# Critique this Routine!!



## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Hello Folks,

For the first time in my life, i have decided to train with a pr-decided routine. Up til now i just used to decide what body part i will do after entering the gym. So, i am thinking of doing something like PPL. Goal is muscle hypertrophy not muscle strength(Never been a fan of adding more weight onto the bar). What i am thinking is :-

Monday(Push):-

Incline Bench Press(DB or BB):- 5*8-12

Pec Dec Machine:- 5*8-12

Seated shoulder Press (DB or BB) :- 4*8-12

Lateral raises :- 4*15-25

Rope pull down:- 6*12-20

Tuesday (Pull):-

Deadlift :- 5*6-8

Seated rowing:-3*8-12

Lat pulldown:- 5*8-12

DB or BB Shrugs :- 4*8-12

DB biceps curl:-4*8-12

Preacher DB curl:- 4*8-12

Wednesday(Legs):-

Stiffed Leg Deadlift:- 4*12-15

Front Squats :- 6*6-10

Single Leg extension:- 4*20-25

Thursday(Push):-

Decline Bench Press (DB or BB):- 5*8-12

Cable crossover or Incline DB flys:- 4*12-15

Rear delt flys :- 4*8-12

Face pull :- 4*8-12

BW dips:- 2*AMARP

Triceps overhead extension :- 4*12-15

Single arm DB extension:- 4*12-15

Friday(Pull)

Rack Pulls:- 5*6-8

Single Arm DB rows :- 3*8-12

Lat pulldown :- 4*8-12

Upright row:- 4*8-12

BB biceps curl:- 4*6-10

Forearms

Saturday(Legs)

Hamstring Curls :- 4*8-12

Back Squats :- 6*6-10

Lunges:- 3*12-15

Sunday REST

Medium intensity cardio here and there for 15-20 Minutes.

What you guys think?. Does it look ok or i should throw this thought out of my mind.?

Regards

Jatin


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## Prince Adam (Mar 17, 2012)

Looks good mate!


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Prince Adam said:


> Looks good mate!


 Thanks Mate.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

?


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## ausmaz (Jul 14, 2014)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Hello Folks,
> 
> For the first time in my life, i have decided to train with a pr-decided routine. Up til now i just used to decide what body part i will do after entering the gym. So, i am thinking of doing something like PPL. Goal is muscle hypertrophy not muscle strength(Never been a fan of adding more weight onto the bar). What i am thinking is :-
> 
> ...


 Give it a go mate, you know your own body better than anyone....youve developed a great physique from what ive seen so obviously know what your doing. That said, just a couple of points...

1. You deadlift on tuesday, then sldl the next day....i can see its higher reps but that would kill me! If its a good session your lower back and cns will be fried?

2. Just one rest day a week? Have you scheduled regular deloads in to this or just go by feel? Also how are you loading the exercises?

Like i say, give it a solid go and let us know how you get on....maybe start a journal?

Good luck man


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

ausmaz said:


> Give it a go mate, you know your own body better than anyone....youve developed a great physique from what ive seen so obviously know what your doing. That said, just a couple of points...
> 
> 1. You deadlift on tuesday, then sldl the next day....i can see its higher reps but that would kill me! If its a good session your lower back and cns will be fried?
> 
> ...


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

I guess i have made a mistake about creating a thread in natural bodybuilding section


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

You know what you're doing mate, so I'm tempted to just say 'try it and see'. I'll make the few comments that occur to me though...

1) As menetioned above, I wouldn't want to be squating or doing SLDLs the day after deadlifting.

2) I also wouldn't do SLDLs immediately before squats - why you would you want to squat with tired hamstrings?

3) Your second push/pull workouts seem to have a few exercises mixed up? I'd say rear delt exercises are pull exericses (since they are also worked by bent over rows and chin ups), and upright rows are primarily a front delt exercise so I'd be tempted to put that in a push session. (If you don't drop it as you're front delts are probably worked enough by chest work and it's an exercise with a bad reputation for causing shoulder injuries.)

4) My main concern though would be if you'd be gettting enough rest? If you know you can make progress with that much volume every day then crack on but I think it would be too much for many (me included).


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> I guess i have made a mistake about creating a thread in natural bodybuilding section


 You just made the mistake of starting a sensible thread - where it is would make little difference at present unfortunately.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> You know what you're doing mate, so I'm tempted to just say 'try it and see'. I'll make the few comments that occur to me though...
> 
> 1) As menetioned above, I wouldn't want to be squating or doing SLDLs the day after deadlifting.
> 
> ...


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

I'll be honest and say I really don't understand how doing first SLDLs could help with squats, unless you're doing them as a warm up rather than getting to failure? I'll see if I can find the article though.

Regarding the whole workload I wouldn't personally want to be training six days straight. More like two days on, one day off perhaps? But you know what suits you best.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Guess this was the article?

https://www.t-nation.com/training/tip-do-hamstring-curls-before-squats

Have to admit I'm totally unconvinced but if you like it crack on. (My worry would be that if I'd properly trained my hamstrings that this would make my squat weaker, and potentially more prone to knee injury.)


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> I'll be honest and say I really don't understand how doing first SLDLs could help with squats, unless you're doing them as a warm up rather than getting to failure? I'll see if I can find the article though.
> 
> Regarding the whole workload I wouldn't personally want to be training six days straight. More like two days on, one day off perhaps? But you know what suits you best.


 How about taking Wednesday off and throwing cardio on that day and doing legs once a week?


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> Guess this was the article?
> 
> https://www.t-nation.com/training/tip-do-hamstring-curls-before-squats
> 
> Have to admit I'm totally unconvinced but if you like it crack on. (My worry would be that if I'd properly trained my hamstrings that this would make my squat weaker, and potentially more prone to knee injury.)


 Not this one mate. It's more like an extract. I will find the detailed one and share with you for sure.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> How about taking Wednesday off and throwing cardio on that day and doing legs once a week?


 @Ultrasonic, I think you missed this one.


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Ultrasonic said:


> 3) Your second push/pull workouts seem to have a few exercises mixed up? I'd say rear delt exercises are pull exericses (since they are also worked by bent over rows and chin ups), *and upright rows are primarily a front delt exercise* so I'd be tempted to put that in a push session. (If you don't drop it as you're front delts are probably worked enough by chest work and it's an exercise with a bad reputation for causing shoulder injuries.)


 Oops! Glancing back through this thread I realise I was talking rubbish here, sorry. Posting quickly I stupidly combined my objection to front raises (a generally unecessary front delt exercise) with upright rows (a primarily* lateral delt* exercise with a bad reputation for causing shoulder injuries). Having upright rows on a pull day does makes complete sense, but the injury risk would still put me off. In case you're interested I'll just give you a couple of related links, including suggested modifications (although personally I rely on 45° lateral raises for targeting lateral delts).

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/training/are-upright-rows-safe-qa.html/


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> How about taking Wednesday off and throwing cardio on that day and doing legs once a week?


 Sorry, yes I did miss this. Why would you only want to do legs once per week, unless you are specifically wanting to prioritise your upper body?

I really don't want to start trying to tell you what to do as you are far from a beginner and are totally capable of trying something and seeing how you get on. For myself I wouldn't train more than four days per week doing PPL (e.g. training Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday each week but cycling through workout PPLPPLPPL... so successive weeks wouldn't be the same). Some people do PPL, rest, PPL, rest, etc but this relies on people being happy to train different days each week.

The balance between training volume and rest is ultimately something everyone has to experiment with and see what works best for them.Mingster for example advocates a much lower volume approach than most and he's been lifting far longer than I have and knows a thing or two!


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Ultrasonic said:


> You know what you're doing mate, so I'm tempted to just say 'try it and see'. I'll make the few comments that occur to me though...
> 
> 1) As menetioned above, I wouldn't want to be squating or doing SLDLs the day after deadlifting.
> 
> ...


 Must say I agree with all of this ^^^^

Personally I would be training 2 on/one off with a routine like this. Whilst everyones recovery differs, as your weights progress something has to give eventually. Maybe start the routine as you have laid it out and simply add in the occasional extra rest day when you feel you need it.

I would do the two rear delt exercises on separate Pull days, and Squat first on Leg day, otherwise all looks good to me.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Mingster said:


> Must say I agree with all of this ^^^^
> 
> Personally I would be training 2 on/one off with a routine like this. Whilst everyones recovery differs, as your weights progress something has to give eventually. Maybe start the routine as you have laid it out and simply add in the occasional extra rest day when you feel you need it.
> 
> *I would do the two rear delt exercises on separate Pull days, and Squat first on Leg day*, otherwise all looks good to me.


 I will note these points


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> Sorry, yes I did miss this. Why would you only want to do legs once per week, unless you are specifically wanting to prioritise your upper body?
> 
> I really don't want to start trying to tell you what to do as you are far from a beginner and are totally capable of trying something and seeing how you get on. For myself *I wouldn't train more than four days per week doing PPL* (e.g. training Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday each week but cycling through workout PPLPPLPPL... so successive weeks wouldn't be the same). Some people do PPL, rest, PPL, rest, etc but this relies on people being happy to train different days each week.
> 
> The balance between training volume and rest is ultimately something everyone has to experiment with and see what works best for them.Mingster for example advocates a much lower volume approach than most and he's been lifting far longer than I have and knows a thing or two!


 I was trying to incorporate frequency with PPL mate. If i would be doing 4 days a week, i don;t know how i can hit each body part twice which has always been my main objective. So, thought of doing PPLPPL in a week.

I would love to see what's your routine look like(A bit detailed please if you can make time), may be can learn a thing or so


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> I was trying to incorporate frequency with PPL mate. If i would be doing 4 days a week, i don;t know how i can hit each body part twice which has always been my main objective. So, thought of doing PPLPPL in a week.
> 
> I would love to see what's your routine look like(A bit detailed please if you can make time), may be can learn a thing or so


 A week isn't the greatest unit of measurement tbh. Even training one on/one off you would be hitting each area twice on the fourth day. Forget about weeks, imo, and focus on days between Push, Pull and Leg sessions.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Mingster said:


> A week isn't the greatest unit of measurement tbh. Even training one on/one off you would be hitting each area twice on the fourth day. Forget about weeks, imo, and focus on days between Push, Pull and Leg sessions.


 Ahhhh Ok. Got your point. Now i understand what @Ultrasonic was upto. Will prepare my schedule according to days rather than fitting everything into a single week. Thanks a lot boss


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## Ultrasonic (Jul 13, 2004)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> I was trying to incorporate frequency with PPL mate. If i would be doing 4 days a week, i don;t know how i can hit each body part twice which has always been my main objective. So, thought of doing PPLPPL in a week.


 The short answer is you wouldn't be training every muscle twice per week, but with the PPL, rest, repeat approach it would be twice every 8 days so pretty much the same thing. Training four days per week would be a little less frequent but still more than once per week. I don't think there's any solid evidence that twice per week is some sort of ideal BTW. I know this sounds like a cop out but again there has to be an element of personal experimentation here, but FWIW here is one general discussion of the subject:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/training-frequency-for-mass-gains.html/



> I would love to see what's your routine look like(A bit detailed please if you can make time), may be can learn a thing or so


 My own training is not something I'd suggest for you, as I think training is a higher priority for you than me right now. I'll give you a rough idea though.

I've literally just started experimenting with is training upper on Monday, Wednesday and Friday, and then lower on Saturdays. This is partly as I cycle to work on weekdays but also as I am honestly more interested in upper body development, but I wouldn't do this if I had any interest in competing. My training is based around few exercises per session, as I prefer to properly push myself for a few sets rather than do loads. For example yesterday I did 4 sets of decline dumbbell presses, 4 sets of chin ups and 2 sets of 45° lateral raises. Ideally I'd have done some ab work at the end but the truth is I couldn't be arsed. I may drop this to upper twice per week but I'm giving it a go.

In term of reps I'm experimenting with higher reps at the moment, but also going to failure on every set. I'm keeping the weight fixed so this means I end up doing fewer reps on each subsequent set. For example my decline dumbbell presses yesterday my reps per set went 22,18, 16, 15. Let me stress I'm just trying this approach out and in no way claiming it's optimal. I've previously made more of a point of training over a variety of rep ranges (from 4 to 15) but recent research suggest a wider range may be useful, and arguably questions whether lower rep work is required for optimal growth (although it may well be). I'm shying away from commenting on rep ranges for training at the moment as I simply don't think it's clear what might be best. You may have already read this, but there is some recent discussion here:

https://bretcontreras.com/discussing-muscle-hypertrophy-science-with-brad-schoenfeld/


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Ultrasonic said:


> The short answer is you wouldn't be training every muscle twice per week, but with the PPL, rest, repeat approach it would be twice every 8 days so pretty much the same thing. Training four days per week would be a little less frequent but still more than once per week. I don't think there's any solid evidence that twice per week is some sort of ideal BTW. I know this sounds like a cop out but again there has to be an element of personal experimentation here, but FWIW here is one general discussion of the subject:
> 
> http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/training-frequency-for-mass-gains.html/
> 
> ...


 Nice read.

So, to conclude, what i will be doing is following PPL but will try to hit each muscle in a week instead of aiming to hit twice with in the same week. I will be working out 4 times a week and 2 days of cardio(LISS) and one day of full rest.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Nice read.
> 
> So, to conclude, what i will be doing is following PPL but will try to hit each muscle in a week instead of aiming to hit twice with in the same week. I will be working out 4 times a week and 2 days of cardio(LISS) and one day of full rest.


 Does this look fine?. I hope LISS on the rest days from weight lifting is ok?

@Ultrasonic@Mingster


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> Does this look fine?. I hope LISS on the rest days from weight lifting is ok?
> 
> @Ultrasonic@Mingster


 Looks sound to me. When I do cardio - which I try to avoid lol - I do it on my rest days from lifting.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

Mingster said:


> Looks sound to me. When I do cardio - which I try to avoid lol - I do it on my rest days from lifting.


 I have an OCD with cardio and moreover, with the family history of heart disease, it makes me feel secured


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## Mingster (Mar 25, 2011)

Jatin Bhatia said:


> I have an OCD with cardio and moreover, with the family history of heart disease, it makes me feel secured


 Cardio is good and, to be honest, I enjoy it once I get started. I use a rowing machine as it is less stressful on my aging joints


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

@Mingster

@Ultrasonic

Just to inform you guys, it been just 4 days following what we concluded, I am already feeling a slight difference in my energy levels through out the day. Feeling good. Thank you guys. High five!!


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## MFM (Jul 25, 2013)

That's a lot of volume for a natty, wow. Let us know how you get on bud.


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## Jordan08 (Feb 17, 2014)

MFM said:


> That's a lot of volume for a natty, wow. Let us know how you get on bud.


 I am not doing what i posted in my original post. After listening to the advises given in the thread, i have kept the volume same but decreased the frequency. I am doing PPL with one day on one day off thing.

Has been just 1.5 weeks and loving it


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