# Dutch Scott / Francis



## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

So I follow a previous member here known as Dutch Scott. I follow him on twitter and it seems like he's a full time coach these days. No doubt the bloke was a complete unit and knows his stuff, but dies anyone here use him? It seems like he's got too many clients to give any real personal feedback 1 2 1, dies anyone use a coach purely online? How do you find it?


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## Galaxy (Aug 1, 2011)

Cam93 said:


> So I follow a previous member here known as Dutch Scott. I follow him on twitter and it seems like he's a full time coach these days. No doubt the bloke was a complete unit and knows his stuff, but dies anyone here use him? It seems like he's got too many clients to give any real personal feedback 1 2 1, dies anyone use a coach purely online? How do you find it?


 @Bad Alan @liam0810

Think they are the only two now. From what I can tell most of his clients are't really BB orientated.


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

There are a few on here doing it now mate.


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## Galaxy (Aug 1, 2011)

Re the OP I use an online coach, BigJim on here. Been with him now a few months and its been great so far, great coach, knows what he's on about and takes out the guess work for me. Also have learned loads as tbh I would have never tried this type of training, and don't have his knowledge in terms of diet AAS.


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Cam93 said:


> So I follow a previous member here known as Dutch Scott. I follow him on twitter and it seems like he's a full time coach these days. No doubt the bloke was a complete unit and knows his stuff, but dies anyone here use him? It seems like he's got too many clients to give any real personal feedback 1 2 1, dies anyone use a coach purely online? How do you find it?


Hit him on twitter mate, unsure whether he has space for anyone ATM tbf.

Best decision I've ever made working with Scott, excellent trainer and lifelong friend too. You'll find mixed reviews on here due to his "personality" coming through but if you're serious about hiring someone I'd recommend him very highly. Liam will say the same completely changed both our physiques and training attitudes.

There are a few other too coaches on here too if Scott isn't a viable option would recommend;

@ah24 @solidcecil

Unsure again if either have slots but can't hurt to ask


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Galaxy said:


> Re the OP I use an online coach, BigJim on here. Been with him now a few months and its been great so far, great coach, knows what he's on about and takes out the guess work for me. Also have learned loads as tbh I would have never tried this type of training, and don't have his knowledge in terms of diet AAS.


Yeah its a amazing how little you actually know mate isn't it.


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## Sambuca (Jul 25, 2012)

Tbf to Scott he's very very knowledgable mind boggling listening to him lol


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## Galaxy (Aug 1, 2011)

Milky said:


> Yeah its a amazing how little you actually know mate isn't it.


It puts it into perspective alrite mate, doesn't it! I Knew/Know f'all really.


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## Galaxy (Aug 1, 2011)

Sambuca said:


> Tbf to Scott he's very very knowledgable mind boggling listening to him lol


Its mind boggling trying to read his posts/tweets half the time lol


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Galaxy said:


> It puts it into perspective alrite mate, doesn't it! I Knew/Know f'all really.


Same as me with Pscarb mate..


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

Out of curiosity, how much is a coach and for how long? I only know of one who owns krunch gym. And he's 300 for 3 months contest prep


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## Sambuca (Jul 25, 2012)

Cam93 said:


> Out of curiosity, how much is a coach and for how long? I only know of one who owns krunch gym. And he's 300 for 3 months contest prep


That's cheap but is he as good as say Jordan peters who charges around 750 for 16 weeks I think


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Cam93 said:


> Out of curiosity, how much is a coach and for how long? I only know of one who owns krunch gym. And he's 300 for 3 months contest prep


Fcuk that's expensive lol. Doesn't Neil cranwell own krunch?

I also use big Jim 87 and best decision I ever made in bodybuilding.


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## bail (Mar 19, 2010)

I use @big_jim_87 and he is very good got

Me training in a completely different way than I was we use progressive training methods as long as completely different approach to diet that I used before in weighing 17.3 now heaviest I've ever been but one thing about Jim is he limits his clients therefore he can give each one the Time that is needed I speak to him every couple of days,


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

Suprakill4 said:


> Fcuk that's expensive lol. Doesn't Neil cranwell own krunch?
> 
> I also use big Jim 87 and best decision I ever made in bodybuilding.


Yeh I think your right he does, I'm not saying that's the exact price, just a ball park figure I heard from a fella that used him. He's very good. Took 4th at Brit finals and insane conditioning


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## small for now (Jun 29, 2012)

Im with big jim to, pretty muxh echo what the rest said.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Cam93 said:


> Yeh I think your right he does, I'm not saying that's the exact price, just a ball park figure I heard from a fella that used him. He's very good. Took 4th at Brit finals and insane conditioning


Did he get 4th? I was there mate and honestly can't remember him having a stand out physique on that lineup but I am probably wrong. Seems a nice guy on all his vids and obviously very knowledgeable.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

bail said:


> I use @big_jim_87 and he is very good got
> 
> Me training in a completely different way than I was we use progressive training methods as long as completely different approach to diet that I used before in weighing 17.3 now heaviest I've ever been but one thing about Jim is he limits his clients therefore he can give each one the Time that is needed I speak to him every couple of days,


I pester the fcuker every single day lol.


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## Nytol (Jul 16, 2005)

Sambuca said:


> Tbf to Scott he's very very knowledgable *mind boggling listening to him* lol


I'll agree with that part 

As I'm sure TinyTom would.


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## small for now (Jun 29, 2012)

Suprakill4 said:


> I pester the fcuker every single day lol.


Same I do..

Must look at his phone and think 'this **** again'


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

Suprakill4 said:


> Did he get 4th? I was there mate and honestly can't remember him having a stand out physique on that lineup but I am probably wrong. Seems a nice guy on all his vids and obviously very knowledgeable.


I think you misunderstood me, I'm talking about a guy I know placing 4th, not Neil. It was classic bodybuilding category i beilve


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Cam93 said:


> I think you misunderstood me, I'm talking about a guy I know placing 4th, not Neil. It was classic bodybuilding category i beilve


Oh sorry I get it now lol. Long day.


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## DiamondDixie (Oct 17, 2009)

Wasn't he outed for selling the same plan to lots of different people without tailoring it to suit their needs?

I think someone told him they were vegetarians and nearly every meal contained meat :lol:


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## Sambuca (Jul 25, 2012)

Nytol said:


> I'll agree with that part
> 
> As I'm sure TinyTom would.


Haha


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## Loveleelady (Jan 3, 2012)

DiamondDixie said:


> Wasn't he outed for selling the same plan to lots of different people without tailoring it to suit their needs?
> 
> I think someone told him they were vegetarians and nearly every meal contained meat :lol:


lmao!


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## bail (Mar 19, 2010)

small for now said:


> Same I do..
> 
> Must look at his phone and think 'this **** again'


haha I wait couple days then just bomb him with 50 questions all at once


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## Tinytom (Sep 16, 2005)

Nytol said:


> I'll agree with that part
> 
> As I'm sure TinyTom would.


Scott has a lot of knowledge.

But also has a lot of bull to mix in with it.

He's a nice guy but just can't help spinning a good yarn to big himself up sometimes. Which is unfortunate because his knowledge is enough.


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## Aslan (Nov 21, 2012)

I went with Scott.

Do not rate the service I got what so ever. Just a generic diet and training plan / very poor comminucation in a very strange language.

There were many in the same boat as me. A search on here will throw up the relevant thread.

Good luck with your training OP.


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## mikep81 (Oct 8, 2010)

I used to find Dutch Scott interesting. As TinyTom say's he knows his stuff and his level of commitment is commendable but I think his bravado and attitude ruin his rep with a lot of people. OP if you want to see more of him, he was in a documentary about weight loss, which was quite interesting, although it is a little bit of a f****. He made a good progress thread on here that followed along with the documentary and his training. They stated on the programme that Scott lost all the weight on 1600 cals per day (or there abouts) but at the time he was on here telling everyone in his progress journal he was only consuming 600 cals per day and when myself and some others asked him about it his whole progress thread suddenly disappeared. I think he's one of those sorts of guys that you either love or hate so to speak.


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## empzb (Jan 8, 2006)

Was the worst £50 I ever spent :lol:

Follow him on twitter and ig though and he is a knowledgeable chap. Just hit and miss what you get.


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## PaulB (Jun 6, 2010)

Aslan said:


> I went with Scott.
> 
> Do not rate the service I got what so ever. Just a generic diet and training plan / very poor comminucation in a very strange language.
> 
> ...


Agree with this. When he replied to emails it took a while to fathom what he was on about. It was as if it was too much trouble to reply. Saying that, I did see results from the diet and training he gave me.


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## cas (Jan 9, 2011)

Cam93 said:


> So I follow a previous member here known as Dutch Scott. I follow him on twitter and it seems like he's a full time coach these days. No doubt the bloke was a complete unit and knows his stuff, but dies anyone here use him? It seems like he's got too many clients to give any real personal feedback 1 2 1, dies anyone use a coach purely online? How do you find it?


Scott is brilliant, did you watch him on tv? I think I was called skinny boys and muscle men.


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## PaulB (Jun 6, 2010)

Nytol said:


> I'll agree with that part
> 
> As I'm sure TinyTom would.


Do you do any online coaching Nytol? You're a very knowledgable guy


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## paulandabbi (Mar 13, 2013)

@Cam93 I can recommend @solidcecil as a top coach!! He has a lot of time for clients and will cater for anything you want!! I must email him nearly everyday(have already done today lol) and he will always answer whatever I ask.

If you PM me I can give you a 10% discount code too


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

cas said:


> Scott is brilliant, did you watch him on tv? I think I was called skinny boys and muscle men.


i havn't seen it although i have actully met the bloke, albeit breifly at a muscletalk show earlier in the year. his transformations are crazy - im just doobious as to how 1 man can manage so many people at once and do a good job of all of them.



paulandabbi said:


> @Cam93 I can recommend @solidcecil as a top coach!! He has a lot of time for clients and will cater for anything you want!! I must email him nearly everyday(have already done today lol) and he will always answer whatever I ask.
> 
> If you PM me I can give you a 10% discount code too


cheers, i'll probally look into it, do you do purely online? ideally i'd rather be able to meet with the coach, so he could physiclly asses me i.e "your calves need more work, more rear delts, chests okay" blah blah blah. however it seems like theres alot of knowledge to learn - specially AAS wise would be very benefitical i know. are you aloud to tell me what SolidCecil charges? whats included etc?


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## Galaxy (Aug 1, 2011)

Cam93 said:


> i havn't seen it although i have actully met the bloke, albeit breifly at a muscletalk show earlier in the year. his transformations are crazy - im just doobious as to how 1 man can manage so many people at once and do a good job of all of them.
> 
> cheers, i'll probally look into it, do you do purely online? ideally i'd rather be able to meet with the coach, so he could physiclly asses me i.e "your calves need more work, more rear delts, chests okay" blah blah blah. however it seems like theres alot of knowledge to learn - specially AAS wise would be very benefitical i know. are you aloud to tell me what SolidCecil charges? whats included etc?


Where abouts are you from and go from there. As far as I know Tinytom does it one to one in his gym.


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## paulandabbi (Mar 13, 2013)

Cam93 said:


> i havn't seen it although i have actully met the bloke, albeit breifly at a muscletalk show earlier in the year. his transformations are crazy - im just doobious as to how 1 man can manage so many people at once and do a good job of all of them.
> 
> cheers, i'll probally look into it, do you do purely online? ideally i'd rather be able to meet with the coach, so he could physiclly asses me i.e "your calves need more work, more rear delts, chests okay" blah blah blah. however it seems like theres alot of knowledge to learn - specially AAS wise would be very benefitical i know. are you aloud to tell me what SolidCecil charges? whats included etc?


With the one to one personal training you are going to be paying silly money for it! With the online coaching you can send pictures and all the coaches will know what need working on or bringing up and that. It is purely online based at the minute!! SC has a very good knowledge of AAS and will be able to guide you a cycle and PCT the lot.

I will PM you prices and that mate.

Cheers


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

Galaxy said:


> Where abouts are you from and go from there. As far as I know Tinytom does it one to one in his gym.


Im from cambsridge. thats why i thought about using Neil from Krunch gym, as i've seen one of his cleints who i can only describe as insane. but he's fairly local to me too. it sounds daft - but i only recently relised that coaches are for year round, not just show prep. assuming i can find a decent coach, i think i may go for it. a professional online coach that can just help to bump me up a level as i plan on competing either next year or the year after as a U21, so more knowledge the better


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## Leeds89 (Feb 13, 2012)

To all the guys that use Jim, is it only contest prep he does? I'd pay if he could help me work a decent diet and training plan around a busy work schedule, factoring in I'm a fkn fussy eater and often have to work 6 hour shifts with no breaks. I'm finding it very hard on my own!

@big_jim_87

Oh, and won't be competing, this is just for myself, a couple of stone more of lean mass, I'd be happy


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Leeds89 said:


> To all the guys that use Jim, is it only contest prep he does? I'd pay if he could help me work a decent diet and training plan around a busy work schedule, factoring in I'm a fkn fussy eater and often have to work 6 hour shifts with no breaks. I'm finding it very hard on my own!
> 
> @big_jim_87
> 
> Oh, and won't be competing, this is just for myself, a couple of stone more of lean mass, I'd be happy


No mate non of his clients are on comp prep at the minute.

I've had the most productive off season ever being with him.

Pretty sure has his quota of clients at the minute anyway.


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## Tinytom (Sep 16, 2005)

paulandabbi said:


> With the one to one personal training you are going to be paying silly money for it! With the online coaching you can send pictures and all the coaches will know what need working on or bringing up and that. It is purely online based at the minute!! SC has a very good knowledge of AAS and will be able to guide you a cycle and PCT the lot.
> 
> I will PM you prices and that mate.
> 
> Cheers


It's only silly money if you don't get results.

I have a number of regular clients I don't charge the earth and they train exactly how I want them to in order to get results. They ALL get results and improve.

Regular PT clients get the diet and supps advice as part of the package.

The only issue with online coaching and why I haven't done it before is that I like to make sure people train hard as the training is integral for the PT and coaching.

Lots of people say they train hard but in fact they don't. You can get the diet and supps right but if you aren't training properly you won't make the progress you want to.

For example I have one guy been training him for over a year he's 22 and started at 85kg and now is 107kg. Not fat either. I have one session a week with him.

I also train his dad. A 65year old guy who had knee surgery a year ago and now leg presses 450kg with ease.

Like I said I prefer the one to one side of things but I know SC and PS and Det do well with online work.


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

ive been with dutch scott and did get good results

however when i stalled there was no answer, response time was poor sometimes 1-2 weeks and then he would say hed emailed me this was after me being with him for 6 months

also as stated in this thread already he uses weird grammar and wording and the last time i paid for a 30 day cut was lean already he replied late in the end didnt go through with it and wouldnt refund either

if your not in dutches inner circle of friends your left out and not given the attention others are


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## Mark2021 (Apr 13, 2012)

I had a hard time with scott tbh


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## paulandabbi (Mar 13, 2013)

Tinytom said:


> It's only silly money if you don't get results.
> 
> I have a number of regular clients I don't charge the earth and they train exactly how I want them to in order to get results. They ALL get results and improve.
> 
> ...


That's a good work ethic mate and I am sure you get the results you and your clients want. If I had the money I would happily have one to one but say 2 hours of one to one is the same as a month with online coaches so its not in my price bracket.

I am sure it does have its benefits too but for a cheaper alternative its the way forward. I suppose if a client isn't working hard enough for a coach online then it could look bad on the coach too so I see where your coming from.

Thanks for the reply


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## SkinnyJ (Apr 21, 2012)

So overall the guy sounds like a bit of a cock and provides a crap service.

Hopefully anyone seeing this thread can now avoid him and use some of the reputable

Pts on here like Cecil etc etc.


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

How much did you guys pay for Dutch's help?

1-2 weeks for a reply is a bit crap if your paying good money TBH.


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

SkinnyJ said:


> So overall the guy sounds like a bit of a cock and provides a crap service.
> 
> Hopefully anyone seeing this thread can now avoid him and use some of the reputable
> 
> Pts on here like Cecil etc etc.


Wk 1;



After around 6 months just 6 weeks out from first show;



To now;



88kg week one competed at 84kg and upto 103kg now. All within the space of around 14months.

Crap service indeed


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

SkinnyJ said:


> So overall the guy sounds like a bit of a cock and provides a crap service.
> 
> Hopefully anyone seeing this thread can now avoid him and use some of the reputable
> 
> Pts on here like Cecil etc etc.


Looks that way unless like Zak said your in his inner circle.


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## NoGutsNoGlory (Jun 11, 2009)

Suprakill4 said:


> Looks that way unless like Zak said your in his inner circle.


I get this impression too.

Even on here he had his "clique" of bezzie mates.

@Bad Alan - looks like you got lucky


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Listen chaps can we not turn this into a dutch Sott slag fest, he's not here to defend himself and its not fair.

Some people have loved working with him, some haven't, that's life.

You have lots of choice on this forum alone who you can use, you pays your money you takes your chance...


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Milky said:


> Listen chaps can we not turn this into a dutch Sott slag fest, he's not here to defend himself and its not fair.
> 
> Some people have loved working with him, some haven't, that's life.
> 
> You have lots of choice on this forum alone who you can use, you pays your money you takes your chance...


In honesty the threads giving the opening poster exactly what he wants. Opinions about Dutch Scott's coaching services. He has 3 people that loved his services and plenty that didn't.


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Suprakill4 said:


> In honesty the threads giving the opening poster exactly what he wants. Opinions about Dutch Scott's coaching services. He has 3 people that loved his services and plenty that didn't.


Totally agree mate, its been pretty balanced to a point but l can see a pattern forming and what to nip It in the bud before the riots start :thumbup1:


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Bad Alan said:


> Wk 1;
> 
> View attachment 143005
> 
> ...


like shrek on roidz


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Suprakill4 said:


> In honesty the threads giving the opening poster exactly what he wants. Opinions about Dutch Scott's coaching services. He has 3 people that loved his services and plenty that didn't.


And plenty more you've never met, seen or heard of. Ukm is a very small percentage of Scott's client base, people who haven't even used Scott are commenting so it's hardly a discussion from personal experiences.

I also know for fact Scott stated to a lot on here that he kept prices down and did *once weekly check ins* so people asking questions multiple times per week were not going to receive answers. That was the agreement in the first place.


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## luther1 (Jul 31, 2011)

Whoever you go with,don't expect to look like Phil Heath after 12 weeks and a couple of hundred quid. Be in it for the long hall


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

ewen said:


> like shrek on roidz


Scott can't change ugly unfortunately lol, I'm stuck with that


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

luther1 said:


> Whoever you go with,don't expect to look like Phil Heath after 12 weeks and a couple of hundred quid. Be in it for the long hall


I would also add who ever you use you will see good results if you follow what they say as they will educate you with things you would never have tried.

These people know there sh*t :thumbup1:


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Bad Alan said:


> And plenty more you've never met, seen or heard of. Ukm is a very small percentage of Scott's client base, people who haven't even used Scott are commenting so it's hardly a discussion from personal experiences.
> 
> I also know for fact Scott stated to a lot on here that he kept prices down and did *once weekly check ins* so people asking questions multiple times per week were not going to receive answers. That was the agreement in the first place.


I know but he is asking who on ukm has used him. And my response was in reply to all those in this thread that have used him and said were unhappy.

I know you've been happy and Liam. Rack was happy but for some reason parted ways.

I don't have an opinion on his coaching as never used him and never would, mainly because I don't the slightest clue about what he is talking about most of the time lol.

Worked wanders on your physique though the pics show that and everyone knows he seriously knows his stuff. But it's a service issue with most from what i can see where people take weeks to get a reply.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Milky said:


> I would also add who ever you use you will see good results if you follow what they say as they will educate you with things you would never have tried.
> 
> These people know there sh*t :thumbup1:


That's the biggest advantage. The ammount you learn is insane. Different methods etc.


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Suprakill4 said:


> That's the biggest advantage. The ammount you learn is insane. Different methods etc.


When l first got my diet etc of @Pscarb l honestly thought " WTF is all this about " but fu*k me what a difference it made in those initial weeks, it was unreal mate.

Things l would never have eaten at times l would never have eaten them, training methods l wouldn't have gone near.. then knowledge is amazing.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Milky said:


> When l first got my diet etc of @Pscarb l honestly thought " WTF is all this about " but fu*k me what a difference it made in those initial weeks, it was unreal mate.
> 
> Things l would never have eaten at times l would never have eaten them, training methods l wouldn't have gone near.. then knowledge is amazing.


Same here mate. Plus soon realised I had never ever eaten anywhere near enough.


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Suprakill4 said:


> I know but he is asking who on ukm has used him. And my response was in reply to all those in this thread that have used him and said were unhappy.
> 
> I know you've been happy and Liam. Rack was happy but for some reason parted ways.
> 
> ...


"Bad Alan likes this"



Good post, I've said in the past not everyone works well with Scott so

I'm not saying he's perfect. Just a lot of unecessary bashing. Not on you're part I'll add, from some others who haven't worked with or know him.


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Suprakill4 said:


> Same here mate. Plus soon realised I had never ever eaten anywhere near enough.


Yeah its quite embarrassing when you realise how little you actually do know :lol:


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Bad Alan said:


> "Bad Alan likes this"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah with a coach you must click with them IMO. It's a must.


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

I've had some good chats with dutch scott on threads, by PM's and also off the forum... I can't comment on the experience of being coached by him, but one thing I will say is that he is passionate about helping people, even if at times he miscommunicates and gets it wrong in the eyes of some.


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

Scott Francis is the BSI of Personal training :lol:

Some love him. Many hate him. But everyone has an opinion


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## cas (Jan 9, 2011)

simonthepieman said:


> Scott Francis is the BSI of Personal training :lol:
> 
> Some love him. Many hate him. But everyone has an opinion


Lol


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

I'm thinking of getting an online coach in the spring/summer and @solidcecil and @exmgtoo are too of my list. Although I'd be interested in hearing more about this big Jim chap


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## small for now (Jun 29, 2012)

simonthepieman said:


> I'm thinking of getting an online coach in the spring/summer and @solidcecil and @exmgtoo are too of my list. Although I'd be interested in hearing more about this big Jim chap


 @big_jim_87

Ask any questions to any of his clients, theyre all happy.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

small for now said:


> @big_jim_87
> 
> Ask any questions to any of his clients, theyre all happy.


He gets my vote the big ginger leprechaun. Lol.


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## small for now (Jun 29, 2012)

Suprakill4 said:


> He gets my vote the big ginger leprechaun. Lol.


Hes the hobbit but wider lol


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## Galaxy (Aug 1, 2011)

Suprakill4 said:


> He gets my vote the big ginger leprechaun. Lol.





small for now said:


> Hes the hobbit but wider lol


Can't you just see the love :wub:


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## Superhorse (May 29, 2011)

Guy is an absolute joke as a PT. Probably a nice guy to those who got to know him early doors and who are close to him.

Provides a horrific service and doesn't give a sh1t. Has no idea about one client to the next.

Owes me a bunch of cash and has repeatedly lied about it. Will end up bringing him to court in the new year.


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## exmgtoo (Feb 24, 2013)

someone call me? =0)


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## Tinytom (Sep 16, 2005)

I think what's important is that you learn something new from a coach. Lots of pros go around different coaches until they find one that works well with them.

I've had a few clients who've wanted to go in a more strength orientated direction. When Scott was training at my gym (the one he owned apparently) I would always defer them to him as that's more his speciality. Now I have another employee who's very good at strength training who gets those referrals.

My speciality is not strength training so I don't pretend it is. Similar as I couldn't really do high intensity circuits or spin. I have employees for this as well who get referrals.

I am always learning. My diet is impeccable and the other day I was chatting to @Pscarb and said I was very lean but finding it harder to get over 96kg off season. I laid out my diet and he said 'where's the sh!t?'

I don't eat chocolate or much junk. I prefer clean eating. I don't eat cheese or high fat foods.

Paul told me to force a few choc bars and some other bits in each day.

The result? Over 96kg now and still clearly visible abs and obliques and my training energy increased.

Sometimes even with the most dedicated and knowledgable trainer the obvious can be missed and needs to be stated to progress. That's part of how a coach can help you. Luckily I have a mate like paul to bounce ideas off.


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Tinytom said:


> I think what's important is that you learn something new from a coach. Lots of pros go around different coaches until they find one that works well with them.
> 
> I've had a few clients who've wanted to go in a more strength orientated direction. When Scott was training at my gym (the one he owned apparently) I would always defer them to him as that's more his speciality. Now I have another employee who's very good at strength training who gets those referrals.
> 
> ...


You know what that's a gem advice wise  find people are often too scared of putting some junk in their diet when if you're lean enough it's massively beneficial. I had a weight sticking point and was eating perfectly clean like you, add abit of planned cheat food and pushed through it.

Must be looking pretty good at 96kg frodo


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## Huntingground (Jan 10, 2010)

Tinytom said:


> When Scott was training at my gym (the one he owned apparently)


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## kefka (Apr 22, 2013)

isnt this the guy that ripped a bunch of people off on this forum a while back?


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## simonthepieman (Jun 11, 2012)

Tinytom said:


> I think what's important is that you learn something new from a coach. Lots of pros go around different coaches until they find one that works well with them.
> 
> I've had a few clients who've wanted to go in a more strength orientated direction. When Scott was training at my gym (the one he owned apparently) I would always defer them to him as that's more his speciality. Now I have another employee who's very good at strength training who gets those referrals.
> 
> ...


great advice.

This is why I am going to get a coach next year.

I think i know what I am doing and can research what i don't, sometimes it's better to put your faith in other peoples hands and get out of your comfort zone. Too many people spend their energy proving their own theories when they could do with trying something they previously disagreed with or thought better of


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Tinytom said:


> *I think what's important is that you learn something new from a coach. Lots of pros go around different coaches until they find one that works well with them.*
> 
> I've had a few clients who've wanted to go in a more strength orientated direction. When Scott was training at my gym (the one he owned apparently) I would always defer them to him as that's more his speciality. Now I have another employee who's very good at strength training who gets those referrals.
> 
> ...


the bit in bold is important, I learn everyday from people I respect and look up to people like Scott Stevenson phd (my coach) john meadows, Phil Learney @Learney Jordan peters to name a few as they have methods that are different and are experts in there own right........

A good coach does not know everything and will admit this.......

Tom is a machine few understand how committed he is to the game or how much muscle he actually holds and is a great PT but like many who are at the top of there game having someone close who can think outside of the box is crucial to advance......

There has been some good coaches named in this thread some I know well some not so well but all seem to know what they are doing, and this includes Scott I will echo what Tom has said the guy knows his sh1t FACT he is not the best at communicating with some and the level of ego type BS he spouts is laughable but he knows his sh1t.......


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

For those who are not aware of Tinytoms size check out some of his vids on YouTube, trust me he is a unit.


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## Northern Lass (Aug 10, 2011)

Milky said:


> For those who are not aware of Tinytoms size check out some of his vids on YouTube, trust me he is a unit.


Link please


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

YummyMummy said:


> Link please


On my tablet so bear with me.


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## Northern Lass (Aug 10, 2011)

I'm bearing... you oldies


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

YummyMummy said:


> I'm bearing... you oldies


Have to go on my bloody laptop now.


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## paul81 (Jun 3, 2010)

Milky said:


> Have to go on my bloody laptop now.


milky you trendy b*stard


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

YummyMummy said:


> I'm bearing... you oldies


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## MRSTRONG (Apr 18, 2009)

Milky said:


> For those who are not aware of Tinytoms size check out some of his vids on YouTube, trust me he is fcuking tiny .


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

UKM has a good number of good bodybuilding coaches who can help with all sides of the equation - training, diet, PEDs, precontest prep.

I do general diet coaching which I enjoy so much, especially when people start to see results and begin to gain a greater understanding of diet and how to build and structure a plan for themselves.

Is as much a learning thing for me, and each client brings something new which helps me with future clients. I steal ideas and suck up advice from guys like Pscarb, Tom, Con, Big Jim, Big Bear, dutch scott and of course bloggers like Phil Learney, Alan Aragon, etc constantly... there is always a ton of new things to learn, and also many things that get forgotten over time that sometimes you need a reminder of.

Advice I would give to anyone who wants an online coach is look for one who personalises their approach to the client, and also who has a good relationship with other coaches - be wary of any coach who claims excellence and seems to always seek to knock other coaches down, top coaches are always bouncing ideas and sharing techniques with each other and see themselves as a group of comrades trying to learn and improve together.


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## Suprakill4 (Jul 11, 2008)

Toms YouTube name is beefcakewarrior.

Massive massive fan of toms physique in the top 3 on here easily.


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Suprakill4 said:


>


Tw*t, l got out of bed to do that :lol:



ewen said:


>


 @Tinytom

ban the ku*t mate, dwarfism is worse than racism, thank fu8k your not ginger as well !!


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## Loveleelady (Jan 3, 2012)

dtlv said:


> UKM has a good number of good bodybuilding coaches who can help with all sides of the equation - training, diet, PEDs, precontest prep.
> 
> I do general diet coaching which I enjoy so much, especially when people start to see results and begin to gain a greater understanding of diet and how to build and structure a plan for themselves.
> 
> ...


I always find you have an amazing way of communicating and explaining things - even for dopey people like me lol who need things very clearly explained and broken down - has helped me understand a lot about the cardio and food side of things


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## Northern Lass (Aug 10, 2011)

Suprakill4 said:


>


Cheers love


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## liam0810 (Jan 6, 2011)

Bad Alan said:


> Hit him on twitter mate, unsure whether he has space for anyone ATM tbf.
> 
> Best decision I've ever made working with Scott, excellent trainer and lifelong friend too. You'll find mixed reviews on here due to his "personality" coming through but if you're serious about hiring someone I'd recommend him very highly. Liam will say the same completely changed both our physiques and training attitudes.
> 
> ...


Yep 100% agree with this. Using Scott was best decision i've made. A lot of people on here slag him off for how he comes across but he is one of my closest mates after knowing him just under 2 years and if you look at his clients and how they have changed, the results of his work speaks for itself


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

liam0810 said:


> Yep 100% agree with this. Using Scott was best decision i've made. A lot of people on here slag him off for how he comes across but he is one of my closest mates after knowing him just under 2 years and if you look at his clients and how they have changed, the results of his work speaks for itself


All he did with you was turn you into a bigger slag !!!


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## liam0810 (Jan 6, 2011)

Milky said:


> All he did with you was turn you into a bigger slag !!!


That's very true and he did a great job at it! ha!


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## Kimball (Feb 26, 2012)

Nytol said:


> I'll agree with that part
> 
> As I'm sure TinyTom would.


It's amazing how someone can appear to know so much


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

The thing with any coach / mentor is you have to click with them and if you don't then its not going to work.

When l worked with Paul l took his word as gospel, l only questioned him purely for knowledge, not his methods and we worked great together ( IMO ).

IF you start with any coach with any doubts what so ever your not going to get into the swing of it because of these doubts.


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

Milky said:


> The thing with any coach / mentor is you have to click with them and if you don't then its not going to work.
> 
> When l worked with Paul l took his word as gospel, l only questioned him purely for knowledge, not his methods and we worked great together ( IMO ).
> 
> IF you start with any coach with any doubts what so ever your not going to get into the swing of it because of these doubts.


do you use a online coach? or somone you can meet up with? this is the biggest thing for me, i'd rather be able to meet my coach, and get opinions, rather than opinions of photos etc


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Cam93 said:


> do you use a online coach? or somone you can meet up with? this is the biggest thing for me, i'd rather be able to meet my coach, and get opinions, rather than opinions of photos etc


I was using @Pscarb services mate and it was mainly online but we did meet up on occasion and had the odd training session together.

The thing with face to face trainers is in all my years training l have met one man who l would pay for face to face training and he was a damn site more expensive than on line coaches. I also know lads who were paying a " trainer " £30 an hour, one of them was an old school mate of mine so l let him train with me for free and he got a lot more out of it than he did on £30 an hour !!


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## Cam93 (May 20, 2010)

Milky said:


> I was using @Pscarb services mate and it was mainly online but we did meet up on occasion and had the odd training session together.
> 
> The thing with face to face trainers is in all my years training l have met one man who l would pay for face to face training and he was a damn site more expensive than on line coaches. I also know lads who were paying a " trainer " £30 an hour, one of them was an old school mate of mine so l let him train with me for free and he got a lot more out of it than he did on £30 an hour !!


Yeah i know what you mean, that would end up very pricey. think im going to go with Solid tbh - too much bad reveiws about dutch for me - seems as if your not in his circle your just a money bank for him. wonder if he's been made aware of this thread? i may link him so he can have his fair say


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

Cam93 said:


> Yeah i know what you mean, that would end up very pricey. think im going to go with Solid tbh - too much bad reveiws about dutch for me - seems as if your not in his circle your just a money bank for him. wonder if he's been made aware of this thread? i may link him so he can have his fair say


Scott knows he has his fans and his enemies mate and from what l believe he has made changes to how he does things and how he operates, if its true l honestly don't know.

End of the day some people expect too much for what in some cases is less than £3 a day !!


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Cam93 said:


> Yeah i know what you mean, that would end up very pricey. think im going to go with Solid tbh - too much bad reveiws about dutch for me - seems as if your not in his circle your just a money bank for him. wonder if he's been made aware of this thread? i may link him so he can have his fair say


He won't post on here anymore mate or any forum. He does know of all goings on where he is being discussed 

He had a few problems on here as said but this is a tiny proportion of his clients and he has a big fan base because of the results he gets.

If you're a bodybuilder you'd have to convince him to work with you anyway as he doesn't take many if any on. As said he's more than likely full ATM as is.

@solidcecil would be a good choice.


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## musclemate (Sep 14, 2012)

bail said:


> haha I wait couple days then just bomb him with 50 questions all at once


Bloody hell. He must think I'm real low maintenance. I only get in contact with him every couple if weeks.


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## bail (Mar 19, 2010)

musclemate said:


> Bloody hell. He must think I'm real low maintenance. I only get in contact with him every couple if weeks.


I'm abit of a sad cvnt tbh mate lol


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## Superhorse (May 29, 2011)

Can you ask him for the £700+ he owes me if he's such a good guy and he chats to your regularly as all I get are pathetic lies.



Bad Alan said:


> He won't post on here anymore mate or any forum. He does know of all goings on where he is being discussed
> 
> He had a few problems on here as said but this is a tiny proportion of his clients and he has a big fan base because of the results he gets.
> 
> ...


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## Chelsea (Sep 19, 2009)

Superhorse said:


> Can you ask him for the £700+ he owes me if he's such a good guy and he chats to your regularly as all I get are pathetic lies.


Out of interest what was the £700+ for?


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Superhorse said:


> Can you ask him for the £700+ he owes me if he's such a good guy and he chats to your regularly as all I get are pathetic lies.


Your name seems familiar are you the veggie/workout from home guy?

Take your issues up with Scott, do I look like your errand boy? Speak to him on the phone and by text everyday and have more important things to talk about than you.

Don't come to me with this attitude out of no where and expect a nice response.


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## Superhorse (May 29, 2011)

(i) No I'm not that weird guy - how exactly would those 2 accounts correlate in any way? Not sure why you feel the need to jump to such an extreme assumption

(ii) Not sure why you think it's so rude of me to ask for money he's scamming - happy to share the various ridiculous emails if you like to show you what you don't seem to grasp right now. Why would you think it strange to ask someone who knows him to help address the issue properly. If someone said my mate was doing something dodgy I would at least pose the question.

(iii) You have more important things to talk about than his criminal activity? I could see why you would say that for yourself personally of course but how about opening your eyes to the bigger world and seeing that it's not just some weird sub-section that isn't happy with him and that maybe he did something wrong that he should put right.

Why do you think I expected a nice response? It was more in hope that someone could actually talk to him and elicit a non lie/scam response if they actually knew him. Doesn't seem unreasonable to me.



Bad Alan said:


> Your name seems familiar are you the veggie/workout from home guy?
> 
> Take your issues up with Scott, do I look like your errand boy? Speak to him on the phone and by text everyday and have more important things to talk about than you.
> 
> Don't come to me with this attitude out of no where and expect a nice response.


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## Queenie (May 30, 2013)

@Superhorse....

1) Are u saying veggies are weird? That's not nice.

2) It's got nothing to do with Bad Alan whatsoever. It's about YOUR dealings with Scott.... I would never pussy out and use a middle man. Your business is your business and u shouldn't really drag other people into it.

3) Of course they don't talk about criminal activity. What a boring subject. They talk about their girlfriends and how amazing they are


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Superhorse said:


> (i) No I'm not that weird guy - how exactly would those 2 accounts correlate in any way? Not sure why you feel the need to jump to such an extreme assumption
> 
> (ii) Not sure why you think it's so rude of me to ask for money he's scamming - happy to share the various ridiculous emails if you like to show you what you don't seem to grasp right now. Why would you think it strange to ask someone who knows him to help address the issue properly. If someone said my mate was doing something dodgy I would at least pose the question.
> 
> ...


How about a nicely worded PM informing me of the entire situation from start to end and appealing to my good nature?

Not a slanderous and expectant post on a public forum slating one of my good friends?

Got yourself off to a flyer mate.

Two reasons;

Scott is not a hard man to find, if he owed me £700 I'd have been knocking on his door or turning up at his gym a long time ago.

If you had a case you'd have initiated small claims court action.

Yes I have better things to do than clear up after your nonsense. I missed the part where I was under your employ?


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## Northern Lass (Aug 10, 2011)

Bad Alan said:


> How about a nicely worded PM informing me of the entire situation from start to end and appealing to my good nature?
> 
> Not a slanderous and expectant post on a public forum slating one of my good friends?
> 
> ...


Exactly.


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## romper stomper (Sep 26, 2012)

> too much bad reveiws about dutch for me -


Well Dutch Scott did have a little arrogance when he first came on the site - but his physical transformations were absolutely amazing - his training methods different - gained my absolute respect that's for sure

And any trainer who could get a Pilsbury dough boy down to fantastic shape speaks absolute volumes (Ie Rack)

Its a shame he does not post here any more- Bad Al say hello to him from Romper


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## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

FWIW My time with Scott was good, we became very good friends and yep, he got me ripped. I know some people didn't like him or how he worked but I can't and won't comment on that as it's none of my business.

Spoke with him over xmas too in case people think there's any friction between us.


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

romper stomper said:


> Well Dutch Scott did have a little arrogance when he first came on the site - but his physical transformations were absolutely amazing - his training methods different - gained my absolute respect that's for sure
> 
> And any trainer who could get a Pilsbury dough boy down to fantastic shape speaks absolute volumes (Ie Rack)
> 
> Its a shame he does not post here any more- Bad Al say hello to him from Romper


Agree on @RACK 

I will do mate !


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## romper stomper (Sep 26, 2012)

Ps - sorry Rack 

thanks big al


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## RACK (Aug 20, 2007)

No need to be sorry at all mate


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## romper stomper (Sep 26, 2012)

If people think it is expensive to hire a professional

Wait until they hire an armature


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

Wouldn't trust the guy with a barge pole. . It seems if you're lucky and he takes a shine to you, you may get a decent service. Just too many disgruntled customers ,I've never seen any other trainer that offers online services have so many people complaining about being scammed, crap service etc.

Guy may know his stuff but seems like has a very poor business approach.


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## kingdale (Nov 2, 2010)

Put up the emails!


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

kingdale said:


> Put up the emails!


For what purpose? Your entertainment?

@Milky think the thread has served its purpose in regards to the OP now?


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

Iirc they've been up before lol and everyone told this guy he was a tool and the agreement of service was met.


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## kingdale (Nov 2, 2010)

Bad Alan said:


> For what purpose? Your entertainment?
> 
> @Milky think the thread has served its purpose in regards to the OP now?


Yes for my entertainment. Funny how you defend him so much and as soon as there's possibly proof of what he is really like you want it shut ASAP :lol:


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## kingdale (Nov 2, 2010)

Bad Alan said:


> Iirc they've been up before lol and everyone told this guy he was a tool and the agreement of service was met.


This isn't him


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## marknorthumbria (Oct 1, 2009)

8 pages of pointlessness; the man doesnt need his ego fed any more


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## josephbloggs (Sep 29, 2013)

Bad Alan said:


> Iirc they've been up before lol and everyone told this guy he was a tool and the agreement of service was met.


The problem is it's not just this one person complaining . I've seen a few threads now with people complaining about being done out of money or getting a crappy service. Why is he the only trainer on the boards that is attracting these reviews. Is there some conspiracy against the poor guy or something?


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

kingdale said:


> Yes for my entertainment. Funny how you defend him so much and as soon as there's possibly proof of what he is really like you want it shut ASAP :lol:


This guy has put the emails up before.

Scott doesn't operate on here anymore and if this guy is owed the amount he says then why is the only thing he's doing about it moaning on the Internet.

I'm at altered image on Friday if you want to discuss this further, not going to listen to people who have no interaction or involvement with my mate use it for their entertainment.


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## Bad Alan (Dec 30, 2010)

josephbloggs said:


> The problem is it's not just this one person complaining . I've seen a few threads now with people complaining about being done out of money or getting a crappy service. Why is he the only trainer on the boards that is attracting these reviews. Is there some conspiracy against the poor guy or something?


He's not even on here anymore.

You clearly haven't been here long enough to comment, so have no reason to comment if we are using threads based on helping out the OP.


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## kingdale (Nov 2, 2010)

Bad Alan said:


> This guy has put the emails up before.
> 
> Scott doesn't operate on here anymore and if this guy is owed the amount he says then why is the only thing he's doing about it moaning on the Internet.
> 
> I'm at altered image on Friday if you want to discuss this further, not going to listen to people who have no interaction or involvement with my mate use it for their entertainment.


I don't think he has put then up you ate getting it confused for the veggie guy. You started talking to me about it I was just encouraging him to put emails up then you jumped in.


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## Milky (Nov 30, 2008)

End of the day like everyone Scott has his friends and his enemies, but we are nit going to allow continual slating of him for his past.

We all make mistakes and bottom line isnif you want to give him a try the do so, uf you don't then don't, no oen is forcing anyone to hand there money over.

Closed as l dont think it needs to be discussed any further TBH.


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