# TB500 Log & Questions



## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Over the past 2 and a half years I have suffered from chronic tendonosis in both elbows which has severely limited by abililty in the gym. My training pattern over the past 2 years has consisted of 6 months of training, followed by 3-4 months off due to my elbows flaring up and me subsequently having to hault all upper body training. At one point I took 6 months off and within 3 months of moderate intensity training it was back.

These past 8 months I have been able to train consistently for the first time ever, but then 2 months ago it flared up again and I've had to be on a permanent deload for the past 2 months, with little improvement still. I am yet to experiment with gear, and wouldn't even consider it until this issue is sorted, so that's not a factor here.

As a result, TB500 seemed like a very attractive route. I've been to phyios and they've been a complete waste of time. I contacted a tendon specialist at a private clinic and the price for a consulation was astronomical, so this, believe it or not, was the cheap way of doing this.

So, I ordered ten 2mg vials from peptidesuk. My protocol is:

2mg x2 Each week for the first 3 weeks

2mg x1 each week for final 4 weeks

I did my first pin last Wednesday. This was my first time injecting anything. I reconstituted with Sterile water from an exchange service, using 0.4ml for the 2mg doseage. In the end I only managed to gather 0.35ml or so in the syringe. I injected it and it stung like hell.

I did my second pin yesterday (Friday), and this time there was less wastage. The pain was a genuinely painful sting which lasted for about 15 minutes. The initial pinprick doesn't hurt at all, it's the solution. I have a residual bruised feeling in the spot still today. There are no physical markers of this though.

I have read that Sterile Water can be painful, and TB500 should be painless. Does anyone have any ideas as to what is going on?

In terms of effects I believe I have noticed decreased connective tissue soreness in this short time frame (there was no elbow stiffness or pain in my last workout which is very unusual for me). But this pain is making me wonder whether something is awry?

I will keep updating this with my progress so you all know how I'm doing. I would greatly appreciate any input on the pain upon injecting though! I am sure my subq procedure is as it should be. PeptidesUk seems to be regarded reasonably highly here so they can't have given me fake ****, can they?


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## luther1 (Jul 31, 2011)

@Ginger Ben

I know Ben used it for a while, he may be of some help chap


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## LGM (Feb 1, 2014)

Protocol sounds good, promising initial effects, looks great. The sting will be from the sterile water yes. Used the tb500 from www.peptidesuk.com before with good results. Was thinking about getting more as my knee is causing me a lot of pain, made me skip leg day this week which isn't good. Will follow this log, look forward to hearing how you get on.


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## Ginger Ben (Oct 5, 2010)

Pep jabs can sting a bit mate. It's the water usually that causes it.

Good news that it's working though. I didnt really get much from mine but think that was due to type of injury.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Thanks for the responses, fellas. My mind has been put at rest a bit.

Will update with each jab/upper body workout.

Tendons are noticeably sore today, but only under tension. Probably wouldn't be so under a controlled repetition with range of motion restricted. No stiffness though so definitely a notable reduction in inflammation. I went the heaviest I have done in 2 months yesterday, so slight discomfort is to be expected. But, as I said, the workout itself was seamless, which has not been the case for ages.

Should also note that I'm on Cissus Quadrangularis, at about 4g each day split between morning and night dosings. Have found this to be slightly helpful but not sure whether this is due to analgesic effects or actual healing - likely the former IMO.

Obviously hoping the TB will spearhead the healing process. If nothing exceptional in a month I'll hop on some GH pulsing peptides too. Genuinely will do anything to rid myself of this so any suggestions are welcome.


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## LGM (Feb 1, 2014)

mymumbeatsme said:


> Thanks for the responses, fellas. My mind has been put at rest a bit. Will update with each jab/upper body workout. Tendons are noticeably sore today, but only under tension. Probably wouldn't be so under a controlled repetition with range of motion restricted. No stiffness though so definitely a notable reduction in inflammation. I went the heaviest I have done in 2 months yesterday, so slight discomfort is to be expected. But, as I said, the workout itself was seamless, which has not been the case for ages. Should also note that I'm on Cissus Quadrangularis, at about 4g each day split between morning and night dosings. Have found this to be slightly helpful but not sure whether this is due to analgesic effects or actual healing - likely the former IMO. Obviously hoping the TB will spearhead the healing process. If nothing exceptional in a month I'll hop on some GH pulsing peptides too. Genuinely will do anything to rid myself of this so any suggestions are welcome.


 Personally have always used GHRP/GHRH peptides while on TB500 and think it helps to healing process even more. GHRP2 + Mod GRF is what I am using now with Ipam + Mod GRF before bed.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

LGM said:


> Personally have always used GHRP/GHRH peptides while on TB500 and think it helps to healing process even more. GHRP2 + Mod GRF is what I am using now with Ipam + Mod GRF before bed.


Yeah anything hgh related would aid in collagen deposition. I'm not going to stack anything for the time being, so I can gage how well I respond to individual compounds /w side effects etc. Tempted to give Ipamorelin a go in a month or so depending on how this turns out but I have next to no knowledge on that. Will do a few searches over the coming weeks and will see what I find.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Trained upper body again today. I went a bit lighter and increased training volume but still went to failure on each set for my primary movers (10-15 rep range).

I was expecting some discomfort today as I went heavy 4 days ago. I was fine, though. A few niggles at points but nothing that would have made me stop as before. Overall I am really pleased with the progress I am making and it hasn't even been a week...

Pinned another 2mg after my workout. Much less painful (did it around the love handles rather than stomach), but still a potent sting. I'm still losing quite a bit of the mixture when drawing it into the syringe so I'd say each injection is more like 1.5mg-1.75mg. Expensive mistakes to make! I'll get their eventually I hope. Could compensate by adding more fluid but that indelible sting puts me off that suggestion.

Will pin again on Wednesday making my first week loading phase being about 7mg. Next week I'll do as I initially planned and do 4mg, week following the same, then just 2mg a week depending on where I'm at.

So far so good!


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Am now 12 days in, so providing an update.

Foolishly went heavy again a week ago and seem to have reagitated things quite a bit. Completed my fifth pin today, so in total have administrated 10mg over a 12 day period.

- Tendon still noticeably stiff and agitated

- Took a week off from upper body and things have improved considerably.

- For the remaining 4 weeks on TB500 I will be training light 3 times a week with stretches and eccentric exercises.

Unsure as to whether this is going to work now. It is still very early days though, so will keep all updates logged here.


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## Mark2021 (Apr 13, 2012)

You should warm your elbows up. I get sore elbows and find doing rope push downs at high reps help once the blood gets flowing.


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## SteveV (Mar 21, 2012)

I used TB-500 for several months, using a similar protocol as yours. It was also for tendon related issues, although the tendon was on the inside of the forearm (bracioradialis).

I used bac water, minimal sting, although I did experience nausea and stomach cramps post injection.

Initially I pinned into stomach skin fold, later pinning directly into the forearm during maintenance dose. Very minimal injection site pain.

Bottom line, I experienced probably a 50-70% reduction in pain, and was able to continue training. Interestingly though, this varied from week to week - maybe as.i trained heavier some weeks to others?

I have now found a method that has got the tendon pain completely at bay though

Deca or equipoise, probably not what you wanted to hear 

Using deca or eq works better than tb-500 IMO, result is pain gone completely on most days, with occasional ache which goes quickly on days I do have a flare up.

Anyway, good luck with the TB-500.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Mark2021 said:


> You should warm your elbows up. I get sore elbows and find doing rope push downs at high reps help once the blood gets flowing.


I already do, fella. I do eccentric tricep push downs, kick backs and wrist curls, as well as stretches for my elbow. Then I do 4 warmup sets of about 15-20 reps before bench press etc. It does help significantly. Thing for me, I don't get massively aggravating pain throughout the w/o. Afterwards I just get awful stiffness in my elbow, and this can last for days. Certain movements then give me sharp nagging pains also.



SteveV said:


> I used TB-500 for several months, using a similar protocol as yours. It was also for tendon related issues, although the tendon was on the inside of the forearm (bracioradialis).
> 
> I used bac water, minimal sting, although I did experience nausea and stomach cramps post injection.
> 
> ...


Haha, I have no issue with jumping on gear. I just don't want to right now because of this injury - it would seem like a waste. Others have suggested deca as well but I'm struggling to find any decent research that's been done on it. Seems like a combination of TB500 and HGH would be best, but I won't bother with the GH until I've exhausted this on its own.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

So, the last week I have been sufferring from abdominal pains. Mostly around the flanks but this can spread to the lower back. Havent't thought much of it but it has gradually increased in intensity. It subsided last Monday completely, then I pinned the TB500 again and it returned the next day.

Not sure why there would be a connection if there is one, but still.

Went to see the doc today about this. Didn't mention TB500, obviously. She suggested ****ing Gaviscon and Paracetemol. Shef felt my abdomen and said everything seemed fine. I asked for a blood test to check liver, kidneys etc, which I will go for later in the week.

I've decided to discontinue peptide use to see if this alleviates this issue. TB500 has been the only thing that has changed lifestyle/diet wise so eliminating that seems like the first port of call.

Anyone else got any suggestions? I am exhibiting absolutely no other symptoms apart from slight nausea after eating - that could well be psychosomatic though...


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Well, am going to update this and things have got strange and a bit worrisome.

So I discontinued TB500 22 days ago today. Was complaining of flank pain which was my reason for discontinuing incase the two were related. I saw the doc about this and got my bloods done for counts and liver and renal function. All was fine apart from slightly low white count and slightly low lymphocytes (nothing the doc was too concerned about but wanted me to take another for the differential), interestingly I have read that TB4 expression is significantly negatively correlated with White Blood cells.

Anyway, I had STD tests done etc to ensure it wasn't due to anything like that (have put my nob in some pretty dank places), but all came clear.

Things got weird 5 days ago when a lymph node was significantly swollen in my groin, probably about the size of a chickpea. I had no other symptoms. As of today more have surfaced in my groin and also in my armpit and neck (only very small). I went to see the doc about this again, and he said I should go for my other blood test but said it didn't seem to be cancerous as they were movable, but that the next blood test would give a better indication as to what might be going on.

I've read the odd thing about TB4 causing swelling but nothing notable. Also read a study on how cancer metastasis through lymph nodes is correlated with TB4 expression. ...Great. The study was related to breast cancer though and isn't causative. But jeezus who knows.

Lymphoma is a huge scare. Not sure if this is related to TB500 at all, but could well be. I'm hoping its a relatively benign side effect that will pass, but time will tell. I feel basically fine, felt a bit run down today but thats most likely due to the stress and anxiety of all this ballache.

So yeah, will keep this updated but also let it serve as a warning that these chemicals are relatively new - we don't completely understand their role as of yet, and individual variation is obviously something to be cognisant of. I'm hoping its something of nothing, but will probably push for a biopsy to put my mind at rest.


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## timbear84 (May 19, 2013)

mymumbeatsme said:


> Well, am going to update this and things have got strange and a bit worrisome.
> 
> So I discontinued TB500 22 days ago today. Was complaining of flank pain which was my reason for discontinuing incase the two were related. I saw the doc about this and got my bloods done for counts and liver and renal function. All was fine apart from slightly low white count and slightly low lymphocytes (nothing the doc was too concerned about but wanted me to take another for the differential), interestingly I have read that TB4 expression is significantly negatively correlated with White Blood cells.
> 
> ...


So how are you buddy. The lymph nodes still up or have they reduced in size. Why did you not have bloods done is concerned?


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

timbear84 said:


> So how are you buddy. The lymph nodes still up or have they reduced in size. Why did you not have bloods done is concerned?


Nodes still up (but havent got any bigger) and have subsequently come up in my neck also, still have nonspecific flank pain. Bloods came back normal with 'no further action required'. Not satisfied at all with that.

Back at the docs tomorrow to demand a scan and/or biopsy. This really ****ing sucks.


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## pea head (May 28, 2008)

Was looking into using this tbh but im not so sure now,it seems horses for courses.

At the moment im knackered.....left elbow bursa that came up like a golf ball and is still bruised and black on the elbow.

Rotator cuff is VERY weak and in constant pain and a full tendon snap of right leg 18month ago which is still weak and tender.

Not sure what route take anymore :surrender:


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

pea head said:


> Was looking into using this tbh but im not so sure now,it seems horses for courses.
> 
> At the moment im knackered.....left elbow bursa that came up like a golf ball and is still bruised and black on the elbow.
> 
> ...


I haven't come across anyone else that has had an issue like this.

Nodes still up, for the record.

Going for un ultrasound next week, but my bloods are now fine (although still slightly low lymphocyte).

In hindsight I probably wouldn't, but there are many that have had positive experiences that would. Could be that this has nothing to do with the pep at all, but if something bad has flared up, I'll forever be kicking myself.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Dunno what to make of the Lymph Glands & Low White Cell count.

I would suggest you go on datbtrue.co.uk & see what some of the guys have to say.

Also, persevere with your doc in getting this looked at closely. Don't let 'em fob you off.

Maybe my expert colleague @aqualung can add something to this? 



Edit: Perhaps this may be of some help.

LYMPHEDEMA TYPES OF INFECTIONS

LYMPHEDEMA TYPES OF INFECTIONS


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## 39005 (Nov 25, 2013)

latblaster said:


> Dunno what to make of the Lymph Glands & Low White Cell count.
> 
> I would suggest you go on datbtrue.co.uk & see what some of the guys have to say.
> 
> ...


the only thing im an expert in is masturbation , as for lymph node swellings they can occur with many infections - lets hope its something simple , as john said- dont let the GP's fob you off - its something that really needs looking into , keep us posted.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Am not going to google anymore, as it ha driven me insane.

As said, I have been to many docs about this, and all have said I am fine, and have tried to fob me off.

I demanded a blood count etc, and I have discussed the results of this.

I have demanded an ultrasound scan of the nodes and my abdomen to check for any abnormalities.

On a side note, a very tender lymph node has appeared on the left side of my jaw. My wisdom tooth on that side has become infected, and explains that. The ones in my neck seem to have gone now as the stiffness has subsided somewhat.

That said, they're still all up in my groin. Every doc has just said to ignore them. I think that would be negligent foolishness.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

I just wonder whether the TB was infact contaminated, which would explain the low wbc count.

Not wishing to concern you in any way, but did you have an HIV test as well?

Might be a good idea to get tested, if only so you can rule this out.

How long has this all been going on?


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

latblaster said:


> I just wonder whether the TB was infact contaminated, which would explain the low wbc count.
> 
> Not wishing to concern you in any way, but did you have an HIV test as well?
> 
> ...


Yeah, been tested for that about 4 weeks ago - all clear.

When I had the first blood test I had slight virus like symptoms, and in the subsequent test my WBC had increased, so that appears to be stabilising.

My liver and renal function is all fine a well.

7 weeks now with abdominal pains, and 4 weeks with the swollen groin nodes. Could be contamination, but jeez I only did 10mg over a 2 week period. Such a tiny amount. I could just be going mad over nothing. Still I am anxious over this and am pushing for explanations.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Just developing a few thoughts here....are you peeing as normal?

Prostate pain or discomfort?

Even though the tests haven't revealed any infection, & therefore the doc considers antibiotics unnecessary, I would imagine

I think imo/ime that a course could well be beneficial to you.

Btw, does your mum beat you?


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

latblaster said:


> Just developing a few thoughts here....are you peeing as normal?
> 
> Prostate pain or discomfort?
> 
> ...


**** is always fine. Prostate is fine. I've been examined 3 times physically, done 2 **** tests and 3 blood tests! All have come back fine! Wondering if the abdominal discomfort could be nerve damage of some sort from pinning? I was new to it so could have screwed something up? Not too fussed if that is the cause as can live with the occassional pain as long as I know what it is!

Oh, and only if I fail to perform when dads away.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

Going to update this so anyone checking up on TB500 gets a clear indication of what went wrong.

I went for an ultrasound. They confirmed the nodes were enlarged but said they were nothing to worry about, and that there are any number of things it could be - but nothing serious.

I didn't tell anyone about the TB500 but I am convinced it is related. It's been 3 months and they're still enlarged. Could be due to a contaminant, but who knows. I ordered from PeptidesUK.

I've discontinued useage.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Ok, well I'm glad that there's nothing serious going on.

But your Lymph Glands are enlarged for a reason. ...

There was a guy on datbtrue.co.uk, who used some IGF, where he bought it from I don't know.

He did have alot of problems though, & suspected that the "IGF" was something else.

If your nodes don't go down in the next four weeks, or you develop other symptoms, go back to your gp.

The issue I have with gp's is that they conduct themselves as if they know everything & can often be inept & a little

dismissive, when really the patients complaint needs to investigated thoroughly.

They are ofc General Practitioners, often without Specialist knowledge.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

latblaster said:


> Ok, well I'm glad that there's nothing serious going on.
> 
> But your Lymph Glands are enlarged for a reason. ...
> 
> ...


Haha don't fuel my anxiety, sir! I know of a fair few whose nodes enlarged and then never went down.

But yeah, something must surely be going on. They could be 'shotty' nodes, but meh. I feel healthy at the moment and am back in the gym pushing myself again so things seem to be on the up.

Would be good to err on the side of caution when it comes to peptidesuk though. Probably was some sort of impurity.


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## LGM (Feb 1, 2014)

mymumbeatsme said:


> Haha don't fuel my anxiety, sir! I know of a fair few whose nodes enlarged and then never went down. But yeah, something must surely be going on. They could be 'shotty' nodes, but meh. I feel healthy at the moment and am back in the gym pushing myself again so things seem to be on the up. Would be good to err on the side of caution when it comes to peptidesuk though. Probably was some sort of impurity.


 Just ordered some TB500 from PeptidesUK this myself for a wrist/hand issue. Have you thought it may be the TB500 itself that has caused it? As it has been linked to accelerating tumor growth etc (same as IGF-1 iirc). After all it is an untested chemical you are using, you may be one of a small percentage this happens to? Just seems a bit off to jump to a conclusion it is some sort of 'impurity'. What impurity could cause this? I would of thought any sort of impurity would cause injection site reactions at worst? Never had an issue with their peps so I wouldn't worry there, I would honestly look into TB500 itself.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

LGM said:


> Just ordered some TB500 from PeptidesUK this myself for a wrist/hand issue. Have you thought it may be the TB500 itself that has caused it? As it has been linked to accelerating tumor growth etc (same as IGF-1 iirc). After all it is an untested chemical you are using, you may be one of a small percentage this happens to? Just seems a bit off to jump to a conclusion it is some sort of 'impurity'. What impurity could cause this? I would of thought any sort of impurity would cause injection site reactions at worst? Never had an issue with their peps so I wouldn't worry there, I would honestly look into TB500 itself.


The suggestion here being I have cancer that has metastasised to the lymph nodes?

If that were the case abdominal ultrasound would have picked up a tumour, the nodes would be shaped irregularly and inflammatory markers on the numerous blood tests I've had would show some sort of abnormality.

Everything has come back clear. Only symptom is enlarged groin nodes, whose function is to clear the body from impurities and toxins.


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## LGM (Feb 1, 2014)

mymumbeatsme said:


> The suggestion here being I have cancer that has metastasised to the lymph nodes? If that were the case abdominal ultrasound would have picked up a tumour, the nodes would be shaped irregularly and inflammatory markers on the numerous blood tests I've had would show some sort of abnormality. Everything has come back clear. Only symptom is enlarged groin nodes, whose function is to clear the body from impurities and toxins.


 Wasn't suggesting that just discussing information I have read elsewhere on TB500. Like I said it is relatively untested, might be good to look for any studies on the chemical and see if anything correlates.


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## mymumbeatsme (Sep 12, 2014)

LGM said:


> Wasn't suggesting that just discussing information I have read elsewhere on TB500. Like I said it is relatively untested, might be good to look for any studies on the chemical and see if anything correlates.


Yeah. I didn't really leave a stone unturned. I know it can lower WBC, or in some studies has been negatively correlated with it. Also know it works on the lymphatic system. Just out of all the logs I have read on the internet no one has had anything similar. Also they rose after secession of use (about 2 weeks after I discontinued). I only ended up doing 10mg over a 2 week period.

But yeah, it's a mystery. I have been to so many docs about this who keep telling me I am fine. Going to have to accept it as an oddity and forget about it, unless anything notable occurs. Has been enought to ward me off it all though. In the future where drugs are concerned I'll stick to things like test etc.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

My apologies, I didn't intend to alarm you.


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## latblaster (Oct 26, 2013)

Any improvement yet?


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