them a go when I get back from holiday just in time for the new football season just to give me a boost. Also is there anything else I could take to boost it all a little further. Cheers mate.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Seems you have not read my post on T3 and muscle loss.

But hey, your research is spot on, grab some T3, and clenbuterol and don't worry about diet, all you need is pills, and the fat will fall away.

Probably will get to 6% body fat in a week or so, and ready to step on stage.

Fantastic.............Im out.


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## DC1 (May 5, 2014)

If your dieting your generally catabolic. T3 can accentuate this hence the belief that it burns muscle.

You need to be on a high protein diet and preferably AAS to minimise this.

I am losing weight at a rapid rate just now on T3. But I am taking a substantial amount of steroids, eating high protein and taking an appetite suppressant.

Nail your diet first. Everything else comes after.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

DC1 said:


> If your dieting your generally catabolic. T3 can accentuate this hence the belief that it burns muscle.
> 
> You need to be on a high protein diet and preferably AAS to minimise this.
> 
> ...


This. I'm one of the biggest fans of T3 on this forum and think it's a wonderful drug for body composition purposes when used correctly, but for muscle retention AAS is an absolute must. Not even a huge amount is needed though, and if we're talking a test cycle I'd say a good reference is mcg of T3 x 50 = mg of test (so for example, 50mcg combined with 250mg of test should be plenty to counteract the catabolism from the T3), but to use no AAS at all is silliness unless you just want to be skinny.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

hackskii said:


> Seems you have not read my post on T3 and muscle loss.
> 
> But hey, your research is spot on, grab some T3, and clenbuterol and don't worry about diet, all you need is pills, and the fat will fall away.
> 
> ...


OP is in the middle:


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Wont matter, he will use it anyway, might as well get him a source so he can go about his business and be done with it.

Then down the road ask what happened.

I remember years ago a 17 year old wanted to do dbol.

Everyone told him to wait, he did it anyway.

Dude got a huge lump (gyno) under his nipple, then was upset as the lump was visible and he said it ruined his body.

You see anyone intent on doing something will do it.

Probably should have advised him to take nolva with the dbol but hell, I did not want to give him advice on safe use, when it goes against what I believe in.


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## elliot1989 (May 3, 2013)

hackskii said:


> Wont matter, he will use it anyway, might as well get him a source so he can go about his business and be done with it.
> 
> Then down the road ask what happened.
> 
> ...


What would you say is best buddy, obviously it's mainly down to diet and cardio but what is the best aid, I've used t3 but didnt like your post saying 3lb fat to 1lb muscle that's a lot to regain.


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

elliot1989 said:


> What would you say is best buddy, obviously it's mainly down to diet and cardio but what is the best aid, I've used t3 but didnt like your post saying 3lb fat to 1lb muscle that's a lot to regain.


Well,one has to run a deficit, that can be done with either less food, or more activity.

Drugs are just the lazy way to do things, and to be honest the least results come from that, hard work and dedication would be key here.

Tracking what you eat will help you to see where you succeed, or fail.

I think 40% carbs, 30% fats, and protein is the way fwd.

1/3 fat should be saturated, 1/3 should be monounsaturated, and 1/3 of the fat should be polyunsaturated fats.

Keto diets work well, just takes a min to get into ketosis, but great results if you can stick to it.


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## elliot1989 (May 3, 2013)

hackskii said:


> Well,one has to run a deficit, that can be done with either less food, or more activity.
> 
> Drugs are just the lazy way to do things, and to be honest the least results come from that, hard work and dedication would be key here.
> 
> ...


Cheers buddy I'll have to look into a keto diet, never done any research so I've no idea about it lol


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## VeneCZ (May 30, 2014)

hackskii said:


> Keto diets work well, just takes a min to get into ketosis, but great results if you can stick to it.


I've never got into ketosis myself even on less than 40 grams of carbs a day (mostly from vegies). At least I haven't had any sides (stinky breath and skin). Still one of the "better" aproaches if not one of the best ones. (...typing this with mouth full of camembert cheese with no guilt  ).


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

VeneCZ said:


> I've never got into ketosis myself even on less than 40 grams of carbs a day (mostly from vegies). At least I haven't had any sides (stinky breath and skin). Still one of the "better" aproaches if not one of the best ones. (...typing this with mouth full of camembert cheese with no guilt  ).


There are reasons for this.

Carbs are too high, or fats too low.

Drop the carbs to zero, add in some fats.

Will take up to 3 days or so.


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## VeneCZ (May 30, 2014)

hackskii said:


> There are reasons for this.
> 
> Carbs are too high, or fats too low.
> 
> ...


Well it was in the past. But carbs were pretty low and from what I remember fat wasn't. Maybe that stinky experince is also person dependant, I've been on LCHF with T3 and clen (<50g carbs/day) and nothing unusual was experienced (when it comes to aroma  ). I'm curently on LCHF aproach while adding cals slowly, having Sunday as a refeed day and doing liquid carbs post-wk. Other meals are fat+protein.

The weird thing is I only started to smell bad (mouth and skin) when I told myself that I won't diet anymore and I went into reverse dGiet, it lasted for week and happened twice, both times right after diet in deficit. GF couldn't even kiss me.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

elliot1989 said:


> What would you say is best buddy, obviously it's mainly down to diet and cardio but what is the best aid, I've used t3 but didnt like your post saying 3lb fat to 1lb muscle that's a lot to regain.


Those figures only apply if you don't use AAS :wink:


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

elliot1989 said:


> 3lb fat to 1lb muscle that's a lot to regain.


Actually, for every 3 pounds lost, 1 pound was muscle.


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## swole troll (Apr 15, 2015)

OP i personally cant understand your logic behind being so quick to throw DNP or T3 into your body yet wont use AAS, im the opposite. I'm guessing youve got a fear of pinning?

on a similar note (to everyone else in thread) at what stage would you recommend introducing AAS? ive ran previous cycles but theyve always been during a bulk

fancied cutting right down and then chucking in a bit of prop to hold on to size whilst getting peeled

at what stage is this advisable?

plenty of experience in lifting but never really got disgustingly lean so ive never suffered strength or size loss whilst cutting


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

swole troll said:


> OP i personally cant understand your logic behind being so quick to throw DNP or T3 into your body yet wont use AAS, im the opposite. I'm guessing youve got a fear of pinning?
> 
> on a similar note (to everyone else in thread) at what stage would you recommend introducing AAS? ive ran previous cycles but theyve always been during a bulk
> 
> ...


I'm not really into looking massive to be honest mate, just want to cut.


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## swole troll (Apr 15, 2015)

welshjay said:


> I'm not really into looking massive to be honest mate, just want to cut.


in a deficit your not going to get massive

all the gear will do is help you hold onto size and make your muscles a little fuller, you might gain a small amount of lean body mass depending on your level of development

on things for sure youll look a damn site better running a bit of gear and no T3 then you would running T3 and no gear

no need to go balls deep with it, just run a basic enth cycle that way youve only got to pin 1-2 times per week

entirely your choice but i honestly think if you could see the results of both before hand youd go with the AAS over the T3


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

swole troll said:


> in a deficit your not going to get massive
> 
> all the gear will do is help you hold onto size and make your muscles a little fuller, you might gain a small amount of lean body mass depending on your level of development
> 
> ...


I don't particularly like the idea of pinning either! I honestly wouldn't know where to start either, I wouldn't know where to get the AAS from, most of my mates don't do it and I wouldn't really want people to know either. So I'd need a good online supplier


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

You don't need to be considering any drugs at all...


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## Dan94 (Dec 29, 2013)

> Did you run any AAS or PH with the T3 mate? Even lowish doses should stop muscle loss on T3, but probably would be different without.
> 
> I've used yohimbine with T3 as well, tbh I was losing just as much fat running T3 alone than when I was running it with yohimbine.


How did you get on with the Yoh mate?


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dan94 said:


> How did you get on with the Yoh mate?


Think it's a waste of money mate, supposed to help shift the area of fat loss to favour stomach/love handle fat loss more but they're definitely proving to be stubborn. They're slowly budging, but so they bloody should be at 3lbs of fat loss a week haha, dropped way more fat everywhere else.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> I don't particularly like the idea of pinning either! I honestly wouldn't know where to start either, I wouldn't know where to get the AAS from, most of my mates don't do it and I wouldn't really want people to know either. So I'd need a good online supplier


Not allowed to give out sources here though mate. If you're dead set on running some T3 then you could use some pro-hormones, which we're allowed to discuss and are basically legal steroids that come in oral or transdermal (skin application) form. You really need to sort the diet though mate, and do thorough research on whatever you plan on using.


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## Dan94 (Dec 29, 2013)

I said:


> Think it's a waste of money mate' date=' supposed to help shift the area of fat loss to favour stomach/love handle fat loss more but they're definitely proving to be stubborn. They're slowly budging, but so they bloody should be at 3lbs of fat loss a week haha, dropped way more fat everywhere else.[/quote']
> 
> Fair enough haha, do you think it helped in general fat loss or not? Heard mixed reviews so always stuck with ECA


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dan94 said:


> Fair enough haha, do you think it helped in general fat loss or not? Heard mixed reviews so always stuck with ECA


Not at all tbh mate, was losing 3lbs a week before I started using it, continued losing 3lbs whilst using it and still losing 3lbs after I stopped using it. Not using ECA either, just the odd Chesteze pre-workout. Just using T3, with some XI-KT which has worked wonders with helping me maintain muscle on an aggressive cut :thumb:


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

I said:


> Not allowed to give out sources here though mate. If you're dead set on running some T3 then you could use some pro-hormones' date=' which we're allowed to discuss and are basically legal steroids that come in oral or transdermal (skin application) form. You really need to sort the diet though mate, and do thorough research on whatever you plan on using.[/quote']
> 
> Thanks mate. I have researched what I'm planning on using, extensively tbh. Just looking for some good advice off people who's done it all exactly right and had good results. I'm going to do a t3/Clen cycle and maybe run a ECA stack on the 2 weeks off. Could you please give me a good dosage plan. Also is there any appetite suppressants that you'd recommend to take with it, caffeine etc? And is there any other supps you think would aid me further like taurine.
> 
> ...


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> Thanks mate. I have researched what I'm planning on using, extensively tbh. Just looking for some good advice off people who's done it all exactly right and had good results. I'm going to do a t3/Clen cycle and maybe run a ECA stack on the 2 weeks off. Could you please give me a good dosage plan. Also is there any appetite suppressants that you'd recommend to take with it, caffeine etc? And is there any other supps you think would aid me further like taurine.
> 
> I have devised a decent enough diet plan I'm going to stick to.
> 
> Thanks in advance, I'd appreciate you taking the time out to help me.


As has been said many times over mate, do NOT use T3 without using steroids or pro-hormones, unless you want to end up with no muscle by the end of the cycle.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

I said:


> As has been said many times over mate' date=' do NOT use T3 without using steroids or pro-hormones, unless you want to end up with no muscle by the end of the cycle.[/quote']
> 
> I'm going to take pro hormones with it mate.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> I'm going to take pro hormones with it mate.


Alrighty then, any particular ones you have in mind?


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

I said:


> Alrighty then' date=' any particular ones you have in mind?[/quote']
> 
> Been looking at DeltaForce test but not 100% sure as to which one yet.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

The DeltaForce hydro lean might be more what I'm after? Its an app suppressant also


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> Been looking at DeltaForce test but not 100% sure as to which one yet.


Never heard of it tbh. Well, I've been running Iron Legion XI-KT for 10 weeks now whilst cutting, it's held on to muscle very well whilst running T3 and no side effects. Obviously running any PH for a number of weeks is going to shut down your balls, so make sure you get some PCT drugs like nolvadex and/or clomid. How much T3 you planning on taking per day?


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

I said:


> Never heard of it tbh. Well' date=' I've been running Iron Legion XI-KT for 10 weeks now whilst cutting, it's held on to muscle very well whilst running T3 and no side effects. Obviously running any PH for a number of weeks is going to shut down your balls, so make sure you get some PCT drugs like nolvadex and/or clomid. How much T3 you planning on taking per day?[/quote']
> 
> How much would you recommend?


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> How much would you recommend?


Thought you'd done lots of research :lol:


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

> Thought you'd done lots of research :lol:


I have! I'm asking your opinion lol


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> I have! I'm asking your opinion lol


I asked you how much you were planning on taking first though :wink:


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

i would like to see your diet.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

> I asked you how much you were planning on taking first though :wink:


Aww right lol I'm thinking of taking...

Day 1-2

25mcg T3 and 20mcg of Clen

Day 3-6

50mcg split in 2 doses and 40mcg

Day 6-10

75mcg split in 3 doses and 80mcg

Basically like that building up to 125mcg T3 split into 5 doses by the 3rd week and tapering back down. I'll take taurine daily too.


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## skipper1987 (May 1, 2013)

I said:


> This. I'm one of the biggest fans of T3 on this forum and think it's a wonderful drug for body composition purposes when used correctly' date=' but for muscle retention AAS is an absolute must. Not even a huge amount is needed though, and if we're talking a test cycle I'd say a good reference is mcg of T3 x 50 = mg of test (so for example, 50mcg combined with 250mg of test should be plenty to counteract the catabolism from the T3), but to use no AAS at all is silliness unless you just want to be skinny.[/quote']
> 
> I have been running 75mg winstrol with 50mcg t3 was worried I was loosing muscle and regretted not running some test with it stopped the t3 last week and lost the muscle flatness and now can see I did not loose any muscle.


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

skipper1987 said:


> I have been running 75mg winstrol with 50mcg t3 was worried I was loosing muscle and regretted not running some test with it stopped the t3 last week and lost the muscle flatness and now can see I did not loose any muscle.


I've been running nothing but 2.5ml of the pro-hormone XI-KT, served me very well in terms of muscle retention :thumbup1:


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## skipper1987 (May 1, 2013)

I said:


> I've been running nothing but 2.5ml of the pro-hormone XI-KT' date=' served me very well in terms of muscle retention :thumbup1: [/quote']
> 
> I ran t3 for about 7 weeks now am off I can see I held onto plenty if not all lbm.
> 
> Gonna take a few weeks off t3 let my thyroid Bounce back then maybe try the 2 day on 2 days off approach like diggyv suggests?


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

welshjay said:


> Aww right lol I'm thinking of taking...
> 
> Day 1-2
> 
> ...


Not a bad plan. No need to split the doses of T3 though mate, it's got a long half life so the timing would be pretty much irrelevant. Always take it on an empty stomach as well, better absorption that way with T3.

What's your diet plan looking like?


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## G-man99 (Jul 15, 2008)

skipper1987 said:


> I ran t3 for about 7 weeks now am off I can see I held onto plenty if not all lbm.
> 
> Gonna take a few weeks off t3 let my thyroid Bounce back then maybe try the 2 day on 2 days off approach like diggyv suggests?


The 2 day method only works IF you can find proper T3 (TriIodoThyronine), it ONLY works with this.

Very difficult to find and no ugl do it.

If it is Tiromel or Cytomel then the half life is too long and will shut you down.

The above info is direct from @DiggyV


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## skipper1987 (May 1, 2013)

G-man99 said:


> The 2 day method only works IF you can find proper T3 (TriIodoThyronine), it ONLY works with this.
> 
> Very difficult to find and no ugl do it.
> 
> ...


Cheers mate must have missed that bit. So all the uni pharma stuff is no good then.


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## G-man99 (Jul 15, 2008)

skipper1987 said:


> Cheers mate must have missed that bit. So all the uni pharma stuff is no good then.


Looks like it mate, I enquired about it myself with myself :-(


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

G-man99 said:


> The 2 day method only works IF you can find proper T3 (TriIodoThyronine), it ONLY works with this.
> 
> Very difficult to find and no ugl do it.
> 
> ...





skipper1987 said:


> I ran t3 for about 7 weeks now am off I can see I held onto plenty if not all lbm.
> 
> Gonna take a few weeks off t3 let my thyroid Bounce back then maybe try the 2 day on 2 days off approach like diggyv suggests?


Fair enough. Yeah I started 2 on/2 off, obviously the bigger spikes with the double dosing on the days you're taking it means your TDEE is gonna be higher on those days which has been working in my favour whilst cutting. This approach though is really only to stop the body adjusting to the dose you're taking as much apart from being a bit more effective, it won't have an effect on your thyroid at all like some people think it will. T3 generally holds a 2.5 day half life so you'll still have plenty of T3 in your system over those two days you're not taking it. Also there's the fact that the thyroid never gets shut down in the first place - there have been many documented cases of people's thyroid function springing back within weeks after being on thyroid replacement for years. It's only the thyroid's job to produce T4 when the pituitary gland tells it to, and the thyroid can go a long time without producing any when it's not needed without any adverse effect. So regardless of how you use T3, it'll take a few weeks for the whole process of the pituitary gland to start stimulating the thyroid to produce more T4 and gradually start building up an acceptable amount of T3 in the body again, but it's literally a matter of weeks.


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## G-man99 (Jul 15, 2008)

Adding kelp in after stopping T3 can speed up the process of recovery


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

Iodoral might be a better option than kelp.


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## skipper1987 (May 1, 2013)

G-man99 said:


> Looks like it mate, I enquired about it myself with myself :-(


Back to the drawing board then. You used the Rohm thermo lipid stack I remember right? Been contemplating it but struggle with clen been a welder the shakes are a real trouble for me!!!


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## G-man99 (Jul 15, 2008)

skipper1987 said:


> Back to the drawing board then. You used the Rohm thermo lipid stack I remember right? Been contemplating it but struggle with clen been a welder the shakes are a real trouble for me!!!


Thermolipid was good but don't like clen myself.

Will use T3 back end of my next cycle on the cutting phase


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

> Not a bad plan. No need to split the doses of T3 though mate, it's got a long half life so the timing would be pretty much irrelevant. Always take it on an empty stomach as well, better absorption that way with T3.
> 
> What's your diet plan looking like?


Basically..

One scoop of optimum nutrition and 2 tablespoons of drinking oats when I wake up at 7.

10am brown bread toast with natural peanut butter

1pm chicken breast and rice

4pm a snack

6pm low carb meal.

8pm one scoop of casein protein


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## dannythinx (Oct 4, 2014)

Just eat less calories..? It's all you need to do.. Start work on an empty stomach don't eat until luch Tim then eat an evening meal then next day again don't eat until lunch so on and so forth.. When you stop loosing weight which will take a while introduce eca


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## hackskii (Jul 27, 2003)

welshjay said:


> Basically..
> 
> One scoop of optimum nutrition and 2 tablespoons of drinking oats when I wake up at 7.
> 
> ...


Too many powders, not enough whole foods.


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## icamero1 (Jul 3, 2009)

G-man99 said:


> Thermolipid was good but don't like clen myself.
> 
> Will use T3 back end of my next cycle on the cutting phase


where do you get t-3 from? I found it on amazon, but there are comments saying that it isn't the proper T3, and I see a comment on here about TriIodoThyronine?


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## G-man99 (Jul 15, 2008)

icamero1 said:


> where do you get t-3 from? I found it on amazon, but there are comments saying that it isn't the proper T3, and I see a comment on here about TriIodoThyronine?


Doubt you'd get it from amazon as it is a prescription only medicine.

I get mine from my source who I get AAS from


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## Goranchero (Mar 26, 2015)

Anyone here had any experience with Nolvadren XT?


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Can someone pm me to get some more t3 my guy I got them from is on holiday for 2 weeks and I'm running low


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## Dan94 (Dec 29, 2013)

welshjay said:


> Can someone pm me to get some more t3 my guy I got them from is on holiday for 2 weeks and I'm running low


Can't ask for sources


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## FuqOutDaWhey (Apr 29, 2015)

welshjay said:


> Can someone pm me to get some more t3 my guy I got them from is on holiday for 2 weeks and I'm running low


Brace yourself, the PM's are coming.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Dan94 said:


> Can't ask for sources


How do I know what's genuine and what's not online though? Lol.


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## welshjay (Apr 17, 2015)

Could someone give me a good brand at least then


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