# T3 only cycles...



## THE_MANN (Apr 28, 2009)

After reading through lots of websites and threads i havent been able to get much info on effects of T3 without the aid of AAS. Everyone says u MUST use a anabolic to prevent muscle catabolism.

There is quite a few people who have been asking if you can do this clean.

One person i hae talked to said as long as protein is kept high and consistently taken in, 50mcg is a 'liberal' dose and a natty would be ok. If so then it would be all good to do a cycle.

Does anyone have any experiance or suggestions on how people would go about using T3 without catabolism when natty?

My thgouts: High protein, 1.5g/lb bodyweight, moderate carbs, low fat, to maximize fat burning and minimize muscle wasting.

Suggestions are to go right into a dosage such as 25mcg then jump to 50mcg and come right off. Therefore smaller tapering up/down is not needed??? Would a natty START at 50mcg if 25mcg is just 'replacement' of your natural produce?

What has peoples experiance been with clen at the same time? Is the synergy significant?

THE_MANN


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## AB1990 (Nov 3, 2009)

No need to taper t3

even if protein is high without aas in there you can say goodbye to some muscle FACT


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## SK-XO (Aug 6, 2009)

Tbh if natural even if dieting down without T3 your no doubt going to lose a bit of muscle. T3 isn't the best fat burner for choice imo anyway. But I don't get it? you are wanting to use T3 which is potentially harmful if used incorectly as it can fk up your thyroid and your querying about clenbuterol which your must have in considerations, so why not just add in aas in that case? Because you wouldn't be natty if you bang clen  .


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## AB1990 (Nov 3, 2009)

agree with above clen is a harsh compound and if your throyid isnt something you want to mess with either if you dont know what your doing.

Get a low carb diet and do morning cardio and run 500mg test for 12 weeks and you will get results simple

Clen and t3 arent a easy way out, it all comes back to the basics which are diet and cardio


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

SK-XO said:


> Tbh if natural even if dieting down without T3 your no doubt going to lose a bit of muscle. T3 isn't the best fat burner for choice imo anyway. *But I don't get it? you are wanting to use T3 which is potentially harmful if used incorectly as it can fk up your thyroid* and your querying about clenbuterol which your must have in considerations, so why not just add in aas in that case? Because you wouldn't be natty if you bang clen  .





AB1990 said:


> agree with above clen is a harsh compound and *if your throyid isnt something you want to mess with either if you dont know what your doing.*
> 
> Get a low carb diet and do morning cardio and run 500mg test for 12 weeks and you will get results simple
> 
> Clen and t3 arent a easy way out, it all comes back to the basics which are diet and cardio


Iv'e seen a lot of this lately, seems to almost have taken over from the "orals will damage your liver" cr4p.

Even if you suppress thyroid function and TSH/TBG it comes back on line fairly quickly, in the average 20-30 year old doses in excess of 1.6mcg/kg body weight will not shut down thyroid function.

Doses of up to 400mcg ED have been used in studies with no long term effects on thyroid function and as doses are reduced endogenous TSH increases proportionately.

50mcg ED for weeks on end will give results with no adverse affects on thyroid function, it's just more chinese whispers/parroting leading to false information.


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## THE_MANN (Apr 28, 2009)

Yea mars probably 95% of threads/sites i have read have banged on about perm thyroid damage/rebound etc. I belive if the dose is kept low then your natural production should come around and all will be well.

BUT the main question is: Without AAS will exogenous T3 inevitably be catabolic, regardless of any other paramters??

I think the concensous is yes it will eat away muscle (at a faster rate then a normal calorie deficit diet)

Clen didnt do much for me, possibly because my diet was not as good as it could have been at the time

THE_MANN

EDIT: Anabolics arent really an option at the moment because my bf% is currently over my acceptable level before jumping onto AAS. The questions here are hypothetical and future puposes/discussion


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## Mars (Aug 25, 2007)

THE_MANN said:


> Yea mars probably 95% of threads/sites i have read have banged on about perm thyroid damage/rebound etc. I belive if the dose is kept low then your natural production should come around and all will be well.
> 
> *BUT the main question is: **Without AAS will exogenous T3 inevitably be catabolic, regardless of any other paramters??*
> 
> ...


This is a really tough one to answer as levothyroxine has both catabolic and anabolic properties.

IMO if you can dose it perfectly so as to be anabolic you will not get the fat loss properties from the increase in metabolic rate, so in the real world if you are looking to use T3 to shed to fat in this way then you are bound to lose some muscle along with it as it increases the metabolic rate of all body tissue.


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## stevo99 (Nov 28, 2008)

this is a really interesting read, ive just started T3 and Clen at 50 and 80 respectively and aim to run for six weeks with a 2 week gap on the clen

im also running Test C Mast E and Tren E at the same time 400 200 200 per week


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## WRT (May 21, 2009)

To those saying it will definitely cause muscle loss when not on gear, is this from first hand experience or more sh1t that's being spouted because your mate or someone online said so?


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## adlewar (Oct 14, 2008)

stevo99 said:


> this is a really interesting read, ive just started T3 and Clen at 50 and 80 respectively and aim to run for six weeks with a 2 week gap on the clen
> 
> im also running Test C Mast E and Tren E at the same time 400 200 200 per week


have you run both t3 and clen seperatley before?

reason i ask, i've run both seperately with no problems at all, but when i combine the 2, the sides are horrendous....

did 40 t3 and 60-80 clen, hated it........


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## AB1990 (Nov 3, 2009)

WRT its from first hand experience, i got 50x50mcg tabs to try and took on e day. I kept my protein high 280g daily and i trained the same push/pull/legs routine.

I did lose weight and i wasnt sure if it was all fat then when i was failing on my lifts on the last few reps and having to lower weight each session i realised i must be losing muscle so i sacked the idea and upped the cardio to twice a day


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## stevo99 (Nov 28, 2008)

well i did the first 3 days of just T3 and felt nothing at all, ive done my first day today of clen and felt all over the place this morning. The only thing with t3 on its own is it makes me a bit tired.

What results have you had from just T3?? If i could get away without the Clen i would but am prepared to put up with the sides if i get much better results


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## AB1990 (Nov 3, 2009)

stevo are you goin to run an anti histimine along with the clen around the 3rd week mark?


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## stevo99 (Nov 28, 2008)

no i was going to drop the clen for weeks 3 and 4 and probably stick T5 in bro


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## adlewar (Oct 14, 2008)

AB1990 said:


> stevo are you goin to run an anti histimine along with the clen around the 3rd week mark?


wouldn't have thought so, caus he mentioned a 2 week gap....

2 weeks on, 2 off......pretty much standard


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## AB1990 (Nov 3, 2009)

adlewar i no that but what i meant to say was he could run for the whole 6 weeks on if he used one inbetween. Only a thought


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## stevo99 (Nov 28, 2008)

id rather have a break than add yet another med, even tho it is only benalyn


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## THE_MANN (Apr 28, 2009)

mars1960 said:


> This is a really tough one to answer as levothyroxine has both catabolic and anabolic properties.
> 
> IMO if you can dose it perfectly so as to be anabolic you will not get the fat loss properties from the increase in metabolic rate, so in the real world if you are looking to use T3 to shed to fat in this way then you are bound to lose some muscle along with it as it increases the metabolic rate of all body tissue.


I see now, so it not really a worth while cutting med if you cant do anything about its catabolism.



WRT said:


> To those saying it will definitely cause muscle loss when not on gear, is this from first hand experience or more sh1t that's being spouted because your mate or someone online said so?


Everything i have read up about T3 has been online, some i have talked to at the gym are on gear so they wouldn't count for the subject of this thread.

Verging off a bit: The anti-catabolic effects of clenbuterol wouldn't make up for the AAS, if a clen/T3 cycle was used would it? Just how anti-catabolic is it?


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## C19H28O2 (Oct 11, 2008)

mars1960 said:


> Iv'e seen a lot of this lately, seems to almost have taken over from the "*orals will damage your liver" cr4p*.
> 
> Even if you suppress thyroid function and TSH/TBG it comes back on line fairly quickly, in the average 20-30 year old doses in excess of 1.6mcg/kg body weight will not shut down thyroid function.
> 
> ...


Thats true! lol 

but seriously there are plenty of case studies regarding oral AAS and liver damage.. for example superdrol or methyl tren (Methyltrienolone). The liver does have amazing regenerative abilities and in 99% of time recovers completely (which i think is the point your trying to make?) but technically AAS does damage the liver.


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## warrior 72 (Nov 28, 2009)

all of my friends use t3 while cutting, but i prefer t4 (levotyroxine) because i noted that with t3 i lost a little muslce.... t4 becomes t3 in a ratio 4:1

while on t4 i'm used to run 2 days clen and 2days eca for 4 weeks ....as for thyroid, it's recover quickly even in cases of long cycles... everybody is different, what works for me may not work for you!!!

REMEMBER THAT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS ALWAYS DIET!!!!!


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