# Does Natural Bodybuilding truly exist?



## travelsofar (Nov 11, 2010)

I call myself a natural bodybuilder. I understand and respect my own genetic limitations. Without drugs my goals are different to others, to get 18 inch arms and even look like a bodybuilder has been a very honest journey, albeit a lonely one.

I can put my hand on my heart and say I've never taken steroids, but feel the range of supplements out there now, the line is beginning to fade. Have now stopped supplements and just eat very healthy power foods to still hold the title of Natural BB. So am I in the wilderness here? how many of us left?


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## Craig660 (Dec 8, 2005)

For about 2-3 months...


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## Soul keeper (Jul 7, 2010)

Did it for many many years even competed, but lost heart totally as I had reached my bodies limitations.


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## empzb (Jan 8, 2006)

It does, but I can't see the point of 'all natural'. Whey for example comes in many foods eaten on a daily basis, so seeing as I've had it in those, that rules out not having that a supplement. Creatine is in steak so might as well add that to the diet in the form of supps too.

cheaper, more convenient too.


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## God (Sep 3, 2009)

You wouldn't play football in slippers...


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

travelsofar said:


> I call myself a natural bodybuilder. I understand and respect my own genetic limitations. Without drugs my goals are different to others, to get 18 inch arms and even look like a bodybuilder has been a very honest journey, albeit a lonely one.
> 
> I can put my hand on my heart and say I've never taken steroids, but feel the range of supplements out there now, the line is beginning to fade. Have now stopped supplements and just eat very healthy power foods to still hold the title of Natural BB. So am I in the wilderness here? how many of us left?


Well first off, respect for your approach and path taken, I couldn't do it.

Natural bodybuilding is anything but. Whey proteins as they exist in tubs are not natural, creatines as they exist in tubs are not natural. High vitamin intakes are not natural (try eating all the fruit and veg to get one even poor quality vit tab, you'll never be off bog).

So many more things, that are far from natural, if you go strictly by the meaning of the word.

Then there are the ones who claim "natural" but are using growth hormones, quick exit steroids etc... don't know any personally but I am assured by people in the know that they exist.

At the very least they should rename it OTC bodybuilding... but then they can't even do that because some of the substances on teh banend list are OTC :lol:

God knows... would def say you are in the wilderness though


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## rs007 (May 28, 2007)

empzb said:


> It does, but I can't see the point of 'all natural'. Whey for example comes in many foods eaten on a daily basis, so seeing as I've had it in those, that rules out not having that a supplement. Creatine is in steak so might as well add that to the diet in the form of supps too.
> 
> cheaper, more convenient too.


There will be traces of testosterone in steak too, testosterone is a perfectly natural substance - so we should allow natural bbers to use testosterone then, going by your logic :lol:


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## God (Sep 3, 2009)

rs007 said:


> There will be traces of testosterone in steak too, testosterone is a perfectly natural substance - so we should allow natural bbers to use testosterone then, going by your logic :lol:


:laugh: Not going to boost your test much by eating it though is it. Natural bodybuilders should be allowed to drink amps of testosterone but not inject...happy :tongue:


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## CoffeeFiend (Aug 31, 2010)

The Spartans and Myrmidon managed quite well a couple thousand years ago :whistling:


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## Barker (Oct 1, 2009)

Respect you for keeping natty mate, i hope to stay natty for a while (no roids, still use supps), got any pictures of yourself?


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

this all depends on your own definition and terms. is it natural to pay to go somewhere to lift a piece of rubber/metal up and down? is it natural to count calories? where do you draw the line? i choose to take my lead from the BNBF banned list. this is what i stick to and this, to me, means i am a natural bodybuilder. i know other that consider themselves to be natural when they aren't on aas cycle...which is what i think Muscle Mania in the US basically goes by(1-5 years drug free, apparently)!


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

it does..and it does'nt:confused1:


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

Ah stop fvcking about with sematics!

Natural bodybuilding means you don't **** with your HPTA and other hormone systems like thyroid.

Natural bb is the best bb but unless you have some really really REALLY special genetics forget about ever looking overly special.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

mal said:


> it does..and it does'nt:confused1:


 i went to a natural show and though this is different. people all started diving in a pool and racing each other


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## a.notherguy (Nov 17, 2008)

im a natty and my definition of a natty is someone who has never used sythetic hormones or any precursors to them. i have used test boosting sups in the past but i think that anything that manipulates the natural test production is a natty sup.

i sometimes get a bit downhearted when i see lads make more progress in a year 'assisted' than i have done in many years of hard graft but i feel no resentment as its all down to personal choice.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

a.notherguy said:


> im a natty and my definition of a natty is someone who has never used sythetic hormones or any precursors to them. i have used test boosting sups in the past but i think that anything that manipulates the natural test production is a natty sup.
> 
> i sometimes get a bit downhearted when i see lads make more progress in a year 'assisted' than i have done in many years of hard graft but i feel no resentment as its all down to personal choice.


 Its a personal journey we are all on mate.

Pay no heed to things you can not control and focus on the present moment and on your self:thumbup1:


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

i must say tho..ive never seen a good natural bb,they always

seem to have a glaring weekness somewhere,but if you want

to just look good in jeans n stuff,a bit of delt and arms going

on...its ok.and a 28 inch waist


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## DNC (Jan 8, 2009)

mal said:


> i must say tho..ive never seen a good natural bb,they always
> 
> seem to have a glaring weekness somewhere,but if you want
> 
> ...


Have you never seen Glen Danbury off here mate?? He'd wipe the floor with 80% of the assisted guys on here


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## danny1871436114701 (May 2, 2010)

I read a lee priest article in MD he stated that what is natural as the natty show in USA you have to be one year clean, where as in UK BNBF is 10 years


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

DNC said:


> Have you never seen Glen Danbury off here mate?? He'd wipe the floor with 80% of the assisted guys on here


 Oh dear don't start this DNC:rolleyes:

Yes his condition is superb but there are other factors like size to pay attention to.

Danny over here many feds count you as natural as long as you only use otc stuff.

So yes you can run drugs just need to be bought legally.


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## God (Sep 3, 2009)

DNC said:


> Have you never seen Glen Danbury off here mate?? He'd wipe the floor with 80% of the assisted guys on here


Yep, same with Fivos.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

here we go, condition condition condition


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## DNC (Jan 8, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> Oh dear don't start this DNC:rolleyes:
> 
> Yes his condition is superb but there are other factors like size to pay attention to.
> 
> ...


Well yes i agree on the size factor.There is only so far natural can take you,they will never ever get as big as the assisted guys as long as i have a hole in my ar5e but can get looking pretty big.

I'd take the natural looking big over the assisted all day long but thats just my opinion


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

mal said:


> i must say tho..ive never seen a good natural bb,they always
> 
> seem to have a glaring weekness somewhere,but if you want
> 
> ...


Bit of a stupid post, Michael Hannam trains at my gym and he's bigger than any assisted blokes in the gym by a long stretch.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

DNC said:


> Have you never seen Glen Danbury off here mate?? He'd wipe the floor with 80% of the assisted guys on here


yes he probably would,not dissin it mate just my opinion,what im

saying is for most its impossible to build a perfectly ballanced body

without drugs,and i know.some body parts dont respond.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

benicillin said:


> Bit of a stupid post, Michael Hannam trains at my gym and he's bigger than any assisted blokes in the gym by a long stretch.


 I just googled this guy. If the assisted guys are smaller than him obviously they have no idea what they are doing


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> *I just googled this guy*. If the assisted guys are smaller than him obviously they have no idea what they are doing


ha ha. so did i


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## DNC (Jan 8, 2009)

mal said:


> yes he probably would,not dissin it mate just my opinion,what im
> 
> saying is for most its impossible to build a perfectly ballanced body
> 
> without drugs,and i know.some body parts dont respond.


I agree mate,i struggle like fcuk to put any size on really,i know by staying natural got a lot more years of training to go but i enjoy so not bothered.

Steriods are just not part of my life and probably never will be.


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> I just googled this guy. If the assisted guys are smaller than him obviously they have no idea what they are doing


well granted, none of them compete. I was just making a point that its unfair to say 'no naturals look good'


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

benicillin said:


> Bit of a stupid post, Michael Hannam trains at my gym and he's bigger than any assisted blokes in the gym by a long stretch.


really lol..someone post up these pics then,il take a look.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

benicillin said:


> well granted, none of them compete. I was just making a point that its unfair to say 'none of them look good'


 Of course they look good in certain cases.

But on the other hand lets take a different view.

How many bodybuilders assisted or natural actually look perfect as in every body part is well developed, nothing looks stumpy, skin and appearance is healthy?

Not very many IMO.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

benicillin said:


> well granted, none of them compete. I was just making a point that its unfair to say* 'no naturals look good'*


 :lol: when did i say that,thats not what i said lol,i said you can look

good with certain body parts and retain a small waist,but not that

you plum.


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

mal said:


> really lol..someone post up these pics then,il take a look.


quite frankly, i cba to go to the effort of putting up pictures for you when you won't agree anyway, google him if you wanna see.

My point was - to say no naturals look good is rubbish imo

But then thats my opinion and you're entitled to yours so whatever


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

mal said:


> i must say tho..*ive never seen a good natural bb*,they always
> 
> seem to have a glaring weekness somewhere,but if you want
> 
> ...


 :confused1:


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

natural bodybuilder,as in a perfect ballanced body..which is the

point im making,but ye see what you mean lol,could have typed

that better


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

all joking aside, whats a heavyweight in natural bb. guy who lived near me was natural heavy and was around 12st 10lb soaking wet ?


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

benicillin said:


> :confused1:


 Yeah he is saying HE has never seen a good natural bb.

I bet he hasn't seen EVERY natural bb on this planet

Honestly the best natural bb will be athletes from other sports who don't do bb like some of the african sprinters.


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

saw some big barstewards when i went to jamaica as well working on the beaches etc and got talking to a couple of them about training, asked if they did any and their reply was 'no, just eat mango for breakfast, and eat fish all day'. Awesome genetics


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> Yeah he is saying HE has never seen a good natural bb.
> 
> I bet he hasn't seen EVERY natural bb on this planet
> 
> Honestly the best natural bb will be athletes from other sports who don't do bb like some of the african sprinters.


some of those guys are pretty well developed,i was gonna say dwain

chambers for a second tho linford christie had a superb body

in his prime.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

mal said:


> some of those guys are pretty well developed,i was gonna say dwain
> 
> chambers for a second tho linford christie had a superb body
> 
> in his prime.


linford, ha. he is as natural as a silicone tit


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## Barker (Oct 1, 2009)

while were here, is Skip La Cour actually natural, is there proof of this?

'cause he's huge if he is


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

1russ100 said:


> linford, ha. he is as natural as a silicone tit


had some crazy condition tho...you saying thats down to

creatine or something.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

mal said:


> had some crazy condition tho...you saying thats down to
> 
> creatine or something.


its a hard one coz he had some tool on him and a set of nads like addidas jupolanis


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## CJ (Apr 24, 2006)

My first cycle was after 12 months of training,

TBH I had absolutely no idea what my potential was going the natural route.

12 months was far to little really but I made a decision to run a Tbol course.

Huge respect for those who choose the natural route, but its not like they are doing anything the guys on roids aren't. Both will push there bodys to the absolute limit, its just that the steriod user will have the ability push those limits further.


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## mal (Dec 31, 2009)

1russ100 said:


> its a hard one coz he had some tool on him and a set of nads like addidas jupolanis


gave him balance down the track apparently,he's in that

jungle thing on tv lol.


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## Magic Torch (May 30, 2005)

1russ100 said:


> linford, ha. he is as natural as a silicone tit


PMSL


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

1russ100 said:


> all joking aside, whats a heavyweight in natural bb. guy who lived near me was natural heavy and was around 12st 10lb soaking wet ?


i compete as a heavy with the BNBF mate, typically 93/94kg on stage. and 105k-113kg off season. guidelines are 80kg of above for BNBF and 78kg or above for NPA, i believe.

Ben, Mike is indeed a beast. hence the 2009 World title!


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

MrO2b said:


> i compete as a heavy with the BNBF mate, typically 93/94kg on stage. and 105k-113kg off season. guidelines are 80kg of above for BNBF and 78kg or above for NPA, i believe.
> 
> Ben, Mike is indeed a beast. hence the 2009 World title!


cool. thanks, i have no knowledge of natural bb apart from a few anb shows i went to years ago


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## DNC (Jan 8, 2009)

For me to look good i don't need drugs.

To look big i would.


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

lets not forget- there are plenty assisted guys out there that 90% of us would still consider 'small'. magic wand, it aint.


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## bizzlewood (Dec 16, 2007)

Do you think that's because they aren't training hard or their diet is ****?


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## DNC (Jan 8, 2009)

bizzlewood said:


> Do you think that's because they aren't training hard or their diet is ****?


Probably both


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

bizzlewood said:


> Do you think that's because they aren't training hard or their diet is ****?


the only thing i would say, is from what i read training wise, people are so scared of overtraining, they actually arnt doing enough


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## bizzlewood (Dec 16, 2007)

You're probably right but if they are undertraining wouldn't they notice the lack of natty gains and put two and two together?


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

1russ100 said:


> the only thing i would say, is from what i read training wise, people are so scared of overtraining, they actually arnt doing enough


over training? who do you know or have read about that actually/truly fits that- for the whole body though? how many people want to do too many squats or deads or bb rows or leg presses? it's always too much arms or chest or shoulders, ie the front of the top of the body. natural, unnatural, super natural it don't seem to matter as the mistake crosses all boundaries.


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## Matt 1 (May 8, 2010)

benicillin said:


> quite frankly, i cba to go to the effort of putting up pictures for you when you won't agree anyway, google him if you wanna see.
> 
> *My point was - to say no naturals look good is rubbish imo *
> 
> But then thats my opinion and you're entitled to yours so whatever


Can't disagree with that :beer:


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

Mr02b... would you be the gentlemen i just had a chat with down the gym....?


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## F.M.J (Mar 23, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> Oh dear don't start this DNC:rolleyes:
> 
> Yes his condition is superb but there are other factors like size to pay attention to.
> 
> ...


Phew, I'm natural then!  I felt a bit of a [email protected] when I started training with my mate, he's been training 10 years natural and he's hoping to do his first show soon and I did a course of M-drol (don't need opinions on this please, I've used it twice and gained fantastic on them) and my lifts and size just boomed - every session we had I was stronger and bigger and he's hit a plateau. 

Everyone has a choice at the end of the day.


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## tomass1342 (Nov 12, 2009)

I trained natural for about 3-4 years. Im now finishing my second cycle. Have gained more in the past 6 months than i did in those 3-4 years training.


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## ekko (Dec 3, 2008)

God said:


> You wouldn't play football in slippers...


lol !


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## james12345 (Jan 13, 2010)

a.notherguy said:


> i have used test boosting sups in the past but i think that anything that manipulates the natural test production is a natty sup.


so to manipulate natural gh production by ghrp's you would still class as natural?


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## danny1871436114701 (May 2, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Oh dear don't start this DNC:rolleyes:
> 
> Yes his condition is superb but there are other factors like size to pay attention to.
> 
> ...


Lois lane can I be nosy and ask how much you weigh and what height you are as your back is thick 

Also how long have you competed? any contest pics?

I am nosy as looking to compete next year

no need to worry if you think I am being to nosy LOL


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## Andy Dee (Jun 1, 2008)

Ive nothing against guys who are against gear using and think/do/get the can get the great body they desire all is fair.

But for me, I also believe its possible to get rid of a headache without taking paracetamol, but I prefer not to suffer and wait if im being really honest.


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

danny187 said:


> Lois lane can I be nosy and ask how much you weigh and what height you are as your back is thick
> 
> Also how long have you competed? any contest pics?
> 
> ...


 Sure why not

5ft8

250lb in the picture

Contest history as far bodybuilding goes

Palmetto cup 2009 novice class 1st place body weight 208lb

Europe show of champions heavy weight class 2010 1st place body weight 215lb

Yes back is thick but it is by far my best body part it has carried me through my contests as there were guys with bigger every thing else yet they lacked a back completely. I have ok every thing else and a big back = win.


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## danny1871436114701 (May 2, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Sure why not
> 
> 5ft8
> 
> ...


Thanks nice one on the wins  so are you a pro BB or amateur

I am looking at a show next November but need 6 months of bulk from Jan first especially legs


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

danny187 said:


> Thanks nice one on the wins  so are you a pro BB or amateur
> 
> I am looking at a show next November but need 6 months of bulk from Jan first especially legs


 Lol you obviously do not know much about bb

Amateur mate, honestly i was lucky to have a win in my last show as i really messed up my condition with the carb up losing all cuts in my legs. But you can't change who turns up and i was very happy to win.

I am already dieting for shows next year....no such thing as too lean!

Here is a picture.....i am in a bad mood now as by searching for pictures i have just learnt i came 5th in the overall so pretty much got whipped big time by every one bar one guy LOL condition is key.... this is the heavy class and i am in the middle


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

I think natties can look great, but to look like a top bodybuilder it's pretty much impossible without breaking the natty bubble.

It seems to me that people who have trained for a number of years mostly go one of two ways - either they become less focused on bb'ing and start training all kinds of other ways and often stay natty, or the decide they wanna keep bodybuilding and often end up experimenting with PEDs.

For me I kinda went down the first path, but if I ever decided to bodybuild properly I'd have no issue about grabbing for the steds... safe if used properly, and allow a much quicker route to the physique I'd be after.


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## danny1871436114701 (May 2, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> *Lol you obviously do not know much about bb*
> 
> Amateur mate, honestly i was lucky to have a win in my last show as i really messed up my condition with the carb up losing all cuts in my legs. But you can't change who turns up and i was very happy to win.
> 
> ...


Well thought I would ask as your sponsored and had twpo 1st places and not sure how it works over there for pro card etc.

Yeah I am 5.9 and 94kg will enter under 80kgs but first bulk to around 100kg I reckon, bit nervous but hey wont know until I try


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

danny187 said:


> Well thought I would ask as your sponsored and had twpo 1st places and not sure how it works over there for pro card etc.
> 
> Yeah I am 5.9 and 94kg will enter under 80kgs but first bulk to around 100kg I reckon, bit nervous but hey wont know until I try


 Well i appreciate the compliment buddy

Good luck with your show, don't get too heavy.

Personally i make my best gains dieting as my metabolism and eating is just completely on point.


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## danny1871436114701 (May 2, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Well i appreciate the compliment buddy
> 
> Good luck with your show, don't get too heavy.
> 
> Personally i make my best gains dieting as my metabolism and eating is just completely on point.


Thanks, I wont get to heavy as I am reevalating my diet all these carbs making me feel rubbish so time for a change I think, just dont like adjusting things in PCT


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## Paul Amos (Mar 2, 2009)




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## welshflame (May 21, 2009)

It certainly does exist and im as natural as they come never having done anything like gear or any cylce etc  .


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

welshflame said:


> It certainly does exist and im as natural as they come never having done anything like gear or any cylce etc  .


 I didn't know you did bodybuilding, which shows have you done?


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## welshflame (May 21, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> I didn't know you did bodybuilding, which shows have you done?


Yeah indeed I do :S. I never done a show before I do it for me because its how i want to look. But never say never show wise


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

welshflame said:


> Yeah indeed I do :S. I never done a show before I do it for me because its how i want to look. But never say never show wise


 Oh so you recreationally build your body, sorry i thought you meant you were a bodybuilder as in a competitive bodybuilder, gotcha:thumbup1:


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> sorry i thought you meant you were a bodybuilder as in a competitive bodybuilder, gotcha:thumbup1:


for some unknown reason, and it's just a hunch, i think you knew that....


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## welshflame (May 21, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> Oh so you recreationally build your body, sorry i thought you meant you were a bodybuilder as in a competitive bodybuilder, gotcha:thumbup1:


Omg no im not competitive by any means yet haha. Yeah I guess you could say I do it recreationally but my mind is turning towards maybe competitive in the future. Just have to see what happens really. Trouble is I doubt I will ever feel ready because I dont tend to see what other people do haha. I got to say dude you look bloody great in that pic  .


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## Lois_Lane (Jul 21, 2009)

MrO2b said:


> for some unknown reason, and it's just a hunch, i think you knew that....


 I have no idea what you are talking about........ 



welshflame said:


> Omg no im not competitive by any means yet haha. Yeah I guess you could say I do it recreationally but my mind is turning towards maybe competitive in the future. Just have to see what happens really. Trouble is I doubt I will ever feel ready because I dont tend to see what other people do haha. I got to say dude you look bloody great in that pic  .


 Thank you for the compliment welshflame.

I wish you luck in your future goals the only tip i could give that i think truly matters is keep a log book of your diet/training/life style and progress it will really become the ongoing map of your muscular existance.


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## welshflame (May 21, 2009)

Lois_Lane said:


> I have no idea what you are talking about........
> 
> Thank you for the compliment welshflame.
> 
> I wish you luck in your future goals the only tip i could give that i think truly matters is keep a log book of your diet/training/life style and progress it will really become the ongoing map of your muscular existance.


No probs dude  . Hmm that would be a good idea actually and I think I will start doing that. I might even do some sort of chart with it all on. Till now I have just done whats in my head in terms of training etc. Deffo food for thought. Cheers con  .


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Did this just slip into the 'your not a body builder unless you compete' discussion again.


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## d4ead (Nov 3, 2008)

Bodybuilding is recreational shows or no shows until you turn pro.


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## adlewar (Oct 14, 2008)

totally nothing against being natural, but unless you've got outstanding genetics (which few have) why would you bust your bollox in the gym to stay looking sh!t???

with the help of a small ammount of AAS you could look 100 times better, and its been proven you can still 'use' gear and remain healthy..

i was natty for years, but seems now to me that training without gear is like skydiving without a plane...

the reason all of us are in this game is to look good, end of.. surely anything that helps you achieve this goal has gotta be done....


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## Marshan (Aug 27, 2010)

adlewar said:


> totally nothing against being natural, but unless you've got outstanding genetics (which few have) why would you bust your bollox in the gym to stay looking sh!t???
> 
> with the help of a small ammount of AAS you could look 100 times better, and its been proven you can still 'use' gear and remain healthy..
> 
> ...


Definitely agree with you and indeed most replies here. I know 'genetically gifted' lads who were disgusted and sickened with themselves after their first cycles. But I think the OP was just querying about natty BBing in general,as in,BNBF no?


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

adlewar said:


> totally nothing against being natural, but unless you've got outstanding genetics (which few have) why would you bust your bollox in the gym to stay looking sh!t???
> 
> with the help of a small ammount of AAS you could look 100 times better, and its been proven you can still 'use' gear and remain healthy..
> 
> ...


you don't have to have 'outstanding genetics' to improve. it's not all about the final destination, most of the time the journey itself can be very rewarding and enjoyable. as for looking good- it's all relative, no a natural is ever going to match up to Ronnie/Kai/Dorian/Cutler, but how many assisted guys actually do? at least the naturals don't have to worry about gyno/acne/impotence etc.

natural and assisted have both got their place, but to say one is best just isn't possible.


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## travelsofar (Nov 11, 2010)

It's nice to know us natty's have some respect. It's should work both ways. I used to be very anti steriod, but can see both sides now, to the point of having some respect too. It's not an easy choice but can see most are careful and know what they are doing, then good luck to them. I'll hit them squats (break parallel) and eat my power foods, I'm making gains, just rather slow. At the end of the day, you got to go to war at the gym, whatever you choose to use.


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## james12345 (Jan 13, 2010)

welshflame said:


> No probs dude  . Hmm that would be a good idea actually and I think I will start doing that. I might even do some sort of chart with it all on. Till now I have just done whats in my head in terms of training etc. Deffo food for thought. Cheers con  .


whos that in your avatar pic mate?


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

May I jump in here and ask if Jeff Willett (spelling?) is actually natural? Saw him in that american documentary "I want to look like that guy" or whatever, and he looked huge. Then saw a few sarcy comments about him not being natural, so I'm confused.


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## God (Sep 3, 2009)

He's admitted to taking prohormones but apparently low dosages. Make your own mind up on that one...


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

God said:


> He's admitted to taking prohormones but apparently low dosages. Make your own mind up on that one...


 :lol: I see. In some states that still makes him natural right? I wonder if he did GH and just never got detected.


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## God (Sep 3, 2009)

He comes across as very genuine and I would like to believe him but we will never really know for sure.


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

Yeh, well if he was natural then fair play to him :thumb: Skip Lacour looks 'less' natural IMO.


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## cecil_sensation (Jan 26, 2009)

im natural.

i dont call myself a bb and dout ill ever look special.

i have made some great gains in the past with just diet and training.

but i do always ask myself how would i look and gain if i went on the steds?

but natural bb is great imo. but ,ost guys i no who used to be natty are now not.

imo a natty is some one who hasent used any type of sted at all not even oral.


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

cecil_sensation said:


> not even oral.


 Why would oral steds be different from injectables anyway? Steds are steds full stop surely.


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## Dantreadz85 (Jun 4, 2009)

im natural and made some great gains over the last few years but am strongly considering gear , just worried about my nuts shrinking that would freak me out lol


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## R11HNO (Dec 27, 2010)

Natural does exist and those that enjoy the sport through out there lifes, chances are they are natural. Taking protien powders are just a convinient and quick way to eat when your on the move and do not distract from being Natural. http://hubpages.com/hub/Steroids-vs-Natuaral-body-building


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## fatbstard (Jan 19, 2011)

Hello everyone, I'm new to the forum and I'm 100% natural but also near the smallest (out of the people you can tell go to the gym, if you know what I mean) when I go to gyms, its a bi*%h! Been training 5-6 days a week for 7 years and prior to that 5 years on off. If only steroids where healthy!


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## Hendrix (Sep 16, 2009)

That Michael Hannan looks pretty good and big to me.


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## Rekless (May 5, 2009)

Still Natty. Will be for a while until i feel a have a decent enough base to begin AAS.

A lot of 'Nattys' use HGH etc....But as it not AAS they claim to be natty stilll...

Most of the famous natty guys i feel have used, Skip, Cordova etc


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## milla04 (Jan 19, 2011)

Natural does exist and im a proof of tht playing pro football im 16.3st atm. and those that enjoy the sport through out there lifes, i enjoy gyming n playing football. Taking protien powders are just a convinient and quick way to eat when your on the move and do not distract from being Natural, however, it does work but what kind of effects will be in the future thats sumthing unclear. lots of in info from Tom Venuto. check it out.www.fat2burn.net/category/burning-fat or www.fat2burn.net/category/vitamins/


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

hendrix said:


> That Michael Hannan looks pretty good and big to me.


He is a big lad


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## MrO2b (Aug 19, 2010)

benicillin said:


> He is a big lad


Mike Hannam is a lump! and i get to see him train first hand- he trains at my Gym!


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## IrishRaver (Feb 4, 2010)

Lois_Lane said:


> Ah stop fvcking about with sematics!
> 
> Natural bodybuilding means you don't **** with your HPTA and other hormone systems like thyroid.
> 
> Natural bb is the best bb but unless you have some really really REALLY special genetics forget about ever looking overly special.


Exactly. Natural bodybuilding shouldn't be taken literally, it means 'without the help of AAS and other hormones'


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## IrishRaver (Feb 4, 2010)

tom0311 said:


> Why would oral steds be different from injectables anyway? Steds are steds full stop surely.


Because you're very limited to the gains you will get from an oral only course. Very limited


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

IrishRaver said:


> Because you're very limited to the gains you will get from an oral only course. Very limited


So you're saying orals are not steroids? :confused1:


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## Hard Trainer (Apr 29, 2009)

To be honest I wouldn't mind some test boosters or T-Bullets but I am a type 1 diabetic and no one seems to know how they will affect my sugar lvels


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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

benicillin said:


> So you're saying orals are not steroids? :confused1:


That was my point 2  Doesn't make sense does it. We're not talking about how effective they are. They are still steroids.


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## benicillin (Feb 28, 2010)

Yeah don't really see the argument there. Orals are still an AAS regardless of their effectiveness compared to injected steroids


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## hamsternuts (Feb 8, 2009)




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## tom0311 (Nov 17, 2008)

I think the can was opened on page 1 mate, lol.


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## hamsternuts (Feb 8, 2009)

i know i only just saw this thread though!


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## cas (Jan 9, 2011)

travelsofar said:


> I call myself a natural bodybuilder. I understand and respect my own genetic limitations. Without drugs my goals are different to others, to get 18 inch arms and even look like a bodybuilder has been a very honest journey, albeit a lonely one.
> 
> I can put my hand on my heart and say I've never taken steroids, but feel the range of supplements out there now, the line is beginning to fade. Have now stopped supplements and just eat very healthy power foods to still hold the title of Natural BB. So am I in the wilderness here? how many of us left?


i was thinking of fixing the head gasket on my car but instead of using all the tools avalible to me i am going to use the tips of my fingers to tighten the bolts 

sometimes help is needed, why make it harder for yourself?


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## fatbstard (Jan 19, 2011)

Some people have different goals. My goal is to get as big as I can naturally, my best mates goal is to get as big as he can! And meaning muscular when I say big. We started training at the same time, we made about the same gains for 4 years then my mate decided enough of this natural lark I wanna get BIG. So three years on I am about 3/4 to 1 stone heavier (12-14% bodyfat), he is 5 stone heavier and a beast (10% bodyfat). See I want to be natural so my size is as such, he doesnt care about being natural and he's a monster and looks awsome. Each to their own! Natural for me not natrual for others, we all do it coz we like training, if you didnt you wouldnt have any size coz you wouldnt train and eat hard enough. The only thing that ****es me off about some steroid takers, is they dont admit it, take another friend of mine, goes straight into the gym and after 6 months starts taking some heavy **** 6 months later is looking quite big, everyone we know is like man you look good, wow thats wicked, how did you do that, he's like go gym 4 times a week, spend about 1.5 hours there, Im like tell them the truth, I go to the gym but I put 2 stone on because I have been taking steroids.


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## cas (Jan 9, 2011)

i have never taken a steroid yet....but i can see why your friend doesnt want many people to know.


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## Joshua (Aug 21, 2008)

*Natural or chemically assisted.*

I view Natties/natural bodybuilders/athletes as being one who has not used drugs (pharmacologically active agents) that have not been genuinely prescribed for a medical condition by a medical practitioner.

Pharmaceutically Assisted Athletes would include anyone who has used things that affect androgen/estrogen/GH signalling whether orally, by injection or rubbing it into your hair. Any injection of peptide, or prohormone use would all be included too. That would also oddly include someone who has megadosed niacin, garlic or green tea.

I do not believe in the concept that one can be be unassisted for a year, or five or whatever and claim that their body is the work of natural, as some agents have such a profound irreversible effect.

*Opinions*

None of these labels particularly matter outside philosophy, but if one is a entering a competition then they should abide by the rules of that competition, especially in bodybuilding where competitions are available for natties and PAA.

People who class themselves as natties, yet scoff down prohormones are either ignorant, in denial or both.

People who are PAA who enter natty comps are demonstrating serious weakness of character IMO. Its akin to a runner faking a disability so they can compete in the paraolympics when they know that they can never cut it against their true peers.

*Risk*

All the stuff we use creatine, garlic, testosterone, GHRP6, DNP, slin, T3, etc has a different risk profile associated with it, and when a person chooses to build their stacks, they should have some idea of the true risks that these agents, and the combination of agents in their stack, are likely have on their particular body. What the potential hazards are, and ideally some idea of probability. Everyone has their own goals and their risk profile should reflect that too.

I find it laughable that a person considers taking high dose Superdrol as being natural, yet thinks injecting test as tantamount to status of a heroin addict.

This above all, to thine own self be true,

J


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Nice post Joshua, very much in agreement with that.

One thing I find kind of contradictory in the view of some natties is that on the one hand they frown upon the use of pharmacological agents to mainpulate hormones, yet will do everything they possibly can to mimick exactly the same effects by using dietary supplements, workout routines said to induce GH increases, eating patterns etc.

I think your very last sentence sums it up best of all "This above all, to thine own self be true" - don't worry about what others are taking/not taking, just do what feels right for you and don't judge others for their choices.

I am natty, but see no moral difference in position between myself and someone who habitually uses heavy doses of AAS or PEDs. To me am equally interested in the physiological process in both sets of individuals and have respect more for the effort, dedication, intelligence and integrity (as in honesty - no probs with what someone does, so long as she/he is honest) of an athlete rather than whether he's considered natty or not.


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## IrishRaver (Feb 4, 2010)

benicillin said:


> So you're saying orals are not steroids? :confused1:


No lol they are definitely steroids, there's no denying that.

I was replying to that guy who questioned why cecil said "not even oral" - pointing out the difference in oral steroids and injectable steroids


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## Dav1 (Sep 25, 2009)

Steven long time no see, (if your the same guy from MT) well done for keeping it up and looking good now.

I think people such as con etc.. have given straightforward acurate answers, its getting a bit silly really I think most who know anything about BBing know the difference.

It does matter though especially if you are natural and competing in a natural fed against others that don't.

I was a top natural for many years and competed at the top level many moons ago in the ANB, did I begrudge those that took AAS and other meds no not at all rather an individuals arrogance or attitude. I was friends with many assisted brothers some at the top of the game, trained with who I consider one of the greatest UK/worlds bodybuilders of all time for a few years off and on did I care whether he took gear - no not at all it was his path and he was a true gent.

I also believe that a natural can look very good/impressive, I competed on a couple of occasions at very low BF (Striated glutes) and was naturally very very vascular and still carried a good amount of muscle competed at around or just under 14 stone. I had a 26" waist when depleted which made me look pretty decent, I remember a BBer in bodyworks at Tottenham (where I used to train) disbelieving this until I took my top off, I got nothing but respect from the top (Assisted) guys at Bodyworks and whereever I trained why shouldn't I have I gave it back and trained and dieted just as hard as them.


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## tempnatural (Jul 8, 2010)

You're a natty bodybuilder and you joined this forum, worst mistake... EVER

haha


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## Dav1 (Sep 25, 2009)

Good man Steve nice to see that you have kept it up looking good.

TN well call it a mid life crisis (If nothing else honesty is one of my traits) but after the dream of competing again faded into the mists of time curiousity overcame me and I tried a couple of OTC DS. It satisfied my curiosity and now I can move on lol. As in my post above who really cares I don't as long as a persons attitude is good thats fine by me.

Without sounding arrogant though I pretty much achieved all I wanted naturally (someone else can be the judge on my genetics) but I hit my goals without ever needing AAS etc.. won a national title amongst others, did a 500lb bench (my goal from 13 how sad) actually benched 235kg for 2 (not to PLing standards but touch and go) so look back with a personal level of pride, would never judge another .


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## SuRge (Jan 18, 2011)

Im not a hardcore bodybuilder i just want to look bigger than the majority of people when im out and about, ive never used steroids..i do wonder what i would be like if i did. im not opposed to them it is a personal choice after all. however i am a massive fan of the pro form and i admire them for there dedication and hard work that they have put in, not to mention the years of hard graft! - nat or not you dont get like that overnight .

As for all natBBs i think you are a rare breed and should be admired for it just as the guys who have had 'help' are admired for there size - imo


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## Ninja (Apr 28, 2010)

Dav1 said:


> Steven long time no see, (if your the same guy from MT) well done for keeping it up and looking good now.
> 
> I think people such as con etc.. have given straightforward acurate answers, its getting a bit silly really I think most who know anything about BBing know the difference.
> 
> ...


I train in Bodyworks at Tottenham..Nice place isn't it? :thumbup1:


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## Dav1 (Sep 25, 2009)

Not been there for a number of years but yes a good gym I bet Mark doesn't still own it though?


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## Ninja (Apr 28, 2010)

Dav1 said:


> Not been there for a number of years but yes a good gym I bet Mark doesn't still own it though?


Don't know who own it now to be honest but I love this gym a lot:laugh:


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