# DNP... what about it



## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

@Pscarb, @LittleChris, since you two are authorities on the subject, I'd like to know what you think of it.

I know that it is dangerous and that it works.

but, there is a diatribe on whether it can damage permanently the body, and/or fat losses are immediately restored.

What do you think?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

DNP is pretty much unique in the fat burning world in that it doesn't stimulate the alpha or beta receptors of your cells, like ECA, yohimbine, Rauwolscine, DMAA, higenamine etc etc. It is something called an energy uncoupler. In a nutshell DNP decouples the ATP mechanism for energy transport. Basically your body is running faster and faster and enters a "hyper-metabolic" state.

In this state it has to burn fats for fuel, and any ingested carbohydrates are just converted to heat. This is why people sweat so much on DNP, and why its important to keep carbs low while on it.

DNP needs to be taken seriously its not like taking too much ECA where you will fee like crap. Currently the ONLY reason that DNP is not being used by the NHS (and it has been considered a number of times) is that the effective dose level (ED50), which for most people is around 125-250mg is too close to the Lethal dose for 50% of those taking it (LD50). So while 250 may be great 500-750 has killed people. I am genuinely not trying to panic you here, as used correctly it is as safe as the stimulant based fat burner.. Think of it like paracetamol. 2 tabs cures you, 20 tabs kills you, with DNP 1 tab is good, 4 or 5 tabs are bad - so the gap is closer than with paracetamol.. If you do run it just don't ever be tempted to raise the dose. It has a long half life (36 hours) so the full effects of raising the dose dont hit for 4-5 days, so really you need to start at a dose and just stick with it for at least 5 days before you EVER think of raising, and TBH I wouldn't raise at all. Even at 125mg, run correctly DNP will give you great losses. I have had 9 pounds lost in a 2 week 125mg course. and 16lb from a 250mg - however 250 is really only just about manageable, and I am happier at 125mg.

You can train as normal - you will feel a little more fatigued than normal - I still do cardio - but look like I have been hosed down after - DRINK WATER and lots of it. Carry a bottle of lucozade with you at all times - particularly in the gym.. As your glycogen (instant muscle fuel) will be depleted then your blood sugar may drop and you can go a little hypoglycaemic (feel little light headed and generally crap). If this happens then a quick glug of lucozade will sort it out. takes 5-10 mins though. These are not the same as insulin hypos, and you will naturally come out of it in 20-30 mins (no more exercise though) - I'd rather hit the lucozade and sweat a bit more.

Like any fat loss method, if you then dont keep up with your calorie control - and let calories creep up, then yes you will gain the fat again. Some of the statements about weighing the same 2 weeks later, are from people that ran it incorrectly, wrong diet, wrong preparation or didn't run it long enough. As your muscle glycogen depletes you will lose weight from this alone in the first week, however this is often counteracted by the water gains - DNP will make you hold water quite badly. A lot of people give up after a week, as condition goes. You need to run it for at least 2 weeks, ideally 3. Losses pick up in the second week and third week and continue through the first week of stopping it. You will then gain a little in the second week after stopping, as glycogen refills and there is also a small anabolic rebound. However done right it will give you permanent fat loss.

DNP is as close to a magic bullet as you can get. However you need to use it carefully, plan it all out, get your supplementation correct, and nail your diet and exercise plan. Do this and you will lose really well.

IF you do consider using it, holler in here or drop me a PM and I will send you more details of the supplements I recommend (and why I recommend them, even if not all are 100% necessary) and how you should approach your diet.

Hope this helps.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

unfortunately I cannot send you a pm. I have repped you, however, because you deserve it and I also have given you my email there, so you can write me there.

I know it can be lethal, if used improperly.

Summer 2013 in Italy appears not to be as hot as the previous ones, but still. I'd rather be safe than dead, honestly.

do you know if it targets mostly visceral fat or subcutaneous fat?

otherwise, @DiggyV can you PM or mail me through the rep I have given you me so we can talk some more?

EDIT: I added you via skype, in fact, it was simpler than I thought.


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

@DiggyV

Hey mate, would running creatine whilst on DNP give any sort of benefits?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

It will hit both. As it doesn't hit the receptors, its not going to favour adipose fats. Basically your cells will just pull from fat stored to fuel themselves. It will take from everywhere.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

@DiggyV what about subjects with difficulties in burning subcutaneous fats? those, like me, with "gynoid obesity" (not obese myself, tho, it's the techincal term)


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Contest said:


> @DiggyV
> 
> Hey mate, would running creatine whilst on DNP give any sort of benefits?


Gut feel say no mate. Creatine is involved in the creation of ATP, and as DNP stops this, the extra creatine you pump in is not going to be used effectively. Also as you are relying on the fact that ATP is not being created to force fat to be burned, it would be counter productive as well. Why force more ATP, when you actually want less?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> what about subjects with clinical difficulties in burning subcutaneous fats?


I guess you are referring to Adipose fats here, as this is normally caused by issues with either of the receptors not stimulating fat burning and storing too much, as DNP is not using any of these mechanisms, it should burn the fat in the same way as it does in other people.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> I guess you are referring to Adipose fats here, as this is normally caused by issues with either of the receptors not stimulating fat burning and storing too much, as DNP is not using any of these mechanisms, it should burn the fat in the same way as it does in other people.


I see, thank you.

I have mailed you, just in case.

as a complete beginner, what protocol would you recommend?


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## r1234 (Jun 16, 2012)

I have never used dnp but I am about to get some for the last part of my cut, ill be cutting for about 6 weeks before I even think about using it. Ill be sticking to 125mg, I would be interested to see the supplements and doses you recommend @DiggyV


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

OK, for a first run just use 125mg. On a three week run you'll lose 8-12lbs, if I can you can.  the basics are as follows:

1/. Keep carbs under 100g a day - but keep a glucose drink like Lucozade (not sport) incase of mild hypos.

2/. Run at 500 cal deficit - should be easy by just reducing your carbs from normal levels.

3/. Lift heavy, minimal rests (not really exclusively for DNP, but how you should lift all the time :lol: )

4/. include some cardio

On the supplements this is the basics:

You should take some additional supplements while on it:

T3 - not as a fat burner though, and it wont catabolise muscle either before anyone asks as its not going to be used at increased levels - rule of thumb is on 125mg probably need 25mcg T3 - some people can do without it and use EcA to keep them alert and not lethargic, on 200/250, probably 50-75mcg but dont go any higher. Start the T3 25mcg from day 3, and then stop 5 days after your last DNP dose. If on more than 25mcg, spread them through the day and take on an empty stomach. As I have said this is not as a fat burner, the T4 to T3 conversion is inhibited by DNP, and you just need to introduce a little extra to stop you feeling too lethargic. Not critical, but does make it more bearable. ALso your thyroid will NOT shut down, as you are just replacing the T3 that is no longer being converted.

The following supps are the ones I recommend, along with a link to my fave ebay sellers. They are basically anti-oxidants, as DNP produces free-radicals, these help keep them in check. Not essential, but some good body level protection. If you dont go for all of them, at least include the VitC and VitE - cheap as chips from ebay. Some people believe they are not all required, and there may be something in this. It is also possible to use oyjer anti oxidants such as CoQ10. However as there are NO clinical trials on this, I personally don't think it is worth the risk.

3000mg VitC click here - water soluble anti-oxidant and will also help with the water retention on DNP

800iu VitE click here - oil soluble anti-oxidant

1200mg Alpha Lipoic Acid (ALA) click here - another anti-oxidant

THIS ONE IS ESSENTIAL THOUGH:

Eletryloytes - I use Science in Sport GO! powder, some guys use the Electrolyte Tabs from MyProtein, and others use Dioralyte - whatever it is take with penty of water.

Water - THE most important - on 125mg you will need to drink maybe 3-4 litres of water minimum each day, with the electrolytres, on 200 and above it will need to be 4,5, or even 6 litres. tough going, but very important. Gauge how much you need by the colour of your pee, it needs to be fairly light coloured, if it looks like traditional lucozade then you need to drink more water. BUT DONT FORGET TO HAVE THE ELECTROLYTES - you will sweat a lot, and pee more, and need to replace the minerals you lose. My Protein Electrolyte tabs seem popular - if you go this route then take with a BIG glass of water - 330-500ml minimum.

also if you get a dry throat then get hold of some glycerol, again from ebay or boots (tell them its for a tickly cough) this will help greatly - take 15ml upto 3 times a day.


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## JANIKvonD (Jul 7, 2011)

i've taken it upto 600mg before :whistling: never again


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> OK, for a first run just use 125mg. On a three week run you'll lose 8-12lbs, if I can you can.  the basics are as follows:
> 
> 1/. Keep carbs under 100g a day - but keep a glucose drink like Lucozade (not sport) incase of mild hypos.
> 
> ...


 @DiggyV mail me, honestly, as I have questions which cannot be answered properly on a forum.

your workout advice, however, is the exact opposite that people often suggest: heavy workouts with cardio... others say no higher than 40mins


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> @DiggyV mail me, honestly, as I have questions which cannot be answered properly on a forum.
> 
> your workout advice, however, is the exact opposite that people often suggest: heavy workouts with cardio... others say no higher than 40mins


Heavy weight session should last no longer than 35-40 mins ever. Then 20-30 mins cardio on top.

I'll mail you, but will be a bit later.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

JANIKvonD said:


> i've taken it upto 600mg before :whistling: never again


omg how was it?

@DiggyV can you define "minimal rests"?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

JANIKvonD said:


> i've taken it upto 600mg before :whistling: never again


I got to 500mg, lasted 4 days - didn't even reach full peak and had to stop. Actually fully stopped for 3 days, and ten started on 250 again. Insane sides. Shortness of breath, constantly soaked through, not good.


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> OK, for a first run just use 125mg. On a three week run you'll lose 8-12lbs, if I can you can.  the basics are as follows:
> 
> 1/. Keep carbs under 100g a day - but keep a glucose drink like Lucozade (not sport) incase of mild hypos.
> 
> ...


A little Glycol?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> omg how was it?
> 
> @DiggyV can you define "minimal rests"?


The time it takes you to change the weights, and take a couple of breaths to psyche yourself up. 20-30 seconds. max.

Its how I train all the time. I look to keep the muscle almost continuously in an overload state. I also finish with either drop sets or negatives. Once you are used to it it doesn't really affect the weight you move that much either. I still manage to shift decent weights at 47. :lol:


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> The time it takes you to change the weights, and take a couple of breaths to psyche yourself up. 20-30 seconds. max.
> 
> Its how I train all the time. I look to keep the muscle almost continuously in an overload state. I also finish with either drop sets or negatives. Once you are used to it it doesn't really affect the weight you move that much either. I still manage to shift decent weights at 47. :lol:


This also keeps your heart rate up which = fat burning mode.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

@robdog you also know a bit about dnp. care to chime in?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

funkdocta said:


> A little Glycol?


I think you mean Glycerol mate  Last paragraph of the post on supps. 

Glycols, like Ethylene glycol are used in the manufacture of plastics, not sure I'd want to be swallowing that shit. :lol:


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

funkdocta said:


> This also keeps your heart rate up which = fat burning mode.


Yup, its pretty much cardio. :lol:


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

I'm not sure I can handle my maximum load with 30secs of rest..


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> I think you mean Glycerol mate  Last paragraph of the post on supps.
> 
> Glycols, like Ethylene glycol are used in the manufacture of plastics, not sure I'd want to be swallowing that shit. :lol:


Thats what i meant haha!

its not just for the throat, it should help you retain some hydration and not **** all the water out


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> I'm not sure I can handle my maximum load with 30secs of rest..


You'll surprise yourself. Its not immediate, and you will drop a little to start with. However you need to understand building muscle is not about how much you lift, its about getting the muscles into a state of overload. I am not recommending the low weight, high reps route advocated by some people, I believe that you need to move heavy weights to grow most effectively. However I shoulder press, flat bench, incline bench and decline bench over 100Kg, with two of them at 140kg. And my pull exercises for back range from 105kg in one hand to 170Kg in both. compound leg movements from 170 to 340Kg.

How much heavier do you want to lift? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> You'll surprise yourself. Its not immediate, and you will drop a little to start with. However you need to understand building muscle is not about how much you lift, its about getting the muscles into a state of overload. I am not recommending the low weight, high reps route advocated by some people, I believe that you need to move heavy weights to grow most effectively. However I shoulder press, flat bench, incline bench and decline bench over 100Kg, with two of them at 140kg. And my pull exercises for back range from 105kg in one hand to 170Kg in both. compound leg movements from 170 to 340Kg.
> 
> How much heavier do you want to lift? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


you do heavier stuff than I do.

again, with this the main issue lies in availability and sources.

you say you recommend taking t3 with it. why?


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> You'll surprise yourself. Its not immediate, and you will drop a little to start with. However you need to understand building muscle is not about how much you lift, its about getting the muscles into a state of overload. I am not recommending the low weight, high reps route advocated by some people, I believe that you need to move heavy weights to grow most effectively. However I shoulder press, flat bench, incline bench and decline bench over 100Kg, with two of them at 140kg. And my pull exercises for back range from 105kg in one hand to 170Kg in both. compound leg movements from 170 to 340Kg.
> 
> How much heavier do you want to lift? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Its common sense really. Why would your muscles need to grow bigger is you stay at an average weight and just do lots of reps? All you do is strengthen slow twitch fibers and improve endurance.

Hit both fibers I say, like heavy bench press and also throw in dumbell press lower weight at higher reps.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> you do heavier stuff than I do.
> 
> again, with this the main issue lies in availability and sources.
> 
> you say you recommend taking t3 with it. why?


exactly, and i have no more than 30s rest ever....

on the T3, it was all in the original post I made  But here it is again for you with the relevant section highlighted:

T3 - not as a fat burner though, and it wont catabolise muscle either before anyone asks as its not going to be used at increased levels - rule of thumb is on 125mg probably need 25mcg T3 - some people can do without it and use EcA to keep them alert and not lethargic, on 200/250, probably 50-75mcg but dont go any higher. Start the T3 25mcg from day 3, and then stop 5 days after your last DNP dose. If on more than 25mcg, spread them through the day and take on an empty stomach. As I have said this is not as a fat burner, *the T4 to T3 conversion is inhibited by DNP*, and you just need to introduce a little extra to stop you feeling too lethargic. Not critical, but does make it more bearable. ALso your thyroid will NOT shut down, as *you are just replacing the T3 that is no longer being converted*.

So when on DNP you have less natural T3 floating around. So while if on 125mg you will possibly be OK, I just add in a small daily dose from 3 days in to 3 days after.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> exactly, and i have no more than 30s rest ever....
> 
> on the T3, it was all in the original post I made  But here it is again for you with the relevant section highlighted:
> 
> ...


then you talk about t3, you talk about Sodium (Sodic) Liothyronine? from 25mcg to 50 at 250 of DNP?


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## JANIKvonD (Jul 7, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> omg how was it?
> 
> @DiggyV can you define "minimal rests"?


lasted 2 days & it was 2ft snow outside at the time....madness.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

Op, whats your diet experience like? Are you disciplined?

Do you drink often?

How long have you been dieting normally for?

Do you work in a warm enviroment? Italian summer.......... im in the UK mate, and I struggled with our summer

Ive just finished a few weeks DNP course, and unless you are 100% committed to it you will have major problems, going out for 1 pint of beer can be lethal. Diet is the same, if you eat the wrong foods or dont hydrate or perhaps arent organised in terms of food intake / water intake you will have problems

Im assuming your requests for diggy to pm you means your going to ask him for a source  Decent DNP is hard to get hold of mate, better off waiting a few weeks for the main man

Ive just read through some of your other posts, you indicate that you are pretty overweight, you tried IF and didnt last on it.

Your lifts are low, you dont seem to grow yet when asked about protein intake you said "lots of meat"

Since joining the forums, all your posts have been asking for GH and AAS, yet your diet seems crap and your routine seems crap. Pscarb told you 2 days ago to get the basics right, you dont seem to have a grasp of the basics for someone whos been training for 4 years.

You seem to constantly be looking for the short cut.

I would avoid DNP, AAS, GH etc till you know your body. I bet you dont even know your maintenance cals / protein req per day, how can you run a diet at defecit if you dont know this sort of info?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> then you talk about t3, you talk about Sodium (Sodic) Liothyronine? from 25mcg to 50 at 250 of DNP?


Yes, LioThyronine or TriIodoThyronine or sometimes LevoThyronine, has the common brand name Cytomel.

Not to be confused with LevoThyroxine which is T4.

However as a first run I would only use 125mg of DNP.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Dark_Ansem said:


> @robdog you also know a bit about dnp. care to chime in?


You'll not get a lot from robdog mate - his last post was back in Sept 2011. Thought I hadn't seen him for a while.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Madoxx said:


> Op, whats your diet experience like? Are you disciplined?
> 
> Do you drink often?
> 
> ...


I'm tired having the same question being asked again, and again, and again, with the same answer being given.

I know my body enough to tell he's always been against me. I've had more surgery to correct physical deficiencies (such as flat foot) than I wanted. it's time to test new ways, since dedication and commitment do not pay off.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> Yes, LioThyronine or TriIodoThyronine or sometimes LevoThyronine, has the common brand name Cytomel.
> 
> Not to be confused with LevoThyroxine which is T4.
> 
> However as a first run I would only use 125mg of DNP.


that is only partly dependant on me.

why t3 is needed and t4 no?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Madoxx said:


> Im assuming your requests for diggy to pm you means your going to ask him for a source  Decent DNP is hard to get hold of mate, better off waiting a few weeks for the main man


If he has then he will be sadly disappointed. Am not a conduit for sources. :no: :nono:


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

Op, can you;

List to advice and follow it correctly to the letter

Avoid alcohol for 30 days

Eat very low carbs

Eat a fair amount of fruit (6+ pieces per day)

Resist food cravings, DNP will make you hungry, it will make you WANT to eat carbs, you have to be in control

Drink 6 litres water per day, always having water with you

Sleep with a fan next to you?

Sleep on a towel, and change towels up to 3 times per night?

Go through 3-4 T shirts per day and keep on top of washing?

Get to the gym and train, even though you feel like a zombie?

Get through the day even though youve only managed 4 hrs sleep?

Have enough money to support your diet, its not going to be cheap?

Keep sports drinks / dextrose tablets in the car?

Shower at least 2-3 times per day?

Track your diet, to the gram, knowing exactly what each nutrient you are getting, weighing your food for precise macros?

Train like a MOFO, lift heavy, low resting, you will be breathing heavy and sweating loads

Hows work, sitting at your place of work sweating and constantly drinking water can be frowned upon...

If you can do the above, then you "could" try dnp. But if you cant honestly commit to DNP and go in half effort then you will have issues.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

oh p.s are you on any other medication?


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Dark_Ansem said:


> I'm tired having the same question being asked again, and again, and again, with the same answer being given.
> 
> I know my body enough to tell he's always been against me. I've had more surgery to correct physical deficiencies (such as flat foot) than I wanted. it's time to test new ways, since dedication and commitment do not pay off.


your getting the same answers because you are not listening to the answers being given, you ask for advice but when it is not what you want to hear then you just ignore it and ask others.....

i said get a grips with the basics of a diet plan and asked what your current diet was and you just gave me what you like to eat not what you eat.....drugs will burn fat but they will be more effective with a sound nutritional base and plus when you come off the drugs (and you will) you will yo yo back to your current weight or worse....

guys on here on the whole are good guys and they will help anyone who will listen and take the advice but if you are just going to ignore the advice and ask more questions then you will be very disappointed with the replies you get....

Guys please do not be to harsh on this guy we all started somewhere confused to what we was doing, please think about that before you rant at him....


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

Have to agree with Madoxx and Pscarb. From what they say you dont have a proper diet plan, you don't train properly and are just looking for an easy way out.

If I was you I would sort your diet out (work out your maintenance calories and what protein you need) and get a good strong training plan. You may well have suffered with surgeries etc.. but if you have healed from these then you need to put it behind you and get down to some hard safe work.

Once you have been doing this for a few months then maybe have a look at running some DNP. If you just eat food you like on DNP you are asking for trouble and could potentially end up like the uneducated people that have died.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> your getting the same answers because you are not listening to the answers being given, you ask for advice but when it is not what you want to hear then you just ignore it and ask others.....
> 
> i said get a grips with the basics of a diet plan and asked what your current diet was and you just gave me what you like to eat not what you eat.....drugs will burn fat but they will be more effective with a sound nutritional base and plus when you come off the drugs (and you will) you will yo yo back to your current weight or worse....
> 
> ...


I've always called onto you, however, right? despite your advice which I supposedly "don't like".


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

List to advice and follow it correctly to the letter

-I already have. however, it was advice from an exceptional and learned individual which I cannot access anymore,

Avoid alcohol for 30 days

-I'm avoiding alcohol for my entire life, I only drink "socially" and in moderate quantities, a month won't make a difference

Eat very low carbs

-I can, with the right motivation.

Eat a fair amount of fruit (6+ pieces per day)

-you know fruit is carbs, correct? this can be done.

Resist food cravings, DNP will make you hungry, it will make you WANT to eat carbs, you have to be in control

-

Drink 6 litres water per day, always having water with you

-I always have water with me. not up to 6 litres, but if I sweat I will have the natural stimulus.

Sleep with a fan next to you?

-that might be difficult

Sleep on a towel, and change towels up to 3 times per night?

-I already sleep "outside" the bed

Go through 3-4 T shirts per day and keep on top of washing?

Get to the gym and train, even though you feel like a zombie?

-I can, with a different training plan tho

Get through the day even though youve only managed 4 hrs sleep?

-that could be difficult-

Have enough money to support your diet, its not going to be cheap?

-how much money are you talking about?

Keep sports drinks / dextrose tablets in the car?

-I'll keep them in the desk or in a pouch.

Shower at least 2-3 times per day?

-what should be the problem?

Track your diet, to the gram, knowing exactly what each nutrient you are getting, weighing your food for precise macros?

-I already weight my foods.

Train like a MOFO, lift heavy, low resting, you will be breathing heavy and sweating loads

-breathing heavy is not an issue.

Hows work, sitting at your place of work sweating and constantly drinking water can be frowned upon...

-I am writing my final dissertation, only me and myself to frown upon


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

IMO your best plan is this......

The main DNP supplier is away for quite a few weeks, finding DNP without him is going to be hard........

Whether you use DNP or not, your not going to be in shape for this summer. So forget that.

Set yourself a goal, say 3 months. Get on a training plans, a nutritional plan and stick to it for 3 months.

So mid october...... look at DNP, by then youve done all the research and have learned everything there is to know about DNP. Run a simple 14 day DNP cycle @125mg per day and you should loose 10lb. This will take you to November, then take 10 days off DNP.

Rehit DNP on 11th November with another 14 day cycle, front load the 125mg for the first 2 days, increasing after 6 days to 250mg and see if you can cope with the sides, this should loose you 14lb. (25th November) Then take 10 days off DNP

Rehit DNP on 5th for 10 days @ 250mg, but front load the first 2 days, this should loose you 12lb, then take 15th December till end of year off.

End result would mean your lifting correctly, your eating correctly, you would have built muscle underneath the fat so when you do diet you dont look like a heroin addict, and youve also lost 36lb before xmas. DNP will be clear for Xmas day and you can enjoy xmas properly whilst being 2.5 stone lighter


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Madoxx said:


> IMO your best plan is this......
> 
> The main DNP supplier is away for quite a few weeks, finding DNP without him is going to be hard........
> 
> ...


the main DNP supplier has probably closed down. The german one, if you're talking about him, is unavailable.

We're in july. I am not stupid enough not to be able to count.

look, I've sticked to my training plan for 3 months before, and to the one before this one for 6 months.

I sticked to a sound nutrition plan for 8 months. I am capable of "sticking", if results can be seen.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

There are online coaches available mate, I am using one myself at the moment.

Fruit carbs is fructose based, which refills liver glycogen and its the easiest energy that DNP allows. If you eat starchy carbs, like pasta, DNP will increase your body temp as it tries to convert into energy.

Last night was 15 degrees in UK, i slept with a fan on all night and im 2 days clear of DNP, its still flushing out, but I still sweat a lot at night

Yeah sleep outside the bed, but on top of towels, avoid white bedding too as it will go yellow 

Getting through the day, pro plus, black coffee and sugar free red bull is your friend. But....... live on them for a month and they suddenly dont work 

At present with meat, fruit, veg I am spending at least £60 a week, add into that DNP, ALA, Vit E, Vit D, Electrolytes, Subiltramine, Caffiene tablets, T3, Milk thistle, Extra washing powder, and I reckon thats pushed to around £65-70 per week. Its worth noting that cheap food....... pasta, rice, potato is all the bad food you arent allowed to eat. However as you are italian maybe your fruit is less there as we import all ours into the UK.

Here was my diet yesterday, not saying this is THE ideal diet. but this worked for me

08:00 - 6 Eggs omelette with 2 rashers bacon and 25g mushroom, Granny smith apple, pint of Sugar free jelly

11:00 - Tin of Tuna (Spring water) with low fat mayo, Cucumber, pepper, lettuce, 290g melon, 3 clementines, 2 applies (Pre w/o fruit)

13:00 - 220g Chicken breast, banana, Cucumber, lettuce, pepper

16:00 - 220g Chicken breast, 330g strawberries, cottage cheese (see below), pint jelly

19:00 - 225g Sirloin, 100g cabbage, 100g brocoli, 100g green beans, gravy

23:00 - Tin of Tuna (Sunflower oil) with low fat mayo

Ive just completed a 14 day cycle, followed by a 6 day break followed by a 10 day cycle and have lost 21lb plus im still holding some excess DNP water so I expect it will be 24 lb by the time I stabalise over next few days


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Dark_Ansem said:


> I've always called onto you, however, right? despite your advice which I supposedly "don't like".


i have no idea what this means????


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

Dark_Ansem said:


> the main DNP supplier has probably closed down. The german one, if you're talking about him, is unavailable.
> 
> We're in july. I am not stupid enough not to be able to count.
> 
> ...


Its not about sticking to something for just 3 month or 6 months. If you diet well and train well for 6 months, lose a load of weight then just go back to a ****ty diet and not training properly you will just get fat again.

Its a lifestyle not a one off.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

funkdocta said:


> Its not about sticking to something for just 3 month or 6 months. If you diet well and train well for 6 months, lose a load of weight then just go back to a ****ty diet and not training properly you will just get fat again.
> 
> Its a lifestyle not a one off.


I don't know how you got the impression I am obese.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

online coaches? are you quite serious?

when you say "yellow", you mean the "normal" yellow due to sweat or bright yellow, as per, lemon?

I don't drink coffee, I have no idea what pro plus is.

fruit costs less here, yes. no problem for that. I already limit myself with pasta, rice and/or potato, as that is usually the very first thing to go.

you eat way more than I do. 6 eggs omelette was all I needed to read. plus all the stuff I see, you eat in one day what I eat in 3.

you lost 21 lb with all that stuff?


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> i have no idea what this means????


It means that whatever I propose you turn down. even if I go from one goal to another.


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

Dark_Ansem said:


> I don't know how you got the impression I am obese.


I never meant to imply you are obese I apologise.

What is your weight? and do you know your body fat %?


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## murphy2010 (Dec 17, 2010)

id love to take DNP to cut on, but my misses doesn't like the idea.

shes fine with with clen,eca and AAS (if I ever decide not be natty) but no DNP


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Dark_Ansem said:


> It means that whatever I propose you turn down. even if I go from one goal to another.


you have not proposed anything, you still have not got a basic understanding of a set diet to achieve your goals, i clearly said to sort this out then you will achieve your goals when asked for diet you gave me a list of what you like to eat......

listen buddy stop tagging me in your posts as you clearly want advice on drugs when what you need is advice on basic diet.....


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## murphy2010 (Dec 17, 2010)

since im in this thread, does anyone have any good studies on DNP not been a killer like the stupid magazines my gf reads says it is?

if I can prove it is safe when taken correct she should be fine


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

murphy2010 said:


> since im in this thread, does anyone have any good studies on DNP not been a killer like the stupid magazines my gf reads says it is?
> 
> if I can prove it is safe when taken correct she should be fine


From my knowledge, all the DNP induced deaths were either related to a reaction with other drugs or severe overdose.

Frankly, when your using a cocktail of drugs which have interactions with one another, what do you expect?

On a side note, do you think DNP is drug worth using @Pscarb and have you or would you recommend it to experienced clients?

I myself have used it in the past but found the sweating too unbearable and for some reason, I can't help seeing DNP as a truly lazy mans drug now (no offense to anyone here using it here). It affected my gym performance quite severely which took the whole fun out of training for me.

I've also read that DNP gives its best results for people who are carrying a fair amount of fat. Say if an individual is already 8%/10% bodyfat. Can DNP assist them in dropping down to 5%/6% and look insanely shredded?


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

murphy2010 said:


> since im in this thread, does anyone have any good studies on DNP not been a killer like the stupid magazines my gf reads says it is?
> 
> if I can prove it is safe when taken correct she should be fine


There are very few studies on DNP TBH. Its a real difficult one TBH as people don't tend to study its death rate as its not a drug in legitimate use anywhere.

Also bear in mind that all drugs are poisonous if taken in excess, a few examples include Paracetamol, Digitalis and NitroGlycerine (also an explosive as well as a miracle heart drug - my father uses it). The big issue is that the Effective dose for 50% of people (ED50) is too close to the Lethal dose for 50% ofd people (LD50) is too close for it to ever be passed for human use, although the NHS did examine it, in the 80s I think, as part of a wider study on energy uncouplers.

Sorry I cant be more helpful right now.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

murphy2010 said:


> id love to take DNP to cut on, but my misses doesn't like the idea.


I was on dexaprine last year, and clen this year, my mrs never gets to know the names, they are just fat tabs and these are yellow


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Contest said:


> From my knowledge, all the DNP induced deaths were either related to a reaction with other drugs or severe overdose.
> 
> Frankly, when your using a cocktail of drugs which have interactions with one another, what do you expect?
> 
> ...


i have used DNP in the past and also coached people who have used it, i think it is a tool to use when the time is right the unfortunate thing with DNP is that many use it as the first stop tool to use when it should be the last....


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## Contest (Oct 4, 2011)

Pscarb said:


> i have used DNP in the past and also coached people who have used it, i think it is a tool to use when the time is right the unfortunate thing with DNP is that many use it as the first stop tool to use when it should be the last....


What dosage and length did you run it at mate and were the results what you expected & worth the insane sweating lol.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

Dark_Ansem said:


> online coaches? are you quite serious?
> 
> when you say "yellow", you mean the "normal" yellow due to sweat or bright yellow, as per, lemon?
> 
> ...


Why not, my online coach controls my diet, my training, tells me what to lift, how to lift and when to lift. He does most of the thinking for me.

Yeah yellow, your pee will become bright yellow, kinda like a highlighter pen, your white t shirts will get yellow under the arms, and if on long enough, high enough dose, your skin can turn yellow too (temporarily)

Pro plus is caffiene tablets

Foodwise, your metabolism will be a lot more, you will be hungry, you have to fill yourself up on veg and fruit to avoid over eating. I eat loads, yet still cut with the above menu. What I listed was a 2.3k calorie defecit diet, involving 275g protein...... but you eat that over 3 days. As stated above mate, get ya diet and training sorted first

Yes, I lost 21lb using DNP.

You seem keen to use DNP, im sure the lads on here will educate you and answer any questions you have regarding DNP. Youve been avised against it but your a grown man. If you wish to proceed with DNP, read the following and come and ask any questions you are unsure of. Then make a plan, of what you are doing each day, what suppliments you plan, here is my plan...........



Once you have forumalated your own plan we can check it over for you. Then you need to source and purchase all you need to start your DNP quest.

Read these guides;


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Madoxx said:


> ...


Things have moved on since these mate - well the UK-M one anyway - and the rehashed version on steroidology.com Some is still correct, but its 9 years old now, and a better understanding of how it works means not everything in that guide is now appropriate.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

DiggyV said:


> Things have moved on since these mate - well the UK-M one anyway - and the rehashed version on steroidology.com Some is still correct, but its 9 years old now, and a better understanding of how it works means not everything in that guide is now appropriate.


Removed, was short on time, ill find a better guiide later


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## jackedbrah (Feb 1, 2013)

Dark_Ansem said:


> It means that whatever I propose you turn down. even if I go from one goal to another.


In order to learn, i encourage you to do your own research before defaulting to simply asking. You will learn a lot more, and information will be much more meaningful & valuable if you research it and determine how things will work for you.

Also i know English is not your first language but your post are pretty rude.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

Madoxx said:


> Removed, was short on time, ill find a better guiide later


as I have from mine 

I need to write a guide like I have done for ECA, yohimbine etc etc...


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## jaime101 (Mar 29, 2013)

To be honest, I think the mentality of DNP being a "last resort" is more damaging then it being considered an aid.

There is nothing wrong with using DNP as an aid to your fat loss, whether you're 8% BF or 30% BF as long as you're smart about it and do your research. Sure, chugging DNP tabs down along with other drugs, without measuring your intake, with no supplements, and then eating what you want is irresponsible as ****, but also some of the routines and such you guys have suggested is overkill and make it seem more frightening than it is. And I understand where that comes from, because you have similar routines all year round from your workouts so of course when you use a drug like DNP, you're going to follow a similar/more strict routine than that, but the more casual people around might not see it like that.

I've personally had success with DNP with quite a "casual" ( casual compared to some of the ones on here ) plan, and would recommend it.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> you have not proposed anything, you still have not got a basic understanding of a set diet to achieve your goals, i clearly said to sort this out then you will achieve your goals when asked for diet you gave me a list of what you like to eat......
> 
> listen buddy stop tagging me in your posts as you clearly want advice on drugs when what you need is advice on basic diet.....


what was I supposed to give you? a list of what I DO NOT eat?


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

jackedbrah said:


> In order to learn, i encourage you to do your own research before defaulting to simply asking. You will learn a lot more, and information will be much more meaningful & valuable if you research it and determine how things will work for you.
> 
> Also i know English is not your first language but your post are pretty rude.


they are not meant to be rude. they are meant to be frustrated because I say "I want to bulk" "no you have to diet"

"I want to diet with help" "no you have to diet normally"

"I want to diet normally" "no you can't do it because you haven't done my research"

"I have done my research" "no you haven't because you haven't read all the obscene amount of information available from any source including stupid ones"


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Madoxx said:


> Why not, my online coach controls my diet, my training, tells me what to lift, how to lift and when to lift. He does most of the thinking for me.
> 
> Yeah yellow, your pee will become bright yellow, kinda like a highlighter pen, your white t shirts will get yellow under the arms, and if on long enough, high enough dose, your skin can turn yellow too (temporarily)
> 
> ...


the matter is, for you it's deficit. for me, it's like bulking.

and yeah, it's an obscene quantity of protein. I already have to fight in my house with relatives saying that by eating protein I'll destroy my kidneys..


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

DiggyV said:


> as I have from mine
> 
> I need to write a guide like I have done for ECA, yohimbine etc etc...


where are your guides?


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

funkdocta said:


> I never meant to imply you are obese I apologise.
> 
> What is your weight? and do you know your body fat %?


my weight is 187 lbs, in your imperial system of measurements. bf% I do not know nor can be sure. I'd say 15 or 20 %. no real belly but no abs visible. nor visible iliac crest or brachial vein.


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## Kaiz (Nov 3, 2012)

Go on my latest threads out and check my last thread out on how I got on with DNP.


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## funkdocta (May 29, 2013)

Dark_Ansem said:


> my weight is 187 lbs, in your imperial system of measurements. bf% I do not know nor can be sure. I'd say 15 or 20 %. no real belly but no abs visible. nor visible iliac crest or brachial vein.


Thats not bad then. I would just urge you before doing DNP to do lots and lots of research. And get a proper plan and supplements all ready to go.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/getting-started/106766-4-steps-beginning-bodybuilding.html

At 187lb, 2.3k is not bulking mate. Unless you spend all day in bed 

Basal Metabolic Rate - calculate it, calculate your daily maintenance calories too


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Dark_Ansem said:


> what was I supposed to give you? a list of what I DO NOT eat?


no i asked for your diet meal by meal with weights and measures it really is not that hard or complicated.....but i am out of this i am sure someone will say yes to using AAS, GH ad DNP and you will then be satisfied....for me you are not ready to use any of these PEDs so i will not advise


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> no i asked for your diet meal by meal with weights and measures it really is not that hard or complicated.....but i am out of this i am sure someone will say yes to using AAS, GH ad DNP and you will then be satisfied....for me you are not ready to use any of these PEDs so i will not advise


you forget that this is all quite new for me. I had no idea what to do.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

I appreciate the pointing out of yellow sweat and bodily fluids. that could have caused serious issues to me.

I just hope that, when I'll be "ready" to get it, it will not have been outlawed in the entire world and there will be no real sources. dammit.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Madoxx said:


> http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/getting-started/106766-4-steps-beginning-bodybuilding.html
> 
> At 187lb, 2.3k is not bulking mate. Unless you spend all day in bed
> 
> Basal Metabolic Rate - calculate it, calculate your daily maintenance calories too


that is true, for average users. as I have pointed out before, I tend to get fatter more easily than others.


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

georgey said:


> Go on my latest threads out and check my last thread out on how I got on with DNP.


your attitude is different than mine, I'd say. Will follow.


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## 3752 (Jan 7, 2005)

Dark_Ansem said:


> you forget that this is all quite new for me. I had no idea what to do.


my point exactly, it is all new to you so for that matter you get a grips with the basics and progress with those first before adding advance drugs into the mix.....


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

still, I really hope they don't outlaw DNP everywhere once I'm ready to take it. that would really **** me off.



Pscarb said:


> my point exactly, it is all new to you so for that matter you get a grips with the basics and progress with those first before adding advance drugs into the mix.....


true. but I do have been training for around 6 years now, and with just a couple of exceptions I've always put the same great deal of effort and dedication. so, @Pscarb, @DiggyV et. al., you should somewhat be pleased that I have at least more questions of my own. only a head full of dung does not ask questions or does not have an own opinion.


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## 0thersid3 (Jul 4, 2013)

Pscarb said:


> my point exactly, it is all new to you so for that matter you get a grips with the basics and progress with those first before adding advance drugs into the mix.....


What he said.

And what's with all these people posting and giving advice that don't even look like they lift lol. Not you Pscarb, but some of the people posting on this thread with avi'. You know who you are.


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## Madoxx (Nov 7, 2010)

0thersid3 said:


> And what's with all these people posting and giving advice that don't even look like they lift lol. Not you Pscarb, but some of the people posting on this thread with avi'. You know who you are.


Haha, im assuming your talking about me. I guess I missed the rule where it said that you had to have an AVI with the hulk in it to offer advice on a product that youve used / tested, perhaps the admins can update the rules so that only "hulk avi" people can deter new guys from trying out DNP and ending up on the front page of the papers.

Way to make an entrance on a new forum, nice to meet you by the way


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

Madoxx said:


> Haha, im assuming your talking about me. I guess I missed the rule where it said that you had to have an AVI with the hulk in it to offer advice on a product that youve used / tested, perhaps the admins can update the rules so that only "hulk avi" people can deter new guys from trying out DNP and ending up on the front page of the papers.
> 
> Way to make an entrance on a new forum, nice to meet you by the way


boys... don't argue on my account, it's not worth it  .


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## BigRedSwitch (Apr 12, 2013)

I've used DNP twice now. I did a lot of research and spoke to the person on this board who I consider to have the best grip of how to manage this substance, and, barring a slight hiccup on the first run (I decided I could up the dose, but I really couldn't), it's pretty much gone without a hitch.

In total (and I'm not at the end of the weight loss yet), it's helped me to lose knocking on 2 stone (from 16 stone to just over 14 stone on my last day of my current cycle - today).

I'm an educated man. I have lived with a serious medical condition all my life (Type 1 Diabetes) which dictated that I understand a lot about the chemical systems of the body, the conversion of food into energy etc. What I have come to realise is that, whilst the "classic" rules (eat less, move more) are true to some degree for everyone, just sticking to that mantra will not work forever.

Due to the job I do, the distances that I travel and the extended hours I'm expected to be in the office, my gym attendance had dropped significantly over the years. Up to the age of about 32, I was very fit, running at about 12-14% bf, and working hard to keep in shape. Career, kids, a wife who is totally disinterested in that sort of stuff meant that from 32-38, I just got bigger and bigger. Ended up at 19 stone 12lbs (I'm 6'5", so looked 'chunky', but not huge as most people would). I decided to get into the best shape of my life by the time I was 40 (principally as a target date I wouldn't forget).

Between then and now (about 14 months) I've (so far) lost 5 stone 8lbs. I now weigh 14 stone 4/3lbs, and am at arouns 11-12% bf.

At first, the weight came off easy. I was losing 1lb a day, just by controlling my diet and working out. Then it slowed. Then it stopped.

I got to 16 stone (3 stone 12lbs down), and just couldn't get below that. Tried Keto, increasing cardio, took up road-running - nothing. So I started to look for alternatives.

Clenbuterol (one of the favorites of the BB community) wouldn't work for me, as it stops the use of insulin to convert carbohydrate, converted to Glycogen, into usable energy, meaning it causes a rise in your blood-sugar. This would completely screw my control and put my life at serious risk, so it was a no-no.

DNP on the other hand, seemed perfect. It STOPPED the conversion of glycogen, drained what glycogen was stored in your muscles, and essentially LOWERED your insulin requirements. As it's not hepatoxic, and also kidney safe, this meant it was a very good choice for diabetics. In fact, I found a few studies to suggest that it had been considered as an additional treatment for obese diabetics. Part of the reason for this is that your insulin requirement as a diabetic is body mass dependent. The bigger you are, the more insulin you need. As insulin is a body building hormone (although usually this means 'fat building'), this becomes a vicious circle that is difficult to escape from - more mass, more insulin, more weight gain, more mass etc.

Having done the research, I decided I'd give it a try, and it's worked wonders. With my metabolism (and I'm not a precious little flower that has a unique metabolism all to myself - there are lots of people like me), the plateau of natural weight loss was a battle to overcome. What DNP gave me was enough weight loss to get to a point that I could *STOP* my cut, and start to think about a bulk.

Why is this important?

Well, it's always good to give your body a break. If you're always dieting, it becomes VERY easy to put on weight. This isn't what you want, if you're trying to get your weight down. I'm now low enough bf% to undertake a 12 week (or so) test-e cycle to bulk up, before doing another DNP cut to get below the magic 10%

I realise that's all a load of ramble, but what I'm saying is that as long as you research how to do what you want to do, and try to look at all the edge cases, the only person who should make the decision about what you should do is yourself. The final piece of advice I'd give you is stay safe - a lot of people on here jump in at 250mg DNP, but I don't think that's a good idea. 125mg and a controlled diet is all I needed, and I'd genuinely advise you and *anyone else considering this* to *not* go beyond that dose - honestly, you just won't need it.

Take it easy, and good luck with whatever you decide to do. It's your bod, look after it and work to get what you want out of it.


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## DiggyV (May 6, 2011)

0thersid3 said:


> What he said.
> 
> And what's with all these people posting and giving advice that don't even look like they lift lol. Not you Pscarb, but some of the people posting on this thread with avi'. You know who you are.


You pointing at me? Given I seem to be one of the very few actually with an AVI. Hope not as you'll be just a little wide of the mark. :lol:


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## Dark_Ansem (Jun 25, 2013)

BigRedSwitch said:


> Well, it's always good to give your body a break. If you're always dieting, it becomes VERY easy to put on weight.


this is exactly me. on diet since the proud age of 17, with a very small break of 4 months at 19.


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