# Torso/Limb Split



## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

Ok guys i already made a thread because i can only train with dumbbells up to 47kg for a while...

Torso/

2 Chest exercices

2 Back exercices

2 Shoulders exercices

Limb/

1 Biceps exercice

1 Triceps exercice

1 Hamstrings exercice

1 Quadriceps exercice

Calves (optional)

Ex:

DB incline press, DB Flyes

DB one arm Row, Pullup

DB Shoulders Press, DB rear delt Flyes

Hammer Curl

DB Triceps Extension

DB Sldl

DB Bulgarian Split Squat

3-5 sessions a week. My goal is to keep gaining muscle even if its less effective than with barbells and machines. Thoughts ?


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

I don't see why only using dumbbells means you have to come up with a weird split. Just do what you'd normally do.


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

How is a torso/Limb Split weird ? Its basically an upper Lower Split with Arms on Lower days.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Dltdz said:


> How is a torso/Limb Split weird ? Its basically an upper Lower Split with Arms on Lower days.


 You're training arms every workout since your upper push and pull exercises work triceps and biceps, which you wouldn't do on a standard upper/lower.

You're in great shape though and so clearly know what you're doing, so crack on with whatever you think will work for you  .


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> You're training arms every workout since your upper push and pull exercises work triceps and biceps, which you wouldn't do on a standard upper/lower.
> 
> You're in great shape though and so clearly know what you're doing, so crack on with whatever you think will work for you  .


 Thanks bro, i am lean yes but i want do add mass...

Well your right but i thought the torso/Limb Split would be good to balance the number of exercices on each sessions.

I almost always did An upper/Lower but on upper days i have no energy left to hit bis and tris at the end of the session most of the time.

I feel like its the reason why my bis are lagging and i thought torso/Limb could be good to prioritize them :-D.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Dltdz said:


> Thanks bro, i am lean yes but i want do add mass...
> 
> Well your right but i thought the torso/Limb Split would be good to balance the number of exercices on each sessions.
> 
> ...


 One other option is a push/pull split (not PPL), doing quad focused leg ecercises on the push day and hamstring/glute ecercises on the pull day.


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> One other option is a push/pull split (not PPL), doing quad focused leg ecercises on the push day and hamstring/glute ecercises on the pull day.


 Doesnt like push/pull Split especially if more than 3 sessions are done per week because it work shoulder girdle every single times. Unlike upper/lower or torso/limb, better in the long run imo for shoulder health..

Come on, no one like torso/limb here ?!


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

I don't see the shoulder problem to be honest. I like the push/pull split for shoulders actually, working anterior and lateral on push, and posterior on pull. It would legs I'd be worried about compromising with my idea actually, but it's not something I've tried.

Re. shoulder health I assume you're thinking of the small stabilising muscles? The strain on these will obviously differ for push and pull exercises, and actually I'm not sure whether lower frequency higher workload or higher frequency lower workload would be better for these? The latter would be closer to what would normally be recommended to rehab/strengthen these muscles I think.

Good luck with your torso/limb split though  .


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> Good luck with your torso/limb split though  .


 Well, i thought that working the shoulders complex every times you hit the gym could lead to injuries especially if you perform back-to-back sessions.

However, i prefer a standart Upper/Lower vs a Push/Pull split  .

Maybe i should just stick with Upper/Lower but alternate between chest+arms and shoulders+back emphasis each Upper days to control the volume and focus on my weak points.

Thanks anyway man !


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dltdz said:


> How is a torso/Limb Split weird ? Its basically an upper Lower Split with Arms on Lower days.





Ultrasonic said:


> You're training arms every workout since your upper push and pull exercises work triceps and biceps, which you wouldn't do on a standard upper/lower.
> 
> You're in great shape though and so clearly know what you're doing, so crack on with whatever you think will work for you  .


 Torso/limbs is something I borrowed from Dorian Yates and DC training as well as Jim Stopanni's program both feature a very similar split, tbf it's still my mainstay and the most productive routine I've ever trained on. Basically an upper/lower but I just never felt like I had the energy to train arms at the end of the upper, so I just tacked a bi and tri on the start of the lower day before going to do legs. Never had any recovery problems.

As for OPs split, if one of those shoulder exercises is always a rear delt/upper back exercise, then it looks good. An example of the split I've done for over a couple of years now:

Dumbbell bench

Incline bench

Shoulder press

Pulldowns

Lat-focused rows or rack pulls

Rear-delts/wide gripped rows/face pulls

Curls

Overhead extensions

Squats

Leg curls

Calf raises


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

I'mNotAPervert! said:


> As for OPs split, if one of those shoulder exercises is always a rear delt/upper back exercise, then it looks good. An example of the split I've done for over a couple of years now:
> 
> Dumbbell bench
> 
> ...


 Nice ! its exactly the kind of routine i was looking for and like you, i got the idea from the DC split and early Yates routines.

Actually thats what i had in mind for shoulders, rear delt every sessions and alternate between DB ohp and Lateral raises.

On upper days, do you always perform all push exercices first then all pull, if yes why ?

DB Bench Or DB Bench

DB Flyes DB Ohp/Lateral Raises

Pullup DB Flyes

DB Row Pullup

DB Ohp/Lateral Raises DB Row

Rear Delt Raises Rear Delt Raises

What are you doing for sets and reps ? Because for now i dont have any plan, i just train hard every sessions and try to lift the heaviest DB i have for each exercices lol.

Basically training by instinct...


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dltdz said:


> Nice ! its exactly the kind of routine i was looking for and like you, i got the idea from the DC split and early Yates routines.
> 
> Actually thats what i had in mind for shoulders, rear delt every sessions and alternate between DB ohp and Lateral raises.
> 
> ...


 I'm thinking of changing mine around tbh. I'd always do the pushes first because my chest and shoulders weren't as good as my back, couple years later they're ahead of my back now! Think I'll have an A and a B workout and do pushes then pulls in A and then in B I'll do pulls before pushes. I always do chest before shoulders though, because my shoulder strength sucks anyways so doing shoulders before chest would really f**k up my chest workout.

Yeah the above was an example split, I have an A and a B workout generally so I can get different exercises in. Depends what program I'm doing as well, if I'm doing a rep/set scheme based on heavy weights then I'll stick to Arnold presses and DB shoulder presses for side delts, whereas if it's more volume then I'll have lateral raises in there as a primary side delt exercise as I tend to find that they work really well with high volume routines for me.

Always have a plan, mate. If what you're doing is working and the weight is also going up, then it'll keep working, so it's always a good idea to have structure and method to ensure continued progress. Depends on what program I'm on as to what progression scheme I'm on though. For example, my two main programs of choice for this type of split are Dorian Yates HIT, and Vince Gironda 6x6.

For the Yates HIT, I keep a spreadsheet of what weights I did for what reps on my workset for every exercise. Then try and get more reps each time, with a rep range of 6-10, so when I can do 10 reps I increase the weight by 10% which has me back down to about 6 reps next time (I tend to find that an increase of 2.5% in the weight = a decrease in one rep, from my experience of using this formula for a good 4 years!). So if you benched 100kg for 7 reps on the workset last time for example, then this time you bust your bollocks to get 8 reps. Then 9 reps next time, then 10 reps next time. Once you hit 10 reps, then increase the weight to 110 kilos next time and try to get as many reps as possible from that, repeating the cycle!

For the Vince Gironda 6x6 (6 sets of 6 reps with the same weight for short rests), the progression system is all based around the rest periods, starting with 30 second rests and then progressing to 25 second rests when you can complete all the reps, until you can complete them all with only 15 seconds of rest between sets. Again, I keep a spreadsheet of where I'm at with every exercise. When I can do all the reps with 15 seconds rests, I increase the weight by 10% and start with 30 seconds rests again.


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

I'mNotAPervert! said:


> Think I'll have an A and a B workout and do pushes then pulls in A and then in B I'll do pulls before pushes.


 Thats a good idea, i think i start to do that too 



I'mNotAPervert! said:


> if it's more volume then I'll have lateral raises in there as a primary side delt exercise as I tend to find that they work really well with high volume routines for me.


 Agree, i feel like raises of all kinds are better done for high volume.



I'mNotAPervert! said:


> Always have a plan, mate. If what you're doing is working and the weight is also going up, then it'll keep working, so it's always a good idea to have structure and method to ensure continued progress. Depends on what program I'm on as to what progression scheme I'm on though. For example, my two main programs of choice for this type of split are Dorian Yates HIT, and Vince Gironda 6x6.
> 
> For the Yates HIT, I keep a spreadsheet of what weights I did for what reps on my workset for every exercise. Then try and get more reps each time, with a rep range of 6-10, so when I can do 10 reps I increase the weight by 10% which has me back down to about 6 reps next time (I tend to find that an increase of 2.5% in the weight = a decrease in one rep, from my experience of using this formula for a good 4 years!). So if you benched 100kg for 7 reps on the workset last time for example, then this time you bust your bollocks to get 8 reps. Then 9 reps next time, then 10 reps next time. Once you hit 10 reps, then increase the weight to 110 kilos next time and try to get as many reps as possible from that, repeating the cycle!
> 
> For the Vince Gironda 6x6 (6 sets of 6 reps with the same weight for short rests), the progression system is all based around the rest periods, starting with 30 second rests and then progressing to 25 second rests when you can complete all the reps, until you can complete them all with only 15 seconds of rest between sets. Again, I keep a spreadsheet of where I'm at with every exercise. When I can do all the reps with 15 seconds rests, I increase the weight by 10% and start with 30 seconds rests again.


 the way you plan progress is fine (+10% when you can do 10 reps), the only problem for me atm is that i can only train at home and im stuck with 6 pairs of Dumbbells,

7,5kg, 10kg, 12.5kg, 22.5kg, 32.5kg, 42.5kg so its hard for me to progress in weights.

Even if i use 6x6 Gironda for example on DB Ohp, once i could perform 6x6 with 32kg with 15sec rest only, it might be too much to progress to the 42kg DBs..

Thats why i kinda train by instinct right now, im still trying to progress in weights rather than reps only, but i guess it will take more times.

Thanks for your reply man !


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

I also have ankle weights up to 5kg each i can use for my wrist to reduce the gap by 5kg between each DBs. But theyre big and its not confortable lol


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## nWo (Mar 25, 2014)

Dltdz said:


> the way you plan progress is fine (+10% when you can do 10 reps), the only problem for me atm is that i can only train at home and im stuck with 6 pairs of Dumbbells,
> 
> 7,5kg, 10kg, 12.5kg, 22.5kg, 32.5kg, 42.5kg so its hard for me to progress in weights.
> 
> ...


 Ahhh, okay, that changes a lot then. Even so, it's always good practice to aim for progressive overload. So if you were using the 32.5s on one exercise for example, and you can do 3 straight sets of 10 with them. Then increase that to aim for 4 sets of 10. Then when you can do that, aim for 5 sets of 10. You'd be on a high volume routine there, but a lot of those sets are going to be low effort. Might be worth a push to 6 sets, but wouldn't want any more than that. From there, you can decrease the rest periods, bump up to sets of 11, then 12 and so on all the way up to 15 or 20. Once you've run out of avenues there then go up to the 42.5s and reduce the sets and reps again - to fully exhaust all avenues with all this taken into consideration is going to take a LONG time), so even if you're using the 42.5s for a few sets of 8 atm for example, you've got a lot of room to progress with them which should keep you going for WELL over a year, and that's for a beginner which you don't appear to be... so yeah, a very long time either way. If you go from, say, doing 3 sets of 8 at 2 mins of rest between sets, to doing 6 sets of 15 with a minute of rest between sets, that's a HUGE increase in your capacity at that particular weight, something that isn't going to happen overnight - you'd have probably doubled your strength on that weight, which again takes a long time. So as I say, plenty of room to be methodical in your progression.

Again, methodical progress. Winging it is never a good long term plan, always aim to increase the workload over time in a tangible manner and you'll see the gains keep coming


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

I'mNotAPervert! said:


> Ahhh, okay, that changes a lot then. Even so, it's always good practice to aim for progressive overload. So if you were using the 32.5s on one exercise for example, and you can do 3 straight sets of 10 with them. Then increase that to aim for 4 sets of 10. Then when you can do that, aim for 5 sets of 10. You'd be on a high volume routine there, but a lot of those sets are going to be low effort. Might be worth a push to 6 sets, but wouldn't want any more than that. From there, you can decrease the rest periods, bump up to sets of 11, then 12 and so on all the way up to 15 or 20. Once you've run out of avenues there then go up to the 42.5s and reduce the sets and reps again - to fully exhaust all avenues with all this taken into consideration is going to take a LONG time), so even if you're using the 42.5s for a few sets of 8 atm for example, you've got a lot of room to progress with them which should keep you going for WELL over a year, and that's for a beginner which you don't appear to be... so yeah, a very long time either way. If you go from, say, doing 3 sets of 8 at 2 mins of rest between sets, to doing 6 sets of 15 with a minute of rest between sets, that's a HUGE increase in your capacity at that particular weight, something that isn't going to happen overnight - you'd have probably doubled your strength on that weight, which again takes a long time. So as I say, plenty of room to be methodical in your progression.
> 
> Again, methodical progress. Winging it is never a good long term plan, always aim to increase the workload over time in a tangible manner and you'll see the gains keep coming


 Thanks bro for all those smart advices, this sound like a good way to keep progressing long term yep. I guess if i come to a point where my working sets are done with the 32's or 42's for all my exercices, i surely will have gain strength and muscle !!

Its only a bit limiting for chest, back and legs but i just use high reps for those, 42kg for 30+ reps for bench, rows and split squat is a nice goal to aim for


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Dltdz said:


> I also have ankle weights up to 5kg each i can use for my wrist to reduce the gap by 5kg between each DBs. But theyre big and its not confortable lol


 Could you perhaps attach the ankle weight to the dumbbells rather than your wrists, so comfort isn't an issue?


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## Dltdz (Jul 2, 2016)

Ultrasonic said:


> Could you perhaps attach the ankle weight to the dumbbells rather than your wrists, so comfort isn't an issue?


 Unfortunately i cant mate, the only way is to use them on my wrists, not confortable but its doable.


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