# Working the outer pectorals, the best technique?



## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

As titled, what is the best way to work the outer pecs. I know flys work the inner, incline works the upper, decline the lower etc. But what hits the outer the best? By this I mean the part nearest your bicep!


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

I find cables give them quite a burn/workout all try and explain the technique as best I can

Get cables at the highest bring them in to your hips with your arms staying as straight as possible the whole time (as if your doing star jumps with your hands but controlled of course)

Along with this when doing cables bring them down and behind your back (when doing this your arms will bend bringing a little bit of bicep into it as well)


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

Rq355 said:


> I find cables give them quite a burn/workout all try and explain the technique as best I can
> 
> Get cables at the highest bring them in to your hips with your arms staying as straight as possible the whole time (as if your doing star jumps with your hands but controlled of course)
> 
> Along with this when doing cables bring them down and behind your back (when doing this your arms will bend bringing a little bit of bicep into it as well)


sounds perfect mate. so basically like a cable lateral raise but the opposite? am i understanding you right yeah? would you do these both arms at a time or single?


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

its kind of hard to exlain

but cables at the highest point then as you normally do cable crossovers you bring the cables in front of you

but what your doing is say a reverse way of cable lateral raise so a cable lateral raise would be starting from the bottom and raising to the top

with the outer pec youll be a few steps forward and bringing the cable directly with a straight arm to your hip

am I making sense?


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

hers a picture of your starting position you can try that or the cables higher

and then follow 1-2-3 keeping your arms straight

If thats not as effective try bringing your arms the same way with a slightly bent arm behind to your lower back at the same starting position

a tried ma best with paint lol



the long black bits are arms lol


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

yeah so opposite of cable lateral raise. So start pretty much stood with arms straight out and squeeze down towards hips? Like a normal cable fly but bring my hands to my sides/hips rather than out in front? and i should do these with all my other fly exercises right?


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

Rq355 said:


> hers a picture of your starting position you can try that or the cables higher
> 
> and then follow 1-2-3 keeping your arms straight
> 
> ...


Haha! just seen this masterpiece! yeah nice one mate i understand now, cheers for taking the time to explain, reps!


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

yes just the way you described and try bringing your arms behind your back and work with the two to see what one works for you best

Am not too sure if you should replace them with dumbell flys but I normally switch it around sometimes dumbell flys sometimes cable work instead


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## Thatcca (Jul 31, 2011)

Cable Crossovers.


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## ardsam (Jul 30, 2008)

A 'most muscular' kinda pose


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

not a problem mate thanks :thumb:

experiment with the two the one behind the lower back works really well :thumb:


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## Readyandwaiting (Mar 20, 2011)

cables are good.

Manipulate the movement to hit the outer pecs.

I.e. I go on my knees, have the cables on the highest setting and use a medium weight initially to gauge a 'feel' of the exercise.

Go for a nice stretch and a good squeeze.

If you do this exercise first it will burn so much.


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

Rq355 said:


> not a problem mate thanks :thumb:
> 
> experiment with the two the one behind the lower back works really well :thumb:


tried them out today, and its exactly the exercise i was looking for. feels great, especially when you bring your hands together behind your back, cheers for the advice mate!


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## Geonix (Apr 4, 2011)

I find doing Incline Bench dumbbells but concentrating on the contraction of the outer pec. Before doing this exercise doing heavy deep db flies (you'll need a spotter if you're going proper heavy or you not going deep enough.)


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

onthebuild said:


> tried them out today, and its exactly the exercise i was looking for. feels great, especially when you bring your hands together behind your back, cheers for the advice mate!


I just happened to try it one day to try and mix things up then I was thinking what the hell have I been missing lol


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

can you work the outer pectorals?

id say it was a myth and a range of angled pressing alone is usually enough to work the full pec.

its a bit like the myth of working the peak of the bicep.... its just some thing Flex use to fill a magazine lol

this is just imo by the way


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

big_jim_87 said:


> can you work the outer pectorals?
> 
> id say it was a myth and a range of angled pressing alone is usually enough to work the full pec.
> 
> ...


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## Wings (May 1, 2011)

I thought the wider u go on the bench press the wider area it hits ur chest... the closer ut grip is the more tris it is?!


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

Wings said:


> I thought the wider u go on the bench press the wider area it hits ur chest... the closer ut grip is the more tris it is?!


bench press to be aimed at the chest more should be more of a wide grip, whereas close grip bench press where your hands are around shoulder length is aimed more for the tris <<(if technique is right elbows in)

thats according to my knowledge do correct me if I am wrong


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

When you say the outer pec are you talking about the pec/delt tie in area?

I wouldn't try put too much stress on this part of the pec as its usually the part that rip's (as in my case)

I will say that some moves do feel like they hit a diff part of a muscle but I can honestly say that I have not developed a wider chest by doing moves like fly, cable x over etc then I have when only pressing.

atm im a volume freak and probably do every exercise ever invented for chest on a chest day now but in the past my chest grew as a whole.... by this I mean I don't feel like you can make the pecs grow out ward or inwards i think its genetic and your pecs will grow how they want to grow.... its more the amount of stress on the pecs not the angle that it is coming from again all imo


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

Wings said:


> I thought the wider u go on the bench press the wider area it hits ur chest... the closer ut grip is the more tris it is?!


The wider grip will cause the pec to stretch and there for use more of the muscle fibers in the pec and it should spread the load right across the pec


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## Wings (May 1, 2011)

big_jim_87 said:


> The wider grip will cause the pec to stretch and there for use more of the muscle fibers in the pec and it should spread the load right across the pec


thats his goal thou right?


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

Wings said:


> thats his goal thou right?


Well you'd have thought so but it sounds like he wants to hit the outer portion of the pec more so then any other part?

I would have and have said that pressing is enough for over all growth but it looks like the focus is on the outer pec... my point is I dnt think you can grow the outer pec as the pec grows as a whole?

Maybe upper lower pec can grow at a diff rate but inner out is the same thing?

Inner outer-

The muscle fibers of the pec are like a tightly strung guitar, they attach in the middle of the chest and at the delt.

When the pec contracts it shortens, so image it's a bit of elastic....

I am the inner attachment and you are the outer.

Now you pull one end ill pull the other.... were is the tension? Spread right across the elastic right?

How can we force more pressure on your end then mine? I dnt think we can, can we?

now as i think about it a pec tear/un attachment usually happens at your end (the pec delt tie in) this only happens as its a smaller are and the smaller are cant take the stress but this isn't to say the outer pec was being hit more or bearing any more of the stress it just means this point is weaker then the middle?

this is why i cant see how you can target inner or outer as its the same bit of elastic?

I wasn't talking to you like a cock lol this is just what popped in to my head of how to get my point across....


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

big_jim_87 said:


> When you say the outer pec are you talking about the pec/delt tie in area?
> 
> I wouldn't try put too much stress on this part of the pec as its usually the part that rip's (as in my case)
> 
> ...


you probably do have more experience/knowledge than me so I will happily stand corrected

Yes I mean the outer part closest to the bicep/delt

I cant say that the cable movements do build your chest more than say flyes would but it does certainly feel that the outer pec is worked more when doing the movement which the op was looking for

I agree 150% with what you say that the outer chest is often the part the chest rips and this can be felt when doing deep flys and stretching certain ways that really do stretch/rip it, and this should be something to be wary of when doing chest going too deep can cause a tear/rip in the muscle

However my outer chest has recently improved a lot especially the shape on the outer but then this can be questioned for me as my whole chest has shaped up real nice recently but I have stopped doing flys as much Ive done 2 sets in the last 2 weeks

Yes it is true its genetics the way your body will grow, and cant really say what works best as Im not sure as I just do everything and dont really break it down to see what gets result I go along with feel/results


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

Rq355 said:


> you probably do have more experience/knowledge than me so I will happily stand corrected
> 
> Yes I mean the outer part closest to the bicep/delt
> 
> ...


No bud im often wrong lol so dnt take what I say as truth... just an opinion

I don't feel that going too low or too deep will cause a tear I think it's more weight and downward momentum that will cause a tear...

Also id say if your outer pec is growing its just genetic and you will find that you have made progress right across the board not just outer pec...

Again every thing said is imo

Ill prob change my mind in a few weeks if im training a bit diff lol


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

big_jim_87 said:


> No bud im often wrong lol so dnt take what I say as truth... just an opinion
> 
> I don't feel that going too low or too deep will cause a tear I think it's more weight and downward momentum that will cause a tear...
> 
> ...


Ill take everything with a pinch of salt then << not sure if a used that quote correctly but Ive always wanted to use it :thumbup1: lool

Yeah its weight and going deep with too much weight will cause a tear ( I started going lighter these days for flys because I dont like the too stretchy feeling when going deep)

Just as I mentioned and youve said just now its everything growing altogether so it may be the extra chest workout Ive added in

Lol welll a had a look at your journal buddy and a liked the wee quote tricep dip machine "I saw jay cutler do it so it must be good" it did make me lool and weve got that in our gym it works pretty well a think lol


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

Rq355 said:


> Ill take everything with a pinch of salt then << not sure if a used that quote correctly but Ive always wanted to use it :thumbup1: lool
> 
> Yeah its weight and going deep with too much weight will cause a tear ( I started going lighter these days for flys because I dont like the too stretchy feeling when going deep)
> 
> ...


lol now you have seen the journal you must post in it! its the rule! lol


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## zak007 (Nov 12, 2011)

will do when am back later on :thumbup1:


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

Wings said:


> I thought the wider u go on the bench press the wider area it hits ur chest... the closer ut grip is the more tris it is?!


Pretty much yes... remember the bellies of a muscle (the pec having two muscle heads, the pec minor and major) have both an origin and an insertion, and in pressing infront of the body a wider grip places a greater proportion of the load upon the clavicular insertion up on the outside of the pec near the shoulder (more load goes there because the bar travels directly over). At the same time because the triceps have less ROM they are also less activated throwing more tension onto the pecs.

Narrower grip presses mean lifting the weight more over the sternal head and the muscle origin lower down on the pecs nearer the nipple, so activates that area harder, and also allows for more activation of the front delts and triceps. Is interesting that EMG studies show that going incline doesn't help the upper pecs at all... BUT, the reason why most people think it does is because compared to flat presses an incline position works this calvicular head harder and develops it better because the positioning of the exercise requires a wider flare to the elbows to do comfortably... is the wider flare of the elbows and higher bar position over the chest that helps, not so much the incline itself.

A good general rule for benching is narrower grip for more total muscle activation (pecs, delts, tris) and strength, wider grip higher position over chest for more pec focused development.


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## golden (Dec 10, 2011)

flat bench press is your best bet in my opinion. incline hits the shoulders more, decline is not necessary and a waste of time TBH. DB flies for chest verge on pointless because gravity and the angle of attack depreciate past a 45% angle. cable flies are much better but you need to hit them heavy. anything else, no offence guys, is in my opinion smoke and mirrors


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## ausbuilt (Nov 22, 2010)

onthebuild said:


> As titled, what is the best way to work the outer pecs. I know flys work the inner, incline works the upper, decline the lower etc. But what hits the outer the best? By this I mean the part nearest your bicep!


LOL impossible to differentiate...

your pectoral muscle has its origin on the sternum (breast bone) and inserts on the humerous (upper arm under the delt). the function of the pec is to move the elbow joint from a plane behind the body, to the front (think pec dec, flys, bench press etc- focus on what the elbows do..)

Any muscle can ONLY contract along its length- i.e get shorter- so to move your arm the pec muscle contracts (gets shorter). It CANNOT contract near the breast bone only, or near the arm only....but only along its entire length.

The shape of your pec is based on your genes- the size by training, AAS (can exceed genetic size).

don't be silly and think you can exercise one "end" of a muscle! LOL


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

ausbuilt said:


> LOL impossible to differentiate...
> 
> your pectoral muscle has its origin on the sternum (breast bone) and inserts on the humerous (upper arm under the delt). the function of the pec is to move the elbow joint from a plane behind the body, to the front (think pec dec, flys, bench press etc- focus on what the elbows do..)
> 
> ...


So basically what I was getting at lol


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## onthebuild (Sep 3, 2011)

ausbuilt said:


> LOL impossible to differentiate...
> 
> your pectoral muscle has its origin on the sternum (breast bone) and inserts on the humerous (upper arm under the delt). the function of the pec is to move the elbow joint from a plane behind the body, to the front (think pec dec, flys, bench press etc- focus on what the elbows do..)
> 
> ...


cheers for the advice. not to be ungrateful but just so im clear..

i realise you cant do an exercise to target ONLY the outer pec area, nor any other part of it, obviously the full chest is involved. But do you disagree with Dtlv74 's earlier post which says

"in pressing infront of the body a wider grip places a greater proportion of the load upon the clavicular insertion up on the outside of the pec near the shoulder (more load goes there because the bar travels directly over). At the same time because the triceps have less ROM they are also less activated throwing more tension onto the pecs.

Narrower grip presses mean lifting the weight more over the sternal head and the muscle origin lower down on the pecs nearer the nipple, so activates that area harder, and also allows for more activation of the front delts and triceps"

just trying to get my head around all this, its like a biology lesson! I think what i should take from all this is that some techniques may put greater strain on certain areas, but to fully work the muscle i need a balance of all these exercises?


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

It may place more tension there but I'd imagine it's because it's a smaller aria and a smaller insertion then the clavicle hence me saying if you tear the pec 9 out of 10 tears are in the shoulder tie in. It's a smaller surface area etc....


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

big_jim_87 said:


> It may place more tension there but I'd imagine it's because it's a smaller aria and a smaller insertion then the clavicle hence me saying if you tear the pec 9 out of 10 tears are in the shoulder tie in. It's a smaller surface area etc....


Yep, but in changing the technique away from the powerlifting style form, ego lifting and focus on heavy weights should also be left behind... the variation requires much lighter loading, and works best with a slower movement and no bouncing. In swapping my benching form to this from a more PL style I had to drop the weight down to about 65% of what I was using before for a similar rep count, but the gains to the pec area, particualrly outer and upper, are much better.


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## eezy1 (Dec 14, 2010)

i just do db flies and use the fly machine thing with the arms set far`ish back


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

Dtlv74 said:


> Yep, but in changing the technique away from the powerlifting style form, ego lifting and focus on heavy weights should also be left behind... the variation requires much lighter loading, and works best with a slower movement and no bouncing. In swapping my benching form to this from a more PL style I had to drop the weight down to about 65% of what I was using before for a similar rep count, but the gains to the pec area, particualrly outer and upper, are much better.


I'd say it was genetic bud. If your outer pec improved it must be...

What you have described wouldn't help the outer pec any more then any other area of the pec it would just help the pec as a whole... Depending on positioning of the bench maybe upper or lower but not inner outer pec.

As said with the insertions were they are it's prob imposs... To work the outer the insertions would need to be top to bottom not left to right?


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

eezy1 said:


> i just do db flies and use the fly machine thing with the arms set far`ish back


This will not help the outer pec IMO


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## dtlv (Jul 24, 2009)

big_jim_87 said:


> I'd say it was genetic bud. If your outer pec improved it must be...
> 
> What you have described wouldn't help the outer pec any more then any other area of the pec it would just help the pec as a whole... Depending on positioning of the bench maybe upper or lower but not inner outer pec.
> 
> As said with the insertions were they are it's prob imposs... To work the outer the insertions would need to be top to bottom not left to right?


I think possibly on reflection, judging by the lack of fatigue this style of benching gives to the anterior delts and triceps, that what is really happening is mostly as you say simply better pec isolation overall leading to better development rather than a specific result of the position itself... but trust me, it does work.


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## Hendrix (Sep 16, 2009)

DB flyes definatley adds thickness to my outer pecs. Heavy and slow.


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## big_jim_87 (Jul 9, 2009)

Dtlv74 said:


> I think possibly on reflection, judging by the lack of fatigue this style of benching gives to the anterior delts and triceps, that what is really happening is mostly as you say simply better pec isolation overall leading to better development rather than a specific result of the position itself... but trust me, it does work.


I believe it work bud I no longer throw heavy weights about... ****ed off with getting injured at least once per yr!


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